Hello Holla Forums

Then what is this thread for?
Props for using Ron Paul and not Trump, at least.

He says, asking the leftist politics board a science question.
>>>/sci/

Then take it onto a science board, faggot.

positivists pls leave

actually that is not the case, particularly outside the West.
I am starting to think that none of you have actually looked into this extensively yourselves.

read the OP

wow you commies are zero fun

I can get down with this, I am a Phd candidate in Biomedical science. Obviously I am well educated in Genetics, Molecular Biology, and I am a neuroscientist by training.

Post a time and a place and I'll be there.

now we're cooking with gas.
keep an eye on this thread.

It honestly makes no difference to the function of a communist society.

Personally, I have no interest in a "debate" with someone who can't even be bothered to stay on topic.

Remember when the author of the book "Troublesome Inheritance" got inherited his own trouble? Remember when 143 senior biologists and geneticists from around the world got together to debunk his (mis)appropriation of their field of research, especially since he was citing those of the 143? Makes you wonder what would happen if Holla Forums's "scientific" conjectures were ever brought to light with all their assemblages of sometimes contradictory and tangential studies. Luckily, they're still a joke because you all are.

...

I thought you said we weren't having the debate ITT you fucking goon.

why is Holla Forums so fucking autistic and why do people reply to the same shit everyday

Will do.

So how do you address the Lewtonin Paradox?

my understanding is that if you look at multiple alleles at once, groupings become very clear
And I believe I've also read that distinctions between some existing species would fall apart if we were forced to use his original methodology with everything.

Mate, the reason you're getting shit on is because biological debates like this don't concern leftists, or even many rightists. This is a highly politicized issue, but I don't think it has a place in political discussion. Scientists and anthropologists should be discussing this, not a group of autistic pseudo intellectuals LARPing as nazis and communist revolutionaries.

Now if, for example, you wanted to debate something related to economics, politics, or ethics, you could probably find someone here to oblige you, but we really don't give a shit about the racial differences present in humans.

...

is that perpetually congested tankie /yourguy/?

You are not incorrect, his methodologies were flawed, and tainted by politics.

Nonetheless a lot of his major conclussions were largely substantiated by the greater scientific community. Humans are one of the most genetically homogenous species on the planet. But what largely affects our phenotypes goes way beyond simply what our genetics are. I could write a short book on this.

So as an example, a lot of variation between humans occurs not in coding DNA (genes), but in spacer regions. Regions that are largely structural and overall don't effect the outcome of the genetic code.

Also look at skin color. There is no 1 gene that completely controls this. Actually, skin color comes from a chemical (melalanin). This is the the product of an enzyme, not something inately genetic. Two people can have the exact same enzyme (thus genetics) yet produce different amounts of that chemical, thus has different skin colors.

And also epigenetics factor in as well. It is very complicated but I can go on if you'd like.

Race isn't our greatest disagreement, it's on economics

the board claims to hate Idpol, but ultimately partisanship has them oppose whitey more than anything else, and Anfem shitposters make real debate kind of pointless

anfem is based for making racists upset

Not entirely true, some of us (myself included) are more focused on class than racial issue. It is my own personal belief that class is the ultimate issue that needs solving, all other issues will more easily be solved after that.

Where's Asian Anfem when you need her?

Please justify expatriating or culling people of other races and justify the acceptance of 🍀🍀🍀irish🍀🍀🍀 , greek, slavic, and other untermenschen into the umbrella of white.

Only experts can settle the debate. It doesn't matter how much literature you read. All you can do is flail around, hoping it provides a scientific excuse to dislike other races and judge people before you get to know them.

Personally, I think it's pretty obvious there are differences in the races. What I don't believe is that humans, especially individual, unqualified humans, can somehow arrive at significant conclusions that can be applied to any races that wouldn't result in unnecessary repression of some kind. Whatever the truth, it's morally better not to judge, than to judge.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Ultimately, the "It's science not politics!!!" excuse is bullshit, because we both know Holla Forums is just looking for another excuse to yell at brown people and doesn't care much for science.

You know Holla Forums is literally retarded when the main point they wish to contend is something as irrelevant and inconsequential as muh race.

Devastating global warfare, economic meltdown, ecological collapse but meanwhile on Holla Forums, black people being dumber by some Autism Level points is an existential imperative.

You are just a stooge of imperialism and the ruling classes that perpetrated it. The greatest problem is your own white ruling classes which is why class comes before race.

Seeing as your a Nazi, you are too dumb to realize that the worst thing that happened to whites came from their own ruler, Hitler, and his imperialist wars that included millions of whites amongst their victims as well as others.

(OP)

Seeing as your view is based on so-called 'science' what leading geneticists do you have in your camp and how do you refute arguments like this?:

Graves joins a chorus of voices in the human genome project in asserting that biological races do not exist. Ironically, some leaders in the human genome project want racial identifiers on DNA samples from which molecular genetic polymorphisms are to be discovered. The population geneticist, Luigi Cavalli-Sforza, also calls for abandoning the traditional classification of races, but at the same time, his groupings of human 'populations' in Genes, Peoples, and Languages are close to racial groups as originally conceived. Despite its many detractors, a concept of race keeps returning and finding uses.

Graves' attack on the concept of race is polemical in tone. He is clear on where he stands from the outset: biological races do not exist. Scholars who believe that biologically-based racial differences may exist in behavioural traits he labels as 'racists.' This ad hominian name-calling is apt to put those on the other side of debate on the defensive. Graves is not seeking a dialogue but rather intends to discourage the use of racial categorizations.
nature.com/hdy/journal/v87/n2/full/6889531a.html

Also are we playing with actual ethnicities or are we going to keep things on kindergarten white ranger vs. Black Ranger?

(SPOILER ALERT: White is a color, not an ethnic group)

Truly he was the worst thing to happen to the purity of the white race.

...

Not to mention most of the people who died in the European-Theater were Whiteys.

I'm a Catholic, but you guys don't have a flag for that
it would be dishonest if i posted without a flag pretending to be one of you

seriously how the fuck do Holla Forumsacks do this shit and keep a straight face?

Actually, we do, you should check it out sometime!

Does cost actually matter to you, or do you think it matters to him? Personally I'm not moved by it.

Science is policy.

I'm not sure what your point is. Whites in America come from a variety of ethnic backgrounds, but their ancestors integrated and now they largely lack all but the most superficial trappings of ethnic identity. There's a reason the debate about race is low-granularity.

Most Holla Forumsacks are Americans.

Light grey?

Yes, and?

Americans have a monolitic idea of whiteness and can't tell a frenchman from a pole
Hitler had a more divisive idea and tought germans, french and italians were completly different things, white americans on Hitler's race world view are less than birdshit

that's some good copypaste skills you got there, i don't know how we'll be able to top that

After what happened with muke? No thanks. I know we'll lose because nobody can fucking argue here worth a damn including me. Just read Das Kapital and it'll do all the argumentation for us.

Really? Post a fucking source for that

When even 8pol hates you, you know you fucked up.

...

It is hard to compete with unsourced info-graphics.

sociology.as.nyu.edu/docs/IO/1043/2008_Reconstructing_Race_in_AJS.pdf
sci-hub.io/10.1111/j.1548-1433.2009.01076.x

It would be better to ask people what race means to them and why they believe in it or not.

You joke, but white Americans are in a weird place. The demographic transformation of their country and their lack of ethnic identity are definitely contributing to the recent rise of white nationalism. In the long run it could get very interesting.

...

Do you know what these are? Polymorphisms are generally defined as point mutations that are common.

They are not restricted to genes per say. As I said earlier in this thread genetic differences can fall in DNA regions outside of genes and result in no biochemical differences between individuals.

Which is why I stated earlier this issue is incredibly complex.

But putting all that aside I will state it is probably more sufficient/useful to describe races as more a product of cultural than they are genetics. For instance a black kid who grew up in the suburbs may behave very differently from one who grew up in the city.

goalpostsmoved.jar

Yeah. White Americans are a mongrel people, ethnically and culturally. White nationalism, is the closest thing they have to ethnic nationalism.

I am not a geneticist myself. But I think the first thing we need to agree on if we are going to be race 'realists' is:

White is a color, not a race.

You fucking what, mate?

What language do you think you're talking in num-nutz?

If you don't like The White Language go back to Africa!

when you have people that are 1/4th irish,1/4th german, 1/8th scandinavian, they are a mongrel.

Because there has NEVER been American nationalism, right?
Fuck off, retard.

Say it with me friend:

White is a color, not a race.

I've been to America and people with tan skin and brown or black hair are considered white as long as thier name is Tony or Brad or Christina. Weird shit

I know bruh! I bet he'll think twice after checkin out that ballin painting!

Way to show him!

Way to comically miss the point.

White is right?

Help me out here. I might have a little more melanin so this might be harder for me on account of my skin disorder.

Who knew America was so diverse even back then

Who said anything about goalposts? I thought you said this thread wasn't for debate.

In all seriousness, I agree that race exists. I would just rather see something more nuanced than a table of percentages. I think it's more productive to find where people disagree, and numbers won't do that.

Case in point:

What does race mean to you?

Wow not even Holla Forumsacks are that dumb.

Although today's 'Whites' might give me a run for my money.

White nationalism is far from the closest thing America has had to ethnic nationalism, especially since America has been jerking itself off 24/7 since Reconstruction.

Running really fast and crossing the finish line first. Other than that, not much.

I think you'd be better off making the case for specific groups of tribes, but as we know, in most densely populated areas, a lot of inter-tribal marriages happen, so you'll have a harder time finding a distinct lineage.

No, I'll leave that to the academics who know more than me or you ever will, who are having that debate right now.

I don't really think race is a real thing, so yea we probably agree.

I hope you guys find what you're looking for. Inventing races seems like a dead end but god speed to yah.

To the race realists in this thread:

When is a mutt, not a mutt?

UR GAY

Didn't the nazis have some kind of rule where if Hitler was held in idolatry then they'd have to stone the people doing it to death?

when it can be grouped with a bunch of other mutts with the same mutt lineage and be called a breed.
how'd i do professor

I'm no professor, but if you feel the need to save the American White Breed, you do that shit.

I got a lot of love for the south. I can't in good faith endorse that confederate flag shit on account of the history(even if no one in my family was ever a slave), but I think you'll find that Southern Whites probably have a lot more in common with Southern Blacks and Commiefornians than they do with Northern Whites and Nordic Europeans.

Doesn't happen with humans. Genetic diversity is highest between breeds in dogs, highest within "breeds" for humans. In fact, if you measure the genetic distance between chimp subspecies the way we measure the genetic distance between human species, those chimps have 3x the genetic diversity between subspecies as humans do between continental populations.

As long as the guy that debate you isn't Muke it should be kinda okay. Also, we have Nazbols on here, if you wanted to know that I guess.

This is stupid. Of course race fucking exists. Take skin colour for example. Whites having light skin isn't a fucking cosmetic difference either (herpderp it's just skin colour guizes), it provides a real actual advantage like easier uptake of Vitamin D through sunlight and Asians (this one is for you, amfem, even though I hate you) have a layer of subcutaneous fat under their skin that is an adaptation for cold weather, like the opposite of a hot weather camel, who has a large portion of its fat location in a hump. It evolved from them traveling through Siberia/mountains with cold climates for thousands of years that's advantageous to them. When they have low melanin, like some Japanese or Chinese people, they look yellow because the skin is somewhat transparent and the colour of the fat (yellow) comes through. That's just one advantageous difference among many between population groups like how Inuit/Eskimo/Mongoloid people have the highest cold tolerances of any population because they are very short to more easily retain body heat and have a thicker layer of subcutaneous fat that other people including; Elongated Torso - stores body heat, Truncated Limbs - preserves body heat, Thick Straight Long Tubular Hair - insulates skull temperature, Lack of Apocrine Sweat Glands - prevents body heat loss, Flat Faces - keep extremities from freezing, Little Facial Hair - an advantage in cold weather when condensation can freeze on beards and lead to frostbite, Epicanthic Eye Folds - protects eyes from needle-like snow and glare from snow like how we have to squint when it's too bright i.e. race but who cares? Sure there's a list of everything certain races are better at than other races naturally due to evolutionary adaptions but we're not about that shit. The only thing that matters is money. Everything else is just a spook.

who is Muke, I don't know your board very well.

I fucking love this webm

Race doesn't exist. It is not a valid taxonomic classification, there is no biological basis for grouping people together as "white" or "black", and the benefits to conducting medical research are tenuous at best. You just chose a bunch of phenotypic traits, you can't ignore the genetic basis for subspecies, or species etc.

A guy who didn't read and thus embarrassed himself himself in a debate. Is the debate in this thread?

Wait, does this mean all I need to do to get my daily intake of Vitamin D is to fuck an Asian?

How many alleles are different/total alleles matters less than the magnitude those differences are causing.

if I keep replying to people, I guess it will be.
My original intention was for it not to be here, just to gauge interest and maybe recruit some participants.
Also I don't think i'm even qualified to be my side's champion in this debate.
There are much, much more informed sinners than myself.

YOU ARE A GAY GAY GAY YOU LOVE LONG BIG COCKS YOU ARE SUPER SUPER GAY YOU LOVE LONG BIG COCKS

YU FUCKING WHITE CUMSKIN CIS MALE GET THE FUCK OUUUUUT

Make it a youtube debate, dumb ass.
That way you have a moderator and all..

Make it a formal debate baaaka.

Youtube or go home, ningen.

Make it a youtube debate.
Audio is the best debate with a moderator m8e

Atleast make the debate on skype. Give us time to organise and we'll work it out.

We're against identity in politics, and harshly criticize identitarian inflitration on leftist circles. We're still free and comfortable discussing identity on image boards for the sake of it, since it's such a relevant topic in today's world.

Audio debate is best. Don't do shit on boards nobody learns anything.

...

FUCk. WHITE. PEOPLE.
THEY ARE NOT A RACE

Sorry but no, not a fan of whites

Whites are fucking evil dude

KILL ALL THE WHITES AND THE ANGLOS

WHITES ARE LITERALLY SUBHUMAN YOU MORONIC ELITIST

Hey man, which gene is melanin transcribe from.

I'm waiting…

I'M COMING FOR THAT TOOTHBRUSH, WHITEY

Then get the fuck off this leftist pol.

Uhhh no? We hate whites here.

>>>Holla Forums

>>>Holla Forums
>>>/gulag/

Cracka detected xDDD

MAYO MAYO MAYO,
I MADE YOU OUT OF CUM
MAYO MAYO MAYO,
YOU ARE SHIT SUCKING SCUM!

Have to be trolling but in the hopes you are not, how can you call yourself a socialist and hate an ethnic group?

Gotta be a troll

>>>Holla Forums

lmfao kill yourself whitey.

i'm sensing a sudden influx of memery in this thread, I guess that qualifies as interest?

I'll try to get some fashy goys involved and set something up

When that ethnic group elevates itself above another it becomes the elite. 101 dumbass.

You better not or we'll dox the shit out of you

>>>Holla Forums

Go back.

All me.

>>>/gulag/

Try here for an answer LARPer

Thanks comrades, I'm cracking up.

What the fuck happened ITT?

Not at all man, I'm a leftist. I question whether you are

I guess I didn't get invited to that party? Because I am white and a hardline communist and poor as shit. But Obama is black and in bed with capitalists. You're identity politics will kill this movement.

I've been debating the Nazi throughout this thread, saying throughout race does not exist. Go back to a fucking science class and learn not to shit on ethnic groups dumbass

Perhaps I am too easy to troll. Been away from the chans for too long. Never change guys

beats me.
do you guys have an affiliated discord/irc that derails threads from time to time?
that's what this looks like to me.

I just joined in because I saw a couple other people doing it. Some things just happen spontaneously.

Probably.

In relation to the topic, how exactly do you define race? And how do you define groups that seem to be almost in betweens?

So in other words, how do you reconcile that there doesn't appear to be set, very different ethnic groups, but instead something of a continuum.

Look at Iranians as an example. Culturally the are very similiar to other Middle Eastern cultures. Yet linguistically, Persian is considered to be an Indo-European language, and it is thought Europeans and Iranians are decedents of the same tribes in Central Asia.

What race does an Iranian fall into? Indo-European? Afro-semitic? Asiatic?

alt-right comes here every day with this shit.
There's nothing more to debate, as far as I'm concerned.

I think it's the new redditors TBH. I don't give a fuck what race you are, but using reddit should have a punishment at this point. And any other pleb social network site honestly.

This.
It's the same shit people did with Social Darwinism.
The never ending appeals to nature are the real schism. I could give less of a fuck about whether it's real or not.

hard to define. I'll take a stab at it.
Race is kind of a clumsy word, so is sub-species. Neither really refer to what is going on in humans.
What we are referring to is really more like Clines
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cline_(biology)

hybrids I guess? Edge populations? This is a hard question.
It's really not super important to me though. I'm an ethnic nationalist, not a white nationalist.

on that we can agree. fucking /r/thedonald users are shitting up 4/pol/ with their relentless newfaggery its god damn awful
I guess that's the price of mainstream success

hard to define. I'll take a stab at it.
Race is kind of a clumsy word, so is sub-species. Neither really refer to what is going on in humans.
What we are referring to is really more like Clines
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cline_(biology)

hybrids I guess? Edge populations? This is a hard question.
It's really not super important to me though. I'm an ethnic nationalist, not a white nationalist.

dunning-kruger effect

on that we can agree. fucking /r/thedonald users are shitting up 4/pol/ with their relentless newfaggery its god damn awful
I guess that's the price of mainstream success

I don't think you know what that means, because you just seem to like using it indiscriminately.

I thought you said this wasn't about policy, retard.

I don't know about that
Look at the trillions upon trillions of dollars poured into trying to close the gap between the Blacks and Whites in US public schools and the minimal impact it caused
It would be cheaper to deport all blacks than to continue the ponzi scheme of education which simply doesn't work

Different people require different needs

Helllloooo Reddit!

And? Did we ever make the argument that everyone has to be exactly the same. All clothes made for manlets now? Or do we have to have a "debate" about the difference between manlets and normal people? Maybe, we provide clothing no matter what size you are, and we can do this for other needs too.

people dismiss race realism debate without knowing how complex the underlying debate it is.
When i first encountered it I reacted similarly.
it's easy to dismiss it as racist hogwash when you haven't had to ponder things like Lewtonin's Fallacy , the genetic difference between groups , what the definition of race is, etc.

politically motivated scientific debates are much more interesting than boring vanilla scientific debates.

Yes, some races are superior to others in SOME real tangible ways that aren't spooks.

So what?

How is that going to make me richer?

you probably want to avoid having low performing/high crime groups in your workers paradise or whatever it is you're going for
they'll just bring you down with them, and they'd probably be happier on their own

And we already told you we don't care about the outcome as it does not affect our politics. How many times are you going to chase your own tail, shit for brains?

It doesn't matter, there is no clear cutoff for a subspecies. I was dismissing your argument that dogs were comparable. They are not. Neither are chimps. Race doesn't exist. But, I'd be curious if you can provide genetic mapping of the genes that structure Autism Level most prevalent in each respective """race""", then show how those genes interact with the environment and how those genes interact with other genes that interact with the environment. Then after, a study that controls for environment and test to look for the affects on the aforementioned genes?

You can't. Because it doesn't exist, because "race realist" are typically psychologist who abuse concepts like heritability and not biologist.

Which is why I said we've been through this shit already. Do you think you're the first thread to pander race realism here? Everything you mentioned has already been debated to death and back again. Hell, we're right next door to Neo-Nazis and you think people here aren't familiar with your arguments? You reek of reddit.

1. I don't think you speak for everyone here
2. it affects my politics, which run contrary to your politics. defeating my politics could help your politics. Is this just intellectual masturbation like libertarianism, or do you want to make some progress?

None of us give a shit. Especially if you aren't going to provide actual scientific evidence to support your case like I asked for in . Anyone can post meme-tier infographs.

I do, actually. Debate me. :^)

Because you based them on something stupid like that. Congratulations on admitting you're fucking retarded.

FTFY

Communism is inevitable. This is due to the inherent contradictions of the capitalist system. Material realities are all we care about, and as far as progress goes, it's going quite nicely. Automation will drive the majority out of work. This will result in the seizure of the means of production because the people will refuse to starve. White or black, you are all niggers to the bourgeoisie. So please, nigger, explain to me how you're so much better than those "other niggers" and why anyone should give a shit when you're all headed to the same place.

Not really, considering every time that's happened the goal post gets moved. The number of appeals to nature you can make are abundant, even without genetics.
Aside from all this, who wins a debate can sometimes come down plainly to who is more articulate or eloquent in pushing their position. It's not what I would call a great barometer for who is right, or even disseminating truth. I think you know this much, which makes me wonder what you're really after by having a public debate.

I'm not sure I understand. Why would I need to re-evaluate my positions based on your "race-realism"? What if I just don't like genocides and think we can manage without them?

also, this article was pretty instructive for me on the current understanding of race that's comin out of the scientific community. I don't know shit about biology and it still made sense to me se it's pretty layman friendly.

You see, this will be a giant waste of my time. We both know you aren't going to read the studies I link.
Your mind is made up, you aren't really a rational person who makes decisions based on a wealth of scientific data. You make decisions based on heuristics.
That is how you approach this question.

But anyway, let's get started. A gene variant was observed in humans that appeared to be linked to criminal and anti-social behavior.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monoamine_oxidase_A#Aggression_and_the_.22Warrior_gene.22
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1682278/pdf/ajhg00064-0013.pdf

Scientists raised rats mice and with an artificial version of this gene in several studies.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7792602
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3435113/pdf/nihms-400240.pdf
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17441000
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12372653
The mice and rats with this gene variant were absolute bastards, very aggressive.

Scientists then learned the gene variant predicts anti-social behavior in humans that had been mistreated as children
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12161658
Then they learned the gene variant predicts anti-social behavior in humans, generally
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24902785

Presence of the gene variant can predict the likelihood of someone going to prison
journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0093854809342839
the likely hood of someone being obese
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15034227
docs.google.com/file/d/0B4NGOBcoYImfakJhX3cxdHU2OVE/edit?pref=2&pli=1
and the likely hood of someone being in credit card debt
docs.google.com/file/d/0B4NGOBcoYImfUU5aLXNWazVqbkk/edit?pref=2&pli=1

Guess what racial in the united states has this gene variant most frequently? (Hint: Blacks)
sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0191886912004047

Being a carrier of this gene has already been used as a legal defense in court in the US.
psychologytoday.com/blog/the-human-beast/201007/pity-the-poor-murderer-his-genes-made-him-do-it

We have found a gene
that causes violence and antisocial behavior.
and is more common in blacks than Caucasians
If there is one, there can be more.

Come on guys

And that same study found that the gene was present in 56% of Chinese males who have a lower crime rate than White Males. Is this all you have? scientiasalon.wordpress.com/2014/07/31/the-extreme-warrior-gene-a-reality-check/

It is also worth noting that the majority of black people go to prison mainly due to non-violent drug offenses
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statistics_of_incarcerated_African-American_males#The_leading_causes_of_incarceration_for_African_American_males

The gene does people more violent. It seems you aren't debating that.

Human behavior is complex and ruled by many, many different genes.
It's safe to assume that the Chinese have other genes working in their favor.

I have still just proved race realism. I just pointed to a meaningful genetic difference between human populations that effects behavior.
Regardless of the Chinese, this gene is a component of the difference between black and white outcomes.

meant to reply here

I'm not denying MAOA-2R could be making people more violent. The earlier studies you link focused on 3R, but the scientific community has not shifted to focusing on 2R. Beaver, who conducted the research supporting this being an influence on violent behaviour said there hasn't been a large enough study to determine the effects of 2R and its interaction with 3R. The fact that 56% of Chinese men carry the 3R variant (only 2% less than Black men) makes me believe this is a spurious correlation, and if it isn't has not been studied sufficiently. An Epigenetic explanation for the expression of this gene in black men is a possibility, as I believe a correlation has been found in woman:

...

...

Key words here.
Geographically separated populations are a whole different sphere. Might want to rethink that.

I also don't see what this has to do with leftism in particular. But no, you didn't prove race realism. You provided a correlation between a single gene and anti-social behaviour which is contradicted by other races having high frequencies of this gene yet not exhibiting those same anti-social behaviour and failing to address and an epigenetic explanation. You seem to forget that we had a completely wrong explanation for something as simple as ulcers for decades, yet you think this is sufficient to prove that X race is objectively undesirable compared to Y. I'll tell you something, Grant Green ain't no subhuman. youtube.com/watch?v=XJxULTbg0Yg

Sure is. But are you suggesting dumbing down an entire curriculum to meet the lowest common denominator or sending them to other schools tailored to their needs?

False dichotomy, fam. Kill yourself.

Most of the observational studies I listed focused on both 2R and 3R. Some focused on only 2R.

The experiments with the mice suggest there is causation stemming from the gene variant itself.

My understanding is that the effect of the 3R is small, but not spurious or insignificant.
You are ignoring the possibility that there could be other genes at work here, perhaps effecting the behavior of Chinese men and counteracting the high prevalence of 3R.

But I think we can just ignore 3R. It seems fairly clear to me what 2R is doing per sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0191886912004047 and 2R is sufficient for my point.

2R causes bad juju
2R is more common among blacks
ergo there are genetic causes to differences in behavior and outcomes
ergo 'Race Realism'

You can't derive an ought from an is, thus despite races being different, your hierarchy stablished based on it is flawed

Lrn 2 basic philosophy

Can you define race realism?

why must you establish any political ideology based on science
why not simply stop denying it so you can properly approach the world?

that is not a false dichotomy, that is a poster asking you if either of those solutions are yours
clearly if not, then you write yours

The point was we don't.
The right does.

that is my off the cuff definition, it's not gospel

Jews aren't 50% of the worlds chess champions just because they have a culture of education.
Aboriginal Australians aren't 0% of the world's CEOs just because they live in projects and sniff petrol.
There are genetic components to each group's success and failure.

So here we have no significant difference in risk variant between 3R and 2R in black males. This is what Beaver said regarding 2R (and most of the hubbub on 2R causing violent behaviour is based on his research)

And as was pointed out in the comments on the piece I linked (which is by an anthropoligist who works in the biomed industry)

So I'm not going to rule out MAOA-2R causing anti-social behaviour, but I think the current research is far from vindicating race realism.

Willing to acknowledge that differences between people (especially neurological/psychological) may be affected by genetic lineage and using the most obvious marker of lineage (race) as a marker to help properly guide policy around any substantial differences.

Burden of proof is on you to prove that to be the case.

I'm not gonna read the thread, have any nazis ever posted a study that did not take the reality of race as fact (using the categories to structure the study)?

all of your studies take the ideas of "blacks" and "caucasians" as fact, and look for differences between these predetermined categories. (arbitrary categories)

How about the fact that on average a black brain has less grey matter than a white brain?

Because i am not an idealist

cute non-sequitur, but that's not what we're talking about, son.

There are no such thing averages

Why must you base any political ideology on (race) or other biological markers?

They happen to be so because it is a fairly common game in the west and because most jews live in cities nowadays not on farms, ashkenazi jews especially.
Computer chess players beat them all.

Most of them that haven't mixed with recent immigrants are trying to maintain their old culture.
They aren't CEOs because they do not chase coins and shuffle banknotes, they chase prey and shuffle sticks.

Success and failure at what?

Can you accept facts without denying them?
Must you deny all facts that do not affect your political stance?

Are you denying there are many more genes involved in brain development?

Has anyone other than a "nazi" done so?

How does your statement answer my two questions?

I can accept facts if they are facts.

I love how this question is framed, btw.
Definitely not an ideologue here.

Where did you get that?

jesus the teenage socialists in this thread make me sick

socialism must be scientific and race is pseudo science.

it was made up to explain the horrors of capitalism.

race is a fantasy of the world based on ZERO empirical science.

just to bolster your point

not race based studies. race is based on no empirical science and does not exist.

Idealists claim they can use something else other than materialism to defend their position in this case a goverment

Your second questio doesnt make anysense, you cant ignore what doesnt exist

Are you saying science doesn't exist?
What are you referring to that "does not exist"?.

So what is your problem with accepting the facts of differences in humans?

Nobody who talks about race actually cares about race. Nobody who's white who calls themselves a nationalist anywhere in the last 4 years is actually a nationalist. And nobody who calls themselves an anti feminist in the last 4 years is actually an antifeminist.

You're all arguing for nothing over abstractions of people you have no claim to be greater than, in a nation you have no hope of succeeding in.

Capitalism can be explained but not excused.
How are you saying race was made up though?

No i never said such thing
What i am talking about whe i say it doesnt exist is idealist philosophy, such as race idealism

All socialist accept differences in humans, in fact the difference between the worker and the owner is the basis of our ideology.

what we do not accept and what is completely made up is that human differences can be even semi-accurately categorized by the arbitrary concept of race. (a series of category that was created before the massive genetic mixing of the 20th century)

Who said I wasn't?
Are we having the same conversation, because you just seem to repeating the same question.

thats a claim made to answer race relations
however we now have science like genetics to show us that race does exist
is the writing of early 20th century people that denied race always going to be your answer? despite evidence to the contrary?

It was an invention of the ruling classes in the 1600s to squash worker solidarity.

...

Whether or not it effects intelligence is even a moot point in the society we live in, or any future one.

No, everyone I disagree with doesn't fall under the category of people I mentioned. I was mentioning liberal hypocrites who haven't even known a homeless person in their lives. You know

Social Democrats.

I support pro-black and other minority movements. Is that wrong of me to do so?

top kek

I did not understand the difference between 3R and 2R as well as I thought I did.

Because 2R is like 5% of the black population, he'd need a pretty large study.
The problem is no one is really throwing money at attempts to prove or disprove race realism.
That's part of the Alt-Right line on Race Realism, and the explanation for why this information is out there already.

I often run into this when digging through research surrounding this subject.
"Interesting stuff, but more studies are needed, let's not jump to any conclusions!"
tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00049538608259009
The null hypothesis was disproven, big implications were on the horizon, but then funding and interests dry up and you hit a dead end.
Then 30 years go by and no one has done any more research on the subject. Sad.

Fair enough. I think there are other compelling cases to be made for Race Realism because of things like pics related.

Expecting everyone to be a genius like you is degrading to everyone who isn't.

Yes because Gommies are fedora atheists on steroids. All culture, all minorities, all religions, must be dissolved, and folded into one universal human archetype, modeled on themselves, by force. They despise diversity and difference.

it was a claim made to report reality.

how does that chart even prove race? do you have a source that explains the different colors and why the fact that literally every color exists in every category doesn't completely disprove the categories?

If you asked me to sort m&ms by color and I gave you piles looking like that shit you'd think I was a retard.

you are a retard.

The point was that race had a political motivation for it from the beginning and it was "made up". The fact you think you hand wave and move the goal post shows me how intellectually dishonest you are though.
Thanks.

Yes I am calling you a hypocrite.

What?

Up your dosage.

I'm not you liberal bureaucrat hooker fucker

...

the boundaries between the groups are arbitrary, but the groups themselves are not arbitrary, and the differences between them are real.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cline_(biology)

I think both of you are cancer, but at least when I argue with anfem poster I feel she knows her shit. Sucdem poster is just kind of lazy and butthurt all the time..

Black and white thinking, or splitting, is a feature of personality disorders.

take your meds

You literally share the same opinions of a teenage American as a liberal finnish wanna be Bureaucrat

How the fuck aren't you

It depends on what you support and how you support them. Trying to eliminate means of material oppression like, say, apartheid is one thing. Trying to integrate these groups into bourgeois society or just get them more bourgeois "rights" like the "right" to marry is another.

Your posts are a compelling case for you to be fucking retarded.

The historical development of Northern Italy is a world removed from that of Southern Italy and has nothing at all to do with the fiction of race and everything to do with the political trajectories of medieval Western Europe, which aren't fucking made up bullshit like race and instead are material, historical facts.

If intelligence is entirely genetic then I hope you're sterile so your fucking retardation never goes beyond you to poison the rest of humanity.

living in fantasy worlds is symptomatic of reaction.

When did this become a meme lol. I'll take some baby aspirin to deal with your awful posts.

By showing the different makeup of the populations.
If you made a similar one with chimpanzees and humans, mice and humans, dogs and humans, snake and humans then the shared colors would be smaller and smaller.

They are genetic markers.

A spectrum from tree to bush does not disprove trees and bushes. You understand that a spectrum from one grain of sand to the sahara desert does not disprove either?

Did you just spazz out and make no sense for the sole purpose of saying "retard" twice?

There was no "moving of a goal post" the whole point was that race does exist.
A claim saying race doesnt exist, written before genetics became studied at the molecular level, should not be used as a refutation because it can not possibly meet the desired goal.

Well done, you've certainly got my number. In a week I've been accused of being post-left, succdem, 3rd positionist, liberal, nazi, fascist, anarkiddie, Marxist, anti-Marxist, syndicalist, fed and a pollack.

Welcome to my world, where people try to label me as one of their bogeyman because I have fact based opinions instead of taking any one ideology wholesale and regurgitating it as the pure truth.

It's probably because you're an idiot who shares the opinions of American teenagers.

So no source? "genetic markers" decided on because of their affinity for specific geographical regions?

If your "science" can't tell if someone is definitely human or a dog why do you believe in its validity?

Are you an autist? Do you not understand what a metaphor is?

Anybody who looks at genetics for intelligence doesn't understand how many factors outside genes effect intelligence. Stress and chemicals.

...

sleep, and nutrition mostly.

...

This is why we need actual nazis

IQ is mostly heritable. Estimates range from 50%-80%
www1.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/reprints/1997mainstream.pdf

It was a question of whether it was made up

I was bolstering this point.
What that poster meant by "empirical science", I have no idea.

Chemicals and stressors effect the developing brain more than anything else, as do actual physical injuries to the skull. "Getting dropped on your head too many times as a child", does in fact, lead you to be pretty fucked up.

Better than being the world's worst hypocrite, petit-bourgeois scum. So many screencaps, so many memories.

Are you talking about medical professionals? Do you think anarchy is Mad Max where these things don't exist?

This is brilliant coming from the dude who larps as a Finnish bureaucrat who can afford even a trap prostitute

I don't blame you for being wary of giving you the cold truth about what is wrong with you.

Pic saved btw

IQ testing is flawed

Also for fuck sakes people sage

Hello Scientologist

it's the best thing we got. It can predict your likelyhood of being Obese, of going to prison, of getting into Harvard.
It can be flawed and still have predictive value.

BR Here, what point is your map even trying to make, do you have any idea what the economical and geographical conditions of the places like the extreme north and northeast are like? How it all developed had nothing to do with race then and has nothing to do with race now.

How are you STILL posting?

Why are you posting on Holla Forums and not fucking the hookers you say you fuck on the daily lol

Are you kidding me. It mostly just leads patients on into flinging their own way to "cope".

It has almost zero imperical evidence to back up its claims. It just a new opiate of the masses, talking proles into chocking down their shit sandwiches instead of fighting

Look, it's super late here and I want to go to sleep and would rather read some theory before I go to bed than argue more about race realism so I'm going to come back to this thread tomorrow.

You can find the same value in a Meyers Briggs test if that's your standard.
Call me when people can finally agree on what "general intelligence" is.

What in the fuck are you talking about now? You literally don't even inhabit reality. I oppose prostitution, I'm a radfem.

This is psychology. Psychiatry is actually, an entirely different field. You are confused, because both have the word "psych" in them. Maybe we do work in the same offices, but our jobs are entirely different.

One is the cognitive behavior therapist, the other is actually not the therapist.

However, the results from things like DBT speak for themselves.

We have quite repeated observable peer reviewed medical research actually.

This is an empty statement. Teenager tier.

...

Coreillation does not equal causation. This why psychology is so convoluted. When ever it encounters something that breaks their model they just expand it more until you have this huge fragile tower of shit

Lmao, it's g. It's been g for 100 years.

So its only heirtable in half of the cases

Good job

Holy tiny-nimble-asian-fingers, how do you shitpost so fast?
I'd be jealous if I didn't find you so abhorrent most of the time.

Yeah, and they can't agree on what g is, fam.

And you claim not to be irrational…

Remember when you said "the medication """we""" prescribe doesn't cause brain damage"

mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/07/03/antipsychotics-and-brain-damage-shrinkage-volume-loss/

You talk out of your cunt continuously, you have a deranged, puerile mind, and yet you have the audacity to call others teens?

What personality disorder have you been Dx'd with btw? It obviously goes deeper than depression.

This is the one thing I'll talk about before I go to sleep.

"Heritabilty" is a correlation between genetic variation in a population and phenotypic variation. It does not mean Autism Level is 50-80% heritage, it means it has a heritability of 50-80%. The Bell Curve (and psychologist mis-use of this, like Richard Lynn) is why it's regarded as psuedoscience.

To illustrate what I mean, I'll use Lewontin's example. Let's say you have two beds to plant seeds in, one is very dry and lacks nutrients and the other is rich in nutrients while being very "wet". You plant the seeds in each bed and then take height measurements of the plants. Now, seeing as the seeds were all identical any variation in height will be due to genetic variation, so the heritability is 100% or 1. However, this does not tell us anything about what genes "code" for height, and how those genes interact with other genes, the environment, or how the genes those genes interact with, interact with the environment.

Similarly, if everyone in a village had the same allele for brown hair (which happens in Eskimo villages), the heritability for that trait would be 0 because there is no phenotypic variation. But the trait would be considered highly "heritable".

Psychiatrists can prescribe drugs. Numbing the fuck out of someone just so they can face another day of exploitation isn't treating any mental illness.

Don't know what peer reviewed science you're talking about but if it's about drugs that's just drug making, being able to change a persons state of mind with drugs doesn't make you a doctor anymore than a bartender.

You're right, I.Q scores don't cause kids to get into Harvard,
however they do correlate strongly with the mystical phenomenon of General Intelligence
and general Intelligence causes kids to get into Harvard, among other things.

Correlation = predictive value

It meant in the general sense of antidepressants, but if you truly want to take people who need antipsychotics off antipsychotics you're the actual evil here.

Genetics DOES play a role though no? And with more and more studies suggesting that 'intelligence' is 'mainly genetic', then this whole topic surely requires dispassionate and entirely rational study? Study that is essentially blocked by PC these days.

Sure buddy, you guys are like economists, shit gets worse but it can't be that the entire field which claims to be able to address these problems can't be bullshit,

Yeah, it is mystical alright.
They can't even agree on what "g" is.
Zero understanding of what the causation is. Sad!

Nope, I'm not for that at all, I've stated elsewhere that anyone who has seen florid psychosis cannot be full Foucauldian like that Fruedfag I also stomped into the pavement. Pushing antipsychotics for off-label indications, onto children, is what I disagree with. And the fact that apparently, the state wants to give someone as disturbed and idiotic as you the license to do this.

Only shrill lefties ITT have said anything about 'culling'.

It's a correlation. Period end of story. If you're so big on correlations then why don't you support asians being automatically be accepted to Harvard instead of white people, there's a. Very strong correlation between that race and college graduation. You just pick and choose what correlations you want to follow

"The unusual trustworthiness of science, despite the fact that scientists are humans and humans are not generally trustworthy, exists when (a) hypotheses are falsifiable, and (b) the professional institutions within which scientists operate promote, broadcast, and reward any falsification. We can trust a consensus of scientists on a problem for which (a) and (b) are true, because we are basing our trust on the fact that, if the hypothesis is false, a large number of very smart people has tried and failed to discover its error. This is not, of course, impossible. But it is at least unlikely."

When academia has observable bias, we should give less weight to what comes out of it.

Also you're a fucking liar, because you clearly said that as a blanket statement about all medications you imagine yourself to be prescribing. Luckily even if you do somehow attain your license, you're likely to be stripped of it for negligence after a very short amount of time.

Prove that changing a persons state of mind treats their mental illness.

Kinda of funny how all these mental illnesses are life long afflictions and not the result treatments failing

I was saying shit out my ass you're right. I'm not going to defend that. In my view, in the general view, benefit outweighs hazard. The same is true of all prescriptions.

The brain is any other organ, and can be harmed.

Here is one source, there are many others:
archive.is/LcPkP

yeah, no.

Neither the claim you're making that I said that nor the claim you say I've said are true.

Yes, the bourgeoise do not like to talk about how poverty, their manifactured ideology and other apparatuses used to keep them in power cquse people to develop communities which material conditions cquse people to hqve lower lQ lvls due to stress, bad nurturing, unheqlthy food and so on

Height correlates to sex.
You wouldn't hesitate to say that men are on average taller than women.
No one would be shouting 'Don't generalize!' If you made these comments about height.
Well actually maybe they would be, I haven't been on a college campus in a while.

Correlation suddenly becomes insufficient when interacting with touchy, politically charged subjects like Autism Level.

Post proofs you're in medical school.

Also if medications were so successful how come you're still fucked up?

Nuh-uh!!

I'm going to sleep

And I keep telling you that a claim made with no proof that is disproven by a superior method (genetics rather than rhetoric) can not be reused. It is proven wrong, using it again wastes our time because we just link you all the genetic data for the last several decades - and there is much.

Hrm…..

How your body reacts to stress and the various signalling molecules is also genetic. Do you know how your body knows "stress levels" or understands signals it sends to itself? Receptors are genetic.

That isnt what the genetic ideqlists claims however, genetic and race idealists would clqim that all women should be executed and sterilized for being shorter

Thats the key difference

Chimps have more than 3x the genetic distance when measured in SNP, and even then that only allows for about 3 clear subspecies. sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/04/070420104723.htm

It would be so easy to prove race realism wrong if anyone wanted to.
You would just need a large, well controlled, trans-racial adoption study.
Why has no one done this?

And what defines a 'valid' taxonomical classification?

That wouldnt prove anything

Do you even know why the term lewontins fallacy exists?

No it means it was environment, that is simple. However when you take those seeds and plant them in a range of the same substrates - then you can see something else.

Why do you think 100% inheritance of the only possible gene means the heritability is 0?

there are moderate race realists, who basically just want to do away with affirmative action.

it's really troubling how many of our definitions are arbitrary when you get down to brass tax

Too bad for them, as there are radical egoists, which basically want to see spooked cunts like you suffer

No one has made that claim here except yourself, and we are at many replies.

There were two more adoption studies that found contradictory results. One of them found a higher Autism Level for black children raised in white households than in black households, supporting a cultural hypothesis.

psycnet.apa.org/journals/dev/22/3/317/
jstor.org/stable/1127540?origin=crossref&seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

Even then, the Minnesota study did not control for prenatal conditions.

A clear cutoff between races.

Has nothing to do with Lewontins fallacy (which isn't a fallacy, research had vindicated what he claimed).

I'm starting to believe you can't actually read. Do you understand what I was typing? The seeds were in an identical environment, they were identically harvested etc - any phenotypic variation is going to be due to genetic variation.

Because "heritably" is not a measure of how heritable a trait is irregardless of environment. It's a correlation between phenotypic variation and genetic variation. If you don't know what that means, then I don't know what to say.

That's an interesting factoid. Did you mean to be offtopic?

...

Well then, since racial differences would be of no political or social use, they are virtually irrelevant

No, I'm claiming that the infographs about "races" is misrepresenting the significance of genetic distance in terms of SNP between races by using pretty colors.

debunkingstormfags.blogspot.com/ btw

...

Literally spooky

*Ratttles*

Are you referring to this wikipedia article that was edited with clumsiness?

In the 2007 paper "Genetic Similarities Within and Between Human Populations",[21] Witherspoon et al. attempt to answer the question, "How often is a pair of individuals from one population genetically more dissimilar than two individuals chosen from two different populations?". The answer depends on the number of polymorphisms used to define that dissimilarity, and the populations being compared. When they analysed three geographically distinct populations (European, African and East Asian) and measured genetic similarity over many thousands of loci, the answer to their question was "never".

However, measuring similarity using smaller numbers of loci yielded substantial overlap between these populations. Rates of between-population similarity also increased when geographically intermediate and admixed populations were included in the analysis.[21]

The however part is literally showing the ignorance of whoever added that to the wikipedia.
Measuring smaller numbers of loci means you don't get the whole picture.
It is like asking how often can you mistake a pair of boots for a spoon? If you obscure most of these items and only see a small shiny metal part or something greyish then you might confuse a pair of boots and a spoon some of the time.
That does not mean when you see the whole picture (many genes or all genes) that you would ever confuse the two.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_Genetic_Diversity:_Lewontin's_Fallacy

I'm done responding to ignorance for today, the same disproven lies continue being rehashed in every one of these threads with a plentitude of strawmen.

Mods can you PLEASE start banning Stirnerfags now? They really shit up every conversation.

No one has said that a particular set of knowledge is of no political use.

Butthurt

imma stay right here my, man.

I just did

We understand races are different, what is the objective political use of this?

Could you prove your claim though? SNP is not the only method used but one of many.

...

I reject your claim.
The political use of this is not patronizing everyone by claiming they should follow a single global culture and do away with their local culture.

And I reject yours

Top kek

Humans are clinal, there is no cutoff from "negroid" to "mongloid" from Europe to Africa. It's possible to put people into "clumps" within a cline, but it does not support 19th century taxonomic classifications.

No, I mean Rosenbergs study in 2008 that sequenced 650 000 single-nucleotide polymorphisms.

How would you like to measure genetic distance then? You need to use the same measurement for both species. I recall a paper by a race realist academic who used two different measurements, mTNDA for Chimps and SNP for humans. That was a laugh.

the Minnesota study wasn't good.
The black kids were mostly adopted later than the white kids. Not rigorously controlled enough.
also not a stormfag.

Ah ha!
But what if my local culture is shit, and I want to see it go away?
I reject your spooks

I'm not a socdem you faggot

So do you just like masquerading as a faggot then?

It's just boring, and retarded.

It's the equivalent of being an ultra-smug solipsist.

Nice

much like your posting

Except stirner is not a solipsist, retard

Why do you hate your parents?

Anyway, nobody has said that we are soloely a product of our genes. But to say they play no role is dishonest.

ghr.nlm.nih.gov/primer/traits/intelligence

If you're born with the worst set of genes, as far as intelligence goes, then no amount of education and environment will make you a genius but can still have a massive effect on your intelligence. There was a Russian tsar who as an experiment acquired a boon at a young age and gave it THE BEST possible education and upbringing. A few generations later this guys progeny was a composer.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abram_Petrovich_Gannibal

Now as much as OP said this wasn't about policy, fuck you OP. If the science was to be 'settled' then of course policy would flow from it. So lets consider the example of the black Russian composer again. Over a couple of generations (and a bit of miscreation) a black was made into a genius. So the question is, is it worth the effort at the expense of those who may have been genetically smarter? What greatness are you throwing away to achieve mediocrity?

Parents are a spook.

Yeah but it's just as refreshing and wild a new idea.

It's like if Holla Forums's redpills were literally just screeching "REDPILL" at everything they don't believe in. It makes you look like a fucking moron, and 95% of the meme fags haven't even read Stirner.

Why do you hate people in general?

I'm pretty sure you're just salty because he offends your spooky sensibilities.

Who's cunt did you spill out of if not your mother's?

There is no such thing as local culture

Not a socdem, but you're a crustie heroin addict with a subnormal I.Q. who thinks posting striner memes is an argument.

You hqve a socdem flag in case you have not noticed

Nice spook

I'm sorry, but did you make an argument?
because I'm not detecting one on your side either.

I love this meme, it's literally the gayest thing I've ever seen.

But no I don't have an argument, I'm just trying to get all the worst offenders to be so humiliated, that they stop derailing every thread, so the adults can have a discussion, becuase the mods refuse to gulag you. In any case, you infantile spastics are a salt mine.

I'm still not seeing an argument.
I think trivially arguing with anfem poster has worn you out. I think you need a nap. come back and post afterwards tho.

I destroyed Stirnerites like 100 threads ago. Why do I need to repeat myself.

Measuring smaller numbers of loci means you don't get the whole picture.
It is like asking how often can you mistake a pair of boots for a spoon? If you obscure most of these items and only see a small shiny metal part or something greyish then you might confuse a pair of boots and a spoon some of the time.
That does not mean when you see the whole picture (many genes or all genes) that you would ever confuse the two.

I don't think you understand. They're making the argument that when you look at the human population as a whole, there is no clear cutoff. It's up to you to prove that the small differences between continental populations are biologically releavnt. Something you got close to with MAOA, but then fell flat on your face when the first correlation with MAOA-3R was more common in Taiwanese than in Niggers, and MAOA-2R showed no significance when compared with MAOA-3R when comparing the crime/depression rates of nigger children with both.

Holy fuck, no one ever said that genes play no role. I claimed that this is not what "heritability" measures.
Let me ask once again: do you understand what the words "genetic variation", "phenotypic variation" and "population" mean.

Yes, this is related to heritability. You might've missed the "within a population" part. This means that genetic variation is responsible for 50-70% of the phenotypic variation of Autism Level.

I would mention that if you scroll down to the next paragraph, they say:

Whoops! Which is what I was saying. Heritability is not testing for which genes are doing what and how those genes interact with their environment. It's entirely possible to have a heritability of 1 for a trait and have all phenotypic variation be environmental. debunkingdenialism.com/2012/08/11/the-widespread-abuse-of-heritability/

I should say correlated.

I don't think you understand the study, look at it and see it, tell us what you just said
is correct, and become a comedian

Yes, I'm sure you masterfully dismantled Stirner. Now go to bed, my property.

See second sentence heren

Stirnerfags are basic as fuck and you're a waste of time. Most of you haven't read Stirner, I'd be happy to discuss with people capable of cogitating or having a rational thought, but it's just an irritating board shitting method, JTRIG would be proud

No that is literally not possible.
Your example here makes no sense:
the heritability for that trait would be 0 because there is no phenotypic variation
because;
Why do you think 100% inheritance of the only possible gene means the heritability is 0?

Anyway, we're talking in circles here. Genes DO have an effect of intelligence. That we don't know exactly which combinations of genes lead to what intelligence is is not excuse for you to dismiss or downplay the genetic factor.

ReeeeEEEE what are we even arguing about then?

Wew
Good thing neither Stirner or I ever said these things.
Are you sure you're not the one that only skimmed the Ego and his Own?

Like I said earlier. You can have the two seed beds, the heritability for the height of the plants in both cases in 1. The disparity between the plant heights between the two beds is almost completely environmental.

Here's an example of how useless heritability is:

I'm not downplaying the genetic factor. I'm asking you to provide me with gene mapping of nigger Autism Level and white Autism Level.

You use it as a thought terminating cliche, nothing more, nothing less. And you're arrogant cum dumpsters about it.

Here's an idea, maybe make a thread about that 1 book out of literally thousands worth reading, and discuss it in there

This is the study I meant btw: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18245521

I'm trying to decipher this word salad, but it just aint happening chief.

Why? You I can't. Absence of evidence =/= evidence of absence. But you know this right? If I were to start the search I'd begin by looking at the genes that encode for cranium size and 'folds' in the grey matter, as both of these have been tied to intelligence.

Because that's what is going to convince me of race realism. Until then, I have black friends I like who are pretty good guys. Some of them are smart, some are dumb. I know a lot of white trash, and I know a lot of smart white kids. This isn't compelling enough for me to go 14/88.

Wow you're such an intellectual, why did i ever doubt you were well read and not a posing little spaz

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cliché#Thought-terminating_clich.C3.A9

Nobody is asking you to go full 1488. But I suspect part of you doesn't want to know the answer (and there is an answer) on ideological grounds. IF you're not interested in the correct answer then your motive behind posting is dishonest. You'd rather shut down the debate cause you fear you may be wrong.

kek. I'll tell you what, when we get transhumanism lets make all the niggers rocket scientist and Jazz musicians because of their dumb nigger genes. It's not particularly relevant to leftist thought, or to my life.

Hahaha, perfect admission of cortical blindness from ideological cancer.

Your thought terminating cliche term is a thought terminating cliche.

No it isn't. You've just been outed and routed yet again, don't you ever get tired of it? The more interesting point here is why Leftists are so frequently such masochistic gluttons for punishment?

Why did you kill Rosa?

Why did you kill all those priests, all those ethnic minorities ("""kulaks"""), all the original Bolsheviks, oh never mind, you'll be a mendacious worm til the day you fortuitously (for the rest of us) expire

You can't find any way to use it other than to avoid talking about Stirner, so you're also using a thought terminating cliche as a thought terminating cliche.
I'm frankly embarrassed for you.
Sad!

No you gibbering bonobo, I'm saying get your shity memes out of every fucking thread, which you use solely to disrupt not to enlighten, and make one for Stirner if you're so insistent on sucking his dick 24/7, that is if you are capable of discussing the material in detail… ?

you got triggered hard by a power-level barrier meme. Calm down, and think about you are doing.

Maybe if Stirner wasn't relevant in this shitty thread you wouldn't see him. :^)

I'll never calm down, being mad online perpetually is my speciality. I am trying to clean up the left, while the posters you dickride insist on making the left come off as somehow worse than literal nazi's.

How you going to do that?
Digging up Rosa and stabbing her one more time?

Why even live?

I'm starting to think Lord Keynes is on leftypol.

yeah, how dare they use leftist in-jokes on a forum dedicated to leftists. What's next? Using "tankie" when they really mean "fellow leftist that, unfortunately, defends the actions of regimes such as the Soviet Union's that I consider to be non-defendible"?

Stirner memes ruin every thread tho

You can't clean up the left because you aren't a leftist

We'll see :^)

for you

'We' are a spook

Just stop it.

It is a spook

that does not show uselessness of heritability
it shows that if you compare the plants in the same environment you will figure out that they indeed do have the same genes (barring that for some reason you seem to not be testing their genes to see they are infact the exact same genomes)
The "example" of china and australia isnt a proof of heritability not being useful just that the conclusion does not follow
china might have more genes that affect height, that is an unknown

No it doesn't. I don't think you understand heritability my dude. It isn't measuring the extent to which genes influence something. It's a correlation between environmental influence vs genetic influence. I'm glad you agree the conclusion doesn't follow, because those are exactly the type of conclusions made by race realist. Comparing separate populations living in different environments using a measurement meant to test for a correlation regarding genetic variation within a population.

...

Sorry can't draw for shit on this tablet. I'll make an even worse one soon.

This guy is correct. Spookposters are insufferable. Literally derail every thread into stupid and unwinnable semantic arguments. It's almost like they know their ideology is empty of potential and are seeking to drag everyone to their level.

Not him but it seems to me that you are being dishonest.

Look at recessive genes. The chances of a child being born without a soul is 100% dependent on the parents carrying the no-soul gene.

I can't keep arguing against this strawman.

If you raise a bunch of people in an indenticl environment, environmental variation is low. Therefore most phenotypic variation will be correlated with genetic variation. Tell me where this addresses the extent to which a gene determines a trait?

No. There's no point.

We will never be free until the last tripfag is hung by the entrails of the last spookposter.

There's real differences between races (and genders) but that's not a reason to discriminate against them. All you're doing is making yourself look like a simpleton.

What the fuck am i reading?

It's almost like you like living under literally retarded political systems.

The lack of certain genes mean a 100% chance of the baby having certain traits. If your parents don't have red hair gene, you won't be a red-head. It's hardly a massive leap to go from this to saying gene or group of genes A will result in physical properties X, Y and Z. You're doing a PHD in this though so you already know this, just as you know pinpointing exact genes for physical traits is not an exact science in most cases, the exception being in certain genetic mutations where we know that carrying X gene will result in defect Y.

Height seems a fair example no? Height is largely driven by genes.

medicaldaily.com/height-isnt-only-determined-tall-gene-hundreds-genes-some-not-even-directly-related-growth-306365

Not that guy but we're leading astray from the point about what heritability measure.
You have the example said earlier about variation of heritability in height;
But on the opposite, you have traits with very strong genetic influence with a very low heritability, like the number of fingers.

and yet, the underlying causes of junkie parents in a fucked system is not addressed. No matter how good the schools are, if the kids don't go then you wasted your time.

Being educated isn't just about pouring money into schools. Its about ensuring proper housing, nourishment and personal guidance. These are all things poor black males lack. The root cause of this is the mass deracination of black people during the imperial period.

When you take people off their land, break up their families, community structures, support network, physically and mentally degrade them, this generation of people degenerates. If you hold this in place for several generations, the degeneration intensifies. The entire black social strata is fucked. It needs to be unfucked.

If you think you can peaceably deport around a 12% of the population you are completely delusional. You are talking about outright civil war, with only about a quarter (probably less) of the whites actually on your side. At best, a 50/50 split. Most of the military had grandfathers who fought in WW2 against Hitler. Or uncles who served with black guys in Vietnam. They aren't going to be on your side.

Factor in finding countries within the international community who are willing to absorb your pre packaged migrant crisis.

Its like gun control. In fact its a lot like gun control. You are never going to be able to round up all the guns in America. Its never going to happen. Better to fund mental health services and making sure people don't get into gangs then trying to round up all the guns and ship them out of the country or have some expensive, bureaucratic permit system.

Even if what you are saying is true, your proposed solutions are totally ludicrous when it when you could simply remove the oligarchy and then everybody could receive the equivalent of a private education, there could be adequate social services and we could afford to provide real community housing that isn't financially and racially segregated into ghettoes which are the perfect breeding ground for gangs.

I could go on and on

I'd like to add into that that young black males are among the most armed section of the population and also some of the most willing to do violence. Have fun fighting a guerrilla war against every ghetto in America

you have been visited by the bolsheviks of revolution. socialism will come to your country, but only if you post "there's nothing to race realism go gulag yourself porky scum" in this thread.

This is essentially giving them the never-ending excuse tho. If you continue to excuse bad behaviour as a result of shit that happened 200 years ago then they're never going to change. If you think I'm exaggerating then what do you say can be done to make up for this deracination?

Maybe so but that itself is an aside to the issue, the issue being are there genetic root causes for certain neurological traits?

Surely this is a commie myth? Even accounting for everything else, not every teacher will be the same. Not every school will be able to employ PHDs as secondary teachers. It's like saying 'you'll only work a job that you like and the hours that you choose'. Like it or not, somebody has to empty bins, stitch clothes, work the mines. My point, there will still be a multi-tier society.

That shit is being automated right the fuck now, nigger.

At no point did I excuse criminal behaviour. I explained it, that is different. I explained it in order to shed light on possible solutions for this behaviour.

As this is a socialist website, my solution is obviously that socialism, particularly, in my opinion, libertarian socialism, will be able to provide the public services required to begin to reverse the years of degeneration.

I said above that this deracination can be characterised as the systematic destruction of the community. To re-establish it I therefore suggest the re-reinstatement and strengthening of the community. In my own mind, this is the embodiment of Anarchism, Libertarian socialism. To give the people power over their own environment to change it. You think people like living in shit? No, but they have no power to change it. They don't own their own workplace, school, home, anything at all. They live off hand outs from other people. They have very little option in getting off of these hand outs as, as the right rightly suggests, they engender and environment of dependency. The lack of ownership of even their own nourishment, combined with the utter failure of American democracy to deliver the will of the people to we, the people, they have no mechanism at all to make these functions suit their needs and so their needs go unmet and so the degeneration continues.

THE FUNDS ARE THERE. The funds are siphoned off into CIA wars in Libya that cause immigration crisis in Europe. In CIA wars in Iraq and Afghanistan that create ISIS. Into the pockets of banksters in order to prop up an economy that THEY CRASHED. Into working tax credits where WE THE TAXPAYER pay the wages of WE THE TAXPAYER because private companies don't want to pay wages to their employees. The funds go to Nato, the UN, the EU. The funds go to government pay packets and champagne parties. The funds go to molesting children on Jeffrey Epstein's private jet. The funds go to deposing Allende and supporting Contra Death squads. The funds go to rigging elections. The funds go to a corrupt police force designed to inflict violence upon you, the citizen and a failed drug war that has kill millions. The funds get lost to embezzlement and corruption. The funds fund Rob Fords crack habit. The funds find their way into offshore bank accounts and Swiss vaults. The funds fund eastern European prostitutes and cocaine parties. The funds are fucking there.

which answers:

...

Sorry I didn't actually answer this

and if somebody HAS to do or society would suffer, then the people who do these things deserve decent living conditions and working environments.

Gay.

...

Sorry, only the vast majority of posters here are neoliberal apologists spouting propaganda they don't even understand, I'll try be more nuanced in my ongoing perma-meltdown over the state of the left in 2016

You realize social democracy is the world we live in today in Europe and it still fucking sucks

Nothing's ever good enough, is it?

CLOSE ALL BORDERS
ONLY ALLOW LEFTISTS INSIDE YOUR COUNTRY

Get off your end of history bullshit.

We've had social democracy with neo-liberal characteristics since about the end of world war two. Its crashed about every ten/fifteen years. Social Democracy in action was the reaction to the crash of 2007, where we picked up the check for banks that were too big to fail. The welfare state provides welfare for the rich in the form of safety from the poor.

This

If social democracy is so great why is there mass unrest in Europe?

DEPORT ALL NAZIS

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Nah don't deport us, we're de-pozzifying the left through our dazzling argumentative acumen.

Social democracy will crash, ask the public to fix it, then collapse into neoliberalism again. It will not bring about communism. Pretty much no social democrat politician is even trying to bring about communism. The ones that are are widely derided. Its a band aid tactic. But the capitalism is still there and the capitalism is the problem. You realise Europe is rich off the fat of international finance yes? All those churches and castles, that shit didn't come from nowhere. The only reason Europe isn't currently a shithole is because we have hoarded wealth for years.

I realise the history. I think Communism will collapse into authoritarian capitalism every time, and it has, and it's worse than fixable neoliberalism, if the proletariat waits up and the petit-bourgeois faggots who populate the radleft stop being such elitist dreamers who tolerate psychopaths within their ranks. Neoliberalism simply wasn't sufficiently opposed by the quasi-leftists ingrained into the system in academia, NGO's, the past lives of "left" politicians. They wanted it to kill off le ebin white supremacy maymay, and shortcut to global proletariat. So they colluded in fucking up unions etc. The left is as much within the fabric of capitalism as the right, even its revolutions within capitalism reproduce it, sorry. SocDem is a bandaid, everythings a bandaid, because the perpetual revolution of technology changes everything. Your fantasies about an international revolution are just not going to happen. When? In 10 years, 20? 50? 100? Do you have any idea how different everything will be by then? And yet you tend to support ultra short term policies which always seem to favour neoliberalism. Hrrrmm…

waits=wakes

To clarify, I don't know either, no one knows. But I know the conditions of the possibility of the inevitable surpassing of capitalism require something like healthy social democratic states. The left hates white people, even the """anti-idpol""" left, so they don't care about fucking them up as a byproduct of neoliberalism, it's weird and gay, and it's not anti-idpol it's just its cryptic inversion.

Weebs to the killing fields!!!!

**inevitable surpassing of capitalism = with something actually better, sorry rambling a bit. It's a complicated thesis and doesn't really suit shitposts

Also I said communism, which is a stateless society, achievable when capitalism has exhausted itself, not your cringey bootlicking dystopia litany of failures.

Whoops.

I'm all for quarantining leftists to just one country and closing the borders down from the other side though. This country would have to be continental so you can lock it down from all sides, no access to sea and strict control on rivers.

Agreed, the left would be great if it wasn't for all the leftists.

We could take bets on how many hours it takes for them to orgiasticly start killing eachother over theoretical minutiae.

Oh really, which country was communist again? Seeing as how you know the history

So you prefer Batista to Castro? Interesting.

you mean social democrats.

> The left is as much within the fabric of capitalism as the right, even its revolutions within capitalism reproduce it, sorry.

Ha, wut?

It does not by necessity change the relationship of ownership, which is what socialism seeks to change.

I suggest, Mr Social Democrat, that you don't actually know what socialism is.

My fantasy is already happening, people all over the place are opening up co-ops, its a growing idea,

Excuse me? Which policies are these?

I'm also just speechless that I am being accused of neo-liberal fraternizing by a fucking Socdem. The fucking nerve of this asshole

Stay mad

Agreed. My point was just that all things will never be absolutely equal. If making things equal is your ideology you should be honest about what you want to take form whom to bring about this equality.

You think you have a spiritual linkage to past and current socialist movements, via some mechanism of metaphysical "solidarity" don't you? You think professing an ideology lumps people together across time and space, it's this bizarre habit of thought I've noticed. That's why it's "I'M accused of fraternizing with neoliberals", no you weren't, you're nobody. Most of leftist theory and praxis these days seems to be about assigning labels and categories to shit and that's about it.

if you're only answer to alll of those points was 'stay mad' you're probably the mad one right now fam.

I'm high and shitposting. This is what I do fam, I don't get mad.

>My point was just that all things will never be absolutely equal

What we want is for people to have equal empowerment. After that the conditions are there own to decide. That is, all are equal in their rights over themselves, other people and their community. Currently, in a system based around private property this is not the case.

Kek whatever you say, nice """points""". Put the bong down son, it's making you retarded

What if I told you that not only did I kill Rosa, I enjoyed it?

Haven't said a word about solidarity. You will notice that it was a string of social democratic parties that imposed austerity and bailed out the banks. These are not socialists. This is neo-liberal collusion.

Historically, anarchist communists have not colluded with liberals.

and again the fact that you drop down to remarks like 'you are nobody' leads me to believe that again it is you who are mad.

So you don't think my points constitute points, would you perhaps care to debunk one of them or all of them, say, point by point?

Even with my daily bong, I am less retarded than you, how does that make you feel?

...

Literally shaking right now: the post

You said communism always collapses back into authoritarian capitalism and yet there has never been communism on earth.

You said it is ALWAYS worse than neo-liberalism so I asked you if you preferred Batista or Castro

What exactly about these points is so retarded?

Its funny how you have to resort to

a literal ad hominem.

>literally speechless the nerve of this fucking asshole!

Added an exclamation mark to put spin on what I said, speechlessness is an expression of bewilderment in this case, at your lack of self awareness.

I haven't degenerated to personal comments, just historical analysis so AGAIN, probably you that is mad.

But since lQ levels are just 50% genetic, they will end up increasing their lQ levels as generations go by

lQ is irrelevant anyway

You are fucking stupid, hopefully you have killed yourself by now

I may be stupid but at least I have friends IRL and don't work 2 jobs for porky.

Still laughing, thanks guy

Also,
gahhahaha

I'd be pretty appalled if anyone here wasn't stoned tbqh famalam

Alright, goodnight losers. I'll see you on the next thread with a new ideology and flag

Still waiting for you to refute my points.

It is a comment on who is saying the words, not the words, ad hominem

...

the problem with the race and Autism Level debate is that no one is agnostic about it

stormweenies believe Race Realism because it's supported by some circumstantial evidence which confirms their world view
everyone else rejects Race Realism, because they have been told that race is a spook ever since they were a small child.

But this whole MAOA situation shows just how incomplete our understanding of the genome is.
"Race could be a spook, or it could very much not be a spook. We just don't know yet."
that should be where everyone is at on this issue.

kys porky

Spookiness: TBD is the status of all scientific hypotheses tho

What's weird is watching so-called leftists, who assume themselves to be the philosopher-king vanguard, handwave and deflect like a HillShill-tier liberal on the issue. I guess everyone really is just plain retarded, and ideology is largely just a front.

Not before we kill you first.

Hail Soros!

t. Mr. After-being-btfo-multiple-times-i-still-don't-know-what-a-spook-is

"WAAAAAAAAA UR WHYTE PPL R EBUL WAYCISS BIGOT NAZI [INSERT ADDITIONAL BUZZWORDS HERE] MUH FEELINGS, MUH BWOWN PEOPLE MUH STUDIES THAT WERE DISPROVEN YEARS AGO"

It was Joseph Smith-tier

I looked for the source of your image and found this: humanbiologicaldiversity.com/RaceandIQWorldMap.htm

You're a White Nationalist quoting White Nationalists, that isn't super convincing.

Looks to me like you're hiding something.

retard

actually it's cheaper to kill all subhumans and produce only superior ubermensch to replace them, much more productive, this is what the Chinese Communist Party are doing currently.

I'm rite tho.

AWAKEN MY MASTERS!