No one here has read any feminist lit. No one here even understands basic feminist positions. Yet they still fall the 'SJW' meme, and the strawmen position of feminists that the children on Holla Forums and Holla Forums have constructed.
Google Kristi Winters.
Other urls found in this thread:
marxists.org
twitter.com
You probably haven't read any actual feminist lit either, OP. Kristi Winters is not a feminist author. READ.
You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, third-wave feminism is not synonymous with idpol or 'tumblr feminism'.
All you're doing is citing the origins of third-wave feminism, without a single critique of it.
Seriously, just watch Kristi Winters debate Sargon of Akkad if you want to see how retarded anti 'third-waves' are.
And by the way, the YPJ are 100% supportive of feminists in the west, and are by definition also third-wave feminists.
I think I'll pass
I said nothing about the YPJ, tumblr, idpol or third wave feminism. For the love of any god that hopefully strikes the urge to read into your noggin, READ THE FUCKING BOOKS. That is all I said and will say to you.
She's literally an academic feminist, who retarded channers claim to hate, and love to construct strawman positions of.
Also, as I said the YPJ are fully supportive of feminism in the west. Does that make them 'SJWS'?
Its about criticising the actually existing movement and not their theory.
Where in that post is any statement made about third-wave feminism? You're just sperging out about shit no one has actually said.
You obviously haven't read them lol, there's nothing in there that refutes any modern day feminist theory. Nothing, it's merely a precursor before the data we have now is available.
yeah, and some teenage girls on tumblr don't represent the feminist movement. Just like that 'queer socialist' guy Holla Forums loves to post doesn't represent all socialists.
So what is third-wave feminism?
Source?
Pretty telling that you don't back up any of your statements. Libfem shitposting needs to be removed. You know where the sage goes.
I read the vindication of the rights of women and it was pretty good. That said, 90% of modern feminism is a basketcase
What statements? I'm genuinely doubting whether you have read the books you posted or not, what makes them so superior to modern feminist theory?
You're coming here and evangelising. You tell us which important issues third-wave feminism tackles.
shameful tbh fam
I fully support whatever cause I know it won't hurt me but will probably be useful at some point.
third wave is just saying second wave is just white bougie feminism and doesn't actually help everyone equally
most of the shit people hate about "third wave" (TERFs, Lena Dunham types, etc) is actually second wave bullshittery that hasn't died out when it was supposed to.
So… have you read them or not? First you imply you have and then show that you actually haven't. Just read the books, libshit.
Clearly fucking neither of you have I have never seen a more obvious fronting contest in my life like damn fags.
Damn this is one spergy thread
Wrong. If it was spergy people would be lost in their ideas and explaining them in detail.
Yes, what do you thinks in them?
I've read origins of the family and Emma Goldman, I don't understand what you think they contain? What's 'non-tumblr' about them? I genuinely don't understand
Thanks for the thread OP, I totally agree. People here are more accepting of nazibols than they are of feminists.
good point, can't even have that silver lining
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Lenin hat posters you're really hurting what I think of Leninists.
Say no to sectarianism
Just look at all those men, sitting there, ready to make war, but forcing themselves to bear the stupid cunt talking to herself. Why do they do it? Because the first one who stands out against it will be beaten and killed by the men around him. They create their own cage. Feminism is the final nail in the coffin of a society. Once it has set in, there is no going back until times get bad enough to set things to their natural order.
Yeah, I'm sure you fucking don't. How about you actually read to find out or quit your fucking shitposting. You don't belong here, libshit.
Not an argument. Explain why we need feminism when socialism is already about full equality. Protip: You can't.
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Sure I have:
marxists.org
Great place to start
That's like saying it's sectarianism to not support any other "turd positionist", you're all a shitty attempt at subversion, or memers who don't have the self awareness to realize you're facilitating a shitty attempt at subversion.
Why are you so eager, so excited, to absolutely already decided to refuse something every currently even slightly successful leftist group supports? Is it because this is Holla Forums and you think it means "censoring your vidya"?
I don't read any reactionary lit user
lol what do you even think feminism is
Hey Holla Forums, how is it going?
How I fucking wish that were true.
Why do you resist making an argument?
If you say so, you could fucking enlighten us, we are occupied with reading fucking leftist economics.
Um… Link? Not gonna google it for the sake of some who started with calling us retards.
Conclusion:
You are an asshole AND you expect us to revise our position without easing out work to be done. Multiple choice: fuck off, be more polite, give links.
Back at ya, you paranoid shitter.
If it doesn't mean equality, then I am not interested, and if it does, then I say I already have socialism. Feminism is unecessary.
anti-feminism is just as much idpol as feminism though.
summon cigarposter
Have you been reading Glubb, fam?
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No, I asked for you to tell me why I should be a feminist. You refused. You are simply trying to shame people into your ideology. It doesn't work becuse you have nothing to offer.
It's like the fucking basics of XXI century.
I guess you think deeply triggering and problematic nationalism is also idpol, you stupid faggot.
Um, I'm not antifem( that's Holla Forums ), it's just that OP is a fag.
KEEP YOUR IDPOL OF MY Holla Forums
KEEP YOUR IDPOL OF MY Holla Forums
KEEP YOUR IDPOL OF MY Holla Forums
KEEP YOUR IDPOL OF MY Holla Forums
I consider it an achievement to read Judith Butler and somehow come out as a (modern) feminist.
PFFFFFF get a load of this guy
Enjoying your first year at uni?
WHAT A SHAME
H
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This
Also, do NOT bump this libfemshit thread, kill it already
Yes but
This is what your brain is for, you can synthesize Butler and marxist class analysis.
it is, faggot.
Can someone recommend books on radical feminism?
Oh, that wasn't me. Maybe I should use a flag.
I am definitely a Feminist. But any person that considers themselves a "feminist" but doesn't think we need to abandon capitalism is shooting themselves in the foot, and no ally of mine
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It is you cockmongler.
Or just skip reactionary feminism entirely and keep revolutionary feminism revolutionary.
Do not validate reactionary and divisive authors for a second. See this.
This.
This.
I don't know how many times we repeated that and still only leftypol understands.
christ you're such a fucking idiot
kill urself
How is Butler reactionary?
I dont call myself a feminist because feminism is a board ideology that covers much of shit I disagree with. Equal rights for all humans is inherently part of socialism, so I see no reason to call myself something that is filled to the brim with inverted nazis and retards.
It's so obvious he hasn't read any of it it's actually painful lol.
It's like when right-wingers say "marxism only works in theory because the state running everything is a bad idea!"
sounds good to people who haven't read Marx, while people who actually have are cringing.
Didn't mean it was you, just meant it's not unreasonable to make the statement I did considering all the
shitposting.
Absolutely true man, but I make the distinction to express solidarity with people experiencing oppression.
I hate modern SJWs because in many ways they are not all that different from the alt-right. Identitarian, I've even heard SJWs making the same arguments as Holla Forumsyps but in reverse, like arguing for ethno-states.
But I call myself a feminist because I get the impression the majority of feminists don't know what socialism is, and that equality is inherent in it. Its a way to show solidarity, even if I don't consider myself part of the modern SJW strain of identitarian bullshit.
I skimmed through the shitposts you mentioned. You are right. I did my first post because I was angered by how arrogant OP was.
She is nothing but pure idpol, no class analysis, nothing revolutionary. Just divisive and reactionary libshit. Idpol is a dichotomy of reaction between liberal and conservative idpol, of which Butler represents the liberal side and where people for example Paul Elam and other MRAs, right-wing populists, nationalists and conservatives like Le Pen, Brexiters and Trumples are on the opposite side of idpol.
The interaction between both sides is an endless game of reactionary ping pong with polar opposite labels and social groups which need empowering. Neither side has class analysis or furthers the workers' struggle or class conflict, just the integration of various groups into capitalism through their identity and association to their respective social groups.
That is why idpol and through it, Butler, McKinnon and 'radical' feminism is reactionary and just the polar opposite of Morons' Rights Activists and Morons Going Their Own Way, poopulists, "muh white race" and other assorted shits. Now, be a dear and do as I say i.e. read, lurk more or run off back to Reddit.
I recall I told you to read, libshit.
do you know what Butler wrote about?
As someone who has been to the third world quite a few times I still can't really comprehend how the lukewarm patriarchy in the west has become the #1 existential issue for feminism.
Anyway Hitler was probably the greatest feminist in history so we should all really just follow his example.
Nothing is stopping women but their own limitations.
Men can't give birth. What do we get in exchange for that? Muscles, the ability to think systematically and cooperate as hunters (problem solvers.)
Shocking, I know.
Femenism as a meme in society does not give a shit about what authors you think are "real" femenism.
They pass around and circlejerk over ideas and pat each other on the back regardless of whether you would call them "real femenism" or not.
And that body of ideas is so filled with fucking idpol and other poison the meme is worthless now.
people literally say the same thing about communism because they don't understand it lol
someone /r/ing the 4pol Israeli post instructing them how to ruin Holla Forums
I'll take "underage sex tourism" for 500, Alex.
I'm just saying its fucking deluding yourself to pretend that retarded tumblrites 'dont represent the femenist movement'
They do. SJW's toxic shit is like three fourths of what the majority of people who call themselves 'femenists' circulate around and congratulate each other over. Even the ones who are just normal people going with liberalism because its the order of the day, they'll support and buy into it because its labeled with their -ism unless its cartoonishly terrible at its face even to them.
I know it was worth something once, even if there were toxic shits here and there, but femenism is unsalvagable at this point. Anita Sarkeesian is femenism now, not whoever you like
benis.
kek
A lot of people here think feminism is just about "women's rights" or "equality."
Like all revolutionary theories, the struggle is to abolish the circumstances that make the struggle necessary in the first place. The whole point of class conflict is to eliminate the necessity and existence of "class," and likewise the struggle of feminism is to eliminate the necessity and existence of "women."
I didn't say anything about SJWs, fagbag. I'm just not interested in anything involving Sargon of Cukkad.
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nah I'm a project manager so I deal with other cultures somewhat frequently. besides prostitution is degenerate and is a sign of a sick society
Then go form a functional woman-only society. No man cares.
But, it won't happen, because women are incapable. They'll follow men to the ends of the Earth like parasites.
Lol bruh all that lead seems to be getting to your head, but I know you are trying and that's what counts in a capitalist society, isn't it?
Go form a man-only society then. No judgement, I hope one day you will stop being ashamed and embrace your homosexuality.
So what do they do besides get fucked and perform an automatic biological activity like livestock?
We did. You followed us here.
Give me concrete examples of how you have contributed to society.
Also, give me proof that I have not contributed anything, if that's what you mean by "you followed us here"
Sweetie, when people discuss things, it's presumed that all parties have a certain baseline level of experience and can agree upon certain obvious facts.
For example, if I were to present to you a red apple, you would say "prove to me the apple is red." Sadly, now there are no grounds for discussion as you cannot contribute anything but silly demands.
Come on, fam. You know this isn't true.
Marie Curie discovered radioactivity.
Jennifer Doudna discovered CRISPR
Rosalind Franklin was a huge contributor to solving the shape of DNA
Jane Goodall has done pioneering work in human evolution
I mean I can keep going but some big examples to show you, you are full of shit
that's not an argument that's a logical ad hominem fallacy
an fallacy it is
Wow. How many of them had giant support staffs of men who let them have the limelight because they were bullied into it by the PC police? (Answer: All of them.)
The best woman is only a mediocre man, and the onus is always on men to bend over backwards to pretend otherwise. Women can fuck off as far as I'm concerned.
By the by, how many millions of male poets better than Sappho died in obscurity? These mediocre women are remarkable just because they aren't totally worthless. I.E., they're freaks.
don't go full retard man. Seriously no more lead for you. But on a serious note, the same could be said for every male scientist. Fuck, my fiancee is a hardcore biochemist. What do you do with your life besides shitpost on the internet?
Goalposts moved. Bored now.
Marie Curie had a husband, Pierre, that collaborated with her in all her work. Do you ever hear about him? NO! Because it doesn't fit the "strong womyn" narrative.
Same with Grace Hopper who "lead" a huge team of male engineers to make a programming language because programming was too hard.
It's the case with all these female geniuses. They fall apart under scrutiny and had a huge male infrastructure supporting them.
the same could be said of society and the individual, for what feat can the long individual do without the aid of society and it's infrastructure? no, if that is your criteria, then we would be left with no notable people in history to begin with
Try late-20s and 30-something women with problem glasses.
Kill yourself immediately, Redditor. Teenage girls on Tumblr are more mature than you.
It's like that with literally every scientist. Look at the Mandelkow's, they are a husband and wife team that discovered one of the major drivers of Alzheimer's diseases. The husband gets more of the credit, event thought they both contribute equally.
So its pretty obvious you actually have no idea what you are talking about.
Papers published by a male Primary Investigator often have females who did the actual fucking research, also listed as authors. But the PI gets the credit. So literally any paper published by a male scientist with female authors listed could fit the exact same paradigm you are painting. Which goes to show that as you dismiss these, facts, you do nothing but move goalposts
remember to report reactionaries and other Holla Forumscucks via the little arrow beside each post
The point is that females have certain, ah, deficiencies that are unpleasant to recognize and discuss.
For example, why can't women work in teams?
When was the last time–or any time, ever–you heard of a group of woman–STRICTLY women–getting together and accomplishing a difficult and complicated task? They can't do it.
Every institution that females have infiltrated was once run successfully as a strictly-male institution. Furthermore, strictly-male institutions are effectively banned today. Because strictly-female institutions don't work.
If you, objectively, examine the achievements of males next to females, there's no comparison.
I don't expect to convince you because you've been indoctrinated, but the facts are all there even though the obvious conclusions they point to are thoroughly suppressed.
Dude virtual every major technological advancement has the result of a group effort supporting the "head honcho." Richard Feynman didn't build the bomb alone. Even Isaac Newton said, "If I have seen further, it is by standing on the shoulders of giants."
If you're going to undercut women in science because they had support you'll need to do the same for men.
The YPJ successfully coordinate hunting in groups.
Feminism of the past
Today's Feminism
I don't need to read that shit since I already believe in total equality between the sexes.
Virtually*
No I don't, because there's no intellectual institutional tradition for women, and those "great men" were supported by… men. The point is that goal-directed systems thinking and teamwork are male traits.
If they aren't, then the women should have made "separate but equal" institutions by now. But they can't do it. They always follow us and bash their way in with entryism, because they can't self-organize into goal-directed hierarchies.
Anyway, this is all wishful thinking trumping reality. I could present facts all day and they would be rejected as simply not possible because we are a priori and axiomatically all equal and everything is great.
Source?
You don't think that has anything to do with socio-economic factors? I'm not claiming that is 100% the reason, but you can't deny that has nothing to do with it. Women couldn't vote a little over 100 years ago, as an example.
Do you actually know any women in real life? Like I said my fiancee is a hardcore biochemist and I work in a team with her. I'm actually the only male in my research lab. Shit's pretty productive IMO.
No, I just have real world experience that is completely different from yours. But of course, any dissenting opinion from yours is "muh liberal brainwashing!!!" Protrip: I'm not a liberal
Reality. They don't exist. Try to find one. With all the "rah rah" girl power feminism, you'd think you'd see dozens of strictly-female enterprises. People would cheer for them. But they're absent. I don't know of any.
Well, take the personal computer revolution for example. For the past 30 years, anyone could have walked into a computer store, bought a computer, learned to program, and sold software.
It was equal opportunity technology. But–whether due to ability or inclination–next to no women took that opportunity, whereas dozens of sweaty males spent thousands of hours in their basements and built Linux and Doom, etc.
Yes. I never see them in teams cooperating to build anything. Period. I'm convinced they can't do it. There's always men involved.
I'm certain that if you're observant, you'll see what I'm talking about.
We're sexually dimorphic animals with different brains. Men have about 7 times the grey matter of women. We have a much higher incidence of autism, etc.
I'd be happy if I was wrong–because women could just build their own institutions and leave male institutions alone–but I'm pretty sure I'm not. Male institutions are doomed to be harassed and infiltrated by women because women can't build them.
can we ignore the pole, guys?
Don't worry, I'll leave you to your torture chamber. Toodle-oo.
are you purposely working yourself up or are you really that stupid you couldn't take a joke?
The aggressive pedo-apologetic is the cherry on top.