What do you guys think of left wing nationalism ?

what do you guys think of left wing nationalism ?

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marxists.org/archive/trotsky/works/1944/1944-fas.htm
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It's petty tribalism

We had left-wing nationalists during interbellum, they were really neat.

depends on the country tbh

What the difference between right wing and left wing nationalism? I hope it's not just pic related.

shurely more like this? -ed

Something like nationalism, but with "progressive" worldview and without lynching minorities, see Kurds.

Highly spooked

...

You're not in a position to talk.

Like all nationalists
S H I T

So civic vs ethnic then?

civic nationalism ala the USA can be shit too

i love the FLQ!

Multicultural nationalism is one hell of weird thing i agree with you

Only partially, as it is usually related to some ethnicity.

liberals, liberals everywhere

Why would I want to base my ideology on something like a nation rather than relation to the means of production?

Relax, the picture is satire.

It only works becaue all 6 republics spoke either very similar (Slovene, Macedonian) or the same language (Serbian, Bosnian, Croatian, Montenegrin). It's ethnolingiustics!

HEY bolshevik where is the means of production at ?

Remarkably accurate.

it's trash

brown nationalism is still nationalism

The Nationalism of the IRA is also considered leftist.

Thats what the Hibernian's whant you to believe

Not socialist, doesn't deserve solidarity

I agree, fuck those filthy Kurds.

National Titoism :^)

I live in the Peron-Peron region so fuck those guys. You have no idea how much people here think they are marxist and hardcore leftists while being peronists. This is a good comic about it, the title says "Peronism: the rapper husband of the working class". In it Peron is trating the working class as a husband after beating up his wife.

All that being said… I do understand a little bit of the feeling. When you live in a region fucked up by imperialists powers for so long your mind becomes kinda confused. Still, thinking imperialism will end by empowering your local porkies is just plain retarded.

Nationalism is a tricky term. A group fighting to have their country be freed from imperialist occupation or colonization could be described as nationalist. However just because their goal is national liberation doesn't mean they are nationalist ideologically, that is to say they may not want a ethnonational state, but simply to be free from imperialism.

Dude we definitely need a Peronism flag on leftypol :^)

There is not even a Peronism flag.

There is an anthem tho, its hilarious. Im sure you guys would love it. It says stuff like "Peron, always figthing against the Capital!" and "Peron, he is the First Worker!".

Did you learn about the FLQ from the new GETchan video or is this just some weird coincidence?

Get the fuck outta here with that FLQ shit.
They just used the guise of Marxism to blow up some mailboxes and cars.

Good thing people in Miami can be Nationalists.

nationalism is shit, generally it tends to lead to war or at least needlessly fucking over another country because muh national interest.
the future is internationalism, it's just a matter of whether it's in the next 20 years or people fight it and it happens in 200 years instead.
but it will happen.
i suppose it's happening anyway, even if people turn their back on it it will still happen and influence everything.
so, i say accept it and ensure it has democratic control and serves the people.
right now it's controlled by corporations and serves the elite.
or just keep having your dumb commie fantasies about the good old days when people with a difference of opinion got sent to the gulag.

It's okay, but a bit flawed…

Not fond of nationalism but honestly not aresed as long as Socialist shit is being done. If you want to take pride in your country cool. I'd probably be a patriot if my country wasn't a fucking shithole.

I wish I had a rapper husband

Ypg are not nationalists

eh sort of ok with the spook if the movement around it isnt utter shit.

A lot of them seem to end up being rampant authoritarians and they're insufferable faggots who frequently can't even express leftwing theory right, they just have a hardon for the liberal propaganda about the USSR..

There's a handful of nationalists who aren't complete cancer and they tend to be more libertarians who have left-wing concepts with what's usually a mild nationalist tinge.

On the whole I don't think it adds anything of any real value to common leftwing ideas

Left-wing nationalism is the only proper way to have states. Having two ethnic cultures in one state promotes cultural imperialism and dominance.

The nation-state is a nation that governs itself, it's inherently heirarchical to have a majority and minority race. The minority race gets assimilated into the majority, or forms a tribalist opposition. Blacks in America formed tribalism because slavery left racial divides in American society that couldn't be healed. In the decades of white supremacy since, it would be better to just give blacks their own nation so they don't deal with an institutionally racist society.

That's how left-wing nationalism works. Pretty obvious historically

Original peronism was fascism, not the "leftist" peronism we see today

there is pic related

Also isn't Titoism and Stalinism like the base of Left Nationalism?

Who are you, exactly?
I assume you're the one that keeps posting catgirls and kitty images, avatarfagging… but never really going anywhere? Every post I see that I think is you makes me think 'defeatist' and 'deadend'… what exactly is your platform, and political stance? 'Splain yourself.

Becasue the mods are lazy on this board, I try too bumb real thread back up and let troll threads die.

I believe in Socialism of the 21st century, and some aspects of Titoism.

Abusive husband, wife beater might be a better translation. If I couldn't read Spanish, I might have assume the "nose of huge wealth" man was dropping sick rhymes to this awe struck aspiring rapper.

Yea… I don't trust you.

Trust me, not him… Geez…

Trust me, not that ugly person.
They probably eat bunnies. After getting their fed paycheck. Because they'd use that, to pay for the bunny stew. It makes sense.

Why would you kill and eat bunnies?

I just wanna to talk about Socialism and stuff, is that so wrong…

All Kurdish parties desire an independent nation or at least autonomy within existing countries, therefore they are classified as nationalist to some degree, but their other policies make them left-wing nationalists. It's not some fucking rocket science.

This. Every ethnicity should have independence and self-determination within an overarching socialist system imo. Otherwise you destroy everything that makes humanity humanity.

Shit on me all you want but I think a dose of nationalism could help with popularizing socialism in the USA, at least among more rural folks. A bit of sugar to help the medicine go down so to say.

okay here's the thing

nationalism is a really effective means for gaining support for socialist movements in colonized places

but it's incredibly easy for left nationalism to shift to right nationalism

I don't mind.

Sometimes it's good.

marxists.org/archive/trotsky/works/1944/1944-fas.htm

marxists.org/subject/fascism/

Educate yourself

What the fuck did I just heard?

I'm not going to shit on you, comrade. I agree with this sentiment. May I ask where you are from?

Pennsylvania, outside the Lehigh Valley metropolitan area. You?

Pathetic and stupid, stop posting this nonsense Holla Forums, it's a waste of everyone's time, your petty delusions are exactly that, petty.

What policies make them left-wing nationalists exactly?

If we follow Oca's theory, basis of Kurds democratic confederalism, they put an emphasis of direct democracy and openeness to others. It seems to integrate some's Bookchin's notions.
However being not in Rojava myself, i have no idea how this is actually implemented.

Again, how does this make them left-wing nationalist though?

Pretty much entire democratic confederalism.

Could you elaborate?

I dunno man, decentralized democraty and tending to emancipation of people seems pretty left wing to me, unless you mean left wing in the strictly economic socialism communism sense?


Now i'm reading a part where Oca is calling democratic confederalism anti-nationalist.
I guess that it really depend what is the definition of Nationalism.

the very tenets of nationalism, that is - national unity, runs counter to the class struggle, it hides the internal divisions of capitalism. You cannot be a nationalist and a communist, because in the end these movements have always abandoned the international struggle for "national" (i.e. nomenclature) gain.

And let's not even go into concepts like "oppressed nations".

I'm talkimg about policies like libertarian munticipalism, green politics, feminism, minority protection, cooperativism and so on.

It's basically the only way to tie current identity crises all around the world and class consciousness

People don't want their culture/language/religion/customs to fade away, and this apply to everyone, especially refugees who are leaving everything just to find exploitation and racism.

We need leftists or socialists nations all around the world who respect their history and preserve it.

that's what actually Not Socialists are like , BTW I know some of them,ba'theists tho.

Is not the same as


The later is more about civic nationalism, among other keys differences

At this point I don't care if we are going to be building giant walls around us if we own the means of production tbh fam

Reminder that to be a leftist, you have to do away with childish notions such as racial and gender equality and social liberalism

*tips helmet*

Ayy

What do arbitrary separations and borders based on ethnicity have to do with socialism?

Useful idiots/cancer

How are they "Useful idiots".

I'm asking how it's nationalism, not how it's leftwing

ITT things that other people say are not real socialism

Good topic.

Keep this thread going.

Finally some big titty stuff posted on this board

I can finally feel at home

I will forever be torn apart between my love of big tittays and my love of DFC. How will I ever possibly reconcile them?

But really just forget the DFC

Easy one side huge, one side flat

But it's so delicious!


Turns out Slaanesh had the right answer all along.

What?