Is anyone else sick of anything remotely difficult...

At least you can have fun playing video games. I'm always preoccupied with the sense that I am wasting my time.

Well there is challenging but boring and challenging but fun.
Bamham's batmobile segments on high difficulties were challenging but boring.
Majority of Dark Souls is challenging but fun.
High difficulties in diablo clones where you need to click all over the place and play piano on your hotbar is challenging but boring.
DMC3 on high difficulties where you need to be BOTH effective and stylish is challenging but fun.
Of course all of the above is subjective.
When you overcome challenging but boring obstacles you feel like you wasted your time and nerves. When you overcome challenging but fun obstacles it's satisfying as fuck, you feel triumph.

Maybe you're playing all the wrong games and should try something different?

Take a break for a month with a different hobby, after a month or two play one of your favorite games again or check one off your backlog- you'll have fun again, probably.

though yesterday i did finally set up a chair with leg rest and tv in a cozy position and beat 4 worlds of ristar and it was great. then i watched the first starwars (episode 4) movie for the first time and it was amazing. haven't had such a cozy night in years

OP is a faggot and part of the problem within the idustry

Ths video i almost 9 years old and things have onñly gotten worse since then

It's modern games. Effort/Reward levels are fucked in new titles. Developers have no idea how to make fun games anymore.

I go back to my old games and have a great time getting my ass handed to me trying to beat them. Titles like Rayman Legends show that when done right, I can enjoy new hard games as well.

Kill yourself and do the rest of us a favor.

You can't be allowed to spread. I'd feel pity if you weren't such a little bitch about it you made a thread to complain about a very fucking tense subject concerning games today.

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I cheat only when it's frustratingly difficult to overcome something or it punishes me for literally nothing.You are part of the problem and most likely a beta faggot in real life who cries over every difficulty he get like not getting his faggotest game in steam.

OP IS A FAGGOT

I'd rather save my frustration and effort for doing something constructive. I hope you guys like my game that's coming out next year.

A game made by a casual idiot who can't stand challenge and probably dislikes video games in general? I think we have enough of that, thank you.

and you wonder why the medium is treated like disposable garbage

You can play vidya any way that you want to.

You niggas have really lost it, what ever happened to "don't feed the trolls"? Or have you lost the ability to even tell trolls apart from legit people?

No, because otherwise I would just read a fucking book. The whole point of a game is to challenge yourself, or challenge someone else, if there is no challenge then you might as well just stick to movies and books and forget video games even exist.

It's the aspect central to game design. Games are systems of play, made up of rules that are be decided by a set of skills according to its design. Everything not pertaining to this, things used to present the game, are arbitrary and cosmetic.

The thing that is truly making games a disposable medium are all the third-rate "writers" using video games as a way to pass off their shitty stories at the expense of making actual well-designed and unique games, and the AAA publishers cranking out rehashes of casual games to appeal to the lowest common denominator without any real innovations beyond new ways for them to fleece their customers.

Ah, so it's you.

EVERYONE BE AWARE THAT THIS IS A THREAD MADE BY TARKOVSKY-user, AKA HAMBURGER HELPER 2.0
You better leave the thread before he starts spreading the gospel of Todd Howard and how authorial intent doesn't matter in creative works.

So you're saying that if they shipped you the game disk wrapped in a metric ton of duct tape, that took you ten hours of painful labor to unwrap, it would enhance the game? Because that's what a lot of these games boil down to. A whole shitton of work for no reward. Humans evolved to be masters at distilling the maximum efficiency out of chaos of reality. If you enjoy smashing your face into a wall over and over again because you think grabbing a hammer is "too casual", you've got some serious problems. If you play video games that take large amounts of time to accomplish very little, or nothing at all, then you're treating the game as a timewaster than an enjoyable experience. They make levels of Angry Birds that are really difficult, too, you realize. Since difficulty is the only thing that matters, Angry Birds must be a really good game, and not casual at all!

I shouldn't be surprised, even some of my laziest shitposts end up with multiple (you)s.

>conveniently ignoring that I said games are systems of play
Please try an actual argument next time you want to excuse your casual-ass tastes.

It's not actually bait this time, just someone really delusional.

its a discussion board, calling everything bait shuts down discussion and is easy to abuse. fuck off back to 4chan

It isn't the "only good aspect" of videogames, it's the CORE aspect of video games. The very definition of "game" is an activity in which one tries overcome a specific challenge via a specific set of rules.

you can keep saying you are right and thats the only definition and yet the most popular games are completely nonchallenging like minecraft and skyrim

...

Sounds like you are in the mood for comfy instead of challenging.

Not at all. Though, I do save scum, that is only to keep my progress. Why should I go back to the start because I couldn't get by the next hurdle? I already got past the challenges I needed to get there, so what's the point?

But, anyone who cheats a single player game outside of fucking around is a right faggot.

Who gives a fuck

No, that's fucking wrong you idiot.
The core aspect of a game is having fun.
Not all games have a challenge, you right queerboy dicksucker

lmao

the fact they exist at all is my argument that you aren't always right retard

See, that's wrong. Because I am.

It's like this, bro:
If I'm wanting a challenge, it's because I want to be challenged, because overcoming that is fun to me.
But, there's more to games than just a challenge. There are more items for fun than just challenge.

R00fles

This meme needs to die. Engagement in entertainment doesn't begin and end at just "fun".

Explain yourself so you sound less retarded. Poorly made games/movies/art/etc being successful doesn't magically change the definition of games/movies/art/etc.

There's plenty of ways to have fun, user. The end goal of a game should always be to enjoy it.

Try a puzzle game that you can solve at your own pace like Simon Tathum's Puzzle collection

chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/puzzles/

Yeah, you can throw the game disc around like a frisbee and have FUN that way, this obviously means the game itself is good.

This is too narrow minded and hedonistic. Would you say that the goal of life is to always have fun and be happy? That's unbalanced and degenerate. Games are more than just masturbation. Through challenge you feel suffering and the bitterness of defeat, which is necessary before you can experience even deeper fulfillment. By being thrust into situations that you do not know how to handle, you expand your knowledge and learn new things.

Only if you consider throwability, and rather low throwability at that, to be enough fun to be worth your money.
Personally, if I wanted to throw a frisbee, I'd buy a good quality frisbee.

Not really. The thing that I am sick of is games being either too easy or frustratingly hard. The only game that I can remember falling into that sweet spot between the two was the original Hotline Miami.

And what if you wanted a good game?
Right, you'd go for the "fun" factor which you still haven't defined.

Are video games your entire life, user? Why are you using the 'goal of life' for what video games should be? Do you consider video games to be all that matters to you?
Personally, I play video games as a form of entertainment. Thus, they should entertain me first and foremost.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with facing a challenge and overcoming it for your fun. That's perfectly valid.
Though, I think you go to a full-tilt autistic retardation of the load.
What kind of sorry sack of shit plays games to 'experience deeper fulfillment"? What kind of sad excuse for a human being plays games to "expand their knowledge"?
Read a book, buy a house, make a forge, create things. Stop wasting your life on video games, user. They should only be for entertainment purposes.

Then a game that is only as good as you throw it is not very good, is it, you fuckmunching cumdumpster.
Search Results
fun
fən/
noun
noun: fun

1.
enjoyment, amusement, or lighthearted pleasure.
"the children were having fun in the play area"
synonyms: enjoyment, entertainment, amusement, pleasure; More
jollification, merrymaking;
recreation, diversion, leisure, relaxation;
a good time, a great time;
informalrest and recreation, R and R, a ball
"I joined in with the fun"
merriment, cheerfulness, cheeriness, jollity, joviality, jocularity, high spirits, gaiety, mirth, laughter, hilarity, glee, gladness, lightheartedness, levity
"she's full of fun"
antonyms: boredom, misery
a source of this.
"people watching is great fun"
synonyms: ridicule, derision, mockery, laughter, scorn, contempt, jeering, sneering, jibing, teasing, taunting
"he became a figure of fun"
antonyms: respect
playful behavior or good humor.
"she's full of fun"
behavior or an activity that is intended purely for amusement and should not be interpreted as having serious or malicious purposes.
"it was nothing serious; they just enjoyed having some harmless fun"
(of a place or event) providing entertainment or leisure activities for children.
"a 33-acre movie-themed fun park"

adjectiveinformal
adjective: fun

1.
amusing, entertaining, or enjoyable.
"it was a fun evening"
synonyms: enjoyable, entertaining, amusing, diverting, pleasurable, pleasing, agreeable, interesting
"a fun evening"

And nothing in your copy pasta says "video games". Guess they aren't meant to be 'fun' after all, dipshit..

You absolute fucking retard.

If that were the case than one could justify cheating in a game as just a means to have fun and thus a factor in whether a game is good or not, despite the fact that cheating goes contrary to the intended design of the game. Hell, you could use fun to justify any interaction that arbitrarily changes a game's rules and system for fun's sake - probably because "fun" is a completely subjective factor to actually measure games, and likewise any piece of entertainment, by.

The end goal of a game is the one described in its rules and one that the player is meant to beat by overcoming the challenge it presents. Whatever emotion they feel - amusement, frustration, resentment, relief, fear, etc - is merely a byproduct of the player's individual interaction with its design.

Sometimes I just want to relax and not have rage fits while playing, so I have been known to cheat.

But then there's times when I want to challenged, so then I play without cheats.

Depends on what mood I'm in.

Video games are made to be fun, you right faggoty little queerboy. They are made to entertain.
God damn, you make me so thoroughly disgusted in the human race as a whole to think that there are people like you living in our society.
People who take a form of entertainment, and they make it their entire purpose for living.
People who have abandoned actually accomplishing goals, who've left aside their hopes and dreams of childhood, to take an entertainment media and try to make their whole life wrap around them.
People like that, the worst part is, I still recognize the ambition in them. The goals. To lack ambition, to content yourself to squallor, to live idly by without improving, those people who do that are not human. But you? You've taken a media that was only meant for entertainment, and wrapped yourself around it. You are still human, I have to accept that, because you still have your goals, your ambitions. They're just all wrapped around the game. You still improve, you just improve at the game. It's worthless, and unlike those many out there who equally disgust me, I cannot just mark them off as lacking that spark of humanity. No, you are clearly, to my standards, human. And yet you've wasted your humanity on what is meant only to ease stress and bring joy to the mind.
It horrifies me.

What sort of definition do you want, then, you overblown gook.
The central point of games is to entertain. To be fun. There's plenty of ways to go about it. But that's the goal

To say 'cheating makes the game better' would fall into the same line of 'MODS WILL FIX IT', you ask me.
Sure, they might.
Doesn't mean the game's not shit. You can just fix the shit, at least a little.

The end goal of an entertainment media is to be entertaining. If one derives fun from completing those challenges, that's the game doing that central concept, that primary goal. There are many games that meet this goal without challenging the player.

Congratulations on being a fucking casual now.

>>>/reddit/

If you cheat your way through a game you end up ruining it for when you want to play properly. If you need to do that just drop the game for a bit and come back later.

What language do devs use to program in the "fun"?

Language of the Soul.

Get out.

But soul is shit

Which is why video game suck! I'm glad we've learned something today.

What dice do tabletop games use to make their games fun?

Your goal is to make the game fun. How you do that is up to you. Some make games where you can build to your hearts content, like a virtual lego set. Some make games where the goal is to beat other players, like playing football with your friends. Some make it so that the fun comes from overcoming challenges, like climbing a mountain.
There's lots of different ways to do it, but the core goal is to make the game entertaining.

Is it?

It is a form of entertainment. You can take it as seriously as you like, so long as it entertains you.
But to hold it over as something more is just sad.

...

Why are you asking me? You know I am going to say 'yes, it is'. That's been my position this whole time, you illiterate fuckmunch.
Stop wasting my time.

Stop posting then.

And then you'll have to prove it. And it'll be hell.

Why should I? Because you're too stupid to have basic literary skills?

Well, let's start with this nice little thing.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entertainment#Games

Why do you play games, user? Do you not play them to be entertained?
That seems like a rather sorry existence, to waste such a large amount of time on something you don;t even enjoy.

With a wikipedia link? Try using your brain for once.

You didn't answer the question, user.

Why do you play games?

>The end goal of an entertainment media is to be entertaining
>If one derives fun from completing those challenges
And here is where you show you're hand - you're classifying any entertainment or engagement with media as "fun", like I mentioned in
There's more to entertainment than just fun, and your reductionist view on that is damaging.

Definitions do change though autists. Millions of people consider Minecraft and Skyrim to be videogames and you are the only one stupid enough to say they arent

Rogert Ebert here, this movie is fun, my jaw dropped, 5/4 thumbs up.

Fair enough, I suppose. I always classified 'entertainment' and 'fun' as one in the same.
But, I'm not someone who gives a rat's ass about semantics.

[si-man-tiks]

noun, ( used with a singular verb)
1.
Linguistics.

the study of meaning.
the study of linguistic development by classifying and examining changes in meaning and form.

2.
Also called significs. the branch of semiotics dealing with the relations between signs and what they denote.
3.
the meaning, or an interpretation of the meaning, of a word, sign, sentence, etc.:
Let's not argue about semantics.
4.
general semantics.

Weird, I'd think that MEANING OF WORDS would be important to a smart guy such as yourself.

You never did answer the question.
Why do you play games?

To be entertained.

I don't recall doing that.

They're existence doesn't affect the definition games, nor do they contradict that definition - they're both systems of play with their own rules and require specific "skills" to beat the challenges presented. They just show that, like in nearly every media, popularity is not indicative of quality.

Well, golly gee wizz, given how many times I used the word "entertainment" interchangeably with the word "fun", I'd have to call you a right faggot.

Seeing as you're one of the morons who uses "fun" at every opportunity, the word doesn't mean shit when you speak it.

k bro lol

You aren't very fun. But you are entertaining.

So kinda like your face.

Wait I'm having deja vu, have you posted about this same subject before? I remember reading some autistic shit about the definition of fun before and I'm wondering if it was you.

No, you're probably having deja vu because people are tired of unimaginative fucks who describe every form of entertainment as "fun".

You sound like you need to have some fun.

I just jerked off to photos of 911

that was me on mobile. you said that if its not challenging it is not a game. minecraft and skyrim are not challenging but are still videogames. animal crossing, mario kart, tetris, all "games". that directly contradicts you saying that games need to be challenging

I didn't leave halfchan for this…

But are you sure you had fun? Or was it just entertaining?

Don't lie to yourself, yes you did.

I had an orgasm, yes.

No matter what you accomplish in life, you're going to die and therefore all of those accomplishments will only be for your own personal gratification and amusement, unless you're specifically developing skills that will be instrumental in aiding other human beings; even then, you can still be a sour and resentful prick who refuses to use his knowledge to help people. Is it fair to say that someone who dedicates his life to learning as many languages he can, or someone who dedicates himself to some type of artistry, is throwing his life away? No, but video games get a free pass because "they're degenerate masturbation" by your standards. I don't think you belong here.

What do you mean low quality bait thread? Where's the bai in OP?

Wait so you consider masturbation to be fun but not games?

That's right.
Does your definition make me wrong?

user, pls, don't tell me you can't check OP posts.

No, it just means that you aren't a person that finds games fun. Which begs the question. Why the fuck are you on Holla Forums?

No, video games get a 'free pass' because they're an entertainment medium.

Anyway, to sell yourself out just because one day you'll die, and one day your accomplishments'll mean nothing, is dumb. That day is not here.
That day will not be here for a long time.

It's the same as those faggots whining about how, due to some fancypants laws of energy, the system of expending energy for growth is unsustainable. Who gives a fuck? If we run out here, on our world, we'll find another, and dig that one out. If that one runs out, we'll go to another. We'll keep doing this until we run out of universe.
If you're human, you aim higher. I don't care which way you go, so long as you are moving forward.
If someone wants to waste their lives on video games, I can't say they aren't human, but I can weep for the lost accomplishment.
At the very least, create new games. To dedicate yourself to games is just so empty. There's nothing to accomplish there that'll ever mean anything. Not here in the now, not any time after.
What, are we going to get that one shitty Adam Sandler movie where aliens attack with video game tactics?

the purpose of playing games is to have fun, yes, but that's not what defines a game.

I already said I find games entertaining. Some of them at least.

I would've thought 'something you play to have fun' was exactly what 'defines' a game.

So if I'm playing some shit game for some reason and absolutely hating it does it mean it's not a video game?

pack your bags fag that could literally mean anything

No, it just failed at it

No, it didn't. Big Rigs is a video game no matter how many people hated it.

I can play with my cock to have fun, does that mean my cock is a game?

How does that refute my argument? That's exactly what I'm saying a game is.

A book can be fun. Does that mean it is a game?
A movie can be fun. Is that a game?
What about a comedian? Are they games?

Is horror fun? And if yes does it make it a game?

Sure. After all, it was made to be fun. It just failed at that.

how about this one?

You need to improve your reading comprehension. I said challenge was central to game design - not challenge as in "difficulty", as in it has to be challenging, but challenge as in "conflict", as in the point if a game is present a form of challenge.

And what if one masochist found it "fun"? Did it become a video game then?

"challenging" simply means to present a challenge, which may require luck in order to accomplish. Luck can also be considered a skill, but thats another argument.

Minecraft has an official end goal now, and even before that the goal was really just to survive.

I didn't say it wasn't a game, you idiot.
Learn to read.

i assumed you were making a point, this argument is pointless if you aren't even making a claim

I have to agree that luck can be a skill. Some people are naturally lucky. Some people are not.

RNG is still shit tho

Look at the traditional risk/reward system of older FPSes.

the player has to think about whether they want to go into that area or get that optional item and risk losing health and ammo. Risk vs return.

then cowadoody happened, no health risk. therefore to create "risk" the difficulty was increased "artificial difficulty"

A Medal of honor game from 2004 is better than a Cowadoody game in 2008 for that very reason.

I just savescum/savestate RNG bullshit nowadays because I can't be bothered with that bullshit anymore. Anything else, though, stop being a bitch.

Example: savestating before fusions in modern SMT, because fuck you I shuffled skills for 15 minutes you're not ruining this with an accident

Only time I turn down the difficulty is when the game has bullet sponge enemies.

Fuck that.