Why does Holla Forums reject the idea that gender, religion and race can and do have a huge effect on your social standing, everything from the education you get to the kind of jobs you can get?
Why does Holla Forums dismiss the legitimate oppression minorities face as "FUCK IDPOL" but is more than willing to engage and entertain their dimwitted opinions like "KILL ALL NIGGERS" and "MUH fun" as "real world concerns"?
I don't think Holla Forums rejects those ideas it's just that people don't want idpol being used to advance neoliberal policies and co
Who is saying this? I certainly believe what you say.
The difference is I believe that sexism, racism, ableism, etc. are endemic to the capitalist system. Capitalism NEEDS to opperss, it needs a "looser" class. You cannot resolve any of those problems whithin capitalism, all you do is having a Palliative effect on the symptoms.
In a socialist society these problems will not magically go away, but they will no longer be supported by the system, so with time and effort they can be resolved once and for all.
Social classes can be eliminated once we eliminate the material class that upholds them
Because oppression based on identity is part of the superstructure, which is shaped by the base, the forces of economic production.
Capitalism causes these problems, you liberal retards. Even if they weren't so utterly convoluted and difficult to approach as to be worth tackling indirectly (they are), it'd be pointless anyway because modifying the superstructure will only further legitimize and reinforce the base, causing social change to fade away, like an ass imprint on one of those memory foam mattresses.
We don't, we just care most about the intersection of oppression that effects the most people. This is class.
Class is the largest oppressed group. I accept that it sucks to be a poor black person more so than a poor white person on equal poverty levels, but the fact is they are both poor and both oppressed.
I don't deny feminism a good thing and that women should have all the same rights as men, but I also don't apologise for its every lunancy, like people who suggest there shouldn't be juries or that women should just believed when they a say they have been raped even without evidence.
Also, I disagree with it where it will actively uphold capitalism. Which is often.
Holla Forums does not say "KILL ALL NIGGERS"
Spooks. They shouldn't have, but they do, because Capitalism. (Also, religion should be abolished as a whole).
Wut? When did we do that?
Raid better, plebbit.
No, but I've seen posters that say "Fascists are better for our movement", "Donald Trump elected was good" and the general sentiment that liberals' feelings on minority oppression are not as legitimate as the white working class with Fascist leanings (Who are also Idpoled to hell)
That's wrong. Tribes had (have?) different roles for men and women (muh sexism) and they couldn't be farther from Capitalism. Assuming "ableism" means treating normal and people with problems different, that's also the case with tribes. Babies born with anomalies were/are either killed or left to die.
And I've seen NazBols saying they are our comrades or something. So?
… Better than Hillary. At least there is a chance for accelerationism now. It'd be equally shit with Hillary
The proletariat has no race, sex, gender, or country. Workers of the world unite.
Also, fascist leanings are a result of the capitalist crisis and the inability of socialists to pass their message. Also, liberals being idiots that think race is more important than class.
It has nothing to do with feelings, it has to do with pragmatism: finding a simpler and more realistic path to our goals. And honestly, liberals are much harder to recruit than fascists.
Mind you, we'd still be expecting fascists to give up their spooks.
They most likely where accelerationist who saw that the Fascists and Donald Trump themselves where terrible but their effect on the political landscape would be good for the far left
Well, we see that some of the idpolers often alienate the white working class (which isn't the oppressors of minorities that would be the capitalist system and the bourgeoisie) and we very much need them for the revolution and our movement, and also the LIBERAL focus on minority oppression completely misses class struggle which is the root of the problem.
can someone link this thread to r/soc , it would be great to at least somewhat kill the "brocialist" meme
They weren't systemic which is what I think that user really meant. If a tribe just decided to stop leaving deformed babies to die of exposure then babies would stop being left to die of exposure in a say that each individual in modern society deciding to stop insulting the handicapped isn't going to replace all stairs with wheelchair ramps.
Make a new acc and use it to be sacrificed.
Anyone who posts this will get banned.
Now, comparing tribes to modern society is a little disingenuos. Men and women had different jobs because it was necessary for the survival of the tribe.
Men were the one that had to fight because loosing 100 women in a battle meant having 100 less children the year after, while loosing 100 men did not diminish the growth potential of the tribe. Even matriarchal tribes had the men doing the fighting (mostly, there were of course a few women who participated)
again the survival of the tribe was the imperative. In a world where getting food is difficult and hard having peopel that cannot take care of themselves is a weight that few could survive.
Capitalism on the other hand is not fighting for the survival of the species. It is not fighting scarcity, it is ecnouraging it. So what we said about tribes does not apply to capitalism, which needs a group of exploitable people and it picked the ones that were historically weaker.
Don't post it in the form of "leftypol isn't so bad." Post it in the form of "for all the leftypol apologists that haven't been banned yet, look at what you're supporting."
But tell me if you're going to first so I can delete this posf
The only people here I've seen reject any of the things you claim are like… actual Nazis and Nazbols here. I say "fuck idpol" because I'm a white male, and I think its both alienating and counterproductive to endlessly be at each other's throats over historical atrocities, but idpol lovers will never live this stuff down. The people who embrace idpol the most have become more obsessed with equating the "white liberal oppressor" as being just as bad as the KKK or some shit, which has never made sense to me. Its like they don't want white comrades at all and are a living example of the book "Settlers." If they say anything bad about black people, and don't join in on endless bashing of working class whites, they're not in the special idpol club. The entire culture surrounding it is cancerous and I want nothing to do with it. I want to be in a group that is positive and focuses on commonalities, not one that bickers about how white people are inherently racist and we have no hopes of overcoming that.
Oh so now discourse should be a free marketplace of ideas? Take a hike, you liberal sack of shit. It's because you fuckwits have totally wrecked the online discourse, and proven yourselves totally incompetent, and inconsistent at your foundations to the point of being functionally insane and unironic puppets of global capital and the state. We gave you a chance and you still are delusional, so we are now memeing you to rectify this situation. It's called the Overton Window. If you don't understand, you probably can't understand, too bad, deal with it.
I already tried and all post from new accounts are automatically deleted we need someone with an already established acc (I called the post typical Holla Forums ableism and brocialism)
I've never seen that. Ever. And even if it were true, why the hell would you take a comment like that seriously? That's pure fucking bait if I've seen it lmao
There's a degree to which social status can take on a life of its own. I don't think anyone rejected this outright. I reject prioritizing these issues over class issues. Take for example the woman CEO's meme. The problem is framed as being rooted in the fact that the CEO's are men, and not the fact that there are CEO's. Focusing on "black people" instead of "poor black people" encourages class collaboration. Idpol is distinctly liberal phenomena. It has its roots in the American Liberalism movement.
Personally? I don't reject those ideas at all. It is very obvious gender, religion, race and sexuality affect social standing. It's just that the proletariat is immediately forgotten by those who focus primarily on all those things because most social justice ideals are uncontroversial and even useful for neoliberal political elite. Helping the working class becomes a secondary and, more often than not, not even an objective at all when Hollywood starts finally giving you your female-led star wars movie.
And I'm not saying they should stop enjoying these things and freedoms that the political elite bothers to give them, it's more the issue that this was apparently their only objective because the fight is apparently over when piggy knocks some table scraps off the table for them to eat. Almost all big socialist movements are dead now and all the neoliberals had to do was cater to identity politics, but thank God they didn't have to stop getting lobbied by big corporations to finally get the support of non-whites, lgbt, and women!
They are oppressed by being automatically chosen over me when applying for work or education to fill a quota, regardless of who's more qualified for the job. So oppressed.
Let's focus on everybody's problems but mine.
We don't and you're fucking retarded, assdamaged reddit hotpocket.
Yeah and people behave counterproductively every day, including yourself. To ask people who are being murdered to this day because of institutional racism to just drop it because it's not helpful to the revolution is hilarious.
Are you going to suck a cop's dick who's harassing you because it's conducive to your participation in a revolution?
Identity politics is bullshit, but dismissing people's anger at unbelievable problems we as white males don't have to deal with is more counterproductive than anything else I can imagine.
Lmfao what kind of statistics do you have that prove how common that is? Do you have statistics for all of the times black people have been passed over for less competent white people before that shit? You're looking at it like a fucking simpleton.
I don't.
I don't. I only oppose movements that postulate that there is such oppression when there is little or none. This is what third-wave feminism does.
You people are going to either be left behind or contribute to the failure of any attempt to bring about socialism.
If you don't think there's oppression there, why the fuck would you care so much about it? You're alienating people for no fucking reason.
Also you're fucking insane if you don't think women are oppressed. Do you honestly believe women are never passed over by less qualified and competent men? Have you ever spoken with other men? The disdain for women as second class is fucking painfully obvious, and that extends all the way up the hierarchy of power.
But keep crying about something that doesn't even affect you.
I got linked here from the Richard Wolff video and I could only stand about 2 minutes of you people. You don't have to be a PC little bitch to not be a fucking idiot. You're like the neckbeards of socialism.
...
Except one person is claiming it's because of genetics and the other is claiming it's because of the actions of powerful scumbags. But I'm sure you don't care about things like that. Enjoy your little nazi gathering here you fucking weirdos
leftypol in chains of ideology thread
Get your nationalist poison out of here. Revolutions depend on solidarity of the whole proletariat.
And both accept that it's a meaningful category and that politics should rest around it, back bourgies as long as they're "racially aware", and are antithetical to class struggle.
I don't like black nazis any more than white nazis.
...
not really, most people who subscribe to liberal muh privilege politics offer no real criticism of class and capitalism. you should read this: isj.org.uk
Riiiiight.
No they fucking don't. Where do people who recognize the blatant racism of our system demand that our entire POLITICAL system revolve around that? Or are you claiming that's irrelevant to politics? In either case you're fucking dumb.
Antithetical to class struggle? They're the most fucked class in the history of the US. Awww poor wittle white video game, anime waifu loving neckbeards being so much more oppressed than all THOSE BLACKS :(
ROFL "socialists" denying muh privilege exists. You people aren't radicals, you're fucking retards.
I love how you guys are calling me a liberal for not agreeing with your fucking insane bullshit that's not even relevant to socialism.
Oh no shit? Are you sure? So what you're saying is we shouldn't discard entire swaths of historically oppressed people, who would be absolutely essential to a revolution, based on bullshit claims that aren't even relevant to the person claiming them?
You people aren't socialists. You would be 100% fine with the current system if you personally had power, but you're just angry that you never will. You're crying about your oppression alone, guaranteeing you will never be substantial parts of any uprising. Read some fucking books.
t. middle class white male american aged 20-30
Thanks for the perspective.
Indeed. I would add that the nature of the legitimate oppresseion that most minorities face tends to have a whole hell of a lot more to do with class than it does with their identities.
This right here is why your intersectional shit is counterrevolutionary. It is completely out of line with the materialist understanding of the reality. An identity cannot be the basis of any kind of material oppression. There is always a material cause at the heart of the issue. Your conception of oppression mystifies the nature of the real physical oppression that people actually experience. It treats symptoms as if they were the disease itself.
Do you mean socialism as in "working class control over the means of production?"
I like how you chose not to answer my answer above, but instead answered the ones you felt you could argue with.
I will repeat it again:
Anybody who believes in intersectionality she seek the abolition of the greatest intersection first, that is class.
Class is the largest oppressed group. I accept that it sucks to be a poor black person more so than a poor white person on equal poverty levels, but the fact is they are both poor and both oppressed.
I don't deny feminism a good thing and that women should have all the same rights as men, but I also don't apologise for its every lunancy, like people who suggest there shouldn't be juries or that women should just believed when they a say they have been raped even without evidence.
Also, I disagree with it where it will actively uphold capitalism. Which is often.
...
This right here is your problem. You've just applied a stereotype to an extremely diverse group of people, like a racist. Perhaps racially, people here aren't that diverse, but in terms of personalities and ideologies we are extremely diverse. Because it isn't about skin.
Nobody is denying that racism exists like you are pretending, we are merely coming to a different conclusion about its origins, namely, in the relation of owner and worker. Which, considering the history of slavery, should be pretty stark.
Class struggle is the struggle of the proletariat against the propertied class. The proletariat is a multifaceted, multi racial mass. When you start saying things like 'your not right because you are white and male and therefore you could not possibly understand." which IS a big thing, or "women should not have to prove they were raped, because males have muh privileged" then you are advocating the priviliding of one group over another.
The point is to abolish muh privilege entirely, not just to make everybody equally exploitative
My favourite book is Debt: The First 5000 Years.
I believe in expanding co-operatives until they can federate to provide networks of mutual aid until the state is no longer necessary and what is left in its place is a directly democratic decentralized federation of co-operatives.
I don't believe identity politics is actually required for the particular program I ascribe to.
Exactly what about me isn't socialist?
Holla Forums has proven time and time again they are a bunch of class reductionists. Somehow the revolution will make the working class abandon their prejudices.
Way to miss the point of my post. I am not saying those issues aren't real or they shouldn't be talked about, not in the least. I'm speaking out against all of these whine buckets on the left that care nothing about analyzing systems, they just are pissed off and want to direct their anger, often times, at other leftists and lone individuals. The end result of such behavior is shit we see on plebbit and its a fine example of why I endorse none of this garbage. Even worse, you talk about dismissing the concerns of a group of people – I'm speaking out about precisely that, the concerns of the white working class here. Those are people that identity politicians truly give zero fucks about. The most you will get from them is "oh well they're trump supporters anyway lol" and they'll move on to every other single issue campaign, leaving them to be entirely co-opted by white nationalists. For a bunch of people that want to call out others for being dismissive, they sure do a bang up job of showing us all how hypocritical they are. Most of them get angry at whites for not allowing black people to have their say and experiences validated – but at the same time, this isn't afforded to whites. The perfect example of this was Bernie's epic moment of saying "if you're white you don't know what it's like to be poor." That's alienating as fuck to white people everywhere that are struggling, but there's many IP tards that will back up Bernie's sentiment or parrot similar sentiments.
What are you even trying to say here? Bad example and it really doesn't make sense what point you're trying to make by this, since no, I'd never suck a cop's dick for anything haha.
Ugh, again, where did I say any of this? There's plenty of things that I might support if it wasn't just empty rhetoric from these folks and a whole lot of "I got mine so fuck you" attitudes once they achieve even the slightest of material gains. All I was trying to say was that solidarity is a two way street, and a lot of people are in denial that there's a whole lot of "we need to protect our own, fuck (fill in the blank)" flying around in Left circles. I blame this stupid infighting on why nothing is being achieved.
Excpet your divisive idpol resulted in more bullshit and infighting, as opposed to unity.
Go fuck yourself with a cactus.
Can we make this wordfilter to "materialists"?
...
idpol is 100% an empty shell game of labeling shit then getting assblasted by the labels
Fucking retards have nothing left so they just pull the "class reductionist" card.
t. A straight white male trying to deny the lived experiences of oppressed minority groups
Did you just assumer xer gender?
Did you just assumed xer race?
What if xe if trans- racial?
I love this meme, socjus persecution complex does not have to be based on facts or evidence
Nobody is denying any lived experience at all. Quote me the part where he denies things happened to somebody. We are denying the effectiveness of focussing on that lived experience as a revolutionary strategy, instead we mean to find the root cause and get rid of it.
Listen to yourself, the only poor you made was about the others guys supposed sexual orientation and race. Who is the racist again? It's doubly funny because this is an anonymous board so he could literally be absolutely anyone and yet you still try to play the "white males can't have opinions contrary to mine and if they do then it's not question of subjective belief they are just wrong an should be silenced and ignored" it's totally bullsht
And also if you collect together a bunch of "lived experiences" into a graph, you get statistics, which tell the story from an unbiased perspective, unlike your subjective emotions. After all, I can claim it was my lived experience that I was actually bullied by the other Nazi camp guards where I worked and you can never know what that was like because you haven't lived it so I am oppressed and you are not
Oh and one last thing, we want to liberation of the proletariat, which includes all your special skin colour and genital clubs, in one nice big unified group. Why would you assert divisions or unity?
Have you read any history? Because it really doesn't seem like it.
What does that even mean? Since when do you call the malevolence of those in power a "material cause?"
Oh you mean like being disproportionately targeted by racial profiling, or subject to murder even while unarmed, or stuck in such poverty and violent ghettos white people just do not experience on any level of non-whites?
You dismissing shit like that means you will NEVER get non-whites on your side, which means you will never have a revolution. Keep your fucking materialist philosophy bullshit to yourself, this is supposed to be a practical movement.
Yes I do, and people here are more concerned with calling white people proles and calling black people who say they're disproportionately oppressed wrong, than with actually instituting socialism.
I think many of the people here disagree.
You've been conned by right wingers. There are probably a thousand people like that, at most. They just get their idiocy blasted all over the country. What movement doesn't have complete retards? Socialism and communism sure do.
The fact that there are Stalinists is worse than anything a "feminist" claims.
Wow.
Do you not know where you are?
Well you are never going to get a single fucking thing done if that's your focus, and I'm glad. Have white people not controlled shit long enough? Do you not realize a huge amount of the white working class are Trump supporters? White people are not going to be the majority of people in a socialist revolution. Middle class people don't want to give up their muh privileges and status.
Fucking pathetic. I just hope you people are a tiny proportion or else socialism is a fucking pipe dream.
cepr.net
epi.org
Good luck with your revolution when you alienate all of them. I can tell rationality is not something people here encourage so I'm done.
Btw a lot of you are exactly like Trump supporters with your memes and obsession with "shitposting" as if that makes it totally acceptable to spew garbage.
Someone commented on that Richard Wolff video wondering if he'd be supportive of you or not if he actually came here. He wouldn't.
Don't let the door hit you.
Neoliberalism and imperialism enacted by a diverse elite instead of a white male Christian one is not progress. Its actually worse than no progress at all because it gives the ILLUSION of progress.
If he didn't actually come here I don't think he would've said "an… Interesting group of people" in that particular tone of voice.
No one is trying to alienate anyone, people just advocate uniting everyone of the same class. That means being inclusive of all workers. Not just certain ones.
When will Holla Forums admit the white race is the most oppressed and being genocided?
lel
Yes we are SJWs for the white race the same way black nationalists or BLM are SJWs for the black race what's your point?
White people are being destroyed and disrespected everywhere they are and we seek justice.
...
Fuck off anti-Holla Forums LARPer
White women are exposed to pro miscegenation propaganda 24/7 and our white countries accept subhumans from across the globe to kill us in terrorist attacks, suck our welfare systems dry, and sell our children drugs.
That is genocide.
the point is you're all fucking idiots
...
The weak must submit to the strong. :v)
Race and identity is the most important thing in the modern political discourse everyone from blacks to trannies to faggots to Latinos to Muslims seem to understand this except for you class reductionist morons on this subreddit who all grew up in lily white suburbs and are ignorant of and insulated from the day to day horrors of multiracialism and multiculturalism.
Your international proletarian revolution with never come and Marx and Engels themselves considered everyone east of the German empire to be basically subhumans undeserving and incapable of communism.
/thread
...
Pick 1
I'm a spic dumbass. Also, not a marxist.
Niggers can do communism. Obviously no contest. See Sankara. And you only care about commie establishment only insofar as it prevents your capital from expanding.
Nazi, that's called expanding your demographic, they can't sell those products to non-whites when their nation is in constant war or economy is in shambles. Got to bring them in, put em to work and suck that welfare money in to push it into business fam.
They don't that's why New York City flourishes with every race and creed all being able to co-exist.
Communism works
Kek, no they didn't. Marx vigorously attacked racism, and broke off contact with Hess because Hess shifted the struggle for socialism from a class struggle to a struggle of racism. As per usual, Nazi has no idea what he's talking about.
The capitalists are sucking our welfare systems dry, and blaming it on black people because idiots like you will believe them.
You're the only person here valuing "race" - well, maybe you and the naziposter from Holla Forums. Most of us see it as an invention of capitalism and an obstacle to class solidarity. No one here is calling "white people" proles - we're calling PROLES proles, regardless of "race".
You ree-ing about how everyone who disagrees with you secretly only cares about "white men", or pretending societal ills you suffer disproportionately are unique racial issues leads you directly into nationalism. And nationalism is antithetical to socialist revolution, as socialists of all "races" have realized - its purpose is to keep workers at one another's throats and to convince them to collaborate with that segment of the bourgeoisie which shares their "nationality".
It's why the ANC, after winning the fight for "black liberation", saw no issues with buying off the CPSA and pushing through neoliberal reforms that made South Africa one of the most unequal countries in the world. It's why the "National Socialists" under Hitler wound up crushing trade unions and giving German corporations everything they wanted. Without the solidarity of the entire working class, there is no socialism - and no improvement in the lives of most of the actual human beings grouped into any "race" or "nation".
No I'm pretty sure that's because hitler had all the actual leftists in the Not Socialists honest to god murdered
He had them murdered because German capitalists saw them as a threat and wanted them murdered, and as a nationalist Hitler saw the "strength" of the German "nation" (which of course meant the prosperity of the German bourgeoisie) as being more important than the emancipation of the German people.
Yeah but if nationalism+socialism was inherently unsocialistic like you claim he wouldn't have needed to honest to god murder them in the first place because there wouldn't have BEEN any
But if the people Hitler purged had tried to exercise power they'd have found themselves in the same dilemma, and been forced by the contradictions of their ideology to either abandon nationalism or (far more likely, IMO) stab the working class in the back.
I see no need to hide who i am on an anonymous board. Am I a white male? Yes, but the point is I'm not denying history, this is a fabrication of the actual points I was trying to make. I am not saying feminism isn't important, I'm not saying "fuck black liberation," I might actually support a modern incarnation of the black panthers if they put forth a sort of progressive rainbow coalition for the 21st century, but that isn't what's happening right now. Many minorities are just pandering to become the left wing of capital, and I'm sick and tired of the ignorance by the left that blacks, hispanics, etc., are on some higher plane of existence and are more likely to foment revolution. The critics of my post earlier are constantly circling back to this theme that I must "reform" my thinking to be like theirs (AKA pander to minorities and more or less "apologize" for being born white). Yet, I am saying their method of "connecting" whites and blacks is an utter fucking failure and has been since its inception. Why is that so hard to understand? Do the proponents of identity politics really think stupid shit like "kill all white people" and "white male tears" are bringing the white working class over to their cause? No. This inflammatory language you guys wield actively drives the people where I come from into reactionary politics. You can say they're just butthurt and should "get over it," but then you should honestly STFU any time you feel like you are entitled to discuss socialism.That's what I'm fighting against here, and I'm also fighting against the blatant ignorance they have toward contradictions within minority communities as well. Too often I see these people acting like its POC that all get along perfectly, but its the "white male" that is the primary contradiction in them achieving liberation. As I live in a low income, urban area, I can honestly say this is some liberal horse shit that goes against reality. Not everything is just a matter of blaming "whitey," but god, you guys sure do come off that way. Maybe if you changed your rhetoric I might understand, but one can perfectly read history, understand it, and not peddle this "woe is me" horseshit that places language and bad words on the same level as things like hunger, police brutality, etc.
Could you be anymore smug?
Just want to clarify that I met "you guys" as in proponents of IP, not you specifically.
Love is a fucking spook and counterrevolutionary.
You've been here for 5 minutes. I have been here for now about 2 years. Sure there are a couple of racists and people who believe gf's should be state assigned, but they are very much a minority, it just so happens that we are more accommodating to minority opinions than you are used to.
You will also find that many of us spend a great deal of our spare time arguing with racists about their racist beliefs. I myself have sunk many an hour into debunking race realism. I know others have also.
It is your complete refusal to even meet these ideas that is your key weakness in overcoming them.
They say things you can't handle so you go 'ahhh I'm done fjbfklbfa TRUMP SUPPORTER' and put up a wall. That isn't going to help anybody.
And just on calling us Trump supporters- a large portion of this board doesn't even believe in the state, never mind a republican state with a racist president who believes in surveillance. So shut your fucking mouth. There is more to the world than 'Us good guys and you racists'
No, I haven't been conned. I've red the newspapers. I have real life feminists activist friends who believe this shit.
I have read Dworkin, Butler, Beauvoir, Crenshaw, MitchellI might even say maybe I have read more feminist literature than you, because I had to for university.
I am well equated with feminist discourse. I believe in 95% of it. That spare 5% is believed by a growing section of society.
Ideas such as ,POC cannot be racist or engage in racist activity. (i.e when those people tortured that autistic kid, that somehow isn't racist violence)
Ideas like, BLM protesters upstaging Bernie was a good idea for socialism.
Ideas like, voting Hillary was a good idea for minorities and socialism
These kinds of things are prevalent, find your nearest anti-colonial study group and I can guarantee you there are people like this.
Sure. So? That doesn't nullify anything they have done. I don't support Stalinism.
This is not an answer.
What about it is pathetic? The proletariat DOES include everybody who isn't a borg owner.
I think you need to understand that most of us are pissed off that Reagan disarmed the Black Panthers and Murdered MLK and Malcolm X and exploits the Congo through violence for iphone minerals.
We quote Fred Hampton and Stokely Carmichael on a regular basis
I think you need to get some fucking perspective and accept that race relations and class are extremely difficult issues and that there is actually more to it than simple muh privilege of skin colour
We hate racism, at least I hate racism, lividly. There are many here who would support a violent bloodbath in order to rid the world of the capitalism that causes racism. I am not one of them, but to come here and call us racist Trump supporters is a fucking joke.
This is the extremist left, or where it dwells on the internet. Fuck you and your liberal name calling.
NO WAR BUT CLASS WAR.
PEACE.
Stop reddit spacing. It takes up too much space and is a nightmare to read.
Most of us don't. Just because Holla Forums permits racist/sexist/whateverist opinions doesn't mean most users condone those views.
/r/socialism mods won't permit elections because most of the voters would be white men, ban people just for mentioning Holla Forums and force the banned users to brigade us but we're the crazy weirdos?
Is space in short supply on this infinitely expanding message board?
It just makes it hard to read. Spaces should be used to break up subjects. So replying to a user a paragraph or two would be the norm for each point.
I am a professional historian, and you appear to be unable to see beyond the false bourgeois narrative that liberals like to retroactively place history into.
You really do not know the first thing about materialism. Alright, the basic premise underlying materialism is that the nature of reality is matter and energy in motion. All imaginary things (eg. race, the state, identity) are ultimately functions of material reality. Their shape and function within a given society are determined by material conditions, and when those material conditions change the imaginary constructs change along with them. For example, mass immigration to the United States from Ireland prompts a reimagining of the concept of the "white race" to include celts where before it had not.
For every society-wide change in the imaginary superstructure, there is a material change that prompted it and gave it form. Thus, when a person or group wishes to change the nature of the superstructure, the way to do so is by altering the material base upon which it is built. If you try to change the superstructure by purely imaginary means (rights, language, social acceptance) all you can ever accomplish is temporary and superficial. The superstructure will always reform to match the reality of the material and economic base.
Being proletarian has absolutely nothing to do with being white or black. Race is utterly irrelevent to production.
Pandering to people's imaginary identities does not get them in line behind an economic goal. All it does is make the movement about something that has nothing to do with economics. Identities should be discarded for the frauds that they are so that time and effort is not expended upon them.
Do you see that? There is the real problem. The fact that poverty is experienced more often by individuals who claim a particular identity has absolutely nothing to do with the nature and cause of poverty. Thus, the problem of poverty is not resolved by addressing that imaginary and inaccurate correllation. Poverty is an economic realty, and it is resolved by changing the economics of the prevailing system.
You know what we need? A black president of the United States! That'll surely change things.