Theatrical traditional animation

What he means is they send them overseas to be animated. All the pre and post-production is done in America but the actual task of animating is done by underpaid Koreans or, if you're lucky, Japs

What you wrote doesn't change what I wrote.

The point obviously is that the skills for making 3D animation are widely in use, and the game industry was an example of that. It also doesn't say anywhere that someone can't move from the game industry to the animation industry or vice versa.

I said "flash and flash-like."

In Korea.

You vastly underestimate the difficulty of animation and overestimate the skill of people who make stuff like Steven Universe. That shit is nowhere near the level of Disney feature animation, and getting to that level isn't as easy as "just do it better."

So you are claiming it as fact that every single person who used to do hand-drawn animation is now freelance?

What are you talking about?

You realise that even Disney used ToonBoom? The days of using cels and paint, or even using CAPS, are long gone.
The only real difference between a Disney film like The Princess and the Frog and some shit cartoon made on YouTube is the amount of time and effort put into it.

Yeah you seem to be radiating yours all over this thread. Maybe you should stay in tumblr since you seem to be so obsessed with it.

I didn't say anything about using cels.

The difference between Disney and shitty YouTube cartoons isn't just time and effort. YouTube animators don't have the skill and know-how to make Disney animation.

Would you say most shows on TV showcase good animating skills?

Yeah, of course someone who likes Zootopia has a shit opinion on animation.

If you think 3D is better than 2D you're the reason people advocate for freedom of speech to be suppressed.

>>>/furry/
>>>/oven/
>>>/auschwitz/

...

kill your self

>>>/oven/

JUST GOTTA WAIT
WAIT FOR GENNDY
AND HIS PARADIGM SHIFT

If anyone can do it, it's Genndy. The man loves 2D. 3D a shit that looks ugly because they try to make it both lifelike and absurd.

Jesus fuck, do you guys have any taste in animation, or are you guys stuck in the "buh all animashions r Didney" meme like the Academy?

2D's still well and alive in Japan and Europe, especially Europe though their budgets are understandably small. Heck, Klaus was talked about a while back, wasn't it?

There's also a small movement to adopt nonphotorealistic rendering and stop-motion style animation into 3D, essentially transferring skills needed for 2D into the currently popular medium. We've already seen such experiments like The Peanuts Movie and the Lego Movie play out.

In general the main problem is marketing and coverage. Disney movies are always guaranteed to have a fuckload of marketing because the company has perfected the craft and sits upon a mountain of money that dwarfs God. Compare that to an U.S. release of April and the Extraordinary World, which had little marketing at all. Or The Tale of Princess Kaguya. Or Long Way North. Or…well, any foreign international film really.

If somebody were to have the budget for such a wide release, and the right timing and draw, that might catapult 2D back into the minds of the octogenarian executives that enforce the 3D convention.

While I hope and very much feel it's likely Gendy with start a burst of new serious 2D cartoons that aren't shit reddit humor messes. We have to remember that Genndy himself is a bit of a snob when it comes to animation. He wants to do it the way he likes in a style he likes. So we'd have to rely on others to be inspired by him and his success over just him. I do really think that the boom with the new Samurai Jack season has really started the fire that will spark a new revolution in American animation. We only have to watch.

This is what always ends up pulling me out of 3DCG movies. I remember it being especially noticeable in Brave. The characters all have these highly stylized shapes and proportions, and whenever there was a close-up you could see that the hair, skin, and eyes were all textured and rendered realistically. It's a ticket straight to the uncanny valley. It's consistently a problem with hair- seeing these wacky cartoon shapes covered in hyper-realistic hair or fur is just disconcerting.

The fundamental problem is an inconsistent degree of stylization. Certain parts of the aesthetic are telling you that what you're seeing is "real" while other parts are telling you it's a cartoon. It seems especially jarring when things like texture and lighting are more realistic than the shapes they're being applied to. It's the same reason that "realistic Mario" picture is the stuff of nightmares.

It is the year of new dawns after all…..

Here's hoping then.

Too bad the pay and treatment is complete shit when it comes to animators. In Japan, it's a 10,000 dollar salary a year, and in the US, it's a fucking joke like what happened to the animators who were involved with sasauge party.

Technically SP was animated in Canada, but point taken

this is the same complaint people levied against shit like polar express and the Jim Carrey Christmas Carol, and those were much more realistic overall so…

Of course anything involving Jim Carrey is going to be disturbingly inhuman, the man's a bigger freakazoid than any character he's ever played.

I think part of the reason for 3D animated movies is because it's easier to come up with toys based on the characters.

Like you can look at the main characters from Zootopia and see fairly clearly how they could be envisioned as dolls.

It seems like a lot of kid's movies are done primarily for the merchandising potential which makes it easier to justify the higher budgets. So in order for 2D movies to make a comeback you'd need to have some way to make it better for merchandising than what is possible with the 3D movies.

Something that seems to be getting done occasionally in Japan is making animated shows/movies based on light novels, primarily to act as advertisements to sell more of those light novels. In France they did Wakfu mostly to help with selling the game by the same name. So I think that the primary impediment to getting more 2D animation in the US is just needing executives to recognize that they could make money off of something other than toys. Because the main problem with Gendy's Sym-Bionic Titan just that executives couldn't see how they could make toys based on the characters?

But… but they're giant fucking robots! Kids love that shit! How could they not have so easily made toys???

Argubly we have another comparable phenomenon without it's own name, but the result is unease and disgust either way.

Uncanny valley is the fact that the more realistic you try to go, the more clearly the imperfections stand out and the harder they ruin the experience.

Putting realistic texture on stylized shapes puts that kind of revulsion into overdrive. Rahter than unsettligly imperfect realism you have a real-looking deformed abomination.

Every other character looks like they each come from a different show

That was something Gendy brought up even, that he tried changing how the characters were designed to make it easier for merchandising.

I imagine toy makers just felt like they couldn't make something like an action figure out of most of the regular guys from the cartoon the way you can with something like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

as a person who is learning to do 3D
There is a revolution coming, and not in the good way
I am so sorry

The reason 3d animated movies are coming in is because they allow for big budget bigscreen things that 2D otherwise would not allow
If you have seen some cg movies in the last year or two
Independent of them being good/bad the effects on these animated features using CGI is objectively very well done and very impressive. if you have the money then there is no reason not to.

3D is getting easier and easier my friend. You are correct that it ages and that 2D is timeless but 3D is the future and has not yet reached full potential. Cartoons will probably go to 2D but I believe that 3D will stick in movies, if not springing new cartoons that take advantage of developing computer technology.

You do not know how 3D animation works.
Go on youtube and look up "animation demo reel 2016" (ps this is how animators get real jobs instead of being ecelebs) and you will see MANY that are 3D and well done.

can you elaborate a bit.

My second post
there are tons and tons of 3d students hitting the workforce that you will probably see soon. It's not even that hard to learn how to 3D animate quite well. As I said look up on youtube "animation demo reel" or "3D ani reel" and you will find a hidden army of animators.
I'm trying to become a CG modeler and even I am afraid of my job being cut down by a computer that can create procedural textures (surfaces such as brick or metal edge wear on a gun/tank) with the click of a button and a few sliders. One man can do the work of many with some of these new programs.

As for CG animation it is simply a matter of manipulating a puppet with handles. Very good CG animation is tough but decent and pretty good cg animation is easy.
Especially programs that are getting smarter and sometimes cheaper are putting more power into CG studios that want to save money cut out artists and use a computer rendering engine to do
Yes someone needs to set up the lights and special effects inside the computer but once that is done then the frame by frame sweatshop work can be replaced by a few computers. working overnight.
I personally think it might not be too bad

3d movies and cgi will never beat out roger rabbbit for lighting.

Now I feel very insecure since I wanted to try animating as a hobby.

But 3D is much more standardized. All the modern CG movies never made me go "Wow". Because at best Im seeing "These rocks sure do look like real rocks but worse".

I am more interested on CGI finally duplicating 2D look, since it would made it easy and profitable again, thought even if the 3D CGI maaged to do that , The Audiences wouldnt like it anyways since they can't "relate" to it, I bet they told you CGI is better because normalfags relate much better to it.

Since I am a manlet with micropenis it has aways been difficult to me to relate to the struggles of the 7 foot tall super predator Negroes of America tbh.

Normal people relate more to 3D, for example, true 2D ( Anime ) Is superior to any other form of animation but normal people find it alien and even creepy, CGI 3D Is safe, relatable and people seem to take it more seriously.

Nigga what? 3D's the one people find creepy. That's why studios try so hard to keep a balancing act between realistic and uncanny valley. Part of the reason the Final Fantasy movie Spirits Within failed was because the models were too realistic.

For one 3d cgi can be stylized if it wishes to, (though you are correct that 2D is much more flexible.)
2 those rocks are going to look better and better every year.
3 don't even try and tell me that an old cgi movie like toy story 1 is unwatchable due to aging. It proves that a cgi movie can do well even past it's heyday.

Don't be, while I do appreciate 3d and what it can do, there are some things it will never be able to do. There will always be a place for 2d in our hearts. You will almost never be able to make something like Samurai Jack in 3d

Then conglaturations, your unreal looking dragon clashes horribly with the hyper realistic environment. See also: The Good Dinosaur.

Its a dead end. More and more money towards a visual dead end.

Its the tumor thats murdering advancement in videogames.

Plus im not the same annon. Toy story is fine sans the humans. But when i look at animation from all across the world and then back at cg, its like a super strong blandness hit all of animation.

Do it anyway. There's nothing else quite like watching something come to life as you draw it.

That's the best way to go. If you're just doing it for yourself then you won't have to worry about making a profit and you are free to do what you want with it and it will be from the heart (which normally ultimately leads to a project being more enjoyable). The moment people start thinking "how do I make money from this" or "oh no it won't be popular and I won't make money" is when they worry. Just do it for fun/passion and you'll be fine.

Another strike against 3D, seeing as designing your characters so there are no sharp edges to hurt the little kiddies when they play with the toys puts serious constraints on what your character can look like.

I want to say this is bait but I'm not sure.

Thanks guys. I will just animate then. For me it was because I have some ideas I just wanted to see come to life so I want to do it before I die and have no regrets.

Yeah Hasbro struggled to make Pony toys look decent since they are very 2D, only the expensive guardians of Harmony line comes close.

Most of the 3D Garys Mod ponoos look pretty on-model.

Eppeljeck notwithstanding lol

And then user was the Truthseeker

>>>/mlp/

A paradigm shift is NEVER going to happen when cartoons are less profitable than video games and movies, and executives still have power over creators with their monopolies of copyright.

They don't give a shit if you like their works or not. Acting like greedy kikes doesn't give them a drop in sales or creators leaving them for their competitors. They know what they're doing is unpopular, but they do it anyway because they profit the same amount as they would if they gave creators high budgets and maximum creative freedom.

Businessfag here. I don't believe 3D will replace 2D animation anytime soon. There's a lot of demand for 2D animation, as evident by a plurality of Holla Forums. Rather, 2D animated works will be sold alongside 3D ones. And since 3D is extremely costly and the art styles presently limited. I suspect that 2D animation will be the more favourable choice among creators and executives. That's only if there's a free market of animation.

Godspeed, user.

Rumba

/m/fag here. We feel for you guys.
Watch embed related and just look at the detail put into the climactic scene of this episode at 21:54. Now think that this was made in the 90s and there haven't been many mech anime that look this good since then. It's all CG laziness now. Try and picture this scene being done today. It'd look shit.
I miss when people had a passion for animation.

*ahem*

lol all these complaints about realistic CGI seem like memes or by snobs, no one I knew ever had a problem with the Polar Express.
They re-release it every christmas and people always go to see it.

Maybe my whole town is autistic or something.

That was a different time. We got laser printers and jews want shortest for more shekels in their pockets.

3D CG movies are absolutely not more popular than traditional animated films. 3D CGI is just easier to market than traditional hand drawn. And arguable 3D CG is easier than traditional hand-drawn because you can recycle the same assets with 3D CG movies, thus allowing for inflated marketing budgets

Its a viscous cycle really

I never got the complaints about realistic CGI either unless it's just shit. Polar Express is fucking great.

It's vicious, but for some reason, viscous actually kind of sounds right in this situation.

welp, time for bed

I know you all Hate Dough Walker but his take on this issue was spot on, Audiences think 3D CGI looks "cool" and "modern" but most importantly, they can take it more seriously, and perceive it as much more immersive than 2D. Test group may be cancer but make a mass pool to random people on movie theaters on all America and they will agree that they prefer 3D CGI.

I think it's more noticeable in screencaps than the actual movie, especially in the theater

intentional or not, now I'm laughing like a retard.

Unfortunately its not available in my country. But I do understand your pain man. Thanks for sharing.

here its not the same scene but its the same anime that this dude was talking about

also this

He wasn't spot on on anything, it's a common sense conclusion even an autistic child can grasp.

What about Don Bluth? Also wasn't Titan E.A. big bust because feature length traditional animation was seen as "for children?" That could be the real reason we're not getting anyone 2d feature lengths

Er, he stopped working even before 3D became a thing. He's now making a pozzed Dragon's Lair reboot or whatever.
A.E. was a bust because it was generic and boring as fuck and CGI looked like shit even then.
Animation is still seen as for children, see pic related

Gunbuster was made in the 80s.

How?

iirc he gave into demands to make Daphne strong and independent instead of cock annihilator

Thanks guys this is beautiful.

A.E. was a bust because it wasn't marketed. It was thrown out like stale bread to pigeons and ignored because the company had no idea how to market animation. No American company knows how to market animation that isn't Care Bears or Pixarface, or Care Bears with Pixarface.

That reminds me, his style would be downright perfect for a Ciaphas Cain adaptation (or Dresden verse books).

His style, when not heavily rotoscoped, is superior to disney tbh

Yis. Especially when depicting beautiful women and (somewhat paradoxically) monsters.

…What the hell, now I want to see the Gaunt books animated the same way.

Sadly most of his works are furfaggotry

Bluth's Belle

Im still on the Disney side when it comes to designs.

you should go back to >>>/reddit/ then

t. disney shill

vnkmvtm

This is nice to see. They could have easily cgi'd or flashed it. Traditional animation may yet start to recover one small step as a time

more detail doesn't equal better design. she looks prettier than disney's Belle, but she also looks firgettable, since no aspects of her design makes her stand out as anything more than a pretty girl.

And Disney's does somehow?

The only people who prefer 3D over 2D are furfags who only like it because it's a step closer to "real" anthropomorphized animals, which is easier for them to get off to. It looks worse, it's allows for far less subtlety, and is much more expensive unless you're reusing the same models over and over again, which isn't really an option because those models are going to look dated a year after they're made.

How could we ever know if this is true?

he's just a goon

I never thought Disney's Belle was anything but forgettable. It's easily the blandest Disney Princess design.

Id argue Sleeping Beauty is worse, i dont even remember her name.

Shit, you're right.
Only 2 years off though!

Well, her actual princess attire is very boring and generically pink

I much preferred this look she had in the forest

I know that feel, OP.

That looks pretty interesting. Wonder what it would've been like.

It's my impression that that's what happened.

How does making that statement mean that I'm from Something Awful?

Maybe he thinks goons are from the future.

See GG Xrd; 3d models to mimic 2d