Holla Forums, do you support the creation of a kurdish state...

I do not care about creation of any nation state. But I fully support Rojava - independent, if necessary - which promises to be much more than that.

Whatever Israel started as, it's now a xenophobic, right-wing religious shithole. Who cares about circumstances of its creation at this point.

Kurds were there first, so Kurds have the right to a state

Jews (many of which arent the Jews of the bible) just stole the land and kicked out the ntives, when coming straight outta Europe.

Nah fam. There's a lot of shit to say about Israel, but the vast majority of Israeli Jews aren't European, they're Middle Eastern. The whole reason there's so many Jews in Israel is that most of the Jews through the middle east and north africa were purged during the 40s, and they mostly moved to Israel: Sephardi and Mizrahi make up the vast majority of Israeli Jews. So you can't really use the same "muh colonialism" arguments against "Israelis" as you do against whitey in places like America. It's a big thing in Israel, because every time someone whines about Palestinians, Israelis get to say "yeah well more of us had to flee than Palestinians did when Israel was created so stfu."

Rojavans don't want a state. They want to skip the "dictatorship of the proletariat" thing (a good idea, given how shit "socialist" states turn out) and move straight to just governing without a state- they thus want to stay part of "Syria" just not without most of the governmental functions that a nation-state currently does.

That's ridiculous.

No, Barzani is building a Kurdish state in Iraq, we don't support him. The PYD isn't building a state, they're building a multi-ethnic community, there are plenty of Arabs and Assyrians in the areas they control.

The Mizrahi Jews (who make a slight majority) were completely discriminated against when they arrived in Israel, Jews of European descent dominate every facet of Israeli power. Israel is a European colony with a classcucked underclass of Jews held two cm above the Arabs .

Palestine was a fucking British Colony before it became Israel, how the fuck can you just dismiss the idea of Israel being a colonial entity with "muh muhmuhism".

That's not what the Assyrians say.
assyriatv.org/2016/01/the-kurdish-ypgpyd-portray-a-fake-image-to-the-world/

Jew detected. Get the spooks out of your head, you don't have to support Israel because someone cut a piece of your dick off.

Assyrians have their own police force and military in Rojava and they fight alongside the Kurds, Arabs, Circassians and other ethnic groups.

NO

Spooked as fuck.

I support the YPG and Rojava not because they are Kurdish, but because I want to support a left-leaning autonomous and the potential influence it has on the surrounding area and the world if it wins. With Turkey involved…not a chance.

*state

wtf op did you never bother to find out why lots of leftists wear some form of keffiyeh?
protip: it is not because they want to exterminate da joos.
(in germany there is this shill movement of jewish/american nationalist warmongers who claim that would be the case)

turkey and syria will displace and kill kurds

kurdistan would be secular and allow turks and syrians to maintain autonomy within democracy

not a nihilist

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Why is your salt showing, friend?

Israel was founded on ethnic tensions and terrorism and that continues to this day.

Supporting national self-determination – even if it is bourgeois, which Rojava isn't – is communist as fuck. The Kurds in Rojava are throwing off the oppressive yoke of the Assad government and reactionary Islam. They're an oppressed ethnic group which has long been denied autonomy and self-government while being subject to localized genocide and generalized repression of their language and culture. You're a fucking disgrace for shitting on their efforts.

Leftcoms are generally not supportive of National Liberation movements.

Leftcoms are generally not supportive of anything but themselves.

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good

OK so they don't want socialism.

So, basically, they are delusional anarchists.

Oh so they do want a state after all; just not an international, proletarian one.

Rojava is statist, don't let anyone really tell you otherwise, I mean so was Catalonia as well, its a natural consequence of class contradictions.

It's democratic confederalism, which is considered a form of libertarian socialism; it is utopian in that sense. Only those utopian elements are tempered by a hardcore ML organization through TEV-DEM and the PYD, which are the vanguard in all but name. This vanguard is the one which sets up the communes, coops, and runs the parliamentary government; it's also the one that organizes the militias – the YPG and YPJ. They aren't challenging the state because the strategy is to grow within it before displacing it. Needless to say this is unlikely to happen. It still makes sense to deny you're out to seize the state in order to keep the wrath of the Assad government at bay.

What is wrong with you.

Not really supported. They're funded by capitalists, aren't really anarchist or even socialist, are mostly racist, and nationalism is generally stupid. War time is an excuse, but don't act like they'll ever go anarchismo if it weren't war time.

YPG is a meme, sadly.

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All those who don't support National Liberation movements are eurocentric hacks

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It's not like Israel at all. Israel was mainly created by Jewish settlers from Europe and America that displaced the native Arab population based on a several thousand year old cultural claim to the land. Kurds are indigenous to the region and have been living there for thousands of years.

Early Christians were proto-commies. I don't see the problem.

God is a spook.

Nothing. What do you think is wrong with me?

I'm not arguing against that. I'm saying people who happen to be the early Christians were proto-communists. That kind of "God of the people" I have no problem with. Why would you? The spook god telling the poor to bend over for the capitalist and the religious nature of people who are practically communists are two pretty damn different things.

This is what tankies actually believe.

No one cares.

My issue with them is not about them not tossing side cultural and historical traditions, it's more that I don't 100% trust them. They exist as an economy of the edges of global capitalism, mostly resorting to contacts with the imperial elites, and sustaining themselves on the exports of oil of territories they've taken control over. There are massive old ties to the CIA, directly.

I sympathize with them greatly, but I cannot get myself to trust them fully. The economy of which they build internally is one of a state of war and conflict, while engaging in the global capitalist economy, focusing primarly on surface "equality" between identities but fundamentally being nothing but a village economy coming upon territorial control of a wanted commodity by the global market.

I do support them, but I just don't trust them. They're too infiltrated, and too incorporated in the war games of the empire. It's tricky as shit.

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They are spooks all the same, and easily coopted.

Pro-commie "reliigious" factions really aren't easily coopted. They're not spooks, all the same, one rationalizes away the rule of a capitalist elite, the other… does not, and has a much more abstracted god. with much less (if any) material consequence. One is a capitalist (or a feudalist) apologist, the other more or less only references "God" as something outside of the world and that humankind should work together. By all material standards, communist in what they wish to achieve.

These are very, very different 'forms' of 'God'. If you can't even understand the notion of how religion in the hands of the masses functions entirely differently than religion in the hands of the powers that be I kind of question you being a materialist at all. We're dealing with echoes of material conditions.

my problem with Rojava is that they have suspiciously good press in the west.