Could identity politics be mitigated if all players were more openly honest towards one another and all races participated in it equally on equally footing, instead of the current situation where identity politics is just non whites in one umbrella coalition dog piling on whites while whites are just supposed to sit back and take it not participate in identity politics at all while every other racial group is allowed and encouraged to organize explicitly along racial lines?
Could identity politics be mitigated if all players were more openly honest towards one another and all races...
It terrifies too many people because it usually ends with that group trying to using their newfound political power to suppress everyone who disagrees with them regardless of their actual skin color. Politics primarily needs to focus on issues that affect everyone regardless of what they are while preventing discrimination against any and all group within their country.
one of my interests is describing muh idpol as a psychopolitical regime of affects, see my recent autistic wall of text effortposts
Or, and here's a radical suggestion, you get off ya fuckin high horse and listen instead of complaining that every race has legitimate grievances against white people.
every race has legitimate grievances against white"""people"""
exactly, all PoC want in the discussion is to actually be heard
How about no more baboons instead? I don't want baboons. Goodbye baboons.
lmao stay mad whitey
you might actually learn a lot from people who have been marginalized all their lives.
Eek eek? Want a banana?
T H I S
Exactly! if i had a penny for ever time i heard one of those id still be in debt but less so than now
post based barry deutsch toons
Sorry ignore that post I misread your post.
Often enough PoC have more insight into how the system really works on the ground than people whose job it is to study it.
and don't forget queers
I'm the only minority who doesn't give a shit about race politics? Maybe it's because I don't live in america
The so-called anti-idpol left shows their true colors itt, quite a shame really
10, 6, and 4 are all true
Also starting to think this thread is pol fishing for screenshots they can "use" to "prove"how deeply triggering and problematic we are
America plays a big part in shaping the debate but every country in the world has its own issues and often enough, there is some minority being subjugated
Castrated by the filter
lol shut up racist. Go back to >>>/leftpol/ if it triggers you so much that minorities are systemically oppressed.
I used to be an edgy channer white dude once, but since then, I have met courageous queer and PoC comrades who helped me grow as a person and realize the true extent of my privilege, but I can't say I'm truly free from unconscious racism or queerphobia, as no white/straight person ever is. It's a constant work deconstructing the systems of oppression we have internalized , but it is worth it.
you should. white supremacy and eurocentrism are global issues. Even asian and latin american countries have internalized the standard of whiteness. Forgive me if I'm intruding on you, it would be better that you spoke to a wiser, more experienced elder of your people, as I am not qualifyied as a white dude to lecture you on race.
Look americans quite literally tried to genocide my country and to this day are still raping and doing violence inside. Honestly the only idea of idpol i'd buy in is anti-capitalistism: nigger, spic, cracker I despide you if you are american.
White people is too broad of a term. White americans are NOT like europeans, again americans don't understand.
test:deeply triggering and problematic
The poor are systematically oppressed
Workers are systematically oppressed
A black bourgeoisie is not more oppressed than a white proletariat
Stop breathing manually
10. Modern white people naturally benefit off the back of the slave trade because its what made the trading nations rich, and as such being white citizens of said nation you have to acknowledge why you may be better off than your fellow man for no tangible reason
4. Immigration policy, on its own, is not racist, obviously. However the debate around it is quick to become racist. For example, the big fallacy of Brexit was there are too many coming here, now i dont wanna get into why thats wrong, why we couldve fixed it without brexit etc. etc. but often enough it was only certain nationalities that brexiteers had a problem with (eastern and south-central europe as well as muslims - whatever they thought leaving europe would do to stop that boggles me)
Being anti-immigration is often enough not being deeply triggering and problematic immigration. London has a massive french population, but the anti crowd dont care about them
I relate to this heavily! Im often enough now confronting my every day actions towards friends who are PoC, and one called me out for what she called a micro-aggression, which was in fact (in my eyes) a deeply hurtful and personal thing i did! Its thanks to simply not talking and absorbing what people have to say that has made me a better person
Again no. You are saying that white americans and Estonians are the same fucking thing you simpleton. I don't need no fucking lectures on my race. Soldiers in my country are of all colours and they are all from america. Revolutions in europe were made by white majority. Race is something that should he talked in american politics.
Also assuming that you are black america, you know what africans think of you guys? No you don't because you are so stupid to think that africa is the same fucking thing just because of the sking colours. This board is no fucking better than Holla Forums when this shit happens. Months ago this shit would have been banned
but a black prole is definitely more oppressed than a white prole. All else being equal you would be worse off if you were black/queer/a woman. And black bourgeoisie, no matter how rich they are, still suffer from many instances of often subtle everyday racism. Why is it so hard to accept some people might have it harder than you due to this oppression in which you are complicit?
Stating unrelated facts doesn't magically become an argument.
Stop talking for other countries
i cant begin to empathise with that as an experience so i understand why you dont view idpol as a priority! What country are you from if you dont mind me asking ($10 on cambodia)
Of course your first sleight of hand is to leap to comparing black bourgeoisie to white proles as if the black bourgeoisie is the majority of black people. It's black proles that are being gunned down by cops, black proles that are subject to intense discrimination, black proles who are fucking dying over mineral conflicts. Kill yourself.
In pretty muc the entire world, actually, including Africa.
Half vietnam half korean living in Germany.
And I can assure that americans have nothing in common with Germany
this answer implies getting rid of capitalism magically solves all these problems
My gott pure ideology.
Have you talked to other asians/mixed race people about your identity? is your mother a mail order bride and your dad a racist white guy?
smh I thought asians were supposed to be smart
10. Ah yes tell me how the slavs and other eastern european immigrants during the great migration are just as good off as the wasp founders just because they're also white.
6. There's nothing to laugh at, black on white racism is rampant in black majority neighbourhoods, and white subraces tend to be very racist against each other
4. Not entirely sure what that word salad was supposed to mean
My gott. You stupid americans can't even point out countries in europe or africa but you think you can talk for everyone
I'm Dänisch though.
This is one of the main problems of the Idpol debate as its a leftist-late stage capitalist hurdle, and so the most developed countries are liekly to only refer to themselves in the argument, because they share more in common with the oppressed minorities in their country and other deveolped countries than the populous of a different nation
Both countries were invaded by the us. Just to say
racialized folks on settlet colonial states are de facto third worlders
someone needs to heal from toxic whiteness. dude get off your high horse and listen to PoC. it isn't that fucking hard
10. True and im falling victim to my own arguement here
6. systemic vs individual cases, theres a difference
4. Immigration debates are highly prone to racism
Getting rid of capiltaism doesnt solve idpol you fuckin cretin, jesus
Idpol is derived from capitalism. It is and always has been a divide and conquer strategy from the capitalist class to keep the worker divided. See the blockhead comics
there's literally nothing to listen to. It's just "OOOOOHHHH YOUR ANCESTORS OPPRESSED ME" meanwhile my ancestors weren't even IN america at the time, there's literally zero chance of my ancestors having been their oppressors
I used to cringe at the mention of 'white priviledge but now I realize it is a valid concept which many of the crypto sargonite white cishet leftist males on here could use. Do you realize how much you are hurting your PoC and Queer comrades? they are in pain a pain you will never understand or comprehend, a pain you have been taught to systematically diminish dismiss and ignore, a pain which has lasted for hundreds of years and which you are unconsciously, or maybe consciously'' helping perpetuate.
It's literally not about MUH ANCESTORS, it's about the racism that prevailed after slavery ended. Which you clearly perpetuate.
its okay guys, no ones racist in once capitalism falls!
Just ignore the treatment of Chechnya and Georgia and Mongolia by the soviet union and youll be wearing Rose Tinted GogglesTM too!
It's literally never been about modern racism when they've started to discuss it, every single time has been about their ancestors and how if their ancestors weren't enslaved they'd not be in the situation that they are currently in (which to be fair is a true statement)
Not him. But I'm an italian-korean who used to post a lot on this board.
My father was italian, white. He was a communist. My friends were all white. Never experienced racism. If that happened it was an isolated case. Are there white assholes? Sure. Like there are arab assholes or black assholes. Not everything is whites or blacks fault.
This idpol cancer is bullshit.
t h i s
Its really not tho, just because you havent experienced it first hand doesnt mean its not a worthy cause
So all whites are racist?
How's that different from saying that all blacks are stupid?
It's not different in the slightest and I'm still convinced this thread is pol fishing, I've NEVER seen leftypol this high on idpol
i was referring to idpol being cancer, but this is an issue too.
Being born whit doesnt make you racist. Lets get that out the way.
Growing up white, however, makes you pre-disposed too it. Youre more likely too be racist.
Because the anti-idpol crowd in here aren't arguing on anti-idpol grounds, but on the grounds that white privilege isn't real, which is just retarded.
there is a different between being an asshole and being complicit in a system of oppression. you are only an asshole if you refuse to acknowledge your complicity and make amends
remove head from anus and actually listen to what were saying
Shit. Me neither but I'm not lurking this board that much latley so I don't know.
Because all whites are complicit in a system of oppression somehow just for being born white? Plus it's not like whites are one thing, this is an american meme. You are saying that ukranians are the same as say french?
How about black oppressors? Mugabe is not put there by whites, saudi arabia is not ruled by whites, Israel is not ruled by whites.
You don't know what are you talking about
'idpol' is 99% a reactionary boogeyman. I know dude, acknowledging your privilege acknowledging tere is an unsoundable gulf between you an marginalized folks, a pait yhat you could never begin to understand, can be hard, but it isn't as hard as what your marginalized comrades face every fucking single day of their lives. You have been taught to see them as less than human and to see yourself as superior, and it shows in every one of your social interactions.
If you were saying anything intelligent, I would. Nobody here besides the italian korean poster has said anything of value
Wealth privilege is real, white privilege is not. Just because there are more wealthy whites than blacks doesn't mean that it's because they are white. Your argument amounts to the age-old pol argument that blacks are genetically less intelligent, which was just recently considered, collectively across leftypol, to be a bullshit argument.
Idpol, of ALL varieties, is reactionary. And it's our job to fight all forms of idpol
so would you say he is 'one of the good ones'?
and besides, white privilege is a proven fact according to many scientific studies. microagressions are a fact. police brutality is a fact. Black people are still much more likely to be denied mortgages, less likely to see themselves represented in media. queer people are still getting kicked out of their homes and murdered. I think you need to be humbled. your entitlement is showing
okay let me boil this down to the fuckin basics
We can agree there are some multi nationals and corporations that exist beyond borders, right? Lets use Amazon
Lets take an African-American man and, to use one of your examples, an estonian immigrant.
Theyre the same age, have the same qualifications (for sake of arguement, the immigrant can speak the same level of english necessary)
the employer is more likely to pick the white applicant. THATS white privilege. youre right! many white peoples ancestors didnt have a hand in slavery, but its the slave owners who paved the way for them to succeed, and for you to not acknowledge that simply due to the paleness of your skin that you are preferentially treated, it shows a great deal about how you think you go to where you are, and why others are down in the dirt.
yo is this the afroplasm thread?
A thread on enlightening people about why idpol matters and how white people can be better allies by simply listening to PoC and acknowledge their privilege got BTFO'd by white people who dont listen and dont want to acknowledge their privilege. i cba
i'm dissapointed but not surprised. There are sadly too many entitled white dudes who think they are leftist but refuse to acknowledge privilege is a thing
this does not excuse the crimes or ignorance of white people. even france and ukraine have a long history of discrimination against PoC. There is a literal nazi army in Ukraine right now. Even Mugabe and the Saudi regime are products of white colonialism. and israel is a literal white supremacist settler state. I think is important for entitled white people to experience AT LEAST 1/1000 of the shame and pain marginalized folks experience everyday.
Holy fuck I thought Holla Forums was radicalized. My first time seeing a post from Holla Forums and it is hilarious. The people here are just as racist if not far more racist.
I doubt it has changed that much
`what the fuck are you on about
Jesus Christ. People used to get bans for the reddit-tier posting thats going on in here. I guess all its missing is for that guy who thinks all South Americans should be genocided to show up again.
I mean exactly what I said. I don't understand what is not clear. Holla Forums is generally openly racist towards niggers and hate faggots. Holla Forums openly hates white people, and in a hilarious attempt to "protect" the marginalized they marginalize and shit on others.
Lurk more. This thread is an aberration and people spouting the line that you see here used to be banned immediately.
Why the fuck would I lurk this shithole any more?
Am I really afraid of getting banned by faggots that only hear what they want to hear anyway?
You mean Karl Marx?
It's just afroplasm shitposting without a name again, don't worry about it user
social justice is supposed to make you feel uncomfortable. but however uncomfortable you may feel it doesn't begin to compare to what your marginalized comrades feel everyday
yh please show where the hate begins because ive seen no hate or deeply triggering and problematic rhetoric here
treating queers and people of color with the minimum of human decency as actual human beings can be heavily triggering to whitedudes as yourself. What is wrong with being empathetic and caring about people who suffer? People who are 'Anti Idpol' are basically glorifying their own lack of empathy an insensitivity about the same people towards which they contribute to their oppression
you want reductionism? here it is
why fix the system when you can casually steer it in your favor
and revolution is fixing the system? racism existed before capitalism, it is dumb to think it wouldnt exist after it
true liberation means liberation from racism sexism and heteronormativity, which predated and set the basis for capitalism. you should at least acknowledge how you benefit from the suffering of your comrades
this thread summises something ive been thinking about for a while.
Anti-idpol leftists dont like to think their skin colour has given them an advantage over their PoC comrades because to do that would be to admit their are benefiting under capitalism, and to be a beneficiary of capitalism makes you the enemy in the eyes of the radicals.
In truth lads, you arent the enemy, nor are you the problem. Being aware of how being white benefits you is not, under some fucked logic, being racist against white people. Stop talking and start listening. From then on you will have a better understanding what to do once capitalism falls, and how to help not only your PoC comrades, but your white ones too.
They're both kind of true though. Blacks don't have as much education globally hence they'll tend to not be as knowledgeable as everyone else and generally will end up being dumb.
Whites as a whole are racist even if they try not to be because their entire society is racist. I can't imagine managing to actually think other races are equal to you if you're white and I'm black. I assume they simply repress making the comparison.
same goes for men RE: Women and Straight folx RE: Queers. I honestly feel sorry for the queer and PoC friends of anti idpol posters in here, imagine all the marginalization they must go through.
people acknowledge it
here and abroad
if playing tiddlywinks over this silly shit was sufficient in challenging anything they probably wouldn't let you do it. just throwing that out there for all you fullcommunism volk
From my estimation there's no difference between anti-idpol leftists and socdems. In fact the entirety of this recent left-wing wave is just socdem nostalgia. If economic prospects slightly improved every single white here would go back to their racist unions and all the blacks would continue to rot and get killed for walking down the street.
You know it to be true. For the minorities, typically asian, that act like muh whites are so kind lmao just wait until shit hits the fan, having lighter skin isn't going to save you from these cannibals.
Young white men are currently politically homeless, and when theyre told they benefit in capitalism by simply being, they arent being shown a mirror but a target with holes in it and their face crudely stapled on. Its what makes MRAs, Holla Forumssters, and all sorts of weird groups of white straight men. Its because being the victim is far easy to spin then being the beneficiary.
If we frame idpol as "youre white, your male and your straight. You have so much more power for change than your comrades and you should use it to help them" then maybe wed get further than squealing manbabies
i used to hate sjws, but I realised they were actually marginalised people fighting for their lives, if someone is really helping bring down capitalism, it is the #metoo women its black lives matter it is queer trans and nb people fighting for their basic rights, not middle class suburban crypto racist ex Holla Forumsacks on imageboards who are basically left MRAs you are not the vanguard, you are just getting in the way and actually harming queers and PoC with your well poisoning and whataboutism, with your stubborn and cruel refusal to acknowledge their basic humanity. I hope you feel bad and you feel sorry
now you're just laying it on too thick dude
tbf, they are willing to listen to reason, and the only reasonable response is to be unreasonable
Y'all mudderfuckas need to give me reparations.
HAND OVER THE MONEY WHITEY
You're absolutely right, what happened to this board? These replies (specifically ) could be word for word from leddit if you added the phrase "Brocialist" somewhere in there.
red sargonites get out.
no room for enemies of progress, progress for all
The absolute state of Holla Forums in 2018, ladies and gentlemen.
the only reasonable solution is to make all POC bourgeouisie for an equivalent number of centuries after the revolution
please make the link between being anti-idpol and being for racial equality
protip: to be for racial equality, you must first need idpol
not an argument
Neither was your post, you assert the claim:
Yet provide no evidence, theory, or logic to back this claim.
Based KARA BOGA gang
it's easy to be anti idpol when you are a fucking cishet whitedude, but for queer folx and PoC it is a literal matter of life and death. Imagine just how harrowing and painful it must be for a young Queer or PoC leftist to come on this supposedly progressive forum and see so much white entitlement, so much privilege denial and so many 'ironic' jokes that perpetuate systems of oppression can you imagine that? Do you know that lgbt people have a very high suicide rate? it is not altogether impossible that your shitposts have literally killed lgbt people
How new are you then?
Ah, it's a troll thread, got it. Well Xe/Xir I'll check my privilege and carry on treading like everyone has paper thin skin.
Love seeing the "politically correct" Marxist chan board use Chapo SJW tier garbage arguements to villianize white people.
Apparently "intersectionality" means "blame white people for everything".
Identity politics is how capitalism can maintain power.
By baiting poor minorities and whites into tearing each other's throats over who is the most "oppressed", the bourgeoise can keep their power.
Why don't we talk about black privilege?
Native American privilege?
Why don't we also talk about how entitled blacks, Arabs, Hispanics, trannies, native Americans are?
Believing that you are entitled to whine about how "oppressed" you are everyday, how everything is "rascist/transphobic" or one of the other grave sins in the privileged Academic Left, "culture appropriation".
The Left deserves to suffer under Capitalism if it keeps promoting this "white privilege, minorities are always suffering, whites are 100% responsible for all evil in the world".
I really don't blame working class whites who vote for Trump, Le Penn if they are constantly attacked by the "Lel white privilege" bullshit.
TIL that opposing identity politics immediately makes someone a Holla Forumstard.
Keep screeching on about "white privilege" with the r/anarchism, r/socialism, Chapo crowd.
You deserve fascism.
to oppose 'identity politics' is to deny the humanity of marginalised folks. Don't fool yourself. you are not a leftist. you are a fascist and a shitty person
This whole thread was either one huge flaseflag with the objective to fish screenshots (as an user said above) or a consequence of the recent ban wave removing most original opposition to reddit waves. Reminder to all newfags that only pic related matters.
TIL that poor whites living in trailers making minimum wage are "privileged" and "oppressive" and that wealthy minorities are "oppressed".
Just like I said earlier, identity politics is "blame white people for everything", and only serves to divide the working class.
Unless you personally think white people arent working class and you are another third world Maoist larper that thinks the Revolution will come from peasants in Thailand, Ethiopia.
"Everyone I don't like is a fascist".
If you want to push everyone to the right, that's your fault, not I.
I'm not going to accept the morons that cry about how some movie or television series is "racist" or "doesn't have enough minorities/transgendered people" and think that such people will welcome socialism with open arms.
Identity politics only strengthens fascism.
TIL that SJW's screaming about how Once Upon A Time commits "cultural appropriation" are leftists.
Accusing people of being "privileged" comes from a privileged position.
I like how racism is only discussed as "white people do/said X", it's never Arabs, asians, blacks, Hispanics being bigoted toward each other.
The old white supremacy can’t be a thing if there’s poor white people trope that got MLs to parrot pol talking points on leftypol. And oldie but goodie.
Race is a spook. If someone gets treated differently for any identity reason that’s wrong. No one but the pathetic losers at pol are going to buy into your black and brown people are the real oppressors bullshit. Anyone that’s held a job for more than a day knows it’s their boss.
Well….go ahead and talk about it then., How do these minority groups materially oppress white guys?
Yeah it's a blatant false flag thread
This whole thread is an idpol garbage fire.
I weep bitter tears for them.
All fucking boons will be placed in zoos.
is reddit invading
They're already here. They've been here since the catgirl fiasco.
MORE FEMALE POC BILLIONAIRES N O W
you'll excuse me if i couldn't give less of a shit about the rich's "problems" lmao
the truth is that when capitalism falls, a lot of the causes of racism WILL disappear
no artificial job scarcity under socialism
no capitalist exploitation and imperialism, no reactions from extremists
again, they'd all have jobs and be provided for
no need for crime when you're not in poverty
don't call yourself a leftist if your primary concern isn't class.
shit i forgot to sage
put the button in the quick reply section ffs