Should the EU fall? On one hand, it causes large divisions between people due to mismanaging the migrant crisis...

Should the EU fall? On one hand, it causes large divisions between people due to mismanaging the migrant crisis, perceived undemocratic governance and force-fed ideals of European unity and the bureaucracy which accompanies it. On the other, it's a step closer to eliminating the spook that is the nationstate, boosts economy and can be an immense force for good if applied correctly. Do you think leftists should be pro- or anti-European unity?

After what it did to Greece, yes.

Being anti-EU doesn't mean you're anti-European unity

The EU is cancer and exists to entrench capitalism

Hey, user, I'm from Holla Forums, and I have to say it would be in the interest of both of us to oppose the cancer which is the EU. I do however approve of the idea of a European council which doesn't issue currency but rather organises Europe. The Catholic Church, despite its often cases of brutality did organise Europe.

Good relations between european countries? Yes i support that.

EU? No, i'm sorry, but centralizing powers in Brussels is not the answer. Fuck EU

The communist party in my country was always against the EU. Before we joined it they were against EU, they continued to be against it afterwards. They said in 1997 euro would be awful for us. They were right.

Hell, the EU has worsened relations between a lot of countries. Guess that's what happens when you have an economic union where one country is dominant.

this, I don't know any communist parties that support the EU

all the ones in Britain supported Brexit

yes. It's neoliberal dictatorship. disassembling of the EU is one of the few things far-left and far-right can agree about.

I can't wait for the day it's dead.


Fucking this. Pro EU = Anti European

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what other left parties are there that are relevant that were pro-Brexit?

user what the fuck

never claimed that

Yes

Yes, but it's mostly going to fail because of butthurt over Arab immigrants and give rise to a new wave of neo-fascist parties

Should it be dismantled completely or reformed? What is its fundamental, concrete flaw?

The EU is a force for Neoliberal economics and Identity politics, so yes.

The EU is a puppet show created to make liberalism and capitalism look virtuous and pacifistic after WWII.

But will the EU fail?

It already did famo. The moment it was created.

And when will this failure fail?

2017

reform or die

I think we were misguided in thinking men from all over the world can be united by virtue of their class. Cultural norms and national idiosyncrasies are real, and they are items that help people find purpose in a purposeless universe.

In fact, if reading most of the counter-revolutionary and nationalist literature of the XIXth has taught me one thing, it is that nationalists are not the monsters we are describing them as. I have found plenty of meaningful and genuinely altruistic components in the works of de Bonald and de Maistre for example. They build their vision for human societies based on mutual respect for another man's nation and way of life. And surprisingly, lots of commands to respect the nature and to make mankind live in harmony with its environment.

Most of Holla Forums associates nationalism with imperialism, this is wrong. The imperialists are always the one who are convinced they have the moral high-ground, and coincidentally, they are more often than not "progressists" and "democrats". And this has been the case since the Peloponnesian War at least.

That isn't possible.

British and Irish nationalism cannot coexist, for example, since both claim the same land.

Revanchism always leads to war.

Unless it does a 360 and reforms like a motherfucker yes.
And it won't because the people who run it are utterly deluded.
If you listen to Varoufakis or Smyth explain how it works you'll wonder how it can ever succeed.

So what's your solution to fixing Europe and providing European unity which isn't just a fucking meme? This board has been so bogged down with fucking undergraduate-tier bullshit and fucking wall-to-wall LARPers that it's getting ridiculous.

Can't we have one EU thread here that isn't just cancerous memelords and actually tries to have a constructive discussion about how Europe can go about unfucking itself?

Does anyone in Great Britain actually care about North Ireland? Every Brit I've talked to that wasn't North Irish' opinion was basically "it should be Ireland's problem now"

Northern Ireland unionists are literally the biggest bootlicker cucks you can imagine. It's fucking embarassing to watch.

Not really, but the British ruling class does, hence why they refuse to relinquish it.

You would need to completely revamp the European institutions.

Restrict freedom of capital.
Scrap the EU's burgeoning army and military style border enforcement.
Create an EU wide living wage
Nationalise the central banks.
Stop relentless expansion, especially in Eastern Europe and the Balkans.
Strengthen the EU Parliament and weaken the EU Commission.
End TTIP.
International Financial Tax and crackdown on tax evasion in countries in Europe
Ban on arms exports from the EU.

Seriously? It wants the entire continent to be one giant nation-state.

Democratic unity > disunity > undemocratic unity

get a consistent ideology plz

also lmao, technocratic neoliberalism is now a topic of debate among leftists. Trash it by any means.

This

It's already dead

It's sad how all the "leftists" are pro EU suddenly. It embodies everything wrong in this world but with a happy, tolerant rainbow face on it. And now those retards want Schulz as german chancelor, aka Merkel 2.0. He will occasionally say pseudo communist meme sentences and those tards will be happy.

I think in Britain at least it's because right now, the EU is seen as less right wing and reactionary than the Tories. But there have always been left wing Eurosceptics.


I thought Nazbols liked a united Europe/Eurasia

Not in its current form, please, that's ridiculous.

I like a united Europe, but not under a Union. Pro EU = Anti Europe.

A new attempt of a United Europe after the EU collapsed in 20 years should abstain from centralizing anything in Brussels or Strasbourg or rehashing any EU symbolic.

Make Paris or Rome the new capital. Don't let the officials micromanage crap like Banana flections. Let regions keep their local culture and languages. Centralize the military tho. Give everything the aesthetic of a Socialist Roman Empire. And, self-explanatory, throw the yanks out.

EU is important tool for globalism.

It was the greek leftpopulist SYRIZA government that mismanaged the migrant crisis, not the EU.

This doesn't sound very different to the EU.