I don't fucking get it. Why does everyone in Bongistan hate Corbyn? Why is Labour doing so poorly in the polls? They have all the right policy positions, don't they? Are Brits just huge masochists? Do they see politics as a circus of celebrities where you vote for the leader who keeps the best beard? What the fuck is going on over there? Is there a single solid reason everyone hates Labour and Corbyn now?
This is so fucked.
the mainstream meteor
When you have the Thatcherite and Labour media destroy your character for months, it gets hard
Why indeed.
I see. That's what I had heard.
So what can be done? Wait until a more charismatic leader follows in his footsteps and keep him here in the meantime to play martyr in the future?
Does it matter? Social Democracy won't save us; the 20th century showed us as much.
classcucked brits will actively vote against their class interests to spite the polish guy next door
Why do they even hate random polish people
At least the poles make good video games unlike Britain
The least social democracy can do is improve our lives in the meantime and shift the Overton Window left.
It honestly seems that way. From an outside perspective it looks like Brits are just really xenophobic and suggestible. Surprised the Nazis didn't happen over there instead.
They took r jobs
If we don't radically change the system soon, society will literally collapse. Trying to get the SocDems to give you a bigger slice of the capitalist pie was always selfish, short-term stupidity - now it's suicide. And shifting the overton window left is a fucking joke; Sweden hardly became any less capitalist or sympathetic to anticapitalism after decades of socdem rule.
He's a limp-dicked pussy. The problem is he isn't radical enough. Indistinguishable program from Red Ed, but he has all the baggage of the media painting him as a further left commie.
That's because their socdems are liberals and not socdems.
You actually might have a point. I mean just look at Melenchon's success.
Hes actively supported the IRA and Hamas in the past. The north remembers Manchester getting bombed and will never vote for him.
A family with a kid can't afford to work for minimum wage in the UK, that and they don't integrate because they have no reason to.
I wouldn't be too pessimistic right now Corbyn is having his message filtered through the media also most people are voting based on personality (which lets be honest corbyn is pretty weak on.) Hopefully once the campaign starts people will look at the party platforms more and recognize which one is in their interest. Also debates and advertisements will allow Labour to communicate directly without having their message warped by the media.
I still think there is still some chance, but I also worry corbyn is just going to be smeared as a weakling who will hand britain to the muslims or something on those lines. Labour needs to develop some kind of messaging strategy on immigration because that is definitely their weak point.
This is an obvious factor but it can't just be used an excuse. This is something every leftist will have to deal with so we need a strategy to address this problem (maybe we should have a thread about this.) It effects Corbyn in an especially strong way because he is overly timid and apologetic, his messaging is also terrible. He is absolutely being misrepresented in the statements from that pic but idk why he is giving such open-ended and vague answers in the first place. Leftists should be unapologetic when dealing with the media and willing to call them out as pro-ruling class shills in a fiery way. Corbyn has started doing this but he needs to keep it up.
More on the media.
soc dems are libs duder. they oppose workers controling the means of production in favour of a large welfare state.
You seem to get it more then rest of these mongs.
You don't need the media to support you for you to be popular, you can bypass it with charisma, which Corbyn doesn't have.
The population has been turned into political retards over the past 30 years by the tabloid media and politicians.
People look at superficial things like personality and rhetoric and have a poor understanding of politics and economics.
Most socialists I see are old (i.e dying off). Most people under 40 seem to think capitalism is the source of all good in the world and that life would be unthinkable without it.
I think it's because the Labour has concentrated on identity politics pondering to minorities and immigrants, forgetting about local Brits.
No I am not Holla Forums, and not nazbol, but in order to gain ground European left should focus on European workers
youtube.com
I don't really think this is a controversial position on here.
brits would tell you the labour party did focus on european workers, mostly from poland
unfortunately most brits hate europeans and think they're something else
A mixture of personal incompetence, backstabbing, media loathing, press memetics, and the public being dumb as shit.
(Most people believe the story they're spoonfed which is essentially that Labour caused the 2008 crisis by spending too much.)
His policy positions are unclear and spun to fuck (as in )
Also it's worth remembering that Turnout in the UK elections hasn't passed 70% since 1992. Even Blair's 1997 landslide was on then-record-low turnout.
tl;dr Bourgeois Democracy a shit.
Its insane to me that people get so triggered by poles in bongstan. In North America even the most racist people would be happy to get more white immigration.
the media is truly losing their shit with corbyn. sadly even their current display or insanity it's enough to make people wake up and realise it's propaganda.
of insanity isn't enough
i need to type better damn
how do i vote for this?
I would unironically vote for this as long as it was voluntary.
sadly corbyn's labour will probably collapse by 2020 due to his treasonous neolib MPs, he either doesn't have the character or the strength to purge them.
It doesn't matter what policies a politician has as they serve no other interests than their own. The only good politician, is a dead politician.
Yeah it's really not a bad idea per se, depends how it's executed of course.
Thank god Stalin is dead indeed.
tfw no state issued gf
Why even live
Have you seen this motherfucker run away from the camera every time he's interviewed? He has all the charisma of a damp tampon. Like it or not that's something you need in a democracy.
David Miliband is the only one who can save us from this hell just kidding we're fucked the fucking libdems are overtaking labour in the polls haha
How is that even possible
What the fuck Labour
Because people don't believe in a nationalized socialism for the whole world, which is what Corbyn offers.
People are only acting in their self-interest.
There was the period, especially just after the brexit vote where he was doing very little in a time where he really should have been doing more in my opinion. The Tories were in a bit of a mess and he wasn't pushing them on it.
Unironically because of lügenpresse.
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They're authoritarians. Corbyn didn't even try to oppose the "snooper's charter" which increased mass surveillance in the UK. Labour have a history of supporting all kinds of "anti-terror" laws which strip people of their basic rights.
The worst bit is that he's still the best leader Labour has had in decades.
Its all on the media. Seriously.
The BBC fuck everything up with their obvious bias, which also elevated UKIP to where it is (seriously, when they were rising they got non-stop coverage by the BBC and even when the greens were bigger than UKIP they got significantly less coverage).
because 'goddamn trot entryists'
the only entryism that happened in the labour party is by tories
yup
i live in one of the most deprived regions and there's fukken UKIP flags everywhere as soon as any election comes up. A party that bills itself as explicitly thatcherite. They want to continue the policies that led to masses of unemployed that they complain about for scrounging.
If you say 'brittun for brittish' they're all over it and will vote to keep themselves in serfdom and their areas neglected. The nation-spook is omnipresent, whereas class consciousness requires a dedicated study into material conditions so socialism's never gonna happen here. Plus, the 'I'm alright Jack' mentality is practically hardwired into our social consciousness. As long as you're the master of your own meagre fiefdom (mortgage, job and car) everyone else can go to hell, never mind the fact that society is an interconnected system of everyone in it.
See this unverified post of bullshit, this is the typical UKIP/Tory voting working class Brit, this is why we're doomed.
See how support for a United Ireland is spun into support for terrorism or protesting Israeli aggression into Lebanon as support for Hamas.
Never mind he was right about Iraq and saw the refugee crisis coming:
youtube.com
Actually I happen to work with Poles, Hungarians and Romanians (that English people are lazy meme is entrenched in our culture it seems) and it's sad because they're just as lazy as we are but believe they are harder working than the rest of us because our media keeps perpetuating this line. Yes labour is a commodity, and immigrants are used by employers in undercutting wages, Corbyn doesn't shy away from that at all and is the only one pointing the blame at the businesses who hire them instead of scapegoating the immigrants like UKIP.
Plus "integration" is a red herring, how and what criteria do they need to be considered integrated? Their cuisine is better so I wouldn't want to impose ourselves onto them (haute British cuisine is not typical food of the masses before you say anything) and they listen to the same shitty pop music we do (I go to their parties), they typically don't listen to much of their own stuff, speaking of music, most of our radio is American stuff anyway. They dress like us too, and are more or less similar in their social outlook. What is it that they are lacking that prevents them from integrating by your lofty standards?
Culture is a spook anyway before anybody interjects, but I want to pretend with you like it's actually something real and important for sake of your response on integration.
At least thats one thing I have is living in probably one of the most socialist cities in the country. Someone tried to put up a Tory sign opposite our school when I was there and it kept getting torn down even though it was like 2 stories up
Get the fuck back to r/ukpolitics.
And lib dems are nowhere fucking near overtaking Labour in the polls.
There scared, cause they saw trump won in the same way, watch it happen and mass kek will ensure with burnt copies of the daily mail.
Also btw, I wouldn't care much about the polls anymore.
Seems character>>>>message. Corbyn isn't the charismatic type people have come to expect.
How do you change the system in your favour when a guy like Corbyn is considered too far left, and you call him sucdem?
and theresa may is?
People will defend May to the last breath as long as she keeps saying Brexit means Brexit. They're desperate and want someone to reassure them it'll all be okay.
Which is retarded, since Corbyn isn't exactly taking a stand against Brexit himself. Why the deep devotion when it's gonna happen anyway?
Not saying I like her just telling you why it is like it is. She is more charismatic, scores more points with the sound-bites at PMQ and the media are pretty neutral on her where they attack Corbyn at every turn.
Fear and nationalist fervour.
Let me give you lads the lowdown. There are several reasons for this.
The media
Take a look at
The media have always made Corbyn to be further left than he actually is. Almost everyone thinks he's a full-blown communist when in fact he's barely that different to Miliband if you look at his policies. However, I would be reluctant to blame things too much on the media - UKIP managed to gain a lot of support despite a hostile media - the issue is that Corbyn does not help himself, which leads me into my next point.
Corbyn's own ineptness
Corbyn is simply inept. He doesn't have the charisma to break through the media's lies. He runs away from journalists when they ask him questions. He does nothing to dispel the notion that he's a communist - he seems to be happy to let the media get away with it. He's fairly weak too, he probably doesn't have the power base within the PLP to take real control of his MPs but all the same he lets himself be sabotaged by them. He doesn't help himself with episodes like the Virgin Trains thing either.
He's not offering what people want
As I said earlier, he's much the same as Miliband policy-wise, which really isn't going to inspire much support across the country. May currently has support partly because of the above reasons (Corbyn's perceived radicalism) but mostly because she offers a programme that strikes a chord with many people - Brexit means Brexit, I care about working people, etc. (yes I know it's all horseshit but voters here have very short memories unfortunately). Corbyn on the other hand doesn't offer anything that can attract broad support. Students love him but otherwise there's nothing there. If he were more anti-EU, and promised to cut down immigration, combined with a more radical left wing economic programme, he'd win a landslide. Honest.
That's it pretty much. Britain has always been a rather centrist country when it comes to politics, unfortunately.
The Manchester bombing was an exemplary piece of work. No one killed but £1.2 billion worth in damages. Provos were amazing tbqh.
Thing is e has been ambivalent about the EU at best. I still think he is a closet euro-skeptic. The media even tried to pain him as such forcing him to come out and say 'nah I love Europe me'. On immigration he is unclear. He isn't shouting its praises like Farron and the SNP. I think he personally has no issue with immigration but realises that a good chunk of the population are concerned about it and so is willing to go wit public opinion on it. And on his economic policies he has proposed at various times nationalising rail and power, as well as some vague sentiment about inequality/redistribution '“Wealth creation is a good thing: we all want greater prosperity. But let us have a serious debate about how wealth is created, and how that wealth should be shared.” He also, for reasons I cannot understand, called for a £10 minimum wage. It's going to be £9 by 2020 anyway so this is hardly radical, despite the papers reaction yesterday.
I think his problem besides a hostile media is twofold. His personality and his integrity. He is too stubborn and principled to flip-flop from a to b on a week by week basis and this makes it hard for him to score political points. If Obama was running on Corbyn's platform and principals we'd be looking at labour 2020/2025.
Only point I disagree with is PMQs. She is fucking awful at them to such a degree that even someone as maligned as Corbyn regularly comes off looking like he got the best of her. Too bad this is about as useful as Clinton "winning" her debates in the states
By the time you've accepted David Miliband as leader, you might as well just join the fucking Lib-Dems and leave Labour too it. At least you'd be intellectually honest, and make a few sops to liberty. (Nick Clegg still deserves to be fired into the sun for not bringing down the government over Snowden though, tbqh.)
Charles Kennedy era Lib-Dems were left of Blair anyway, then the orange bookers had to fuck everything up.
She's not significantly more charismatic, she just has party and media support. (And a general air of being an evil witch of a substitute teacher, instead of the nice geography teacher who let class out early and openly admitted he hated the Tories.)
As Peter Hitchens so rightly observed
Wrong on all accounts tbh.
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He didn't purge the party quickly or effectively enough.
Really makes you think
wtf im a lenin style bully boy now
We Cheka 2.0 now
Prepare to get bullied nerds.
this is actually a good idea
I'd send her to the gulag tbh
I'm liking this new red baiting by liberals
Someone send these to DemocraticSocialist01
brits are brainwashed beyond repair
look at the guardian comment section if you want a headache
Because he lacks common sense, we need nuclear weapons to defend ourselves from other states with nuclear weapons. Not because we will ever use them, they are purely a deterrent. (as opposed to tactical nukes which are going to happen as will nuclear terrorism I have it under good authority from PROSPERO.)
why?
