What's your views on Plato's allegory of the cave

but it's not tho

Are you saying that the phylosophers do not have our best interests in mind?
Are you gonna go as far as call them a nomenclature???
Do you wanna be framed "counter-revolutionary"???

You want me to call the guardians???

(Also, BS like the Venus Project, is Republic X Science.)

This fam. Pre-Socratics were superior to Plato and Aristotle

An excellent allegory of how the Jew pulls the wool over the eyes of the goyim.

kek

this tbh

There'd no evidence Nietzsche read Stirner, and Nietzsche wrote far more about tons of shit that Stirner never even addressed. Quit talking out your asshole

If you had read the republic then you would know Plato advocated for a government split up into three Castes. Sure he was "so progressive" because he supported meritocracy. You would know that he advocated a one ruler Aristocracy, and you would know that the lowest class couldn't own any of its own property. You would know the middle class are soldiers which by his words are dedicated to forcing the philosopher kings ideals on the majority.

Yui, you are an idiot. If that isn't fascism to you then fuck off and quit you whole >well I read the book so I know more than you

Soo… Feudalism?

We cannot start calling anything that is not anarchism, fascist!

Nietzsche seems like the first imageboard poster. Spews whatever arrogant shit and personal biases first come to mind and then make no attempt to justify any of them.

Fascism is an attempt to revert a modern society to feudalism.

I hope you appreciate the irony that you literally just spewed arrogant shit and personal biases without making an attempt to justify them.

Yes. So, when you are before feudalism, it's progress.

Right?

As an archetype, however, the republic is … … the state will wither away…

That's the joke, Black Flag. Jesus, you've been an idiot every time I've seen you post.

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Then it was a bad joke :^)

Honestly, I find Ancient Athens and the Roman Republic to be far superior to Feudal Europe.

Reality is that Marx is wrong and what really happened was that society reseted itself after the Roman Empire fell. Basically, the Roman Republic was forced into a choice between plebeian democracy and Caesarism, and it chose the latter which led in turn to it's collapse.

Plato is not a fascist. Fascist =/= authoritarianism. Plato's ideal was elitist authoritarianism without any of the populism of Fascism.

Basically, Plato is shittier than fascists.

Pericles and Democritus are based as fuck though.

Like mostly everything with Plato and Platonic thought in general, it is pretty based.

Outside of its original meaning in The Republic I find the allegory most applicable to both Simulation Hypothesis/Digital Physics and an example of the ignorance of the masses (and as such an example of why they need people with a wider perspective to lead them).

Technocracy advocates for collectively owned property, legal equality for men and women and the destruction of traditionalist ideology.
However, I have yet to see you mount a defense of it against the wild claims of it being Fascist.

Platonic thought is the very highest watermark of human thought.
The only school of thought that even gets close is Chinese Legalism.

If you want to see those that have poisoned Western thought, look to the individualists.

Okay okay ya got me. No one ever speaks of fascism in its proper sense. Meant authoritarian.

Also hey, Howard; any links you could give me/places to start on reading about technocracies?

Just sit in your Mom's basement for a while and browse r/transhumanism and it'll come to you naturally.

Taking "start with the Greeks" seriously is also needed.

Lol wut?

That would depend on what you mean by "technocracies".

If you want information on the Modernised Technocratic Model (MTM), you can find it attached to this post.

If you are looking for information on subjects related to technocracy, they can be found in the small reading list I put together on >>>/urbanate/

8ch.net/urbanate/res/108.html#q109

If you want any further information, you will have to be more specific in what you are looking for.

Chinese legalism is authoritarian shite and Plato is incredibly overrated especially in regards to his metaphysical ideas

Didn't even know about that board. I appreciate it! I'll be posting there in the next couple of days if you'd check it (I figure its not active). Thank you.

Firstly, Chinese Legalism is Totalitarian, not Authoritarian.
There is a marked difference between the two systems, you fucking pleb.

Additionally, Legalism has shown itself to be an extremely effective philosophy to orientate a society around.
If it were not for Legalism, China would never have become a singular political and (mostly) cultural entity.

On the topic of Plato.
He is absolutely not overrated.
Even if there was a statue of him on every street corner and a Platonic academy in every city, he would still not be receiving a thousandth of the admiration him and other great Platonic thinkers deserve.

Absolutely not.
The works of Plotinus and other assorted Neoplatonists show how great his metaphysical ideas were.

hi mister, i wondered if you could tell me if technocracy is just another form of communism?
and if so why in modern days technocracy seem to became a synonyme of neoliberalism.
thanks

It is not.
Technocracy is just as opposed to Communism as it is Fascism or Capitalism.

Technocracy was subject to the same bastardization of definition that Communism was.

Much like how American media and dictionaries worked to change the definition of Communism to some Marxist-Leninist strawman.
The same forces did the same thing to the definition of Technocracy, once the American Technocracy Movement grew large enough to threaten their power.
In the case of Technocracy, the definition was changed to reflect Veblenism (Due to Thorsten's Veblen's idea of a "soviet of engineers" - An idea that is not in anyway Technocracy).

Why that has now evolved into the more modern use within Europe, I cannot say.
It could just be lazy reporters, hoping to sound educated on a topic by co-opting a term.
I suppose that the more conspiracy aligned may see it as an attempt to poison a word (much like how "Communism" and "Fascism" have be poisoned) in an era ripe for social change.

your political inclination is interesting as hell, in my country(chile) there was once a government project called cybersyn with technocratic aspects, that consisted in a comunication web around the country, in order to distribute wealth and regulate the economy during the socialist government. maybe you wouldn't agree with me, but i see technocracy as an evolution of communism/anarchism, as both are for social engineering.
i wish there was more knowledge about technocracy nowadays.
is there any party or movement in the US or something like that, that follows technocratic ideas? thanks

If you would like to learn more about, Technocracy.
I would recommend that you investigate some of the material found on >>>/urbanate/
Not only is their a wealth of material on Technocracy there, but it is a much better location to post any questions that you may have.

I'm very much aware of Cybersyn.
It is quite true that some aspects of it are shard with Technocracy, the Modernised Technocratic Model for instance seeks to recreate a similar such system, only controlled by an AI.

It should be noted however that Cybersyn was built off the back of cybernetics, not Technocratic organisational principles.
As such, a mature version of Cybersyn would have taken on a distributed form, rather then the centralized form that Technocratic system would have used.

I do disagree quite strongly.
Technocracy is it's own distinct system.
It's closest cousins would be the Spartan Agoge or China under Legalism.

All developed ideologies and administrations systems require some level of social engineering.
Really Technocracy only stands out in this regard because it requires much more then most others.

Well the only group I know of is Technocracy Inc:
technocracyinc.org/

Just keep in mind that they have been intellectually dead since the death of Howard Scott.

It's just a very generic metaphor for education and can be applied to many instances, but particularly where society concerned. Plebs don't even know that the Republic is more properly translated as the Constitution and concerns how one should constitute their soul.

I like your pictures OP.

fake and gay

you all should be libertarian nationalists. its a real thing; i swear

poal.me/mztn2u

poal.me/mztn2u

poal.me/mztn2u

poal.me/mztn2u

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lsr-projekt.de/poly/ennietzsche.html

This is… beautiful

your post is an excellent allegory of how capitalists pull the wool over your eyes

You are probably the worst poster on this board. Holy shit. Actually read the things you talk about.

It's a story about how people will perceive the world based on what they know, whether its factually right or not. That's it. I don't understand why its famous or intellectual. It's just stating the obvious in a round-a-bout way.

Allegory aside,
The Republic is some pretty awesome dialectics, but I don't like the authoritarian nature of his solution state. That being said, his critiques of different systems was spot on, and we still see it in democracy today (muh champion of the people mentality)

Plato is a hack

But did he genuinely advocate for this idealized society, or was he just using it to demonstrate an idealistic society that takes justice into account?

Didn't Socrates disagree it would work because eugenics would eventually fail to stop corruption of the ruling class?

breeding*

Who we're the spookiest of them all

Isn't he often accused of being a populist?

I think Plato's original intention was to show how different philosophers are to other people, because what philosophers are saying seems like nonsense even though they are arguing over shadows. In the context of the Republic he's refering to the bickering of politics and inability for the State to incorporate the virtue of reason (he was not a big fan of democracy as you can imagine).

So by going back into the cave philosophers we're basically reentering normal society.

Fark, maybe Aristophanes was on to something when he BTFO'd him

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wew lad

wewty wew

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It's 100% true

t. reader of the Apology, Crito and Politeia

What if the cave is just another shadow and I have yet to exit the real cave?

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Marcus aurelius, lenin and many more were pholosophers

how so? when marx says "the philosophers have hitherto interpreted the world, the point is to change it" he is calling on philosophers to act on philosophy. when they did this, they assumed power, like lenin.

Gee I don't know, look at this thread.

Unlike Holla Forums, this place isn't a torture chamber. We have differing opinions on things, and just because someone disagrees with someone else doesn't mean anyone is "triggered".

I don't have a political view of it, but rather an existential one.