Lack of self-awareness

On both Holla Forums and Holla Forums I see signs of the same way of thinking you hate, that tribalistic and undying hate for "them" that results in closing up the dialogue. That open unwillingness to even try and understand the other side, and bring them about. That feeling that "it's not worth it, they can't reason"
I confess I don't know anything about Reddit, but I get the same vibe
I really want to think these are just loud minorities, but I find that hard to believe

I am not advocating radical centrism here, much less holding hands. But I want at least to see SOMEONE acknwoledge this is a thing
I don't understand why there it's so hard to come across with self-awareness about it. When someone points out how torture chambery or echo chambery a place is, they are more often than not outsiders, and they get subsequently shitposted and meme arrowed to death

Does someone here agree with me?
This should be address, and I look forward to see who will sustain the most insightful analysis on the matter

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The entire concept of dialogue is predicated on a standard set of objective facts common to both parties. When one of the parties rejects facts, you can't have meaningful dialogue with them.

You mean Jewish trade cartels?

Hella no. Holla Forumsyps people should be talked to only in real life. Here, it's just waste of time. There are no facts we can agree on with them.

We need to post more catgirls.
Post catgirls. I'll start.>>1276428

"this place is an echo chamber" usually means "why can't I shitpost"

senpain, I think a just system of governance qualifies as a common objective, albeit not an immediate one

I do get that, but in the spirit of this thread, can't you see they think exactly the same of you?
Doesn't that bother you in the back of you mind at least just a bit? That you might be utterly wrong about many of your core beliefs?

I'd remove the "only" though

do please, I have none

It does happen, but come on, at least say "I'm tired of engaging only to realise I've been rused" instead of "there is no reason to engage if a small porcentage is bait"

I hear ya, OP. This has been a trait of humans since our inception; it's only become worse now that we have the internet. It's a self-fulfilling cycle of people who define themselves by an identity refining it into its most fringe form, and people who want to be part of a group subscribing to that identity. The need to be accepted by our peers takes over reason, and anyone who isn't in with the in is then damned by them. At that point what you have left is a cesspool feeding off of its own garbage.
Board division was a mistake. Sanctioning ourselves away from other ideas has stunted all creative and insightful discussion. I'd rather be surrounded by people who don't agree with anyone else other than themselves than people with the same ideology as myself. This place is just as incestuous as Holla Forums sometimes.

Except their supposed "facts" are demonstrably false. You can argue that there are problems with communism, such as information and other things that are more technical, but the average Holla Forumsfag is still crying about his toothbrush. So no, it doesn't bother me that a tinfoil hat-wearing retard thinks I won't listen to facts, because what he believes is demonstrably false. Holla Forums has never had multiple threads with hundreds of replies talking about how modern physics is wrong because da joos. Think about that and then realize that we are not on the same level.

Nowadays you have to go out of your way to immerse yourself in other sides and I try my best to do so. The ease of the internet has made it easy to become more insular and secluded from each other until it's only people of incredibly like minded opinions talking to each other.

I visit Holla Forums & /reddit/ to try and understand their thoughts and I think many people should do that.

While here can be as bad as those a lot of the time I think the one advantage this place has is that the far left has always argued within itself due to the varying ideologies.

It's really hard to find any leftist in my country. Most of them aren't even socdem… I'm glad that this board is separate and we have a lesser amount of right-wing people here. I hate that I have to argue them all the time on basic facts. (like jews)

nah, it was impossible to discuss so much stuff on Holla Forums. Also, they ban you on 8pol

pic related

They are retarded kids with no theory in my country

Except we had to leave because of 8/pol/ moderation banning all things that didn't support their pre-conceived ideas. You cannot try to post leftist stuff on Holla Forums. We didn't do the division, they did. Notice that they still are allowed to post here. Nice try, Holla Forums.

This. They are so numerous compared to us that they could shitpost us to oblivion if they wanted.

kill yourself

Maybe one day friend.

If you think Nazis can be reasoned with, then you go ahead and try it, because I think everyone here has tried it and realised how pointless it is.

They tried that, numerous times. Turns out bunkers are stronger than Holla Forums.

Liberals need to leave.


sorry for alleging that the guys who worship hitler and meme about ethnic cleansing are nazis

That was very insensitive of you.

I know about the places we can fall back to. :)
But a cross-chan Holla Forums rally would mean certain death to us and to all our bunkers. That's what I mean by "if they wanted". Nowadays their shitposting can be considered some stray Holla Forumsack's autistic screeching.

Holla Forumsyps are, at least, fascistoid people. Some are outright nazis. All of them are nationalists, and we are internationalists here.

Most of their "facts" are spooks forged by porkies or misinterpreted data.

My point is about non-nazis. Some of you are dead certain a Trump voter is worthless to address because "he cannot think"

As a practical matter, revolution does not permit us to merely command a narrow majority of the population; oligarchic resistance will be sufficient to peel off wavering proles and obstruct change. What we need is the overwhelming majority of the workers, including a great many who presently hold ideas contrary to socialism.

Nonetheless, nazis and liberals are obnoxious, and when they come here to advocate counter-revolution, telling them to go back to Holla Forums or tumblr or wherever is really just a way to say "fuck off".

It's better, of course, to make them doubt their nazi or liberal convictions, and I don't like saying things like gb2/pol/ because it offers little in the way of substantive objection. Nonetheless, I'm human, and they get on my nerves.

Some of us are unrepentant redditors trying to colonise the board, but I am not one of them.

I don't think Holla Forums could handle a sustained attack here, the biggest effect they have is at the beginning and then people drift off, or try to infiltrate deeper and actually become a communist. 4chan is not allowed to raid us, so our only effective rival is 8pol, who don't even particularly want to shit this place up too much because if they keep their hyperbole and rhetoric in check they have more freedom of speech here.

well you brought up Holla Forums in the OP

It's worth a try with Trump voters sure, but it is pretty hard to convert anyone especially someone who is spooked as fuck.

And how do you wish to find the non-nazis in that heap of shit called Holla Forums?
Needle in the haystack. You can only differentiate them in real life, when you can find a place where you can communicate without others interfering (shitposting).

If Holla Forums people hit the right tone here, they are welcome.

yeah, the most solid critisms of communism I've seen were from Holla Forums

or maybe I'm a shill. Am I shill? Am I?
idk anymore

That's true. Perhaps I wasn't clear when I said "Sanctioning ourselves"; I meant people in general, not Holla Forums. But you're right, and it's unfortunate that it happened.

That's how you grow as a debater.

Sorry i dont buy into "do the good thing so you can feel better and right because you avoided violence which is ultra evil".(Violence with purpose, not emotional satisfaction)

Holla Forumstards cannot be saved expect minor exception, they are too far gone, most have already cemented their already close minded world view meaning it ll take years of psychotherapy to remove their autistic beliefs because that is what holds them alive as a person, without that they are nothing, and humans have a thing called denial to protect them from collapsing.

So there is little dialogue to be made, the left is more diverse when it comes to opinions and more flexible, that is why you ll find more opinions and different people here unlike Holla Forums where discussion is barely viable unless you are a nazi autists supporting each others' delusions mutually.

Trump voters cannot think, Trump is a dangerous choice even as a protest vote, the rest are just complete morons who are so stupid they literally believe a rich capitalistic CEO cares for them and wants to make their lives better.

Which is something that if you believe, you are too far gone to be saved


I don't think I'll be a better debater if I say the the "protocols of the elders of zion" was fake and the other says it wasn't. It's something like an axiom in math. If you grab different axioms, you construct another world. These worlds are mutually exclusive. Only measurements, experiments can decide which is better. If people just wave off these facts/axioms, there's no point in debating.

Guys, I hate this "post-truth" world.

Keep making pretend it doesn't always boil down to my gang vs your gang you high falluting fucks, and it always come back to people aligning with people who look most similar to them.

You'd be surprised how many of us mighty whities truly believed in inclusiveness and multiculturalism as children before we realized brown people see white people as nothing more than naive targets.

So in other words it all boils down to your feelings only when it doesn't.


People on the internet are high off their own solipsism and individuality. Nothing new to see here.


One step forward two steps back

Oh cmon i was being funnyu, even a furfag can see how dumb nazbol is which says a lot

if leftypol was a major chan board with millions of posts, then there would be all sorts of colorful threads

well put
fundamentally different understanding of economics + scientific racism = always talking past each other

no conversations between Holla Forums and Holla Forums could possibly be productive unless it is attempting to find and address these differing axioms


I see it here a lot. With Holla Forums it is true. Reasoning with them is time wasted, since they do not operate on reason. However I believe reasoning with liberals can be useful, as long as you catch the right liberal. Target proles specifically. Black movements in particular always had tons of socialist potential and even today in BLM there are dozens of socialist activists.

if you're uncomfortable with hate you don't belong on the internet at all

Or liberals who are more open minded and accept the evils of corporation and governments but support capitalism because they never thought of anything better and are against fascism and closes minded hateful idiots

If you're uncomfortable with being hated you should be uncomfortable with hate

I see now that I came off too much as "if you don't listen to your enemies, they win"

Let me explain the source of my concerns:
Since Trump was elected idpols have been having unproductive fits on the streets instead of organizing and attempting to understand what happened. Their closed minded mentality is what made it impossible to realise that:
A - Trump was acutally winning the race
B - The media WAS constatnly lying about lots of things
C - They think that most Trump voters are actual neo-nazis and that Trump is literally a fascist (I hope you agree on this; no matter how much of a danger you regard Trump in economic/environmental/immigration policies, he does not want to gulag the gays, enslave the niggers, and he's doing a terrible job at being a kike-hatter)

Then, on the HWNDU matter, I had endless discussions with Holla Forumsyps about why the fuck they kept memeing instead of using the 24/7 stream to expose the neocon war machine. Their main response was "you can't reason with leftists, leftists don't reason". The irony is not even funny.

But then I saw /lef/tists having the same reaction: You cannot argue with Trump supporters, they are too much of a cult to give a fuck about the environment, corporatism, and the oppression of the worker class

The same goes with my friends, who I cannot talk about local politics because they each defend their different parties wholeheartedly, deadly convinced anyone who thinks differently is a piece of shit.
I'm tired of my retard friends insulting my other retard friends because they made political decisions they don't agree with

It's just tiring, how everybody is always right

In that line of thought, I rue the day when I learned what a PSYOP is


im unaffected by the hate of others

my hatred is metaphysical and directed against the nature of the way we socialize right now as a species. im fully prepared to be called everything by everyone because nothing they can say incapsulates the fate i wish for global capitalism (hint: baptism by fire)

Wow congratulations on being on the internet for a while

If I weren't I wouldn't have made this thread in multiple boards and get heat from all sides

8pol deleted my thread and banned me for "blogposting", if you care to know

Tip responsibly, you might injure your neck
I agree though

How do you feel about Holla Forums being the one that allows it?

Pretty good, but I already expected these results, including Holla Forums being more insightful.
endchan/pol was the great surprise, though; It was as if they understood exactly what I meant needing no clarifications, and immediately went on to make quality posts discussing (almost repentingly) about the group think. It was self-awareness heaven. I guess you cannot be in the single most paranoid board on the internet and not end up asking yourself if your own mind isn't PSYOPing itself into firmly believing stuff.
Also very surprising was the eerily lack of calling me a concern trolling kike shill doing a PSYOP for the CIA that gives off that unmistakable endchan charm.

I've been spending ever more time here this last year. I only want to go on Holla Forums to check happenings, but I end up spending 30/20/10/40 between 4pol, 8pol, endpol, 8left
I'm actually thinking of picking up thick books instead of scrapping short reads from the internet

People really don't like to have their views challenged. It makes them uncomfortable. It's easier to retreat into an echo chamber of easy solutions and "us vs them" than consider that the world is a big complicated mess with no easy solutions. It's the same reason conspiracy theories are appealing because they at least provide some order to the chaos. It's comforting to think that at least someone is in charge, even if they're you're enemy

It could be the Reddit and 4chan users we've been getting.


Ok is a spuk ignore him.

He had a nazi flag fam.


Snowflakes are snowflakes no matter what color you paints it with.

Snowflakes in jackboot is still snowflakes.

It's fucked up world filled with fucked up people who repeatedly fail(or refuse) to realize their ideas and methodologies are major contributing factor of problems.

To mitigate this segregation people need to interact with real people not 'scotsman' and 'straw man' that exist only inside of their mind.

But we cannot 'force' conversation when two parties GENUINELY despise each other either. And our tribal instinct and hormone system enjoys emotional responses.

Easy way out would be planetary annihilation of any species that developed nerve system more complex than boolean logic gate.

nigger, more debate goes on between the right and left here than literally anywhere else on the internet


Practically every far-Left organisation gets mired in endless splitting and factionalism over either personal disputes or minor doctrinal differences.

Climate change will see to that fam. Would like to see some more coops first tho.

So what you're saying is…the left has diverse opinions.

No, what I'm saying is the Left has "diverse opinions" shortly before everyone that disagrees with whoever is in charge gets kicked out or forms an alternative party

Don't see anything interesting being said still.


Having opinions is inherently reactionary.

Whenever I think about this, I think of all the ideology of the far right; the racism, reliance on hierarchy, inability/unwillingness to try cooperation and uphold individuality at all costs, the un-ironic defense of religion, corporatism, etc and the absolute void of thought about alternate systems and paradigms and I realize that no, this is not akin to that horseshit horseshoe theory where my ideals are the whacky inverse of theirs (like we're autistic neo-atheists debating orthodox religious people,) they're just reactionary (meaning they hold onto the idea of returning to some prior golden age, falling back onto the less progressive social and economic models of yesteryear) and unwilling to advocate pushing the species into the future.

basically this

lol they'll ban you off of 4/pol/ too. There is nowhere you discuss these things with the alt right without them calling you a shill or crying about anuddah shoah.

I'm fine with basic redditors. The ones that are representative of the worst parts of that site - i.e the mods - can go kill themselves though. They are reactionaries and probably cointel (t. Leftist)
As for Holla Forums, the ones who recognise something is wrong with the world and are desperately trying to figure things out are always welcome to discuss things here. The ones who have had minimal disadvantages in their lives aside from being autists who can't laid and therefore blames Jews for making white women want to fuck blacks - can also, go fuck themselves. Grow the fuck up or stop disguising your personal insecurities with """politics"""

That is done for the revolution ;^)

Now it is in the pre revolution stage

Honestly? I did understand their side for a while. I was actually a part of their side for at least a year.

I realized that, as I talked with them, they have really simplistic political solutions that have been tried and failed horribly in history. And I don't just mean failed in the same sense as "communism didn't work out for the USSR" (which was a whole other complex issue), I mean failed outright and were bad from the beginning with no scholarly merit behind what they believed.

I realized that their worldviews were very limited and they were seeing solutions to problems that also didn't even exist (i.e. Cultural Marxism, anuddah shoah.)

I'm more than welcome to them come and explain their positions and a dialogue if they agree to one. It's when they come in here and actively sabotage us while being really bad at hiding how obvious they are that makes me believe less that they actually want a real dialogue.

Against who? Us against reddit? Maybe a bit, but it's slightly open.

Against Holla Forums? Half the times they're not even serious fucking arguments. They show a picture of someone black doing something stupid and then say "LOL Lefties want us to all believe whites are this stupid! How wrong can you get?" Most of the time, when people ACTUALLY make serious discussion and argument, there's at least one or two people making a serious attempt to answer it. I also see a lot of shitposting around it, but I typically see at least one person making the attempt.

The only time I've seen someone trying to make serious discussion on Holla Forums with me was when I literally asked for far right philosophy and literature. I begged to be taught something of substance and even then people were calling me a "shill" and "board slider" and "obvious d&c troll". Sure, I did get a good number of serious responses, but the number of times people called me out for asking to see what they thought was good philosophy.

A note. I'm not saying that Holla Forums has no "us vs them" bannerwaving stupidity, but that a lot of it is defensively against sheer stupidity nobody should be expected to reply to, though maybe overdone at times, and there is usually some level of discussion when it's not sheer autism.

It's something that could be worked on but it's not the worst yet.

I will never understand this childlike thinking that one day everyone will get together and simply believe how we're all uniquely good and then we'll all go eat at mcdonalds and go to a sale at the gap. Political Correctness during the 90's and the whole third way shit was driving this. The end of the USSR. The increasingly lack of faith in anything besides corporations.

What's even the point of being alive when your greatest foundational belief in how good it feels to consume + (the hotfix added in the last few decade) regardless of your sexual preference, gender, race, a very small window of allowed liberal beliefs.

As someone who was on /n/ when it started and then /new/ and Holla Forums I have to say that while I view the far left as an enemy I have nothing but admiration for them ridding themselves of these weak willed faggy liberal beliefs. I mean commies/socialists w/e are going to find out real quick that race is real and it effects how good of a worker a nigger is going to be regardless of if they're given the same exact education and environment as a white but that's w/e at this point. At least they are willing to see that there is something disastrously wrong with our current world.

I'd probably be happier if I was a liberal. Voting either a neocon or a neoliberal and watching the culturally approved sitcoms and comic book movies. But I wouldn't feel like life held any meaning. Why would anyone want to create a world without meaning OP? I mean obviously besides the jews.

I've worked in a factory where almost half the workers were black and they were no worse than the whites working there.

even if that were true (it isn't) why the fuck would you even want intellectuals in every position?

and if the world is advanced enough that manual labour is no longer required, then we're definitely advanced enough to provide for everyone regardless and "work-ethic" won't be nearly as important

I grew up with niggers, went to school with niggers, worked with niggers, even played football with niggers. But I doubt anecdotal evidence is going to convince either of us so w/e.

I've been to the factories in SEA. It is very much still alive. If the need to work is ended in society I have no idea why niggers are going to act any different than they do now. For most of them their immediate needs are already being taken care of by the government. That being said if anyone has any literature on the effects of full automatization will have on communist ideas I'd enjoy reading it.

you live in a fantasy world

I've been in the projects. Attended birthday parties there. Talked to the family. Who is living in a fantasy world here?

You are. Your experience is nothing but a reactionary anecdote that you then project out onto disparate groups you've never met but don't like.

There's no reason to want a "dialogue" with Holla Forums.

The idea that if we all just had an open, honest dialogue, we'd all get in touch with each other's warm, human cores which would bring us closer together and reduce division and increase understanding is a dumb liberal humanist meme. This board has been under an almost constant Holla Forums raid since its inception. Guess what? The more "dialogue" we've had with Holla Forums the less I've come to respect them, and the more abhorrent and irredeemable I've found them. The truth is that some people can't be reached and there's no reason to want to.

Some posters here have reported being from Holla Forums and being win over to the left by trying to troll leftypol.

Some minority of the Holla Forumsyps who actually took interest in us first being won over doesn't inspire confidence.


Because ur a newfag to the chans. That shit don't fly here.

I used to visit /pol daily, just to read something that goes completely against my beliefs and ideas. you know, as a challenge. anyway, i quickly got tired of it, i still visit occasionally but it's like dumpster diving, 99% of the content is shit. Plus there is much much more hate over there.

however i see what you mean, there is indeed tribal thinking.
leftypol can not do dialogue with pol. all they can do is compete for the dankest memes.

That is because you dont do it for any other reason other than the "challenge" and upholding that "see the other side belief".

That is something used to make you feel better for yourself because you consider that is what a good rational person should do.

Anyone with a brain that spends some time on Holla Forums realizes most of their "Arguments" are based on emotion and self masturbation and spamming memes, there isnt some useful dialogue, that is extremely rare and it is mostly about mutually supporting each other's delusions

not exactly, it made me feel better because it challenged my worldview therefore i had to exercise my critical thinking in order to defend/improve it. so this "improvement" and exercise is what made me feel better.

that's what i said too. im not getting you, are we disagreeing?

why it's important to talk to fascists: