>China

John Thomas
John Thomas

China renews pledge to open its markets
China pledged yesterday to press ahead with market opening and reforms, while reiterating that it will treat domestic and foreign firms equally and protect intellectual property rights.

The pledge on reform and equal treatment came from Vice Premier Han Zheng, at a time when there are increasing prospects of a trade war with the United States. Mr Han, making his first speech since being named executive vice premier earlier this month, told the China Development Forum in Beijing that China needs to "open even wider to the outside world", and would do so via its Belt and Road Initiative.
China is fully aware that economic globalisation is "irreversible", said Mr Han, adding that unilateralism and trade protectionism served nobody's interests.

Also at the forum, He Lifeng, chairman of the National Development and Reform Commission (NDRC), said China "will deepen supply-side structural reforms and work hard to eliminate ineffective supply".
Earlier this month, the NDRC said China, the world's biggest steel and coal producer, would cut its annual steel capacity by around 30 million tonnes and coal capacity by about 150m tonnes this year.

China will also promote international capacity co-operation as part of its Belt and Road Initiative, which Beijing considers to be a modern-day 'silk road', and widen access to the Chinese market, including the financial, telecom and education sectors, Mr He said.
It will also "give equal protection to property rights of all ownership types by law" and strengthen protection of intellectual property rights, said Mr He. (Reuters)
reuters.com/article/us-china-forum-economy/china-renews-pledges-to-open-economy-protect-ip-rights-idUSKBN1H1033

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All urls found in this thread:

reuters.com/article/us-china-forum-economy/china-renews-pledges-to-open-economy-protect-ip-rights-idUSKBN1H1033
marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism_in_20_years
facingrealitycollective.wordpress.com/2013/10/18/what-is-capitalism-how-do-we-break-free-from-it-4/
prole.info/ar.html
theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/01/why-do-chinese-billionaires-keep-ending-up-in-prison/272633/
nytimes.com/2017/10/23/world/asia/china-xi-business-entrepreneurs.html
jamestown.org/program/chinas-counterintelligence-trinity-foreign-business/
nytimes.com/2018/03/19/business/economy/china-xi-jinping-liu-he.html
medium.com/@John_Pollock22/chinas-coming-coup-xi-jinping-s-war-with-jiang-zemin-2353d9e49f1f
businessinsider.com/xi-jinping-ended-term-limits-because-of-failed-coup-2018-3
dengxiaopingworks.wordpress.com
quora.com/What-are-some-bitter-truths-about-Steve-Jobs
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_clique
stalinsmoustache.org/2018/03/28/kim-jong-un-and-xi-jinping-together-in-beijing/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideology_of_the_Communist_Party_of_China
workers.org/2013/06/13/marxism-and-the-social-character-of-china/
cominternist.blogspot.com/2010/06/soviet-millionaires.html

Adrian Cox
Adrian Cox

The CPC views globalization as a way to accelerate the ability of capitalism to renew itself, only when there are no new markets that can be tapped in to will the rate of profit really fall. China will never give up it's state grip on their key industries.

CPC's stance is way closer to orthodox Marxism and Engel's Principles of Communism as many would admit. It's not a socialist society though, of course, but a part of the economy is a socialist mode of production.

Tyler Watson
Tyler Watson

Don't 4D chess this one. It's porky with Chinese characteristics being porky.

Andrew Ward
Andrew Ward

These porkies are just pretending to be porkies so that the rate of profit will fall and make socialism happen.

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Christopher Garcia
Christopher Garcia

I'm not. The PRC still does hold all the key industries (50% of the economy) and this is never going to change.

What they are doing is literally the transition into socialism over time in the way Engel's laid it out:

(i) Limitation of private property through progressive taxation, heavy inheritance taxes, abolition of inheritance through collateral lines (brothers, nephews, etc.) forced loans, etc.

(ii) Gradual expropriation of landowners, industrialists, railroad magnates and shipowners, partly through competition by state industry, partly directly through compensation in the form of bonds.

(iii) Confiscation of the possessions of all emigrants and rebels against the majority of the people.

(iv) Organization of labor or employment of proletarians on publicly owned land, in factories and workshops, with competition among the workers being abolished and with the factory owners, in so far as they still exist, being obliged to pay the same high wages as those paid by the state.

(v) An equal obligation on all members of society to work until such time as private property has been completely abolished. Formation of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.

(vi) Centralization of money and credit in the hands of the state through a national bank with state capital, and the suppression of all private banks and bankers.

(vii) Increase in the number of national factories, workshops, railroads, ships; bringing new lands into cultivation and improvement of land already under cultivation – all in proportion to the growth of the capital and labor force at the disposal of the nation.

(viii) Education of all children, from the moment they can leave their mother’s care, in national establishments at national cost. Education and production together.

(ix) Construction, on public lands, of great palaces as communal dwellings for associated groups of citizens engaged in both industry and agriculture and combining in their way of life the advantages of urban and rural conditions while avoiding the one-sidedness and drawbacks of each.

(x) Destruction of all unhealthy and jerry-built dwellings in urban districts.

(xi) Equal inheritance rights for children born in and out of wedlock.

(xii) Concentration of all means of transportation in the hands of the nation

marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm

Jonathan Gray
Jonathan Gray

You see, Yuan is a newborn reserve currency. When your currency is the reserve currency, it's not you who open a market. It's the others who open their markets for you.

Logan Mitchell
Logan Mitchell

Gradual expropriation
they've had gradual liberalization and privatization so far
china is the country with the 2nd highest amount of billionaires, there weren't any billionaires during mao's time

CREATING NEW BILLIONAIRES IS ACTUALLY EXISTING SOCIALISM

Asher Morales
Asher Morales

Christ no wonder people think you're tyrannical babies. You can count me outta that, thanks, and the working man feels the same way.

Parker Mitchell
Parker Mitchell

privatization
Where? They just allowed private companies producing consumer goods and foreign companies and factories (in the SEZ). They never privatized original SoE. The state usually takes over conglomerates by buying 51% of the stocks.

the working man feels the same way
The working man in China overwhelmingly supports their government because Chinese living standards have skyrocketed within the last thirty years. The only reason the World Bank and the UN can claim that poverty is decreasing is because China lifts millions out of poverty each year.

Tyler Brown
Tyler Brown

Good luck in North America where the people aren't part of some ant colony. All the masons I know would rather dictate the terms of their own employment, own their property, and pass it on to their sons. They don't care what happens in China.

Christian Cox
Christian Cox

defending dengist revisionism
Life expectancy doubled under Mao, since Deng it just grew at the same pace as Europe.

Lucas Butler
Lucas Butler

Do we expect chinese to live until 200 years if Mao continues to reign?

James Stewart
James Stewart

China cares what is happening with you gweilo.

Jason Kelly
Jason Kelly

I would. He'd have implemented communal ownership of hearts and lungs by now so the old could simply make use of the young's hardware in perpetuity, living forever.

Ethan Ortiz
Ethan Ortiz

Asians are ants
/pol/index.html

human life can be extended indefinitely
user…

Oliver Nguyen
Oliver Nguyen

Sure they do, but what's that going to change? If you think the chinks can roll up to NA and implement your glorious socialist state without resistance you're dead wrong.

Juan Stewart
Juan Stewart

Asians are basically ants my dude, you seen those creeps boil dogs?

Jacob Rogers
Jacob Rogers

China isn't remotely Marxist, but it's certainly Leninist and Taylorist.

Nolan Long
Nolan Long

I don't think anybody argues that the PRC should conquer the US (although I wouldn't be opposed to it). The working class is the revolutionary subject, only the American workers can carry out a revolution in accordance with their own conditions.

Isaiah Cook
Isaiah Cook

Yes, and the American worker doesn't give two squirts of piss about your ideological convictions. They're concerned about getting their work done, supporting their families, and enjoying their lives with minimal intervention from bureaucrats and busybodies. You're not able to offer them anything better than what they have now, according to their own criteria, so they don't care. Your revolution simply won't happen.

Chase Nguyen
Chase Nguyen

Who needs to conquer a land when its rulers fall over themselves to sell it to you?

Jayden Carter
Jayden Carter

enjoying the scraps the capitalists throw at you
If you think the contradictions of capitalism are going to spare the US, you are quite idealistic, especially considering the increasing social problems. The election of Trump shows that the American worker is largely unsatisfied, and even the minimal standards, such as properly feeding your family, are becoming more and more of a difficulty in the more precarious milieus.

Colton Bailey
Colton Bailey

I'm not opposed to this tactic either. Beating capitalists at their own game.

Tyler Collins
Tyler Collins

Sure, that's fair. And what happens when the American people say "piss to our rulers and piss to the Chinese, eat our cocks and enjoy it" and simply say no? Americans are already fed up with their ruling class, but there's not a snowball's chance in hell the form of the revolution will be anything like what you guys want because you can't even explain your systems and theories to anybody in the working class without linking them a 300-page fan fiction and telling them to educate themselves.

Face it, you have a problem communicating with the very people you claim to need for your revolution and if you don't solve it then you'll look to them like a bunch of queers trying to tell them what to do because you have an inflated sense of your own intelligence.

You're right, but he's not going to depose his government and implement socialism, whatever that might mean. He doesn't care about your system, your theory, or anything related to it. You can't even explain it to him in a way that he can understand, so why no Earth would he fight and die for your kooky opinions?

Jacob Martin
Jacob Martin

You're right, but he's not going to depose his government and implement socialism, whatever that might mean. He doesn't care about your system, your theory, or anything related to it.
Then he's free to live in a Mad Max dystopia. Communism isn't inevitable, even though this is largerly said as a catchphrase. It's either socialism or barbarism. If an illiterate Russian worker in 1917 could understand what socialism is about, then why not an American in 2018?

Logan Foster
Logan Foster

Oh, so you'll just implement your utopia at gunpoint like always, gotcha.

Catch is, North Americans are armed and hate you guys in their bones. You're gonna fail and thank God, Dog bless America and blow it out your ass.

Ayden Nguyen
Ayden Nguyen

the current order is not enforced at gunpoint
GTFO liberal

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Connor Walker
Connor Walker

An empty stomach is a powerful motivator. I think you will learn that soon.

Bentley Rivera
Bentley Rivera

I don't think the current order isn't enforced at gunpoint, I know it is. That's not a problem. The problem I have is that you queers always seem to think you'll be able to run an economic system without coercion, which is retarded.

You're right, it certainly is. The result though won't be what you hope for. Nobody cares about your theories.

Julian Howard
Julian Howard

The problem I have is that you queers always seem to think you'll be able to run an economic system without coercion, which is retarded.
Where the fucking fuck have we ever said that? The reason violence and coercion exist is because of class differences. When you elimante class differences, and stop pitching humans against each other in a market, coercion will disappear and the labor of everybody will be social from the start (communism). Until then, a state is necessary to protect the dictatorship of the proletariat against foreign invasion, even when the capitalist class has been liquidated. Violence and coercion have their causes in social relations and nothing else.

Samuel Williams
Samuel Williams

where have we said you can have an economic system without coercion
our economic system in its ultimate incarnation will not require coercion

The fuck?

Chase Torres
Chase Torres

Socialism is the transitional period to communism you idiot. You know, the USSR, Cuba, GDR - they were all socialist states. Of course they had coercion. Communism would be a moneyless, stateless and classless society, there is no reason for systematic coercion to exist anymore. An example of a proto-communist society would be the Incan Empire.

Henry Reyes
Henry Reyes

You are saying your system will not require coercion when it's complete.

Are you high?

Wyatt Morris
Wyatt Morris

Communism isn't a system. But yeah, in a stateless, moneyless and classless society with free access to production (no individual producers), systematic coercion would be abolished. Think of the stone age, there was no coercion either. The only coercion that would exist would be in the dealing of individual crimes within families or similar things.

Robert Ward
Robert Ward

How do you abolish coercion? What if someone decides they're going to get a gang together and coerce people?

And besides all that, you literally ask me "where is anyone saying our economic system won't require coercion" and in the next breath tell me your economic [NON SYSTEM OK] won't require coercion. You're an incoherent faglord.

Nolan Phillips
Nolan Phillips

literally buckling to Trump at the first hint of a trade war
China is a fucking disgrace, even among capitalist countries they're among the lowest of the low

Gabriel Foster
Gabriel Foster

How do you abolish coercion? What if someone decides they're going to get a gang together and coerce people?
Why would they do it? There would be no material reasons to do that. If there would be a criminal syndicate like that of course it would be swiftly dealt with by the appropriate institutions and brought to justice. What I'm talking about is systematic coercion - there would be no police force anymore violently keeping away from production. We literally have a society where people are kept away from work by force.

And besides all that, you literally ask me "where is anyone saying our economic system won't require coercion" and in the next breath tell me your economic [NON SYSTEM OK] won't require coercion.
I've tried to explain it to you that socialism, which is what we desire to establish, does indeed include coercion, it's a dictatorship of the proletariat. Communism, which is something different, won't include systematic coercion. I didn't know you lacked the brain capacity to distinguish between those two

Jordan Reyes
Jordan Reyes

Communism… won't include systematic coercion

This is your ultimate goal and the final incarnation of your system, which I mentioned, and you say it won't require coercion. I don't know how you don't get this yet but you're literally saying what I said you're saying.

That's not even getting into the internal contradictions of your system. You believe in a stateless end-game free of coercion.

Noah Morales
Noah Morales

I don't know how you don't get this yet but you're literally saying what I said you're saying.
I don't know my dude, it sounded a lot that socialism and communism are like the exact same things for you.

You believe in a stateless end-game free of coercion.
Such as it has existed for the majority of human existence on this planet.

Daniel Thomas
Daniel Thomas

The polyp has said a big truth itt: nobody cares about our theory, and we must change that.

Also China is going to be ready for socialism in 20 years, deal with it negros.

Matthew Martinez
Matthew Martinez

China is going to be ready for socialism in 20 years
Of course
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism_in_20_years

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Blake Reyes
Blake Reyes

Tbh I talked with a friend from China recently and he tells me that the biggest concern is the state capitalists and facists hiding inside the CCP that might try to overturn Xi's work someday to reinstate China as the world's next unironic America as opposed to something like the USSR

The struggle China fights now is environmental degradation, the next will be the class divisions inside China, which the CCP better solve if they don't want another civil war

Alexander Williams
Alexander Williams

modern China has more in common with Chiang Kai Shek's vision than Mao Tse Tung's

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Lucas Hughes
Lucas Hughes

The polyp has said a big truth itt: nobody cares about our theory, and we must change that.
No he hasn't, nobody expects every worker to read Hegel and Althusser, it's not necessary. Little articles or pamphlets can already raise class consciousness, and everybody can read those.

Grayson Barnes
Grayson Barnes

Without a doubt.

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Gabriel Jones
Gabriel Jones

It's not 4dchessing, what user tank say is right.
The point is that Engels and Marx were full of shit and nobody is willing to accept this. Every their assumption turned out wrong in face of reality. Stop thinking them as prophets, they are not. Take the science, drop the ideology.

Landon Scott
Landon Scott

I don't know fam, say what you want but mao still built the base of the secondary superpower of the world today

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Owen Reyes
Owen Reyes

I hope DPRK nuke Beijing to be honest

Christopher Ward
Christopher Ward

Comrades keep it up!

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Sebastian Evans
Sebastian Evans

The Private sector needs to have at least one group of workers that are members of the CPC btw and they need to obey the CPC. So when they get orders from the CPC the company needs to fulfill them

Noah Butler
Noah Butler

Alright comrades!

Red pill me on Xi Jinping!

How is he building socialism? What has he done to get to that goal? What is his plan?

James Bennett
James Bennett

According to my friend who lives there, he is tightening his grip on the private corporations inside China and restricting the capital outflows outside the country, essentially he is clearing up the mess Jiang zemin left behind.

Christian Williams
Christian Williams

That's what I am saying, people are discontent but they don't specifically care about socialism to solve their problems. What we need to do is proselytize our basic ideas and positions further, not send them off to read bordiga and google weird-ass 900-page doorstoppers about psychoanalysis and the metaphysics of the toilet in capitalism.

Jose Sullivan
Jose Sullivan

Kim convinces Trump of adopting Juche in the US and they invade and divide China between themselves to establish the base of global trumpism-jucheism socialism

Jordan Gomez
Jordan Gomez

lit

Benjamin Long
Benjamin Long

Is Chinanon still on Holla Forums? How can the CPC represent people's and industrial interests, when so many members are porkies? What stops the billionaries from enacting self-serving policies through lobbying the central committee?

Nathaniel Young
Nathaniel Young

I think this is a good article, however it's from a Leftcom so you'd have to remove the obligatory shitting on socialist states, but the rest of the article I find perfect for workers to read:
facingrealitycollective.wordpress.com/2013/10/18/what-is-capitalism-how-do-we-break-free-from-it-4/

This is an article for people who work in restaurants:
prole.info/ar.html

This kind of stuff needs to be produced more. Short, light articles that don't lack the sharpness and emotional edge to make people think over their reproduction of their daily life.

Mason Price
Mason Price

They don't have much say in the CPC. Of course, there is always the danger of them staging a coup (where there is money there is power), but billionaires have it harder than in the west.
In most places, being ranked by a prominent magazine among the wealthiest people in the country constitutes a great honor. Not in China. Such lists, known as bai fu bang in China and published in Forbes and its Chinese equivalent Hurun, are described instead as the sha zhu bang: "kill pigs list."
theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/01/why-do-chinese-billionaires-keep-ending-up-in-prison/272633/

This very different from the West where billionaires are seen as idols and heros.

David Williams
David Williams

This, tbh.

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Daniel Scott
Daniel Scott

They litteraly have Marxism woven into the fabric of their political system, lol.

Xavier Phillips
Xavier Phillips

Itt: Mutts loosing their shit.

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Jose Garcia
Jose Garcia

How does the CPC stops billionaires from putting up their stooges in the committee?

I live in a third world shithole and this is the way out national bourgeoisie do stuff, by extorting or paying off public servants to enact their interests through policy.

I know there are frequent anti-corruption campaigns in the PRC but details on those operations is scarce and the prosecutors might be corrupt themselves.

Michael Moore
Michael Moore

China will never give up it's state grip on their key industries.
But the problem is that China has been using the state controlled industry in the international capitalist system. Doesn't state capitalism suffer from the same declining rate of profit that private capitalism does?

Dominic Baker
Dominic Baker

It does.
Xi has declared that only Socialism can save China and any marxist, which I suppose include a majority of the CPC, knows he's right about that.

We can only imagine what's the next step of his master plan.

Jaxson Jenkins
Jaxson Jenkins

ehhh, which company? some SOEs don't expand outwards globally, for example, semiconductor manufacturer loongson primarily does stuff for state computing, to so much private.

it depends on which sector your talking about, since China has a firm grip on it's enterprises, the theoretical and supposed way they would go about this is use the profitable companies that deal with superficial products (IE: online shopping, entertainment, consumer goods productions) to develop and maintain the more critical sectors that cannot be run for profit (Infrastructure, education , etc..)

Charles Lee
Charles Lee

not so much private*

companies more closer to the profit motive in this case would be startups like phytium and larger groups like zhaoxin-via / Rockchip

Gabriel Foster
Gabriel Foster

Litteraly all countries face that shit.
That's how. Profit motivations work.

Logan Richardson
Logan Richardson

Some more links on China's tightening grip:

nytimes.com/2017/10/23/world/asia/china-xi-business-entrepreneurs.html

jamestown.org/program/chinas-counterintelligence-trinity-foreign-business/

Supposed "opening-up", but is in fact a reigning in by China of private businesses.

nytimes.com/2018/03/19/business/economy/china-xi-jinping-liu-he.html

Samuel Foster
Samuel Foster

Can someone give me sources for that??

Owen Adams
Owen Adams

Oops sorry

Logan Scott
Logan Scott

At some point those profitable industries would also stop being profitable though. After which China has to either liquidate the bourgeoisie that has emerged in China that has control of the banks and the Shanghai stock exchange.

Who's idea was it to participate in the international market of borrowing and lending instead of sustained socialist growth?

Ethan Wilson
Ethan Wilson

*either liquidate the bourgeoisie… or stop paying debt.

Cameron Lee
Cameron Lee

The Billionaires are under a big attack since Xi Jinping was elected.They don't make up the majority of the peoples Congress anymore so thats something

Jaxson Green
Jaxson Green

Who's idea was it to participate in the international market of borrowing and lending instead of sustained socialist growth?

Deng's

William Jenkins
William Jenkins

war against Jiang's group:

medium.com/@John_Pollock22/chinas-coming-coup-xi-jinping-s-war-with-jiang-zemin-2353d9e49f1f

businessinsider.com/xi-jinping-ended-term-limits-because-of-failed-coup-2018-3

it was necessary to let China catch up, socialism must take an offensive approach, and one offensive move is to build up your productive forces to the most superior in the world.

and on profit, that is certainly true, but by then China should be the main decider of the global economy/productive forces, with that logical choice, they should make the choice to change the worlds course away from mere profit.

Brody Peterson
Brody Peterson

surely everything can't be blamed on the eternal Dengist, right?

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Nathaniel Brooks
Nathaniel Brooks

He did start a process that broke up China's state services and resulted in the rise of corruption under Jiang

But the technological gap had to be closed, I do not think China can ever stomach the losses suffered under the Korean and Sino-Japanese war, this time they are determined to be a technological match.

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Samuel Ortiz
Samuel Ortiz

I'am not kidding.

It really was his idea, here dengxiaopingworks.wordpress.com

Asher King
Asher King

how do the billionaire capitalists who run the CPC stop billionaires from putting their stooges in the committee?

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Nathaniel Gonzalez
Nathaniel Gonzalez

Only in an illusory sense. Red flags and hammer and sickles devised by Lenin make for good aesthetics, but the nature of their political system, social ethics and economics has nothing to do with Marxism.

William Cruz
William Cruz

the West where billionaires are seen as idols and heros.
lel what are you on about

Nathan Perez
Nathan Perez

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Luke Flores
Luke Flores

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Ian Hall
Ian Hall

to be fair few people unironically like zuck

this asshat on the other hand

quora.com/What-are-some-bitter-truths-about-Steve-Jobs

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Ayden Thomas
Ayden Thomas

anti-CPC kulaks only post greentext one-liners and memes
pro Xi gang posts actual content supported by sources
"""Tankies""" always win.

Aiden Miller
Aiden Miller

he's not seen as a hero, just an eccentric businessman

Jose Sullivan
Jose Sullivan

chinese state propaganda and rich new york jews whining about a few corrupt businessmen getting clamped down on (which happens everywhere) doesn't count

Connor Parker
Connor Parker

uhhhhhhhh people have literally compared him to tesla and being better than NASA

he's definitely quite close to a hero, maybe an eccentric one , at least to his fanbois

Bentley Price
Bentley Price

we can have capitalists idols too west-chan!

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Austin Hill
Austin Hill

If consider alibaba much more in the hands of the CCP than apple in the hands of the US Govt , sure he's a billionaire but I don't think of him running away to america with money between his legs

Owen Morgan
Owen Morgan

I'd *

Jacob Young
Jacob Young

There were no restaurants before 1760
Bullshit. Most Romans lived in insulae that had no kitchens, so they ate every meal at restaurants, taverns, and street vendors. Hard to take someone's analysis seriously when they fuck up basic facts that form the basis of their argument.

Adrian Collins
Adrian Collins

"""Tankies""" always win.
real mothafuckin ☭TANKIE☭s don't support dengist revisionism bitch

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Hudson Sullivan
Hudson Sullivan

really don't see what commies find attractive about modern china
i mean at least under mao the rich were driven out and there was a sense of egalitarian collectivism
modern china has zero interest in supporting international revolution despite being very wealthy

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Aiden Flores
Aiden Flores

You're exactly what he is talking about.

Tankies support China, leftcoms and western maoists don't ;)

Mason Richardson
Mason Richardson

This thread turned me from being sceptical of China to fucking China Gang real quick.

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Levi Kelly
Levi Kelly

What is Jiang's Group? Who is Jiang, what did he do? And what is his Group?

Dominic Allen
Dominic Allen

Tankies support China, leftcoms and western maoists don't ;)
How many non-western Maoists support China, post-Mao? I'm pretty sure the RIM and Sendero Luminoso, who basically created Maoism (MLM), recognized the revisionism of Deng and the restoration of capitalism in China. You just had to add "western" to it to imply that there are imaginary brown people somewhere who agree with you, which somehow makes your anti-Marxist beliefs more legitimate, huh?

The CCP holds that cultural revolution, which is pretty fucking important to Maoism, is an ultra-left deviation. The CCP is not Maoist and doesn't claim to be.

Have fun waiting for the bourgeoisie to implement socialism out of the kindness of their hearts, against their own rational self-interests. I'll believe it when I see it.

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Christopher Davis
Christopher Davis

the CCP is what the Kuomintang have always wanted to be but couldn't due to incompetence. This is Sun Yat Sen's China, the Maoist dream is dead.

Adam Morgan
Adam Morgan

Nah ,odern China isn't Georgist. Also SYS was a democrat.

Asher Adams
Asher Adams

Mainland China also has more sympathy for Chiang Kai Shek than Taiwan does.

James Allen
James Allen

C O P I N G

Wyatt White
Wyatt White

I fear the Chinese as much as I fear the Americans.

Ryan Richardson
Ryan Richardson

And Chaing was a traitor to SYST. Reminder his wife was a maoists (and also sister in law to Chaing).

Samuel Clark
Samuel Clark

50c shill army is out full force today.

Kayden Scott
Kayden Scott

Proof?

Owen Perry
Owen Perry

shill army is out full force today.
Yeah, where do these anti-cpc shills come from?
I'm betting on the eternal pajeet.

Cameron Perry
Cameron Perry

On SYS' wifeu being maoist? user Mao made her the first president of China.

Henry Jackson
Henry Jackson

Hasn't Xi engaged the Chinese state in giving guns to the Naxalbari though?

Jayden Cook
Jayden Cook

This is done as part of negotiations with Trump. It largely won't work unless they explicitly accept tariffs on certain products or accept quotas. Expect Trump to call their bluff, Beijing to be caught red handed doing socialism, and trade talks failing resulting in higher tariffs right as NAFTA 2 is finalized and the midterms happen.

100% pure bullshit.

Nathaniel Price
Nathaniel Price

doing socialism

actually a better term is "market manipulation", exactly what capitalists do but because China is doing it via their government this is considered unacceptable.

Gabriel Evans
Gabriel Evans

I just wish China would do more to help countries resisting imperialism. They should also actively try to undermine the global financial system. They could easily crash the entire thing if, for example, they asked the US to pay its debts.

Liam Harris
Liam Harris

When Deng Xiaoping died on February 19, 1997, Jiang took a hatchet to the Party and began a series of swift pseudo-purges, removing many of the people Deng had appointed or were ‘too extreme’ for his tastes, replacing them with his own supportive cadres, many of whom were from Shanghai, earning his government the sobriquet, ‘the Shanghai Clique’.

With the death of Deng, Jiang was free to move all the necessary pieces into place to effectively hold his position as General Secretary and Paramount Leader.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_clique
The Shanghai clique (simplified Chinese: 上海帮; traditional Chinese: 上海幫; pinyin: Shànghǎi bāng) is the name given to an informal group of officials in the Communist Party of China, especially those who serve in the Central Committee or the Central Government of China, who rose to prominence in connection to the Shanghai municipal administration under Jiang Zemin, former General Secretary of the Communist Party of China.

This phrase was used somewhat pejoratively to describe Jiang's efforts to promote people who previously worked, or were associated with, his administration in Shanghai. However, none of the "Shanghai clique" members are originally from Shanghai, rather, the city is where they reached political prominence.[1] It is more appropriately referred to as the "Jiang clique".[2]

Chase Lewis
Chase Lewis

No, because if they asked the US to pay debts only one of two things would happen:

(a) the US would recognize Taiwan as the real China again, and pay them instead. Taiwan would happily accept it because they'd suddenly get money for free.

or

(b) the US pays up 100%, using new debt issued to the US Social Security Administration and US-based banks. China gets a brief influx of money, but is then slapped with sanctions which ruins their economy. Bonus: the GOP pass a balanced budget amendment and also gut social security to cut costs

The global economy wouldn't crash. China's would though, and younger Americans would find themselves without much of the social security that was guaranteed to their parents.

Joshua James
Joshua James

the US would recognize Taiwan as the real China again
Not even Taiwan recognizes Taiwan as the real China

Joseph Stewart
Joseph Stewart

I wouldn't say that's the case, they only entertain China as of recently because they've had money. But this can change, especially if the US government drops a shitload of money on their lap. But I also believe option (b) to be the more likely of the two.

Luis Green
Luis Green

China resisting imperialism
actively try to undermine the global financial system
Gee, I wonder why China doesn't stop the imperialism of its best WTO buddy, who then dumps part of the profits it plunders from other countries, right into China through shady trade deals and the finance industry.

It's amazing some of you still believe China isn't on America's team because of a few propaganda puff pieces in China Daily meant to placate the masses and a few neocons in the USA trying to increase military spending as high as possible.

Attached: 4D-Chess.png (106.37 KB, 1410x809)

Nolan Sanders
Nolan Sanders

(a) the US would recognize Taiwan as the real China again, and pay them instead. Taiwan would happily accept it because they'd suddenly get money for free.

I hope this happens just for the sheer troll value.

William Allen
William Allen

China is Bukharinite.

Oliver Thomas
Oliver Thomas

None of the younger generations expect to see their Social Security. That's a long forgotten laughable joke by this point.

Jason Anderson
Jason Anderson

eh I wouldn't say that. Most people have given up pensions yes (a part of social security, as a concept), but not the SSA itself. Whether or not Trump pulls the trigger on this or Pence does when he's President is anyone's guess.

Andrew Hill
Andrew Hill

/pol/

Jeremiah Clark
Jeremiah Clark

Nothing should come between China and the DPRK

stalinsmoustache.org/2018/03/28/kim-jong-un-and-xi-jinping-together-in-beijing/

Benjamin Foster
Benjamin Foster

stalinsmoustache.org

Attached: elvis.png (101.56 KB, 475x651)

Dominic Cooper
Dominic Cooper

China has no ability to manage North Korea. Controlling a neighbouring country runs counter to Beijing’s long-term foreign policy. China and North Korea treat each other as equals and respect one another.
The nature of the Beijing-Pyongyang relationship is utterly different from the Washington-Seoul alliance, which is comprehensively determined by the US and its troops in South Korea.

On the Korean Peninsula issue, Xi said that China sticks to the goal of denuclearization of the peninsula, safeguarding peace and stability on the peninsula and solving problems through dialogue and consultation.
“It is our consistent stand to be committed to denuclearization on the peninsula, in accordance with the will of late President Kim Il Sung and late General Secretary Kim Jong Il,” he said.

“The issue of denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula can be resolved, if south Korea and the United States respond to our efforts with goodwill, create an atmosphere of peace and stability while taking progressive and synchronous measures for the realization of peace,” said Kim.

Attached: kim-and-xi-02.jpg (90.33 KB, 900x506)

Henry Roberts
Henry Roberts

I'm pretty sure millennials don't even know what SSA is or cares. The ones who have, don't need, and the ones who don't have, want to die long before 64.

Isaiah Jenkins
Isaiah Jenkins

100% pure bullshit
Kill yourself.
<They insist that socialism, on the basis of historical materialism, will eventually triumph over capitalism.[57] In recent years, when the party has been asked to explain the capitalist globalization occurring, the party has returned to the writings of Karl Marx.[57] Marx wrote that capitalists, in their search for profit, would travel the world in a bid to establish new international markets – hence, it is generally assumed that Marx forecasted globalization.[57]

<Because of this there is considerable optimism within the CPC that despite the current capitalist dominance of globalization, globalization can be turned into a vehicle supporting socialism.[59] This event will occur through capitalism's own contradictions.[59] These contradictions are, according to party theorist Yue Yi from the Academy of Social Sciences, "that between private ownership of the means of production and socialised production. This contradiction has manifested itself globally as the following contradictions; the contradiction between planned and regulated national economies and the unplanned and unregulated world economy; the contradiction between well-organized and scientifically managed Transnational Corporations (TNCs) and a blindly expanding and chaotic world market; the contradiction between the unlimited increase of productive capacity and the limited world market; and the contradiction between sovereign states and TNCs."[60] It was these contradictions, argue Yue Yi, that led to the dot-com bubble of the 1990s, that has caused unbalanced development and polarization, and widened the gap between rich and poor.[61] These contradictions will lead to the inevitable demise of capitalism and the resultant dominance of socialism.[61]
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideology_of_the_Communist_Party_of_China

Jackson Martinez
Jackson Martinez

So what are the working conditions like in China?
I've heard they are really bad with workers having 18 hour shifts. Is that true? And what is Xi doing about Workers rights

Angel Williams
Angel Williams

I've heard they are really bad with workers having 18 hour shifts
That's not only insane. but also a total waste of human resources.

Working conditions are probably worse than in the West in the Special Economic Zones, but quite okay everywhere else. Remember the systems in Hong Kong and Macau weren't implemented by Bejing, but by London and Lisbon.

Grayson Taylor
Grayson Taylor

It's not a socialist society though, of course, but a part of the economy is a socialist mode of production.
Ah yea, socialism is when the government does stuff, and the more stuff the government does, the more socialistic it is.

Blake Bennett
Blake Bennett

CCP are socialist in the sense that Ba'athists are socialists, national development is the first concern, nit expropriation

Hunter Phillips
Hunter Phillips

I don't think you are familiar with the terminology. Ismail has recently made a good post on /marx/:

<Arguing that China is socialist because the state runs some of the larger companies is not an argument based in a Marxist conception of anything.
It is perfectly consistent with Marxism. What matters is what the dominant mode of production is. The Chinese state clearly holds the "commanding heights" of the economy, and the state is able to dictate to capitalist firms rather than vice-versa. See: workers.org/2013/06/13/marxism-and-the-social-character-of-china/

That there are billionaires in the CPC does not prove they decide its policy. The CPC also has some clergy among its members, but that obviously doesn't mean the CPC is a theocratic party.

<Why then do these people, who call themselves Marxist-Leninists, expect the billionaires and hundred-millionaires in the CCP to implement socialism, against their own rational self interests?
Because otherwise they won't be able to function as capitalists. Just like Lenin pointed out that Western businesses would stand to make a whole lot of money if relations between the Soviets and capitalist countries were normalized.

It is in the self-interest of capitalists to accumulate capital. That is what the Chinese government allows them to do. This also allows the rapid development of China's economy and living standards without disrupting the leading role of the socialist sector.

<There are not supposed to be billionaires in a socialist country.
There were actually millionaires in the USSR under Stalin: cominternist.blogspot.com/2010/06/soviet-millionaires.html

Socialism does not equate to egalitarian income distribution. Incomes actually became more equal under Khrushchev and his successors, to the detriment of productivity.

Furthermore, you know very well that you're strawmanning my argument on state ownership of the means of production. China's socialist sector came into being in the 1950s, it constitutes the dominant mode of production (just as slavery existed in the US before the Civil War and yet capitalism was still the dominant mode of production.)

Lenin himself noted in 1918 that there were five "socio-economic structures" operating in Soviet Russia at that time, from the most backward individual peasant farming to socialist industry. He concluded, "It is not state capitalism that is at war with socialism, but the petty bourgeoisie plus private capitalism fighting together against both state capitalism and socialism. The petty bourgeoisie oppose every kind of state interference, accounting and control, whether it be state capitalist or state socialist."

When China "opened up" in the 1980s, its socialist sector ceded some ground to private initiative. This latter sector does not rule the Chinese economy, nor the state apparatus. Tienanmen in 1989 was its big attempt at doing so, and it failed.

<Socialism completely goes against the rational self interests of Xi Jinping and his family and friends.
To the Communist Party of China, socialism is bound up with a massive increase in the productive forces of their country and the raising of living standards. It doesn't entail what Marx contemptuously termed "barracks communism," which is what the Cultural Revolution led to.

The goal of socialism is not to make Xi Jinping (or any other Party official) have a diminished quality of life; it is to make the rest of society better off by gradually narrowing the sphere of what Marx called "bourgeois right," culminating in communism where distribution is wholly based on needs.

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