SAA and Kurds achieve left unity

What is the US position in this? What are the chances they'll assist either side on this particular conflict?

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Turkey and the U.S. have been growing apart for a few years now.

The Kurds were a tactical ally of convenience but the relationship with the U.S. stops there.

If I had to guess I would say the best case scenario for the U.S. would be for both sides to beat themselves bloody with no real definitive winner. They aren't going to pick a side of that is what you were getting at.

smart realpolitik move on their part. i suppose israel/usa/saudis would throw them under the bus or undermine their ranks rather sooner than later in order to please the sultan.
they're in a good position for negotiations with assad/putin now.

what happens to the already established over a dozen US military bases in Syria?

guess yet once again the US bootlicking forces shit themself and cry for ebil Assad the "neoliberal Russian puppet" to safe their ass. can they establish "real socialism" with their dependence on SAA and Russian troops?

or are they just complete failures and brainlets going apeshit crazy in their opportunistic nationalism?

i guess only time will tell

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you need to go back to reddit, berniecrap

just close your eyes, they said it, look at the OP
there are no US supports :^) it was all just a spook i suppose

Enough of your enlightened ebin cynicism.

Reminder the destruction of Kemalism is required for socialism

Erdogan is a Sultan wannabe, not a Kemalist.

when will the flood of shitposts and excuses of liberal Trump-trooper apologets finally end? is a bullet the only cure for such utter retardation?

Kemelism is imperialism too, the fact is Erdogan has fused Kemalism and Ottoman ideology into the ultimate reactionary force in the Middle East now that Daesh are irrelevant, the Saudis fucking wish they were on Erdogan's game.

Actually a scary development. I don't put it past the US to throw the Kurds totally under the bus to reconcile with Turkey and do regime change.

is the new empty phrase to excuse retardation really "realpolitik" now? they just can't take a break for a second and face the reality of them being fucking useless retarded tools

This is the start of the destruction of the Turkish state dude, we're gonna free the world bud.

And actually existing Stalinism on the internet isn't useless? You gave birth to Khruschev, you've never owned up to it.

socialism gave birth to Marxism
guess socialism as a whole is shit because somewhere down the line revisionism came to being :^D well isn't that convenient, guess we can close down because we debunked socialism just now

you gave birth to this sorry ass apology for an argument, how about you kill yourself?

shit I messed that line of text up bad

Tsargrad will finally be Russian.

Stalin gave birth to Khurschev, your theory is shit and you have no means of defending yourself from revisionism because you're a cynic, revolution has no use for cynic shitheads like you other than dealing drugs and robbing banks and that's where you need to stay.

over a dozen US military bases in Syria denied Al Mayadin report about agreement with Assad government to deploy SAA inside Afrin

mobile.twitter.com/HoseinMortada/status/956225094216486912

Just because you put on a stalin-stache flag, doesn't mean you get to praise "daddy Assad" and act like a cunt, dipshit.

kek

anybody who denies that worldfilters are fun can suck my tit

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Do us all a favor and go fight for the Green Resistance in Libya or something, you don't belong to the actual historical movement.

please stop tarnishing the name of uncle joe

c'mon comrades, keks aside, where are them arguments?

?

do yourself a favor and stay on your Democrat Cops of America reddit where you can cry about the real movement of being cucked by bernie

uhu, tell me more

we are well past those and imageboards are for shitposting, if you really think there is something to gain other than having a laugh at retarded people failing for the same liberal ideologies over and over again you really need to take a step outside your basement and get some air

After selling their ass to nato… they learned the hard way

"Over a dozen Syrian military bases in Syria" would be better.

No, these kinds of strategic compromises are not a new thing in the Syrian war, and the military bases are still there. Roj*va is still a project for the Balkanization of Syria.

I was referring to your sperging out

It's good to know that you at least considered it. Let's see what the future brings.

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why do you have your flare on

On look who finally showed up. I was half tempted to make a reply to Stalin stash but I'd just be banned for imperialism or some other vague reason.

cringe
what a fucking chauvinist.

Someone reported their own post to get a response about their question.

It's called "imperialism". Look it up.

guilty as charged

So what about the French resistance in WWII?
"We must support the Third Reich in his struggle against American imperialism"?

What’s to get. I’m just saying it was proven that there isn’t an opening up to SAA my dude.

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Nowadays are like the Cold War, it's just Russia who has less hegemony.

shit as a raging ☭TANKIE☭ i really wanted to find a way to like r*java, and there it is
absolutely beautiful

Syria is an imperialist construct put in place by the British and French after the end of the first world war. BO confirmed defender of imperialism.

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see pic

"We must support Arabs monarchists in their struggle against Ottoman imperialism!"

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THere had to be more to it than that

you realise the USSR itself allied with the US to defeat Hitler? Stalin himself. The gorrilion gulag king is in your eyes wrong for doing that?

some serious cognitive dissonance

depends on who you prefer running europe, hitler or the allies

this isnt binary. youre retarded abstract concepts dont mean shit in the real world.
communism was just used by the bolsheviks to gain power in russia. same with nazism in germany and democracy in any given western country.

Stalin confirmed for allies puppet!
Only Switzerland is anti-imperialist.

you anglosphere fruitcakes were always cancer

Have you considered stepping into the real world for once?

Confirmed for knowing nothing about the Bolsheviks.

So why did the bolsheviks allied with western liberal democracies fought the nazis in WWII?

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

why the racism

but that's exactly the point. The allies were preferable. Today the US is not.

The US are still preferable than ISIS.

There is an update that says this isn't true.
muraselon.com/en/2018/01/kurdish-forces-deny-agreement-allow-syrian-troops-afrin/

Also Assad is just a neolib

I mean objectively in global terms the US is worse than ISIS, but if you are a Kurd you are thinking about Kurdistan, which means your main problem is not the US, but Turkey, Syria, Russia, and ISIS

SAA + Kurd federation soon friends

Are you a Turk or something?

The BO clearly support Erdogan.

Told you that the US military bases in Roja,va was all 6,382,344,365,235 dimensional chess.

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If this is true, why are ☭TANKIE☭s complaining about it? Isn't this what they wanted?

no you imbecile
it's what we told you from the beginning you delusional illiterate fuck

Stash-poster, why are you such a cunt?

do you even literacy?

False flagging. He behaves like a parody. Like what anarchists imagine Stalinists to be.

rojava

I think you both are intentionally misinterpreting what I said, because its pretty straight forward.
For thread after thread "anti-imperialists" bashed the SyDF for accepting American support as an immediate dis qualifier for receiving left-wing support. This whole shitstorm really started with Jason's debate against SocOrBar where he argued that the SyDF were balkanizing Syria by setting up their own democratic forms of government and the only proper course of action for the SyDF was to relinquish the lands they had captured from ISIS back to Assad and let the SAA come back in. The SyDF did not do that, until seemingly now they have on at least some scale.
No, it was the "anti-imperialists" who didn't understand what nuance was. It was everyone but them who continually pointed out the issues with NATO and Turkey and foresaw the US abandoning the SyDF when they had served their purpose. Because the US abandoning their new puppet seems contradictory to "the over a dozen US bases Syria" new colony meme, they said exactly the opposite.

Tankyism is a disease of the mind.

R0java fanboys were the ones going on and on about Assad was "literally Hitler." This just shows how opportunist they are.

No actual ☭TANKIE☭s condemn the Kurds for realpolitik.

Nevermind that it might not actually be true.>>2367636

The opinion of R0JAVA fan boys or ☭TANKIE☭s doesn’t fucking matter when discussing whether or not actions taken by the SAA or over a dozen US military bases in Syria makes sense
Critical support means fuckall

That's my point. Reading comprehension.

No one said that. The point was that Assad is an authoritarian right-wing nationalist, which he is.

So was Chiang Kai-Shek. That doesn't mean the Chinese deserved what Japan had planned for them.

It was never about "great men", it was never about ideological purity, it's about what communism is about - the people. And the Syrian people shouldn't suffer what CI-ISIS and USA has planned for them.

Afrin legitimately never received any support or worked with the US in any capacity

Better than a repeat of Iraq, Saddam and Peshmerga.

They don't deserve what Assad and the imperialist powers he's aligned with either. They deserve socialism, and only over a dozen US military bases in Syria are fighting for that.

Not to mention that our "critical support" means exactly dick. We have no influence on geopolitics, so when you support authoritarian Right-wing dictators, you come accross as contrarians and loons, sacrificing the cause of socialism in your own country to the altar of edgy realpolitik. Just say that you oppose imperialist war and be done with it.

not sure about assad himself being right-wing, he seems to be rather liberal/centrist to me. he definitely kept syria very secular which is quite remarkable in that region, even the oh-so-western zionists are anything but secular and liberal. what's more, assad's country is under attack from a number of imperialist powers, he is self-defending. the russians and iran are in there under his mandate, which is legit with international law. however, make no mistake, russia and iran are both not engaged with assad out of altruism, they both have realpolitik interests in syria as well. all of assad's opponents, except the kurds (who have, like assad, no imperialist interests and act in self-defense) are right-wing neocon oligarchies, full-on monarchies or savage religious fanatics who operate illegally under international law inside syria.
having that in mind i get the bo's support for assad and i agree with it, however i don't get outright hostility towards the kurds. in that theater assad and the kurds are the only two factions leftists can naturally relate to, while over a dozen US military bases in Syria are actually *real* leftists, not just liberal centrists, like assad. the fact alone that they are leftist makes them a pain in the ass for everyone else involved with the theater, which puts them under threat from literally everyone, so they need to seize every opportunity and can't cherry-pick (temporary) allies until they are secure.

not sure about assad himself being right-wing, he seems to be rather liberal/centrist to me. he definitely kept syria very secular which is quite remarkable in that region, even the oh-so-western zionists are anything but secular and liberal. what's more, assad's country is under attack from a number of imperialist powers, he is self-defending. the russians and iran are in there under his mandate, which is legit with international law. however, make no mistake, russia and iran are both not engaged with assad out of altruism, they both have realpolitik interests in syria as well. all of assad's opponents, except the kurds (who have, like assad, no imperialist interests and act in self-defense) are right-wing neocon oligarchies, full-on monarchies or savage religious fanatics who operate illegally under international law inside syria.
having that in mind i get the bo's support for assad and i agree with it, however i don't get outright hostility towards the kurds. in that theater assad and the kurds are the only two factions leftists can naturally relate to, while Ro**va are actually *real* leftists, not just liberal centrists, like assad. the fact alone that they are leftist makes them a pain in the ass for everyone else involved with the theater, which puts them under threat from literally everyone, so they need to seize every opportunity and can't cherry-pick (temporary) allies until they are secure.

They can easily become an asset to Assad and Russia against Turkey, weakening Turkey weakens all of NATO, any Apo affiliated group (or anyone in the middle east for that matter) have no interest in the diaherrea soup of ideology Erdogan is creating with Kemalism and Ottoman imperial chauvenism.

I don't get "opportunism" as a critique of any political movement. How the fuck do you think you can succeed in politics by being anything but Machiavellian is beyond me.

Assad is a Ba'athist.

Ba'ath is is a right-wing nationalist movement. Simply being secular doesn't make you not right-wing.

liberals keep spinning this in their media, but i don't buy anything from them at face value.

Yes, clearly a Wikipedia stub means that Ba'athism is no longer a right-wing nationalist movement.

And, before you say it, no, a movement simply calling itself "socialist doesn't make it so". Hitler called himself a socialist.

I'm not even going to argue with you because I know this is pure orientalism but I will give you a video.

youtube.com/watch?v=wTM83MKJjy8

Democrats confirmed for communists.

You're actually mentally ill.

Not an argument.

get off my board.

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because after the molotov-ribbentrop pact was negated by the german invasion and the german forces penetrated deep enough the USSR sough help, which it got from the allies who were inturn victims of their plan to have germany and the USSR wipe eachother out up untill they signed the mentioned pact

this is the real world get used to it
lets steamroll hungary again

those are not the only two (or even the best) possible options

what

pic related

your three posts claiming something with no backup at all means nothing either. give me some details about assad's ba'athist right-wing politics. i admit that i have not much of a clue about the subject, so i'm all ears.

this whole thing started when the state dept needed FSA 2.0. if youre following this thing only via some imageboard then you dont really have a clue about whats gonna be going down

the US didnt abandon them. the two pockets are separate enteties you dumbfuck

and the problem people have with your posts is that everyone who isnt a complete retard could predict this happening in Afrin, just as they predicted the race for dierezzor and other crap, while some fucking anglo libtard royawa fanboys on here kept circlejerking in their LARP fantasy based on twitter posts and idealism

the kurds arent the ones that are retarded, its their fanboys that are. kurds have a choice to survive or die.
the fanboys have a choice to be retards or not.
the latter picked the wrong choice

a desease ofthe mind is cognitive bias that prevents you from understanding basic relations and instead makes you a schizophrenic idealist retard

and the world deserves peace

pic related

pic 2 related

because of what? some invisibla ingame health point system?
the more insurency there is in turky the more militarisation comes to both turkey and the middle east. NATO wins
the more the kurds get destroyed and the more the US protects their proxy in syria the further turkey drifts from NATO.

se case study of every fucking politician in history

the pinnacle of retarded anglo left-right politics

i tought leftpol was your board

There is no confirmation from the leadership of either side on this, talks are still ongoing.

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shillary pls

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You're anti imperialist garbage is the pinincle of idealism. You're so focused on trying to fight a literal bogeyman that ignore any considerations on the ground.

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no it isnt. its the most pragmatic way
see

thats trockyists like you

im not an anglo nor am i a marxist leninist.
since when is the deepstate and global elite run by anarchists?

also your post is not even an argument, it just sais

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If your logic is "Assad was with Kim Sung Il therefore he's socialist, then Jimmy Carter must have been a commie too.

Holla Forums - the Highest stage of discourse.

Support Comrade Carter in his noble fight against Reaganite Imperialism.

Carter funded the mujahideen against the USSR because he knew the soviets were revisionists engaging in Imperialism.

There are plenty of westerners fighting for the Kurds against ISIS and T*rks. Where are all the brave ☭TANKIE☭s standing up for Assad by actually going to fight?

At least look at the links
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_socialism

This applies to literally every country/movement ever. It’s a non argument, it’s like saying in 1917 “the Bolsheviks might become revisionists later so let’s not support them”.

The collapse of the American Empire won’t help jack shit, since it will immediately be replaced by something else like Russia or China. Imperialism is an inevitability under capitalism, and all capitalist countries inevitably become imperialist or accomplices of imperialism. This also goes for your brave “anti imperialist” countries like Iran amen Syria. Besides, Iran has been “anti imperialist” for almost 40 years, fat load of good it has done for the American left. In fact I would argue that socialism can only become a world phenomenon when it occurs at the heart of Empire, since if we imagine a slow American decline followed by a socialist revolution, the imperial competitors like Russia and China will already be in positions to crush the fledgling American socialist Republic. Not to mention the massive chauvinism that is inherent to telling 3rd world proles that they should not rise up and sit around and support a government that fucks them over just because “it’s not the right time yet” or it’s “anti imperialist” you fucking soft western cuck.

Baathism is littered with ideological and historical links to fascism. Multiple Baathist intellectuals cited direct inspiration from fascism, the formed right wing paramilitaries inspired by the black/brownshirts, massacred communists, and used a lot of Nazi literature. A group of Syrian baathists we’re responsible for translating Mein Kampf into Arabic. Fascism doesn’t stop being fascism just because brown people do it. You’d think that we’d be savvy to the classic fascist trick of appropriating leftist sounding rhetoric, but apparently ☭TANKIE☭s didn’t get the memo.

vs
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavonic_Corps
en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/461284.html
dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4973598/Russian-mercenaries-buying-virgin-wives-75-Syria.html

a saloon marxist, nice.

I don’t know how it could be any clearer tbh. If it looks like fascism and does what fascism does, then it’s fascism.

Right, because we all know how progressive and pro-worker Russia is.

Have you even read the links?

so its true. it then is an argument and you just cant accept it because of your cognitive bias.

why even try then?
youll need some solid arguments fro that one

there are no results not because iran is inactive,
there are no results because the american left is a bunch of incompetent fruitcakes, and considers action shit like this

no, theyd just support the perpetual status quo of civil war and political instability rather than bother invading a shithole

the US has been doing the exact opposite; see arab spring and color revolutions

revolutions only happen when a greater power has benefit from it, and they dont happen because people that want them to happen wont do shit themselves. thats your western revolutionarism in a nutshell

he posted no links

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to practicaly ensure political stability
to defend the country from foregein subversion
you mean like all others, even those where the ruling party is "split" into a few more pawns so people think they can vote?
which nonetheless proves to function, unlike some ideological experiment might in the country
the true scotsman amaright?
did you even bother to see why?

i guess half the west is fascist too right

i dont care who gets killed, aslong as its on the right side.

This but unironically.

You speak like some american Holla Forumstard conspiracist.

well its true. the only difference is
vs

It’s a non argument because it has no bearing or implications for anything. It’s like saying “I don’t support x movement because at any moment a meteor could come and destroy the earth”. It’s technically true, but it is universally applicable in all situations, and thus is not a valid reason to do/not do something.

Because you don’t need the support of imperialists to succeed, and you don’t need imperialism to collapse for socialism to be viable.

Historical precedent. When the British Empire collapsed the up and coming American Empire took its place. The same will happen when America’s Empire collapses.

Exactly, and the status of Iran has no bearing on this. If Iran was still an imperial puppet America’s left would be no less or more inept.

They don’t need to invade, America has crushed plenty of leftist governments without invading.

I know they have, and I’m not saying that they aren’t seeking regime change. What I’m saying is that this doesn’t mean that leftists shouldn’t also be seeking their own regime change to establish socialism, that we shouldn’t be encouraging proles everywhere to reject both imperialism and local reaction.

Lmao I honestly hope you don’t consider yourself a Marxist if you think this. Revolutions happen under proper historical circumstances, they are inevitable, and they have succeeded without major outside help (see France and Russia).

I fear for so many people being/going to be banned in this thread and I'm just honestly afraid to voice any thoughts on the matter because I could piss off a vol or BO

no, theyre cancer
its a term i picked up from turkey. what do i call the elite running the countries from behind the scenes then? DA JEWS?
the global elite isnt even a burger thing. even hitler and stalin used it. it reffers to the monopolists in global ecomoy and markets, which then affects global politics

Spooky.

I genuinely believe the west is under a pseudo-fascist state of governance, I don't need to evoke the joke that is western "democracies".

The UK for instance - they didn't just take protectionism from the nazis, but several other social and security aspects too. Same with the US.

There's this great misconception that fascism requires people to dress up like BDSMers with a resurrected zombie-hitler. Just that liberal mystification of reality by thinking fictional stories have credence IRL.

I heard he's banned billions. It's another holodomor I tell you

Lol if you consider the political stability of a bourgeois state to be more important than a successful proletarian revolution then you don’t belong here.

This is the exact excuse that fascists use.

Not all states are totalitarian, and the extend to which the ruling class monopolizes political power varies from country to country. Hegemony, not dictatorship, is the accurate term to describe the position of the ruling class in most countries. Even Marx acknowledged that the grip of the bourgeoisie varied from country to country.

You definitely don’t belong here.

I don’t know how else to describe crushing communist parties and labour unions as anything other than “crushing worker’s movements”.

I don’t fucking care why. Fascists and their followers get the wall, all of them, without exception.

The rest of the world doesn’t follow the same combination of all the shit I described, even if they may follow individual elements of it.

I already heard that somewhere else…

Turkey is now borderline fascist.

Capitalists.

the global elite isnt even a burger thing. even hitler and stalin used it.
Not the best examples.

Yes capitalists but I don't see how they are monopolistics, they want to have monopoles in their respective sector.

I feel like there's the opportunity for a a lyrical adaptation of Panzerkampf to be made about this.

INTO THE MOTHERLAND
THE TURKISH ARMY MARCHED

COMRADES STAND SIDE BY SIDE
TO STOP THE OTTOMAN CHARGE

Reddit spacing and some weird song?
Either Reddit dumbass or false flag without flag on.

I can't imagine what it's like to be this butthurt all the time. You have my pity.

Turkey is threatening US to stop support for Kurds.

wrong. its based on the observation of countless parctical experiments of revolution. and with the currenct circumstances its very likely in this case.

without that support kurds would have been massacred by IS and turkey

nah, youre right, its easier fighting one allpowerfull enemy than a bunch of smaller ones that are infighting

only in the western world, and even there former adversaries of briatin like france and spain gained much more power and soveregionity

then why support any other movement if it wont change anything? why do you westerners do that?

and what kind of a puppet goverment do you beleive will they put on as the head of the US?

yet somehow this "change" only happens when its convinient for Washinton

exactly how is this suppost to refute my claim?
asmuch as the eventual collapse of the sun yeah.
the french revolution was a result of a complete paradigm shift in the european society and revolutionary market reforms, not because of some oppression. the latter just fueled the revolt
russia was collapsing since the 1880s, and everyone from the germans to wallstreet and adventurist capitalists were pouring cash into the bolsheviks

People who don't fucking know Sabaton can fuck right off.
youtu.be/dcab4_-ooj8

well their posters usually are

doesent refute my point in any way

thats kinda broad dont you think?

examples anyway

those arent real are theyyy??

They're meh so that explain why I didn't remember the song

Sounds like someone want the wall via a woodchipper, but okay…

There is a Marxist-Leninist pro government militia called "Syrian Resistance"

They aren't memorable you twat

well that revolution didnt have exactly enough traction did it? case study: itself

tl;dr

im still looking for any state-sized longlived case that will prove me wrong

caucescu was a peoples hero on the same level as Lenin then?

great argument. everyone loses.

so no true scotsman

4 years of hard labour in Vorkuta for having no state.

taste*

So, because you don't find them memorable, nobody should?

reminds me of this

A monopoly is when a single company have all the market in it's economic sector, when they have no competition. So it doesn't apply to any of your examples.

then call it an oligopoly or dominance or what you want

Then the definition by law is too narrow.

I can tell who you are just by your flag and the way you write. You are the most intellectually dishonest person on the board who pretends to be a leftist. There's nothing to argue about there because you are toddler reaching for the high cabinets, at least on the OP's subject

You don't have to speak authoritatively on subjects you don't spend hours rearching

No proletarian revolution will ever be successful when imperialist powers are still standing.

Will imperial powers ever be gone? If not, does that mean proletarian revolution will literally never happen?
Surely history shows that when one imperial power falls, another will rise in its place

With a socialist threat to unite them, imperialists will turn on each other. That's why the last successful proletarian revolution happened in the aftermath of imperialists wrecking each other, twice. They were ruled by monarchies then, and the year was 1914.

Without*

So we wait for World War III?

Yes. It won't be long, though. The wait, I mean, not the war.

I also wanted to ensure political stabilty

Ever heard of the October revolution

Are you like this all day?

You mean the thing that happened when all the imperialists were fighting the most devastating war to date amongst themselves?

IS THERE A CONFIRMATION FOR THE UNITY OR NOT?

thank you

i donr have a flag on

why, because i dont hold the same values as you?

thats everyone on this boad. everyone wants to acheive some goal, unless youre just here to shitpost

wew
try years. ive been on the ME for longer than this board and website existed (which on itself is just a few years recently)

no but its alot more convinient to fight more lesser ones than one big one

t. every leader that ever came to power

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With Turkey's aggressive stance towards the plan of putting over a dozen US military bases in over a dozen US military bases in Syria, it's probably confirmed. As a NATO member, they have primacy.

dont bully him its the depleted uranium

The question is this: is Turkey starting to go off script? I've heard that some analysts are saying that the US and Turkey are at odds and that Turkey is a rising power in the region.

The entire shitshow was off-script since a non-interventionist got elected instead of a warhawk. This isn't the Peshmerga no-fly zone script that worked before. This entire thing is a little too late for the "subtle" ""intervention"" that USA pulled in Iraq and Libya, anyway. Toppling Syria and Iran isn't enough to secure USA's unraveling hegemony anymore. I predict they will strike North Korea and China, instead. After they dispose of Trump.

Reminder that Donny "Tiny Hands" Zoboomafoo paralyzing USA's ability to act internationally is the only thing standing between you and WW3, and you should praise him.

I honestly believe this tbh Trump just doesn't have the social support necessary to fight a major war. He's also such an embarrassment that the other imperialist partners of the West bloc don't want to work with him which makes it harder to hatch war schemes.

Another +200 reply dumpsterfire about the Røjava issue? Please, just stop. over a dozen US military bases in Syria is not even socialist, it's somewhat mutualist but not socialist. It also can't survive without massive third party support. It's not worth arguing about.

im not from serbia. and the bombing was in 1999

thats actually whats happening.
turkey has much more power as a regional power than a mere US extension.

Guaranted replies

Not a bit of variation, a huge amount of variation. Even when anti-communist repression was at its worst in the US you didn’t have state security forces going around and systematically murdering every communist they could find. The most you would get was harassment and very occasional cases of assassination of key figures like Fred Hampton. They didn’t outlaw the communist party, arrest anybody advocating communist ideas, round up every member of the party they could find, and summarily execute them. That’s what the Ba’thists did.

All states rely on violence to exist, but the extent to and context in which it is used varies greatly from state to state. I can stand on a soapbox in the US and openly criticize the government for all to hear, or I could legally be an open member of a communist party. I could not do this in Nazi Germany. Clearly they are different.(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

Here's something you can watch, while you're unable to post historically ignorant bullshit.

youtube.com/watch?v=Hznlp-DwgSw

you fucking idiot, you're not allowed to say this.

thank you.

Assad started this war by shooting peaceful protesters in the street.(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

Sigh… just stop

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:DDDD

youtube.com/watch?v=ko2sIllVVek

retard

This was a deserved ban.

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Yeah the US having programs with Nazi scientists trying to remove communist ideas by neurological surgery in the McCarthy era surely is less repressive. Syria has two communist parties, they are not outlawed, many western countries did actually outlaw communist parties, like modern Germany which outlawed the KPD. I usually don't advocate bans for dissenting opinions but we really don't need McCarthy apologism on this board.

Sauce?

look at this retarded faggot and remember next time BO is getting shit for enforcing rules to keep liberal war apologists out of here

operation paperclip, read up on it.

I know what it is, what book should I read to find out about this surgery madness?

if your western country is so good then why are you on here? are you just one of those anglo leftists thats against the sytem to tell their stupid parents and his boss at McDonalds that hes a rebel?

they deserved it

part of MKultra

this doesn't really change what user said
The US was, is, and will be a McCarthiest shithole, but Ba'athists did kill most of their communists

No one is advocating for McCarthism?
We are stating the reality that killing Comrades is shit no matter where it goes down

It's not
that's why

then fix your own boat first before jumping on the CIA bandwagon just because theres a "revolution"

Sure thing. American Anti-communists will meet theirs.
But are you willing to put the gun to yours when the time comes?

The war literally started due to the Syrian army shooting at and killing four peaceful protesters in Daraa. Prove me wrong.
hrw.org/report/2011/06/01/weve-never-seen-such-horror/crimes-against-humanity-syrian-security-forces

I also think it's amazing how someone can get banned for disagreeing with B0 even though they never broke the rules. It's just plain cowardice. How is this any different from /r/socialism spergouts? What a shithole this place has become.

Supporting imperialism and bourgeois tyranny has always been banable you class cuck redditor.

careful user
your kicking the bee hive

Pointing out that the SAA killed people is not supporting imperialism. The poster never advocated for US intervention to overthrow Assad; he was just pointing out the facts. Or as you call it: 'wrongthink'.

Fuck it. Someone has to point this dumb shit out.

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cant say not being a torfag

Long live Kurdistan, Long live the over a dozen US military bases in Syria, Long Live the Revolution!

So why its ok to support russian imperialism in the middle east? Whats the difference if both superpowers are capitalist?

why does it matter if youre only supporting X because you think it somehow excuses the fact that youre an incompetent passive fuck that wont do anything?

He never said the Americans didn’t try to repress communist ideas, only that they were far less violent and intensive in doing so. They tried to drive them out of academia, entertainment, Civil service, etc. What they didn’t do is round them up and send them to camps like the Nazis did, or outlaw the communist party like Syria did in the 80s.

They were in the 80s when there were sweeping arrests and crackdowns on communists.

What apologism? It’s a fact to say that the US didn’t round up and execute American communists, and their repression was less violent/heavy handed. It was still repression, it was still shit, and it was still reactionary. But it certainly wasn’t the same as what went down elsewhere.

Is that why you support Russian imperialism? Because if you sat out every conflict in which both sides were backed by imperialist forces you would never do anything? The only way to truly oppose imperialism in Syria is to not take a side, since it’s obvious that both the SyDF and SAA are compromised.

If he’s a Ba’athist then he IS an anti-communist.

read the thread before shitposting faggot

because of what? your cherrypicked examples of implications?

Lmao that’s ridiculous, you might as well support the German Empire in WW1 because they were the up and coming imperialists rather than the top dogs. Replacing one Empire wth another does nothing to advance the cause of socialism. This isn’t even the same thing as the case of Iran, because at least Iran is genuinely anti imperialist. Assad is a literal shill for Russian imperial interests, so your pic doesn’t apply.

Because Ba’athism has major historical and ideological links to fascism and a history of widespread repression of communists. They openly preach class collaboration and their definition of socialism is the use of the state to strengthen the Arab nation.

you didnt even read it you fucking idiot did you?

so what? if it works well and is beneficial to the people its preferable to unproductive idealism. not to mention your retarded western left-right division is fucking stupid and only applies to your retarded politics of D&C.

theyre no saints either. its always about getting to power not some fancy ideals.

alot more people will prefer a strong nation over a pack of small collectives that get bullied by every warlord faggot that comes around. you clearly dont have any fucking idea what has been or is happening in the arab world.

one can only hope you anglo scum suffer a war of total destruction and annahilation that will shut you up and put you in your place for good. were sick of your idealistic preaching and world policing

I read it, your argument basically boils down to thinking that breaking up empires will increase the possibility of revolution by weakening the global bourgeoisie. Except what’s happening in Syria isn’t the breaking up of empires, it’s the rebuilding of one. If we were talking about Iran then you might have a case, but in Syria it’s clearly just Russia trying to re-establish the domain of Soviet social imperialism that they lost after 1991.

Jesus how is this not ban worthy? You are literally arguing that a fascistic, anti-proletarian ideology is acceptable because “it works”. Go back to Holla Forums where you belong.

And some people, like genuine socialists, prefer a strong proletariat to a strong nation. But I guess Arab workers being crushed under the boots of the ruling class is okay as long as it’s the Arab ruling class right?

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readabook.com

you prefer to fuck wind then?

and some people, like X will prefer something else. your argument makes no sense, unless youre counting on
being the winning argument.

great CNN quote.
tell me what kind of boots do you like to lick? if theyre red do they taste better?

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Don't you have Israel to praise as the most progressive force in ME on /leftpol/ or something?

It won’t mean anything if Russia gains a foothold. Again, we aren’t talking about bourgeois anti imperialism here, we are talking about Russian vs American imperialism. It’s the building of empires, not their destruction.

I prefer to support genuine socialist anti imperialist movements, because exchanging a foreign master for a local one is an exercise in futility as far as the proletariat is concerned.

You’re allowed to prefer whatever you want, but don’t sit there and preach class collaborationism and ethnonationalism while pretending to be a leftist. If you believe in those things then that’s your business, but own up to it and admit that you are a reactionary.

So you are saying that if people rise up, drive out imperialists and gulag the local bourgeois, while establishing proletarian democracy and self governance, this is somehow licking boots? You are the one advocating for bourgeois ideology and anti democratic systems. You are the one begging to be ruled by Arab porkies and shilling for Gazprom to rape Syria’s wealth.

I didn’t say Assad was a fascist, I said Ba’athism is fascist, a fact borne out by the direct inspiration it’s theorists took from fascism. Ba’athist intellectuals were the first people to translate Mein Kampf into Arabic ffs. I don’t think Assad is consistent with he predecessors in the Ba’athist movement, rather he’s just a generic neoliberal despot lacking an ideology. He’s closer to an African kleptocrat than anything.

it wont be ovrnight, there will be a powerstruggle; a powervacuum. whoever wants it will exploit it.

and those experiments are guaranteed to function and expand because of what? wishful thinking?

no it supports your "socialist collectives".

ayy

all ideology is bourgeois. they invented modern ideologies and there was always a ruling class in every major community.

theyre alot more enclined to listen than your porkies
whats next, barrelbombs and sarin crying?

you can go support a revolution on your own homes expense, but stay out of other countries where you have nothing to lose.

Only imperialism is bannable, not fascism.

kill yourself Yeltsinite

Hafez Al Assad supported the imperialist idea of Greater Syria. Does that mean Ba’ath posters can be banned?

wtf I love Carter now

how is this bad?
>>>/leftpol/

If Assad is "neoliberal", why does the CIA world factbook complain that Syria "failed to liberalize its economy"?

How can an arab state emancipate minorities?

I should have specified "Only Western Imperialism is bannable".

an arab state would need to emancipate both major religious sects, sunnis and shias. that would also mean emancipating kurds and christians, and its a slippery slope from there on to everyone from druze to alawites and assyrians. each minority would be arguably always smaller than all others combined. this would create a lebanon situation where the potential represive dominance of one minority would be challanged by all others. that would either force the ruling power to distribute the power among other minorities or make the living conditions so good that a revolt would not be in question.

again, youre using your anglo logic with your nation states and nationalisms that dont apply to the rest of the world.

the term "arab" is a new construct that only recently replaced the term "ummah", when the beduin tribes and local kingdoms needed to unite under a common banner against repression from outside forces that were also islamic (like turkey, persia, etc)

Yes but you did not explain how, if an arab state was the solution, there would not be the R0java nor the Iraqi Kurdistan conflict.

those two only appeared as a result of the power vacuum crated by the US sponsored war.

So what about the Kurdish–Turkish conflict?

if kurds would be emancipated in the superstate then the superstate could defend the kurds and their interests along the turkish border. that also means demanding the return of hatay and a very likely alliance with turkeys antagonised neighbours like the amrmenians and even greeks

Seriously, you are a reactionary. You don’t belong here. Go somewhere else, like a fucking gulag. Also

Is that why literally every non-Arab in the ME jumps at every opportunity to oppose them? Is that why Kurds, Assyrians, etc all have major independence movements? It must be those evil anglos who are behind it, not the fact that Ba’athism is a chauvinist fascist ideology whose followers deserve a firing squad.

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thats why they call you eternal anglo

gr8 argumnt, ill r8 it b8 out of 8

it doesent. and minorities have always been jumping long before the 20th century.

cry me some mustard gas

Are you saying that Syria for example is not a nation-state?

Nation states already exist there dipshit.

Good! Turks are a cancer and stand in the way of progress. Any strike against them, no matter how small, marks great victory.

no. the syrian identity is an artificial one, like for example the chinses or american one.
this isnt suppost to mean that the existance of such a state is bad though, as drawing up ethnic borders would e near impossible

states do. nationstates dont. in due time aconsensus of a nation might appear, but aslong as minorities jump at eachorther and want to play their own game that wont work

All identities are artificials.

yet they are not equal

Realistically, how long can the over a dozen US military bases in Syria fend off the turks and their arab cannon fodder before they have to retreat from Afrin?

You're right, arabs are inferiors.

Depends if US withdraws support, if Turkey actually commits instead of remaining surgical, if PKK won't start a shitstorm over the issue, if Peshmerga won't get involved.

Too many factors, projection probabilities too low.

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identities that an individual or a group holds are not equal.
regarding races however now that you bring it up, jewsih and anglo posters one here have the leats developed mindset

Is Ba'athism just Arab Nazbol?

Yes, theoretically, they were in touch with Marx, but with spiritualist spooks on top.

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T H E E T E R N A L A N G L O

What does everyone make of this?:
archive.is/iDwif

weak

its just some banter between kurd, turk and syrian supporters. we have alot of thet here too you know.

twitter.com/JOHTURK1/status/959810302429851648
Russian pilot shot down by TAFSA beheaded.