I know you guys are a bunch of middle class edgy Stalinists who think HRC and Trump were both equal...

*schniff*

*Anyone who uses the same reaction images is the same poster

You might have a case with filenames, but not with images alone.

If it's not something I see often I'm suspicious.

You would be better off on reddit with your own kind.

socialistworker.org/2008/10/29/marxists-and-elections

Too bad Marx blew your lesser-evil bs out a long time ago. I'm embarrassed for you about the fact that socialist worker is more educated on this issue and has a better line on it then you.

Hillary would be far far worse than Trump, even from a non-accelerationist perspective. With Trump, the porky influence is right out in the open. He's lining his cabinet with rich businessmen. Clinton wouldn't have done that, she'd have used politicians paid by corporations. And just look at the shit that liberals flip shit about right now - other than wedge issues and non-issues, everything that Trump is doing or saying he will do is something Clinton would have done and probably already did as secretary of state. The key difference is that someone will actually call out Trump for doing it. When a liberal like Obama is an imperialist shit bombing poor fucks in the third world, torturing people, and prosecuting journalists nobody says anything. Conservatives think those are good things so they ignore them because it's a liberal doing it, and liberals think they're bad things so they ignore them because it's a liberal doing it.

Again, this isn't even an accelerationist argument. It's an overton window argument. If you disagree you've gotta be fucking stupid or something fam.

I'm pretty sure I got them from this board you tin foil idiot.

Thanks for your worthless childish input.

Nobody intelligent is an accelerationist, there have been hundreds of atrocities throughout history with all kinds of people doing the "night is darkest before the dawn :)" bull shit and look where we are. Chomsky's right.

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Not an argument, they voted together 90% of the time and their policies were almost identical, just not in degree because Hillary wasn't dishonest enough to tell people they could have free shit within 4 years of Republishits meanwhile Obama has been on record of voicing support for a lot of progressive shit domestically and look how that turned out.

My point was is that most of you faggots chose to eat a shit sandwich instead of trying for some sort of progressive reform, and why should the workers eat a shit sandwich? Because the Left's nominee wasn't a Maoist, super retarded logic with absolutely no silver lining. What's your solution, pls tell me. Is a Marxist organization supported by thousands of unions going to rise up out of the earth? No, you cucked yourself and you just want to gloat because you want to be angry at something.

The lesser evil shit is a right-wing narrative, a higher minimum wage would not have been an evil to millions of workers, you have no clue what you're talking about. The Dems platform would have been de facto better for workers and Leftest movements in the future.

For this.

She never campaigned on any of those promises and infact basically indicated in every way possible that they were a concession merely to try and shut berniecrats up for a minute.

The problem with the idea that Hillary is Bernie lite is that we have a thirty year career of her doing one minor good thing a children's defense fund and then doing mostly fuck all except goatsee for corporations the rest of her career. She didn't have a basic stance on almost any issue we could consistently call even liberal, let alone even socdem.

Every thing she has done in her career has basically pointed to the fact that she is everything wrong with neoliberalism. Unless you have some new great argument to challenge that assumption or shed light on her endless bad decisions, please fuck off.

How exactly?

How was anything Hillary going to do helpful or different from what Obama was doing? You might as well turn Obama into a white woman and give him another 4/8 years, and you would have what a Hillary presidency would look like. I don't even have any vested interest in this, I'm not American, I just love seeing the people who feel they have lost freak out every 4 years after not getting the lollipop they wanted out of the two presented to them by the establishment.

Come back and mock people after a year if anything Trump does has changed anything significantly, then we might have something to talk about. Until then it's just fearmongering and mockery.

Not if he read the wikileaks and Hillary's speeches to billionaires and banksters as to her true dreams and intentions. Zizek is the only one right here but OP can be the first to die in the revolution.

DOMA, Iraw War, Patriot Act, Bailouts, Tarp loans, Crime Bill, private prisons, fracking, the cutting of social security, DAPL,

The difference between Bernie and Hillary is that even if he couldn't get any of his positive changes done, at least I know he wouldn't be conceding to the right on a bunch of terrible issues in the mean time to please donors and give off a fake sense of "compromise." Like Hillary would already be doing and has been doing since she lost. Hillary had no plans for anything which was why her aims were more pie in the sky than Bernie who consistently had the same talking points and laid out a plan for things he knew the people wanted.

STRRONGER TOIGETHER, IM WITH HER, sounds like some great plans to help us all out, thanks neoliberal fam.

Cause it helped so many people under Obama, even though inflation basically wiped out any gains that workers might've seen from it. I'm not against a higher minimum wage, but its not the be all and end all, and what she was working for was not much higher at all.

Obama was the worst thing that ever happened to the American Left. And guess what? You're clearly not following Marx with your support the democrat shit he said to build a proletarian party for the working class, not sell out to libshits. I didnt vote for Trump and I seriously doubt anyone here did other then a few dumb edge lords.

Except this is empirically false, she tried to push through universal healthcare with her husband at one point:

"The Clinton health care plan, known officially as the Health Security Act and unofficially nicknamed "Hillarycare" (after First Lady Hillary Clinton) by its detractors,[1][2] was a 1993 healthcare reform package proposed by the administration of President Bill Clinton and closely associated with the chair of the task force devising the plan, First Lady of the United States Clinton.

The president had campaigned heavily on health care in the 1992 presidential election. The task force was created in January 1993, but its own processes were somewhat controversial and drew litigation. Its goal was to come up with a comprehensive plan to provide universal health care for all Americans, which was to be a cornerstone of the administration's first-term agenda. A major health care speech was delivered by the president to the US Congress in September 1993. The core element of the proposed plan was an enforced mandate for employers to provide health insurance coverage to all of their employees." - Wikipedia

It failed, but it proves without a doubt that HRC was always a vanilla soc dem. You honestly think Bernie would have gotten his "free shit for all" platform passed had he won? This is why HRC wasn't dumb enough to run with that, maybe in Canada you can hand out candy when you get to be PM but not here, here you have a Christian conservative majority of the country to deal with, along with their numerous batshit representatives. Hillary was Bernie lite, Republicans hated her guts for a very good reason, they're not stupid and neither was Hillary, it's how she won the nomination(inb4 hur rigged primaries).

Healthcare.

.I don't have to make an argument, you are the one too stupid and reliant on memes to not look at her platform and the history. I'm not even arguing that she would have been a progressive warrior either, I'm only arguing that her policies would have been pretty social democrat for American standards, she's been a vanilla democrat her whole life. Why would not she stick to the platform that she ran on, supported in the past, and that's supported by the American people? You're just full of convenient non-arguments, "NOPE NOPE NOPE, LOOK WHAT SHE SAID IN THE 80s." You're dumb as shit dude, I can point out far more patterns of her being a socdem then you can for your arbitrary definition of neoliberal.

A. She would have gotten to pick upwards of 3 Supreme court justices

B. Her platform was far more progressive than "muh hope".

C. Time. Yeah 8 years of Obama got us very little because we had a financial crisis to recover from and Republicans literally shutting down the government, but 8 more years of Clinton probably would have gotten us even more shit that he couldn't get done in the first place. I'm not arguing that we'd could have been like Denmark in 4 years, I'm arguing that we could have been on the track there instead of this right-wing crony capitalist shit-hole that we're heading for.

Yeah he definitely would have after you see the trainwreck of an economy Trump will leave behind, you complete autist.

What, how?

He probably would have if he wanted to get fuck all passed. He's compromised with the Republicans on a ton of shit in the past because there's no way around it in this Christian conservative shit-hole of ours.

msnbc.com/hardball/sanders-mccain-reach-bipartisan-deal

HRC is a known quantity. We knew that if she won it would be business as usual, with all sorts of cronies taking over with the media singing her praises while they robbed us.

No, she wasn't BSLite. They hated each other, as the emails revealed, and any sign of concession was intended to ultimately screw his supporters. You could in fact see it when he conceded to her, his big argument for her was that she didn't have an 'R' next to her name on the ticket.

Trump is a wildcard. The gamble was always that a wildcard always beats a known quantity that will screw you over, because if the wildcard has even a 1% chance of not screwing you over, it's still the more rational option.

This is how I know you're a middle class autist, HRC was proposing raising the wage by 4.75$ and even higher in cities that could manage it. That alone would have made a giant improvement in the lives of most workers.

I gave a single example, that coupled with the other welfare shit would have been far better than what we currently have and what we will have with Trump..

Yeah you're about to see how great of a shape the Left will be in after 8 years of Trump, they're already pandering to conservatives and kissing their feet, and young people will start to turn more right wing after they see this garbage but hey, that magical Maoist movement will rise up any day now. :)

None of this has anything to do with the policies of the Dems and the Republicans, you just memorized it because it sounds convenient.

That's happening with Trump right now you autist, also.

How stupid are you?

She isn't an socdem on trade, foreign policy or domestic affairs. Supporting the TPP then barely fucking mentioning it on her """opposition""" on your platform is not socdem. Spending the summer talking to big money donors instead of talking directly to your base is not socdem. Working in the destruction of Libya and now wanted to continue that destruction in Syria is not fucking socdem. Creating a fucking oversight board for Puerto Ricans going through a financial crisis is not socdem.

Oh that same one when Clinton folded on that as well, calling Obamacare just a continuation of "Hillarycare"? She won't even admit the broader scope previous plan because she is a fucking failure and doesn't want to look at her past failings. Why? Because she is not principled, but a fucking neoliberal coward who bought into the notion of winning campaigns behind close doors. Why on earth you believe she would keep a word of her extremely light center left policies I have no idea. You might be the same type of fucking person who though Obama was actually going to start a Jobs Program that he was screaming about when he ran for his office. Stop believing the can speeches of elected officials during election season, you sound like a Trumple supporter. Remember what she said, you say one thing to the public and another thing behind close doors. Which is why she might have been away for most of campaign behind closed doors.

Why keep defend a fucking failure? She offered NOTHING to the american people other than a vague $12.50 raise which is not even close to liveable for minimum wage earners and the workers who are apart of $15 Now say that over and over again. People didn't want a fucking president who said "everything is already great! America is great already!" fucking nonsense when half of the country is suffering. She's an idiot and you're a fucking idiot for blaming a paper crafting board on your mama's failure to win.

it's almost as if you need to stop posting or something

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Go the fuck back to Reddit. The reason why social democrats have been cucking for capital for so long now is because with the collapse of the USSR there isn't a direct threat to capitalist hegemony that would provide an alternative t system at hand, so the porky fuckers don't need to offer the proles the few crumbs they used to get and can fuck the working class even harder.

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The 11-12 dollar minimum wage that she was suggesting would've merely been the 1968 minimum wage adjusted for inflation. Really despite the nostalgist bs ask anyone from the old generation that isn't completely braindead that wasn't a golden age for workers it was just the best American capitalism has been able to do.

I'm old enough to remember the Bush years kid, so I actually have an idea of what wages were like back then. When adjusted for inflation Bush's last the minimum wage for Bush's last year in office was 7.35–under Obama they raised the minimum wage once when he first got in office and then they never raised it during his entire 8 years as president. What's the excuse? He gave out literally trillions of dollars to the banksters but it was cool for us to take a wage freeze and suffer long-term unemployment.

And ya it helped a some, it was better then absolutely nothing, but once inflation started kicking in and rents started rising those gains were gone quickly.

It's already increasingly difficult to even get a job thats not part-time these days because employers don't want to pay benefits, much less overtime. Its almost like that loop-hole has been left open deliberately to benefit capital no matter what the situation with welfare or the minimum wage is. It's like UBI the price you'd pay for that higher wage or guaranteed money is more frequent unemployment and precarity.

This is really how I know you're not older then 22. The anti-war movement was vibrant and militant under Bush but the moment Obama took office it fucking died. Once liberals were no longer fighting the embodiment of straight white christian men they packed up altogether. Look how polarized liberals have gotten over Trump's he's going to go into office with very little legitimacy–just like how when bush's limo was egged on inauguration. If you were around then you would've noticed that a literal once in a lifetime pearl harbor event couldn't save his reputation, he went out of his second term as one of the most hated and lowest ranked presidents.

The Left was gaining rapidly in influence after the financial crisis and the Iraq debacle that partially explains the euphoria people experienced during Obama's election and the staying power of the SJW movement despite their lack of substantial content.

Gross. Nothing will get done if people accept defeat out of hand and cynical play the parliamentary game endlessly instead. Read a history book, even reformers need committed revolutionaries to their left to actually get anything done.

Douglass said it best:

Did you miss the entire last year of this election? She criticized Sanders for proposing the same plan that she once previously did and basically tried to make him look like a republican who wanted to gut Obama care and not replace it with anything. In fact her platform basically stated she wanted to mildly reform Obamacare even up to the last day of the election and Obamacare is already going to fail with Trump or Hillary in office because the insurance companies are already backing out of Obama's deals. He erected a plan on a sand castle and the now the whole nation has to pay for the democrats stupid fucking mistake of not passing universal health care when they had a filibuster proof majority and the presidency.

Canadians had to fight hard for universal healthcare most nations had a prior struggle and long held fight to get these things passed. The problem with Hillary on this and most issues is she gives up the fight before it even happens. Not only was she not going to do anything about health care but most things indicated that she was going to gut social security and further take away other welfare programs.

You also didn't address the main issue in my post she has had an entire senate career and a position as secretary of state to propose health care and many other things instead she did nothing but do the bidding of corporations and sell arms and the process of fracking to dangerous foreign nations. "By American standards" is not an argument, because by American standards she is basically indistinguishable from Dick Cheney, except he was for Gay marriage before she was.

Also the VA deal by Bernie and McCain was one of the only good pieces of bipartisan legislation. I don't mind people working with the perceived enemy if nothing is lost and we achieve something good. The problem with Hillary was she would compromise on Fracking, on wars, on oil drilling, social security and on Wall Street. I'm not sure she would even stay strong on Idpol issues if republicans pushed hard enough. She just wants what they want and she has no fight in her or care enough to stop them on bad issues.

That healthcare plan was a massive fucking mess that was designed not to fuck over the companies too hard, it was not socialized medicine or single-payer, if you want to look at how well something like turned look at Obamacare you massive fucking faggot.

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