How come so many leftists become indistinguishable from lifelong right wingers and start spouting "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" ideology the microsecond that someone talks about how dating culture in contemporary society is alienating millions of young men?
Can someone explain this to me? The kind of instant and reactionary garbage you get thrown your way for even daring to speak about this is as bad as it was during the the height of the vampire castle era.
If you're having trouble in the current year, try reading the Bible; going to church; getting baptized, etc. and try to find a girl in the church who shares hobbies/worldview/etc. Like honestly what do you expect if you try to date heathen girls. Not saying that Christian girls are perfect but you don't have to be a scientist to know that all the media promoting fornication and sexual freedom will probably create extremely depraved women looking for fun and not the sort of long lasting committed and loyal relationship type of girl you probably want.
The reason people get mad at incels is that generally they do not try at all to even so much as talk to girls and they expect free sex automatically like it's somehow a right. Staying celibate is fine too you know.
I mean, you're proving my point for me. This instant reactionary garbage is exactly what Zizek was talking about.
I can't wait until people like you get bored of LARPing as leftists and go back to being the liberals you all are.
Fuck off pathetic fuck. Socialism is not a thing of the bedroom. Incelposting is idpol garbage.
holy hell this level of projection is nothing short of beautiful
Please explain how my post was """"liberal"""". If anything it was the antithesis of it.
And by the way, I'm sure this is going to be exactly the winning attitude you need as Gen Z males grow up and become even more alinated than Millenials. Telling them to fuck off, pull themselves up by their bootstraps and that all their problems are imaginary is definitely a socialist thing to say.
All incel gen z guys will be forced to go gay and will provide sexual favors to millennial incels in exchange for companionship. There you go, problem solved.
How shall we distribute the means of cummies? One cunt for every dick? But what if one's cunt is prettier than the other? Maybe an ugly dick should get a hotter cunt and an ugly cunt a hotter dick. In the next generation, they should all be equal looking so everyone can looks match.
…I say as the american right wing continues to surge and young men get recruited by RWEs who want to lop off some commie heads.
Americans are literally retarded and their country has always been right wing, big fucking whoop. Killing commies won't solve any of their problems either so no idea who you're trying to engage with your spiel.
Don't you think it's funny how you liberals demand that hundreds of millions of men change their views about slut shaming, victim blaming, etc yet whenever a man suggests that women change their change their views when it comes to dating you start pretending that we're asking for something completely ridiculous and unheard of before?
Do you really think we want to force every woman to every man?
Rightists are faggots tho.
Women change their views on what? And furthermore, how can a beta like yourself even pretend to speak on behalf of all women?
Why are you in this thread? Please leave. This doesn't concern you.
so, "its not a problem, they deserve to be lonely, they should just go get some sex if they want it, they must just deserve it because I don't like how they express their frustration." People with issues' own interpretation of their issues is informed by how they see things and feel about things, which is itself warped by those issues. Its as idiotic to expect everyone to rise above this as it is to expect all the poor people to just go make some money, because a few might be able to. They just wanna fucking be with someone, man. Christ. They dont have many friends and have trouble interacting with people, the world is stressful and alienating, and their sexual urges get pent up, so some of them get frustrated and angry and express their frustration without trying to make it sound fucking nice and meek and considerate to you. Others get bitter and so, when they sometimes talk about these things, sound bitter. Some are retards whos frustration and alienation make them prime targets for retarded circlejerks of ideology, and so get into retarded shit like Holla Forums or r9k mysoginy. What they need are friends and a nice, mutually loving relationship. Idiots who get drawn into Holla Forums are liable to express this as 'KILL THE NORMIES' and 'STATE MANDATORY WIVES'. But you just shit on them because they're lonely, frustrated, and a fraction of them get drawn in by ideological circlejerks that feed on that.
Bro if you can't even charm a girl for the night I doubt you'll be rousing the masses any time soon, or find the balls to organize the workplace.
After the revolution relationships will return to the egalitarian distribution of one man one wife. Anything else is cruel social Darwinism. Do not listen to feminists, they are reactionaries who latch on to the far left in their ambitions to haremize society.
It's rather delusional to expect anything else from an image board, sexuality is one of them things that can't be discussed on here.
Btw I totally agree with you, it's a problem that should be confronted. We may agree for different reasons but we agree, this board doesn't want to talk about it because most of these threads degenerate into incelposting or /r9k/ posting.
Look, I’m not going to tell you to pull you up by your bootstraps but under socialism we will have freely available tech to make your face and body look like more than trailer park vomit ona Saturday night
Way to reveal your privilege.
Isn’t that what incels always come here to post about? Inevitably that image always gets posted with the Chad-tier guy telling the guy who looks like a fish to “Just be yourself, bro”
I guess this is where you go in and shift to gold-digging skanks who are only into guys for their money? I’m not rich and I have a girlfriend and many other working class men have to, Ive went through long periods of celibacy and have social anxiety—maybe not as bad as the typical /r9k/ poster tho.
Not sure what would make you guys happy besides a implementing a literal anti-communist parody of communism where everyone gets the same haircut and has the same level of attractiveness.
Most socialist countries promoted monogamy if for nothing else but social stability and solidarity. But the idea that we’re going to take Chad to the Gulag if he manages to pick up more than one girl is pretty damn absurd, sorry.
This whole post is a massive non sequitur. Feel free to address the central point of my post any time.
No? There are lazy deadbeats on every political spectrum and there are driven, passionate and do-it-yourself types as well. The right does not have a monopoly on successful alphas.
What is there to explain? Western dating has lost the sense of the sacred, the sanctity of marriage, people are perpetually "dating" each other for no reason other than private hedonism and social status. So you need to acquire social value and social skills otherwise you are on the bottom of the social hierarchy ladder.
addendum, re: why the male dominance in relationships, ALL WOMEN ARE WHORES, etc spook sappeal to them- they feel like they 're worthless and that a 'girlfriend' wouldnt really like them, and would just cheat on them with someone who was hotter/richer. this is a painful and scary thought. They feel like noone likes or cares about them, so it makes sense that dominance and arbitrary moral codes would be the only way or else they'd just be abused. Of coures this would be a toxic attitude in a real relationship, they should just both care about and love each other, and cooperate on equal grounds. But they dont fail to recognize this becaues they're just such fucking bad people. as a matter of fact ,not all of them even get like this. I'm a virgin NEET whos just too much of a nihilist to buy into /pol9k/ incel nazi spooks and not particularly self loathing. I can fucking see that other people have some problems I don't, and empathise enough to see how and why some of them at least think certain things. Its just fucking lonely and it hurts, and for people with more serious problems, starting off looking at things from a different perspective, its easy for that to manifest as stupid shit. That on a mass scale is a real problem. Like every other social issue, no, it is not as important as addressing the basic structure of society, and no, it should not take focus away from that, but it isnt not an issue.
This is kind of a secret. but I think you guys are mature/kind enough to comprehend this. I'm considering becoming gay. Why you may ask. Because dating women is too expensive, I have the worst luck with women, I'm growing tired of this.
I wish I knew. But I'm a victim of all of this, I have nearly gone crazy, over the frustration and the alienation I've suffered. I'm tall and clumsy 186cm tall and I used to be thinner, but as of now, I weight 77kg I'm so insecure that I consider myself to be ugly, but people say I'm good looking, I honestly don't know. my best friend also has no luck with women, he is 181cm tall he is a weight lifter he weighs 109kg he is good looking. but we are both poor. we play xbox360 and all the games are pirated, because we dont have more money to spend on the latest and greatest, our computers are frankensteins of scavenged computers, when wo go out we eat ramen and we are really cheap, some times we walk out the convince stores with some stolen stuff.
House niggers and uncle Tom's hang the highest. Never forget this.
I mentioned Holla Forums and r9k, implying their more retarded spooks. I didnt say I'm not critical of normalfags and how they think about and engage in socialization and romance.
Men are even more superficial than women if we're being real here. Good luck, if you do "go gay".
1. Because nobody is exploiting you by refusing to fuck you.
2. Because you are taking reactionary propaganda at face value whenever you further incel talking points. There are more female incels than male ones, men on average tend to have more sexual partners than women, women aren't exclusively looking for 6'4" chads, etc. Women compromise all the time with boring loser-ass men like you.
You think I'm joking?
I'm not even 5'4". I'm skinny fat, have more hair on my chest, back, stomach, legs and ass instead of my head, with a crooked nose that purposely broke when I tried out for football in high school.
Yes, I really think people like me need women provided to us. I have an amazing personality but that's not enough to get me a girlfriend or even laid. I only had sex four times with a big girl who later dumped me because she thought I was too "clingy." They'd rather be treated like property and fucked like a fleshlights instead of being an equal partner in a loving and trustful relationship.
This. Why can't we discuss sexual alienation and the effects it has on people? If we all had gfs, we'd probably be more motivated to bring about the revolution faster because we have something to fight for. Being alone and depressed does nothing for the revolutionary spirit!
That's because a tiny sexual elite are having sex with the lion's share of the women. Learn2statistics
You can talk about alienation and the way culture and technology can shape it (I think Tinder is awful), but you can't promote sexism and still call yourself a leftist. If you feel entitled to somebody else's body, you are a reactionary. Full stop.
If you do not wish to distribute relationships in an egalitarian manner that is for the good of society as a whole and wish to return the harems of paleolithic age you are a reactionary. Full stop.
It doesn't sound romantic, but being able to look past somebody's shortcomings is a compromise, no? Ugly men are in relationships. Fat men are in relationships. Bald men are in relationships. Short men are in relationships.
Incels are often incels because they're just plain misanthropic, and refuse to admit it.
They dont feel "entitled" to someone elses body you dense fuck. They're just angry because they're lonely. GIVE ME A GIRLFRIEND REEEEE is because they're angry, because they're lonely. If they had some deep-seated sense of "entitlement" they'd be some sort of date rapist. Thats more common amongst chad. Most of them just sit in their room. Again, not all of thse people are /pol9k/. And even for the ones who are, you sh ould stop and consider how /pol9k/ poach them. Instead you just go for the kneejerk tribal bullshit where they're evil others because /some of them/ go to the right. also, in case you were too thick to get this: They are not inherently reactionaries. Their aligning to the right(in the west, in the 2010s, and only some of them, in particular circles) is a momentary cultural phenomenon.
LMFAO! No one is buying that bullshit anymore. This is a common line used to shame honest, hardworking men like myself into making them believe they aren't worthy of female companionship or affection. The feminists say that line then go fuck the fratboy with his trumptard hat. If we the proles are entitled to a decent standard of living which includes means of production, healthcare, food, shelter and safety then we should be entitled to be loved!
'that feel when no gf' is a bourgeois stance on intimacy a relationship with another person ain't a citizen watch, bro you guys need to fucking relax
observe this one. theyre directly contradicting the statement "you arent entitled to someone elses body" How could they?! Thats obviously true! they must be reactionary facists!!! they are indeed saying something retarded. they're contradicting you, because by "you aren't entitled to someone elses body", what you meant was "you dont deserve to be happy just kill yourself already." You don't deserve companionship and you dont have it because you're worthless. you directly drove them into saying retarded reactionary shit by using egalitarian soundbytes, correct and good when taken on their own, as a bludgeon to mock them and tell them they deserve to be miserable.
I'm not the one in this thread telling people to kill themselves. I don't understand why grown men need to be treated with kid gloves when you tell them that they're behaving inappropriately. "Agree with me that all women are whores or I'll become a Nazi" isn't very convincing.
Feminism is already critical of a patriarchal culture that promotes this sexual insecurity in the first place. The way virginity is distinguished in men/women, the alpha/beta dichotomy, the concept of sex as conquest: these are all incredibly reactionary constructs. If somebody feels alienated by them, then the first step is to dismiss these constructs and offer alternatives. Yet that's precisely what causes so many men to throw a shit-fit, because the f-word threatens their fucking video games or something.
Women act like the bourgeoisie in the sexual free market, it's all just a sham to exploit their sexual capital to the fullest before it deteriorates. Hmmm.
The ownership class exploits the surplus value a worker's labor generates. Women who don't have sex with men exploit ??????
Please explain how you would ensure companionship in material terms.
More shaming. Silencing men with real complaints by telling them they're acting like little boys. You're trying to tell us to "man up" and be good little doormats.
Sexual inequality is a real problem and we must discuss it and how we can bring an equilibrium to it. You can help or get out.
More shaming and passive aggressive insults.
My attitude on this topic generally varies based on how the topic is being discussed. If the conversation steers towards entitled nonsense then I might be inclined to poke a bit of fun at someone unironically advocating for state-distributed gfs or whatever.
But I do think it's a problem. I'm not sure if it's just that people are being more vocal or what, but from my standpoint it seems like the current social dynamic is certainly deteriorating. Hell, I'm something on an incel myself. But the problem isn't women. If you're trying to make it about them then your unwittingly falling into an idpol/reactionary trap. In my opinion the problem stems from two big things: 1.) Alienation. People can't go out as often and it's hard to find a lasting partner (much less even consider having children) if you're living from paycheck to paycheck. 2.) Public Healthcare. I cannot speak for other nations, but with everything related to health going down the shitter in the US and this in my opinion definitely has something to do with this incel phenomenon. Depression is everywhere and it is destroying our motivations, our goals, for some even our will to go outside. If people could get the proper mental health care they need, I think this problem would subside substantially. 3.) Commodification. Capitalism has been eating away at our culture for some time now, and I'm beginning to worry that it's beginning to interfere with some of the most basic wants and needs, and our relationships are next on the chopping block. We're becoming so focused on the outwards appearance of social excellence and trends we're losing sight of what really makes us happy about social relations. The grounds of romance are being invaded by advertisements in fashion, enhancements, apps, what have you. This hurts twofold, in one standpoint, those that partake may find themselves feeling empty, and those that do not feel that they measure up to this new media's standards are crushed. Obviously this doesn't apply to everyone, and if you've found an SO through tinder or what not, then I'm genuinely happy for you. But I hope this doesn't prevent you from seeing the problems that are surfacing for others.
I'm certain that there are more factors, but none are coming to mind.
In summary, I don't really have an issue with incels in principle. However, if your conclusion to the alienation you face is that "all women are sluts", or you begin to feel that society owes you something at the expense of others for this, or that it's the jews or the cultural marxists, or female biology, then you are part of the problem.
Capitalism is the problem. Not her. If you want to see something change, you have got to fight for it at the source.
State sponsored matchmaking. Those that refuse to take part will be left alone but they must be celibate for the remainder of their life. If they take part in sexual misconduct then they will be imprisoned. To avoid sex in prison put the offenders in their own cell.
I do try to help, but it doesn't mean I have to accept fundamentally right-wing conclusions about sexuality. Your legitimate insecurity has been exploited by bad faith arguments from people who profit off of misery. I don't see how you're going to get anywhere if you categorize women as an oppressor class. It sounds a little idpol, you know?
Yeah, that's Holla Forums as fuck. Sorry.
t. sad and ugly nerd one day you will find a fat chick and you will be happy
Why is it so hard to admit Chads and females are also apart of the problem. Females don't try to fuck Chad because Chad is forcing them to. They do it because they see him as a superior male and if they can't get him they settle for someone else within their reach.
It isn't sexist to point this out. It's the same as males wanting to fuck the youngest, sexiest girl they can find. If they can't they'll settle for whatever they can get.
it isn't a threat, you horrible cunt. They don't like feminism because feminism and feminists dont like them. Or men in general. Yes, i'm aware thats the right wing talking point about feminism. Yes, i'm aware its not true of feminist "theory". It is actually the average, vulgar, simplified normalfag feminism though, and theory does not matter here, what matters is the vulgar, basic, meme version people get exposed to.
Did you actually read my post? Or, if you realize I wasnt promoting le forced girlfriends, why did you respond to me as well? I'd hope for a healthier culture towards sex and relationships and otherwise generally try to resolve the alienation that results from capitalism. Probably try to have some social programs, too.
found the whores
Lol. What a fucking White Knight. Maybe if you prep the bull harder she'll let you get some finally
I don't agree with inceposters but the fact is most feminists don't stick up for men either in the alienating aspects of the "gender struggle" or in the class struggle. The vast majority of feminists are liberals, the word lost any sense of danger in the 1980s and the liberals flooded in–it was totally dead by the 1990s with the whole commodified riot grrrrl thing.
Tbh the fact feminism stood aside from the communist movement nitpicking under the guise of friendly criticism had already been noted by socialist thinkers like Lenin, Luxembourg and Kollontai.
I tend to agree with Zizek on another aspect of this too, the society that we live in is oppressive for women but post-patriarchal. It isn't a coincidence btw that communist groups with an ultra-feminist line like MIM they were famous for the all sex is rape/sterilize all men lines started becoming friendly with the ideas from the Men's Rights movement as a new phase in the struggle. Their concept of a "gender aristocracy" similar to the 1st world labor aristocracy in their frame of reference would have definitely been a welcome concept on /r9k/. They took it even further by arguing that black men in prison are socially gendered as females because of the fact of their oppression.
It sort of makes you wonder how far sex=/=gender and other "intersectional" frames of reference can go. I don't think I have the answers but I would say that both man and woman under capitalism are condemned to a quite miserable state.
If you're a female I will bet the very little I have you have friendzoned really great guys because they weren't handsome you rejected them. Yet you are in an on and off fuck relationship with your ex who treats you like shit but is handsome.
I don't get you Holla Forums types. One minute you pretend to be an ally to the lost and alienated, but as soon as they leave your narrative you're just as toxic as anyone else. It's so disingenuous.
Read above. I lost my only gf because I was being a good bf. I later found out from a mutual friend I wasn't challenging enough. Apparently I needed to fight with her about what to watch on TV or where to eat out because giving her what she wants is bad!
Hippies were liberals. Committed Commies in the 60s were angry middle aged guys/girls in suits or dressed in leather and berets in the case of the BPP
off to a great start. I can't imagine why women don't date you.
You could argue the same thing about socialism, and it'd be inane.
How about starting with yourself? The posts you make are dripping with online outrage culture.
Money won't be a factor at least.
What does anything you said have to do with my post?
Forgot shit flag
Imagine just how much more popular would the Left's cause be if it gave the sad incel nerds a non-zero chance of getting laid.
Same is true if you're single
I'm going to stop responding to you because you are being so transparently Holla Forums that I'm probably being trolled. I was friends with somebody but I didn't suck his cock. How horrible of me.
they're either normalfags, just edgy young republican normalfags, or wannabe chads. muh hierarchy.
I use the word cunt in the generically profane english sense, you cunt. I dont care what gender you are. No, itd be entirely correct. This isnt about whether something in a socialist or a feminist book is right, its about whether anyone will actually read it and see that it is. OK daddy peterson, ill stop criticizing society and sort myseslf out sorry :🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧(
Radical feminism was partially born out of disgust with new left politics and the cynical way in which free love was leveraged by men to get what they wanted from women before pushing them back down. 21st century forms of wokeness like polyamory and "sex-positivity" are facets of that same mindset and are alienating to men and women alike. Yet somehow these ideas have come to be the public face of feminism.
You mention different things except the actual causes of sexual inequality. Like I said, why is it so hard to see how the guys at the top have the majority of women and the bottom tier men are doomed to die alone and miserable and incel? If we are striving towards equality for all then we should give equality for all.
How the fuck can anyone talk about seizing the means of production and redistributing wealth when there is a great sexual inequality that needs redistribution?!
I read you like a book and hit the nail on the head. You probably think your nice guy male friend whom you friendzoned was probably creepy for having feelings for you but the guy you're currently fucking who treats you like shit is so great. I've seen this so many times. You're a joke. This is why feminism will never be taken seriously.
You cant posssibly be the same poster who was saying incels would be feminists if they werent just such reactionary mysoginists. please apply this idea of the public face of feminism not being representative of whatever feminists you actually like, and consider how people who never saw the ones you like will see the idea of "feminism". most of what I think about sex, gender roles and sexuality has been a talking point for one or another feminist group yet I don't label myself one. can you please see, from that, why I might make that choice?
man it's a problem about education. I get it, it's unjust having to suffer this, but forcing people to sign up to a State sponsored matchmaking thing sounds awful. I once read an article that people in the GDR had a happier sex life and they didn't had that State sponsored matchmaking.that you are proposing.
Your daily reminder that women's liberation is male enslavement. Pregnancy has never been less of a problem, birth control is given out like candy, abortion is available on tap, and they still don't want to fuck you. Makes you think huh?
No it makes total sense. I think liberal feminism is a real problem, just like liberalism is a real problem.
As leftists we need to present alternatives to both.
How so? You know what sounds awful too? to reactionaryfags taking property from the rich and redistributing to those who really need it. You can call it theft but I call it justice.
This is your last reply. Maybe screencap it so you can jerk off later. "All men are either ugly nice guys or good-looking assholes" is some vintage fedora-meme era shit. If you read me like a book, then I read you like a glaring light-up billboard. Assuming you're not getting your kicks ironyposting like it's 2010, I'd advise you to seriously re-evaluate your thought process. Good luck.
but sexual intercourse's aren't and relationships aren't property. I know. Under capitalism those can be sold. but man, it just sounds awful, having to register people under a state sponsored program, for match making. we have to get rid of capitalism in the first place and then let the people be free. I think people will start to gather around by itself once the material conditions change. if you view sex as a class struggle man that rings so many alarms.
You really got triggered about that. Thanks for proving my point with your replies. I guess even feminists want alpha bad boys instead of the guys who were taught to respect women and treat them like partners instead of property.
One more thing. Does your alpha bad boy fuckbuddy not bf because he doesn't want a relationship even though you really do. You're happy being his fleshlight and secretly hope one day he loves you back have tattoos and some sort of addiction such as drug, tobacco or alcohol? of course he does :^)
We've already had this thread, and we already told you we don't care about you, faggot.
Thanks for the honesty. It's nice when a movement claims to be for the common man actually means they're for their own interests.
Why do people get mad at each other when they cheat then? What is marriage? What are the children from a relationship?
I know you think this is a good time to come in and drive a wedge but I don't want a slave. I want a wife who loves me and I love back. Partners, equal in our relationship. If the State can provide for the people like food, shelter, healthcare then why can't it provide marriage in an age of extreme sexual inequality?
oh well. I genuinely felt like I wanted to read a reasonable discussion but you derailed everything with your insane proposal. My goal is to get rid of private property. people are not property. douche behavior. I view it as a free union of people. Children are little people.
I'll clarify again, since you seemed distracted by the insults: I am not defending the ideas of /pol9k/(all women are whores, forced girlfriends, etc) as not all that wrong. They're false. People do not go to these ideas because they're just such nasty, reactionary bigots. I dont even think its actually a majority of people like this who do. I repeat myself:
Lonleyness is a real problem, and this attitude that they just deserve it and are awful is disgusting. Presming all of them to be r9k is just a way to rationalize it, and so is portraying r9k as innately reactionary and terrible rather than as gullible fools vulnerable to propoganda. So I wasnt particularly inclined to be polite.
You do know you're doing exactly the same thing as 'every man is my ex boyfriend' tumblrinas here, right? And, scumbag chads are constnatly pressuring women to go out with them. They persist. They're also psycopathic shitbags who will lie and pretend to love them to get pussy. The woman who falls for it will not come out of that experience as capable of maintaining a good relationship as she went in. Her ideas about love and relationships will be warped in unhealthy ways to some extent or another.
Fuck off and just say you think sex should be for the handsome people like you. You know? The ones on the top?
Don't run away. Answer the question. Why do people get mad when the other cheats? Because they view their partner as theirs. So yes relationships are property dumbass. Feel free to write an essay splitting hairs and using convoluted terminology to make your points. I'm sure you'll win the lurkers who are reading this.
its abusive. why though? its just a ceremony formalizing the fact that two people are in a relationship. what matters is the relationship. both people in a relationship do sort of 'owe' each other support, attention, sexual attention, etc, so one could construe it as some kind of "property". thats a toxic and stupid way of looking at it, though. nor does it really make much sense if you think both people should cooperate as equals, seeing as how itd mean both parties own and are owned by their property. its just a social bond, property is a bad metaphor for social bonds.
I don't even care enough to consider it a plight. Seriously, make sure to turn the safety off when you pull the trigger.
I'm pretty sure that's not what user was implying
Doesn't make it true. Ancaps view children as property and that's fucked up. If my girlfriend is property then can I trade her for some magic beans against her will?
Yeah those Chads threaten, harass and stalk women if they don't go out with him for a few drinks or Netflix and chill. Females call it the chase. Apparently they like that just like they want a guy who "challenges" them. God forbid you want to live in peace and do what they want in order to make them happy. So they have their consent to Chad to pump them full of semen? Chad didn't pressure them did he? Yet she could've avoided it with the nice guy who treated her right instead of the douchebag who mistreats her. Good! Fuck her. They're our equals right? If some guy fucked a chick he knew was crazy then that's his fault. Why are we giving them passes?
Enslave or be enslaved there is no equality.
I'm with at this point. Neck yourself. "Nice guys" are the manipulative ones.
Thanks for being elitist. I guess if you're not hungry then all the hungry people in the world should kill themselves. I'm suspecting that you're trolling me but your replies are so weak it can't possibly be.
Nice strawman retard. I asked why do people in relationships get mad when the other cheats. It's because they view their partner as theirs. Can you trade your partner for magic beans? No. Can you lay claim to your partner as solely yours and no one else's? Yeah.
I hate you so much right now because you have awakened this radical communist incel spirit in me. I'm about to organize the masses and burn down Tinder, OkCupid and even fucking Craigslist buildings for their massive part in sexual inequality.
Everyone today is an apologist for the baseness of current society. Capitalism has degraded Humanity so much that no longer do we care for achievement besides meme rocket men that don't sterilize the shit they send in outer space.
I ask you a simple question: You are a human being, potentially the highest point of evolution in the entire fucking universe and you spend your time thinking about how to nut. What is wrong with you?
Soon CRISPR will exist and your views will be somewhat rationalized. No longer will the billionaires end up with unattractive failsons. Maybe if you wanted this to not happen you could advocate for a system that was more equal. Alas you care more for your own plight, masking it as a class issue when you are mad about a base activity. Many people have struggled to get to the point at which we inhabit. At this point in time women may have it easy but you have to realize that for millennia they did not. You now have the luxury of sexual frustrations and issues being the result of a lack of positive experiences instead of an abundance of negative ones.
Also the only human relationships that can even be considered mutual and loving are f/f.
You are right Cheating is a form of abuse but I never viewed it as such. I view it as a cooperative relationship with more commitment and responsibility. This. This will fuel the delusions of the tanktard.
You better leave. The ☭TANKIE☭ is insane enough on it's own you will catalyze his corruption and craziness.
Only in marriage, even then, your partner is free to get a divorce. YOU DON'T OWN THEM. PEOPLE GET JEALOUS, SO FUCKING WHAT?
Tinder has little to do with it. Either put women in cage or you will be in one. There's no two ways about this. You need to take away their rights and restore natural order.
I agree with tankman here, actually. Fuck tinder, it's superficial and shallow. OKCupid will put you on their frontpage IF YOU PAY. Dating services like that are vile
chad lies to her and manipulates her. she thinks he loves her, it hurts when he doesn't really, she doesnt really want to believe it. this breaks a person a little. women disproportionately end up with men with characteristics like this because men wich these characteristics are disproportionately likely to ask women out and 'persist'. as well, this sort of thing is romanticized in popular culture, so they're more vulnerable to it to start off. and its not as though all women actually are like this, any more than all non-chads are incels, or all incels are pol9k.
I found that one on tumblr. They're not wrong about everything, not all the time.
Sad incel nerds want sex. Capitalism will provide it. Sex dolls, sex robots, VR sex, relationship surrogates, you name it. One more victory for Capital. One more step into alienation. Here you guys are, bickering about rights, values, ethics, while Capitalism skirts all that and creates a commodity. Another facet of human being absorbed by the machinery, while the ineffectual Left is too busy bickering over "nerd entitlement" or whatever.
Yes, I care more about hungry people than you getting your dick wet. Aiming slightly down through the mouth, or pointing the barrel at the rear base of the head damages the spinal column where it meets the base of the skull (base of the head at the back). It tends to be quickly fatal. Give it a try.
Also, part of the problem is relationships aren't organic anymore with the advent of sex-seeking services such as tinder or okay cupid
Another feminist apologist. You can be leftist and not be a feminist. I want equality not this system is inequality where Chads rule and if you're lucky you can marry Stacy when she's completely ruined. But Stacy would rather be alone with her dozen cats and vibrator than be with me.
"Nice guys" are push-overs that think being nice is all it takes. THEIR respect for women is fake. It's not respectful to treat a woman like a delicate little flower.
This "Chad" you describe is just a tool. Tools attract sluts. Do you want a slut?
So your gf is free to cheat on you because "you don't own her!" I want to use the c word but I don't want to because fuck it you're a fucking cuckold. I may be a short, bald, hairy asshole but I will never let my gf get fucked by other men
This is unironically a possible solution to the incel question. In the same way that weak prisoners become women in the eyes of their fellow inmates, men imprisoned by their own sexual paranoia can start to use each other to assuage their self-hatred. This arrangement is still incredibly patriarchal, but it removes two reactionary elements from the dating pool at once. This is already what's happening to a certain extent. Most trans-identified males are incels who arrived at a different conclusion.
Yeah, pretty much. I've been cheated on. It sucks. I moved on once I realized the problem was with her. She was a slut.
Both the "nice guys" and actually nice guys don't get much sex.
My man using the word cuckold is always justified if you're talking about a literal cuckold
There's nothing "patriarchal" to my solution nigger
I really don't get why you have that impression myself. but any way… I was being sarcastic, just to poke some fun at you given the fucking shit show that you provided.
she thinks he loves her, it hurts when he doesn't really, she doesnt really want to believe it. this breaks a person a little. Complete bullshit. Read my posts above with the feminist. She friendzoned a good guy, she's now getting fucked by an asshole who treats her like a fleshlight. She thinks one day he'll love her but Chad has options and he will never settle down with a slut.
very much this. the idea of wanting to prevent someone from cheating on you is fundementally stupid because you should not want to be with someone who would. they're scum. you dont want to prevent a terrible partner from being terrible to you, you want to not go out with them, and rectify your mistake if you realize you've made one.
Most "nice guys" are "nice guys" who think they're nice guys.
I know it's a crazy idea, but people who are confident, friendly, and non-abusive do enjoy a healthy sex life.
Not to make a bad thread worse, but trans-indentified males tend to embody a lot of the ugly stereotypes men have of women, which makes sense because they themselves are men.
Trying to force someone to be a gender they don't want to be is reactionary. Back to reddit
Reread what you wrote. If you don't care about sexual inequality, you won't care about hungry people because neither affects you. I'm guessing you're some sort of champagne socialist a la Bernie?
Not an argument
Wow really? So feminism teaching me to respect them is fake? It can't be because I'M THE FUCKING NICE GUY IN THAT EXAMPLE AND THAT FAT CUNT STILL CALLED ME NEEDY FOR TAKING CARE OF HER! But if you treat her like a whore she'll really appreciate it. Why not? I only had sex 4 times with 1 big ungrateful bitch.
incel sexual frustration isnt politics it is not society's problem that you dont get pussy, i dont give a shit if you do or not.
Society has no role in the current sexual inequality we face today? Is that really what you're saying? So who's problem is it?
this has really gone down the drain when the discussion has shifted to the "nice guys" meme, but Ill bite What about people who are C, but neither A nor B then? someone can be actually nice, but reclusive, socially anxious, and offputting to most people. More importantly though, someone whos basically a decent person can be bitter, mean, and get nasty when faced with human interactions. This sort of nurture over nature shit should be obvious to any socialist. People who are miserable are often also nasty. They're not miserable because they're nasty, they're nasty because they're miserable, because of their environment and past.
RESPECT is treating them like humans. Not something above you, not something below you. Are their women who love being dominated? YES. Abused? NO. THEY ONLY LIKE IT WHEN ITS CONSENSUAL. You, my friend, need to go out and meet people. Not everyone is the same. Learn to read people. With enough practice you'll be able to tell what a girl is into by how she acts. If you're a fat fuck, start working out. I don't know what else to tell you. This isn't a life or death situation. Socialism is under no obligation to provide sex for you. If this tiny detail is that much of a problem for you, maybe you should head on over to Holla Forums and start making friends with them. You'd fit right the fuck in.
you having a faggy maladaptive inadequacy complex cause you fuckin browse 4chan all day isn't society's fault dude, i really don't know what to tell you people either make yourself fuckable or get over it
lel swing and a miss fyi, if you used a shotgun to the head, it would have a 99% success rate, and 100% chance of making the world a better place.
Then you can work to reform society to address their material concerns and hopefully make things less miserable, but it doesn't obligate you to be sucked into their personal vortex of negativity.
It's the same as with alcoholics or severely autistic people; you can address the root causes of their distress in a non-judgmental manner, but you're not supposed to accept the destructive behavior that manifests from their conditions.
What if he has social anxiety? What if he has autism? I don't think what he wants, or at least what he needs, is a fuck buddy. What if hes chronically depressed? What if any of thees things plus a history of being abused by his parents, or bullied at school? Or, any combination of those things, and/or any of those other ones, and it all just being exacerbated by a history of lonelyness? This guy is sperging out, but thats not just a fucking meme insult. People with problems sometimes throw fits. Have some empathy, especially since its not like you actually have to live with them or something.
None of the people shitting on the incels seem to have any interest in making things less miserable for them, nor would I describe their stance as "non-judgmental."
You won't understand because you are dumb lol
smells like uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh slave morality buddy
Obviously culture puts too much pressure on young men with the whole dating mating shit. You don't see incel women doing Elliot Rodger type stuff.
Convenient. I know it might be a radical idea, but I don't think personal virtue correlates very well with finding a mate. An even crazier idea - "friendly and non-abusive" aren't attractor qualities in themselves. Like, you meet a guy who is friendly and non-abusive, is very much into intersectional feminism or whatever…and I somehow don't think any of this has sex appeal. Attractor qualities would be looks, status, confidence. If a guy has this, great, you're interested. Then, depending on how much self-respect you have, you might eliminate him based on not being nice enough, friendly enough, or not into feminism (or whatever) enough. In theory. In practice it's very easy to find stories of literal human garbage finding women to sleep with, ruining their lives with physical and emotional abuse, before dumping them and finding a new girlfriend/victim within a week.
So, if there is a guy, and he is genuinely nice, friendly, non-abusive and into feminism, or whatever. But just lacks in attractor qualities. Then suggesting to him that he should be nicer, friendlier and less abusive is a bit disingenuous. Please don't do this. He might be naive enough to believe you.
Fuck off vulture
Because there are no female analogues to Elliot Rodger. 2/10 bottom of the barrel ham beasts get regular sex. While all males below 8/10 are either incels or hardly ever getting laid. This is Feminism and women's liberation.
I think socialism and radical feminism will create a healthier society and sexual climate for all people. But I don't accept the reactionary talking points espoused by most incels, and let them know that they're behaving inappropriately when these topics come up. This can lead to the perception that incels are being shat on, even when we're trying to make the world less hostile to all working people. If they can part from this delusion and drop the right-wing stance on sex, they'll be met with open arms by the left.
You're so poisoned by liberalism that you think you can quantify attractiveness.
(Actually you're just an insecure young man who is not beyond redemption. This is literally what high school kids think. You'll grow out of it.)
It's just the way he portrays himself. He has made no mention of disabilities. He has given no reason for his situation.
imagine believing this
Almost all of my normie class mates with average physiques and without any special qualities either have gfs or already married with girls of similiar standing, I don't know where you are getting these 8\10 2\10 meme, maybe from shit like tinder where people are commodified to the max.
I'm not even going to dignify this with a response. You should feel really stupid for wasting bandwidth.
I "get it" mostly from going outside and interacting with the world.
Women just kill themselves instead of other people. It's not like misery is a competition. Patriarchal norms harm men and women alike.
It's the 80/20 rule. 20% of the population does 80% of X. 20% of the population is having 80% of the sex.
This is embarrassing. Develop a personality dawg. Make a friend or two (don't try to fuck them). Get a hobby. Jack off more. I don't really care but do something productive instead of bitching on leftypol.
It's a handful of autismo posters who have a deep hatred for Holla Forums. It's convenient for them to tell them to fuck off because it makes it seem like their above the incel-type pol users when they're probably in the same boat themselves. They're also probably the most unread group who post here. They devolve the issue to simplistic terms like sex and vagina: or retarded analogies: to make the issue seem ridiculous, whilst being unwary of human social needs.
Imagine a hypothetical world where Holla Forums wasn't involved in image board culture. Some book or study is published showing how this issue relates to economics. These very same autist would be posting this in a late stage capitalism thread with no qualms, just like with every other social issue. Isn't it odd how this is the only issue leftypol spergs on? Literally the only topic that we don't universally agree on, other than minor ideological tendencies. And it just so happens this is probably the most pressing issue for Holla Forums, it's why the words/memes cuck, bbc, chad, soyboys are the most used there. There's an element or theme of sexual tension on Holla Forums and that makes Holla Forums reactionary towards it.
tl;dr egoistical projection, falling for spectacle
how come people call everything bad that happens to people under capitalism patriarchy?
Like hot girls need to fuck me without any real effort?
Most incels(as in, 'beta virgins', not so much people who use it as an identity label) are normal people. I'd bet money the majority by percentage are generic left-ish liberals, and most hardcore NEET hikkis just hate all political discussion and just want to escape into their fantasy world. inasmuch as they're political, they're succdems who just want their autism bux. The ones that go right are suckered in by propoganda made to appeal to them. Saying "well, the left is waiting when you stop being a reactionary" is stupid. It provides no alternative to /pol9k/ propoganda, it doesnt even acknowledge that its real or an influence, it implies that they're just, for no reasson, facists, and thats like, their problem I guess. I cannot see the incels=reactionaries idea as anything but a justification for cruel hearted disdain. Please prove me wrong.
Having sex won't suddenly make your life better. In fact it can be the opposite. A hobby will make your life better.
When you try to turn your inability to talk to girls into a philosophy
It almost sounds like all that talk about sexual liberation was just complete bullshit and a rationalization to treat people like subhumans, specially those who fall on the lower end of the looks and social status ladder.
Because the concepts of masculinity and femininity predate capitalism. Abdullah Öcalan wrote a very short book that attempts to link the two concepts, if you're interested.
I have hobbies. I do bathe regularly. I even have friends and go outside regularly and maintain a job. I dont have any deformities either. but i can't get a relationship or sex.
Keep on revealing your privilege, though.
Well then the next thing to do is to stop bitching. Or hire a fucking prostitute idc.
So, nothing is wrong with you at all?
No one cares about high you put pussy on a pedestal.
Men kill themselves more than women. Class conscious feminists wanted to deal with this long ago but they've been driven out by liberal feminists and coopted. I'm surprised you never replied to my post but spent the thread arguing with incelposters. Guess you love reddit-tier debate.
Yes. I'm average to below average in every conceivable way. I'm simply a victim of hypergamy and female mating strategy through no fault of my own whatsoever. I'm not exactly a rarity either.
Capitalism is simply the next dimension of darwinian selection. Selection. Pressure. Optimization. Evolution. Repeat. Ultimately organizing matter into a more efficient bacterium just follows the same pattern as organizing matter into a more efficient toaster. It's always just Capitalism, even in the time before capitalism with a lower-case c.
If most incels are normal people, then there is no problem with most incels. Most self-professed incels that you find yourself arguing with online are beholden to reactionary sex politics because they've already honed their arbitrary status into an ideology.
Do you really think feminists or numales or chads or whatever other bogeyman there is have a problem with virgins who just like playing Warhammer together? No. All antagonism is directed at the subset of incels who are vocally reactionary in the first place.
Youre not entitled to someone elses affection.
And if you think you are. You won't get it.
no problem, bump.
What you really mean is "you can't afford affection".
fyi, thread was anchored. have fun, tho. I'm out.
More like depressed angry white boys wanting to control who women can and cant fuck.
This is ahistorical. Gender intersects with class, but will still have to be contended with a post-capitalist society. Developing consciousness in one aspect doesn't preclude one from being conscious of the other anyway. I think you have a visceral revulsion to the term "patriarchy" itself, which you associate with online screaming matches I guess.
cool, but we all know you'll be frustratedly monitoring the thread.
surely there's a reason for why this is, right? go read a book retard
Consider: Women in the state of modern western society are the bourgeoisie, holding monopoly power over the distribution of sexual gratification, a commodity not just necessary for mental health but indeed the very continued existence of the human race. This monopoly of the specifics of distribution is legally entrenched in every industrialized country with massive penalties for breaching it, and even the statistics quoted by the most wild-eyed servitors of the bourgeoisie suggests that it is upheld in upwards of 99% of all sex transactions. The sexual proletariat, therefore, scratches just the tip of its yawning need by conforming to the edicts issued by the Wall Streets and Chateaubriands of the movement. These edicts are increasingly arbitrary, historically unprecedented and unknown in a state of nature - sexual equality, nonviolence, monogamy, and consent. And even these merely scratch the surface; there are also nebulous, contradictory and ever-shifting considerations of wealth, status, material possessions, social marketability, personality characteristics, fashion, and arbitrary matriarchal definitions of beauty decreed from on high as quite literal barriers to entry. All bourgeois monopolies seek to protect their power base by attacking those who would undercut the source of their power, and here too we see the expected result. Strippers, porn stars and prostitutes are all derided by the reactionary mouthpieces and it is demanded that the State put them out existence. And why not? They are seen as scabs or bootleggers, responding to demand by distributing products of comparable value for a far lesser cost outside the traditional business model (this is to be seen in the claim that these professions are "debasing" to women, i.e. it literally lowers the value of their salable commodity.) The rapist, therefore, commits a revolutionary act, retaking some power from the oligarchy that in a coup d'etat gained quite literal control of the means of production, not of just ultimate commodities but labor-power itself.
It doesn't matter. The patriarchy will 100% be restored in my lifetime. Either through an internal reworking of sexual politics or through our hyper patriarchal MENA imports. I guarantee it.
I imagine a fat incel hambeast who sees a fat guy with a thinner more attractive girl has similar thoughts.
Too the wall with you
I don't follow. Are you implying females hate males in their tier of attractiveness or below? I'd agree with that.
What does the Holla Forums-Holla Forums shit you're bringing up have to do with this? The subject of the thread is lonely virgins, not 'geeks' or 'gamers' or whatever. And most of this thread, and discussions about this, casually equate beta virgins with r9pol, and any attempt to discuss male lonleyness with STATE MANDATED GFS NOW. Not that the people actually saying that help, but that doesnt make it less worth addressing. And thirdly, non-r9pol losers say and think r9pol-sounding things without actually being reactionaries or very political at all, just out of misanthropy, bitterness, and insecurity. Thats one of the reason reactionaries have such an easy time pulling some of them in.
Please don't post in this thread if you're stupid.
Most "attractor qualities" are behavioral themselves. 90% of physical attraction in both sexes is related to grooming. The glaring exception (in men) is height, but this is still a social construct. Women in non-Western countries don't discriminate based on height to the same extent.
Unless a man has an exceptionally unfortunate facial condition, nothing about his attractiveness is innate.
So "just be nice" could be disingenuous advice if the man were also obese and didn't wash his face, but those things can be changed.
I love how you all just flock to the biggest and most obvious shitposts and completely ignore all the ones that bring up legitimate points about this subject.
I would say don't be nice to get laid. Be nice because you don't want to be an asshole.
par for the fucking course in these threads.
Incel ideology is shit but the way ostensibly left-wing people go para-capitalist self-improvement cult whenever the issue gets brought up isn't any better. The whole thing brings out the worst in everyone.
Stay mad you greasy swede virgin.
waaah look at this obvious incel troll he confirms all my beliefs about alienated men
Like forcing women to be with unlikable men, in some type of weird arranged marriage form of communism because muh feelings? Muh sad virginal male feelings.
This is getting tedious. If you're not reactionary, then you're not my target. I don't know what else you want me to say.
IDK if you noticed but we live under capitalism. If I came in here claiming I was getting kicked out of my apartment for not paying my rent you would tell me to get a job. We might agree that the system is fucked but pretending we live in a different one isn't helpful either.
Yeah. I think a lot of these people have problems making friends of any sex. Maybe that should be their first challenge: prove you're actually a nice person by getting five other men to like you before even worrying about sex.
Extremely few people are actually agreeing that the system is fucked. For decades liberals pushed that "sexual liberation" ideology when all it did was create an even worse hierarchy than before, one where relationships and people are disposable.
Self improvement is capitalist?
If your fat and women dont want anything to do with you. The logic tjing to do would be to lose wieght to better your chances right? You do know that women are concious being with agency of their own right?
The fuck does this even mean?
Again, it is important to recognize Capitalism as an ancient and ultimately inhuman process for which we happen to be willing hosts. It is synonymous with evolution. Capitalism only has anthropomorphic features because it still needs humans to operate it, - when you automate factories, when you replace the CEO with a genetic algorithm, when the factories no longer create commodities for people, but other factories, when there are no longer boards of directors, just automated banks, - for how long do you think Capitalism will keep its human facade? It doesn't need windows, safety rails, chairs, office cubicles or carpeting if there are no humans involved.
Gender is a weird offspring of different iterations of Capitalism. Sexual reproduction existed before humans developed consciousness and grafted a lot of meta-intuitions to it that we've come to recognize as gender norms. Patriarchy arose from sexual dimorphism, then mutated and evolved in response to selection pressures, environmental and social. Some societies evolved to be more patriarchal than others. We've inherited much of the system from the time before humans, which is why we're having so much problem just deleting the old culture-OS and replacing it with a new one. The kernel wasn't designed by us.
Which part of my post confused you?
I kind of agree with the system is fucked but I don't think that sexual liberation is the problem.
If it's not sexual liberation than what is it? Don't say capitalism. Even malnourished gutter dwellers in Calcutta who make a dollar a day cleaning the sewers are guaranteed a wife.
It's sexual liberation and nothing but.
No, I'm not porky, a rightist bootlicker, or some autismo who post here. Millions of people live paycheck to paycheck. At the very least I'd give you some advice instead of being reactionary
A combination of an out-of-control welfare state that just gives to people no matter how worthless and anti-social they are, make-work jobs/affirmative action and bad propaganda designed to tell women to work rather than the reality of when fertility declines and how quickly is why you have so many women who only fuck guys way above what they could reasonably expect a serious relationship with, and then write articles for HuffPo or the Guardian when they are 40 years old wondering what happened.
It's why you see these Pareto distributions. The Chad meme is real life, Sven.
Most non-Europeans are genetically shorter is the thing. So if you're a standard-sized "manlet" between say 5'6 and 5'9" that is perfectly acceptable to people where their tallest men tend to be 5'7"ish. Of course then you'd be doing the miscegenation bit and we all know how well that works out in the end on a large enough scale.
What about forcing men to pay for unlikable and destructively anti-social women with wealth redistribution schemes. :^)
One of the best writers on this subject is F. Roger Devlin. A lot of people went along with this idea back then thinking there'd be "more sex" but it just redistributed it from being assortative mating with monogamy to this sort of Pareto distribution where women offer up virtual harems to a small number of exceptionally attractive men under the delusion that the "man of their dreams" isn't also the man of dozens of other women's dreams.
It's almost as if you shouldn't dismantle such social systems before you understand why they were put there in the first place.
w e w
I thought I saw some numbers that most Americans have virtually no savings and it's not really any different elsewhere. Outsourcing/offshoring so that some people can pocket a huge difference and then the importation of scab labor has done some really serious shit. Most retards on this board support the mass immigration though. They don't know what cognitive dissonance means because their favorite hipster band never wrote a song about it.
You have no right to someone elses affection. Develop game and maybe you might have a chance.
Yeah its capitalism that creates rape apologists. Read a book.
There may be something to this horseshoe theory afterall.
I don't think Ive seen anyone in this thread address reactionary incels in any vaugely useful way. It was just a circlejerk over a tank that probably had autism having an episode. If you want to address reactionary ideas, go ahead. If you try to address reactionary incels specifically and in particular in just about any way someone has tried to here, you're making it worse. I dont really know what to say either, otherwise. If you just came here to contradict the rose and the tank, and have nothing else to add beyond 'state arranged marraiges are reactionary,' this suddenly became incredibly fucking inane.
How do I ?
Machine learning is an evolutionary process and you can set one up in an excel sheet. All you need is a selection machine, an RNG machine and pattern generating machine. RNG machine mutates the pattern, and the selection machine evaluates the result. One generation has passed.
As annoyed as I am to have to qualify my shit like this, the rose is wrong-but- everyone who uses the word "game" to refer to relationships should be hung
Yeah i said game. You know, a cool personality and not being a chode.
Full sexual gommunism now. Make blonde sorority girls suck the benis of the fattest most unkempt NEETs. Redistribute the means of baby production.
Machine learning is infinitely more malleable whereas our evolved traits could possibly take thousands of years of forced selection to get anything you might want out of it (and likely with huge negative unforeseen effects) so good luck with that.
It is better to work as much with nature as possible. There's a reason communist economics didn't work, and also a reason that the working classes were all for fascism in the countries it popped up in. Of course the same subversive aliens behind the original gommunist coup in Russia wrote and self-promoted a bunch of sophistry like The Authoritarian Mind rather than come clean about what the whole project was actually about, and this too has evolutionary roots in group selection and competition.
So, projecting a bullshit costume persona that gets you pussy. Again, just fucking die please.
Self-improvement is the product of capitalist societies and suggests humans can be ranked on an objective, hierarchical scale, and if your position therein is low, it's your own fault and can be fixed with a mixture of working harder and buying self-help books.
I have a gf, but I didn't get one by buying into self-improvement ideology; it's honestly mostly luck. Hikkis become incels because they don't interact with anyone to begin with and no one can fall for someone they've never met.
You are wrong. Me and my best friend go to school. He is in the Uni. I'm taking some courses. in separate locations but we do interact with a lot of people. I guess we are just unfuckable.
So youre defending these weird incel authoritarians? Im sure you met youre gf the way most people meet their partners.
Self improvement is a product sold by capitalism but like many things capitalism peddles it isn't inherently bad. It's good to consider yourself capable of adapting and changing for the better. I agree that the self blame aspect leads to some bad consequences but blaming outside forces can be just as dangerous for someone who has a poor understanding of the world.
You aren't unfuckable you just need to lower your standards.
What if they're balding manlets and no amount of self-improvement will matter. Is this not in some way analogous with low Autism Level negroids and other browns and blaming whitey? What say you.
Of course, we have full control of it.
I think you've misunderstood me. I didn't say we can change our genes at all. In fact I pointed out that the reason we can't shape society into what we want is because a lot of what society is derives from the underlying genetic foundations and Darwinian mechanisms. Again, the analogy is that culture is our OS, but the kernel of that OS is pre-human. We don't have kernel-level access, not yet.
And again, consider the similarities between capitalism and evolution. You will intuit that they are very similar. They are in fact the same. The economy is an energy-dissipating system. A physical process.
These aren't my ideas, nor are they novel. But I find them very useful, because they create a much needed connection between economics and physics. And certainly let you see Capitalism for what it is, not what it's masquerading by. It's not about you, the consumer, getting the best product for the best price. It's about matter rolling down the entropic hill. And to be sure, the economy can work just fine without consumers. Or workers. Or CEOs. Isn't this what all the discussions about automation boil down to? "UHHHH but if factories are operated by robots, what about us?". *laughs in binary*
and many of them would quickly go back to not interacting with people if forced to for a time or given the opportunity, because they became hikki in the first place because they had issues, and being hikki itself can do a number on you. And then the lonely, alienated, sexually frustrated young man kills himself with baloon helium a few years down the line. Addressing this, and how capitalism fuels this process of isolation and alienation, how to prevent these sorts from falling for reactionary propoganda, and how socialism might help them could have been what this thread was about. Could.
if you're going to school you arent a hikki.
What the fuck is that supposed to mean? He doesn't have to agree with the tank or the rose, or else say that if you're sad and nogf its your own fault and you should Sort Yourself Out TM.
I used to be one. I stayed inside my bedroom for 4 years.
There's quite a lot of difference between what people thought of the word capitalism 100-200 years ago and now. It's a very airy term. Right now it's full of obvious negative connotations and rightfully so because it stripmines countries and destroys organic communities/nations.
That's separate though from the evolutionary issues.
Automation is also going to be very scary in terms of how the people at the top handle the masses this technology disemploys and many of them will then view as an unwanted burden afterwards, but automation on that scale is still really just science fiction as is any real AI in general..
You have to realize that though you are not entirely to blame for you own situation that there is not another group or individual to which blame can be passed to either. Reaching this state could be considered a form of self improvement.
Whats the tank and the rose?
Same, just about. Although I never had as much underlying autism or depression as the average hikki. Hikkis with more problems than I had have a harder time reintegrating, either because they got worse over the course of being hikki, or became hikki because they couldnt handle it in the first place. Often at least. These are generalizations.
Look at the flags through the thread.
Ive seen balding shorter men with gf's
Wow, you have all the trapping of a polyp.
But then their bloodline is doomed to end, m80. Could we not then make the same argument against economic redistribution. Hey man, it's just your situation and although you're not to blame for it I guess no one else is either and you have to starve and die of exposure to the elements. Crikey.
Lol, oh wow. youre fuckin spooked my man.
So this is why I am so alienated from the world.
Imagine being so neurotic that you get triggered by this terminology and wow just wow instead of engaging with any of the actual ideas. Swedish NEETcels are more authentic than you.
Are you the sperg that hates people from Latin America?
I don't know who that is. I just think homogeneous countries are functional and everything else is dysfunctional and only destined to get worse until you're shitting in the streets and actual civilized countries have to issue warnings about massive rape risks and other wonderful cultural artifacts if any of their people deign to visit your multikult utopia. I don't need to hate anyone to make this observation.
They obviously do care or they wouldn't be bringing it up. Also, why not? It's the same argument but for different existential issues.
Possibly. I don't know you personally. I had an easy time integrating into a small social group, but even I didnt make any lasting connections. And then when the school year ended I left. I suspect half of them went on to other schools too. If it was a four year school and we were all first years, we'd go off to different jobs anyways. Even if coming back from seclusion wasnt a problem, the capitalist world is made to atomize people and scatter them to the wind.
social bonds not bloodline are the matter here. don't respond to the Holla Forumsack like I just did pls.
Much of evolution is about getting rid of useless drag. You want to be nimbler, fiercer. Bigger teeth. I'm not disparaging the values these communities/cultures attach to themselves. I'm calling them useless from the profit-optimizing algorithm's perspective. It really isn't. Organisms convert matter into genes. They must collect more energy than they use to grow and stay alive. Businesses convert matter into capital. They must turn profit to grow and stay alive. When you intuitively begin to comprehend Capitalism as a great and terrible Lovecraftian God, that's how you know you're on the right track. Hiding problems far enough in the future is a solid coping mechanism, but they tend to sneak up on you anyway.
Recognizing that the systems and institutions are unfair in any way and trying to change things is different that finding a group of people to blame for your situation. Also realizing that you are not to blame for your situation is not the same as refusing knowledge or courses of action that would improve it.
Social bonds are most often inextricable from bloodline i.e. genetic relatedness, continuity. We are after all biological creatures that operate on the same general rules of nature as everything else. You can pretend this isn't so but it doesn't make it less true.
Why not just say what you mean?
I highly doubt this kind of argument would fly on this board when it comes to scrapping things like affirmative action and the general deeply triggering and problematic policies in play which amount to blaming whitey for disparities with zero evidence in hand to display that it's indeed a result of discrimination rather than simply what you would get given genetic traits in a relative meritocratic system.
You can argue a meritocracy is impossible between distant genetic groups but that's also my argument which necessitates separation. People who are genuinely oppressed desire separation, after all.
That post had nothing specifically to do with the merchant's guild, my dude. This one sort of did.
There are no "general rules of nature" that tie relatedness to social bonds. Most living organisms dont have social relationships. Many mammals have very few and couldnt give, and another individual of their species may as well be another species, unless its literally their offspring or they can mate. social psychology is particular to each animal. humans, for example, naturally care about their immediate social group and immediate family. Anything outside of that doesnt matter all tha tmuch unless you work to convince them it does.
oh not this shit again.
edited the post without double-checking it. I dont even care at this point.
We recently had an ebin :::DDDD poster that disguised himself but had a deep hatred for Latin America. Just that but your are just a s shitty. kys seriously.
Yet mammals will defend their territory from invasive species and don't get along well even with different subspecies of the same animal.
I say! A cogent example: the red squirrels native to Britain. Jolly good show old bean.
one will, another won't because it doesn't care. it cares about eating and fucking. these generalizations are retarded.
Wizard, neet, semi-incel here. It's not that I'm some repulsive, fedora wearing retard I just have no idea how to properly interact with and talk to people in general. It doesn't matter if it's a qt or my 85 year old grandpa I just don't know how to hold down a conversation with people due to decades of isolation and likely undiagnosed/untreated mental illness because I have no healthcare.
I don't want a state appointed gf and consider the idea to be akin to slavery. What I want is a Communist society where situations like mine are simply not possible in the first place.
lots of mammals will defend their territory from other members of exactly the same species. and don't get along well even with the exact same subspecies.
You must redistribute big titty mommy gfs to the Swedish NEET population to be consistent with your principles here, friends. That's just how it is.
Race the spookiest spook.
Sorry bud a Communist society can greatly reduce the chances but the only thing that is certain is the uncertainty of it.
I also enjoy discarding relevant information and data to pretend my worldview makes sense until I'm shooting people in the back of the head and dumping their bodies into mass graves.
Nothing about what he said changes much if you replace impossible with 'highly improbable'
Then he's already good to go. Keep on working for that revolution friend
"I'm a social outcast, bottom-of-the-totem pole, as low status as you can get" "But I'm STILL higher status than some of these REALLY low status assholes, who are garbage"
Sorry wiz, I hope it didn't come out very rude. I just find this very human tendency to have an internal status counter running at all times very amusing. I'm guilty of it also.
t.also an outcast, bottom-of-the-totem pole, volcel wizard
It can't stop mental illness but actually having access to things like medication and and guaranteed job would go a very long way.
I don't think you understand spooks. Read Stirner.
Send all the black ones. Sweden needs to be "misgenated", fast.
They are garbage though! They are too fucking stupid to understand how badly Capitalism has fucked them over. You're right though now that I think about it, I internal status counter a lot in my thinking.
Stay shit /leftycuck/ I'm sure your mass movement will be achieved by discussing the intrincacies of 19th century tomes and ignoring concerns of real people
White men are not really attracted to black women. This is not going to work.
Black men? The ladies will love it.
Yes! Funny isn't it. Ever feel the experience of shame, where you accidentally do something embarrassing in public, your cheeks flush and you look around furtively to see if anyone's noticed? As if you are instinctively aware that a faux pas might cost you status, and you want to hide/evaluate the damage done. And it's probably a silly thing, not even that embarrassing.
I think it's wired in our brains. Like recognizing faces in the clouds, or rocks. To a social primate status is very important, it means friends, access to mates and help from the tribe. And so I think we've had the status counter before we even evolved intelligence. And this shameful status-preserving reaction is just one example of the deeply seated, subconscious process much older than language.
I was just thinking about it a lot lately. And now I see it everywhere. Even on anonymous imageboards, I get a thrill from getting replies. Our brains are highly trained to detect opportunities for gaining status, or avoiding losing it. May be part of being a sperg is having that bit of Human OS software malfunctioning.
Arrgh, fuck Darwin. I really wish I could rise above it.
Maybe if they love actual rape, but that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about seizing the means of production here, friendo. The wamen have that.
Are you mostly the only one who uses that spurdo flag?
If you could would that not imbue you with a certain social status?
Kek. You wouldn't care though, too busy being serene and free from status-related anxieties.
It's the best flag in the list so I don't see why I would be.
Eh whatever, youre a fag.
Egoism before altruism
Pure idpol garbage. Saying things like "state mandatory wives" does not become acceptable because someone is in a bad place. This is exactly what Zizek aims at when he goes off on "an enemy is just someone who's story you weren't ready to hear" or some such.
I have sympathy with the involuntarily lonely. I don't have sympathy with those who would dehumanize half of humanity because of their loneliness. And that is always, always where these threads end up.
Then what is to be done about loneliness? Create a program of re-socialization for lonely men and women, with social workers and dating coaches, or whatever else the specialist in that field propose.
What is this, Government mandated dating? Are we really saying in 2018 the government should force people to date and have sex?
Are you people really that incompetent that the only way you can even come close to a woman is if she's literally handcuffed to the table with you?
Don't get me wrong, the dating scene these days can suck a dick but this is ridiculous.
Time to move to Bongstan
Nazis are a classcucks carbon copy of Communists. Not a surprise that they imitate us.
Love how all these retards immediately jump on this meme.
Shut the fuck up and get out of my thread you worthless piece of shit
How else do you plan to get women to be with your repulsive self?
You're right, it's hard to find a partner if you were born an ugly man of low social status in today's atomized and sociopathic society.
Spare me your self pity. How do you plan to get women to be with you absent forcing them? If your problem is that we live in an atomized and sociopathic society, propose concrete steps to fix that. You've already ruled out state sponsored gf's, so what do you propose? Submit your ideas for evaluation.
Read the thread.
All I'm reading is reeeeeeeeeeee chads, reeeeeeee feminism, reeeeeeeeee hypergamy, without any programmatic proposals. I've offered up social workers and dating counsel, do you have better ideas?
It's telling that you can't link to one (1) non coercive proposal.
Pull yourself by your bootstraps and read the thread.
Because you're so far left that anyone remotely to the right of you looks like they're a neocon to you.
I do not fucking care in the slightest. I didnt say it made it correct, or 'more' correct, or some kind of thing like correct, though.
Thats how they see it. Do you honestly think that this sort of thing is easy, for these people?
adding to my repsonse to this: saying "I have sympathy for the involuntarially lonely but NOT if they're misanthropic and toxic" is like saying "I have sympathy for the heavily autistic, but that ends if they start making people uncomfortable or failing to respond to social cues", or "I have sympathy for people with severely paranoid schizophrenia but NOT if they act like I'm plotting to kill them or something!!!"
I have sympathy with the heavily autistic, I think that as a society we should maintain a corps of specialists to care for them. Doesn't mean I should be forced into associating with them. Same for incels. Social workers, council, and who knows, maybe vouchers for certified sex workers. You might feel lonely now, but the nanny state will eventually welcome you in her warm embrace.
I didnt demand that you associate with them. I just suggested they might be actual human beings who sometimes think stupid shit because they're a bit fucked up, not because they're just so horrible. Saying "I have no sympathy for them if they're misanthropic and bitter in a specific way I interpret as 'right-wing' " is disgusting and you can fuck yourself for saying it.
Solving social alienation, like helping people learn guitar, is a bit more complicated and intertwined with economics than merely "free therapy" Yes, but in our guitar analogy first of all people need disposable free time that they can use to practice guitar, and they also need the money to afford a decent guitar as a basic requirement. The same could be said for relationships: you need disposable free time which you can use to spend meeting people. Additionally, an environment in which socialization and meeting people is easy is also incredibly helpful. Capitalism doesn't promote either of those things. A wage-worker (or even a student) with limited disposable time to meet people and socialize due to overwork is obviously going to have trouble with relationships. An environment in which someone with naturally reclusive tendencies is allowed to shut themselves off from the world and spend any remaining disposable time shitposting on a Mongolian throat singing forum is even worse. It should be no surprise to anybody, then, that Japan, having an intensely classcucked culture of massive overwork and hyper-competition, also has a declining birthrate, loads of people hanging from trees in the forests near Mount Fuji, and such a huge hikkimori problem. Similar trends on a less-extreme scale are most likey to blame for the increase of incels, NEETs, school shooters and other manifestations of social alienation in the West. The obvious solution is an economic system that promotes disposable time for people to socialize and improve themselves, and provides environments in which alienated people can and must interact with people. In other words, socialism along with a program of social reform and therapy to get reclusive people socializing again. It doesn't even require therapy for most people: community organized events, festivals, and programs to force people off of the internet and into comfortable social settings (note that this is very different from govt-mandated dating shit, the focus wouldn't even be on dating but rather socialization in general) could be sufficient.
Sadly, that doesn't provide much in the way of a realistic, short-term solution, and most people facing these problems usually don't bother to think materialistically about their causes beyond "damn chad stealing my rightful share of pussy" anyways. Instead of fueling revolutionary sentiment, this shit has and will continue to express itself with suicides, autistic reactionary sex politics, school shooters, and so on. I don't see a solution coming anytime soon.
The people (including r9k incels, shitposters like pretending to be r9k incels for bait, and the kneejerk reaction to them) who make all of this about state-mandatory wives and forced pussy distract from the real problem of capitalist alienation and honestly should get the fuck out of these discussions.
Please fucking off yourself you entitled piece of shit. Your analysis is 0% materialist, 0% scientific, and 100% autistically spooked. If your only issue with capitalism is because not everyone is equal then you are nothing but a fucking red liberal that the right can strawman off of. In fact, this only convinces me this you are probably some dickhead falseflag troll. Although I'm unsure if you're coming from Holla Forums or if you're just some anarchist dickhead that wants to shit on ☭TANKIE☭s by artificially making them look autistic.
Then fucking move over that jackass. Anyway, not only are you fucking wrong, but you fail to realize is the difference in both material conditions between them and the US and the stage of capitalism that is present in india. The same commodification of culture that is producing all these things you loathe isn't in fully swing over there, in fact this stage of capitalism only hit the US recently. Furthermore even if you could pin it all on sexual liberation, this is only a subideology if liberalism, so you have said nothing new here whatsoever.