Creation of "German" Islam

archive.is/1UkKw

Yes I'm reposting a Holla Forums thread, but I genuinely want to know how your side looks on it.

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=-3MvinY66r0
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Saudi_Arabia
liveleak.com/view?i=597_1452679537
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_statistics
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_of_Islamic_law_by_country

hungarytoday.hu/news/breaking-desperate-migrants-march-towards-hungarian-border-serbia-67613
aljazeera.com/news/2016/07/hundreds-refugees-march-serbia-hungary-border-160724133938553.html
dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3704581/Hundreds-migrants-asylum-seekers-march-Serbia-s-border-Hungary-protest-decision-border-closed-people-trying-reach-EU.html
migrationsverket.se/English/About-the-Migration-Agency/Facts-and-statistics-/Statistics.html
bra.se/bra/bra-in-english/home/crime-and-statistics.html
youtube.com/watch?v=a56EqUPwyFQ
youtube.com/watch?v=4Vzk5QBg9a8
youtube.com/watch?v=PIK8bfeLXSw
youtube.com/watch?v=ZOGIXPrEaqw
data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/regional.php
unhcr.ie/about-unhcr/facts-and-figures-about-refugees
diw.de/de/diw_01.c.518472.de/themen_nachrichten/integration_von_fluechtlingen_fuehrt_langfristig_zu_positiven_wirtschaftlichen_effekten.html
doku.iab.de/aktuell/2015/aktueller_bericht_1514.pdf
politi.no/vedlegg/lokale_vedlegg/oslo/Vedlegg_1309.pdf
discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/24/response-to-taqiyya-deception-lying/
madworldnews.com/migrants-rape-woman-wheelchair/
madworldnews.com/migrant-kids-sexually-assault-girl/
northbergenpolice.com/general/annual-reports/reports/pdf/2015-Annual-Report.pdf
de.scribd.com/doc/76695373/Excerpt-From-Oslo-Police-District-Report-on-Rape
madworldnews.com/muslim-refugees-beat-choke-school/
theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

youtube.com/watch?v=-3MvinY66r0

Multiculturalism is Imperialism with a human face.

I didn't come to troll, I don't hate you, but I would like to see how you see the subject

Personally, I don't think islam and western values can coexist. It has been proven also that they don't want to integrate. It is very clear that they view women aa inferior human beings.

The cause of mass immigration itself was caused by Imperialist forces, such as Saudi Arabia, or the US.

The refugees are left with no choices but to go to Europe.

I think a lot of them already moved to Egypt or somewhere else in the region. But we have to be in mind that a lot of middle eastern countries are notorious capitalists. Just look at how countries like Qatar or Kuwait treats their foreign workers.

And what do those immigrants become when they come to Europe? Cheap labor source for the Bourgeoisie. Liberals know this and they wrap up their labor source import with "Humanitarianism", when it was them who caused those people to move at the first place.

Thank you for the reply.
I agree with you.
Honestly I'm very worried how this will pan out, we're all probably aware that the second wave is about to be released by Turkey.

saging myself for doublepost, but I think that
leftists and rightwing people (both moderate) do not have to be eachothers mortal enemies.
we may we different views on subjects, but we can also work together like smart people.

*have different views, but can work together as intelligent human beings

I speak for myself, I believe in secular law for all without exception, no tax breaks or charity statuses for churches or mosques.

Uniform animal cruelty laws, ie secular butchers can slaughter as cruel as a kosher/halal ones or kosher/halal must be banned.

No exceptions for Sikhs to forgo wearing safety helmets in lieu of turbans, or any other pri.veledges that other members of society may not have (like carry knives and wearing jewellery ie their steel bangles).

Of course I would ban all religious and segregated schools too, ban religious clothing on children on public institutions too.

I don't see why we can't have selective multiculturalism, we shouldn't just respect other people's spooks because they were born into a tribe that has them.

I would say we should ban immigration from most Muslim countries too but most immigration from said places are illegal and the system is intentionally set up to facilitate this so a ban would only provide lip service for idiot flag wavers and Nazis.

I also agree with this post and I'm reminded by it that all of the preceding stuff I just typed are minor petty issues in the grand scheme of things compared to what this guy posted.

Muslims immigrants in Qatar, Kuwait and don't forget the quashed uprising in Bahrain, are literally second class citizens with no right to buy or inherit property and work as indentured slaves with virtually little to no workers rights.

I also love that the Church of England has those trite "Refugees Welcome" hanging outside of their empty churches and cathedrals. It's not like they or the wealthy will be footing the bill for the socio-economic trauma that this is bringing.

Fuck that. Punish refugees who rape. Don't collectively punish everyone fleeing war zones on the basis of that small minority.

...

Kill all men and make qts state issued gfs.

If you say so. Notice though how it's only proponents are self-described leftists?

my reaction: overthrow them

how would you intend to do that?
its not like islam hasnt had revisionists and people attempting to reform it before
the Ottomans attempted to reform it and failed
how would you intend to successfully reform a backwards semitic religion with dark age values and ideals that believes in a rigorous hierarchy of submission and persecution, strict rules enforced by family and community leaders and mass delusion
arabs still drink camel piss as a cure all today because the Qu'ran names it a panacea

Interesting, it's like it came from garbage sites with no credibility what so ever.

Also, it's fucking obvious Islam is going to be come "Europeanized" when it comes to Europe, do you seriously think a between 3-5% minority can actual remain uninfluenced by the norms surrounding them? Muslims in Sweden celebrate Christmas ffs.


fucking this


a) this is not a very "moderate" i.e centrist board. It's not a question of raising or lower taxes, yours and our goals are completely opposed - there is no common ground.

...

Send them to Antartica.
use them to make Antartica habitable for the future.

...

I wouldnt call the US imperialistic, you guys are fond of that label but it doesnt apply to them
the US is an oligarchic hegemony, empires are less corrupt than them and are far more beneficial than those
why?
why in the flying fuck do they have no choice but to go to Europe?
they arent starving, they cause these wars amongst themselves over their own issues, all America, Israel and the House of Saud do is arm and finance them
you're so deluded its unbelievable
they dont work, most of them are illiterate in every language and barely speak english let alone which ever national language of the european countries that get forced to take them in
and literacy is pretty basic for any workforce these days

they receive massive welfare payments and live off those
if they want more money they breed and get the child support welfare
I remember a news story where a Pakistani man was receiving 5500 euros a week from the state in total for his 14 paki kids

either that or they commit crime, most usually burglary, drug dealing or human trafficking mostly in children

the idea that they're being deliberately destabilized in order to create a new cheap workforce in Europe is not the big bad plan
neither is it as simple as bringing in third worlders to do all the menial jobs the natives dont want to do
which is not the problem because these countries are already wracked with youth unemployment

the idea is simple
destabilize the middle east, accept millions of dangerous savage foreigners into your country, settle them among the peasants no matter how much blood is spilt and use the ensuing civil unrest to swear in emergency powers and create the perfect totalitarian surveillance state so a globalist elite can live in absolute bliss and luxury in their ivory towers far away from the nightmarish life of the common man as he lives in a real life rainbow coloured rendition of 1984 and Brave New World

you're about 5 steps behind the reality

French revolution for the middle east.

they've tried that
Islam is not open minded to the ideas of egalite, liberty and fraternitie
this is a religion and a culture where brothers murder their brothers over titles and land, where women have their clitorises cut off to instill subservience into them and they are the only people still in the world to run religious inquisitions and have morality police who will stone you to death for being raped and have in 1980's Iran shot women in the street for not wearing their hijabs

Yes. Syrian crisis started as conflict among the Syrian people. But the US and Saudis are hiring mercenaries from Sudan, Egypt, and so on and so on. The crisis isn't even about Syrians anymore.

The last paragraph you wrote is pretty much what I meant though.

Examples, please?

Sweden will be first.

No it wasnt
you still think its class warfare, the way you described it gives the impression that its evil factory bosses sitting in their offices rubbing their hands with glee while poor refugees are forced to toil the wheat fields
first thing these fuckers ask when they get to Europe?
wheres my free phone? wheres my european girlfriend? wheres my money?
native europeans are going through all sorts of experiences at the moment
nationalism is on the rise in Europe in response to being oppressed, persecuted and victimized by their own state
when your daughters raped by arabs but nothing is done because the police dont want to cause a racial incident
when your sons stabbed to death by a somalian but he only gets a 2 year jail sentence because hes a refugee
they riot and destroy infrastructure and attack people and show a complete and total disdain for the natives where ever they go and that makes people angry

they're not mercenaries
Africa is practically a land of bandits and warlords
the Soviet Union and America flooded that dark continent with weapons for decades in their proxy war of communism vs republican puppet states/dictators
the native negros and arabs didn't change at all they just swapped their spears and muskets for AK 47'S and M14's
is it any wonder every time a dictator is overthrown in africa these days he's just replaced with a few more smaller dictators who have even less control over their countries than the last guy
most rebel groups in Africa are just men from some tribes who gang together to rape and pillage but they pretend its a political war in order to not just get blacklisted as organized crime by the UN
whats needed for Syria's long term stability is Assad, America/Israel/Saudi plans to overthrow another stable dictatorship in the middle east to economically sabotage their non-puppet states has just backfired horrendously so they've sped up their plans for Europe in the meantime

lol this is literally just made up information

Japan accepted 9 refugees into that district
2 of those 9 gangraped a 40 yo Japanese woman in a public toilet when she was on the way home from work
beat her bloody and senseless then ditched her
they caught them on CCTV and with DNA evidence
they were turks that had filed for refugees to Japan

it doesn't mean "THEY BELIEVE IN JIHAD AS WELL"

also then you punish those responsible severely. you don't go ahead and just marginalize everyone escaping a war that the west caused as inhuman baby rapists. this is like shit we are going to look back at in 100 years and laugh about, like how we used to be racist against irish people

the problem is not with them at an individual level
they practice cultures where this stuff is normalised to them, they barely consider it a crime
it isnt a crime in islamic law to gangrape a 10 yo boy as long as that boy is not a muslim
they inherently think different to what you believe they do
they may not believe in jihad but they sure as shit didnt believe it was a big deal to beat a woman half to death and sodomize her just because they were feeling horny
this is whats flooding into the 1st world

i think everything has been said.
i just want to add that refugees != immigrants.
their status is temporary and its up to the country accepting them to make sure of it.

immigrants are a different story and its also up to the country accepting them to make sure that they can and will blend in their host country.

France and Europe in general has a history of hiding 3rd world war criminal who flied their home countries justice system. all because they may face death sentence (rightfully so).

France UK and Belgium has a large population of muslim radicals and their 12 devil spawn for each woman, who fled Algeria when the civil war ended.

Implicit admission of demographic reality. Germany will be an Islamic majority within a lifetime

really now.
do you have any rape statistic about muslim countries to back that up ?

do women report that they've been raped when they get beheaded by the authorities for being raped?

The greatest irony to come out of the post-9/11 atmosphere is, more and more it's becoming apparent that "Islamic values" and capitalism aren't exactly enemies, or were ever enemies at all to begin with. The fact that the burkini is allowed to exist at all - and the fact that France was the one that came out with egg all over its face when it tried to ban it - is proof that capitalism can just as easily create a market for Islamic modesty as it can for sex.

It's so obvious that Merkel invited all those Syrian and Iraqi refugees into Germany in order to 1. put a shitload of pressure on Greece, as that's how they enter the Schengen Area and 2. gather cheap labor. This had nothing to do with Europe giving back what it stole from Third World nations as a lot of moralists like to claim.

It should also be said that "Islamic communism" only exists in the minds of western leftist academics. If Muslims truly believed Muhammad was LITERALLY LENIN or some great egalitarian and defender of human rights then that's how they would be interpreting their scriptures, which they're not.

proof that .

Muslim women typically need to bring four witnesses in order to prove they were raped.

you're trolling right ?, i can't tell with Holla Forumstards anymore

thats not a sauce
most muslim country don't apply sharia you deluded stormtard

Nope.

Yeah the islamic fundamentalists are bad, but the right wing fundamentalists like le pen are capable of much more damage.

As for this, I doubt the German government would be able to make it work.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Saudi_Arabia


which ones?
the ones run by aging arabic oligarchs who were either installed or trained by British, French of American influences?
most arabic countries werent countries 100 years ago, most of them were formed with the idea of an artificial nation state encapsulating the borders of a former colonial province

...

Ever been to Europe in the past year? Refugees and other migrants are trying to become permanent residents of said countries and get permission to WORK.

I visited Frankfurt back in July and saw plenty of Syrians and Turks living just like normal German citizens. They're a valuable resource for capitalism because, despite their "backwards" customs, their culture greatly values hard work, obedience to authorities, and discipline.

Is there any data on growth in employment among Muslim refugees and the like in Germany?

What you said about Islam's compatibility with capitalism is true, though. In the US Muslims were seen as a solid Republican constituency before the whole 9/11 thing happened. Dosen't the Quran basically say that the rich are favored by Allah or something along those lines?

So they are not ok with it
And 2.19 is a very law number

+ you didn't prove that saudi women get behead for speaking up
there was one women in 2009 got prison for that,

Nice one pol you are the easist to BTFO

thats one of those old SAUDI ARABIAN laws that isn't followed anymore, if you think saudi arabia is the entirity of the muslim world then you are a stupid faggot.

its seriously as if russians were to be terrified of how crazy we are because we have weird old laws like you "cant wear red shoes on a tuesday in public".

what you are doing to a mostly 99.9999999% and just like us in every way (capitalists/and exploited) good people is straight up old school racism. thinking that they are all exactly the same, rapists who just want to see everyone you know and loved raped. it's fucking stupid and in 100 years when we realize its just people running away from a shitstorm we started (some of them being bad and the rest being good like in literally every single society ever) we are going to laugh

what drinking beer, eating pork, clubbing and engaging in drunken consensual extramarital sex?

hard work? are you retarded?
their culture preaches why work yourself when you make slaves do it for you
obedience to authorities?
they recognize no authority but Allah and the Prophet Muhammad, if they are quite devout they may adhere to the wisdom of an Imam which is just a guy who can read and has a Qu'ran and calls himself an Imam alot of the time
and discipline?
they make up so many excuses for 'temptation' they act on their impulses and blame it on everyone but themselves

what you met were the 'westernized' immigrants who keep their mouths shut, their eyes and ears closed to what their more savage brethren do and even shelter known terrorists like they did in Belgium with that jihadi that tried to blow up a nuclear plant

remember muslims have been using the same tactic since the 6th century to conquer lands

its how Muhammad went from camel train bandit to persecuted minority to ruler of Mecca and Medina to Caliph of Arabia
if he had been tried for banditry by the pagan arab tribes he attacked Islam wouldnt exist
but Muhammad had the protection of the Jewish Kingdom of Yemen and Christian warlords in Arabia who protected him from the hangmans noose


liveleak.com/view?i=597_1452679537
live in denial you fuck its not you who suffers is it you upper middle class white suburban prick

I dated a Muslim guy a few years ago and seriously thought about converting, so I have a decent amount of knowledge on (Sunni) Islamic theology.

Not sure TBH, but in Islam there's a very strong idea that poverty is one's own doing, and that charity to the poor is a kind of "special ed" in a way. Islam has a work ethic that is very similar to that of Protestantism.

Every time I read the whole "Sweden is a rape capital" thing I cringe. People who believe this have literally just googled for Sweden rape rates and saw that the number of cases that were actually brought to the police rose. They completely ignore the fact the number started to go up before the influx of Muslim refugees and that the numbers rose because in Sweden there were multiple efforts to encourage victims to report the crime since for many victims it's just too embarrassing and they'd rather just forget. If we look at the rape-survey from the BRA we can see that the number of rapes is about the same with some fluctuation that doesn't correlate with the refugee-intake.

Islam puts a huge emphasis on hard work, pulling yourself up by your bootstraps and all that. The Ottoman Empire had a thriving merchant economy in its early years before the Mongols invaded and forced trade to move from Constantinople to Florence.

Islam doesn't see the presence of wealth (and thus poverty) as inherently unjust, much unlike Christianity (outside of Protestantism) and some sects of Judaism. Islam has never believed that the existing world is inherently broken and in need of escape (Christianity/Gnosticism) or fixing (the notion of tikkun in Judaism).

rape is literally the biggest crime in muslim countries.

there is no jail for that shit, they look down on rape more severely than any other place on earth because they still have backwards womens honor stone age mentalities. (girl being muslim or not) rape is taken very very seriously you will literally be murdererd if you rape a girl in a muslim country, from saudi arabia to jordan they all have the death penalty for it.

lol dude… come on… ALL RAPE is punishable by death in islamic countries, there has never been a "but they aren't muslim" defense. and if you seriously think having gay sex in islamic countries with little boys is cool because you can cherry pick weird in congruent statements about being able to take what you want in a war without it being stealing (like every other culture ever) and link them with sex with little boys then you are an idiot.

take 5 seconds to actually study muslim countries and how they treat rape

Somewhat relevant.
The french did also a study on Islam in their country. I'll post it and translate:

www.institutmontaigne.org/fr/publications/un-islam-francais-est-possible

Untrue. Orthodox Islam has very rigid social hierarchies. Men and women are not allowed to pray together in the same room. Men are clearly the head of the family and women are conditioned into obeying their husbands (in most versions of Islamic Law, women are required to have sex with their husbands whenever the husband demands, for example). Muslim children do not disobey their parents; there is a huge emphasis on duty-based ethics and rituals even from childhood.

Talk to any Muslim and you'll see how he/she tends to have his/her emotions very much under control. The image of the "raging Muslim" is pretty much a media fiction. In Islamic societies, it's considered a sign of great shame to burst into a fit of narcissistic rage the way tumblr SJWs (or alt-righters) do. Being triggered is considered a sign of weakness.

Arguably, one of the reasons why incidents like Charlie Hebdo happen is because Muslims feel ashamed at being so weak and disempowered that they're unable to stop their religion from being slandered.

this. islam is the ultimate enemy of communism for this reason.

it is literally haram to have a system where there are no poor in islam, its why leftism was so hard to take off there regardless of britian and america's betrayal of the arab world with israel being a thing. Actual Muslims are bootstrap as fuck.

in the end this little war the west is fighting with muslims doesn't need to exist, they are both exactly the same ideologically. the real war comes in 200 years when us communists try to spread communism across the planet and have to start working on the middle east, unlike the USSR's pathetic attempt

no they just believe they are gods chosen people because they submit to him
explain dhimmu then its no different from how the jews view goy
the turks spent 400 years ransacking and pillaging their way through Roman Asia, and the arabs did the same for Roman Africa
that 'merchant economy' was only by trading goods from the east to the west
the Ottoman Empire ran on its slaves
it had jews running its finances and castrated christian slavs fighting its wars for it
Vlad the Impaler dedicated his life to slaying turks because his father sent him and his brother to the turkish courts where he and his brother were sodomized by the sultan
his brother became a homosexual, adopted islam and became the princes secret lover
meanwhile Vlad got mad and used his bilingual ability and knowledge of the turks to liberate his homeland from their rule and jizhya tax

The west has been at war with Islam ever since it crawled out of the Arabian desert


no thats apostasy
turkish caliphs practiced it, Muhammad sucked the tongues of young boys, Pakistan and Afghanistan are known hotspots for child rape
mainly boys and in pakistan abducting and raping boys from the small christian community there isn't pursued by the police as a crime
Islam is hypocrisy to the core
they say one thing and act the opposite when noones looking
noone remember that Saudi princess caught by MI6 being the center of a 6 man gangbang in her apartment during a raid?

i am not white
i am not middle class
i live in the hellhole known as the middle east
I went through 2 wars and manged to stay alive
I fought in one war and manged get out of it alive
I am nobody, and that is the best thing

How dose it feel to be BTFO this easily tell me poltard ?
Go outside this board and practice your favorite hobby burning books and such

cont.

authority and hierrchy arent the same thing
is leftypol just full of illiterate yanks and darkies?
go up to one and call the Prophet a goat sodomizing cum drinking syphilitic sister fucking cancer sore and see what happens then
they got triggered all the time, Saladin lopped a prisoner of wars head off because he got mad at him
you are mad
1000 years ago men were burned alive for blaspheming against christ
muslims do that same shit today for those who blaspheme against muhammad and allah

To be fair, there were anarchists and Marxists in the late Ottoman Empire, BUT they tended to be heretical Muslims like the Alevis/Sufis, or Jews/Dönmeh. Some very prominent Turkish feminists, for example, came from Dönmeh or Sufi backgrounds.

Or, we can just look at what happened in Indonesia during the 60s: the vast majority of Indonesian communists were synchrotist Muslims who blended Islam with Hinduism, Buddhism, and paganism (plus Marxism) - they were slaughtered mercilessly by Islamic fundamentalists who were supported by the US and Australia.

And again, if "Islamic communism" was a legitimate thing and not just a meme, then actual Muslims on the ground in Egypt, Palestine, Iraq, Pakistan, etc. would be fighting for it rather than liberal democracy or Islamic feudalism.

yeah fuck off, reveal yourself or be the fantasy you really are
cant imagine a war veteran not being proud of what they did no matter what the cost
palestinian?

gee i guess that contradict your claim here

so it has been proven to be the least likely country to get raped in by NGO.

whay safer tha countries like Finland has a 15,2/100k and France with 16,2/100k
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_statistics


thats beside the point, moron.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Application_of_Islamic_law_by_country


and yes, under islamic law rape is severely punished


literally blow your whole argument by yourself

3

cont

so you believe what they say instead of how they act
smart lad tbh

can't believe that fucking tool made me defend islam.

so i should believe you instead of statistic and logic ?

islamic communism is a meme, its not a real thing its like saying capitalistic communism

its only on this board as a joke. the only communists left in the middle east are ones who are christian or secular muslims or lefty palestinians

I see no problem with this.

Islam will conquer the world and bring to it peace.

inshallah

Monitored

BREAKING

URGENT ANNOUNCEMENT!

Soros and Brussel declare war on Hungary!
Migrants march toward Hungary border to demand its opening
newscenter1.tv/story/33310923/migrants-march-toward-hungary-border-to-demand-its-opening
hungarytoday.hu/news/breaking-desperate-migrants-march-towards-hungarian-border-serbia-67613
aljazeera.com/news/2016/07/hundreds-refugees-march-serbia-hungary-border-160724133938553.html
dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3704581/Hundreds-migrants-asylum-seekers-march-Serbia-s-border-Hungary-protest-decision-border-closed-people-trying-reach-EU.html

Why, your feelings, of course. Don't you know that all the Arabs and Blacks are going to rape and murder everyone and destroy civilization? Aren't you scared? Don't bother thinking about it, they're a real threat, and if you ever doubt that or go against our official lines that means you're helping them win and it's too late.

The first image in OP is truly and completely reasonable.

If a woman is alone without man company, she deserved to be raped.

We already accept such if a woman walks alone in a black neighbourhood so Muslim should be no different.

Fucking americans and their wars on x

Its not fucking war. You dont fucking know what war is.

31% of respondents declaring themselves Muslim travel once a week in a mosque or a prayer room, against 8.2% in the general population;

70% of respondents say they "always" buy halal meat, 22% buy "sometimes" and only 6% "never";

about 65 percent of Muslims - religion or culture - favour the veil;

78% respondents declaring themselves Muslim - registered voters - say they do not always vote for a Muslim candidate in various elections.

Holy shit. Holla Forums is more redpilled than I imagined. You guys can be right wing socialists, you know. This board has no reason to exist. But that's fine, because an enemy of my enemy is my friend.

On the day we take Europe back we'll fight side by side against the brown hordes as comrades

what is the u supposed to stand for and what is the green thing supposed to stand for?

i'm increadibly hung over and have class in 2 hours sum this picture up for me

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Stop, there is no such thing. Being against backward religion (opiate of the masses) and literal rapists, and using your brain and trying practical solutions to problem does not make you a nazi.

You are absolutely retarded. European countries (France in particular) have been importing cheap labour from the Middle East and North Africa since the fucking 70s, that's the whole point of mass immigration in modern society. Your views are based entirely on fear and absurd fantastic stereotypes. Nothing happens in this world if someone's not getting paid behind it. Plus, this sort of policy only helps the far right, which (surprise surprise) the EU has ties to - look, for example, at their technocratic appointments during the imposition of Greece austerity. A surprising number of these ostensibly apolitical technocrats turned out to be far-right nationalists. I wonder how that works?

Yes, Islam has served as a means for young men to rebel against the alienation caused by Western capitalist society, and this has manifested materially as rape and violence. However, Islam didn't cause the alienation. Jobless young men without prospects in life and without socially acceptable means to get laid tend to respond with extraordinary violence. What do you think it would result in, importing them en masse, once dispossessed by war, and again by a society that has no need of them besides as supplementary bodies in the industrial reserve army?

This Holla Forumsyp's tendency to distill everything to matters of culture and identity is intellectual poison. There are clear socioeconomic reasons for all of this, but you prefer to cling to your infantile orcs vs humans fantasy instead of confronting them.

Ideology and commodities respectively.

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cont

PURGE TIME

Haha, no.

most of the modern growing nationalist movements are exactly comprised of those types of individuals
gee i wonder why the rape and violence from that group hasnt skyrocketed in recent months
we dont want them imported in in the first place, they arent imported anyway they fucking walk here with the aid of humanitarians and groups run by kikes like Soros
you're joking right?
the EU parliaments majority is formed of a socialist party, a liberal party and a socialist party
Merkel is an actual east german communist
because they were totally the problem not the corrupt banks and corporations

you cant even see problems through the lense of culture, race and religion
noone at the bottom rung of society gives a flying fuck about socioeconomics

And Palestine is just one Muslim country. You don't see any far-left movements in the Islamic World aside from the Kurds, who are mostly atheists and secularists.

they werent when they were beheading and raping the ever loving shit out of Armenians 80 years ago

Have you even checked her political party's ideology?

Inb4: "Bu, but I thought Liberals were communists?!"

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Different user reporting in. Can anyone point out any numbers that show higher rape rates among Muslims compared to other people in the same country (since different rape laws and definitions make a huge difference). Every time I hear that claim thrown around it's "b-but muh Sweden rape capital!" and well, it basically just comes down to this

Christianity is liberal as hell these days
the pope bergoglio sucks the feet of people he should be massacring for heresy
he legitimizes homosexuality and promotes contraception
he is by far the worst pope that has ever existed
not even a christian but the Pope is supposed to represent Christendom not make it more tolerant to islam and sodomy
if Merkel is pro-european why does she fly rapefugees by the planeload into germany to stick on welfare?

Nasser and Gaddafi were never communists. They were basically Arab turd position. (Gaddafi actually murdered communists.)

you could try and explain why Malmo has 55 no go zones for the police and why the religious demographics of Malmo read more than 60% muslim
do correlational studies you plebs its all right before your eyes

Also the Egyptian Communist Party supported the coup by Sisi.

(link to Its history, its organization, its funding and its evolution)

(link to All about the Salafist islam: a rampant ideology without centralized organization)


The year 1989 is a hinge: after the outsourcing of the management of the Muslim faith to States of origin from 1960 to 1989, the conjunction of three events - the fatwa launched by ayatollah Khomeini against Salman Rushdie, "the case of the veil" which burst in Creil and the rise of Islamism in Algeria that threatens the french territory - pushed the State to get involved in the Organization of islam in France.
(link to various articles i'll post if someone ask)


CONT

Because the stormcucks don't know the meaning of alienation. Strictly speaking they're in a far more privileged position compared to the brown people economically and don't have all their women hidden and locked away. If most of them raped and murdered they'd lose quite a bit, because they have quite a bit to lose. Likewise, they don't generally reject the system and its values entirely. Like you, they cover their ears, close their eyes, and sing 'It's the corporations! It's the leaders! It's the culture!' Yeah, blame anything but the real problem.

You're retarded. There's not even any real socdem parties in Europe, much less legit socialist parties.

Do they eat feelings, then? Christ, you're stupid.

cont


Then follows the Institute's propositions. Do anyone read or am i bothering for nothing?

First, no go zones for the most part don't affect the topic of sexual assault. In its nature the crime is fundamentally different from any other form of crime. You could make a case about Muslims being more prone to crimes like stealing for example in the same way black people are, it comes down to poverty. Germany is the perfect example, in the 60s-70s a lot of poor working class Turks immigrated into Germany and due to the low class-permeability a lot of poor people are Turks today. I'm sure you know of the crime-poverty dynamic. Second of all, I'd like you to cite a study that shows a positive correlation between sexual assault and Muslims. The Sweden-case already works against your point. Here are the sources.

migrationsverket.se/English/About-the-Migration-Agency/Facts-and-statistics-/Statistics.html

bra.se/bra/bra-in-english/home/crime-and-statistics.html

Look at the sex gangs being exposed in Britain in the last few years. They're all Muslim, and it's been accepted even by pro-Islam journals like the Guardian that this is not coincidence or selective reporting. And I don't know about rape in particular, but Muslims are hugely overrrepresented in crime stats. British Muslims are 3 times as likely to be in prison than the average, and 10 times as likely as British Hindus (who are overwhelmingly from the same racial and economic background, so that rules out non-religious factors). France famously does not collect religious stats, but it is generally accepted that a clear majority, and maybe as much as three-quarters, of the prison population is Muslim (they are 10% of the general population).

And before anyone says 'they're only criminal because of poverty', I don't give a fuck WHY they do it, only that they do it and that this is a problem that we do not need.

...

Yeah, just like liberals think they're leftists… Hmm…

you really have no idea
again proving your SJW loyalty
what do they have to lose?
respect of family and friends? barely any friends usually cut ties with family
how society views them? demonized to the extreme by all media
they're jobless and living on welfare watching their society fall to the barbarian hordes and noone is coming to save them
what do they have to lose?
because life is cheap in this nightmare

what is the real problem in your eyes?
whatever fantasist we come back to the its not real socialism flowchart dont we

i dont even know what the fuck you mean with this statement


what are Malmo's crime statistics 40 years ago?
compare them with today
seek what changed in the meantime
3 police officers are handing in their resignation a day in Sweden because they cant handle it anymore

vid related
youtube.com/watch?v=a56EqUPwyFQ


all pakis, all muslims
they abduct white british kids and raped them
happening across the country, covered up by socialist labour because their main voters include muslim immigrants instead of the poor white working class Britons they used to represent

...

it a buzzword faggot
theres no such thing as muh privilege of any kind in the sense you use it

Yes, postcolonial theory is shit.
youtube.com/watch?v=4Vzk5QBg9a8

The most clear relationship that I think could be argued for the link between Islamic cultural background and sex assault is the objectification and commodification of women that is found in Islamic cultures. It's not necessarily unique to Islam but also something that is disproportionately found in communities such as ultra-Orthodox Jews, various Mennonite groups, fundamentalist Mormons and such. Since there's a high value placed on female sexual virtue and the general demonization of sexuality. When neither sex are allowed to express their desires naturally and there's huge pressure for women and girls to remain pure, rape becomes that much easier. It's helped, of course, by the fact that the girls and women in this case are generally totally financially dependent on their families and could lose their ability to survive if they fail to live up to societal standards of virtue.


Understanding problems is how you solve problems.


You're pretty fucking self-absorbed if you don't realize how good you have it. It's funny how often they turn out to be middle-class kids from the suburbs who get to go to school and enjoy a life of having food daily and shitposting all day about immigrants on the internet. And I wasn't talking about race-based muh privilege, I was talking about the simple fact that you're most likely in a much better socioeconomic position.

I take it you agree transwomen are real women then?

Socioeconomics is what determines whether you get to eat or enjoy any sort of social life. They care very much about it, even if they don't know it.

Holla Forums is alright.

t. Holla Forums

my parents waited in the bread lines and Ive gone days without food
I steal my neighbours internet tbh they've got a wifi modem with no protection and unlimited download so its pretty sweet

what do you make of me then
Im working class, poorest of the poor
i moved from council house to council house, only ever attended public school and my family lived off the socialist handouts
i am that virtuous poor
explain to me why i oppose socialism?

I don't use those words. Because those muh privileges only exits in human minds.

This is just racism.

Blacks also rape disproportionately everywhere but it's because of racism.

Besides, it's not like rape is murder. They deserve it for being white women.

That's easy, it's because you don't understand socialism.

...

Sex gangs? What are you referring to. As far as I know there was only one thing which was the whole Sex-Slave deal lead by a few Asian men and while that's horrible, a few instances like this don't somehow prove that Muslims in general are way more prone to commit rapes and the alike. Statistical evidence does and as far as I know, there's none. If you got some I'd like to see them.


Even though this goes away from the original topic, I'd still like to see the sources on that. Especially in regards to the economic background. A thing that is also important to keep in mind is the number and location of people of the particular group. 200 People of a certain ethnic group grouped together in a city will have an entirely different cultural reaction to poverty than let's say 2000 people of a certain ethnic group who are distributed all over the country. Also alienation plays a role. This potentially could play a role when it comes to rape but we don't have much evidence to go on here since the crime itself is so unique and influenced by much more factors than let's say stealing.

The video doesn't present any statistical evidence and it doesn't even link a study or anything along those lines in the description. Concerning Malmo, again, I don't necessarily deny that Muslims can be more prone to commit a crime due to alienation and poverty. We're only talking about rape and to Malmo applies exactly the same as to Sweden. A rise in overall crime doesn't automatically include a rise of rape since it's so vastly different, you have to single out the crime and present data that goes beyond just the rape cases reported to the police. Read carefully again. It might help you in understanding the factors that play into the whole rape-situation thing. Of course it doesn't go into detail but on a surface level it explains why the rape claim is wrong or at least not as unequivocal as it's made out to be.

And thats why you'll never gain the support of those poor proletariats smart enough to question certain aspects

Gee, I wonder who's behind this post?

What's the problem here? Get raped and fuck off.

...

It's not a meme, it's a fact. You do not understand even its most basic tenets. The version of socialism that you are against is a version that exists only in your head. You have not brought any real arguments against our political philosophy, because you have no idea what it is.

You can externalize all the social problems you face and lay them at the feet of politicians and immigrants, but even if you win with that line of thinking, your problems will continue to exist and they will continue to affect other generations because you're not addressing the root causes.

...

a disproportionate amount of pedophiles are priests and other christian affiliated works.
yet you don't see anyone blaming all christians for it.

gee, could it be double thinking ?
could it be the fact that your mediocre cognitive abilities don't let you see past than your tribalism instinct ?
could it be that your autism don't let you grasp the concept of nuances and the existence of individuals entities ?

i'm always amazed by this.
you're able to see individuals only among your "tribe".

...

Not the person you're responding to, but why are you going to such great lengths to defend Muslims? Perhaps you idealize them or maybe are guilty about your race or wealth.

Stop playing these mental games. You can be right wing anti Muslims and still be a socialist. Really

I don't remember you questioning anything. You just came to blame "socialists" for some stuff, you were told that they are not socialist by any mean and you just spewed no true Scottman. even tough this is unrelated.

we should just make all regilions a capital offense 2bh

No, you literally can't. Be right-wing I mean. Even if you call yourself right-wing, if you're against private property everyone on the right and the left is going to view you as left-leaning.

You can be anti-Islam in the same sense you can be against any sort of religious reactionaries, but that doesn't necessarily mean supporting deportation and suppression of all people who practice Islam, in the very same way it doesn't mean supporting the deportation and suppression of Christians who practice their religion in a non-odious way.

I saw some people on the internet arguing about Muslims in a really shallow manner so I decided to educate myself. I get pleasure from being correct about things because I'm insecure about my own intelligence. It isn't the most noble motivation but it really doesn't change the point I've made.


Nah.


Haha, I wish.


Oh no, you got me. The valid points I've raised are all just a game. Now that I'm out of the closet let's spread some fascism.


You can't be right wing and a socialist. You can be anti-Muslim and a socialist. I'm not really into the latter so no, thanks.

You really can't think past ethnic/religous groups don't you?
The point is to show that blaming some Muslims's criminality on the fact they're Muslim is meaningless. There are Muslims criminals, there are non criminal Muslims. The Muslim criminality is largely the result of material conditions, like in every other community. If it's stupid and unfair for all Whites to be blamed for slavery why blaming all Muslim for the rapes some of them do should be different?

Not true. For the Modern alt-right, economics are not a concern. You do all your communisms and whatnot as long as you want to remove brown people. We have variable views on economics. I myself believe the means of production should be given to the (white) workers.

(the latter being the combination of socialism and an anti-Muslim sentiment. Socialism is pretty great imo)

How'd that work out for [email protected]/* */, huh?

don't bother, stormfags are like radical feminist who blame all men for rape.

surprisingly, stormfag can see the fallacy on that one but not when they do it themselves

The alt-right only has vaguely socialist tendencies when it comes to things like health care. Actual socialism is an extremely rare thing there.

Can I just point out that sounds exceedingly difficult given that rape requires at least two people?

What rock have you been living under, fuckface? The Catholic abuse scandals significantly undermined the already-shaky position of the Catholic Church in almost every Western country.

On the other hand the British media pretty much swept the various paki rape gangs under the rug with cries of #NotAllMuslims (and those white trash Poorthern chav slags probably deserved it anyway)

Why is no one here discussing the true motivation behind such fallacies? Why is no one here discussing the people behind these agendas?

Holla Forums claims to be intellectual, but I see more circular logic than critical thinking. We must never forget the Jewish agenda. We must never forget the Frankfurt school. We must point the finger at the obvious anuddah shoah committed against Europe in the name for greater Israel.

Despite Holla Forums's childish attempt to censor words, w. h. i. t. e genocide is very real.

May the mods kill themselves slowly and painfully in the name of liberalism.

GULAG yourself

...

Also, read Adorno, it will blow your mind.

See:

Muslims being invited into Europe is literally for no reason other than muh cheap labor.

Seems like a pretty bad idea tbh.
"American Islam" is best exemplified by that guy who shot up the gay bar, that guy who shot up the military base, that guy who shot up the mall, that guy who smoked a lot of pot and his brother and he were like, "fuck this shit man, let's blow up a marathon.

Even our latest product, Ahmad Rahami, despite efforts by the media to sensationalize his Muslimness, is a distinctly American creation. He hated his conservative, petit-bourgeois dad who kicked him out, his chief influences were all Americans, he purchased his illegal firearm in Virginia like any good Mid Atlantic resident, and his bombs were made from materials purchased at Wal Mart. He even brought pipe bombs and a journal to the party, Harris and Klebold would be proud.

A German Islam would be the Munich shooter. The problem is not that these people are not integrating, but that they are integrating far too well into societies that bubble with barely contained violence.

...

You realize that the shooter had medical files at home that pointed towards a depression? He was angry at his classmates. Furthermore the shooter did intensive research on Breivik and Winnenden. In terms of semantics it's kinda off to call the shooter "German Islam".

you're full of shit and you know it.
no one points fingers at Christians for it, but they do at Muslims.
the fact that we're here arguing about it prove it.
how many thread have you seen blaming christian about child rape ? you insurable cunt.
i'll tell you, none.
because everyone understand that its a fallacy, but somehow itsn't a fallacy with muslim or whatever minority.

i hope you all die you fucking moronic stormdumbasses

What planet are you living on? Jokes about priests touching kids are more commonplace than jokes about ditzy blondes.


The difference (outside MSM coverage - again, you must've been born in 2000 if you think the coverage of the various rape gangs in Britain is anything compared to the coverage of the Catholic sex scandals) is that while Christian abuse was largely limited to members of the particular denomination, the pakistani rape gangs were actively involved in raping non-Muslims, such as low class white girls or Sikh girls

Father Dougherty wasn't turning yeshivas into industrial rape factorys

Yes. Jokes about priests. From a specific organization with a history of sweeping molestation under the rug. They don't for example, blame Methodists or Orthodox Christians or even ordinary line Catholics. Even so, the fact that jokes are what you bring up is telling. I don't recall anyone talking about deporting Catholics and illegalizing the Catholic Church.

People blame pedophilia on priests, not on Christians. But they blame terrorism on Muslims instead of blaming the sole terrorists. Can't you see the double standard?

The migrant crisis is a disaster because of government incompetence, simply put. Most of the refugees in Germany aren't even Syrian.

I agree that the government failed when it comes to handling the migrant crisis. However, I don't see how pointing out that most refugees in Germany aren't even Syrian points to that .The government accepts people from every country that's not a "safe country" as determined by the government itself. Mostly it comes to to whether there's war/intense oppression or not. Syria isn't the only country with war or oppression.

That was my point.
He was a German Muslim, fully inegrated into Kultur. Bleach his skin white, dye his hair blond, inject blue dye into his eyeballs, and change his name to Fritz Kreiger; none of this will make a damn bit of difference.

The idea that Western values can cure Islamic backwardness is wrong from the start. Both cultures are founded upon violence,.

While I agree that both cultures are founded on violence the kind of violence is different, at least when it comes to your other examples but those are not the ones I want to talk about. Not enough time for that. Anyway, not paying enough attention to psychology is a thing in Islamic, German and about every culture on the planet. That's why I was pointing out that in terms of semantics it's redundant to call the Munich shooter German Islam. The whole thing had nothing to do with things that are specific to any of the two cultures. You might as well call every body brown person who pisses while standing German Islam.

Breddy bad example

Let's get something out of the way. No one gives a fuck about what happens to the refugees. Don't pretend like you do. So stop considering thier interest when deciding. Now do you have a different opinion?

This. Depending on how far you want to stretch the definition of "war-ravaged" you could probably include every country west of India and south of Europe

I solely receive pleasure from Nazis getting hurt. This means that I just choose the option that increases the Nazi injured per day rate. As it turns out more refugees, while funnily enough being also a rather humane option, is the option that leads to more Nazis to engaging in actions that might hurt them which increases the Nazi injured per day rate. It's pretty much a win-win for me and the refugees.

that's hot af tbh

This.
Believe it or not, the problem isnt a right/left problem.

The problem is a porky problem.

you should consider buying a rope and killing yourself

Fixed.

...

you seem to be upset

You bet I am, you're as degenerate as porky.

Really makes you think

You forgot that the common man in the attacking country did not want to attack those other countries. The pandering to porky is killing innocent people in both countries now.

Which sounds like tyranny tbh.

Fucking this. If I could give you 100 internets or a kilogram of gold for this post, I would give it to you immediately.

Do you know what is funny though?
Last year antifa attacked me because I was at a protest, for just this thing. Saying we don't want backwards islam in our country.
The protest wasn't against those seeking refuge from war, which I personally believe fully deserve the compasion.

Do you know what antifa called me while they attacked 8 v 1 with baseball bats beat me to the ground and started bashing my skull in?
They called me a fascist and a nazi.
That hurt me more than wounds, those can heal. But to attack someone because of your (false) assumption and be ready to kill him?
That hurt me on a strictly human basis.

My grandfather was a partisan. He fought against nazis. I personally lived through the balkan war and had refugees from Bosna as schoolmates. We had deep compassion, understanding, love and acceptance for them. l With some of them I am friends to this day.

So for some deluded fucking spun out of their mind brainwashed kids to attack me while I lay on the curb in the protective position (curled up, hands across head) while I'm being dealt serious blows left and right to call me a nazi.

That hurt me more than those strikes ever did.

It also worth noting that no marxist are against it either. it is not uncommon to see marxist publications and organizations argueing for the EU and the importation of refugees. Was not the slogan "let them in you bastards"?

I've seen marxist arguments for these refugees
they want to accelerate the immigration of these savages to accelerate societal collapse and possibly bring about a revolution
they seem to believe the proles and peasants are only pacified by bread and circus
not by an inherent wish not to engage in violent reprisal
all accelerating third world immigration into Europe does is accelerate nationalist sentiments in response to the savage behaviour and barbaric cultural practices of these people and increase crime and disorder which globalist capitalist oligarchs use to increase their own power
if the marxists actually considered this they would not be supporting a borderless open society for Europe because all its going to do is result in is a clash between the globalist elite EU, their marxist-socialist puppet supporters they've played like fiddles and a pissed off numerous disenfranchised populace directed by nationalist groups pointing the finger at those responsible with objective truth

In other words, filthy, bloodthirsty Islam will kill everyone that disagrees with it, bringing humanity into the barbaric dark ages.

Anita are just brainless animals, dumb thugs for SJW's that cry whenever you point out that Islam is barbaric.

yes, literally back into dark ages.
Internet kuffar? HARAM(be)!

I would like to urge everyone to watch this video:
youtube.com/watch?v=PIK8bfeLXSw

Here Muslims themselves explain their religion and European inability to "understand it"

Pure coincidence: the age of philosophers and mathematicians in the antique Middle East stopped at the exact moment Islam got enough political power.

That would either be an Islamic revolution or the day of the rope, but I don't see how you will get a communist uprising with millions of immigrants with a strong sense of private propriety.

same video, but different uploader just so you know I'm not trying to advertise / get youtube monies

youtube.com/watch?v=ZOGIXPrEaqw

I know a Muslim who say he is a moderate. He won't salute at the dojo because it is linked to some religious shit.

Another Muslim who say he is moderate too refuse to get a meal with our common friends if there is alcohol on the table.

Moderate Muslim my ass. Don't get me started on what they think of women in the workforce.

stopped reading
stopped reading again
you just keep going don't you

If they keep their thoughts to themselves it doesn't really matter what they think

When they self segregate from society because of what they think, it become society's problem.

In Paris, they have a market where they can buy everything without paying VAT. They can, they just choose to not.

"unfortunate cases of sexual attacks"

"while many Muslims are “completely non-religious,” occasionally Islam’s compatibility with liberal democracy and human rights remains “quite hard.”"

It is very unfortunate. Especially for the victims. I wonder if anyone asked them about importing another two million muslims who respect only sharia and view women as inferior human beings.

...

It's astonishing to me that so many supposed leftists here can take economic circumstances into account when it comes to let's say black people in America but not when it comes to refugees. Yes, the situation smells like "porky" in the sense that nations accept refugees because they want cheap labor but the refugees aren't the problem here, the problem is that the bourgeoisie wants to justify the decrease of minimum-wages without the decrease being necessary in any way shape or form. The refugees are used as a cheap excuse to form a false argument. Already arguments along the lines of "refugees aren't properly educated so no one is going to pay the full minimum-wage rate for them, the only option is to create a new low-wage sector, otherwise they'll turn into parasites" pop up. The thing is, most of these refugees are rather young and while it's true that many of them don't have a good education ,except when we take a look at the higher education sector, there they're about the same as most European countries, it's possible to educate them to a level where they can perform average working class jobs. Not that I like the idea of integrating them into the system but it's better than letting many of them die. Anyway, what we as leftists should be against isn't the immigration itself we should be against how porky tries to use and frame said immigration. However, the fact that some comrades buy into the porky rhetoric like the Op post in pic related saddens me the most, yes, some refugees are going to act like total dickheads, no shit. We are helping humans after all, not literal angels. He also raised some other very porkyesque points, like bringing up rape incidents which has been covered in this post and the ones before: . He talks about them being a strain on the economy even though models like the one from the "German Institute of Economy" already suggest a positive impact. He talks about most of them not being from war-torn regions and them being mostly military aged men which simply isn't true except for the age thing. I'm afraid that this whole refugee situation is causing an unnecessary divide in the left because some don't do their research properly and fall for porky rhetoric. Just to clarify, that's not to say that there aren't any problems like an increasing crime rate at least for the first three years due to poverty and alienation but ultimately it isn't a fight between Islam and the West, it's a class conflict.

data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/regional.php

unhcr.ie/about-unhcr/facts-and-figures-about-refugees

diw.de/de/diw_01.c.518472.de/themen_nachrichten/integration_von_fluechtlingen_fuehrt_langfristig_zu_positiven_wirtschaftlichen_effekten.html

doku.iab.de/aktuell/2015/aktueller_bericht_1514.pdf

(you need to use a translator for some of these sources, sorry)

What proof exactly are you asking for?

I can't be arsed to go find them again but I know that both Finland and Norway, possibly Denmark as well, published studies showing upwards of a 20x overrepresentation compared to natives among Middle-Easterners and Africans in rape and sexual assault cases. The former split it up by groups so you had the Iraqis with around 20 times the rape numbers while some African groupings had around 7-13 times more than the native rate (this was the Finnish breakdown, the Norwegian one stated that assault rapes was entirely a non-western phenomenon there.

It's a widespread Pakistani epidemic, with a small infusion of muslim Africans, in Britain with over 10+ separate gangs all from different parts of the country and with similar community protection.
It's also pretty clear they choose white children for being "fair game" according to their morals unlike other groups, the one exception to it was tellingly a Sikh.

The worst argument I hear from people hear is honestly the Socioeconomical one. There's tons upon tons of poor people, wether native or of other 'alienated' people groups, yet they act nothing like the middle east's and africa's rapists.

You know that socioeconomics factors aren't limited to money right?

Islam has to be destroyed
especially political islam

Keep the lumpen scum out of Europe. Let them die. Like I said, the only arguments I've seen in favor are ones that consider the interest of refugees. When it really doesn't matter at all what happens to them. Let them die in thier own countries? Why the FUCK do you care? No moral arguments pls

And those of you who disagree are unequivocally the voice of the status quo/porky and it's only because you have the luxury to separate yourself from these scum that you support letting them in

...

i said "HAS TO BE"
all non-muslims and ex muslims should unite against the islam and destroy it completely.
islam is even worse than christianity.

Because I want to avoid a precedent that the US government can literally cause mass death and get away with it. They already do it and cover it up, I don't want to know how brazen they would be about it if they didn't need to.
Also, "lumpen" is not a left wing analogue of "shitskin".

Even if this wasn't completely retarded from a purely practical perspective, you must be a burger if you think Islam is literally humanity's worst creation by a wide margin.

It is indeed spooky as fuck, but not the source of all ills.

Actually here is a funny thing: Those who live far from immigrants are quite welcoming. Those who live close are rejecting them. But those who live and work with them don't give a shit about them.
t.,someone who experienced the three situations in this order

And for those of you here who want to remove islam- how will you figure out who's Muslim and who isn't? Are you aware you taqqiyah, it basically allows so called ex-Muslims to exist because if they believe that they are threatened because of thier faith, they can hide it. So you really can't trust ex-Muslims either. The only way to remove Islam is to remove everyone who has Muslim parents, so called moderate and liberal Muslims too. Are you prepared to support that?


Your logical is contrived and stupid. You want to let in millions of people simply because you don't want to set a precedent? Does that seem logical at all?

That sounds a lot like the US. Most people with racist views live near minorities, but never actually interact with them, especially in places like Omaha, while in DC it was racially integrated so no one paid it mind.


In a superpower governed by opaque bureaucracy, precedents mean everything.

i live in a muslim country and i'm an expert on this subject
taqiyyah does not always work :^)

palestinians are far more secular than kurds, as zizek said they are the "jews among the arabs". kurds still circumcise their women. you can't make generalizations like this when they are blatantly false, sounds like someone from Holla Forumss opinion of the middle east aka an opinion based on complete delusion of the reality of the situation

Reigion is an idea, it's a meme, not a gene.
Technically anyone can become Muslim.
I'm started to think you are one actually. You say that we'll be safe if we deport all people with Muslim background, so meanwhile we're not paying intention to you… waiting to rape and stab us kouffars

Also leftists who say "with muslims we can start a revolution in europe" are delusional
Remember what happened to Iranian communists who worked with mullahs after the revolution?

taqiya is not a real thing you retard, lying is a sin in islam and takkiya literally translates to "strength of your fate in god" and is a principle in SHIAA islam which only like 5% of muslims are.

Literally osama bin fucking laden got pissed off at the airplane shoe bomber because while he was taken to an american court the american court stated "You took a loyalty oath when you came to america to not attack it, did you not" and the shoe bomber replied "your oath means nothing to me, don't care"
OSAMA BIN LADEN replied that the shoe bomb operation was considered haram now because a muslim broke his oath to another nation and the dude will burn in hell, meanwhile if he wouldn't have taken the loyalty oath then the terrorist attack would have been halal and osama wouldn't have shat on him like that.

its only fucking retards who think it means "you can't trust any muslim ever all muslims are lying to you and want you dead)

oh shit

anyone can be a muslim

even my dog could be a muslim

EVEN I COULD BE A MUSLIM

THEY'RE EVERYWHEREEEEEEEEE

you need to understands that the people coming to europe are not all fucking salafists.

arabs like everyone on earth have varying political opinions and varying degrees of secularity. This opinion that they are all exactly the same with a political ideology and motivation to destroy europe when really all they are are refugees trying to escape a war we literally created is asinine.

they are not. but they are sunni.
Alawites are bro tier but sunnis and shias are just plain durkas. Salafis are more durka than both.

stalin no…

stop feeding into the right wing nazi faggots made up fears of takkiya

stalin you were cooler than that. explain to him how political islam/wahhabism and just regular ass muslims are a different thing again, i don't think he got it. or how takkiya is not even a real thing and muslims aren't secret spies who you can never trust because its considered a holy duty for a muslim to tell lies to a non muslim

fake stalin detected, you aren't a real stalinist at all. fuckoff

nice reading comprehension

FAKE STALINIST

what do you mean by "regular" muslims?
there's a huge difference between a regular muslim in Egypt and a regular muslim in Kazakhstan for example.
it's a real thing actually
yes i know. not all muslims are secret spies BUT that does not mean takiyya does not exist.

As i mentioned before i live in a muslim country and i know i am talking about.

Okay, I bothered. Here's the official police report from Norway:

politi.no/vedlegg/lokale_vedlegg/oslo/Vedlegg_1309.pdf

I used a translator and I'm not going to bother with correcting the errors of the translator. The meaning should be clear though.

"When one breaks rape reviews down the type voldtektog identified suspects / accused country of origin, one approaches a nuanced picture of the relationship between rape and ethnicity. Grove generalizations that have given the impression that rapists are only foreigners - and mainly Muslims - proves inadequate and erroneous. Below shows that the largest group (11.8%) of perpetrators among all 152 known suspects / accused persons were Norwegian and anmeldtfor relational rape."

"Oslo is a knutepunktfor a wide range of activities and transportation and many people are visiting and the passage of several continents in addition to the diverse population living here. Grove generalizations that Oslo rapists are foreigners and mostly Muslims, are both mistaken, utlistrekkelig and unfortunate. In all, three-quarters of the 152 known perpetrators which was reviewed in 2010 have European citizenship, mainly Norwegian. Half have ethnic roots in Europaog again mainly Norway. The other perpetrators had ancestry fraulike continents country."


I only could find evidence that two of the cases exist. Could you link something that proves that it actually is an "epidemic"?

cmon dude:

discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/24/response-to-taqiyya-deception-lying/

why the fuck would osama bin laden shit on the terrorist who took a loyalty oath before his attack if takkiya was real you stupid faggot. lying is a SERIOUS sin in islam. putting up this "they can't even remotely be trusted, any muslim friends you met in highschool were faking it and you can't trust them at all" is just backwards hick ideology shit. you are a moron and a faggot. muslims are normal people, their religion is identical to christianity and judaism in every single way because it is an abrahamic religion plagarized off of christianity and judaism in every single way.

i did not say "don't trust muslims". i said "takiyya is real"
seriously? are you really this delusional? Islam is a backwards as fuck religion and these religions you listed reformed themselves. But islam never reformed itself.
it's basically abrahamic religion mixed with 7th century bedouin traditions

also

an*

It doesn't matter, in Jihad you use any means necesarry so that Allah may prevail.

i agree, islam is a particularly cancerous religion and there is definitely a problem with many muslims.
but i don't think antagonizing everyone is the solution.

Asset management firms, banks, investment organisations, big pharma, insurance but also heavily governmental subsidized organisations and their elite bureaucrats with top salaries are the modern capitalist elite.

The people higher up know that the entire situation is completely fucked. The rise of nationalism has a very strong correlation of the mass illegal immigration and Islamisation taking place. It's completely impossible to create a civilization based on a religion that is full of strive (look at middle east for example), so wherever Islam will go it will take its many problems with itself.

But the situation is not only terrible because of the refugees, it is what makes the situation worse. Economically the Euro is in a bubble at the moment and it will burst eventually. Deutsche bank is screwed, ING is heavily tied to it and underperforming, so that bank is also screwed which leads to more banks being screwed. The 2008 crisis can be done all over again, nothing has been done to prevent it except for making an emergency fund to save banks that might collapse, but this emergency fund is simply to small for a giant such as Deutsche bank. Even governments wouldn't be able to just save that.

And even if its not Deutsche bank, southern Europe is camping with huge unemployment due to them not being able to devalue their currency to be competitive. So that means they will remain at like 20-30% unemployment, which is just terrible.


There won't be an Islamic revolution ever anytime soon in western Europe because Islam can't unify itself, and in Europe they don't really hold positions of power. Also the original population of these countries is becoming increasingly more atheist over the years which also clashes with Islam.

If you are from Europe and you ever had to deal with these people, you wouldn't have this opinion. I did projects with them, talked with them both formal and informal and sometimes come across some on the streets.

They are the worst people there are. They are extremely stubborn overall which is a reocurring thing with these people and littered everywhere in their history (Chechens, Syria conflict, all the seperation of their organisations etc.). It's impossible to really work with them. Now overall they do try to get their stuff done if you ask them to (other minorities in my country are people from Suriname and Dutch Antilles, the laziness stereotypes are true).

Another really prevalent trait except for being stubborn is aggression. A lot of the time they go about issues in a really aggressive manner, this combined with them being very stubborn makes it again impossible to get anything done with them and often ends up with you on the end of some insults.

It's not tribalism. I don't see a group of 8 Christian assholes running around with knifes on the local train station at 1 am, but this is normal behaviour among Muslim youth.

I have not had white Christians or white people in general threaten me in a public space for no reason with a knife. But these guys have and not just once.

I don't want anything to do with them, I want to be as far away from them as I can.

your personal experience (real or not) holds no scientific value.
i had a bad experience with girls and women named Sonia in my day, litarally all of them.
i still don't think all Sonias are bad nor do i believe all women inherently are.

i like how you focuse on white.
the good thing abut Holla Forumstards is that they're too stupid to be subtile.
you can't hide it.

gether with your fellow stormfags and buy an island for yourselves.
you can circlejerk there all you want about how pink your nipples are

not surprising coming from a nazi.

but why even pretend to care about islam ?. when you just want to get rid of "non-whites" ?

The Norwegian report conflates marital rape, which muslim communities are infamous for keeping a clampdown on (as evinced by secret mosque vids telling them it's their own fault for not giving their men what they want as well as ex-muslims speaking out), and assault rape. The Oslo and Bergen police both put out reports on assault rape stating that in a five year period not a single assault rape case was perpetrated by anyone but non-westerners.
The finnish reports are arguably worse despite of that since they're so very clear on which people groups are the problem and by just how much.
Then you didn't look very far as even a casual glance would show tons more. There's even wiki articles for many of the others.
To name a few: Rotherham, two in Rochdale alone, Derby, Oxford, Bristol, Telford, Peterborough, Banbury, Aylesbury, Blackpool, etc. All pakistani child rape gangs.
There are just the ones who've been caught after much pressure from outside communities.

I don't care that the justification is as long as the result is the same

I hear ya.
Working a shitty job along with a couple of arab youth hires is really what soured me on them when everything else didn't stick. If they weren't being aggressive and demanding "respect" at random they were making side-comments saying the absolute worst things in the world to co-worker, I mean talking really base sexual shit about any female customer from ages 11 to 30 and making comments about how they're "the guy who fucks 'yo gf" and similar "jokes" said off the cuff. (fat chance of that seeing as how they were to a man ugly inbred-looking chainsmokers and some of the thirstiest faggots i've ever come across in my life)

Pakistanis are disgusting in general.
180 million of them, and the only contribution by them to mankind is a nuclear program and that economist who invented HDI.

they're truly as """""""equal""""""" to any European race, especially the Germans and English

...

Good thing those scandals have actually been uncovered and books were written about them.

No one in the Muslim community cares about that. At least the West moved on, the major Islamic countries in the world are pretty much theocratic totalitarian. Have fun criticizing the regime for overreach.

I'm with Lenin on this, in which religion and socialism is incompatible.

Just like he denigrated Christian socialism as being an oxymoron, I see the same strain of reasoning to be used against Islamic Socialism.

So yes, in most holy books and religions there are edicts and holy writ proclaiming about some weird tenet of benevolence to one another, or some proclamation of welfare.There's something in human nature that yearns for the numinous, and while I don't think religion and holy places should be wiped out, I think religious education should be restricted (i.e. not mandatory). If you want to live in a multicultural society and want to practice your religion (which you are allowed to do), don't be surprised if we have some questions for you, and don't jump under some hate speech law whenever a question somehow maligns an infallible line in the "unalterable" book.

Multicultural masochists who defend the liberally applicable hate speech laws are the worst, and its through that reasoning that alt-righters spring up.

are you an elected representative of the muslim community ?.
empty words, what does major means ? most populated ? in this case on top of my head there is Pakistan and Indonesia both are democracies.

interesting, whats your contribution to mankind ? why are you as a person better than a Pakistani doctor ?

PFLP is quite anti clerical. Communist in the middle east=/=Islamig gommunist. Though Ali Shariati is worthy of study, and could be described as a "islamig gommunist".

madworldnews.com/migrants-rape-woman-wheelchair/

This isn't hate mongering, racism or what the fuck ever. This is real life

do you support the Swedish left?

Olof Palme was a real nigga, though. He very nearly turned Sweden into a socialist country.

crossposting this from Holla Forums - I think we can both agree that sexual violence against a child is deplorable, repulsive and completely unacceptable

A 9-year-old White girl was repeatedly beaten, sexually assaulted, and emotionally tormented by a group of migrant children at her school. However, instead of reporting it to the authorities, the school decided to cover up the sickening abuse, giving outraged parents a 5-word, infuriating excuse.


"We got explained to us by a school staff that our daughter was blonde and sweet and so excited to embark on. She had a mind of her own and it made it even more fun for them,” the mother told Swedish Television News Sörmland. “My daughter was standing with a tray in the dining room. Then, they pulled down her pants and humped her while everyone watched."

madworldnews.com/migrant-kids-sexually-assault-girl/

Excuse me, as I'm going to fucking vomit to the bathroom

This is too much for me. Everyone has a limit. I've just reached mine

But both Holla Forums and Holla Forums's mascots are lolis

Oh boy a single data point presented in an emotionally charged fashion guess I better start hating all people of a particular group forever regardless of the context or circumstances build the wall deus vult etc. etc.

go back to Holla Forums

I have two tabs open. Fuck the police

this might come as a shock to you, but anime isn't real

Prove it, nigger.

Funny the ones i worked with were quite polite and bro-tier. Your point?

I'm not implying that this definitely isn't the case but just a few mosque videos aren't really bulletproof evidence. I mean we could make videos of every christian ceremony and only the ones where funny stuff and literally insane stuff happens would get uploaded/noticed. We could then watch about 50 videos and base our views about certain christian themes on that, our view of the average christian would drastically change. That's not to say that you couldn't make an argument about at least some differences but you can't really deduce an approximative scale and without that it's pretty much useless. Furthermore, just to provide some context, it's not like marital rape is that foreign to western countries. Germany for example counted marital rape as a minor offence until it was changed to actual rape in 1997. Whether martial rape is more prevalent among specific Muslim groups or specific Western groups is of course another topic.


The only thing I have found concerning Bergen is the North Bergen police report, it only contains 17 cases of rape. Not really much to go on.

northbergenpolice.com/general/annual-reports/reports/pdf/2015-Annual-Report.pdf

Oslo report:

"Even though a majority of the registered perpetrators have Norwegian citizenship, a high proportion of them are originally from other countries than Norway. In 2007 there was an unusually high proportion of perpetrators from the African continent, accounting for 30.5% of cases, so that the proportion with Norwegian backgrounds was unusually low (27.2%). This could be attributed to a reported group rape inwhich several persons of African background were involved. The picture in 2010 is more normalized, andin line with the trend from 2004. In 2010 the proportion of perpetrators with a Norwegian background is34.9% and the proportion originating from the European continent outside Norway is 13.8%. Together almost half (48.7%) of the perpetrators had a European ethnic background. The proportion of perpetratorswith a background in the continent of Africa had sunk to 19.7%, the Middle-East 15.1%, Asia 14.1%, andAmerica 2%"

"Young foreign men, immigrant workersand others, can find it hard to establish steady pair relationships and/or acquaintance with potential partners in Oslo, and this can help to generate unsuccessful and degrading sexual relationships which are reported as rape. Circumstances like loneliness in the homo-social reality that some of these young meninhabit, rejection in the sexual market by Norwegian girls, lack of access to young women with the same culture and national background as themselves, arranged intimate relationships and promises of fidelity embedded in their own culture, can all be factors in this. "

This for example offers a potentially different reason for why marital rape is underrepresented in rather recent immigrant groups. That's not to say that culture of a specific group can't be a factor but simply concluding that it is is not a sustainable argument at this point since there are so many factors at play. Anyway, in order to prove your point about Muslims having higher rape rates overall you'd have to provide evidence that certain Muslim groups actually make their wives shut up about it to a degree that approximately accounts for the supposedly too low Muslim rape rates. The ultimate question here is whether Muslims rape more or whether it's just a matter of the different composition of rape types. Another interesting question would be whether there are significant differences between Muslim groups in the same country. If there are overall differences in numbers it could help us in finding out the actual causes behind them.

de.scribd.com/doc/76695373/Excerpt-From-Oslo-Police-District-Report-on-Rape

cont.

I was referring to cases where the motivations were of a purely non-economic nature. Rotherham for example had human trafficking involved. In any case, I'd like to go with statistics instead of these kinds of scandals. While they're horrible, no doubt, they don't give much of a clear indication about the Muslim population as a whole. At least not as clear as statistics do. I mean not even statistics can give a clear indication as to how Muslims behave. Just categorizing them as one group instead of multiple groups is inherently misleading. Just compare Muslim groups in Sweden to Muslim groups in France. You'll get an entirely different picture depending on factors like economic background, alienation and the alike. The same goes for comparing African and Syrian Muslims. Let me get back to the Christian example since it's probably one that is much more visible to us. If we compare American and European Christians we see that the latter is broadly speaking much more progressive. We then could divide the European and American category even more and see that in terms of progressiveness there are vast differences between states and countries.

Sorry, I went on a few tangents there. Could you or in fact anyone who replies to me actually source their material? If people just tell me non-fact-checked stuff they heard somewhere the whole conversation gets frustrating and annoying, I probably won't even respond to a post without any sources anymore.

Since when is Alunya a loli?

Muslim Refugees Beat, Choke 8-Year-Olds With Chain

School officials rushed to the aid of third graders as they were being beaten and choked by Muslim refugee children shouting “Muslims rule the world!”

madworldnews.com/muslim-refugees-beat-choke-school/

yeah buddy I'm sure this is specific to these shit kids from the middle east there sure is no possibility that shit kids of all nationalities bully other children in horrible ways and we just don't report it in the news because it doesn't fit any alarmist narrative we're trying to push with our overtly ideologically motivated """news""" site yup

Oh and note how the headline doesn't note that these are refugee children just for that added emotional manipulation and provocation of outrage

Woops, at a few points I used Muslim and middle-easterners/immigrants synonymously. You get the meaning though. I'm way too tired at this point.

user, are you illiterate?

Olof Palme was a CIA asset and the primary reason why Socialism is now an untenable position in Sweden.
He did all of the following:
Imported American-style debate tactics, debasing the national political scene immensely to the horror of his colleagues.
Started an agency specficially in order to keep tabs on and harass Communist and Socialist organizers.
Adopted the mass-immigration stance that is responsible for rebirthing nationalism in the mainstream in Sweden.
He lost SocDem power to rightwingers and liberals for the first time since the 20s because of what a hateful fuck he was.
The closest he ever got to Socialists was to adopt some of their anti-USA rethoric, which he also did for liberals against the Soviets and Yugoslavia.
And most importantly, he went through with the pseudo-workers ownership shares policy (the sole true socialist thing he ever did), despite the fact that his genius economic advisor who had a large part in his success said outright that it wasn't at all economically feasible at the time and would absolutely sink along with them.

(Porky is more of a semite than anything else)
then again, a dream that will come true is not a dream

western countries have a humanitarian duty to accept refugees

I don't have a duty towards anyone.

yes you do

It's getting SPOOKY in here

...

tribal stupidity is the lowest form of stupidity. because unlike regular stupidity it cause war and suffering.


it makes no sens for anyone with more than two neurons to rub together, yet stormfags live by it.
in some way it also help them with their mental problems.
they're all underachieving losers, by blaming people for things they didn't do while taking credit for things they didn't do they found a way to bump their low self-esteem and give a meaning to their worthless lives.

profound stupidity.

you can convince yourself that you're not a complete failure by attacking minorities and leaching off others achievements, but you can't convinces others of it.
certainly not here.

And why does "tribalism" always seem to rise whenever different ethnic/religious groups are placed together?

because stupidity is universal, you'll find it in every ethnicity.

just like violence, rape, etc… it's a primitive behavior that has no place in the civilized world.

you will notice that the less intelligent a person is the more likely he/she is to fall back on his/her primitive instincts and live by it.

Are we talking about racists or blacks?

i corrected your idiotc picture

It's probably for the best, the whole point is to encourage them to assimilate

racism is tribalism, its stupid by definition.
"blacks" are an ethnicity as far as i know.

reminds me of some feminists who says that science is sexist because it was made by men.

what exactly is stupid to live in tribes where you trust each other and care for each other.
while multicultural societies always end up in chaos and genocide until one main brutal tribe remains?

multiculturalism dont work as several long term experiments have shown. if someone wants to tak racism away from you it means he wants to weaken you as a tribe and use you later for his purposes or simply get rid of you through diversity.

/Leftypol is really nothing more than a place from mental disabled homosexuals and pederasts who dont want to work.
dont forget socialism is based on work (but you wont get paid)

It will be amusing watching him trying to recover from this one


a tribe is a outdated false category, a product of past era and geological position

heh the swallowed the memes
Anti-culturalism > multiculturalism

Oh no Holla Forums is mad! Whatever shall we do comrades!?

Multiculturalism =/= people of different races living together

Unless you want to make the arguement that culture is derived from genetics

Outside forces inevitably corrupt either. These societies do not exist in a vacuum. You can say "If the whole world was this way", but then you would end up being the one corrupting others through conquest of one kind or another.

If everyone agreed it would be easier, no matter what ideology they agreed on, but getting to that point would probably end up being more violence and death than it's worth, so the world remains imperfect.

your feelings are not a scientific measure.
and while you're entitled and free to live among who you want, you're not entitle to decide where others do.

tribalism is a fallacy, it assumes that the other is fundamentally different and potentially dangerous based on subjective measures and superficial characteristics.


do you have any scientific study to back that up ?
if any thing that only proves that tribalism is indeed terrible.

again [citation needed]

le paranoid stormcuck face.
you should see a doctor, m8.
seriously

thats not true. tribalism will reform and always come back.
best example are the jews.


ok lets try be logic: sooner or later in future we will have a one world government without a single border. everyone will have european, asian, nigger, arab and other poo-ancestry.

what will happen? people will sort each other to their ideas and world imagination. it will start with the elite.
(and elite will always exist as any social construct will always create an elite.)

there will be spits. and this splits will form groups with common interests. this will create tribes again. tribes will develop individual and develop different strengths. some will be superior and inferior.
thats an endless loop.

being anti-culture is a from culture
no matte what a society look like it always has a culture.


you dont have plan or something?


multiculturalism ends up always in the dissolve of all cultures, tribes and races, its just a matter of time that can be influence by a common enemy or from the inside of the construct itself.


you cant beat the corruption. the soviets tried hard and failed. social patterns happening in small will also happen in big.

….okay.


so ?

research yourself im not here to teach you this and that.

some times yes and sometimes no. so your point is not valid.

look in the mirror and say that again


le eat a brick and die twat

i would not pass the "Nuremberg Laws".

burden of proof is on you.

i'm not the one pushing for the bandwagon fallacy, so firs its indeed a valid argument against.
second, it proves my point that people aren't inherently x or y based on the superficial characteristics you chose.

It really all comes down to the harsh reality.
Islam is not a "religion of peace"
It has no place whatsoever in Europe.

I'm glad my Holla Forums counterparts agree

It's known that islam is a backwards religion that's even worse than christianity and any other religion

Only a trot or an anarchkiddie would disagree with this.

AstroTurfing is obvious, stormcuck

Some of them, but not all of them. Many of the people coming into Europe are not from war torn areas but people who want bux. And now that they are in Europe, do they say "Thank goodness, I am free from war and Islamic oppression" ?
No, they take their Islamism with them.

State educated imams that spread a tollerant and secular kind of islam sounds great, whats the problem with that. Its easier than turning all the muslims here into atheists or deporting them all.

>once again I hafe proofs of the things I assert
The traditional thing is to declare victory and then leave. As a traditionalist, you know what you must do next.

If you had been, you would know that God Himself washed the feet of sinners.

People don't commit rape because they're poor. Rape in no way alleviates material want.

You have a loser mentality. You won't get far in life.

This.

No but people without alleviated material wants may be more likely to engage in behavior like rape..

what is this child's drawing?

They're disposable idiots. They will die.

It has been really interesting to read your thoughts Holla Forums turns out, we're not enemies afterall.

Do you understand what "stopped reading" means?

The Non-Existence of Norway

Slavoj Žižek on the refugee crisis

The flow of refugees from Africa and the Middle East into Western Europe has provoked a set of reactions strikingly similar to those we display on learning we have a terminal illness, according to the schema described by Elisabeth Kübler-Ross in her classic study On Death and Dying. First there is denial: ‘It’s not so serious, let’s just ignore it’ (we don’t hear much of this any longer). Then there is anger – how can this happen to me? – which explodes when denial is no longer plausible: ‘Refugees are a threat to our way of life; Muslim fundamentalists are hiding among them; they have to be stopped!’ There is bargaining: ‘OK, let’s decide on quotas; let them have refugee camps in their own countries.’ There is depression: ‘We are lost, Europe is turning into Europastan!’ What we haven’t yet seen is Kübler-Ross’s fifth stage, acceptance, which in this case would involve the drawing up of an all-European plan to deal with the refugees.

What should be done? Public opinion is sharply divided. Left liberals express their outrage that Europe is allowing thousands to drown in the Mediterranean: Europe, they say, should show solidarity and throw open its doors. Anti-immigrant populists say we need to protect our way of life: foreigners should solve their own problems. Both solutions sound bad, but which is worse? To paraphrase Stalin, they are both worse. The greatest hypocrites are those who call for open borders. They know very well this will never happen: it would instantly trigger a populist revolt in Europe. They play the beautiful soul, superior to the corrupted world while continuing to get along in it. The anti-immigrant populist also knows very well that, left to themselves, people in Africa and the Middle East will not succeed in solving their own problems and changing their societies. Why not? Because we in Western Europe are preventing them from doing so. It was Western intervention in Libya that threw the country into chaos. It was the US attack on Iraq that created the conditions for the rise of Islamic State. The ongoing civil war in the Central African Republic between the Christian south and the Muslim north is not just an explosion of ethnic hatred, it was triggered by the discovery of oil in the north: France and China are fighting for the control of resources through their proxies. It was a global hunger for minerals, including coltan, cobalt, diamonds and copper, that abetted the ‘warlordism’ in the Democratic Republic of the Congo in the 1990s and early 2000s.

If we really want to stem the flow of refugees, then, it is crucial to recognise that most of them come from ‘failed states’, where public authority is more or less inoperative: Syria, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, DRC and so on. This disintegration of state power is not a local phenomenon but a result of international politics and the global economic system, in some cases – like Libya and Iraq – a direct outcome of Western intervention. (One should also note that the ‘failed states’ of the Middle East were condemned to failure by the boundaries drawn up during the First World War by Britain and France.)

It has not escaped notice that the wealthiest countries in the Middle East (Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, the Emirates, Qatar) have been much less open to refugees than the not so rich (Turkey, Egypt, Iran etc). Saudi Arabia has even returned ‘Muslim’ refugees to Somalia. Is this because Saudi Arabia is a fundamentalist theocracy which cannot tolerate foreign intruders? Yes, but Saudi Arabia’s dependence on oil revenues makes it a fully integrated economic partner of the West. There should be serious international pressure on Saudi Arabia (and Kuwait and Qatar and the Emirates) to accept a large contingent of the refugees, especially since, by supporting the anti-Assad rebels, the Saudis bear a measure of responsibility for the current situation in Syria.

New forms of slavery are the hallmark of these wealthy countries: millions of immigrant workers on the Arabian peninsula are deprived of elementary civil rights and freedoms; in Asia, millions of workers live in sweatshops organized like concentration camps. But there are examples closer to home. On 1 December 2013 a Chinese-owned clothing factory in Prato, near Florence, burned down, killing seven workers trapped in an improvised cardboard dormitory. ‘No one can say they are surprised at this,’ Roberto Pistonina, a local trade unionist, remarked, ‘because everyone has known for years that, in the area between Florence and Prato, hundreds if not thousands of people are living and working in conditions of near slavery.’ There are more than four thousand Chinese-owned businesses in Prato, and thousands of Chinese immigrants are believed to be living in the city illegally, working as many as 16 hours a day for a network of workshops and wholesalers.

The new slavery is not confined to the suburbs of Shanghai, or Dubai, or Qatar. It is in our midst; we just don’t see it, or pretend not to see it. Sweated labour is a structural necessity of today’s global capitalism. Many of the refugees entering Europe will become part of its growing precarious workforce, in many cases at the expense of local workers, who react to the threat by joining the latest wave of anti-immigrant populism.

In escaping their war-torn homelands, the refugees are possessed by a dream. Refugees arriving in southern Italy do not want to stay there: many of them are trying to get to Scandinavia. The thousands of migrants in Calais are not satisfied with France: they are ready to risk their lives to enter the UK. Tens of thousands of refugees in Balkan countries are desperate to get to Germany. They assert their dreams as their unconditional right, and demand from the European authorities not only proper food and medical care but also transportation to the destination of their choice. There is something enigmatically utopian in this demand: as if it were the duty of Europe to realise their dreams – dreams which, incidentally, are out of reach of most Europeans (surely a good number of Southern and Eastern Europeans would prefer to live in Norway too?). It is precisely when people find themselves in poverty, distress and danger – when we’d expect them to settle for a minimum of safety and wellbeing – that their utopianism becomes most intransigent. But the hard truth to be faced by the refugees is that ‘there is no Norway,’ even in Norway.

We must abandon the notion that it is inherently racist or proto-fascist for host populations to talk of protecting their ‘way of life’. If we don’t, the way will be clear for the forward march of anti-immigration sentiment in Europe whose latest manifestation is in Sweden, where according to the latest polling the anti-immigrant Sweden Democrats have overtaken the Social Democrats as the country’s most popular party. The standard left-liberal line on this is an arrogant moralism: the moment we give any credence to the idea of ‘protecting our way of life’, we compromise our position, since we’re merely proposing a more modest version of what anti-immigrant populists openly advocate. And this is indeed the cautious approach that centrist parties have adopted in recent years. They reject the open racism of anti-immigrant populists, but at the same time profess that they ‘understand the concerns’ of ordinary people, and so enact a more ‘rational’ anti-immigration policy.

We should nevertheless reject the left-liberal attitude. The complaints that moralise the situation – ‘Europe is indifferent to the suffering of others’ etc – are merely the obverse of anti-immigrant brutality. They share the presupposition, which is in no way self-evident, that the defence of one’s own way of life is incompatible with ethical universalism. We should avoid getting trapped in the liberal self-interrogation, ‘How much tolerance can we afford?’ Should we tolerate migrants who prevent their children going to state schools; who force their women to dress and behave in a certain way; who arrange their children’s marriages; who discriminate against homosexuals? We can never be tolerant enough, or we are always already too tolerant. The only way to break this deadlock is to move beyond mere tolerance: we should offer others not just our respect, but the prospect of joining them in a common struggle, since our problems today are problems we share.

Refugees are the price we pay for a globalised economy in which commodities – but not people – are permitted to circulate freely. The idea of porous borders, of being inundated by foreigners, is immanent to global capitalism. The migrations in Europe are not unique. In South Africa, more than a million refugees from neighbouring states came under attack in April from the local poor for stealing their jobs. There will be more of these stories, caused not only by armed conflict but also by economic crises, natural disasters, climate change and so on. There was a moment, in the wake of the Fukushima nuclear disaster, when the Japanese authorities were preparing to evacuate the entire Tokyo area – more than twenty million people. If that had happened, where would they have gone? Should they have been given a piece of land to develop in Japan, or been dispersed around the world? What if climate change makes northern Siberia more habitable and appropriate for agriculture, while large parts of sub-Saharan Africa become too dry to support a large population? How will the redistribution of people be organised? When events of this kind happened in the past, the social transformations were wild and spontaneous, accompanied by violence and destruction.

Humankind should get ready to live in a more ‘plastic’ and nomadic way. One thing is clear: national sovereignty will have to be radically redefined and new methods of global co-operation and decision-making devised. First, in the present moment, Europe must reassert its commitment to provide for the dignified treatment of the refugees. There should be no compromise here: large migrations are our future, and the only alternative to such a commitment is renewed barbarism (what some call a ‘clash of civilisations’).

Second, as a necessary consequence of this commitment, Europe should impose clear rules and regulations. Control of the stream of refugees should be enforced through an administrative network encompassing all of the members of the European Union (to prevent local barbarisms like those of the authorities in Hungary or Slovakia). Refugees should be assured of their safety, but it should also be made clear to them that they must accept the destination allocated to them by European authorities, and that they will have to respect the laws and social norms of European states: no tolerance of religious, sexist or ethnic violence; no right to impose on others one’s own religion or way of life; respect for every individual’s freedom to abandon his or her communal customs, etc. If a woman chooses to cover her face, her choice must be respected; if she chooses not to cover her face, her freedom not to do so must be guaranteed. Such rules muh privilege the Western European way of life, but that is the price to be paid for European hospitality. These rules should be clearly stated and enforced, by repressive measures – against foreign fundamentalists as well as against our own racists – where necessary.

Third, a new kind of international military and economic intervention will have to be invented – a kind of intervention that avoids the neocolonial traps of the recent past. The cases of Iraq, Syria and Libya demonstrate how the wrong sort of intervention (in Iraq and Libya) as well as non-intervention (in Syria, where, beneath the appearance of non-intervention, external powers such as Russia and Saudi Arabia are deeply involved) end up in the same deadlock.

Fourth, most important and most difficult of all, there is a need for radical economic change which would abolish the conditions that create refugees. Without a transformation in the workings of global capitalism, non-European refugees will soon be joined by migrants from Greece and other countries within the Union. When I was young, such an organised attempt at regulation was called communism. Maybe we should reinvent it. Maybe this is, in the long term, the only solution.

For west fighting refugees "rape epidemic" now is like fighting akne when you got cancer.
There was a source of all this. These rape victims never gave a shit while NATO bombed the fuck outa all those "muslim countries". Nobody protested. Your tax shekels went to pay for every bomb. No shit there are muslim refuggees now.
At least ISIS sells you that cheap oil you wanted. Oh wait it's cheap for corporations, you regular taxpayer get pretty much the same gas price, just with rape as a bonus. That's only fair because you're a loser. It would be terrible if everyone were equal, right? :^)

Yes actually, I am aware of this. Doesn't change the fact women and children are getting raepd left and right.

What exactly is the point of your post?
They deserve rape because they drive cars?

he implies that

takes the barbaric Abrahamic maxim "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth" to a literal definition

rape is a crime in islam, consenting adult gay sex is a crime in islam, breaking the law in the country you live in is a crime in islam (unless it's something like a ban on praying).
find out how and why the taliban became a thing.

Kek

Listen friend, 2008 called and they want their neocon memes back. Do you have ANY proof what you are saying isn't complete and utter ideology?

Nigger I just had lunch with my Saudi Arabian uni friends. One of them is a huge slut, none of them eat halal food and we get drunk once in a while.

I would believe all this crap about Islam as some kind of monolitich slave to Sharia law where every single one of them, from brown babies to random women, want you and your values destroyed if you had actually met a Muslim before or a read a book about the subject.


Shut the fuck up. Saying shit like

And

Means you literally know nothing about Islam outside of memes. Also

When has this every, every fucking worked? Literally name one time.

rape isn't just a crime in islam, you will literally be killed for it in some muslim countries

i don't get why some right wing retards think muslims can go around raping muslim boys. it seems like anytime they find a group they don't like they just call them "pro-rape" (ie mexican immigrants, and now refugees) i think its projecting since the right are the biggest rapists on earth

bull fucking shit, there are a bunch of atheists in jordan and that country is 99.999% muslim. meanwhile if you rape a girl/boy in jordan and someone finds out you will be KILLED.

you obviously know absolutely jack shit about arab/muslim culture yet you try to come off like an expert because you spent a lot of time on breitbart reading about how 99% of muslims believe gods word is important (ie 99% of muslims want you to convert to sharia law or die and believe in gays not getting married) you have a deluded and stupid ass world view like that of a child who has never traveled or even begun to remotely understand other cultures. you are a stupid faggot and are everything wrong with this world

Arab spring.

what if two dudes in saudi arabia were saying that christians in america are hypocrites because christianity says being gay are wrong but theres a bunch of fags having gay sex and shit in america. and then they said "one time trumps daughter was caught doing a gangbang with 6 guys" as if trumps daughter is the symbol of christianity.


if a catholic priest has gay sex with a boy people blame the priest/church, it would be INSANE to blame catholocism and say that catholics are all hypocrites and a religion of perverts. meanwhile if some weird syrian dude gropes a chick suddenly islam is to blame, and muslims are all hypocrites because obviously they condone this. as if the syrian guy groping the girl was a fucking religious shiekh/priest and not just some random dude who comes from a 3rd world country and who happened to be muslim.

Islam IS the problem. ISIS is a literal interpretation of Islam. Islam is a violent religion that preaches spreading by the sword and subjugation of the Kafir.

Exactly. I am glad that some of you recognise facts, despite we're on different viewpoints regarding politics.

you can't just say everything is 'x with a human face'

its more complicated than that

fuckoff back to Holla Forums right wing shithead

I am sure it is. But if Islam teaches that the Quran is the infallible and direct word of god, and also that it is unchanged from its inception, then this doesn't leave a lot of room for reinterpretation.

It also strikes me that the idea that exposure to western values and culture will moderate them in their belief is patently false. There are numerous examples from the UK recently of muslims killing those they consider apostates.

IMO if change is going to happen to Islam it has to come from within. That is it has to come from Muslim majority countries/

christianity = islam

Christianity has reformed. And it did so from within.

The Qu'ran says to destroy those who destroy mosques, churches and synagogues.
That basically describes what ISIS did.
So maybe ISIS is a literal interpretation where they do literally the opposite of what the Qu'ran tells them.
Is that what you mean?

No I mean their beliefs. The first American they executed, the location was relevant. Because it was the site mentioned in the Quran as the place where the great battle between the muslims and 'Rome' was to take place. They believe they've got to bring about the apocalypse before Jesus will come back and help them attain final victory. As I say, they are literalists.

theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/

No, not at all. Pretty much the opposite in facct.
Muslims had something halfway to the standard of the Geneva Convention in the 7th century.


As a rule Muslims, being part of the Abrahamic line are obligated to follow the ten commandments. So no lying.
However there are exemptions for exceptional (life or death) circumstances, one could eat pork or drink alcohol if they were starving to death and nothing else was available.
Similarly a muslim could lie if telling the truth would result in death, eg the Spanish inquisition.
Or if they had a job where it was neccessary like an undercover police detective.
It doesn't allow them the right to lie and decieve in every aspect of their life, just the spiritual relief to someone that God would not punish them for being an undercover detective, or saving their life by eating a ham sandwich.
Doesn't mean Muslims eat pork every day so by the same extension it doesn't mean they lie constantly.
You wouldn't be paranoid that every person you meet is an undercover cop would you?
Well thinking every Muslim is constantly lying is as preposterous.
I'm led to believe Shias are rather more indiscriminate with their application of Taqqiya, though.

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