Probably Stupid Questions

Hey Holla Forums, recent migrant from 4/pol/.
I'm a left leaning centrist, and while the ideas of the far left seem appealing, the actual details seem really fuzzy to me, though I assume this is due to misconceptions (which you can hopefully educate me on).

Okay, Anarchist Communism. How does a communist society stay together without authority? For example, let's say everyone in your community are fishers. What's to stop one fisher deciding to keep his own catch for himself if there isn't any authority?

What always confuses me is the revolution, and how it's supposed to occur. The majority of those oppressed by capitalism in North America and Europe believe communism (and any far left belief) to be PURE EVIL, and aren't willing to even consider the idea of there being a problem with the current system. How can we inspire people who have been so indoctrinated by capitalistic forces?

Thanks in advance, I'm sure they're pretty uninformed, and I realy would appreciate the help.

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Assuming good faith

According to anarchist theory, communal sanctions.

In a commune, there would not be purely fishers. People in the commune would vote upon production.

I don't think we can go directly into an anarchist order, but I think it should be noted that we moved beyond the sort of cottage industry you're describing years ago. The fish you bought in the store weren't caught by single fishermen with fishing poles. They were caught by fishing companies with boats with large nets specifically designed to reel in large catches and are operated by many fishermen working cooperatively. Under capitalism, these fisherman have to forfeit a good chunk of the value they produce in caught fish to the owner of the fishing company. Under socialism and communism, they keep the value they collectively produced. Social production is already a fact of life, but social production for private benefit. All we demand is social production for social benefit.

Okay, but let's say one person decides to leave the community to start a life fishing far away from everyone else. Is that okay? Are people who do not wish to stay in a community free to leave?

Go back to cuckchan faggot

you should read Ha Joon Chang: the secret history of capitalism
will get you solidly on the left camp, but not rad left just socdem
well, what do you mean authority? We tend to all think of authority as the part of society performing necessary violence.
But, we are able to imagine instances where necessary violence can be done by individuals among each-other. Self defense or defense of property, namely. This happens in small communities, who can maintain order through an informal justice system (if x kills y, and everyone can readily see and react to it, and the abolition of murder is strongly ingrained in people, generally murder is prevented, or swiftly dealt with.)
We can imagine anarchy (this informal peace keeping and decentralized justice of people defending against transparent crimes, crimes that everyone readily witnesses and can all agree justifies reaction/justice, like murder or theft) with property. Because we can imagine instances where property theft can be warded off by everyone having a level playing field of violence (everybody having a gun to defend there homestead), thus making transgression not worth the risk.
But this entirely hinges on the concept of theft justifying violence. If no one thought the theft of property justified violence, this informal regulation wouldn't work. It'd be like if you shot somebody in your community for wearing a blue shirt, everyone would think you were a nutjob and kick you out/kill you.

I'm not an ancom. I think ancom may eventually be possible, and has existed in the past with primitive communism, but I think formal law is necessary. Although having strong municipal democracy/direct democracy/officials picked by lot and recallable by vote/making police duties evenly distributed through the whole population, would get as close as possible to ancom and still function.

There's not going to be one answer to this but generally yes. However, he's not really going to find much of a different system elsewhere because, as the song goes, The Internationale Will Be the Human Race.

So basicly, no?

There will always be empty places for hermits, no matter the system. Of course people can leave - if you get rid of rulers because it's a society without (an) rulers (archos), then who's to stop them? Anarchists already do this when they squat, anyways.

Yes and good luck. You'll need it.

People change quickly. The general mood of society can change quickly. Periods of deep political and economic instability will cause these rapid shifts in consciousness.

In 1916, Lenin spoke at a conference of European socialists in Switzerland. He said that Russia was a backwards place, that people were conservative, and that he would likely never see a socialist revolution in Russia in his lifetime. The next year he led it.

yes
but this isn't the case where all land is privately owned is it

The people of Russia were conservative, but they didn't have the ingrained hate of communism today's working class have. Most people I know think of the radical left as a bunch of lazy people who refuse to get "real jobs". How do you shift this sort of opinion?

Three days without food and people will rally around Literally Satan Raping A Little Boy As We Speak if that's what it takes

Why would there be three days without food and water in a functioning society of any sort?

ily OP

I imagine that he can keep all the fish he catches if he wants. But contributing his fair share to the community is the only way his neighbors would be willing to give him the things he needs, like shoes, fishing poles, boat repairs, etc.

imo, education is the only thing we can do right now. But leftist movements always gain steam when capitalism falls into crisis, and crisis is inevitable. Take a look at the US during the Great Depression, for example.


Yes and yes.


You first.

Bunkerchan is waiting for you comrade! Now leave!

Can one man not make for himself shoes, fishing poles, a boat or even a grand house fo himself to live in?

By demonstrating that the radical left is actually a group of people able and willing to provide coherent political perspectives for people during the crisis period. When shit hits the fan, we need to be an organized, educated mass force, and that will in itself dispell preconceptions about the left.

i wander what Anzu looks like naked.
do you think her pussy shoots rainbows ?

they hate something called communism.
but if the third greatest crash of capitalism happened (we've had 2 so far and the bubbles are still here)
And a well liked president instituted a massive nationalization and jobs program giving everyone a job, if a country with vast resources and capital like the US did it with the organization of the U.S military (WW2 put everyone back to work after the great depression), most people would love it.

I didn't say without water, it's generally much harder to abruptly disrupt water.
But in general the fact of the matter is capitalism is really good at abruptly turning society into Not A Functioning Society Anymore.

A US president would never make massive nationalizations or decide to give everyone a job, are you delusional? Also, despite capitalism's "great crashes", it still stands proudly today. It is truly a timeless and invincible system.

He can if he wants. But considering the amount of time and effort required to get the raw materials to make all those things and teach himself how to make them from scratch, it's much more convenient to live in a community. Being a hermit irl is a little more complicated than it is in minecraft, unfortunately.

Every system always stands proudly despite everything that almost brought it down until one day, suddenly, it doesn't

...

end of history lmao

Hahahahaha

do you think Anzu's butthole taste like candy?

Where can I find far left people at a college campus who actually have jobs?

Maybe in America but not in Europe. What is driving away oppressed workers from the left is not the ideology but the political direction that the left parties have about immigration and terrorism. the media scared the people with with an anti-immigrant rethoric and islamic terrorism to make share. If the media were more honest, and the people more accustomed to get informed, the shift to the left would be obvious. Europe is still licking its wound from the 2008 financial crysis, too many people are unemployed, too many bourgeois filled their pockets with workers tears.
If we talk about America, I want you to remember that Hillary won the popular vote, this means that in real numbers more people voted for the left than the right.

Well on a college campus it might be tough, cause they'll mostly all be students not workers. But talk to the student left-activists, they might know worker left-activists. Whereabouts are you based user?

t. neoliberal

What's wrong with fearing islamic terrorism if it happens so often (though admittedly not as often as gang shootings)?

Source on the webm?

It's wrong because it's RACIST

No idea.

How is fearing the actions of a radical multiracial group racist?

I'm not saying that Hillary was good, I'm saying that less people was attracted by the Trump lies.


Nothing, as long as it's not strumentalized by the far right to put every muslim in the same basket and legitimize their blind hate for everything that is islam. People who take what the TV says as an absolute truth generally lacks critical thinking.

Are you implying Islam isn't a race? RACIST

Is this satire?

*were

sorry

Look at the flag. Do you need to ask that question?

W-what's wrong with gay nazis?

It's a flag meant purely for shitposting.

Fighting islamic terrorism is fine, and any real leftist knows that programs set up to stop it are fine if they actually tackle islamic terrorism and aren't just an excuse for porky to do shit abroad and sew divisions in the proletariat. The proposed Trump measures for example are pretty much all feels > reals, and all the effort spent making working Christians and Atheists fear working Muslims (or more generally working Arabs) by doing feel-good shit could be much better spent actually targeting the sources of radicalization. Leftists oppose porky diverting attention from actual issues because it's always done to keep workers divided.

And ignore . They're just a nazi trying to make leftists look bad by saying dumbass liberal shit. Hating ISIS and islamism isn't racist and they're just mad that we don't have buzzfeed level analyses of race or religion.

Congratulations on simply being the minimum the establishment wants you to be.
Btw communism never works

Good to know for future: Do not speak of gender-segregated full gay fascism.

…do you really not see the contradictory nature of the flag?

...

It worked pretty well for the first 38,000 years of human existence.

You're gonna turn me into an anprim with talk like that.

Communism worked when we were living in huts and chasing down fuzzy elephants with sticks, so I don't know why it wouldn't work with modern industry, automation, and the internet.

Don't forsake technology, user. Think of the robo qts.

Existing in simple tribes that kill other tribes that get too close to us worked when we were stabbing all of our prey to death, I don't see why it wouldn't work with modern arms technology!

It would. But that sort of behavior isn't beneficial to us in the long run.

Welcome Comrade

As a social democrat, I believe in gradually establishing socialism through elected governments.

The anarchists are right to be suspicious of instruments of government, but invariably end up either disorganized or duplicating hierarchies either formally or informally.

However much hate bourgeois democracy gets, it is very useful in preventing the takeover of a cult of personality or incompetent administrators.

Ultimately, the details of the post capitalist society will be decided because they are the best thing to do at the time.

aside from electoral politics, organization of workers into trade unions or worker cooperatives also increases the power and consciousness of the working class and prepares the way for socialism.

we must have freedom with socialism, and utopian projecting must be shunned

...

The true utopianism is believing that you can get the people who hold all power and wealth to give that up peacefully.
youtube.com/watch?v=d2-CZQnBRYs

So as opposed to capturing the state you want to capture the state after a civil war?

Let's ignore the fact you guys murdered Luxembourg, an actual socialist who initially ran for political office peacefully within the system.
And no, welfare and state capitalism isn't socialism.


One day…

Communism is more or less one of two results of the lack of state. Without a government enforcing private property the workers will simply sieze the factory/fishing boat etc rather than put up with whatever fraction the owner deigns to pay.

The problem is how you prevent the other possible result, which is warlords moving in.

Always a good place to start if you need any answers to rather broad questions

theanarchistlibrary.org/library/the-anarchist-faq-editorial-collective-an-anarchist-faq

Under socialism they'd never buy a new boat.