Electoral Politics

Liberalism is incompatible with "democratic socialism". Even Bernie is not a democrat. After the election he retook the title of independent.

…and your point is? The DSA rejects liberalism all the time. You want to see what they're ideas are, look to Jacobin, it's practically their mouthpiece.

Lol I like that the second you sense you can't get away with hyperbole about "Schumers and Clintons" you have to switch your tracks and the goalposts to avoid having to defend your accusations

All pretty words but the eventually the SPD killed Luxemburg.
When SocDems take power, they betray real Marxist Leninists.

SocDems =/ Democratic Socialists.

also
Rosa was not a leninist, and there are many Luxemburgists in the DSA leadership as well as members. Speaking of which, considering how many times the M-L's have betrayed the revolution, you're not really ones to talk.

Like I said, DSA are all SocDems. Pretty words to hide their real goal. They want parliamentary control to create a Social Democratic Nordic model in America. Capitalism will remain under DSA.

The SPD were the establishment. This meme needs to die because it leads to un-nuanced and lazy analysis like this. Even if Sanders is a socdem it's not a relevant comparison. Here's something to chew on if labels matter so much to you

How do you ever expect the left to get anywhere if dickweeds like you keep spouting old ass memes like this? Leftoms please fuck off.

The SPD were not always the establishment. If DSA takes power they will become like the Democrats but with a nice facade.

Also, back then being a Social Democrat meant a different thing.

DSA isn't running Leftists, they're supporting Democrats.

Alright then, go run Karl Marx's skeleton in 2020 and save the left. Fuck you role players.

DSA has changed since the 80s and 90s. Organization is controlled mostly by Marxists at this point.

The Old Guard is still in power. The Harrington disciples will actually become stronger because of the new Bernie Sanders liberals.

The Left Caucus in DSA will die out because of the new uneducated masses.

Weird how "social democrat meant a different thing back then" when it comes to Lenin but not when it comes to the SPD despite being mostly contemporaneous.

I sometimes feel legit bad for the DSA. They have to undo more propaganda on the part of the american "socialists" than the masses of anti-socialists who actually believe cold war shit.

Following that logic any left-wing organization is useless until everyone is, by default, a Marxist magically. The left-wing education of these "uneducated masses" is supposed to happen within left-wing organizations.

DSA's political education is a joke. They depend on Jacobin for everything. The average DSA member hasn't even read Das Kapital or The State and Revolution.

I know plenty of DSAers who've read das capital, and while I'm sure there's educational value in the state and revolution, they are not leninists. Like I said before, the biggest marxist current in the DSA is Luxemburg, and for good reason, she was a democratic socialist in a much more meaningful sense of the word than lenin.

And just like that, the Holla Forumstard reveals himself. What a surprise that he's fostering divide and conquer techniques regarding the DSA here.

When will you people wake up and realise that all these pseudo-radical ideologies that favor abstentionism are just a conducting wire for right-wing manipulation? Next time american intelligence has to deal with a Leftist threat they will just have to support left-communists, anarchists, revolutionists and "accelerationists" to kill it.

I have a feeling that the average DSA member has read more than the average Tankie, the average Holla Forumser and the average anarchist.

my opinion is that you're either a troll from pol/t_d or the dumbest man alive (or woman, I'm not sexist)

The SPD wasn't exclusively revolutionary marxist, Luxemburg and Liebknecht only represented a portion of the party. Also, socdem had a different meaning back then, it basically meant communists. The DSA is currently attempting to emulate european socdem parties from the 80's, they're marxists in name only.

At least the DSA has their shit together unlike other leftwing organizations. They have a strong online presence and Jacobin. They will eventually capitulate to the Democratic establishment or split.

They're young people who read twitter 24/7

rofl, of course rosa posters can't fucking read. can't wait to cozy up to my mountain of rosa corpses and free healthcare.

Reactionary liberal logic.

The DSA is currently attempting to emulate european socdem parties from the 80's, they're marxists in name only.

/thread

Intentional dishonesty and misrepresentation, nice

where are the proofs jimmy?

This is your brain on tanks

every tankie argument is essentially a loud, whiny cry that 'x group is actually our enemy!' and any criticism they take is actually just 'us propaganda, imperialist propaganda, cointelpro' of course they never get around to actually making any kind of argument.

thankfully you're a small, stupid group of faggots that can't achieve anything and it doesn't matter.

Then join the organization and start educating people.

If we take Jacobin as a mouthpiece for DSA, they understand the limits of European social-democracy.

There's no point in having a FULL REVOLUTION NOW party when your membership is still virtually insignificant. Higher wages, shorter working hours, political reform and the like attract people who, on the inside, can be exposed to more radical ideas, and the proper mechanisms can be put in place to ensure that these radical ideas will not be diluted among newcomers.

To those saying this is "anti-revolutionary", this is a position most thinking revolutionaries, including the Bolsheviks, had:

There's no fucking point in demanding the downfall of the entire system when you're a micro-party. Why do you retards think all your Marxist-Leninist parties degenerate into cults?

post that webm plox

...

man that's a bad image

is it sarcastic? if it's not, I agree with the message but it's really bad

kys tankie scum

sage goes in the email field, moron

the name field saves it here and I always forget to remove it before posting

Can anyone explain in great detail why I should care about this bitch if it means voting for a social democrat party will mean voting myself more benefits?

Because, as it stands, capitalism is going to kill us all.

inthesetimes.com/article/20034/should-democratic-socialists-be-democrats-sanders-perez-ellison-pelosi

Funnily enough, this article came out just yesterday on this very topic. Two DSA members debating about whether and how to be involved in electoral politics, and I think they reflect a lot of the concerns brought up in this thread.

Why would you read Sudden propaganda. No mention of Lenin or even SPD and their betrayal of the left.

you are dumb and you should feel dumb

DSA members are running as leftists, sometimes openly Dem Soc in either non partisan city councils or under Dem label for local seats. DSA doesn't have the resources to run a bunch of leftists right now.

Old Guard has influence but they aren't in power. National Political Committee changes something like every 3 years and it's mostly young people who don't have the harrington fetish/don't agree with realignment strategy. Also DSA convention is in August and we will probably see massive shift left.

DSA isn't focusing as much as they could on cadre building and internal education but they openly acknowledge that. You could easily start a study working group at your local chapter and start studying lenin if anyone is interested.

For average working-class millennial reading Capital and/or State and Rev is a massive waste of time. DSA should be reviewing Marx Engels readers with as many members as possible before that.

Shoot all socdems and demsocs on sight

Will you need assistance or can you shoot yourself?

Implying you're getting out of that armchair boi