How come is there still no substitute for TES games?
I mean, it's 2016 holy shit, even the most powerful of the game engines are free to use. What's so hard about making a completely open ended open world game with some quests and lore? This is why people are loyal to Beth despite of their shaddy quality control.
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There are plenty of open world RPGs in the vein of gamebryo Bethesda RPGs. Most of them have poor or no mod support which is pretty much the main reason for the autism concentrated on gamebryo games.
Broken, empty, badly written pieces of shit with terrible gameplay?
Why would anyone want them.
I don't know, probably the fact that you have to make a whole open world full of assets, quests, and other content. I mean is it any wonder why Skyrim, despite taking 3~4 years to make, is filled with Draugr, Warlocks, and Forsworn? Shit takes a lot of time and resources. Yes I realize they're incompetent and not the best example to use
There's also the fact that you're going up against a sales titan - why would you compete directly against Bethesda with your imitation? Regardless of the quality of the competing products, people will gravitate towards Bethesda because it's an established brand. It's the same reason why CoD-clones don't outsell CoD - the people that want CoD already have CoD. The best way to compete with those kinds of games is to be similar enough to appease to their audience but fresh enough to seem like more than a copy. Doing that would take quite a lot more time and effort than making a straight-up TES clone, which itself takes a large amount of time.
tl;dr: maekin big gaems iz hard, and people are probably going to buy Skyrim 2 instead anyways
Apparently so hard not even Bethesda can do it properly even though they use the same tools as always.
Working on one right now in Unity.
Unity can do Open World given that you manually place your WorldSpace cells and globally allocate some gameobjects.
I can't promise that I'll fulfill all of Todd's buzzword quotas but I can at least promise an RPG. Design Docs are pretty early in development and I'm currently working on the stats. I don't need any help with the project at the moment but when I have more to show for it I'll likely be asking for development assistance.
Can do or can do well? World of difference.
That said I know nothing of unity or really anything about game engines at all.
Just let me climb any mountain that you put in the world and I'll be happy
Yes and no. Open World doesn't really take much more resources than a typical linear game or just a small game with an open area. It's all about how well you allocate the resources, what needs to be global, when you load the next, etc.
Unity has a feature that lets you asynchronously load a new level, which I'll be using for "seamless open world" illusion that Bethesda uses.
Now, here's the issue with Unity. If you've modded Skyrim/Oblivion/Any Bethesbryo game before, you'll know that the engine automatically divides this big ass world into square cells and puts them all in one file. You can't really do this with Unity. Instead, you'll have to create a new scene for each cell and bind any cell instance to that scene.
It's workable, but can get slightly tedious. The good news is that you have slightly more controls over what's loaded like this. Another plan I have in mind is seamless caves which is also doable, I don't think even Fallout 4 had this.
Maybe. I wrote down all my planned skills, but climbing like in Daggerfall isn't in there. I may use climbable ropes like that one Skyrim mod and design the world around making it more usable. That or a hookshot-like item from Zelda.
play Gothic already
That's pretty cool man. I hope I get to mess around with your game someday.
Open world RPGs are expensive to make and hard to sell. Bethesda's games are pretty mediocre and sell mostly on hype and the existing fans/modding community. If you don't have a massive marketing budget or the goodwill of hundreds of thousands of customers you can't compete.
That said there are substitues. Warband does 'big world' better (though it's a Sandbox rather than an Open World). Gothic 1 and 2 also exist.
There's also the matter of the audience being very easy to please. Bethesda could shit on a plate and it would still sell as long as they put a TES or Fallout label on it.
The most important thing in game development these days is marketing, everything else is irrelevant. Having an established fanbase is one of the biggest advantages you can have because it means you can keep jangling the keys in front of them and you'll keep making money. People are just conditioned to buy some games. Why do you think yearly releases have become so common when they used to be relegated to sports games? People know the name, and that means guaranteed sales so you don't even need to try and impress people anymore.
The most expensive part of any game is likely the assets. Maybe 10 or 12 years ago, this would have been an issue with the AAA/AA scene, but nowadays a non-open world game has just as much assets as an Open World game. Hell, you could probably make a living, breathing world using nothing but models and textures from Bayonetta 2.
I think you're right though when you say that there isn't much marketing sense in competing with Bethesda. Many people will buy Bethesda RPG's simply because they have Todd's name on it or because they know they can mod it. You can't exactly say the same for a new RPG franchise.
There's also the issue that there are no more new franchises anymore
You've never been AGDG, have you, OP?
True, but there is change in the air. Publishers must be quite concerned about the diminishing returns of massive marketing campaign. At some point they will need to but some truth behind the empty words, at least for a while.
Sure enough it seems like it but I can't help but think that they'll just find some other scam. Even if they don't the damage that has been done to videogames as a whole is probably irreparable. Entire genres of games have dropped off the face of the earth, the AA scene is mostly non-existent and the kind of people who represent the majority of game purchasers has completely changed.
I wish the fabled "crash" would happen and somehow reset this industry to purge it of all the shit that has accumulated, but when you look at the older industries like music and film they're in just as deplorable a state as games are and it doesn't look like any of them are heading for a crash, at least not in our lifetimes.
Because there's a lot of shit many people don't really know before they start doing a project like that and end up failing because of that.
Most of the stuff people think takes ages is actually only a small portion of the work.
For instance, one thing Gamebryo does quite well over all other engines is the loading cells that allows you to travel around the world while only having a small portion of it loaded.
Anyone trying to make Skyrim 2 would need to code something for that to happen as well as obscene amounts of occlusion.
There's also the issue with polish, where their models are terrible and their textures even worse but still miles better than average amateur stuff. The cities in TES are often filled with a lot of tiny details that color the landscape and make it feel less empty and even the wilderness has grass all around and rocks specifically so it doesn't look like a big plain of nothing (which is ironic).
And finnaly, it's because everyone that can code or draw knows how shitty TES vannilla is. So they always stick to their heads that it should be something more deep and interesting with new gameplay mechanics, but they end up failing when they try to implement over complicated things that they can't even get to work.
To be honest, I kinda feel like giving it a shot and then hosting the project code and assets in a GitHub for the ultimate modder benefit but that'd take people picking up after me.
Bethesda has the advantage of having drones that rival Blizzdrones as fans. If another company were to release a broken, buggy mess like Bethesda they would be crucified for it.
Bethesdrones are unrivaled. That's why they're so hard to control. Similar to Nintendrones.
Sonyggers, on the other hand, have a direct competition/rival so they're much easier to control and are smaller in numbers.
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this smh tbh fam
There's already a shit ton of open world RPGs, the reason why bethgames are so popular and have so many mods for them is because they've been using the same engine for years so no one has to relearn anything and apparently it's easier to mod than some jap game where they locked everything away.
fuck you.
on a more serious note, its actualy pretty time consuming to make an open world rpg that doesnt suck complete cock. which is every bethesda game since morrowind has been shit that kept floating because of marketing.
SureAI's TES complete overhaul mod series set in The World of Vyn.
Haven't played the ones for Morrowind and Oblivion(since I don't know krautspeak), but Enderal makes Skyrim look like a bigger joke than it already is.
Says a lot about the state of the industry when a bunch of fans working for no monetary compensation have a better game design philosophy than the biggest fantasy RPG maker on the planet.
Oblivion's TC has english caption version. I actually prefer it that way because it makes it feel more like a fantasy game.
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I never understood that either to be honest, I mean there is a fucking ton of shitty survival indie games being shat out daily but the only first person open world fantasy game I can think of that is still alive is elder scrolls.
Does Enderal make shitrim fun?
Most mainstream engines are capable of streaming the world in as it is needed. Every open world game needs that technology and there realy isnt a shortage of open world games.
That said, youre right about all the rest. Its just much more work to do it right than people think.
This is a shill thread.
Post Todds and check 'em.
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None of those games are both first-person and open-world. Kill yourself.
The only TES-like games in that list. The former of which isn't even based on dungeon-crawling or exploration.
wtf is this doing on there?
Broken, empty, badly written pieces of shit with terrible gameplay?
Why would anyone want them.
Agreed with
OP IS A HIT 'N RUN BETHESHILL
Depends on where you're looking for it.
For example, none of the areas are randomly generated, so you might have fun just adventuring in the vibrant, organic world which doesn't neglect to reward exploration and doesn't hold your hand like you're braindead.
Unfortunately, though skills and the like are overhauled, the combat is just about the same. HOWEVER, there's no level scaling and randomized enemy spawns, so you might enjoy becoming OP as fuck and smashing nerds across the screen.
Best to just try it, honestly.
Unity's biggest problem for open world, as usual, its userbase. It's easy to shut off entire sectors of objects and in so doing ease up on the renderer and ram requirements.
Almost no one does that, and it's a problem when someone tries to use unity to make a high-detail game, forgetting that EVERYTHING is being rendered
kill yourselves:
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TES games are like swirly shit in a chocolate pudding bowl. You bite into it disappointed and come out knowing you could have had a good dessert had it not been literal shit.
I think OP just means a first person open world RPG with good lore and comfy exploration, but without all the shit that comes from being a Bethesda game.
Bethesda makes nothing but trash and has never made a good game, don't get me wrong. Skyrim and the like are the penultimate normalfag entry level games.
Becouse you need good writers and lots time to write GOOD lore which is essential for open world games.
Most of the modern game developers focus on graphic becouse that gets the kiddies wet.
TES games were developed and had their groundworks done when the graphic was shit so they had more time to focus on the lore part of the game.
Now they do the same shit as the rest with the addition of building on developed lore.
So, they would be good if they weren't bad games? No shit. You can say the same for every shitty game. And open world is a garbage meme.
Do yourself a favor and knock back a little shotgun mouthwash.
There's a difference between a shitty game and a shitty game with potential.
You're trying too hard to fit in.
Lamenting about a lack of alternative to dumpster diving? Since when were bad games hard to come by?
True, and no bethesda game had an ounce of potential. Only Todd believed they did.
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If you want an alternative to TES, you could try playing battlefield or any of the other dozens of casual shitty AAA games being made.
The only thing worse than Skyrim is your malfunctioning dick pills
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This thread is getting intentionally derailed so I'm just gonna filter this salty faggot. Suggest everyone else do the same.
Thoughts on Risen? It's a Gothic spiritual successor, feels like a cross between Morrowind and Fable I.
Must be hard acting superior in an English community when you don't know English.
Done.
I haven't played Risen. I've heard the first is decent and the others are shit. Is that true?
If you're looking for games that have better quality than TES, pretty much every game ever made can be listed.
it needs more work than making a rooty tooty point n shooty where you can be like "this man is man, you are out to kill him. that'll be 70 bux pls"
Haven't played the sequels either, but I heard they're buggy as hell with shit gameplay. Not that Risen 1 wasn't buggy, but it was still semi-functional.
My main appeal is the sense of finding your own way around the world, and not just geographically, but in character too. Learning your place in the world when someone knocks you on your ass, or being treated like shit when you're an outsider in a small village.
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Yeah, except OP is looking for open world RPGs, not just "every game".
I've heard the exact same thing and it's the reason why I only played the first.
Enjoyed it a lot and think that anyone who liked Gothic I&II would share my sentiment(though, I saw some anons who don't).
Speaking of recommendations for Gothic fans, I'd say Enderal deserves another mention.
It's a Skyrim TC mod, but it's strikingly similar to Piranha Bytes' games(not sure why, probably meticulous German craftsmanship).
It even has a Learning Point system.
How's the performance on Enderal? Because my PC barely ran Vanilla Skyrim at 30 FPS with occasional crashes.
Enderal comes packaged with a number of graphics improvement mods, so you'll probably need some new tech or a mod that disables them.
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They are all shit but if you want to provide an alternative, it has to let you make your own character and let you go wherever you want and do nothing but play in factions or do sidequests. Any game with a big focus on "the main quest," voiced protagonist, no side factions, or no character customization does not have the appeal of TES.
The only game similar to TES in that list is Mount and Blade which doesn't let you wander around everywhere in first person and has a boring muh realism setting. It's a better game but it's still quite different from TES.
It's better but it has a set protagonist and very little focus on letting you go wherever you want and do faction quests. Just because a game has an open world doesn't mean it's similar at all, that is just surface-level shit.
Obsidian did FNV in less than 2 years and they even fell for the "full voice acting" meme.
Ok name one
and before you name the following, they don't count because they either have set protagonists or no way to establish yourself in the world through factions
The closest thing to a Bethesda game not made by Bethesda (other than FNV) is Mount and Blade which is clearly massively different.
Not even close to true.
You'll enjoy the first game if you liked Gothic
Rage was a fucking mess of a game though
It's a massive investment and you'd be trying to directly compete against Bethesda
I'd love for more devs to try and do it
It is a massive investment but its one that these companies already make. Look at all the "Skyrim with x" open world meme games. Devs are copying the surface elements of Bethesda games which is fantasy open world and failing with the features they need: no defined protagonist and no focus on one "main quest." People like Skyrim because they can fuck off and join the Dark Brotherhood instead of saving the world and they'll have plenty of content to support that. Devs seem to think that if the player doesn't experience absolutely every piece of content in their game then there's no reason to make that content, and even Bethesda is doing this by removing mutually exclusive factions (brought back in F4 though).
People want choices and they don't want shit like "choose A or B" in a dialogue tree, they want to actually go wherever they want and do whatever they want without the developer telling them "no you have to do the main quest its where all the content is locked behind."
I'd agree with this, even beth is starting to fall prey to it in that you can do every single thing in one playthrough
I think there's also a lack of ambition playing into it
Let me rephrase that, its a pretty watered down fallout 3 experience. If you dumbed down all the rpg mechanics even more then fallout 3 already did, and it was pretty damn linear with very light open world aspects, but if more time and effort went into content, you could have had a pretty decent fallout 3 clone. Since it was basically a tech demo anyway, damn it Carmack. It defiantly had the potential, especially not being fucking gamebryo.
Damn it Bethesda.
The thing I want most from one of these games is the faction system from fallout new vegas, its genius if blatantly unfinished and I wanna see a sequel just so I can see that shit finished.
OpenMW is not a game and it's not even a mod. It is an engine. If someone made a game entirely separate to Morrowind in the engine (which is likely what the Enderal devs are planning to do) then that game would count, but OpenMW does not count.
That's like saying Unreal Engine 4 is an alternative to TES games because you could theoretically make an open world RPG similar to them in it.
Agreed, though I doubt Bethesda will want Obsidian to make a sequel since they got BTFO'd so hard by Obsidian despite the fact that they had far less time to make it and got fucked over in hopes of a hostile takeover (which didn't even work). Bethesda is a worse publisher than Activision because at least those greedy jews can jew correctly.
They also botched the hostile takeover of Prey 2 so hard that the developer was destroyed and they didn't even get to profit from the game. What a mess.
Did Mark get paid by Bethesgay to allow such threads without deleting them?
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You could make a game for a Doom-based engine or some other Open Sourced engine to make Daggerfall if it was good if you really, really wanted to.
I hope your not talking about Unreal