Open Discussion

Yep, we're looking for differential viewpoints. We've got one libertarian, and one Civic American Nationalist.

We're trying to get a live spoken discussion, through some voice communication system that allows for multiple spoken opinions based on political ideologies.

A greater amount of Holla Forums-Holla Forums communication and exchange (in good faith) can only be a good thing. I want to see more of this.
youtube.com/watch?v=49o2o-uaEVg
I know there are some communication issues and jargon to work around here. Most of Holla Forums has a poor idea what we're arguing for, and we're not entirely blameless.

I hope this is the "liberal" of "liberal arts" tbh
Liberals suck

This is pretty much what we're going for. Just general open discussion that can exchange idealss without everyone labeling each other as something.

I mean that in the sense of open discussion.

Sure, sure. I volunteer Muke.

Are you on IRC?

bump

what do you mean by an open forum?

Any position is welcome to come put fourth their views in a debate setting, trying to be cordial and not speak over each other, not hurl insults, but to broaden understandings, plus we're bored.

I might be willing to do this. What's are you using, though? IRC, Discord, etc?

sure, classcuck

Allow me to interject for a moment, I have a question for leftists.

K so I believe you people are doing this one thing wrong (imagine that, huh?). And I dont understand why..
Why are you promoting weakness and what we call 'degeneracy', you know, welfare that causes addiction and encourages parasitic behavior, or what about 'fat is beautiful' cunts, you know, moral relativism, awful art that sometimes consists solely out of rancid excrement? Or faggot gays, you know, the flamboyant kind, the kind that needs a flag to have sex, the shrill kind that disrupts public transport, the promiscuous mentally unstable kind that has around 1000 partners in the lifetime and wants to shove his rotting dick all over your kid's face.
Or junkies, why do you allow junkies to exist in your ranks? You know, the antifa kind, the kind you are afraid to punch because you dont know if he is going to fucking die and ruin your life.
Or promotion of victim complex, never the one to find a way, always the kind that finds an excuse, living in the west and thinking it is oppressed, poor dear..
Also, what is point of wimpy faggy skinny unfit 'men' in your ranks who do not even lift, why do you promote this hipster unculture? Or buffed women who actually lift and want to join the army, what's the point?? She will never have a lung capacity, or bone density, or muscle mass of a man, it doesnt matter how much she trains she will never be able to carry a 20 kg machinegun on foot for 2 days straight without rest.
Why do you want to destroy the classical, old, normal culture, culture that produced the best civilization has to offer, the richest, most free and full of civil liberties, and with what do you even want to replace it with??
Also, why dont you simply find a job in the private sector and fuck off with the banditry and thievery and obsession with other people's money?

But hey, I do not really care all that much about anything above. That's all fine. Here's the big one:
Why the fuck do you tolerate shitskins? Are you all overly sheltered, delusional rich kids that lived in mansions their whole life, never having to interact with.. religions of peace and trucks of tolerance, so you are oblivious to the fact that we are not all equal? Why cant we have our own ethno-state, like Israel has, like Japan have, and so on? Why is multiculti just in white countries?

Is there a peaceful way for us to just.. leave? Just go to a fucking mountain or in the woods somewhere, try to live life, farm land, and never have to deal with shitskins??
Pic related, something quite a chunk of polacks want, peace, quiet life, ability to just live your life unmolested, never having to deal with faggots, shitskins, muslims, moral relativists, leftist political theorists, postmodern artists, any of those repulsive fucks.

I've had better pasta from a Kraft Dinner box tbh

then go to the fucking alaskan wilderness, the rest of us will be better off for it.

Stopped reading there. Those are idpol SJWs. Not us. They're only leftists in name. This is a strawman. Most of us on Holla Forums despise identity politics. This includes third wave feminism, white nationalism, black supremacy etc. AS WELL as racism. We don't buy into the whole "WHITES CAN'T FACE RACISM" etc.

again, strawman. I don't give a shit.

Second

Give me a fucking break. Considering the rich have enough wealth to get the world out of global poverty four times over, you don't think that's a fucking issue that needs to be adressed? Or should I just forget about the wars fought in the name of profit, or convenientally forget about the global recessions, financial crisises, mass unemployments, depressions and inflations we've had in the last 110 years caused by Capitalism?

oxfam.org/en/pressroom/pressreleases/2013-01-19/annual-income-richest-100-people-enough-end-global-poverty-four

Workers co-ops do better than private companies, fam. Why should one faggot have all the wealth when I was the one who basically did the labour? The boss needs us, but we don't need the boss. Believe me, I have a job, and it's part time in a workers co-op and I feel better for it. Read the pdf.

To the third , I don't give a fuck about race. I do agree that radical islam is a cancer, but I could say that about any other religion. They need reform.

Ah yes, Israel, an ethno state which commits vast human rights violations against the palestinians in the name of Zionism. Fuck that.

Japan? You mean a country which has sexual harassment agencies, a declining population, a decaying economy and is seeing a rise of a youthful communist party?

Yeah, QUALITY ETHNO STATES FAM.

I don't know? Maybe because there is some economic benefit to multi culturalism because libshit porkies want to exploit them to make more money for themselves?

citylab.com/work/2011/12/diversity-leads-to-economic-growth/687/

Forgot the link about the rich

oxfam.org/en/pressroom/pressreleases/2013-01-19/annual-income-richest-100-people-enough-end-global-poverty-four

Are you actually advocating for a fucking safe space? Man the fuck up you pussy, not every single non-white person is out to get you and wipe you off the face of the planet. If you don't like other ethnicities, then yeah, go and live in the woods and practice chaos magic with Juan.

say I open a bakery in alaska, and faggot walks in and I tell him to fuck off, having a right to deny service to anyone, would the leftists campaign to invoke the wrath of government on me for months? why do all the muslim bakers get a pass when they tell faggots to fuck off?

if you think this is the most important problem faced by politics atm you're fucking retarded.

Is it a co-op?

thing with leftists is, they dont take people to court when they suspect foul play, if these evil rich men are stealing take them to a court.. what if they work harder and smarter than the rest of the planet? is working hard evil now?
no, they just campaign to take your guns 24/7 and then come to your house and shoot your dog, that's leftist justice for you

what if I dont give a shit I am being exploited? what if I dont mind the evil monopoly monocle guy is.. taking my cut or whatever? what if I dont give a shit about your ideology, am I free from your molestation?

What did he mean by this?

I don't want to invoke the wrath of government on anyone for refusing service, unless it's a utility or something.
You're right. It's a savage hypocrisy that will eat the identarian pseudo-left alive. I don't condone that nonsense. Most of us here see most of what democrats and SJWs do as seriously backwards or destructive. Leftism, correctly understood, is not "take what these crazy feminists/democrats are doing, and turn it up to eleven." It's in a completely different direction.

No. You're being designated the "free bread for Muslims" centre.

pic related

The laws defend capital accumulation and the extraction of labor value
Government is literally a device of class rule.
You can't be this dense
No, "theft of labor value" is not when you are hired at $11.56/hr to stock shelves and find out that you only got $11.25/hr in your paycheck.

fucking hell

again, shitty strawman and objectively false.

Except they don't all do this. They pretty much just leach off the workers while they sit in their ivory towers doing sweet fuck all except make a few buisness calls and sign a few contracts.

WOW, it's not like the rich have been able to bribe judges, police officers and talk into politicians ears….

judiciaryreport.com/corrupt_judges.htm

No, it's just a stupid fucking strawman, you politically illiterate faggot.

HURRR IF THE FEUDAL LORD HAS SERFS THEY CAN JUST GO TO THE KING U GAIZ

I am really worried you people are going to do something awful. And I dont mean for yourself, you are absolutely free to shit your life up. I am talking about everyone's life.

I was born with pretty much nothing. Mother cleans offices for a living, dad is a dysfunctional drunk. I became certified electronic technician at 19, learned how to put electricity inside people's homes. Took a debt from a loan shark, bought a multimer that measures amperes, volts, resistance, frequency etc.
Anyway that's irrelevant, I put a few of those papers saying I am looking for work. I was getting a call every other day all over town. Payed back the debt. Bought my own room with a bed. Made enough money, now I am putting myself trough college, going for electronic engineering. I was wondering if I should hire a helper, teach him myself what to do and take a few extra calls, but decided to do school instead. Now I can do integrals!

That's our glorious western civilization for you. Why do you hipster fucks want to take it away from me? Who's oppressing who here? How is this thing not great?
God damn leftists, undisciplined scum with a fetish for complaining, thinking world owes them a yacht each.

Gotta give it to you tho, those Soviets did put a man in space. How the fuck did they do this I dont know, maybe they tortured kids in gulags to pull it off, maybe everyone was happy at the end of the day, so there probably is something about it.. but what we already have is just too perfect to fuck it all up.

...

How are you this confused about who we were and what we want? You really need to lurk more.

In regards to everyone's life, we want to eliminate poverty.

Again, we don't want to see anyone being brought up with that childhood, especially if it churns out fuckwits like you.

No one's denying the west has done some awesome stuff, but you're a fucking idiot if you think any civilisation were gud bois who dindu nuffin.

HOLY STRAWMAN BATMAN, also, the only one who's complaining is you lad, you know, about your rather shitty knowledge about leftists.

NEWSFLASH FAGGOT

Not every single leftist likes the USSR. There are plenty of other successful examples of socialism, and socialism itself comes in many forms, from anarchism, to council communism, libertarian socialiasm, marxist leninism to fucking posadism.

And guess what, those libertarian socialist socities actually gave the means of production to the workers and their lives improved ==substantially==

anarchism.pageabode.com/afaq/secI8.html

Your whole ideology went to shit in a single post tho, no wonder you cant address it. You all think you are entitled to stuff. You all think you are poor, tricked, oppressed dears. And that all self made men should also take care of you, for no reason.

You live in a world where a farmboy can become an astronaut, if you put half the effort you put into complaining into actually doing something useful, you wouldnt have to complain a day in your life.

Opinion discarded.

Like kill 5-6 million Jews?

And you people have the NERVE to call us cucks? damn, maybe it's true that you Holla Forumsyps just project your deep desire for that bbc.

Wrong, see

You're the one who was advocating for a fucking ethnostate you dumb faggot.

I don't think I'm opressed. I think the world is being fucked over by a bunch of rich fucks and governments who are sending our planet to hell and could have solved global poverty four times over. You're a fucking class-cuck of the highest degree.

And yet here you are complaining. Also

PURE
FUCKING
IDEOLOGY

You live in a world where a farmboy can become an astronaut, if you put half the effort you put into complaining into actually doing something useful, you wouldnt have to complain a day in your life.

...

Believe me, I don't

Well I guess I dont know what you people stand for then. I mean you dont really expect normal people to know what anarcho-socio-council-libertarian-communist things even are, do you?
If you dont want to take people's guns and freedoms and force a 90% income tax on everyone and if you keep your.. words to yourselves, I guess I dont see a problem. I dont go around nagging people what mosfet transistors are, nor do I expect them to care what that is. If you people are like me, dont want to molest anyone, I guess there's no problems between polacks and you.

Well the way we see it, we can make a decent living and not feel the need to complain about anything, all while being "exploited".
Your average polack simply sees no merit in complaining. Moaning like a bitch is not the most rewarding or productive thing you can do in life about solving problems, is it?

All we see are news of hipsters on the streets smashing trash cants because Trump, that's all we know about leftists. And that half of them are junkies, poor oppressed souls, having cash for iv drugs.

WRONG
WRONG
WRONG

No, that's wrong. You don't understand us.
Frankly, I don't believe your emotional story, it doesn't matter if it is true, by the way, since you'd be an exception, but you know that.

That much is fucking evident.

Yeah fuck off, class cuck.

Except they're the ones who think the genocide of the white race is real and they want to bring identity politics to the table. We hate white nationalism, black supremacy and third wave feminism. It's identity politics which got these groups opressed in the first place.

You're literally FEELS>REALS the poster

Ok sure but which worker died and made you the representative of all the workers in the world? Are you even a worker? Eh, as long as you dont try to represent me, I guess everything is fine.

Whites used to be 40% of the world population at the start of first world war. Today, they are 7%. All muslim refugees in Europe are unemployable welfare munchers, leeching tax payers and breeding like vermin. Similar with niggers and spics in USA.

How do you see this playing out? Ever heard of South Africa? Ever heard of Rhodesia? No?
Soon enough we will all be set on fire because wizardry (common news in Africa), or beheaded for heresy (common news in the Middle East).

Considering people's leashes, not least your own, are made from hundreds of millions of them, maybe you should.

Why are you okay with being exploited?

You do realise that poor people are more likely to breed to than wealthier ones?

debunkingdenialism.com/2014/01/11/white-genocide-eurabia-and-other-white-supremacist-nonsense/

Well maybe if western imperial powers weren't busy bombing the ever living shit out of people and subjecting them to PTSD because of the pursuit of capital, you wouldn't be dealing with this shit, now would you?

But hey, that's capitalism for you.

considering that the education system in America is absolutely shit, as well as the fact that most of these people were born into poverty, this has nothing to do with their race and correlation with crime and said poverty.

Ever heard of Rwanda or Botswana? Or Namibia? Fuck off you emotional cunt.

You also wouldn't be getting western resentment and the rise of Islamic fascism, but hey
AT LEAST WE GET FUCKING OIL

*this has nothing to do with their race, but poverty

Where's social justice for white farmers in South Africa who are getting slaughtered as you read this, and cant call the police because niggers are the police?
Why is jew owned hollywood promoting open borders and fun for goyim, but not for israel? Why does all multiculti have to happen in white countries only??

Because money comes and goes. Who cares? If I can put food on my table and a roof over my head, which I can.. who gives a shit?
What matters infinitely more to me is that my children do not have to grow up in a world besieged by clinically retarded savage shitskins who hate their guts out of pure envy and impotence.

Born slave.

Well, not everybody, but those who come onto a leftist forum claiming to have debunked leftism should have a fucking clue what we actually argue for, yes.
Like, if you say "I've found a counterexample to the mean value theorem," you should be able to state the theorem. If you start spewing some absurd crap like "oh it means all functions are linear" expect to be called on it. But yeah, you don't need every random on the street to know or care about it.

Lol.
If your boss told you that they "could only work on paper, but not in the real world" and demanded you never use any of them, you might be inclined to argue with him about how they work. If it became clear that he has no fucking clue what they are, but doesn't believe that this undermines his position in the slightest, you might get a little frustrated, and might try to briefly explain what they are. But it's not important, again, to randoms on the street.

Holla Forumsyps are the single-most complainy people I have ever met in my entire life. Muh j00s, muh niggers, muh globalist conspiracy, muh refugee flood, muh anuddah shoah, etc.

Wow yeah right on fucking cue, Mr. Stoic.

This is a literal ad hom. You see that, right? My personal position is completely irrelevant to my argument. Workers should own workplaces and control the full value of what they produce.
I do chemistry research now and did retail logistics for a while some time ago, and I say this only to shut up your "muh experience" non-argument

This is the kind of shit that worries me, not everyone being clothed and fed with relatively piss easy work anyone can do.

Do you honestly think we don't care about this problem? We do.

Considering black cops are capable of acting like any other trigger happy cop, I don't give a shit. This applies to Milwuakee and other places.

Bullshit conspiracy isn't going to save your skin, stormfag. I could go on about how the Irish control everything, but then that'd defeat the purpose.

Do you honestly think us leftists are all for open boarders? Foreign aid is the key. Immigration may save a few, but it can take in Radical Jihadis and allow for porky to expolit immigrants for cheap labour.

Again, Botswana and Rwanda may take you up on that.

It's important to interact with humans outside of the internet.

This is happening in countries where old people are not dying fast enough.

(YES. mostly countries with good welfare and state provided healthcare system)

Japanese will go extinct if they don't accept immigration. Thanks to Fukushima meltdown Japanese government has to practically beg for foreigners to stay there and is planning to give out permanent resident status to any high paying|highly educated people as soon as they spend more than 1 year in the country.

South Korea is accepting lots of Vietnamese, Indonesian and Chinese people because they know they'll eventually die out too.

Say I seize all memes of production, what use are they to me when I drown in niggers? Where is immigration for Israel that promotes this shit trough hollywood?

They have white people hating white people, you dont see this kind of shit with any other group of people.

If economy really works on flee bitten illiterate 3rd world shitters.. why is their home economy so bad? Why is the world economy dominated by Europe and USA instead of.. India and China who still live like animals, shitting in the streets and so on?

The future "we" chose.

You know migration benefits porky, right?

No, fuck off.

...

They have to be kept poor so their resources can be used cheaply.

He's going to devolve into spamming "red pills" any second now.

hello my fellow Marxist :)

There's no country called Europe. Eurozone countries have shown us various degrees of successes and failures. Germany, French(to some degree) serve as power house, and country who could not keep up with such technological advance like Greek enjoyed brief period of freebies and then went bankrupt.

Not really sure how your safe space dwellers define world economy dominance but GDP wise China is 2nd largest economy powerhouse. avg quality of life in China is somewhat different topic for sure but no matter how many memetic images you make, you cannot change how the world works.

Uh huh

unesco.org/fileadmin/MULTIMEDIA/HQ/CLT/pdf/P_Lovejoy_African_Contributions_Eng_01.pdf

citylab.com/work/2011/12/diversity-leads-to-economic-growth/687/

Lad, you got BTFO and now you're sperging out like some triggered autist.

This, ladies and gentlemen, is your brain on Holla Forums

This faggots drunk dad should've beaten him to death as a kid

Mass immigration doesn't necessarily foster Scientific development.

Not sure what kind of straw man you are trying to fight exactly anymore.

Are you denying the existence of STEM community outside of US?

This is a serious problem. I acknowledge that the government is conducting a state-sponsored harassment campaign against whites, and that it should be stopped. Part of this is due to the self-enriching, criminal government, and part is because so many of them have been conditioned to believe that all problems there are due to whitey, so that they don't look at who owns the world they live in or change things in an actually effective way. Literally the same way feminists are trained to hate men. It's supposed to be diversionary and ineffectual.

Come again? I'm not certain they actually do this, but neoliberalism and free trade are literally the order of the day for the bourgeoisie. Of course this is going to seep into popular media.
Geopolitics. The stability of the Israeli state depends largely on immigration controls, and in turn facilitates NATO strategic objectives in the region. Which are ultimately in the interest of the bourgeoisie. Which the state exists to serve. Simple stuff.

Well, first thing is people have to want to move there. South Sudan can drop its immigration controls all they like and get only a handful of willing immigrants, likely refugees from war elsewhere. That is, if it currently has a government, I don't recall.So there's naturally a pressure on people to move from poorer nations to richer ones.
Beyond that, it's a lot of "gee, I wonder why the rational, profit-optimizing bourgeoisie want mass immigration of unskilled labor into richer countries with accomplished labor movements and higher wages - amid a backdrop of historic rollbacks of the gains of the working class and social programs and as desperate capital infusion is used to safe failing banks?"

Why do the plutocrats who run the government push for immigration today? Doesn't it seem like having control over the engines of production in a society renders you kind of immune to material impacts of these decisions? Able to be self-sufficient and freely associate with only those you so choose?
Also if the bourgeoisie aren't running things against the peoples' wishes, you can straight up ban immigration.
Jews can claim citizenship through the "right of return" law. It's pretty heavily advertised. Just, you have to be the right race for it.

Remember the two world wars where different sections of the bourgeoisie came into direct, bloody conflict? Basically that sort of conflict is always there, and the bourgeoisie of one nation or regional partnership (EU, NATO, etc) will seek to dominate those of others through interfering in internal affairs and public policy, starting wars, setting trade policy, etc. When you have one set of guys "ahead" they can use that advantage to suppress competition and crush the free market. Like I've said, the state is a device of class rule. It furthers class interests, both domestically and abroad.
Basically

We are not importing doctors and engineers, half of them cant even speak English and even more of them are illiterate.
I know that you arent a racist, that you dont hate them and that you dont think whites are superior, but can you at least see they hate you? Can you at least see it is in your interest to not oppose right wing effort to curb the immigration?

I don't oppose the anti-immigration efforts. I don't think many people here do.
Can you at least see why it is they're being invited in, by whom, and whose interest this serves?

Classcucks aren't just a meme.

whose interest does it serve? So far I've heard it's either a clever capitalist conspiracy to undermine muh welfare state. Then it's clever capitalist conspiracy to undermine third world countries of their most skilled workers. Then it's a clever capitalist conspiracy to shut down migration to spread racism and nativism by importing illiterates who don't actually work.

That's a side effect of brain draining. The goal isn't to undermine the country the workers are coming from.

That's probably a side effect too.

It drives down wages, and keeps up unemployment. Capitalists benefits.

And where does the rise of populist parties that roll back immigration and the erosion of the European Union factor into this clever capitalist equation?

They aren't infallible wizards planning everything. They just benefit from cheap labor.

Idiot.

South Africa has to adhere to terrible neo liberal policies and world bank restrictions.

Mugabe was asking for foreign investors.

If I find a pic of white Christians fawning over women's lingerie do I then need to gas all whites?

See user, most people in /leftpol does not think mass immigration benefit proletariat. Some accelerationist might think it's good venue to start counter conspiracy but it's unfair to consider every leftist as accelerationist.

The problem is, some of /yourguys/ are using this chance as an excuse to score few more uncanny points that achieves far more than banning mass immigration of 'sand niggers'.

It's all three.

I have Holla Forumsyp friends irl who are not autistic bastards. It's not a big deal that you are not "cuck"-ing. Feel free to lurk or join in other discussions, but I'm pretty sure that everybody here knows reasonable right-wing people.

what the fuck is wrong with you cucks? Shouldn't you be in favour of less bureaucracy, less state power, and less welfare? You should want the state to be as weak as possible or non existent so you can try and seize muh production means.

Why would we want less welfare? How would Bernie increase state power in a way that's bad for us?

Why would it be good for you? Like why? I mean if all welfare is abolished there will be some mass dindu riot that you can seize upon as a revolutionary moment.

I do. Albeit they still think that socialism is ==EVERYTHING THE GUBERMENT DOES==

Muh acceleration.
Why don't you become a market anarchist?

what kind of faggotry is this shit?

The version of the left that exists in your head.

Let me guess, do you think the left has everything to do with """BIG GUBERMENT?"

I don't fucking get it if you want to abolish the state then you should have supported Ron Paul or Gary Johnson, if they get into office they do enough damage the whole fucking thing begins to crumble with mass lolz and instability.

They wouldn't abolish the state. They'd just make things worse for the workers.

for fucks sake

I'm sure Marx dealt with this bullshit back in his time as well. apart from accelerationist retards, the left has nearly always argued that welfare state reforms are a good thing, even if their very existence is subject to the will of the bourgeoisie.

hungrier, sicker, less educated workers are easier to divide and atomize. since ancaps are actually even more politically and economically illiterate than most Holla Forumsacks, you're unable to see anything past a simplistic state vs da peepul dichotomy.

And what, give rise to "Muh free margets" and more power to private companies and corporations?

Nah.

Not an argument

Yes. Wouldn't that be an interesting new system without the state being there? Wouldn't you at least want to see how that would work?

Ill give this faggy ancrap kid 3-4 posts until he starts with the pirvate court retardation

The state would be there, guaranteeing the rights that benefit one class.
No, I don't particularly want to see how that would work. The only benefit would be that it might bring back organised labor, but even that isn't guaranteed.

The natural motion of the welfare dialectic
This is not revolutionary, socialist activity, but a natural process that occurs within the system, which it is designed, now, to accommodate.

That is highly doubtful, for the same reason that even electing a socialist to the existing offices of bourgeois rule will change relatively little.
This is also a huge "if." Their low level of support indicates relatively few porkies are that "extreme" and would rather pay more for more security, just as they would have rather paid for less than Bernie suggested.

Really taxation is an "exploitation insurance" racket, basically

I'll tell you how it'd work, you'd have various monopolies being formed, you'd basically be a new feudal lord, with you OWNING people who will do your work for you and having the accumulation of most of their labour. Sure you pay them, but then again, how much? Considering that the minimum wage is not set, you could pay them either a small fortune or use them for cheap labour.

Considering that workers co-ops would do better than privately owned companies, what would be the point in happening a privately owned company. You'd then pretty much pay corporate espionage and sabotage them. You wouldn't be achieving anything, you'd just be competing for profit as opposed to helping the community and generating wealth to be placed into infastructure which could help communities.

You massive faggot thats what you think say is happening right now.

what the fuck is wrong with private courts? So muh bourgois state courts are different in principle than private courts fucking how? Once the state is abolished you cucks can make your own goddamn courts

yeah that would be owned by a collective of workers, not some fat porky.

And it would only be worse in an ANCAP society

Friendly reminder that humans are this fucking stupid, we will never ever achieve communism with retards like these

Why? Why would anyone sabotage your proletariat village you paranoid shizophrenic

Le mad ancuck is mad.

Because humans are fucking stupid?

wow great argument.

WEW LAD

Are you implying humans are civilized enough not to attack other tribes out of pure hatred and jealously?

who the fuck would be jealous of your poverty ridden shithole village?

I don't know, because you want slaves to sell to the Kentucky Fried caliphate?

Kek, btw you owe me 2 million because you are breathing my privatized air

Your lord boss would worry that our mutualist utopia would draw you voluntary indentured workers away from his land, obviously.

Because it would inevitably be in their economic interest to do so. See colonialism etc.
You can't expect absolutely everyone in society to adhere for ideological reasons to the NAP, even if it weren't self-contradictory, when their material interests diverge from it.
I mean, we see businesses pollute lakes and rivers and burn unclean fuel all the time, because private profit diverges from social need in those cases.

To be a capitalist is to interfere in product, labor, and resource markets and to suppress competition. It is in the rational economic interest of giant capitalists to form a state to more efficiently do this on their behalf. Ideology does not change this.
The ancap solution, as I understand it, is to simply not call this a "state."

No fam. I've breathed more of the air than you, so it's mixed with more of my labor. Pay up.

Note I'm using "capitalist" here to refer to the owners of capital, not its ideological supporters. I should've been clearer.

This is literally communism im going to get my private militia and court against you you will fegret this whn you afe in the helicopted

really great plan

Yes, because Catalonia, The Zapatistas, and the Ukranian free territory never happened.

Excpt for the fact that no one would like to return to such a shit system like capitalism

I'm sorry did trading and exchange for goods and services get abolished there? Besides they lasted for like 5 years and were states with organised militaries and a central authority

And you call us economically illiterate.

WRONG

Again, the Zapatistas are still alive and well today.

The state is a device of class rule, dude. It's not merely a neutral arbiter of conflicts, as I'm sure its very existence and activities testify to, for you as well.
If that was what it is, it would be far closer to the "minarchist" ideal. The only remaining questions, then, are over who is corrupting the system, how, and to what ends.
Invariably you have to answer that, at least in part, with "big business." What I'm trying to argue here is that "crony capitalism" is in every way a natural product of capitalism itself - private ownership of the means of production - because it is a fully natural way of pursuing the very same sets of economic interests. Drug cartels use violence to crush the free market for a reason, and that reason is it benefits them, and it benefits every firm to act similarly, so long as they can do it with a sufficiently low cost.
This is the origin of lobbying. It is simply more efficient than direct physical violence

OP here.

Jfc.

There are tons of problems between us and Holla Forumsacks problems that run so deep I could shoot you in the back of the head and lose no sleep over it.

However I would prefer that you just stop being such a spastic ducking retard and lurk this board for a while and ducking learn something for a change so this can be avoided.

It doesn't only happen in white countries dip shit. If you actually cared about the issue you would know that Tibet is having its native culture drowned out by a massive wave of Han Chinese that are encouraged to go there by the Chinese government to pacify the local population and destroy their culture so they can no longer resist and will never rebel. The ethnic displacement that you ducking idiots whine and cry about is literally actually happening right now in China and you are too busy smelling Hitler's farts to notice

I wish I could afford internet so I could quit using this piece of shit phone with autocorrect