Question

The stereotypes of a Jew can all be seen in an average Holla Forums poster 🤔

This is actually pretty emblematic of the difference between the far right and the far left. Whereas the Jew is an identity without basis beyond a particular timeframe of material circumstances (you aren't going to argue that the first Jews 4000 years ago were planning SJWs and industrial capitalism, are you?), the Porky is an abstraction of a currently-existing material condition, that is, the division of ownership of capital and subsequent results which defines aptly-named capitalism. You don't "identify" as a worker or a capitalist the same way you "identify" as a Christian or a Jew or a Muslim or anything else, really. Porky is a phenomenon arising from when people conflate their self-interest with capital accumulation and therefore act for it alone. You become Porky when you employ someone, when you invest in capital, when you do as the market commands because you see capital accumulation (getting money) as being your self-interest. A Jew is a fixed identity, something arbitrary whose only point is to be attacked. You can't ascribe the traits of the capitalist onto an identity in full because capitalism must destroy any and all fixed identities in its search for ever-more profit. If an aspect of gayness did not jive with capital accumulation, for example, it would destroy it. Currently, "whiteness" has been identified with a desire to return to a time where you could get a $70K/year job without a college degree, but without the history of class struggle which led to this 1950s-70s concession. This runs counter to the logic of capital, which must always extract as much surplus value as possible. Therefore, it will be destroyed or capitalism will be destroyed. We leftists take no side on this conflict other than that capitalism must be destroyed regardless.

Half-Jew here, I can tell you that we're nothing like how the memes describe us. My grandfather is a big-time Trump supporter for example, fiercely anti-communist now even though he once served in the Red Army. He even thinks Jerry Brown is a commie. My dad is a don't-care Democrat (votes for them because they don't come across as brainwashed assholes like Republicans). That's just one example.

That would kill all of humanity then…that is unproductive

Production is a spook used to control you comrade. They tell you do this do that, benefit this benefit that work for this. It is all empty, it must all burn. The only good man, is a dead man.

I mean the jew
Not a jew like you
My grandma was jewish ethnicly
The jews that i am talking about are self evident Zionists etc

Do these folks look like fucking porky to you?

What makes a Zionist different from a white supremacist other than that they are more respectable, powerful, hard working and wealthy?

Based.

Zionists are just a fraction of the capitalist class. We should oppose them just like any other capitalists, but there's no reason to give them special treatment.

His main gripe was basically: "Why do people watch causal shit like Jersey Shore instead of going to the opera, like sophisticated human beings."

Litteraly kids these days

Because drugs and prostitution are illegal 🤣

Kevin 🍀🍀🍀O'Leary🍀🍀🍀

But they both share the same negitive traits
Porky is just all capitalists
Which all working class Americans are

hehehe, good sassenach

The thing about zionism is it is an ideology that even people outside the jewish take. The US government backs israel's policies and most liberals as well as conservatives in the US think Palestine have no right to their land. Zionism is another form of imperialism and nationalism it is no surprise the capitalist class supports it and that it isn't purely of interest based on identity

The majority of the 1% of the 1% are Jewish

and they will die because of their class and not because of their race.

Not really. His gripe was with the general populace.

Proof?

Aren't they Jewish nationalists though? Shouldn't Holla Forums welcome them instead, since you are all about nations and shit.

That is the problem
Christianity says convert or leave
Islam says convert or die
Comunism says die

That is very unproductive

That's the worst understanding of history I've seen in a while

Some things in the real world are complex and multi dementional

Turns out Israel is doing exactly what hitler did
But they are jews…
They also don't want anyone to do what they did because it would be racist

I am talking modern day
Back then you convert or die or just die
Things change for some

There are brown white supremacists, most of Holla Forums is.

Communism doesn't "say die". Communism says stop leeching off the labor of the proletariat and work like everyone else.

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Ever tried non-linear thinking?
Rich Jews help their friends get richer. White people do the same but to a lesser extent. There are fewer Jews, and they are already very tribalistic in the first place, so they help each other more than white people in addition to it being easier to help a smaller population. Jewish families push their children to become successful or take over family business'. Moreso than white parents, who often have a follow your dreams attitude. And because of how capitalism works, it is easier for the children to become the boss of whatever company the Jewish parents own. If you remove capitalism this becomes impossible. The average Jew won't be able to accumulate wealth and the over-representation naturally disappears. If they are counter-revolutionary they will get the bullet anyhow. So in the framework of communism, it isn't necessary to focus on ethnicity. It only becomes a distraction and gives rise to an unnecessary division between the proletariat. Calling out the something abstract such as the "Jew" is idpol and should be avoided.

I once heard from a Jewish person that the stereotype of Jews being greedy has its roots in Ashkenazi Jews being forced to work in undesirable fields, like the finance sector, because the Bible condemned such occupations, however they remained necessary. Medieval Europe decided to relegate Jews to those occupations because "they were going to Hell anyway", and so the relationship between European Jews and business was born.

I don't know if that's true, though. But something I heard.

In any case, Jewish people have nothing more to do with capitalism or the bourgeoisie than anyone else and should not be targeted because of their ethnicity/religion. IDpol, etc.. And anti-antisemitism and any other bigotry is immoral, hurtful, and divides the working class it pits proletarians against each other instead of against their real enemy.

Grade-A political analysis here.

In the early 2000s, two greatly influential and outwardly religious men declared a manifesto of intent for their vision of the middle east and geopolitics going into the 21st century. One talked at length about Israel's dominance in the region and their links to corrupt and diverse business interests in the west. The other talked about his religious text for a few hours and ranted about the tale of Gog and Magog for a few hours. Guess which was which?

What are you talking about?

No, working class Americans are working class, not capitalists

Capitalists are an economic class.

leftypol may not like to admit it, but there's not much of a difference. jews were the original bourgeoisie, using money to make money when christians saw this as a sin. they survived and then flourished off of capitalism.

of course there are still many jews among the proletariat, but as a whole they are the most porky race to ever exist.

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No, Brits are.
Like every central bank since 300 years ago?

M80, you do realise that many Zionists support the establishment of a Palestinian nation-state alongside Israel? They have a right to their land, just as the Jews have a right to theirs, as much as anti-semitic tankies and the like might autisticly screech about driving the Jews into the sea.

same shit, different day

quit blaming other people for your problems.

umm the jews have no right to the land, it was stolen by the british and give to the jews

Europeans who can distantly trace their heritage back TWO THOUSAND years do not have the right to land already being lived on by the present inhabitants.

That's why it's called Capitalism, not Capitalistism. Capitalists ultimately don't control anything, the system does by acting through them; they are as much pawns and cogs in it as proles.

Very stupid.

You're both repeating racist, anti-semitic propaganda that's used by porky in Arab countries as a scape-goat to stop people developing class consciousness. Two-thirds of Israeli Jews are middle-eastern, not whitey- about 50% are European, which is more than 100% all up but the crossover is intermarriage. The vast majority of Jewish people are communities that were purged from other former parts of the Ottoman Empire, it has little to do with the British. The preferred alternative is a Swiss-like confederation encompassing the entire region, but as long as people are spreading shitty anti-semitic memes we can't work towards that. The question isn't supporting Israel, it's why aren't we helping the other subjugated, oppressed minorities in the Middle East to get their own countries out of the lands dominated by theocratic and baathist Arab imperialists?

If Jews want to live in Palestine, that's fine, people should be able to migrate to and live wherever they like. I have a problem with foreign immigrants migrating somewhere and violently forcing the other inhabitants out with the help of foreign imperialist powers, then proceeding to create nationalist, quasi-religious state, and then keeping millions of people under an apartheid regime while destroying their homes and stealing their land.

We are very inclusive of the people who get all wall here at leftypol.

Capitalism literally says bow down to your corporate masters and allow them to suck away the wealth you produce or die. If somebody is systematically destroying the individual freedom and agency of millions I see no problem with rolling out the guillotine.

Except there is a clear and obvious reason within the logic of capital that causes porkies to behave like assholes. The dynamics of the marketplace mean that whoever produces the most profit can re-invest the most into their business and squash their competitors. Acting like a grade A asshole nets a higher profit, therefore assholes prosper while relatively ethical porkies are out competed and go out of business.

Pol just sees Jews as cartoon villains who do it for no reason.

Because the right wing concept of exploitation isn't founded on empirical reasoning, it's a feeling.

Try telling the average normal that.

Normies gonna norm, it doesn't change what I said.

jews can do it for all those reasons but switch business for tribe

Except ethnic groups are not inherently opposed to one another. The prosperity of a Jew is not dependent on the misery of a German.

In the case of labour and capital, the capitalist by definition gains value from extracting wealth produced by a worker. If they don't do this they aren't a capitalist. This is not the case with a Jew, a Jew can work hard and make an honest living without parasitizing anybody. A capitalist can't, because if they did then they wouldn't be a capitalist. Therefore the interests of the worker and capitalist are inherently opposed, whereas the interests of the Jew and the non-Jew are not.

Also I don't know what nutty world you live in where Jewish porkies don't exploit Jewish workers, or white porkies don't exploit white workers, but clearly they operate according to the logic of capital, not ethnic loyalties. Shlomo the banker and Bob the industrialist smoke cigars together and laugh while you and Jewish workers are at each other's throats.

In addition, while a Jew might say "I support my people so I want to enslave others" there is nothing about them that compels them to think this way. In the case of the capitalist, they literally don't have a choice. They may want to pay their workers fairly, allow them to unionize, not pull the strings of government, not pollute, charge a fair price etc but the mechanisms of the marketplace will ultimately not allow this. If they don't pay their workers crap, manipulate the state, polute the air and water, bust unions, and charge the highest possible price for the lowest possible quality, then somebody else is sure to do these things. That means that this competitor will net higher profits and out compete the "ethical" porky. It's literally a situation where your only options are be a bag of dicks or go out of business.

Why would the capitalist be opposed to the worker if he needs the worker to extract wealth from?

Same way the jew needs the goy to extract wealth from.

Why isn't the tribe comparable to a business wherein to secure the future of your tribe you have to trample others?

That's really fucking spooky, m80s. You know what drove me away from idpol for good? Hearing what my grandfather and father said about Palestinians (the one thing they really agree upon politically), seeing what the "left" had to say about Israel, and coming to the conclusion that both sides are utterly full of shit. Just don't take a side, it distracts from the class struggle. It's not even real. I'm slightly more inclined to side with the Jews over the Palestinians at this point (because of the arguments I've heard), but both sides are a steaming pile of shit tbqh. Those who now live in the West Bank and Gaza Strip have never personally lived in Israel/Palestine proper. Moreover, Yasser Arafat had a chance to fix it all but he /had/ to demand Jerusalem too, even though he was in a far worse negotiating position. Their people fucked themselves over and are extreme far right. No thanks!

The capitalist is opposed to the interests of the worker, not the existence of the worker. What is good for the worker is bad for the capitalists. Anything that increases the prosperity, independence, or political power of the worker endangers profits and is therefore bad for the capitalist.

Because tribes aren't inevitably locked in competition, not in the modern world. There is enough resources and industrial power in the world today to see to everybody's needs.

While one tribe may well exploit another it is not an inevitable fact that they will do so, there are lots of ethnic groups who manage to live side by side without screwing each other over. This isn't the case with capitalists, since the fact that they parasitize others and benefit at their expense is what makes them capitalists.

Not all porkies are Jewish, not all Jews are porkies

It's not hard to understand

replace capitalist with jew and worker with goy

yes, jews

???
Are you actually capable of understanding these concepts. A Jew could work cooperatively without exploitation, but a capitalist by definition can't. If they did they'd stop being a capitalist.

Yeah, all those anti-semitic tropes are totally just like Marxism.

You can't just replace one with the other because they are not the same thing. You might was well say "Ebola kills people and sharks kill people therefore Ebola and sharks are the same thing."

Not all porkies are Jews, not all Jews are porkies. Non Jewish porkies exploit Jewish proles and non Jewish proles. Jewish porkies do the same.

A tribe isn't an economic relationship based on patterns of exploitation. You might as well believe that because the Swiss and the Vietnamese are different tribes, this by definition means that they are opposed to each they and trying to screw each other over. This is obviously not the case, however it is the case that a capitalist must exploit a worker because exploiting workers is what makes them a capitalist. The same can't be said of a Jew or a Brit or a Kenyan. Just being a Jew doesn't mean you have to exploit anybody.

To put it simply, a porky doesn't exploit people because he's a capitalist, he is a capitalist because he exploits people.

lol

Not all porkies are jewish and not all jews are porkies. Porkies and their supporters will get gulaged regardless of race, ethnicity, gender, sexuality, religion or any idpol bullshit.

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just being a capitalist doesn't mean you have to exploit anybody.

now you see

Yes, it does. A capitalist is an owner of capital.

Jews are an ethnic and religious group like the many others on the planet.

Porky is a parasitic subset of the populace found in all modern, developed societies that preys upon the energy of the worker by means of an abstract system of capital ownership.

You confuse and conflate the two because porky encourages it and thinking past your racial prejudices while being bombarded with propaganda by porky is hard. When the Black Plague hit Europe the church and the nobility often claimed that people were getting sick because Jews were poisoning the wells, turning popular anger on convenient scapegoats.

Porky has your fucking number and knows how to push your buttons.

Lets be real, we all know 🍀🍀🍀who🍀🍀🍀 is really behind global finance.

what's more likely

occams razer bruh, gas the jew

Exploiting peopl is what MAKES them a capitalist. Saying that you can be a capitalist without exploiting anybody is like saying you can be a murderer without killing anybody.

Except a Kibbutz is just a communal farm. It's literal proof that Jews can and do live lives without exploiting anybody. Do you really think the guy who works at the falafel stand in Tel Aviv is behind the global banking conspiracy?

not every transaction is exploitation

yeah if by "anybody" you mean other members of the tribe.

That is the stupidest attempt at using Occam's razor that I have ever heard. You must be suffering some hardcore cognitive dissonance.

Exploitation is the appropriation of value that you had no hand in creating. The wage the worker is paid is wealth that they themselves created. Porky doesn't pay workers to work for him, workers pay porky to do nothing. It's parasitism plain and simple.

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What's more likely?

Or

Like, do you unironically believe that white porkies give a shit about you because you are the same ethnic group as them? Was it love of their race that moved all those American porkies to ship production to China and impoverish their countrymen?

Stefan Molyneux would be apalled at your lack of an argument.

or

hmmm which is more likely

It doesn't materialize out of nothing. It grows out of the economic development of society, from the urban small scaled artisans and skilled labourers that exist from the genesis of urban society. Following the introduction of industrialization they apply the factory system to their small scale shops and you have the first capitalists.

The idea that Jewish identity remains singular and cohesive throughout their history is laughable, Judaism isn't even strictly monotheistic until the Macedonian conquest of Israel. This same people are then scattered to the four winds following the destruction of the second temple, and they are highly influenced by the areas where the settled. Ashkenazi Jewd and Ethiopian Jews are not even close to the same. They don't even start calling for a United Jewish homeland until the 19th century, and they only do this because nationalism was the dominant ideology of the day and they wanted a piece of it. Zionism literally arrives on the scene 100 years after capitalism starts to become the dominant economic model in Europe.

Congrats on your autism

Totally false, 35% of US billionaires are Jews and 11% of the Worlds billionaires.

takimag.com/article/jewish_wealth_by_the_numbers_steve_sailer/print

That's an argument to reverse ethnic cleansing worldwide. Hell, if you go beyond the founding of Israel you'll have to deal with, er, 99% of the population of the Americas, Australia, etc.

Wrongdoing doesn't flow through the bloodline, the _effects_ of that wrongdoing do.

This bit might be important on your ideology.

The majority of americans are not capitalists; they are capitalist sympathizers. But you have to see that you're a worker and it's in the capitalist best interest to fuck you as much as he can, because that's how he generates profit.
If you accept this, we might start with another discussion if the relationship between capitalist and worker are healthy for society (protip, it isn't).

Calling working class Americans capitalists is like calling medieval serfs dukes and earls.

Why the fuck is this thread not anchored??