youtube.com
Zizek says that there is nothing wrong with taking in refugees, but the way the EU did it is terrible and that he sympathizes with the radical right when they decry it.
Frenchies, is this stuff in the video common? If so I am inclined to agree with Zizek.
Other urls found in this thread:
en.wikipedia.org
theguardian.com
ncleg.net
glaad.org
dash.harvard.edu
twitter.com
Sounds about right to me.
Zizek is ALWAYS right.
that youtube video you linked seems to be just some generic piece of alt-right propoganda from its title and the op's account name, not zizek
what were you trying to do here?
I mean, you can find hundreds of these videos on YouTube. I just searched up "walk through Paris refugees" and this is what came up. If this is not the case, that's why I asked the Frenchies about it in the OP.
Confirm whether or not Zizek is right about the refugee program into Europe.
Zizek is practically useless and a talking head at this point. The worship over him is primarily just because he talks funny and is a known communist.
I would take everything he says seriously full stop with a grain of salt. Zizek can and has been wrong
He is the most prominent communist of the day, dude. Can you name me another communist that has the depth of knowledge and the breadth of influence that he does?
*sniff* yesh *touches shirt nervously*
So let's just believe everything Zizek says
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t. brainlet
*gasp*
Of course he is.
I'm sympathetic towards the idea of taking refugees, sort of, but most of the migrants are not refugees. Many just come to get on welfare, though some of them actually work. With too large of a Muslim population, governments will be forced to appease them to win elections, which will in the long run lead to European Islamic Republics.
This will be a disaster. If you thought the Nazis were bad, just wait until we have Deutsche Islam. If you thought Arab Jihadis were bad, just wait until an obedient, warlike population like the Germans, who already harbored a fascination for Islam in their psyche, adopt in en masse. The Germans are, after all, not known for moderation.
you fell for a meme
This is hysteria at this point.
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Now this is some scaremongering. At least give some realistic commentary.
accept refugees but instead of clustering them together in camps where the refugee lifestyle is the norm house them in the homes of citizens with space to spare across the nation to acclimatize them to the nation's culture
it's that fucking easy
I'm not saying they will run on an Islamic platform in the near term, but, over time, I think Germans will convert to Islam. It's perfect for the eternal German. Submission and Jihad are core ideas of Islam. A religion like Islam is practically tailor-made for the Germans. Hitler, of course, was a big fan.
Germanic Islamic Socialism with jihadi characteristics when?
Holla Forums trying to subvert while Zizek advocates for literally air lifting refugees to Europe
Hmm lets try that again…
Hmm lets try that again
Well tried everything
5% is short term thinking. Remove old people from the equation (irrelevant as they'll have no more children) and then look at the difference in birth rates. Given time they'd become a majority based on those facts alone, but they don't even need to reach 50% to be a major voting base. Native's are alright split between left & right and other racial groups will fragment the voting base even further
This is hysteria. You aren't recognizing many Syrian refugees, are fucking leaving at this point.
Syrian's don't make up the majority of refugees, the people claiming to be Syrian can't return to a country they're not from.
Fun thing is that if a revolution ever happens they will get killed if they don't drop that religious bullshit, so basically we are mining our own revolution by letting them in. I don't understand how a socialist can be ok with letting reactionary, racist, bigots diasese ridden assholes into the continent. But again, more assholes like them to kill less reactionaries will oppose us
Hysterical nonsense but even if it were true it wouldn't matter.
Please, learn your facts before you start shitposting here Holla Forums
en.wikipedia.org
You are just spreading the fear of "eurabia", while ignoring the facts
daily reminder half the planet will be uninhabitable this century and mass migration to colder climates is inevitable
Well you are kind of spreading "eurabia" too
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Your own link says they have an above average fertility rate both globally and within Europe.
How does this help at all?
Explain to me, how the 10% of entire population is going do take over the whole continet.
The number is high, because they are already muslims living in Europe in countries such as Kosovo, Albania and Bosnia and Herzegovina, so it isn't as scary as it may sound to some.
What are you going to do to stop them?
Shoot them some more? That's a great idea, it's not counter intuitive
Like they did in afghanistan. Fuck off with this bullshit.
Good luck disposing of at least half of the worlds bodies before they cause unimaginable destruction to the already dwindling habitable land.
It's literally not counter intuitive, the countries that treat immigrants the worst have the least problems with terrorism etc
There's an element of guilt over past sins, an element of identification of islam with anti-imperialism, but also, I think, a fascination with Islam by many leftists. See the popularity and romanticization of Hezbollah, Khomeini, Ba'athism, etc.
They may very well have, but the high fertility rate is present mostly in their homelands, not Europe. In Europe their fertality rate is pretty close to non-muslim population fertility rate
What is exponential growth.
I'm not scared of a take over. I'm scared of their presence. We nearly ended christianity I don't want to spend half a century taking off another shit
I wasn't talking about a socialist one but I do think that Muslims will have their own revolution in Europe/
It is counter intuitive because of the context of our time.
What's the solution then?
Bitching about muslims is mass hysteria at this point tbh
stop reddit spacing
Export the problem back to the Middle East or North Africa.
Complete hysteria ITT, just take a look at the Muslims in Germany, most of them are supporting pride parades, the ones I know in my Uni are mostly chads who party and drink all night, you people honestly believe that Islam is going to beat liberalism? the ideology that ended both Nazism and Communism?
say that to the people of rotherham
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How was that reddit spacing
So you can keep Capitalism safe?
Holla Forums loves to romanticize Arab nationalism and Arab secularism back in the 20th century. How did that turn out in the long term?
maybe if they weren't bombed into oblivion they wouldn't have come to europe en mass in the first place
You can thank the eternal anglo for that mess
The Cold War happened
1. Double on renovable energy
When I say double I mean eco stalinism levels of doubling on it. Less dependency on oil, less dependency on saudi cock, less wars, less immigration
2. Stop giving weapons to the saudi
Obvious
3. Embargo every country that is doing shit in that part of land
4. Close the boarders, shoot anyone who tries to enter until the countries that partecipate in war in the middle east have to take them all in
5. Do not build mosque or shit like that
6. "I wanna pray" "I wanna wear a veil"
Ok go back to you country then.
Don't let muslims in don't suffer islamic terrorist attacks is pretty basic logic
theguardian.com
agreed comrade FUCK poor whites
Can't believe I would say this, but even Stalin wasn't nearly as retarded as you
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How did that turn out in the long term?
got bomb'd and invaded by America and Ussr because of inane political reasoning, then became fundamentalist s-holes.
Those are some pretty high figures compared to middle east countries
Western imperialists got mad that the Arabs weren't bowing down and paid ethnats to take over only for the ethnats to turn around and revolt against the West anyway?
you wouldn't know basic logic if it walked up to you and fucked your stupid face
you don't care about those people, and i don't doubt that you're actually glad it happened so that you could use it as a bludgeon for your defective ideology
Look at the US. A small portion of rural, ultra-religious rednecks are able to get bathroom bills and anti-evolution propaganda passed with ease. Despite the majority of the country favoring Democrats, we have an all republican government who are now going even against their own electorate and are trying to get rid of Obamacare. 10% of anything with a singular purpose can be very controlling in any democratic country, espcially one like the US where power is often decided by political districts (states) and not by raw population numbers: oeople of Wyoming have 100 times the voting power of people in California.
Also I agree with other posters there that we really don't fucking need more Islam, and if anyone should be talking on more muslims it should be the US, who are funding the wars and radicalization in the first place. Insane christains are bad enough, we really don't need another crazy religious group vying for power.
It also really makes me doubt the current anti-democratic EU, as one woman in germany can just decide to introduce major demographic shifts in a country and no one can really do anything about it. If germany wants to take muslims then more power to them, but why the fuck do they have to force everyone else to?
I think the immigration issue is something I really steer from most of Holla Forums on, you guys are putting ideology before reality. Forcing the importation of large amounts of people from a different culture, education level, religion, morals, etc. into countries with already shaky economies is fucking retarded. I don't care how much you preach about world revolution or helping others, it's going to cause a lot of stress and you're not going to convince Joe Worker whose already struggling to get by to pay for a bunch of foreigners to sit around and complain all day. All this did was help the rise of the Aut-right as something to blame the left on.
America has that problem because of its electoral college, it isn't the same system of voting as in Europe.
Also this identity politics shit is really getting old at this point
am I dreaming
I agree with you, what's the solution to this problem then? how do we stop it?
Assuming that nothing else changes, it would appear Muslims generally view American imperialism as an attack on the global ummah, which, combined with Saudi propaganda and Israeli treatment of the Palestinians, promotes radicalization, even in countries where US intervention is minimal. Unless one of these things changes in the future, which is not likely, I don't see why we shouldn't expect radicalization to continue in Western countries. Given this, it would seem a lot easier to export the problem back to the Middle East than to try to integrate them or try to go full Hoxha on the Islamic clergy.
Because they're in seats bought for them by capitalists you massive dipshit. The "bathroom bill" is just a cover for the anti-worker legislation actually in the stupid thing.
Tell us more about the scary muslim shadows on the wall my dude.
What you need and what you have are two entirely different things, and reality doesn't usually give you "what you need", you need to adapt to the circumstances or fucking loose.
Right now, the Western World has fucked up massively by not only supporting the wrong causes in the 20th century, but by creating a worse climate. All in areas that are going to be hit the hardest by the climate. You could not have fucked up worse and destabilized the world easier. The "Western World" has "lost" already.
What everyone who doesn't want migration to happen is either mass death (supporting the Military Industrial Complex yet again that lead us here, supporting Capital and Imperial); or just wants fantasy where the world is comfortable.
The world will not be comfortable, so get that through your head.
You have to find out a way to make this fucking work.
What you mean? Are they trying to attack workers rights to use the restroom on the clock? I don't see how saying that you must use your birth sex's restroom is anti-worker.
Gee, I wonder who the US could be supporting. I doubt it's fucking Saudi Arabia
Man imagine being this deep in the trashcan, news flash, the only reason Germany is still kicking even after the recession is because of immigrant workers, hell even the NHS which nationalist fags keep complaining that is going to get shut because of immigrants is actually RUN by immigrants (1 in 6 doctors), the U.S is also a world power because of it's immigrant workforce that comes from Latin countries, without immigrants you get a stagnate economy such as Japan, when will this "immigrants don't work" meme end already, how about you actually meet some immigrants before you lump them into whatever stereotype suits your ideology
The problem is that there is no solution to this problem. YOU CAN NOT FIX IT no matter how many are integrated or deported. All sides are stuck between a rock and a hard place.
bad post
You have 0 reading comprehension and are looking to argue for the sake of arguing.
Well the question was how does a small percentage of a population gain power and this doesn't disprove my point.
I didn't say a damn thing negative about muslims, simply that the native europeans won't accept them no matter how much you try to tell them not to. Muslim immigrants could be the coolest dude on earth, but if the population doesn't want them then forcing it will only make them dig in their heels and vote right.
If your summary is true then I am disappointed with him. Tbh, we should just fuck off and become pluralist
Stop posting
didn't say it is good thought :^)
The only way to stop radical islam and improve the lives of muslims in general is for them to have a better alternative. Taking people in and integrating them is good, as long as you don't marginalize the shit out of them by taking a shitload at once and riling up the racists (whoops). But I guess that's an unavoidable consequence of bombing the shit out of their native lands and tromping around looking for oil. Nuke the west tbh fam.
so how will this happen? How will you persuade the investors to put money in Middle East?
Which one is easier: exporting the Islamic problem or overthrowing a military empire that can't run out of money? The first one, obviously. You don't even need to send all of them home. Even if you're just stuck with the T*rkroaches, that's an improvement.
"The Islamic Problem" is not going fucking away you naive dipshit
It doesn't need to go away, it needs to go back to Turkey or Syria or Iraq.
You can't be a leftist and support Islam.
What are you going to do when it becomes too hot for human occupation? All you can do is look at the plans you could have made and cry you were so fucking stupid and naive as you are now. You're a fucking child politically
They are already doing this. Every bomb dropped is an investment because statistically it will create X number of radicals who provide a justification for more war ergo more arms contracts. Nothing else will come close to being that profitable, so the idea that the problems in the middle east will get better under capitalism is pure fantasy.
Thanks. Remember afghanistan
Islam and Muslims are two different things. Islam is a fascistic cult that has taken about 2 billion people hostage. Muslims are the hostages.
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you can oppose middle eastern wars without supporting Muslim immigration
What if we, you know, tried improving places like Africa and the Middle East so their inhabitants didn't have a reason to migrate in the first place?
Why are you concerned with improving the welfare of others before the welfare of your own community? Dumbfuck.
fugging rebisionists :DD BUNKERS and ATHEISM not ISLAM ok, praise Hoxha
Holy shit, you fucking racist pro-US imperialist bigot! What's going to happen to them?! Where is your internationalist anti-imperialist spirit? Muslims are our comrades and are anti-imperialist. Remember, Ba'athism is socialist, also praise Hezbollah.
Why the fuck is this thread bumblocked?
That is what began all this in the first place. Capitalists "improving" these places through colonialism and until capitalism is gone any genuine try at improving will either be accused of being colonialism or subverted by capitalist into colonialism.
Don't see whats wrong with this.
Why should European proles have to fix Africa and the middle east?
Chomsky, Cockshott, Stallman.
Why indeed
I hope they come and rape you all tbqh
When I said eurpeans/muslims whatever I'm not meaning every last fucking one. Like my previous posts said, even a small percentage of the population can have huge political power. If there is a large enough minority to resist muslim immigration, they will give everyone else problems. If a minority of immigrants are extremists/rapists/whatever, they will give everyone else problems.
nope
Nice meme, you're only enjoying your first world living standards because people in the third world are slaving away in sweatshops
Fuck that liberal anarkiddie fuck
Ah yeah we sure need another hippie fuck
He's fine
Well, maybe because we colonized, exploited and helped to destabilize the region?
Hi jason
now I've seen everything. European people are still working class and still exploited, they shouldn't have to fix the mistakes of the ruling class.
Yeah why shouldn't those poor western proles keep burning carbon until those lazy shitskins get cooked to death? It's really not fair.
My post wasn't meant in a Maoist tone obviously, but to say that we have no business in helping proles in third world countries is extremely smug, reminds me of the liberal bourgeois attitude
ncleg.net
The bathroom shit is irrelevant identity politics to cover for the actual meat of the bill, which attacks what meager protections contract workers have, as well as taking the ability for municipalities to set their own regulations regarding requirements and discrimination and putting them solely in the hands of the state legislature.
The bathroom stuff doesn't fucking matter and never, ever did.
No, it wasn't.
but this was the doing of the ruling class, and the worst of it was done before most people where even born. Why should the average prole in Europe or North America have to accept immigrants or improve the conditions for people in the middle east. That like if I broke something of yours and you forced my younger brother to pay for it.
There is a difference between sympathizing with someone and agreeing with them or admitting they are correct. People who flock to the far right have legitimate fears, but they are being led by Machiavellis who don't even have principles at all, even questionable ones.
What you should take from Zizek's commentary on the refugee crisis is the crux of the leftist position on the matter: Germany and the EU have bluntly demonstrated the failure of liberal capitalist "democracy", which suffers an inherent, irreconcilable conflict between its humanitarian ideals and the inhuman exploitation it endorses.
Muslim immigration is a direct consequence of the wars, and not allowing them to immigrate marginalizes them and plays into the hands of the islamists.
It being possible to have a position says nothing about how reasonable the position is. A position doesn't even have to be coherent for people to be able to have it. I can oppose measles without supporting vaccines, even though that makes no sense.
glaad.org
Reminder to always check sources and never trust Holla Forums
Why should western proles be punished for climate change? Do you think a billion or so people can be lifestyleist hippies?
Liberals are the ones who have the condescending noble savage view of brown foreigners who think they need to be saved and brought into the civilized world.
wew lad
Because regular people shouldn't be deprived of a safe place to live.
Because working people have no nation or state and improved conditions there mean improved conditions for everyone.
if having a reasonable immigration policy plays into the hands of the Islamist then Muslims aren't even worth trying to convince on our side. Let them go to the Islamist and just be sure to keep them out.
Reasonabale is a buzzword in this context.
Curtailing destructive consumption isn't punishment.
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It is not punishment, you mong, it's necessary for your great-great-grandchildren to not die.
The safety of a place for non-Muslims rapidly changes when the Muslim population reaches a critical mass.
I don't get why pro-Islam leftists can't just come out and say that a certain number of terror attacks, murders, rapes etc. by alienated or radicalized Muslims is an acceptable price to pay for the number rescued from Middle Eastern/African war or poverty. This is what the de facto position is, so why try to disguise it with various platitudes about the US, Saudi Arabia, or Israel? None of these factors is going to change in the near future. Integration doesn't really seem to work, so it would seem obvious that terror attacks or other crimes are simply a fact of life that we must accept for the greater good.
The overall trend with Islam polls is most important. There is an extremely strong correlation between country of origin and reactionary sentiment among Muslims. Pakistan and the MENA region are hotbeds of it, but Muslims in the Balkans are about as secular as Christians (there is some reactionary ideology, but only in terms of their weird ethnic conflicts).
It is true that Islam itself is massively spooky, but the sociological and political functions of religion are largely ignored by "rationalist" types. All Abrahamic religion is inherently political from a theological perspective, but there's no particular reason that Islam wouldn't become the empty cultural symbolism that Christianity has become under similar circumstances.
Well, Communists eliminated Real Islam there, like in Albania. Now they practice Islam In Name Only. This is fine, it's like how we practice Christianity In Name Only in the first world.
Not an argument. Seriously most European proles where born after or at the tail end of colonialism
Its not the job of the European proletarian to provide this.
Let the proles of the middle east and north Africa fix their nations, Europeans fix theirs, Americans theirs and so on. Forcing them to fix the situation of foreigners is no better than work for porky.
not an argument
how does letting in immigrants help stop climate change? In only makes things harder with a more divide population and one with spooky religious shit who may not even believe in climate science.
It is Real Islam to them, though. Religion isn't founded on facts and reason.
If only that was true for the rest of the Islamic world. Until this is the case, it'd be best to keep them out.
The problem is that migration is going to be inevitable because climate change will render those regions inhospitable. Taking more people now will make the rush less intense later.
I like the way you make out like terrorism is just some sort of Islamic hobby
Are terrorist attacks going to stop in Western countries if more Muslims are let in, or not? Based on Muslims' own words, a combination of US imperialism, Israeli treatment of Palestinians, and Saudi/Qatari money funding mosques that are visited by alienated young men are the primary drivers of radicalization. Since the latter two are backed by the US, and the US can't run out of money, it is obvious that none of these factors is going away. It seems obvious that some terror attacks are going to happen if there is a large Muslim population from the Middle East present. Given all this, how many natives is it acceptable to let die to terror attacks or other crimes in order to rescue Muslims from US-backed violence?
All the more reason why immigrants should be keep out now before things become completely unstable.
Whether you like it or not, that isn't actually happening because the monarchs of the Middle East have immense de facto political authority. Even when the oil dries up, they'll have invested all of the money they made into literally trillions of US dollars in global investments. Due to the need for trade, and enabling Islamic pilgrimage, the Saudis will always be able to keep a path of human movement open between their country and the Western world. From a logistical perspective, trying to prevent Islamic terrorism is a fool's errand.
Being reformists, the biggest issue that anti-migrant political groups have is their absolute unwillingness to reason with liberals on their terms, because the leaders of these groups are far more paranoid than the normies that see them as a lesser of evils and think there is no point in trying at all if they can't have their unrealistic ideals. This has led to liberals having free reign to decide how the crisis has been dealt with, and their solutions will always be mired in political correctness when they aren't being challenged effectively.
I've seen this arrogance in arguments about the migrant question, not necessarily here, but definitely often. Calls for a "pragmatic solution" seem to be little more than a refusal to listen to reason, a demand for everyone who disagrees to shut the fuck up and do what they want or oh my god we're all going to die. It is no one's problem but yours if the potential consequences of actions are irrelevant to you.
Ok, so how many Muslims is it acceptable to let in, and how many native Euros is it acceptable to let die to terror attacks to rescue Muslims? Your answer seems to be "We can't do anything to stop it, so arbitrarily many."
Everyone likes to write paragraphs and paragraphs of drivel on here about the impossibility of preventing more Muslim migration, the utter immorality of sending them back (which is laughable while simultaneously anticipating revolutionary terror, especially against the religious, but whatever), but no one wants to provide a solution that isn't "Just have the revolution now!" Well, no shit, but how are you going to actually get people to support you while trying to convince them that a group of people who frequently exhibit a problem with terrorism and crime are actually their allies, and that they will update their beliefs after capitalism is abolished through global revolutionary terror? What's the backup plan for the revolution not materializing, Communist-run integration centers, or what?
Even Zizek's solution is basically "Take as many as we are taking now, perhaps more, but, make it orderly *sniff*" This is not particularly appealing.
At any rate, it really doesn't matter what we write on here. As you said, leaders want it to happen, so it is going to keep on happening. Too bad for the Caliphate of Europe, but it's been a walking corpse since WW1 ended, so bring on the Chinese Century.
Quote the full thing, boy
So what does "address cultural differences" mean? Either you get them to update their belief systems so that they are not prone to accepting radical versions of Islam, somehow, or you just acknowledge they exist, stop trying to integrate them altogether, and just accept terror attacks as a cost that must be borne for the greater good. Current methods of integration do not appear to work, after all.
What makes you think that they were meant to
Ok, so what do you do? Mandatory language classes don't work, welfare benefits don't work, etc. What does work, if anything?
How does moving the goalposts stop you from being a faggot?
Fuck you.
They have no right to stop it.
They can't because Europeans and Americans keep wrecking them.
Now pull the other one granddad
lel
I can't be bothered with these discussions about Muslims/Islam any more - they're just Sam Harris tier, i.e we need to let 2 billion people die in order to preserve life and our moral superiority.
Considering, what, every major terrorist attack in Europe was perpetrated by second or third generation immigrants, what the fuck does "how many are let in" matter? Maybe, just maybe, the problem isn't scary foreigners with Islam.
dash.harvard.edu
I don't know what to suggest to you because you seem to be posting from some alternate dimension where Holla Forums bullshit is true. Stopping the intense Otherization of them and letting them assimilate might be a good idea, but having worked with immigrants, taught immigrants, and working with immigrants, I don't know where you're getting this bullshit that they can't or won't assimilate. There's not some magic spell that will transform these people and fit them neatly into the social framework, especially at a time when the overall social framework is falling apart. Just like the Germans and Italians and Irish coming to North America and assimilating with Anglo society, there's going to be tension and strife until people figure out how to deal with one another, which means both societies have to change somewhat.
How about you stop trying to burden the European working class?
still not an argument
They have no right to not be overrun by reactionary, fascist, ultra conservatives? I thought the left hated fascists.
And the when the western working class overthrows capitalism this will stop.
It's only a paradox if you think all Muslims are terrorists. :^)