/prc/ -- China General

Thread for discussions of the People's Republic of China. Is Xi steering us back on the way to Maoism or is it condemned to be State Capitalist? How are their relations to the DPRK, would they be willing to protect them against U.S. Imperialism? What motivates China's current actions.

Other urls found in this thread:

chuangcn.org
scmp.com/news/china/economy/article/2125671/china-start-releasing-proper-unemployment-figures-after-decades
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biennio_Rosso
maps.clb.org.hk/strikes/en.
dengxiaopingworks.wordpress.com/selected-works-vol-2-1975-1982/
criticaltheoryresearchnetwork.com/2017/08/22/obscure-subjects-myth-metapolitics-alt-right/
return2source.wordpress.com/2011/05/20/china-market-socialism-a-question-of-state-revolution/
youtube.com/watch?v=YtPsTieXSfI
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

Of course, China wants the US to fuck off its borders, between the Republic of China, Japan, Vietnam, and the Philippines the US has China neigh surrounded. Xi is not a Maoist by any stretch of the imagination, his anti-corruption campaign should be celebrated along with his renewable energy projects.

Bumping with Maoist posters

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China is protecting the DPRK.

lol that is one cute Stalin

do you think they can pull it off?
More importantly, can WE pull off a socialist revolution after/during the war?

couple of allied countries join nk's side*

Anti-Chiang gang is my favorite

Totally, here's a qt young Mao

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Other than nukes, the USA is a paper tiger. All they can use against China is ICBMs and other long range missiles. They're incapable of an ocean-to-land invasion because China, Russia, Iran, etc. can all sink the entire US ship fleet with hypersonic missiles. A handful of nukes or a bunch of regular missiles would take out the US positions in the Philippines, Japan, ROK, etc.
Basically, in terms of modern total warfare, all the USA has for leverage is MAD, which prevents total war.

The USA is a paper tiger period, its nukes are outdated and rusty, they won't use them

That's not something we can count on. If even a tenth of their nuke stockpile is still functional, it could still destroy civilization as we know it.

so what would happen? Would they try to naval invade only to get wiped out? Or would china or russia strike at the US homeland?

The top brass are stupid yes, but they don't have the guts to actually destroy humanity

China needs to return to Maoist principles. Goddamn it. Are there even still Maoist purists in the Communist Party of China?

chuangcn.org

Your opinion contradicts the entire past century of communist analysis of MAD. The USSR, PRC, DPRK, Cuba, and all other socialist states concluded that the USA was serious about nuclear warfare, and so they took the threat seriously as well.

War between nuclear powers doesn't necessarily have to go nuclear though

but it will, inevitably

That's ehy it's gotta be quick and decisive, beat them before the battle starts

or use proxies and have all the fun of a conventionall war without the nasty blowback of nuclear winters

Probably the most likely

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:( im just pointing out the subcontratation of ally/subservient nations for the buisiness of war

You can either be Machiavellian or you can get out of politics, you can't do both

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It works, especially as agitprop against the Italian nobility

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They dont call it the headquarters of the revolution for nothin

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imagine being someone who thinks china is socialist, how happy would you be

scmp.com/news/china/economy/article/2125671/china-start-releasing-proper-unemployment-figures-after-decades
place your bets

who would've thought
such low wages when you have 4% rate

hot take: unemployment > foxconn

but they are stupid enough to try.

Stop spamming this picture

Maoism is literally just communism

Why would you support it?

KEK

Mao was one of the best things that happened to global capitalism, pushed forward a process of brutal modernisation, developed industry which allowed employers in the West to offshore production, and so far Xi has shown no sign of planning to change this.

In regards to the DPRK, China is getting increasingly sick of their shit, but if war does break out (which is incredibly unlikely btw), millions of refugees are going to take the path of least resistance, which sure as fuck isn't the DMZ. China already has enough problems with overpopulation, it doesn't want or need more than 20 million Koreans turning up at once.

Ultimately the PRC is another feudal enterprise, masquerading behind the veneer of a people's republic, what motivates their actions is whatever the fuck the guys at the top of the pile think is best.

Fucking word filters

Maoism is

R E D F A S C I S M

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That word filter is fucking hilarious. Easily top 5.

kek

Unsurprisingly China's already built the refugee camps on the border. Hopefully they send a shit ton of solar panels down to DPRK to get around the fuel ban.

Mao (or was it Lin Biao?) literally talks about class collaborationism and how it may be possible to reform capitalism once the "international bourgeoisie" are expelled

But yeah, that doesn't sound familiar at all

China really are serious about communism, but they know they need to develop rapidly and know capitalism is a proven way to do it. They don't have the emotional attachment to capitalism the west has, it's just a tool to them. They have a culture that thinks and plans very long term.

Fascism is capitalism in decline. And we definitely know of a group of authoritarian, highly nationalist, capitalist imperialists LARPing as commies. Dengists.

Rather undialectical IMHO

Now you fucked up.

why did it begin in almost pre-capitalist Italy then?

Are you daft?

Lenin didn't live to see fascism

Well, perhaps if you're using fascism as short-hand for corporatism Actual corporatism, not "muh not real capitalism" corporatism

There's a difference between when ideological thought begins, and when ideological thought begins to matter.

Maybe a better way to put it was "predominately proto-industrial society". The point is capitalism was hardly in decline in Italy at the time of the regime's beginning.
Plus the Fascist regime was by 1938 the second most state run economy (next to the USSR of course), hardly the behavior of uncloaked late-stage capitalism.

I've spent a lot of time researching Mussolinian Fascism, and I can say that Mussolini's chief advocate in FIAT was its vice-president, who began actively opposing the Fascist regime after the Matteoti murder.

sounds like Menshevism

Menshiviks were right, Leninism was a mistake

Italian fascism rose up because there was a serious movement of Italian workers striking and taking over factories at the time, people back then were worried it could lead to an actual revolution.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biennio_Rosso

Now that's true. With just slightly different Socialist Party leadership, Italy might have gone red instead. Fascism's inception was not a reaction to that, though.
We know its earliest origin in Italy lies in the so-called "developmental nationalism" of Enrico Corradini's Italian Nationalist Association, which ideologically crossbred with National Syndicalism, this marriage happened before the most severe of the general strikes had even begun, though, and had started at around the time of the Italo-Turkish war.
Most of Fascism's early-to-mid-life major leaders were former socialists/anarchists, chiefly anarcho-syndicalists like Filippo Corridoni, who had split with mainstream socialism because of the party's refusal to follow the European trend and support the nation's role in WWI.

but fascism's growth in power and support was in reaction to that. The blackshirts were originally strikebreakers and Mussolini promised the bourgeoisie that he would stamp out communism in Italy.

although, as an aside, some leftists-turned-Fascists like the anarchist Sergio Pannunzio were chiefly disgusted by the rise of Berstein's Social Democrats, and in their hurry to discredit it had ironically adopted some of the ideological material (e.g. Sorellianism) necessary for the eventual formation of Fascism.

Yes, I will agree with that. Though the extent of boug support of Mussolini is somewhat overstated and had become extremely strained by the late regime. Gramsci pointed out that Fascism had a rather dodgy reputation with Italy's rather weak capitalist class, and his strongest support was in the middle class and so theorized that Fascism was chiefly a middle class reaction to its proletarianization as a result of the emergence of industrial capitalism in force in Italy.

Block your part*

shit wars gets 150 posts but prc gets buried

Hah, yeah man, real socialist development going on in China right now: maps.clb.org.hk/strikes/en. What, don't believe me? You fucking ultra-Trotskyite wrecker leftcom revisionist, Xi is just playing the long game!

Read Deng.
dengxiaopingworks.wordpress.com/selected-works-vol-2-1975-1982/

Also read this: criticaltheoryresearchnetwork.com/2017/08/22/obscure-subjects-myth-metapolitics-alt-right/

=>How is CLB funded?=
Nice try mr regime change.

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China is more capitalist than Star Wars.

star wars is fun

return2source.wordpress.com/2011/05/20/china-market-socialism-a-question-of-state-revolution/

The line of the CPC has produced unprecedented wealth, growth and living standards. It's based on scientific economic planning and decision-making, and every communist who wants to discard China out of ideological purity makes a grave mistake. I recommend every ultra here to actually talk to a Chinese person about his increase in living standards, the CPC has never lost connection to the masses. Any theory which refuses to update itself in the face of the 21st century is bound to end up in the dustbin of history.

i agree witht this 100%

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That's savage shit m8.

Words are cheap. At best the CPC coddles porky so they don't have incentive to dissolve the state like the soviet ruling class had.

Yeah because the USSR is a successfull template to be following right? China knows it's a capitalist world, and that capitalism is war. Workers might be soldiers, but porkies are tanks, like it or not you need them to win.

You sound like an American arguing for capitalism right now.
Plenty of working class liberals and reactionaries in the west feel like their governments are "connected" to them, that doesn't mean that those governments represent the working class. The Communist party in China is filled with billionaires and China has more billionaires than America does now.

jesus, china shills at it again

one hundred gorillion keks
in the 20th century rapidly developed only US, Japan, USSR and somewhat FDR
everyone else ate their dust

capitalism worked for china because of its enormous population creating a very slack labor market
plus a strong state that doesn't shy away from union busting

Reagan would be proud

uwot mate
Chinks don't even have indicative planning on the level of Britain in its post war years

criticism of class collaborationism is not an ultra position, you dip

chink party system has the worst aspects of soviet system and none of the good ones
at least supreme soviet was not a total bitch of the executive branch

soviet state dissolved exactly because there was no mature bourgeoisie in which interest was to keep a strong state
bourgs don't need a state in times of primitive accumulation

China refers to itself as socialist, not state capitalist as the NEP did, so the comparison doesn't work.

Another thing is that the NEP was introduced when Russia was in ruins after a civil war, and only lasted 7 years before moving towards a planned economy. China was not war torn when it introduced market reforms in the late 1970s, it's been going on for 40 years in one direction and one thing people always seem to miss is that China already had a planned economy under Mao, so they've gone backwards in the Marxist sense.

No, China openly refers to the market reforms as capitalism, it just says that the overall state in China is still socialist. This is exactly how the Soviets referred to the NEP.

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Are there any good sources about the cultural revolution? I can't imagine what it's like to be a middle schooler and have the chairman tell you to take over like it's a Recess episode.

Why are there no worker cooperatives in China?

Les habits neufs du président Mao: chronique de la " Révolution culturelle "

there are though

yes he did you moron

fascism didn't just start in the 30s it started getting popular all the way back in the early 20s(21 to be exact)and Lenin lived to 1924

kill yourself kerensky

Yes, mainly in agriculture. The state especially tries to promote them in less developed rural areas. I've seen state media reports about the successful ones but who knows how well coops do in general and how democratic they really are.

what are some good resources to start learning mandarin? i've been wanting to learn it for a while