The holocaust was not real. Convince me otherwise

It's a myth, not in the sense that it didn't happen, but in the sense that it doesn't matter whether it happened or not.
It serves as the basis and justification for the modern world order.
Why can't we have a fascist party?
Why do we have to accept every immigrant from anywhere forever?
Why do we have to prop up Israel?
Why is "hate speech" bad?
Why is the idea that races exist evil and racist and nazi?

The world almanac and the census for population by religious belief, couldn't find the pan, and just look up Auschwitz swimming pool.

I'm missing the point of your post, and half of the statements made in your image made me laugh.

Except "muh six million" is a Holla Forums myth. The majority of the time people just reject your ideas because they're self-evidently retarded, and then you blame the Jews because it's the only recourse you allow yourself.

That objection was already dealt with in the in the fourth infograph.

Either state your objection to the evidence presented there or you can fuck off because you're not arguing in good faith.

Whats there to miss? It doesnt matter if the holohoax happend or not because either way its used to control people. All the statements in the picture were made by supposed holocaust survivors and its supposed to make your laugh.

I asked for a source, not what you assumed this image to be from. Morever, the image features obviously altered content (cropping and added year-dates) that might be wrong or malicious.

No, I'm not going to "look up". You're the one making grandiose claims, you back them up.

From the imgur:
Another denier picture (pic related), this time using "World Jewish Almanacs" as proof
This is one of the holocaust deniers' Golden Oldies. They clearly don't know how almanacs work. They do censuses every decade or so, but keep publishing their books almost annually. Doesn't that seem odd? It isn't - during peacetime. The sharper tools in the shed are capable of understanding that the annual figures are nothing but mathematical projections, aka "reasonable estimates".

In 1945, the world just got out of a war that cost the lives of some 60 million people all over the world. Do deniers really think that the world Almanacs will already have the correct numbers one or two years later? Those kind of death tolls take years to assess, as censuses have to be conducted in dozens of countries and countless lists of dead have to be analyzed. Unsurprisingly, the 1949 addition of the Almanac does show a decrease of the world's Jewish population to 11,266,600 people for the year 1947 (see the left page here: fathersmanifesto.net/jews/jews1949z.jpg) , while in 1939 it was around 16 Million, as shown here: fathersmanifesto.net/jews/1949WorldAlmanacJewsMissing.pdf).

The funny thing is, the denier who made the above infographic was stupid enough to even include it without noticing (or included it on purpose to show us how stupid and incriminating a fraud a Jewish population plummet AFTER world war 2 would be, right? err..right guys? g-guys?). It is indeed the sharp drop that appears around 1948-49.

The icing on the cake, of course, is that despite each almanac specifically pointing out that all figures are estimates and which last obtained hard data they are based on (in this case, pre-war), we are treated (yet again) to the epic hilarity of watching the less sophisticated deniers use almanacs as proof.

More detail here: nizkor.org/features/denial-of-science/worldalmanac.html

To recap: Wartime and immediate post-war estimates were projections using pre-war data. These weren't updated in the Almanac until 1949 when the Jewish total did in fact plummet.

As usual, dickhead deniers cite Almanac figures as entirely credible….but if they somehow know which brave committee was conducting accurate census surveys in Europe during wartime when bombs were flying all over the place, I would be glad to let them tell me who these brave souls were…

E.g. for 1940: fathersmanifesto.net/jews/jews1940z.jpg
and 1941: fathersmanifesto.net/jews/jews1941z.jpg

To think almanacs published during these war years are accurate is the height of (denier) stupidity.

The Swimming Pool
A favorite example of the deniers is the Stammlager's swimming pool. They argue that the presence of a swimming pool, with "diving boards", shows that Auschwitz was really a rather benign place, almost a holiday resort, and therefore could not possibly have been a center of extermination. They ignore that the swimming pool worked as a water reservoir for the purpose of firefighting and that the pool was only accessible to SS men and certain privileged non-Jewish prisoners who were at the top of the complex prisoner hierarchy and employed as inmate-functionaries in the camp, including "Aryan" prisoners.

The presence of the swimming pool in the Auschwitz I Stammlager, originally for political prisoners, and that's where the pool was, does not say anything about the conditions for Jewish inmates, and does not challenge the existence of an extermination program, predominantly carried out in Auschwitz II Birkenau.

The great majority of prisoners of course (and the complex housed over 100,000 of them) NEVER got anywhere NEAR this small pool - this is fact.

The problem here is the classic denier generalization tactic from things which were limited in their application, i.e. from the relatively decent conditions provided to the Nazis running the camp, and a small number of privileged prisoners who were their most loyal lapdogs quartered here, to the entire camp population, especially everyone over at Birkenau.

So the swimming pool argument is a complete red herring with the sole purpose of baiting the average person on the street into denial, because clearly he didn't hear about this in school, and clearly it exists, so clearly there's something fishy about the entire camp and he was lied to his entire life.

The idea that, after years of deliberate persecution, anti-semitic laws, pogroms, destruction of synagogues, ghetto starvation, massacres, and so on…that the Nazis forcibly removed people from their homes and transported them hundreds of miles in cattle cars…to a friggin Butlins holiday camp complete with swimming pools, brothels, and 'work' to set them free…is just such a load of COMPLETE AND UTTER BOLLOCKS that anyone espousing it seriously needs the most secure straight jacket that can be found.

It uses Wikipedia multiple times as a source. If it was made with just about anything other than Wikipedia I would be fine with it.

Please don't tell me to fuck off, it makes you seem rash and will only alienate others

No, I know it's from the world almanac and it's not a grandiose claim, i'm saying that it seems dumb and not very likely that it happened. Image attached is pool.

...

The incinerators in death camps were not operated in the same way conventional incinerators are — multiple bodies were cremated at the same time with no casket to burn through in an uninterrupted process designed to minimize cool-downs.
Source: hdot.org/debunking-denial/ab4-civilian-ovens-comparison/

Nice ass and tiddies though. What's her name?

Hoxhaposter covered the almanac - apparently yearly estimates prior to '49 or so were actually collected from 1938 estimates.

I'd like to add that OP could have taken the time to read himself the sources provided, i miss the time we could just bully people asking for spoonfeeding.

Guess who the world almanac was written by in 1949?

Jews.

Not even a joke.

Because last time we did it they burned Europe to the ground and virtually all Europeans subsequently denounced them as the traitorous lunatics that they were.

We don't.

Because they're an ally of Western imperialism in the Middle East.

Because inciting discrimination against innocent people is reprehensible.

Race-based discrimination remained not only legal but ubiquitous in the US well into the '60s.

holocaustcontroversies.blogspot.com/2017/05/rebutting-twitter-denial-most-popular.html#worldalmanac

What do you mean?

navymwrguantanamobay.com/programs/8863a82f-f81c-4737-bcd3-c474e869e6d7#
navymwrguantanamobay.com/movies

Does this mean massive long-term military prison operations are staffed?

As far as i remember the commies burned europe to the ground fam

You shot yourself in the foot, someone else in this thread used the almanac to "disprove" my previous claims. So this Wikipedia article (STOP USING WIKIPEDIA AS A SOURCE) disproves the post higher up above you.

How do you know?

I didn't ask for a picture of the swimming pool but for a source backing your claims regarding the story of inmates swimming to death.

Okay, considering hoxhaposter said that I wasn't reading sources, how about you read my original post. "Not a Nazi."

Because if you read a scanned copy it's there.
And ffs just look it up, I don't have time to go through files to find the image.

OP asks us to convince us to convince him of the veracity of holocaust.
Then after being provided sources and aknowledging we answered to him

, he starts making claims already addressed in thoses very sources we provided him, thus showing he did not read them, OP want to be spoonfed.
In early chan period we could tell people like this to fuck off or just fuck with them, but now people like him are making up the majority of Internet and can even vote.
i wish i have saved that pic of the fat guy eager to drop his redpills and the hipster saying it's not my job toeducate you because that sums up perfectly the reason behind proliferation of Holla Forumsysm.

I really don't see how. The author of the link I posted didn't use rely on wikipedia a single time. Maybe the creator of the infograph did but the fact that he used wikipedia as a source does not debunk or dispute what I posted above. He used outside sources not linked in any way to wikipedia not that wikipedia is even that bad for real–even if it is highly anti-communist

Then surely you can provide me with a properly-sourced, unedited version…?

What makes you think I do, you drooling imbecile?

Found it.

That writing is wiki writing.

It's an almanac do you wan't me to fucking mail it to you?

And stop insulting me, 1 It alienates people that could've listened with open ears to you. 2 Just because you know the word imbecile doesn't mean that you're smart.

Text overlaid an image is not a "source".

I'm saying that people were using it as a source, and that made me doubtful.

No, to provide me with a proper version. If someone shows me a JPG of a page he says is from a novel by Dostoyevsky, I'm not going to believe him unless he provides me with a source that allows me to gain access to the actual text in context, or at the very least proper references like publisher and edition.

You literally told me to do something you couldn't be bothered to do yourself because you "didn't have the time". What makes you believe I am your personal on-line servant?

I'm not sure what you're having an issue with. Are you asking me to check to see if the quote is real? Because I'm pretty sure you can do that yourself.

What the hell are you talking about? I put the text through google and came up with five pages of results and none of them had anything to do with wikipedia. The blog is also not a wiki, its run by Hans Metzner although that particular piece was written by Sergei Romanov

show me images pls

Of what? You can read the link for yourself and google it for yourself. It's not from wikipedia.

DID YOU ACTUaLLY READ mt pSOT

...

okie am done here I just wanted proof and was insulted

Sounds more like you don't have an argument and you're trying to insulate yourself from your beliefs. I'm really not convinced you know anything about the mainstream literature produced by historians about the Holocaust.

Most deniers do actually know something about the actual work done by historians on the subject. It seems like you just read some Holla Forums infographs that said there were swimming pools and decided it wasn't real on that basis.

But if you're just going to believe blindly everything you believe on the internet without doing any deeper research, its better for you just to be a normie and not really question anything the establishment or the MSM is telling you. Really, you're mad you've been insulted? What's been said to you is quite mild.

I suppose you'd like us to believe that Holla Forums or whatever home board you like to hang out at is full of caring, empathetic individuals who always consider other peoples feelings. I'd tell you to stay off the internet but that would feed your victim complex.

You've really had a poor showing in this thread. Sad.

And thoses proofs were provided, you can study them but i doubt you will.
And telling you to read the material we provided to you and doing a research to you is not insulting you sheltered colossal fucking faggot.

*insulate yourself from having your beliefs challenged

They actually freed it.

...

I'm getting the feeling I was never welcome to begin with.

Learn to argue in good faith, post your sources, and actually present counter-arguments when challenged.

Stop expecting to be pampered on imageboards
>>>/tumblr/
>>>/reddit/

...

...

Closing statement from OP.

3 Things I have learned from this thread.

1. Why people are slowly being pushed further right. I came here to have a discussion but ended feeling empty, as I feel that people are not willing to hold discussions, instead they feel that conforming a stereotype is more important.

2. Somehow Holla Forums back on 4chan is friendlier than Holla Forums. How. How did this happen?

3 Apparently you fuckers can't read as people began saying I was a Nazi. I am not a Nazi, I am a libertarian. Also you're still not funny. Also you're hypocrites. Telling me to argue in good faith, when you had straight away in your begging 5 info graphics were insulting people.

This isn't how you make friends politically, it's how you burn bridges. Good luck everyone on this board, I hope you didn't feel like you wasted your time like I did.

You're a retard and we don't need friends like you. Have a nice day.

You've proved my point right.

Imageboards are for fun, not actual politics. Noone is obliged to address your needs if he doesn't feel like it. Likewise, you may do whatever you like to have fun.

Like creating famines that kill 60 million people? Sounds like fun.

You started being dogpiled when you claimed to be insulted because someone told you to look for something yourself.
This lead people to you're arguing in bad faith and that something that makes patience run really thin.

And disregarding the validity of someone's claims because you feel they are mean to you is a very vile view of communication, and you should feel ashamed for promoting the safe space mentality.

Good. Fuck off.

"Y-You made me a fascist by being mean to me!"

Holla Forums is okay with accommodating your retardation. We don't — we're not a safe space.

"Nazi" or not, you're an Holocaust denier. That's what people described you as.

You were asked to argue in good faith and provide proper evidence. You didn't and then started crying like a little bitch instead.

We don't want to be your "friends" nor to "build bridge" to the cesspit in which you and your ilk wallow like pigs. Goodbye, nigger.

I just wanted a place for my own biases to be challenged. I've only had them reafirmed.
Nice one. You sure showed me.

Goodbye, nigger>>2346726

Oh, yes. Communism is responsible for artificially created mortality, which resulted in 150 million victims of communism in the Soviet Union alone.

You raise a good point, however. Discussing a "death toll" of an ideology is an entirely fruitless endeavour, and Nazism is shit regardless of holocaust (which clearly took place, but was also exaggerated).

This was mild in comparison to how discussions here normally go. When you make a claim, expect to be challenged.

t. Resident ultra-reactionairy

And this didn't happen?

Brb, grabbing my Luger.

You had absolutely no intent of challenging your biases.
When we started to challenge them you quickly retreated to the" leftists are smug assholes" to dismiss everything you've been told.

How was the Holocaust "exaggerated"…?

The number of 6000000 may not be exact, and the actual number may be lower. It makes sense that allied coalition didn't really care to verify it as well as every accusation, not to mention that it was simply impossible to get it right in some cases.

You must admit it is much better than local Holla Forums and has something 4chan pol doesn't provide too.

5-6,000,000 Jews killed is the consensus among contemporary historians. Early post-war estimates actually tended to propose lower numbers.

On that I agree. Though I don't think it would hurt to be a bit more lenient towards actual Nutsac posters. You may not convince them (right away), but it's great for lurkers that are on the fence.
We could really do with a thread dedicated to debunking nazi propaganda through infographics. It's a great counter to the incessant Gish Gallop shitposting.
Also point out the nazi genocide of non-jews for added effect. So much for "saving" Europe.

tbh I enjoy discussing with confused Holla Forumstards who wash up on Holla Forums in search for earnest debate, but people who won't provide sound evidence I can't be bothered with.

Yeah, sometimes I feel actual genuine right-wing enquiries get anchored a bit too fast here.
A thread dedicated to debunking is a good idea but it is very easy to foresee that it would be an absolute shitfest of schizos and autists who have made holocaust denial part of their ego. Maybe a curated resource sticky would be better but I don't want this place to be like Holla Forums with an obnoxious spergy mass of stickies.

You are on leftypol.
Where even the swear filters are engineered specifically to stifle discussion.

Yet discussion you can have

Best post.

10/10

not read any books, have you

OP,

if you want free discussion go to >>>/1917/

this board is for leftist discussion only.

Yeah, no a human body is not very flammable and the "ovens" they had were the same height and width of crematorias of the period, yet they didn't have thousands they had usually less than 10.
Further more they were not sealed, meaning their close proximity to highly combustable Zyklon B for the alleged "gas chambers" would have meant a fucking massive explosion after the first of showers.

Using the body fat of corpulent victims as a fuel was something that would require first hand knowledge. Tauber was a shoemaker and would not have been in a position to know this without actually observing it. The issue is how credible was this testimony. The German engineer Rudolf Jakobskotter, who Mattogno had cited as an authority on cremation ovens, wrote that body fat produces heat for burning in an oven. [171] Mattogno did not directly address the issue of using body fat in the ovens as a source of fuel. He had initially dismissed testimony about using body fat in cremation pits to accelerate the burning process. However, he subsequently withdrew his initial objection by writing that "I have discovered that such a procedure can be made to work if done in a determined fashion…" [172] Tauber had also discussed how body fat was used in the cremation pits to accelerate burning. [173]

The process of using body fat in an oven was also described by Sonderkommando Filip Müller, who noted that the authorities had found ways to place the bodies in the ovens to maximize fuel efficiency.

In the course of these experiments corpses were selected according to different criteria and then cremated. Thus, the corpses of two Mussulmans [camp slang for emaciated prisoners] were cremated together with those of two children or the bodies of two well nourished men together with that of an emaciated woman, each load consisting of three, or sometimes four, bodies. Members of these groups [SS men and civilian visitors to the crematoria] were especially interested in the amount of coke required to burn corpses of any particular category…

Afterwards all corpses were divided into the above mentioned four categories, the criterion being the amount of coke needed to reduce them to ashes. Thus it was decreed that the most economical and fuel saving procedure would be to burn the bodies of a well-nourished man and an emaciated woman, or vice versa, together with that of a child, because, as the experiments had established, in this combination, once they had caught fire, the dead would continue to burn without further coke being required." [174]

Similarly, Auschwitz camp commandant, Rudolph Hoess testified at Nuremberg that three bodies would be burned simultaneously and that the bodies of fat people burned faster. [175

phdn.org/archives/holocaust-history.org/auschwitz/body-disposal/

Leuchter is not, as many deniers hail him as, "America's foremost gas chamber expert"… he only holds a bachelor's degree in liberal arts

Leuchter repeatedly expressed concern and disbelief over the proximity of the gas chambers to the crematoria, stating that due to the explosivity of HCN, the entire place would blow up if a homicidal gassing took place - although an "execution expert" and "engineer" like him should have known that warm blooded human beings can be killed with concentrations as low as 300 ppm, while HCN only becomes explosive in concentrations beyond 56,000 ppm[1].

Leuchter calculated that it required 3,200 parts per million (ppm) of Zyklon-B to kill a human being.[7] In reality, it requires only a maximum of 300 ppm.[8]

hdot.org/debunking-denial/ab12-leuchter-report/

i dont feel free tbh