What should our online praxis be? We need some projects

How do you envision this? Like, what type of platform, how would it be organized, etc.

Holla Forums has a webzine?

Methinks an online newsletter would be a pretty good idea for spreading info quickly

When?

chans have organized direct action before. All the Scientology shit for example.

Just a file anyone can download, subdivided into countries, maybe the user writes a general summary and then provides all the links to sources IT MUST BE SOURCED AND SOURCE WELL. So like a general summary and then an extended bibliography of books, documentaries, articles etc. Once submitted we can all read through and validate the information/sources, but also leave it open so new information can be added

I honestly think more people are going to be open to the idea of possibly opening co-ops than actually joining an armed struggle.

Also alongside the co-ops I think it would be necessary to train self defence forces. Have members go to the gym, learn martial arts, kick boxing and Brazilian jujitsu in particular, especially in countries where you can't have weapons, in others I think weapons training would be important.

Yeah, and it turned out terribly

I'd be down for forming an armed to the teeth commune tbh.

Bunkermag. It's more like a blog, though.

This is why we shouldn't do it.

Bunkermag is still a thing. It's just that the people capable of writing things of value are few and far in between.

yes but its a different idea.

What actually stops it from happening besides naysayers and a lack of organisation?

The point is to GET ORGANISED so we can do some EDUCATING and AGITATING

Obviously we aren't organised now, does that mean we can't be in the future?

I don't see that particular project as productive though or attractive to most people on the internet.

I think Holla Forums is pretty good at organizing in a lot of different ways.

I think it would be interesting if we had like a "shark week" type of promotion for bunkermag to encourage more articles. Like something different groups of people could engage with.

Which one are you referring to and why don't you see it as productive?

What happened to bunkermag?

I don't see this particular project as going anywhere useful and furthermore it's already been done.

Surely the only useful praxis here is propaganda. The internet is a communication tool, we should use it as such. To educate and agitate. Spread the ideas of socialism, convince others and educate them. Lets use what we have at our disposal. Memes, bunkermag articles, the Facebook page; education and propaganda, spread it and contribute.

We should also make propaganda, print it and spread it. Don't make these cringy. No memes, just facts and art.

what wouldn't be useful about an easy to access resource on imperialism?

could you point me to where it has been done?

Lets give detroit commune another try.

I would fly out if it was actually going to happen

Right then, so let's reiterate the goals of the detroit commune:

eng.anarchopedia.org/Mass_killings_under_capitalist_regimes

proletariatwiki.org/index.php?title=Mass_killings_under_Capitalist_regimes

Posted this the other day but the thread is gone now. Also I would fly out but also I think this would work best as an international network so if there are UK comrades I would probably join them. However cheap real estate is a large consideration

1) Groups of like minded individuals save up enough money to start small businesses together. They agree to run these on a co-operative basis. They agree between other groups to form networks of mutual support.

2) Once up and running, these businesses agree to pool profits in order to buy out completely all means of production for one of these co-ops. Land, machinery etc. All debts paid. This, under the agreement that once bought out this co-op will pump funds into the liberation of other co-ops.
This will be the first stage, at this stage potential revolutionaries should be attracted by democratic working conditions and better remuneration. At this stage it will be necessary to enter any and all industries possible with no real focus but building a financial power base. This stage must be allowed to grow until there is a substantial network of both liberated and non liberated co-operatives.

3) The second stage will be the creation of infrastructure for collective use, at this point the buying power of the network should become more focused. The revolutionaries should pool resources to build or buy out schools, hospitals and other public services. These for the families of co-op workers but ALSO to provide free healthcare and education where possible for non co-op workers. This to gain support from the public. We simply start out providing public services. At this point we start to have real public power. Once a certain relationship has been attained we may be able to start demanding, for instance, tax exemption.

4) This brings us to stage 4. These are really the two goals that need to be aspired to, a self sustaining network with fully integrated systems of production in all areas, and secession from the state. As the power of the co-op network grows we will be able to demand more and more secession.
I understand that at certain points these secession's will be withheld. I understand that at these points violence will be necessary to defend the network. This is a blueprint for a peaceful revolution however I fully understand that it may not go that way, I fully understand that our enemies have no limits and will stop at nothing.

So stage 4 is secession. Once the network is able to provide for itself entirely, it will secede from the state.
Problems? One I can see is getting enough co-operatives to start over a small enough geo-graphic area to make it efficient. Also, to be fully integrated the network would pretty much HAVE to be international to be able to have access to all the worlds resources. So this would need to happen in pockets all over the world and grow.

That sounds syndicalist as fuck.
Right then, so basically leftypol will have to start one big union that focuses on funding co-ops and communes? How to go about this?

I think it is a good idea to start a detroit commune thread and a new detroit commune irc channel on rizon

I think there are actually plenty of people around who would like to start a co-op if it was part of a global network like this.

The problem is they don't know they want it. One advantage is that people can be revolutionary without committing violence or even breaking the law. All they will be doing is improving (probably) their working conditions.

I had the idea of setting up a website for people to try and meet others in their area to start co-ops with.

Once we had a couple or even just one or a decent looking website we could stage events for publicity, which ties in with other direct action ideas I've been having

Like Occupy Wall Street but call it 'Occupy Everything' we simply expand until we Occupy everything…

instead of dropping everything to move to Detroit (unless you already live there) how about starting co-operative housing where you already live?

Co-ops are a good idea obviously but it takes money and I doubt most of us have that

I think it would be best if this was as global as possible.

This is a good idea. I think something like , starting a website to meet up people that would like to start housing co-ops or industrial co-ops would be effective.

So your action as a vanguard (instead of killing people) is to work for a but and save some cash

Starting a small business doesn't take as much as you'd think. Four or 5 people saving 5 grand could start one, particularly a small cafe or grocery store or something.

It would have to be a really gradual process

obviously the problem is the capital…

Can anyone design websites that thinks this is a good idea?

Like I said, instead of killing people, you just have to save some cash. Which IS hard but can be done.

not gonna lie but you can make 5 grand in like 2 months selling not even that much weed… just saying

I only make minimum wage :(

how do I do this?
t. not fbi
I'm poor as fuck and owe money

but killing people is more instantly gratifying…

5 grand is a lot to many people (like me) but even so, don't the vast majority of businesses fail? That might be alright for some who started with a lot but when we're pooling our own money without even the opportunity for profit I feel like that would be financially and morally devastating

Also TBH if we had a slick looking website and got enough publicity we could probably get some donations

I think for now you could just use a forum website template.
Anyways, I'd call it something like go-organize.org

It should not only be for co-ops though, but for anythign regarding organization. Meeting up to build public infrastructure, forming a union, protests, etc.

One day comr8, I'll own a coffee store that doubles as an anarchist hideout. But I don't have the capital ;_;

...

So do I, I recently went backpacking, took me a year to save 3 not really trying too hard. I don't know where you are though also so hard for me to judge.

But if you had some other people you could for example move into cheaper housing with them (like move into a 2 bedroom apt but fit 3 people in) etc

its pretty much the easiest thing in the world.

Find somebody who you can buy in bulk off, then sell smaller denominations for a little extra. Keep it lowkey. Always keep it lowkey. Trust me, once word gets out even a little bit the stoners will come to you.

then you are no true commie and should frankly kill yourself. No profit motive? Seriously? I live for that.

...

Maybe we should start with co-ops and then expand scope? Keep it simple?

I agree it would be cool to be a multi faceted platform but we don't want to take on too much. Also its easier to publicise simple things.

Mutual Aid, pooling of resources (plus a little backbreaking work)

But c'mon, or forebears literally risked life and limb against brutal monarchies and fascists but we can't save a few pennies?

I'm too alienated to make an effort at anything

Tbqh we already have bunkermag… I don't know why we can't just make an extension on that site.

The only real problem is that I don't think this is well thought out.

Besides a go-organize should be like pointing locations of protests, meet comr9's in your area to discuss communism, looking for roommates, even….

m8 this is stupid af.

wow fuck off bunkermag shill.
I dont want your circlejerk garbage to have anything to do with this genuine proletarian effort

Revolution or Suicide.

Of course it isn't well thought out, its in the early stages.

why

suicide seems a lot more likely don't it

why

I was just noting the irony of us requiring capital in order to destroy capital.

I'm sure it's easy af, i'm about to get my car on the road, but because of financial failure due to failed dreams, resulting in recent poverty, I had to (shamefully) move back in with my parents. I'm too old for this shit. Reach for the moon my ass.

The conditions for revolution are nowhere near existing and life under capitalism has no meaning

To be fair if you even tried to achieve your dreams you did better than me.

Also I'm at my parents place too

Being at your parents is a great place to save money because you don't have to pay rent….

So what, are you going to wait for them?

Also I would strongly disagree, we are about to enter another global recession only this time the right is on the rise because of the whole migrants thing.

There hasn't been a better time for revolution in about 50 or 60 years.

I like the irony. We will be like a cancerous tumor that kills capitalism. Which is ironic, because capitalism is a cancerous tumor

Is Alaska out of the question?

it would be hard to have a tech-centric community in alaska, unless of course we settle somewhere with lots of natural resources.

I would imagine land is kinda cheap? We are going to need agricultural supply chains.

although that would probably be a lot later.

If you could imagine any kind of co-op then it isn't out of the question

I think the yukon territory of canada would actually be more ideal because it has a lot of natural resources and the permafrost makes it ideal for creating cheap subterranean infrastructure. Pretty soon drilling technology will make it possible to drill into the earths mantle. I think that this will allow geothermal powered underground colonies to prosper in cold regions.
The outside air can be compared to the hot underground magma to create water and create room temperature air that can be circulated around the underground facility.

getting excited. Which is good, but baby steps

maybe we'll get an influx of trump refugees to help

if we could get homeless people off the streets we would have made a real difference regardless of revolutionary potential

Yes, plus they might be capable of helping with work. Though I don't know how well that will go over legally unless we're saying fuck it to employment laws.

it would also be good publicity, i guess employment laws would have to be an area by area thing.

If we were to do this, what do you think would be the first stage?

Figuring out hard numbers on who we could count on to start this up, honestly. The total lack of hard information at the beginning was a large part of what killed the last commune idea.

Daily reminder Bunkermag is always in need of your submissions.

You can count atleast one person: me.
I live with my parents and have just enough assets to start a new life. People in my age group are probably the ideal recruits for this endeavor.

So I'm guessing you are 18-35, where do you live?

I'm 24 and live in central IL.
I have a few thousand dollars to my name to help start this.

I think we would need to somehow exchange information and move to a more reputable (sorry Holla Forums) place. I don't know how we would go about doing that.

How about you hold a special event for it… kind of like a writing prompt and see how people react to it.

I'm 24 and live in Edinburgh, Scotland, so there is one problem. However, if we were gonna start a website to arrange local places that wouldn't actually be a problem.

I'm broke but I can make money when I need to

Also I think there was another poster (possibly anarcho nihilist poster) who would probably/maybe get involved I think the Detroit thing was maybe his idea?

19.
Florida. The south of the united states in general is barren of leftists. I must go elsewhere to organize.

So that's 3.

How about we try to get at least two more confirmed people and then I can set up an email address and post it, then you can message it. or could just do this now and recruit here on a continuous basis?

I think it would be good to start as open as possible and have a period of discussion in a specific space so that we can get a really good idea of how best we can achieve these goals, as people have said I don't think these boards are a good place for that, also I'm not very tech savvy, so I don't really know what platform would be good to use

Probably. We might be able to get a few others too in the area. I might try looking into what exists in Chicago too.

That would work.

Would we want throwaway emails or real ones?

just use irc.
#detroitcommune on rizon

I can't tell if I'm talking to two people or 1 person.

None throw away would be best but obviously if you want to use a throwaway at first and then use a normal one once you know I'm not the FBI/A long con artist/ a troll etc then thats cool.

Sorry, both are me.

That would be better if irc wasn't always dead.

Do any of you guys actually have money?
if so you could always pitch in to starts a small casino or strip club.
make that dosh.

best to keep it none seedy

Great Idea.

Why not food? Some stuff in food sells for ridiculous markups on average.

I just thought it be the best route to make bank and fund communist activism and education .

that can work too.

tried to register on Rizon. No idea what an IRC nick is…

the other day somebody said a supermarket/small grocery store

I think to start with also the service industry would be the easiest to enter

Yeah, not bad idea user. I'll go make a thread about it.

Oh, and just fully read through this thread. You guys are trying to put the commune back together? I was a part of the first attempt at that, was the one who researched all the properties and shit. If you lot are serious I'll be sure to lend what help I can.

[email protected]/* */

true could make bank but in terms of mass appeal its not gonna be good publicity if we started from strip bars

I think you need some tech savvy m'dude

would you be willing to send your email address to that email address?

I told you, tech noob. Big time

Sure kiddo, but it'll be a burner for now.

then don't be open about your projects, fund them secretly or anonymously donate to causes

fair enough, just so I have at least a few interested people I can write out an extended idea to and who can reply without the clutter of a board. Once I've talked to people a bit I'll post my IRL name and shit as a goodwill gesture or whatever.

I don't think that is necessary though, also that would be impossible, in my view at least, all accounts/books etc should be open to all members and the public, total transparency of finances/decisions etc

well ok, I just though the end justify the means

its just my view. This is supposed to be a democratic collective so other people may disagree

you gonna mail it though?

I sent you a mail fgt. Look for an email titled "m'comrade"

thnx bbz

I sent a mail

have not received

Yes you did, you replied to me.

okay yeh, so that means I did not receive

fug, i've lost the email.

i'll need to use a more permanent one than the 1hour throwaway.

I would be interested in this. We should make an official commune thread.

Well I mean initially wouldn't it be feasible for everybody to get jobs while living on the commune and just pool our resources? Eventually we would be able to save up enough to maybe start a co-operative enterprise of some kind and bring in real money.

don't do that, please, too many people not involved giving their unwanted advice, do that once the thing has some movement

For getting this on its legs, threads on leftypol really are not the ideal place.

gj

i used guerillamail which is not really a long term email solution.

Also writing a prompt for people to respond to does sound like a good way to get more people to write for le ebin bunker mag

yeah, I'm trying to come up with something

We have bunkermag.
Our fb page has 30k+ subscribers btw.

30k is a lot, we should really harness that following and keep our ideas growing. Trying to convert right wingers is pointless, and they will come to us when they eventually see the weakness of their arguments and the strength of ours, but those who can be actively reached out to are the unpoliticized.

Sup prickly

Building a virtual state, obviously. Silkroad-style socialist market of Cyber Soviets. If you want to influence people for real, you need to provide real things.

Shouldn't we go for actual education? Security and stuff. Explanation of possible legal problems and so on.

Some people never learn. What will you do if gangs decide to take your stuff? What will you do if police does? It's fucking Detroit.

Yes.

Are you an actual editor that can proofread stuff?

That is the current editor for bunkermag.

I am the Editor of Bunkermag, but yeah I do proofread when the occasion calls for it.

vanguardism

find organisation and skilled highly educated workers
finance them via patreon for example
start up multilinguistic open leftist channel that allows outsider content contribution and links all organisations and parties in related channels
organize playlists according to socialist branches
start up website hosting even more media
offer artists platform within to upload content

email that email address fam.

just make a new fake email address that isn't a burner strictly

you didn't read my 4 point thing did you

bump

can i bump this thread?

I could do it if I don't need any money.

Question: what will the commune produce? Will it be agrarian subsistence farming, or will it produce products to sell on the market?

what is our fb page?