Developer worship

Hideo can do whatever he wants because he's Hideo Kojima.

Hideki can do whatever he wants simply because he gives no fucks.

OP is a faggot.

This is actually very true. Unfortunately people fall prey to it.

A good example is how both Star Citizen and Mighty Number 9 were kickstarted just on the premise that "that bigwig developer that made all of your favorite games is making a new one"

It wasn't just these two. Bloodstained, Yooka Laylee, Shroud of the Avatar, Shaq Fu A Legend Reborn(?) and even Psychonauts 2.

I expect this thread to generate a lot of salt from the drones. OP was not a faggot this day.

Can't think of any devs nowadays who haven't hit their peak or are washed up with no more talent inside of them.

I think Cyanide Studios are getting closer and closer to hitting their peak now. Ever since Of Orcs they've started improving more and more and now they're doing stuff like the Styx sequel and supposedly helping out on Deathwing.

OP, please. Everyone knows Skyrim and Fallout 4 were all singlehandedly the work of Todd Howard.

It's easier for journalists to push an article with an EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW WITH THE DIRECTOR OF AWESOME GAME 2 if there's been a cult of personality propped up around them. In some cases, these devs really are cool people and deserve praise… to a limited degree. But yes, at the end of the day, it always comes down to the team making the game, and if there's one thing in flux in the video game industry, it's raw talent. Three people who made a game great might get fired or move on to work on something else by the time the sequel rolls around.
At the end of the day, what is there to worship but the games themselves?

Kojima worship is the only one that's annoying because it's so prevalent even in communities that are nowhere near as cancerous as Reddit and NeoGaf. Kojima embellishing it has only increased over the years, making it to a two-pronged effort of building up an idol out of a dev team. Romero would be proud.

But Yooka Laylee had a shitton of people from Rare.

I mean as a whole plenty of games try and go "from the developers that brought you X and Y comes this thing". I think there was a low quality sea metroidvania that claimed it was by Ratchet and Clank devs.

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Devs are the new Gods, this should be apparent.

Devs, Directors, Producers.
You get the point.
It's all in the same cauldron of modern mediocrity.

Celebrate the work, not the person.

People like associating success with a single entity rather than a team, it's an "alpha" sort of thing.

I don't know what Kojima's stance is, but Kamiya is trying to fight it himself. He states over and over again that while he appreciates the love, he isn't the only person working on the games, and he even refers you to the true mastermind behind certain games if you ask specific questions.

It boils down to the "faces" of the game. For every good game there's often a face associated with it, and there's not much that can be done about that. Kojima promoted a Stephanie Joosten a whole lot, and Kamiya promotes PG, the Bayonetta character designer, and other team members. I think it all boils down to whether or not the faces are willing to share the accomplishment.

Now why didn't I think of that?

Brb buying flour

You can't change fanboys OP. They'll suck their idols dicks until they die due to lack of oxygen.

wew

I just like everything Kojima has made, why is that bad

Now that I remember, anyone have the picture of when Kamiya used to be hot, it was a picture with his mother as well. He had hair and everything.

Now he looks like a monk on heroin.

Because you think he had much to do with it.

Because Kojima didn't make it.

One way might be to notice elements of a game that you like (level design, music, control programming, whatever), go look up the credits for that game on MobyGames, find out the names of the people who actually fucking did that thing, then mention their names when you talk about it. Give credit where it's due, in other words. Human brains like names and we like attributing things to people, so we may as well attribute it to the right people instead of allowing publisher PR to hijack it.

That's because you only know the names of the shitty "auteurs" that the advertising machine wants you to know. Surprise surprise, they're ego-ridden hacks that're having their lack of actual talent catch up with them!

Go learn you some real dev names instead of being spoon fed. We can't trust the games press to inform us properly so we'll have to do it ourselves.

I'm not sure it is possible, whoever they put out in the public to promote the game and answer questions from the press is going to be associated with the game. If a name doesn't have a face attached people probably won't remember them.

I'm not sure all devs want to be public persons anyhow. In some cases when the game goes bad it has the puppet effect, people will blame the public face even if he didn't have much to do with the failure so the other devs can just quietly move on and don't get their social media flooded and have their photos used as memes.

That attitude won't move pre-orders, user. How're they supposed to get predictable returns from mediocre and mismanaged teams if gamers are allowed to set taste around the quality of the games themselves?

It'd be a nightmare. Which is why that sort of thing and the sort of people who do it have been systematically discouraged and disenfranchised for a decade or so - quality's just not predictable enough.

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There was also Energy Hook, claimed to be made by the guy(yes, that one guy and no one else) who designed the swinging for Spiderman 2. Guess how that turned out?

Sure, I guess that's why the spinoffs of the series he worked on are so great and can stand on their own
Oh wait, they're not, fags

Are you referring to Rising or AC!D?
AC!D was okay

its just weeaboo mongoloids that do this shit

retards gonna be retards

You want an example of meme game, there it is. And surprise surprise, it looks just as shit as the original.

Yet your depiction merely paints every role in development as a equally disposable. In reality though directors and lead designers have much more important roles in game development than those below them. That's not to say the other roles aren't important in their own rights, but they're less significant to the overall direction of a project. I mean film is just as much a group effort as games and it's pretty widely acknowledged that directors are the driving force behind a film, so what's so damaging about acknowledging the role of team leaders in video games?

Yeah, the notion that a sole person being responsible for those games is absurd, and not all directors or designers are involved enough in the development of games to have much of an impact, but to deny credit to those that are involved, especially those that are so meticulously involved like Kojima, is equally absurd. They're team efforts, but teams need appropriate leadership.

Like you?

In all seriousness, it's not unreasonable to weigh your optimism or pessimism for a game considering the director or a main developer's track record.

For example, fans of Pokemon, especially back on cuckchan's /vp/ last I saw of it, maliciously call for Masuda's head based on their hate for complete shit like DP and a waste of potential like XY as well as RS, which was the first time he directed in the series, if they hated Hoenn that much. They now associate his shitty design philosophies and idea of what makes enjoyable content and postgame with him and now vehemently oppose his continued work on the series. He also worked on solid, but unacceptably short games like BW, which seems to hint at a flawed preference for a fleeting experience rather than a replayable adventure with plenty to do. The director of the sequels was someone completely different who greatly expanded the previously tiny region, crammed the main game, not postgame, Pokedex and had much more to see and do, most notably the Pokemon World Tournament. This man on his first fucking try far ahead into the franchise lifespan completely outdid Masuda in every single way as far as gameplay and content. The sheer gap in terms of overall quality between BW and B2W2 are now practically associated with that man's directing and by extension himself.

That mentality almost certainly sums up as "They made this game I liked that was different in ways I liked from others in its genre or its own series. I want to see them in charge of more. I can trust them to make good games or at least games I'll enjoy."

Now that i think about it, Kojima did look pretty handsome huh?

OP is correct, games are made by more than one person. However, directors and the like can act as good leaders which give a significant boost to the team as a whole. Someone here said that for MGS2 kojima took his team to military training, which helped with the detail of the soldiers in every possible way. Kojima likes the details, so if you have him on the team you can expect the game to have that.

But Kojima isn't good at everything, you can tell he doesn't know how to code for shit. SO much missing in the MGS2 HD ports (in terms of detail ironically) including some effects native to the PS2 GPU such as heat hazing. All of the original dev teams effort have pretty much gone to ruin, he used a mediocre team(blue point) and he himself wasn't aware of all the details his original team put in(irony again).

so yes and no.

It's about leadership. This is exactly why I disagree with OP as far as how much faith you have in names.

It also depends alot on the team's capabilities. Kojima's team was given a task and dicked around for years, before they brought in Platinum, gave them the half-built game and MGR was born.

Aint saying nobody else could have done it, but Kojipro sure couldnt by themselves.

yes leadership, but you have to consider the programmers were talented. Bluepoint games were just some shitty phone dev before they did HD game ports, so it's no surprise they bring mediocre results (but compared to most ports they're amazing, which is sad)

Yes, the idea that one person makes or breaks a game is stupid, but it's equally stupid to say the director or others with the vision for the game are disposable. As others have mentioned, a good leader with a well defined vision for what he wants the game to be is invaluable for keeping a project on track. Otherwise, you end up with a team of people working on tiny, individual pieces with little to no communication, and that results in disaster. This is why Final Fantasy XIII was such complete dog shit aside from the visuals. There was no strong leadership to say "Maybe it's stupid to have a game over when the player controlled character is killed" or someone to tell a stupid writer that requiring players to read an encyclopedia's worth of text to understand half of what's happening in the game is a bad idea.

You have absolutely no idea what the hell you're talking about.
Blue Point is literally the best team on the market for HD ports.
If you don't believe me take two seconds to look at their results when they ported over Gravity Rush and the massive amount of work that they put into it.

Any and all limitations in any of their ports entirely depends on the material they're given to work with.
Even the best team on the market can't shit out a miracle when contracted by a company that doesn't give a shit (konami).

i always had this idea of a site where people could list all people that had a hand in a certain game, like actually going through the credits of games and cataloguing all that shit, and then you could bring a whole lot of metrics about each individual, like a list of games certain programmer worked on, their ratings/ranks based on the success of the games they made and the overall predicted rating of a game based on these other metrics, if enough people helped putting information there, it would be way easier to track who actually makes a difference and who has a historic of fucking up.

it would help immensely in trying to gauge the success rate of a certain game.

Digital foundry has a lot of regurgitated info, don't hold them up as having an expert understanding of games.

As for the gravity game here is what I see. It looks less cell shady so it loses style, and it becomes generically realistic. Well done, they've done the minimum expected for a HD port to hardware vastly more powerful; like I said average/mediocre. But you're giving me a game that was done last year, have you considered that perhaps they've gotten better at doing it since then?

Actually, you don't. Unless you've played both the Vita and PS4 version of gravity daze you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

I have both the PS2 version and the PS3 version of MGS2, and I can say right from the beginning that the HD version is far worse for analogue control making first person aiming much slower than it used to be; that is a problem that is 100% nothing to do with konami. There's plenty of other problems, many being graphical details. But how do you know gravity daze doesn't have the same problems? You won't unless you played it!

When everyone else is shit, you're the best. I already said this.

Right, here's another source:

Me.

I own the original game and the HD port on PS4 and i can confirm that it runs wonderfully, looks amazing, and they even fixed the controls to play more smoothly (it plays so well i platinumed the game, in fact).

So i'm talking to a guy that "sees" things and on the other side i have first hand experience and i can tell you that it's clearly better.

You're talking out of your ass and looking for shit to nitpick to cover up the simple fact that you've been caught spewing bullshit.

Oh and by the way i played MGS2 and 3 on PS2 back on day one, and the HD port of MGS2 and 3 (i played the HD port of MGS3 specifically so much i platinumed it), i encountered zero control issues whatsoever and the main graphical "glitches" were in a couple of cutscenes in MGS2 specifically, and that was it.

If it makes any difference the HD collection was patched multiple times, and it could be a ZOE situation, where pre-patch it was a mess and it ran and looked way better post-patch (and for PS3 only, if you had a 360 you were fucked and stuck with a version that will never be patched).

Other than that possibility, i don't consider you a reliable source anymore at this point.

shut the fuck up with your passive aggressive bullshit

list of MGS2 HD differences

This isn't the full list. You say you've played both versions of gravity but you sound like a casual player. Platinum trophy really? If you actually like the game you play it 100s of times through at minimum, you shouldn't need a carrot on a stick to do everything.

Now, go turn on both versions of the game and directly compare them. I'll see your results tomorrow.

Because there a still heroes left in man.
Fuck off.

Heh.

Did he even invent proto-sandbox FPS and default mouselook with mouse smoothing?

Ironic shitposting is still shitposting.
Kojima invented stealth genre.
Kamiya invented stylish action game genre.
Todd ruined open world RPG genre.

So I was looking up about the heat haze in MGS2 HD, and stumbled upon some site with OP's post verbatim minus "Holla Forums."

This is a copypasta thread.
gg no re

If you're talking about Hollaforums, look again. Every single post there is actually mirrored from this thread. Why they do it is uncertain, but the best guess is to create a fake forum where they can sell ad space.

hollaforums.com/thread/10484180/video-games/developer-worship.html

Whats the next step in their master plan?

It already exists: mobygames.com

No he didn't even before the original Metal Gear on MSX there were stealth games, Castle Wolfenstein is probably the first proper stealth game, of course Metal Gear was the first decent stealth game series but that's more of an issue of other stealth games releasing on severely limited hardware I'm not sure if Kojima contributed anything to video games but a few good games with good stories and good cutscene directing.

Personally I think Kojima is the second most overrated game developer, the amount of people here lining up to suck his dick, all the people talking about Death Stranding which has shown 0 gameplay and 0 in game footage when it will probably launch on the PS5 and PS4 simultaneously, the absolute lack of quality in MGSV at it's very core, clearly decisions that Kojima had a hand in, the significant decline in quality between MGS3 and MGS4, he's good but holy shit he's not as good as some of you guys make him out to be.

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That too.

I would suck this guy's dick tbh

I don't worship anyone. No one is perfect, after all.
There are individuals I respect and there's nothing wrong with that, but you're right. Too many development team members out there spend their careers in the shadows of the directors, producers, illustrators and composers who hog all the spotlight. It's not quite right.

Nice ironic shitposting then, I don't even know what legit inventions these two people did, while Future Shock actually pioneered a lot of things that didn't exist in FPS games before. Zenimax ruined FPS-like open world RPG genre that Todd has established with Morrowind.

Castle Wolfenstein and Beyond Castle Wolfenstein are a significantly better and more proper stealth game than Metal Gear and MGS.

It's called idol worship and it's nothing new. You faggots suck dicks.

Kojima is a genius constantly harassed by retarded publishers and corporations, managing to release fantastic games despite all obstacles.
I really fucking hope sony won't limit his creative freedom with Death Stranding and he will finally realize his full potential.

Kamiya is overrated though, mostly thanks to his twitter shitposting.

A prime example of dick sucking idiot.

Just throwing insults around doesn't validate your point, if you even have any.
You can't name a single outright bad game made by Kojima. And whatever flaws there are, they are always evidence of time or budget constrains. Or both.

Spacenauts is a shit game. Solid's mobile games are shit. MGS4 is shit. His Tokimeki games are shit. Boktai was shit after the second game. He was the executive producer for C:LoS. Gaitame Baibai trainer too.
No, he's just a hack.

The leader gets the credit for the group success, this is true of any team effort, from video games and movies to military accomplishments. This of course isn't to say that the people who work under them aren't important, but in the end the one who takes responsibility for the group is the director, in both accomplishments and failing.

Both Kojima and Kamiya have a very similar way of directing a game, which is probably why Holla Forums likes them so much, and why Kamiya thinks so highly of Kojima. They are both have a heavy focus on not what sells or appeals to their fans, but instead what they think would be fun or interesting to have in their game. They're very independent standouts who don't tend to bow toward the conventional wisdom of do what sells, I guess in a sense you could say that they never really sold out, and that kind of conviction is really appealing to a lot of people, but probably those on Holla Forums especially

Don't even bother, leave retards being retards

Celebrity devs have been a thing forever. Peter Molyneux, Warren Spector, Richard Garriot, John Romero, etc., it's just something simple thinking people are prone to do and marketers will take advantage of that.

After Inafune, I now believe that most of them are frauds.

have you actually looked at the game yet user? Don't give me the same bullshit about "it's so smooth and high res!!" Yes, it's easy to see what the game is marketed on, but much harder to see what isn't there. The picture blatantly shows the the upgrade has different colours and a darker look, as well as a completely different wall and weaker cel shading.

You talk about first hand experience but then go on about MGS2 when you're a third hand source

I would know, because I AM the first hand source for that. That was my research that I posted a few months ago.

me-→anons who saw my posts–→user reposts–→you

Now until you do a comprehensive comparison of every single aspect of gravity rush, you a no better a source than a casual player who had happen to have both versions. Lots of people have played both copies of MGS2, yet nobody noticed except me and maybe 5 other people in the world. I await your results.

This. What people don't understand is that the process of designing games, and making a game function from a technical level are two separate artforms. Unfortunately, so many people, including a good portion of Holla Forums, mix the two up which leads to people thinking that a person who can't program is incapable of making a game.

This is some fine fanboyism right here.

Well that's disappointing, the hola forums fake that is copying from "Holla Forums" can't even get my name consistent, filters "user" to user and removes quotes so you don't know who is talking to who. 8ch 8ch.net a_non Holla Forums 8_chan.net

reddit isn't Holla Forums nor part of Holla Forums. they aren't welcome here and they aren't to appropriate of this place
just because redditors worship developers and celebs doesn't mean actual Holla Forums does
now you too get out

Some of the early ones really were proper developers though and headed small teams so you know they has an impact and what they did. Molyneux, Romeo and Carmack all had more accessible credits, you know which levels Romero designed for example. Richard Garriot really created the Ultima series. Many of the early "celebrities" had earned their fame.

These days big companies just like to put a face out there for promotional reasons and you don't know what they've actually done, also since the teams are bigger than ever single people inevitably contribute less to a project. You can't even put trust in a studio since they keep firing and hiring people between projects.

Can anyone on Holla Forums like anything nowadays without OP shitting their diaper and sperging about it?

So long as people love games, there will be love for the people who make them. That's not inhuman, that's something beautiful.
Don't assume that all praise is blind, either; that's just cynicism to a numbing degree.

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MGS4 was bad.

As for never being able to finish his games, "art" is never really finished. Its just abandoned and shown, and its flaws affect people.

good example of developer worship