Alt-Left vs. Post-Left

What's the difference between the Alt-Left and the Post-Left?

Other urls found in this thread:

counter-currents.com/2016/01/introducing-the-alt-left/
8ch.net/leftypol/res/781767.html
altleft.com/2015/11/14/a-clockwork-greenshirt-introducing-the-alt-left/
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

One doesn't exist and the other doesn't exist in a meaningful way

pls dont

Doesn't exist lad

I thought Holla Forums was the alt-left like how Holla Forums is the alt-right

disgusting

There's mainstream left(mostly social-democrats, and all the parties engaged in bourgeois politics) and radical left. Radical reject the bourgeois ways, when mainstream left seeks to achieve it's goals by the means of liberal democracy.

The former is edgy faggots trying to reconcile their beliefs about human agency with the sometimes failures of revolutions, and the latter is edgy faggots who shitpost and revel in philosophical obscurity.

This.

Never thought I'd find myself agreeing with an Anarcho-Feminist and a SocDem, but yeah, this.

post left hates western value and tradition.
alt right hates perceived threats to said values.

The irony being the values the alt-right try to protect are liberty, freedom of speech and religion, and enlightenment values. The Post left supports people who's values are 100% reactionary to western liberal democratic values.

Really well jewed tbqh.

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Maybe you just don't get it. It IS now the right that speaks up for free speech. It is the alt-rught that doesn't want an oppressive, alien culture brought in, especially one with form of ghettoisation.

Meanwhile, we got the regressive left calling for the Brexit vote to be ignored, the regressive left. Sorry, 'post left' calling for the shutting down of speakers who threaten their echo-chamber. It is the left that pushes for new laws on hate speech and attempts to broaden the definition of it.

Put the kool-aid down homie

The alt-left is basically Holla Forums

counter-currents.com/2016/01/introducing-the-alt-left/

Do you seriously think ghettos appear from the bottom up? Or maybe you're just using the butchered version of the term to appeal to fear, lol.

twitter libshit get out

jesus christ, just fucking kill this board already

Le alt left

Slips right off the tongue doesn't it.

People who try to force this stupid fucking meme like we are on the same stature as that gay jew Holla Forums worships should be publicly shot.

There is not and never will be an "alt-left", there is anarchism, socialism and the fake "leftist" liberalism or idpol idiocy that is paraded in the universities and media.

rude sage

Alt-left = ex-Holla Forumsyps who want to seem controversial, nuanced and edgy, even though being a communist is already pretty edgy and controversial, though maybe not nuanced.

Post-left = everyone must be like n1x

top kek

Nobody here but Pure Blooded Bookchin Revolutionary's know about the post left and that they are the incarnation of satan and are bassicly degenerates that should be purged in name of the revolution.


This tbh fam, n1x is a true lad.

Traditionalists think Enlightenment thought is a cancer on muh true western civ.

alt left is like national syndicalists or just leftists with certain conservative ideals

They're literally dank memers.

and alt right is edgy homosexual nazis who think being a nazi isnt just right, but a mirror of the right. or something.

Alt-left = Holla Forums

Post-left = Actual IRL anarchists


ayy, basically this

Holla Forums for the most part seems to know little to nothing about post-left anarchy and just has a knee-jerk reaction to it anytime it gets mentioned, because it's wrongthink. Being a "leftist" forms a major part of the identities of most people on Holla Forums, so people tend to take it personally that the post-left anarchy writers criticize the Left.


also this

no.

Reminder that Bookchin is a filthy class collaborationist who dared to question the authority of syndicalism:

The Revolution is just one more labor strike away, comrade ;^)

Read The Ecology of Freedom, it will blow your mind!

I seriously hope you guys don't do this

You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, either lurk or leave.

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Sorry for offtopic, but what comic is this? Look cool.

ssshhh, they don't want to be honest with themselves.

Tails Gets Trolled

Thank You! I hope i will fill Sonichu shaped hole in my heart.

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Hello, Hitler : D

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post-left are actually edgy anarchists that think Marx is "muh fascist" and are "2kool4theory".

wew lad.

No.
Hitler was a nationalist posing as a leftist. Nati0nal S0cialism is "socialism."

>Who is Otto and Gregor [email protected]/* */

Revisionists.

Whatever you say m80.

Or useful idiots, if you prefer.

I wouldn't really call Otto a useful idiot. He opposed Hitler throughout the entire war and was constantly hunted by the Nazi party.

Well, if only he hadn't called Hitler an "impotent coprophile" he might have spared his brother from execution…

Seriously though, I still have doubts that nation-states can resist being absorbed by global capital.

At least you see the distinction m80. That's better than most modern "leftists".

Drunk, forgot to quote:

It's weird, leftypol usually says I'm not a leftist because I am fem-whatever, but pol says I'm a leftist because I advocate collective ownership. Feels bad, user…


Pray, what're you drinking in particular?

Not real.

Meme spouting edgelords, pedophiles, and primitivist.

I really love the irony that you retards are so salty about post-left anarchy that you refuse this hard to read anything about it beyond the title, that you don't even know that post-left anarchy is known for critiquing identity politics. And unlike Holla Forums, it actually has real points of critique to make towards identity politics, and doesn't resort to a hamfisted meme-version of orthodox materialism to make an argument.

Back in the old days of Holla Forums you used to piss me off but considering the flood of redditors you're one of the few reasonable people left by comparison.
I'm a poorfag so I'm drinking bud ice

I'm not reading all of that bullshit anyway. Fuck off.

I'm sure that otherwise you read theory all the time and don't just regurgiate whatever opinions Holla Forums approves of ;^)

I've read Marx, Sorel and Proudhon. Fuck off nigger.

No you haven't. You couldn't be this retarded if you really read Marx.

^

The alt-left are racialist socdems who are irrelevant.

The post-left are faggots who suck up masturbatory theory and are irrelevant.

Literally

Hey, I really hope you've read those names, at least you won't be as hopelessly retarded as the majority of this board.

Shit thread, kill yourself OP

I didn't read the thread, if others have been saying the post-left or alt-left is irrelevant it's because that would be accurate. Or did your special snowflake party/organization finally cross into triple digits last night?

Somehow i'm agreeing with this faggot

Like clockwork has this thread shown that leftypol has not and will never read theory.
The vangaurd of the upcoming revolution lmao.

Their critiques of idpol are lackluster and nothing new, better has been done in the past. Even though some do critique it, it does not mean that there isn't any post-left who don't delve into it.


Judging from McQuinn's, Black's, and Hakim Bey's writings they haven't read much either because their criticism of Leftism is bad compared to the ones of past marxist and anarchist. In Black's debunking democracy I did not see any critique that was new or not done better before, and his failure provide a alternative makes the whole thing a waste of time. In the Abolition of work he went to say that it was not a play on words when it definitely was, strawmans the Left as being bureaucrats, and again does not provide any new insight on the Left that has already been written about before.

McQuinn goes on about milieu, collective and "libertarian values", him and Black both believe people can't be individuals at all under collectivism and that Leftist hate "individualism". They also say that anarchism was never Left at all, that it was just a "association" and that it should stop associating with the Left because its dead and harms the image of anarchism.

Some quotes Black and McQuinn.


From Anarchy 101

I mean seriously, this is so wrong that its not even funny.

Bey is a complete mess, In Pirate Utopia where views that the republic of sale was a proto-anarchist society? Mien Gott
Lets just ignore the criminal poetry, artistic crime, his love for pederasty and became a Sufi so he could touch little boys.
After reading the incredible lameness of left-anarchism by McQuinn, I had not read any since. Honestly, it would be talked about more if it wasn't mostly californian primitivist bay area trash. Though I may just been reading the wrong shit.

Like?

If anyone calls themselves alt-left, beat the fuck out of them

Anarchist and Marxist critiqued each other much better than Black and McQuinn did, though I admit i haven't read much post-left besides them besides some anarcho-primitivsm stuff. Also Max Stirner, who does a much better job with the individual egoist critique.

Why should he still uphold the idea of democracy and reform it to be in some may better. He disregards democracy for it still being flawwed when we bring it to direct democracy. (Its purest form)

That is your only problem with it? It being a play of words? Langauge? Hope you didnt ignore the content.

Maybe provide a vew

As Anarcho-Collectivism still upholds the authority of idealogy and society (Unity and cooperation for the sake of the idea instead of mutual interest of Individuals) and the idealogical obligation that are attached to it wich can contradict individual desires and pashions. ALl those who do not participate in revolution is an unman/heretic/degenerate/counter revolution.

The left is dead and maintains a corpse to be left in its grave.

user, post left anarchists there main philosophical basis is Egoism. Did you know that Mcguinn and Feral Faun regullary wrote about Stirner? Have you even read this pdf?

Besides Stirner, who else was there who did better criticism?

I did not say he should, its just that in real theory you provide an alternative in which he did not do. He did not bring up any flaws we don't already know either.

Though this discussion may be interesting, I need some sleep because I'm dead tired. I may continue later after I reread some stuff.

Fuck off faggot. Marx is overrated. His analysis of capital is fine but his solutions are shit.

Nigga you must have missed Bob Black's autistic tantrum when Bookchin called him out as a useless lifestylist. Or is Black not the real post left?

Face it, the post-left are maybe a hundred people who are absolutely irrelevant outside of their circlejerk. If the left is a corpse continuously attempted to be frankensteined by ideology blinded faggots then the post-left was a stillbirth paraded around by its mentally ill parents.

I don't think that the post was necessarily implying that Bookchin was post-left, but he is nevertheless a key figure in the discourse even if he was a figure around which post-left anarchy formed as a critique of.

The rest of your post just demonstrates that you, like everyone else on this board, are completely and utterly out of touch with any IRL anarchism. Not surprising at all considering that very few people on this board do anything for leftism aside from shilling Bernie and Corbyn.

Then he made his point badly. At best Bookchin's relation to the post-left faggots is that he was attacked by them. I don't need to bring up everyone they've attacked to dismiss them as irrelevant larpers with sticks lodged in their assess the same way I bring need to do it with ancaps.


You caught me, I don't larp irl with the real anarchists whose activities are the equivalent of gargling each other's cum and patting each other on the back.

wew, this willful ignorance: A Holla Forums classic

"Anarchy After Leftism" is a cornerstone of post-left anarchy, and it was written as a response to Bookchin. Therefore, Bookchin is a pretty major part of understanding post-left anarchy's ideas.

Holy fuck the salt in this statement. K fam, continue to be an edgy e-activist, I don't really give a fuck. The fact of the matter is that Holla Forums will never be anything more than a torture chamber of sheltered white suburban males bitching about SJWs "idpol" with a pseudo-leftist identity to make themselves feel smart and important. It's a tale as old as the internet.

Top kek. Bookchin saw Black's attack as unworthy of response, and he isn't wrong. The post-left's ideas aren't fit to wipe my ass with, because they're so full of shit my butt would just get dirtier.


You caught me Aids Skrillex, I'm a fucking white male like a quarter of burgerland. My shitposting on a taiwanese finger painting board will never be as serious as your masturbationself-theory and I'm sure your group of post-left friends will break the glass ceiling of 5 people any day now. Insurrection is just around the corner with those numbers!

Hey, at least I can take comfort in the fact that your post is the best the Left can do: Impotent butthurt at any kind of criticism of its dogma.

kys tbh fam ;^)

Sure thing bucko, tell all 3 of your post-left real anarchist friends that you beat a fucking white male shitposter on an obscure image board. I'm sure they'll be very impressed and give you a big gulp of their self-theory.

Hey, at least I'd be getting laid - unlike you.

Oh I get laid, unfortunately my gf has a job and is on her period atm so I shitpost when I can't pound that shit.

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Faggot.

Neither of these terms mean anything.

Post-Ironic Leftism>Post-Leftism>The Left That Was ism>New Leftism

Everybody is shittu.

"Quantity of sex is messure of succesfull life"

SUCH DIALECTICS!

Faggot is for anal, as the saying goes

Alt-left in my opinion refers to turd positionist movements - they aren't right or center, so how couldnt they be left?

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They are both revisionist ideologies that will be gulag'd. Frankly, anyone who isn't a Post-Center Anarcho-Hoxhaist Queer Theorist is part of the problem.

Not really what I was saying tbh. Nothing wrong with reading more theory but this place is generally an intellectual pissing contest where you how to show your literary credentials to be taken seriously.

theres no such thing as an "alt" left. the alt right exists because its an alternative from the usual right wing circle, with the alt right being less focused on economics and more focused on social issues. thats why we see "libertarian" alt rights supporting trump despite him being a protectionist, simply because they give less fucks about economics, if not know nothing at all, and care too much about "cultural marxism" and immigration.

even if there is an alt left, it'd just be the neo-left movement back in the 60s, which, like the alt right, focused less on economics and more on social issues, pushing the class struggle back and the meaningless bourgeois feminist/anti-racist movement forward. most of Holla Forums could be considered classical leftists or paleo-leftists.

Alt- means alternative
Post- means after
Considering the fact that leftism as a concept doesn't end, I am guessing that the first exists and the other does not

As says, if there's something befitting the name "alt-left", it's the liberal idpol crowd. Either use it for them, or not at all.

If this stupid attempts of pushing the label onto Holla Forums continue, I believe a wordfilter is in order.

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Seconded.

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not an insult, just a stereotype. Stay triggered lefty/pol/

note "sheltered" and "suburban", you fucking retard.

the alt left is the actual fucking left

stay classy reddit

Stay triggered alt-left ;^)

It's a stereotype only in 'Murica.

Stay Redneck, 'Murica.

this is not a thing

Get your revisionist bullshit out of here tbh

Anyway, I’ve seen a couple blogs referring to an “alt-left” that is essentially socialistic but spooked by the “race over everything” meme—not unlike some of the more autistic anti-idpol crypto-polyps here. Think what the alt-right says about socdem: “Only works in ethnically homogenous states P.S. fuck those niggers/jews/gooks :DDDDDDDDDD”


Even though the “alt” in alt-right is not in reference to their racial spooks.

Both are irrelevant speshul snowflake internet """"""""""leftist""""""""""" """"""tendencies"""""""

When will N1xy and his cancer crew stop pushing this terrible meme?

It is almost as bad as the post-left "theory" meme that they push.

/thread

If you can label it, you can hate it.
This said, there is no Alt-Left

Alt-Left is literary New Left, AKA precursors to liberal Idpol.

fuck off Useful Idiotite

Can you please elaborate on this? I'm not sure I understand what you meant

There isn't a such thing as either, this is division tactics 101.

This pretty mutch, dont be deceived by the jew fellow Comrades.

I don't think so, buried in that article is the aspect of the "alt-left" that white nationalists like the ones at counter-currents probably like best:


So basically, the alt-left is for people who have some leftist views but they've totally bought into the racial pseudoscience of Holla Forums (see 8ch.net/leftypol/res/781767.html for good arguments against this), and maybe even the Jewish conspiracy theories.

And notice that the quoted text wasn't written by counter-currents, they were just quoting from the guy who created the altleft.com site at altleft.com/2015/11/14/a-clockwork-greenshirt-introducing-the-alt-left/