What's wrong with Fash?

The italian fascists were even bigger corporate shills than spain, they literally had representatives of every major corporation running the legislature.

Yes, it's part of what they do. Fascism always used leftist terminology to distract proles from the crisis of capitalism. Hitler openly states in Mein Kampf how the right should appropriate left-wing terminology in order to gain the support of the working class.

Yeah, well, I agree with the whole 'others' fear thing is a bit overhyped and shit, but I suppose all big countries need a rather large ebul to crush at some point in order to rally the populace.

B-but I thought nazi/fascist iconography was superior to commie (its all sickles, hammers, red backgrounds, stars, grains and gears)

Whenever people say private property they mean the whole 'commies are after our homes and shit' angle of it that most people have whenever abolishing private property comes to mind

Same problems as regular Capitalism - workers have no control over their lives, markets are shit in general etc etc, but then plus totalitarian dictatorship which of course is going to become corrupt because it's a fucking dictatorship, and then there's that traditionalism bullshit as well that tries to just remove fun out of society.

it's obvious from the start you're just leftypol, m8. no Holla Forumstard,Holla Forumsack or whatever you want to call them types like that.

make an argument or fuck off classcuck

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Become a NazBol.

fascism destroyed my whole country and the other country (that was fascist) destroyed itself so… yeah its shit

I've been here for a couple months, but am really not originary from here.

Well lad, I don't know what to say. So I guess I'll fuck off after this post

Tbh, the swastika isn't as good as the Romanian Garda Fer flag

But its the same shit

I have something that is much more better than a swastika

I have to admit that the Iron Guard is rather unique and interest ascetically

Oh and I forgot the compass, btw, that thing behind the compass is ayh hammer.

Your confusion is very common. A corporation in Mussolini's Italy was a group of people with shared interests. That group could be made of industrialists, miners, musicians, etc. A corporation then was not the same as a corporation now. Mussolini didn't give much power to the worker corporations though, they had representation but weren't allowed to fight fairly with the industry corporations.
Fun fact: corporatism comes from latin corpus (body). Reason being society should work like a body, where the organs don't fight each other but do their best for the body as a whole.

National socialism is fucking shit compared to original Italian fascism.

It's all

while Italian fascists had theory.

Are you fucking drunk?

That isn't a compass? What's it called then, genius?

AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHA

Don't forget about machetes

Tell that to Niccola Bombacci, Jose Antonio Primo de Rivera, Ramiro Ledesma Ramos,and Juan Peron

Wew, English is weird. How are these both called compass?

Žižek explains it well: htps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQHoGwnXpYM

* youtube.com/watch?v=FQHoGwnXpYM

Your snowflake fascists were all defending capitalism. All they were against was laissez faire liberal capitalism.

???

What's in the Democratic German Flag is called a Compás in spanish, which translates to compass in english.

I'll give it a watch, although knowing Zizek, its quite likely am not well versed enough to understand it fully

Isn't that the point?
Dialectical garbage aside, I mean, I must admit am not very good at marxist thinkery

so you literally just want gibs then

Fun Fact: The Romanian Iron Guard once worked with communists

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compass_(drawing_tool)
la angla aĉas, lernu esperanton

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God I fucking wish the Iron Guard hadn't been spooked orthodox nationalist fags.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cercle_Proudhon

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Feel free to ask us if you couldn't understand something from the video.

That guy was fucking hilarious. Anything cool Hitler/Mussolini did was copied from him, even the Roman salute. He also used to give laxatives to his opponents. Guy was a riot.

you can tell them when you see them in hell

the only "gibs" i want is to gibs you a bullet to the back of your stupid skull

Agreed.

Many proto-fascists were actually pretty based from a socialist standpoint, especially the ones who didn't take any shit from Mussolini.

But even then Mussolini was a hundred times better than that choleric manlet Hitler.

SAVAGE
A
V
A
G
E

did any Fascists ever actually get along with each other well? lol

Okay, so, Zizek doesn't like the whole 'us' vs 'them' inherent in German Fascism. But does he ever propose an answer?

Its funny because I always look for an answer in Zizek's videos, but never quite find them

It's not that Zizek dislikes the "Us vs Them" thing. For communists this antagonism is systemic (between classes that are economically rooted) for fascists this is between the jerbs and the super saiyans, completely missing the point that just because you put Shongoku at the head of the factory he'll still profit off the workers without budging his pinky finger, or that most of the jews living in Germany were poor as shit, with no power whatsoever.
youtube.com/watch?v=mGC3uJadXh0

Not sure if serious or memeing

Fascism developed out of Italian/French revolutionary syndicalism, which was Marxist revisionism.

So, he wants a revolution? I thought he wasn't a traditional marxist-leninist

I don't understand, what does he want people to do?

Sorel was pretty okay.

With all due respect, Sorel STILL rates as fairly socialist, unlike Maurras

Sorel supported the Bolsheviks towards the end of his life.

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Do you like free speech? Yes?
Do you like the high possibility of being killed by the government for vague reasons? No?
Then why support an ideology against your own interests?

MLs are not the only ones advocating revolution though.

Why would I be killed by my own government for vague reasons in the first place?

The whole idea is that I support an ideology because it is in my best interest to have a society that works, unlike a society that is a house of cards that gets blown away every other day either by refugees, commies, or whatever calamity that happens

Can't a man be entitled to some peace?

Well, am concerned that the only thing following said revolution is sacking, riots and then it getting put down by a mighty fist. Whether its capital or the military not wanting to see the collective shit of society breaking apart.

If there is to be a revolution, there has to be a well organized plan for the thereafter of it, that's why fascism exists, and communism exists as only ML or Maoism so far

you can just say jew, its ok…we know you mean that anyways.

Have you considered that even if muh banks was a talking point of fascists, the massive support and cooperation/favouritism with large industrial capitalists negates any chance of Mussolini or Hitler being anti-capitalist.

To put it mildly, my problem with communism, is exactly what Zizek points out at youtu.be/J5udUpycu0Y?t=800

Which is Lenin's unfinished legacy, what to do next after the revolution.

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When I mean the real last fascist regime, I mean that Spain survived the second world war, not that it was better or something than Italy

Spain wasn't fascist.

Then what in the fuck name's was El Movimiento, what was Falange and National Syndicalism, if not a Fascist movement (and the last one to die off)

Play Democracy 3.

We have certain ideological blueprints related to economy and political system during the transitional period(as you probably know), however we generally avoid thinking how should the future society be ran and for a good reason. Before Marxism and anarchism got established, there were many so-called utopian-socialists who were spending a lot of time thinking about the way a future socialist society would work, however their ideas aged really badly due to being a byproduct of their time. This is why imagining how would our glorious left-wing utopia would look is a nice mental masturbation, but it's a counterproductive. To quote Marx:

fug

I understand a bit the whole deal with utopian socialists, am not entirely illiterate. But I believe the revolution is easier done than what comes after.

In fact, we've seen leftists (or 'leftists' in everydayman's parlance) win without bloodshed at times, but never seen a result that trascends the failures of the past.

We live in the world of SYRIZA (Greece), Frente Amplio (Uruguay), whatever the one in Iceland is called and PSUV in Venezuela, but none have done anything to radically change the status-quo in favor of the left

Try to go reformist full commie is easy way to get murdered. Reorganizing society without violence is possible unless there's a superpower out on an interventionist spree.

Antonio Primo de Rivera was killed as soon as the war started and Franco set about to coopt the Falange, exclude the original membership and replace it with his conservative cronies and deradicalise it into a propaganda organ for himself.
National Syndicalism never even got off the ground.

Up until the 60es when he began with the market liberalization it did follow a kind of nationalist market path, but you do have a point

It's the purest ideology

It was a pretty boring military dictatorship

why do you want, in mussolini's terms, to subordinate yourself as an individual to the dictates of the state? because you think the state will care for you? because you think the state will restore traditional cultural values and customs that have no use to the economy?

you're making a bad decision that you can't go back on, and you're placing any decisions the state makes an absolute rule in your own life without any say in the matter.

Honestly, most genuine fascists i've talked to live in a world of fantasy. they imagine great men trickling down their superior wisdom to the average idiots and all of the problems are instantly solved by brute force. when does this ever work in real life?

Being embargo'd for being a Nazi collaborator ain't exactly a choice.

Personally when I say I want a bigger role for the state it means "I want the government to enact more wealth redistribution and state control over key utilities and industries" not "I'd like the government take my neighbours away and send them to a death camp".
Yes I know communists did the same thing, that doesn't make it right.

Super fucking spook. Capitalism is so shit it crashes every five to seven years by law.

Why are nazis so fucking dumb?

What if you're neighbours with one of directors of JPMorganChase?

It kind of works more often than not, until people begin forgetting the circumstances that put said strongmen in power and begin demanding muh freedoms back

Eh, you have a point.

Stay in that 2x2 box far, far away in a gated neighbourhood with members of your same class and ethnic background

Like I said, wealth redistribution.
I also want his wife
And any daughters

I doubt you've left the house in the last 6 months you scared little cuck. shut the fuck up

any system that upholds private property is capitalist
no more how much bullshit pro-worker speech you spew

All those economic refugees are a subproduct of capitalism anyway since people will migrate where the wealth is concentrated. In a socialist society Abu would stay in somewherestan enjoying the fruit of his labor. It even works for racist fucks like you.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mefo_bills

The entire Nazi economy was based off of simple kikery

Reflection working at its best, stay classy.

I could care less about where Apu takes a shit, I care more about Hasheed who doesn't know the difference between fucking a goat, and decapitating an infidel

it does kind of go like that, except for the part where it works and has a net benefit. instead idiots sell their own power and rights away because a strongman told them they were needed to fight nonsensical minority/far away threat.

the american right has seen the loss of education, healthcare, consumers rights, the bill of rights, the constitution, etc despite the fact that most rightist (including liberal) idiots think they're voting FOR those things.

Hasheed was a subproduct of capitalism as well since hasheed saw his country being bombed by some imperialist nation from the west before he decided to join a revolutionary islamist group.

Besides religion has no place in socialism.

so you are a scared little cuck then

Does nazism have any actual theory apart from "Muh juice, muh rays" ?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Doctrine_of_Fascism

The perks of eternal war; none. When you have an eternal enemy (whether its fascism, communism or terrorism), everything becomes a living ball of bullshit, you cease to be a person, become everyone's weapon, and everyone's toilet.

Welcome to 1984 burgers

Alright, riddle me this. Do you think Hasheed will cease to exist magically once Capitalism is dead?

Surely it will cease to produce Hasheeds, but the existing Hasheeds still gotta be culled down like rabid dogs.

no it's basically a bunch of fags with an overactive fear centre of the brain

We are absolutely in favour of relegating reactionaries to gulags so we can reeducate/work them to death, if that's what you're asking.

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mefo_bills

The entire Nazi economy was based on kikery

We could say that this is the case precisely because those victories were bloodless. Those left-wing populist movements who won in the parliamentarian democracy are entrenched in the very parliamentarian elections that elevated them to power and constantly remain aware that their reforms could be potentially unrolled four years later as the system enables that. Thus, to actually ensure the change of status quo, said populists would have to deny the legitimacy of the very system that gave them right to rule at the moment, which is hypothetically possible, but it would take balls of steel or perhaps even some harder material.
Not sure if Webm related, but posting it anyways.

Fascist regimes tend have a group they persecute. There is no guarantee you wont be in that group since each leader has it out for someone else. Don't forget Hitler actually had some Nazis killed for having political views a bit different from his own.

Reformism ain't for pussies.

Source?

No, because if you don't bomb them to get their oil, if you don't allow them in your country to pick fruit for 1 dollar an hour and if we liberate them from their totalitarian Islamic societies to install socialism they will stay in Iraq milking camels or whatever they do in there.

While you and Hans stay in Germany fellating each other.

The most totalitarian regime in the middle east is the Saudi one and there's not really a refugee problem from there.

That's completely gratuitous and I would consider rude if I were an arab

Well that's because of their greatest ally helping them fuck up the region.

Keep ignoring it, but the entire Nazi Economy was built on kikery

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mefo_bills

Am not ignoring it, I just don't know what to respond to a short wikipedia article on one of the many means of Nazi Germany to seek funds for its expansionistic plans

yet

Yes. And always remember you have to give them a platform otherwise your incapable of reason.

having polite discussions on the internet is pretty nice though

Well I'm sure Team USA can fuck another place up because they feel so so bad for those poor oppressed Saudi women.

If you must. But those discussions don't stay nice for long.

because that doesn't happen ever, right?

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ishygddt

The Italians at least had a vaguely justified reasoning. The world is inherently violent, only a strong violent state can survive, to do anything else is to live at the mercy of states that care even less about you than your own.

Nazis were much bigger on violence-for-violences sake

It was the soul means of financing rearmament (I.e.. the centrepiece of Hitle'rs economy).

What you fail to understand is the true nature of kikery and so this means nothing to you. Let me break it down.

Hitler essentially printed his own currency, it only had value because he gave it to arms manufacturers and they agreed that it had value, they only agreed that it had value because they knew Hitler Planned to expand and would therefore be able to pay them in other way later.

Hitler, just like a kike, lent out imaginary money, in fact, it was the entire basis of his economy, just like the kikes

All Hitler wanted was his kikery monopoly.

NS isn't fascism moron. Left Fash (JONS, Guarda de Feir, Accion Francais, Republican Fascist Party, National Popular Rally, BUF), Nazbol (Widerstand, Paleo-Eurasianism), Left NS (Brownshirts, Federists, Gobbelites), and Asserism are okay.

class collaborationism is a fantasy. the bourgoisie are not going to act in the interests of everyone because 'muh race, muh nation'
also, 'nation' is an artifical construct thats stupid to care about. pride in and love for your home and where you come from only makes sense when applied to a city or a region.
I also dislike facists because they recognize what alot of the problems are(banks, international capital), but then attribute them to delusional bullshit like an ethnic supremacist consppiracy on the part of the jews. instead of, y'know, the propertied rich seeking to maintain and increase their wealth and power. its distractionary bullshit even worse than liberal idpol.

actually socialist NS I dont hate, though.

I think you are more obsessed than I am with kikes. I only pointed out Hitler because Hitler. Am not A NSDAPer, just a nondenominational fascist

people with your flag are very often acting like retards, try putting something like gay nazi flag and ironically you might get treated more seriously

I would put on a better flag if there was one
But unfortunately, there isn't
I just don't know what flag to identify with.
Socialism is just plain red and am not exactly a socialist, the black flag is for anarkiddies, the rest are clichés and justfascismblack doesn't exist. So I'll have to stay with outright nazi

German flag with yellow is for cucks.

Black/white/red are the only colours.

In all seriousness I am disappointed that East Germany used the yellow flag. That flag, minus the compass, was the same one that marched on Rosa's revolt and crushed it, and proceeded to make the shitty Wiemar Republic which would fall to Fascism in less then a fucking decade.

Should of just stuck with the red, black, and white, the yellow version might as well be the Socdem flag.

Confirmed for retard.

He advocated class collaboration, was a military guy and buttbuddies with Hitler himself. I know a thing or two about Peron, am from the River Plate region

Asking what's right about it would be a better question.

Fascism is essentially the rejection of reason and materialism as being harmful to the human experience.

Well, most societies these days are run in some shape or form with a degree of fascism inherent to them. I don't believe its harmful, but yet another phase of human development with its own contradictions

That sounds like social justice liberal claptrap but with a different conclusion derived thereof. Fascism is a culmination of the factors of a decaying capitalist society, not the other way around.

If you really care about your race, stop subjecting them to the madness of capital.

He was also good friends with Che and put a huge emphasis on the worker, going so far to make International Workers Day a state holiday. Peron's ideology was so ambiguous that you have both far-left Marxist Peronists and far-right fascist Peronists. He can be used to justify literally any ideology.

Well, I don't really follow the race thing, I am more for the law & order aspect of it.

I don't quite follow the marxist dialectics and don't trust any revolution whatsoever that has them as their foundation, therefore am a right wing revolutionary, hence fascist

Which got him in trouble with the military, who had him overthrown, only for him to come back a few years later, shun the very leftist groups who wanted him back, and eventually leave people who'd torture the shit out of them.

Its rather ironic if you ask me, and has set back Argentina years

I don't know, any ideology that relies on a dead figurehead's memory binds society backwards in my opinion.

Fuck knew I forgot someone.

Then you know we are fundamentally opposed to your beliefs, why make a thread, lel.

I wanted to see what you guys thought is wrong with fascism, that's all

NazBol here. Our ideologies are very similar, as we both seek to preserve culture and identity. The term fascism has a lot of baggage. There are non-racist strands of fascism, such as Italian, Peronist, Falangist, etc. Basically, fascism has become the dirty word in politics now, as opposed to "commie" or "pinko".

I don't like 99% of traditionalism and social conservatism. I'm also egalitarian (but not the EVERYONE IS EXACTLY THE SAME meme version though).

Unless you're superman there's not much you can do by yourself. If you don't see how a state is useful just give up on politics. There's a reason every piece of land is controlled by a state and not anarchists.
It did. Germany had like 30% unemployment before the NSDAP, with people starving because life was not as easy as it's now, and under them unemployment was close to 0%, with fewer hours and much higher wages. 99.7% of Austrians voted to join Germany and have the same.
The economy exists to serve the volk. Not the other way around. You're thinking of Capitalism, which sacrifices the volk for international capital.
The average "idiot" is also their volk. It works the same way "from each according to his ability" is supposed to work: the volk believe that's how it should be and act as expected from them. And it's self-reinforcing: you grow up with your volk taking care of you, you'll take care of your volk when it's your turn. Of course this requires some altruism, so it doesn't work for all countries.
Nobody says that. The closest I can think of is Stalin's "quantity has a quality of its own". Which worked.

Nothing.

Fascism is superior to all leftist ideologies because it provides functional, operational solutions to real life problems, such as scarcity.
Just ask any leftist how to deal with scarcity, how to deal with practical reality of life when there's just not enough shit for everyone, and it instantly goes 'muh utopian space gay fully automated communism' or some other bullshit.
Fascism is superior because it provides much needed hierarchies. Nuclear family is essentially fascist institution, but father really does know more, can lift more, can make more money etc, and therefore provides for the family and family is much better than under…. equal rule of all or voting or if children called the shots or whatever.
All armies are essentially fascistic because using thousands of people to achieve goals is more effective when a guy that has 50 years of experience and combat and previous various commands calls the shots, hierarchy is essential to any army, a soldier alone could be easily broken, a soldier restrained by ranks and orders into a bundle with a massive fucking axe can actually achieve things.

Finally: ideals. Or values.
Leftists claim that they are 100% materialistic, but ideal of complaining is absolutely essential to all leftist ideologies. All they ever do is fucking complaining. You never see any leftist separatists, or any leftists wanting to go on an island, because you cant complain there. They always want to redistribute someone else's money, they always require a host to parasite, they always must complain about something.
Fascist ideals are a polar opposite: they are openly idealistic about something, but that something is absolutely never complaining, fascist ideals guide a man forward.
Fascists in practice lift weights, avoid drugs, do not tolerate weakness.
Leftist ideologies just fucking complains and does nothing but complaining, tolerates all sorts of weaknesses, and they always have some sort of an excuse for EVERYTHING. It's always the system or the capitalist or I dont know who, always something or someone.

To be fascist is to find a way.
To be leftist is to find an excuse.

So fascism tends to be less 'spooked' than any leftists, with their ultimate spook of infinite entitlements to everything and rights and whatever.
Fascism is at least honest. It tells you: 'listen, the world out there can be a harsh place from time to time, it can be great, but you can also die from hunger, exposure, animals, people… you dont have any magical rights, and there's no magical fairy that flies around righting wrongs. You gotta stand for yourself, everyone can find an excuse, it's up to you to find a way because nothing and no one gives a shit about excuses'.

I came here to learn something opposing or different but all I found was mental gymnastics and justifications for weakness. These people dont know anything new or different. They are all just weaklings, holding onto ideologies that justify weakness.
They hold the ideals of complaining and ideals of infinite entitlement as the highest truths in the world and the best way of doing things in life, which just tells me that they had an extremely sheltered upbringing, that's it.

They don't want to preserve culture, though, they want to replace it with something extremely idealistic and formed around aesthetics.
Fascists are radicals, not reactionaries.

I made a too long post because its 5 am but basically what I am trying to say is, in practical terms, out there in reality (spare me the books for a moment, politics do not happen in books):

Leftist ideologies have this extreme ideal of entitlement and complaining. Scapegoating and a priori guilt of successful people is absolutely essential to leftism.
Zero quality control. Zero personal responsibility. Zero real life practical solutions you can do, today, to solve certain things, such as shortage of something.
Leftist ideologies believe in this magical jealous fairy of human rights and injustice according to which no one can earn more or be better at anyone, and we also all come from the same cloning facility that clones us all 100% the same.

Right wing ideologies simply work better, and do not require all that much books, because they are written in our instincts already. Survival instincts, etc.
They are ideologies of self overcoming, becoming ubermensch, never complaining, never doing any useless shit or shit that doesnt work. Never investing yourself in everything and everyone equally, but finding out what works, what is practical, what brings results.

There is a reason why the private sector, armies, and anyone competing for anything has right wing values.
There is also a reason why you only find left wing ideologies concentrated in places that do not have to compete to work. Such as obscure academia, and >30 year olds that do not pay taxes and do not support families.

This is a lot of projecting for a whole lot of nothing. You don't understand the concept of a spook, or materialism in philisophical terms, or the goals of communist movements. I don't mean LIBERALS either because normally people conflate the goals of the two. You are saying leftists do this, think that, and to address the points of another you have to interpret it but your post is basically a giant strawman.

Radical against what? You wish to eliminate a tiny fraction of the ruling elite and basically maintain the current system except this time under some vague moralistic ideological reasoning about why certain individuals who are weak must be dispelled or eliminated. What happens after the fascists win? More war, more fracturing of society and no end to poverty and exploitation.

I was only explaining their ideology. Of course it's all a farce of appearance and feelings, but these things are real to them.

Nice sophistry, bro

in a society where workers own the means of production and get all the benefit of their labor, I guess everyone wouldn't always have enough to get everything they want.
hell. you'd have to work if you want things under any system other than fully automated luxury communism(not attainable yet), so things being scarcer would probably mean youd have to do more work to get or maintain them. Not as some arbitrary way of doing things society decides on, just as a consequence of the economics.
The rich are parasites on society.

this, basically. a load of halfassed cliches dressed up in alot of rhetoric and aesthetic language.

In many cases it's just the case of distribution. We have enough food and housing to feed and shelter everyone on the planet, but this will not be the case because these necessities aren't granted to individuals who don't have the cash to purchase them.

yes, but when he reads that he thinks you're saying 'THERED BE NO MOR SCARCITY AT ALL ITD BE FALC IMMEDIATLY UTOPIA MAN'
so Im pointing out how fucking trivial the matter of scarcity under socialism is, not pointing out that thered be somewhat less of it.
Theres enough food and shelter for everyone, we just cant distribute it, but say you wanted a solid gold grille on your car. Theres probably not enough gold for everyone to have that. Itd be hard for you to get one. Thatd probably manifest as you having to work a long fucking time to earn enough money at the mining coop/personally dig up and refine enough cold/get enough labor vouchers/etc etc. to get one.
'production for use' or 'no parasitic pig fucks stealing the profit MY work made' doesn't fucking beg the question 'YEAH WUT ABOUT SCARCITY THOUGH HUH EVER THINK ABOUT THAT.' its a nonsequiter.

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fashy "theory"

Again, you leftists could build a house with your books, you have construction amounts of your books, but none of those answer some of the basic questions I have, that are very every-day type of things, and that the worldview I already have answers easily.

Question such as: imagine a lab conditions society of say 15 factory workers who just spin the fucking wheel or pull a lever 8 hours a day. They own the place. And all get an equal proportion of pay that linearly and directly corresponds with the amount of times they pulled the lever. No bosses, no exploitation, just a worker and his factory and his lever and his reward.
Now what if one of the workers with his free time, completely alone in his basement invents a much better engine, that results in much larger reward per lever pulled?
Does he now gets 10% larger reward? 20% Does he licence the engine to other workers? Does everyone still gets the same amount of reward, even tho he worked unimaginably hard and invested all of his free time in this thing, while everyone else just didnt?
What happens??????????
Intellectual work is basically 99% of the profit and value, not manual labor. If you are doing manual labor, you are poor because an animal can be trained to do your labor, not because of some evil rich guy who just woke up and said 'what a beautiful day to be evil', but because every fucking retard can do your job. Sure exploitation happens, but not to a manual fucking laborer.
WHAT IF YOU ARE SIMPLY WORTHLESS??

Here's another: is all wealth inherently unjust? Can there be no earned wealth?
Here's another: are we all 100% exactly the same? Is it unjust for someone to be simply better?? If 10% of population is born without an eye.. do we blind 90% the population so the rest feels better?
No incentive to do intellectual work (real intellectual work, one that is applied in industry for example, not some pretentious bullshit like art) equals no work, I am an engineer, never met a guy doing this shit as a hobby, now getting my masters and still nobody does this shit as a hobby.
NO INCENTIVE

Or another: simple fucking scarcity. All right, someone has to fucking starve, ok? Cant bullshit your way out of it this time. It's too late. Who starves first????
THIS TYPE OF SHIT IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT EXISTENTIAL THINGS, AND NO LEFTISTS GIVE YOU A REAL PRACTICAL FUNCTIONAL OPERATIONAL ANSWER

Another thing is: personal responsibility, enterprise, that sort of thing. 80% of businesses fail. That's right you read that wrong, depends on various sectors and factors and whatnot but the general figure is 80.
Why does leftist propaganda portray any sort of private undertaking as 100% successful, and profitable, and risk free, and evil thing that always works all the time?

Inequality among men is empirically, measurably, scientifically quantifiable and all efforts to get rid of it socially or politically results in failure. You would have to get rid of it trough genetic engineering.
Labor theory of value is fucking retarded because we already have German and Japanese factories and manufacturing of things such as fucking cars, WITHOUT A SINGLE FUCKING HUMAN WORKER, we already have storage houses operated by drones, we already have first self driving car put in commercial use, etc.
Wealth inequality does not equal injustice.
Capitalism isnt even all that bad, more than half of fortune 500 companies are owned and founded by tech geniuses from their own garages.
Exploitation is bullshit, some people are just fucking worthless, and you dont see any doctors or engineers or chemists or whoever starving in the streets or working in bad conditions.

And finally, the West is fucking awesome. Switzerland has more millionaires than people on welfare. And they have the most banks as well.
EXPLAIN THAT SHIT

You are just a neocon. Real fascists realize at least wealth unearned from labor is unjust. You are just a Pinochet type Randroid. Read Fascism and Capitalism by Mussolinni asshole.

I don't know economics: The post

Every time.

Case closed. Western society is much fairer and less exploitative than a jungle, you are much better off living in the west and you'd be on your own, you are entitled to nothing you cant earn, and to be leftist is simply to be entitled. That's it.

Switzerland has more millionaires than welfare cases, the West is meritocratic enough, you are all just lazy if you are doing the complaining here.
Yeah top politics, no thanks, goodbye, pol and leftypol are equally retarded, but at least pol encourages you to also lift and study and avoid drugs while complaining, leftypol is just complain and there's nothing else to it.

nice ideological abstractions divorced from reality and purpose built to prop up your retardation user.

In other words you are an ameriburger that lives in a reality bubble

And meanwhile he supported Allende. Peron did a lot of shit that conflicted with other shit he did. You can be a fascist Peronist. Hell, you could be any ideology and be a Peronist. It doesn't really mean anything, anyone can be a Peronist. Doesn't mean he was a fascist. It's very difficult to pinpoint his actual ideology, which is why "Peronism" is a term in the first place.

Capitalism is a sub product of it's constiuents, and Hasheed is a subproduct of his biology, culture and economic means. MENA has been a violent shithole long before the last hundred years and has been infact the region to historically extend it's imperialistic tentacles over Europe.

Effects do not lead to causes.
Modern Islamic politics are a relatively recent creation, the volatile hellspawn of Anglosphere diplomatic overreach. Comparing Iran and Saudi Arabia to ancient caliphates is like comparing European neoliberalism to the Roman Empire. Also pic related.

Why did Hitler want arms and to expand Germany's borders though? Could it be that you are ignoring historical context?

Read the pdfs

Watch the videos

youtube.com/watch?v=1ji_3v5yWLg

youtube.com/watch?v=YMdIgGOYKhs

You're as politically illiterate as you are economically illiterate.

Piss off.

looks like your asking for another helping fam

While some self-described Marxists do believe dialectics are magic, that is not how historical materialism works. The relationship between the base and superstructure is not unilateral, but it is nuanced and the base is generally dominant.

I'm only pointing out that historically, Christians were barbarians like Muslims.

I'm not referring to Marx's bastardization of Hegel fam btw, I don't even disagree that the means of production is essential, but to claim that it is the font of all causality is ignorant.

The totality of man is barbarism and unless the fundamental underlying conditions for such are changed than it will continue in such a fashion. It is nonsensical to think that somehow with the means of production in hand workers communes will change this. The dialectic will continue onward without them.

Historical materialism is not deterministic, it is a tool used to critically analyze and try to understand human history. As Marx himself said, there is no excuse for not knowing your history.
Which you base off of what?

That's what you were doing previously though, you claim that "radical" Islam can only be examined through a dialectical material analysis. The issue is that "radical" Islam is a misnomer never mind the fact that you are too limited in your scope laying it solely at the feet of Western Imperialism.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellum_omnium_contra_omnes

I never said solely. It's as if reality is nuanced.
Literally edgy teenage tier.

don't be disingenuous

explain why true Communist societies "devolve" into Fascism or are crushed by them then

And do you think religion exists for no reason whatsoever? Most terrorist groups were indirectly started by the US and get their expertise from direct training they got from American soldiers during the Cold War, because literally anything was okay back then as long as it spited the reds. Iran was turned into a theocratic shithole from a secular, temperate nation because of the US and UK fucking with them to keep up the flow of petroleum after WWII.
You are basically implying that without religion, they would have happily taken it in the ass.
Something has to happen before I can explain it. The 20th century Eastern dictatorships simply reverted to capitalism.

Religions exist because they provide reproductive success and fitness. Culture is merely biology by other means(which is a codependent relationship, in which biology has trouble keeping up)

The collapse of the Ottoman empire left a vacuum of power, someone else would have exploited them if not for the British and French. While it was certainly the M.O. of Western forces to encourage sectarian division that does not explain why they would do so at a net negative cost to themselves. There are plenty of other means of obtaining energy that doesn't involve regime change in MENA.

When I say true Communists I am referring to anarchists in Spain and the Ukraine. Those eastern dictatorships were Fascist.

Yeah man don't think about how things will be AFTER the revolution that totally won't lead to conflicting political directions, opportunists taking over power, corruption, socio-economic collapse and reversion to capitalism.
Marx and dumb anarkiddies ruined socialism.

Darwinian evolution does not work that way. Everything people do could be considered biological in some meaningless technical sense, but this does not mean literally everything a person has ever said, done or thought is hereditary.
What negative costs? It has led to tremendous economic development in the Western world. They don't care about the ethical implications or any long-term consequences, they will do whatever they can to maintain presence in sandland.
Well, anarchism is pretty naive.

Did I claim that all behavior is hereditary? Did I claim that we live in a deterministic World? Did I claim that the clash of cultures was inherently Darwinian? And for that matter, I have yet to see anyone prove otherwise.

That's pretty easy, to ensure access to the oil the West has to make concessions to MENA - the truth of the matter is that we could have easily invested in alternative energy sources in the 50-60s that would have made MENA superfluous, but such things were never invested in because the occupation of MENA was considered paramount. Now countries like China and India are taking off were our scientists left off in the 50s.

I'm glad we can agree the communism is pretty naive.

"Wow, this is a straw man, even though it's exactly what I said!"

Alternative energy means less growth. Ideological acceptance of capitalism means that the path of less profit is unthinkable.

An-communism, sure.

Are you actually going to refute me or what??

yes, green energy is worse than that. It destroys value. I'm not referring to green energy.

I'm not sure what part of Communism you're not getting here. Communism =! Socialism. Lenin's claim that you could Communism through a dictatorship was preposterous.

What is there to refute? Biological determinism is nonsense for people that are too lazy and/or arrogant to read history books. In other words, the opposite of historical materialism.

Then what? Petroleum is big because it works well, despite the catastrophic pitfalls.

I think you need to actually research things before you talk about them.

what did he mean by this

I know I sound like nutcase, but we don't use a specific nuclear design that we've had since the 50's. With a decades worth of development we could solve our energy crisis in a safe and sustainable fashion.

This is a short intro vid
youtube.com/watch?v=uK367T7h6ZY

youtube.com/watch?v=7kBCMEUuSNw

Oy vey, thread sure goes places while one sleeps

He supported Allende? That's a new one to me, did he live to see Allende get kicked out of power though? That's what'd be interesting to know

You're pretty cogent and lucid for an Holla Forums nazi. Most nazis on this site seem kind of delerious/zealous.

Am not originary from here, you see, just came to Holla Forums because it has leftypol and halfchan Holla Forums is kind of an echo chamber where its unlikely I'll get the answers I want for things.

There's a lot of material I'd like to browse, but very little time for it, since I still study shit and quite probably soon will be working again.

For instance, I wasn't interested in Zizek's pervert's guide to ideology before like I am now

Holla Forums socialism is just deeply triggering and problematic capitalist banker-worship

Corporatism in 1930s italy meant "lots of small divisions with different fucntions". Corporatism was kind of like alphabet soup agencies.

...

Yes, he did, and he condemned it heavily. He did meet with Pinochet once while he was passing through Argentina, but both both men were allegedly very uncomfortable during the meeting. At home he was sort of right-leaning, but abroad was a completely different story. He even called Castro an admirable man.

That makes it even weirder that he rejected the Montoneros at Plaza de Mayo. Maybe he wanted to woo the military to his side by rejecting them?
I guess we'll never know

It is odd, since the Montoneros were some of his most fervent supporters. Their motto was "Peron or Death", ffs. Peron all in all was a pretty odd guy. His actions were never really all that consistent. You make a good point about the military, though. Maybe he just didn't want to get overthrown by them again.

My critique of fascism is that there is still worker exploitation of some sort. I recognize that Nationalism-Socialism (The kind the Nazis had, ie not socialism) was not fascism and that genocide isn't inherent to fascism, I just don't see fascism as a worthwhile step towards higher prosperity (and most of its supporters are Neo-Nazi LARPers that have no understanding of what fascism is anyhow). S trasserism & Nazbol seem somewhat okay save for the spooky antisemitism, and nationalist tendencies. It really doesn't change much in the way of exploitation, and seems to have reduced the rights workers had and removed unions, it seems to only serve porky.

These guys were the very embodiment of irrationalism; they hated "theory" with a passion. That's probably why they were such great artistic innovators — and grand-guignolesque political wrecks.

This is pure, unadulterated bullshit. Under Hitler wages clearly fell and never recovered to their pre-1933 level, working hours grew longer as limitation on the length of the workweek were slashed and unemployment was artificially eliminated by forcefully enrolling jobless men as a cheap workforce into a labor army. Which hardly comes as a surprise, considering how the Nazis persecuted organized workers. Whatever growth the economy of Nazi Germany seemed to have achieved was backed by endless military spending which resulted in a war that destroyed the better part of the continent.

This is the weirdest, most confused defense of Fascism I've ever heard of.

It only destroyed Soviet Union and Eastern Europe which were already shit. The west was largely unscathed except few freak accidents such as Dresden or Rotterdam, and that wasn't German fault but deliberate English bombardment of innocent civilians.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialist_Program

amazon.com/Green-Shirts-Others-History-Fascism/dp/9739432115

The only color capitalism cares about is green and gold.

What exactly does this mean?

Early Eurasianists as opposed to modern ones like Dugin and Savin.

Nazism was very weak theoretically.

You have some legal theory from Carl Schmitt and some philosophical abstractions by Heidegger. But overall it was muh jews, muh race, social darwinism etc. The poor theoretical backdrop of Nazism is due to Hitler being relatively poorly educated, and the people behind him being a bunch of kooky neo-pagan petit-bourgeois mysticists.

Its no surprise that in the 1933 elections the Nazis did not get the working class vote (that went to the Communists and the SPD mostly), but was extremely attractive to rural people, farmers, middle-class wage earners etc.

On the opposite side Mussolini and the Italian fascists had a far greater socio-political background that was carried over from the communist left and was much less dependent on theories of race or conspiracy theories to justify itself.

Even the US, under Democrat Roosevelt during the early 30's was very warm towards Fascist Italy:

ihr.org/jhr/v15/v15n3p6_weber.html

no, i am not obsessed with kikes, i am obsessed with capitalism, i use the word kikery to put it in language an idiot like you can understand. Kikery is capitalism dum dum

And the pursuit of attaining and maintaining the green and gold naturally results in racial division.

fascism isn't an ideology tho, it's a defense mechanism for so-called alphas fears of losing their place in imagined hierarchies. becoming territorial and claiming ownership is something apes do with their shit, and dogs do with their piss.
if it were an ideology, it could stand up to rational debate. that's why no one debates fascists. you're a scared animal, clinging to an evolutionary stable system that the first vertebrates and mammals did for hundreds of millions of years.
you're afraid of the left hemisphere of the brain. you're afraid of the world of ideas, so stop calling it an ideology.
get a gf who you can open up to and cry about your daddy issues with. then see a psychotherapist and start to develop something called morals and a social relationship with other human beings.
godspeed

You are afraid of advancing past the 70's in terms of neuroscience too, am afraid

If I were, I wouldn't be here

I don't know fam, it does seem to have a defined end unlike anything Bakunin or Marx came up with, although it devolves into neoliberalism, which sucks donkey balls

Now you are just plain reflecting yourself onto me

The only idiot who'd think am obsessed with jews here is you fam, who'd think making a point with the word kike is a way to drive a concept home with a fascist, only because the pic in the OP has Hitler in it; he was relevant, but I guess I should've put Mussolini instead of big ol' kike hater

you can't attack the idea so you attack the terms

whether you believe in popsci denunciations of the exact location of the rational portion of the mind within the nervous structure of the brain, it remains apparent that the fascist program rejects rationality in favor of territorial struggles. See: Bookburning, science denial, "alternative facts", denial of dissent & independent media, nationalism

This is why the common argument is formulated Reals > Feels. Nationalism is just a feeling, a biological urge, produced from a lifetime of overactive anxiety.

History does not end, but it is continually revised and renewed. You can't mummify a culture and preserve it. It must change into something else.

nah, when I was 2, my dna sent signals for me to explore the boundaries of territory rites within my social sphere, and I made healthy impressions where I felt accepted. It's truly not my issue. The nationalist however, acts robotically from unresolved issues there, and it manifests itself in a lifelong struggle over territory.

When that tension surfaces in the realm of ideas, the rational mind tries to come up with a semantic expression for the problems it's facing. This comes out as, "Immigrants! My culture! My jobs! We should go back to Primitivism! Everyone should follow The Man In Charge, I give Him Authority!".

Again, you need deal with the issues there before you can come up to the world of ideology. Don't be afraid to cry, and ask someone you love and respect for help.

The irredentist part of it, sure, guilty as charged

What does this have to do with the former?
Also, to the nazis it was perfectly rational to burn books, same with 'alternative facts', they don't seem alternative to much of the far right

Denial of science is something that is particular to the US (not to me), since they've got many fundies mixed in; most fascists are pro-science, to a degree that is disgusting, because they support even pseudosciences to some degree

Which didn't exist earlier in human history and now does? I wouldn't argue that point if I were you

I never said this, stop projecting

You are fully blowing through your prejudices now, which makes my whole position rather ironic, because am the one who's supposed to be a prejudiced jerk y'know

The whole position of fascism isn't to embrace some lethargic anti-modernist middle ages society, but to marry both an anti-modernist ideal with modern means of production and whatever else we've gained in modernity.

Its modernity with as little fun as possible

Stay classy leftypol filters

Mussolini was a corporatist who wanted to strengthen the ruling class just like Hitler.

Didn't someone point out that corporations were a different thing in Italy rather than big companies?