Dumb cape stuff

all capeshit is fanfic tier

w-wut?

...

It killed her popularity so fucking bad.

It was not good.

Why do the big two get edgy teenagers to write their comics?

Also,

Remember when somebody framed Bruce Wayne and Batman for murder, and Batman utterly refused to tell anyone he was innocent?

Good times.

Were actually decent arcs. Artemis was hot
Was funny if nothing else
Dr Light just raped her. It was Ray Palmer's wife Jean Loring who murdered her, because she wanted Ray back

Remember when Batman hired Spoiler as Robin to make Tim Drake jealous? Remember when Batman didn't tell anyone he was Matches Malone? Remember when Leslie Thompkins refused to save Spoiler's life?

...

Chuck Austen wrote it

To be fair, if they cared about what Batman Beyond fans wanted, they probably would have left Batman Beyond alone, and not done a bunch of shitty spin-off comic books written by a bunch of guys who couldn't even be bothered to watch the show it seems.

To be honest I believe Hawk and Dove was crap after they killed and replaced Don but this turned into even more convoluted bullshit after they retconed what happened to Hawk. Evil wizard on another plane of existence, Hawk was possessed, Dove with a coma pregnancy, and the baby was Doctor Fate?

All because the readers guessed who the big "hero become villain" reveal was going to be.

Even the worst that the new Batman Beyond comics offered us
Doesn't compare to the levels of stupidity in Futures End.

Then again even that isn't the worst thing to come out of DC in recent memory.

I always hated this censorship gimmick. It just looks lazy.

I'm going to cast my vote on Gwen Stacy losing her virginity to Norman Osborn. I'm glad that, nowadays, they just ignore this and pretend it didn't happen.

They aren't wearing underwear though. That's conveniently placed shadow. Granted it's not drawn the most artfully, but then again that's to be expected from an X-Men comic post '80s

If Juggernaut were wearing underwear, She-Hulk's leg wouldn't be placed over where Juggernaut's massive schlong would be

God I hated that story.

I was thinking back about JMS' run and it was actually pretty good when John Romita JR was drawing it. But when he left, though, that book turned into utter shite. The first half of JMS' run was one of few good modern comics and the second half pretty much turned into an exemplum of what's wrong with modern comics.

Speaking of dumb Spider-Man shit

While it was entertaining at some points, the premise was just dumb and it ending with a simple return to status quo with little resolution to anything and rendering the entire run just pointless. Writing this out made me realize that this could be said about most things mentioned in this thread and most comics in general these days.

You forgot the part where they completely redesigned Deimos for some reason, even though he's supposed to be the Deimos from the original Warlord series, making him unrecognizable and completely undercutting his appearance in the event.

Convergence: The event comic that was too neckbeard for casuals and too casual for neckbeards.

Spidey's robot parents
All of the people in Peter Parker's private life turning into supervillains at some point
Matt Murdock's identical twin brother
Spoiler coming back as the most titsandasstastic Batgirl ever, after being tortured with a hacksaw and power drill. What kind of torture can you do with power tools that doesn't leave you in pieces, or at least looking like Frankenstein? What did Black Mask do, exfoliate her? Play the saw really badly to annoy her? Keep her awake with noisy home renovations at odd hours?
Thug gangsta nigga Luke Cage with a gold tooth.
Tony Stark being adopted, the whole Arno Stark thing.

Remember when Batman created a satellite to kill all of his friends?

There was the bit where he kept his solutions to each Justice league member sealed in individual boxes, but managed to forget how many times sleeping gas has been effective against Wonder Woman.

How many times was it?

I think the worst part of that was when it was revealed to have been a plot by Peter's dead best friend, who died after saving his life.

And then Ted died.

What's going on here?

Booster is mad at Batman for getting Ted killed.

I can see that. How did he get Ted killed?

He discovered that Maxwell Lord had taken control of Brother Eye and was planning to kill all meta humans. So Max shot Ted in the head.

It will always be remembered as that time when the Avengers just let one of their own go off and get raped. At least when Bobbi was being raped they were constantly trying to get back to the old west to save her.

Who even knows. It's the go-to when you have to gimp a super strong character that isn't obviously immune to it.

he got better though in power girls book(i think)

That's not even scratching the surface of Convergence. The entire thing was quite literally Hell for DC fans and anyone who reads comics.

How much of this stuff was due to writers having a rape fetish or just wanting to piss on another writers previous work? I know that was the case for Big Barda and MM.

Sometimes it seems like writers are little kids on a playground and the comic characters are all toys they have to share. How accurate is that assessment?

That's a fair assessment, and sometimes the kids don't put the toys away.

Who the fuck wrote this?

I feel that the comic characters are more like a sandbox and the writers are a bunch of kindergartners

Even as a kid, I didn't really understand Hawkeye here. If a delusional cowboy had raped me, I'd have let the fucker fall, too. Bobbi did nothing wrong. Until her current series where she commits the crime of spreading boredom every issue

Steve Englehart

I recall that if Green Lantern ever goes rogue, the plan is to sneak into his apartment and hypnotize him in his sleep, and not take away his ring

Usually the writers act more like cats in a sandbox…

I don't understand what people see in Englehart. This is the same guy who created the NEW GUARDIANS.

Really? This Steve Englehart?

The reason for this is because it's very difficult to remove the ring without actually killing Green Lantern

What the fuck is going on with Daredevil's costume. Fucking 90s

He created Snowflame. He's ok in my book.

If comic book writers had grown up, they wouldn't be writing comic books. This is true for the majority of them, in America. This does not apply to Japan (where their ceiling of quality is far far lower, as opposed to America which has a superior standard for artistic endeavor, but not in comics) or Europe (where comics artists are considered to be as legitimate as movies and TV).

Why isn't his plan "Use that Yellow Lantern ring I have been gifted on several occasions"?

I had no idea that that character was Daredevil. I thought it was one of the many tacticool characters that show up, go on a no-name team, and stop existing because people forget about him.

He did that for like two issues and they fucked with it.

Englehart's work is, if nothing else, highly influential. His Batman stuff has been adapted for the Burton movies, the Nolan movies and the Animated Series. His work on Justice League was at least partially adapted for the animated series. He created Star Lord who later got used in Guardians of the Galaxy.

Because why fight him when you can disable him without much effort?

Wash away all his sins in a sea of beautiful, pure cocaine!

I like his design and name though.

Oh god.

Every time I see that page, I can't see Norman Osborn. I see pic related. I'm probably stating the obvious though.

That's cause it is Tommy Lee Jones. It's not the last time Deodato has done that, either

I still don't know how someone who has fought alongside Batman for years wouldn't suspect bat-trickery if things suddenly went to shit when you side against him, though.

?

They weren't expecting it. That was the whole point of the story

in my mind everything between "final" crisis and Flashpoint is a blur. I only remember Generation Lost and the Death cameo in a Lex Luthor story and that's it.

make up your mind.

Pff. We all know, the true solution was the Justice Buster.

And don't tell me it's less awesome than the Hulk Buster.

It seems like sneaking up on an evil green lantern in his sleep would really be the more difficult part of the plan. You could probably improvise for step 2.

Killing off Spider-Man and His Amazing Friends pissed me off worse than anything Marvel ever did, and that was pretty much a throw-away page. Still fucking mad.

Worse than destroying Leopardon almost immediately after it appeared?

Spider-Verse was a steaming pile of shit.

Leopaldon?

That was pretty bad too. It's a shame that Spider-Verse turned out to be so fucking shitty, it had some neat ideas and was a great chance to revisit other Spider-Man media, but all they wanted to do with it is use the chance to kill everything.

I only see odd pages of this from time to time, but I have no idea the reasoning behind any of it. What's even the point of killing off characters from classic Spiderman media anyway? It's not like it even matters, because there are infinite universes where those same characters didn't die, so… seriously. If they make a MvC4 are they going to pretend that Spiderman died? No, because they want that Spiderman in the game.

I don't know, it seems like people only think about trying to be shocking for their one run, and don't care about leaving fun ideas for future writers to use. Not that it will stop the next generation of writers from ignoring how shit this whole era was.

Large corporations have similar problems. When a project comes up that has regular check-up intervals, they'll front load everything to make the current interval look better, and keep doing it harder and harder until they can pass the time bomb off on someone else. Once they do, it falls apart for those other people and the irresponsible asshole(s) gets a raise for managing such a "Difficult" project so well, even though the company as a whole suffered for it.

Capwolf was pretty dumb. I mean, I loved it, but it was dumb.

just realized
oh shit, I didn't mind him as much before but oh christ

Millar is several threads worth of stupid comic moments. All of Nemesis is pure jackassery. Trouble was just… I have no idea what anyone was thinking. Who thought that was a good idea at all?

What was it?

Marvel did. They thought it would it bring in mountains of female readers, proving once again how amazingly out of touch the comic industry is.

Clearly she wasn't popular enough to keep her original ongoing afloat. The rape baby saga's real sin was sealing Carol's fate as a perpetual supporting character.

Bill Jemas (then-president) and Joe Quesada (then-EIC)?

There is so much about it that just suggest a lack of understanding about basic storytelling or appealing to ANYONE. Like the insistence that it was canon to the Ultimate Universe, and the whole fact that it's boring as fuck. And then May runs off and gets fucked by some trucker that beats her, and it's just… who would want to read this?

If you wanted to make a comic for girls, make fucking single issue, contained stuff, or actually BE INTERESTING. Who cared if May got knocked up if she's written as a boring bitch? At least show the fucking, so someone might enjoy it.

Current trends have made this into an oxymoron. You can't sell one complete story and expect people to buy more, especially when the average comic book doesn't do that well past issue #1.

Trouble?

It was basically Marvel's attempt at doing a girl's only book. It followed younger versions of Peter Parker's parents and aunt and uncle as they went around fucking each other and it was implied Peter is his Aunt May's child, not his mother's.

It was really fucking stupid and Marvel tried to pretend it never happened.

I think a lot of the reason is the writing for trades mentality. Why buy a single issue when you can just wait for the trade? It also leads to most stories feeling like they drag out too long, which was a lot of the problem with Trouble (however long that lasted).

I also don't get giving the book to Millar, who is basically Stephanie Meyer for BOYS. He has the mentality of a 13 year old who just discovered fanfiction. I can't think of a single thing he's every written that made me think "romance". Well… I guess a few moments in Authority were romantic. But he can only do guy guy romance.

Trouble was the slutty adventures of young Aunt May.

web.archive.org/web/20061123003453/http://www.newsarama.com/000aaaTrouble.htm

I think their biggest mistake was probably connecting it to Spider-Man at all.

Leaving aside the fact that one of the most endearing things about the Peter-Aunt May relationship is that she's not his mother, she's not related to him biologically and yet she still cares for him deeply, nobody wanted to see a comic where Peter's parents fuck Peter's aunt and uncle.

It raises the question of who this was meant to appeal to. Certainly not comic book fans for whom the plot was sickening and certainly not first time comic book readers for whom the characters have no fucking relevance

I'm convinced that Millar talks such a good game in person, that he'll make most anyone think that any SHIT TIER idea he has is fucking gold. And then he'll write it, and you either realized it's shit and edit it all to hell, or you just let him do whatever retarded thing he wants.

Reminds me a bit of Todd McFarlane. McFarlane can make any idea he has sound interesting. But once you see the execution you , nine times out of ten, realise you're reading shit.

Millar is a fucking crazy person.

Yeah, how could this ever have gone wrong? I mean, every great idea you have in a bar should be carried out when you're sober!

I have to assume every comic Millar has written was an idea he had at the bar.

Want to be Millar famous? Just write every drunken idea you ever get.

Yeah, I don't know if it's alcohol, but there's no way that Millar is sober when he comes up with his shitty ideas.

I think Bendis made a joke in the Ultimate Spider-Man scriptbook that how Millar writes is that he drinks himself into a diabetic coma and then wakes up to find all his scripts neatly typed on his desk.

Maybe there's a grain of truth in it

Words failed to describe how much I hate what they did to Ted.

From what I remember she was one of the most popular female heroes at the time, strong woman (not strange wymon) and all that. When I said her popularity was killed because of that I meant it was kindnaped, blindfolded, shot in the back off the head, had cement blocks tied to its feet, and thrown into the middle of the ocean. They fucked up and never truly recovered from that shit.

Their horrid attempt at a romance book. This is their first attempt after who knows how long and they got Mark "The Goddam Batman" Millar to write a romance comic. The same man who wrote "All Star Batman and Robin". Just saying, not my first choice for a teenage romance.

You're confusing Mark Millar with the vastly more famous Frank Miller

Damn, my bad.

Yeah, Frank Miller only BECAME CRAZY, Millar was born in it, molded by it.

And while I had fun with Authority, that was mostly because I never read Millar before it. Once you've read one Millar book, I can't imagine any feeling but boredom from all his other stuff. Even with as over the top as he goes, it all feels the same to me. It's like he has one set of tricks that get tired after one use. Miller has actually produced books I could still read today.

This guy is in the comics? I thought they made him up for Marvel vs Capcom.

God fucking damn it, Quesada.

WHY

(Hail Satan)
There's a lot of things that Spider-Verse shat on. For example, MVC Spidey was killed, Spidey Unlimited was killed…they didn't respect the fucking robot, killing of Spidey and his Amazing Friend…but no, 60's meme Spidey gets to live, shitty Ultimate "Monkey Noises" Spidey gets to live. There is no justice, man.

You also forget the fuck up they did to the Justice Lords in that Batman Beyond comic.

It's at this point I'd be tempted to label you a casual for getting those two confused.

Mark Millar hasn't made anything but edgelord shit

Frank Miller has seen better days, but when he was good, he was really good. Helped to revolutionise the American comic book industry along with people like Alan Moore and several others

Everything Wonder Man has worn? Come on, I like the coat and shades outfit. Also..the stuffed in the fridge happened ONCE and some folks never lived it down. Yes, it happens. Move on..it happened years ago and it was done by a bloody psychopath

I never read it, but is the only villain some shitty OC vampire guy? I mean, who gives a fuck about that kinda character? If it was a multiversal thing, is there at least a team up of different versions of Spiderman's REAL foes? You know, one of the best rogue galleries out there? How would having a bunch of Spidermans run away from one no name villain be an interesting story at all?

Guess old age finally catches up to Frank Miller. I mean, his writing works if he's writing Noir but anything else is a bit iffy to me.

Correction, it's a group of shitty OC Vampire Guy, originated from JMS's Spidey Totem arc. Seriously, JMS's Spidey run makes me wonder if he's a shitty writer, a good writer intentionally writing shit…or Quesada had a hand in this.

What part of JMS' run did you take issue with? The magic?

He's dying

Heh, I have no problem with that and I thought ASBR was pretty fun, but I it's hard not to cringe reading these descriptions made as if Miller was in the same room as Jim.

I mean, it's funny how "unprofessional" it sounds on paper.

The vampire, the Spidey in a cocoon…One More Day.

You shouldn't judge anything by their #1 sales. Those are purely speculative.

Spider-verse also completely ignored Asian animu Spider-man for fucking Spider-Gwen.

Slott already used the Sinister Six, Doc Ock, and The Green Goblin in previous arcs, so those were a no go.

Personally, I would've done INTER DIMENSIONAL SPIDER-SLAYERS. That's a classic villain nobody really uses and has a solid reason to destroy Spider-men.

The twist at the end would be that they were all made by an alternate reality Peter Parker out to remove the curse of Spider-man from the multiverse.

Oh….dear. Sorry to hear that.

A lot of comic strips are like this. Not exactly like this, but the writer tends to talk 'to' the artist - when they know who the artist is going to be.

Those were both Quesada. Especially One More Day

Wasn't a bad story. Of course, then they brought him back and you can imagine how that went

When I said 'strips' I meant 'scripts'

He recovered a bit, he's dying a lot less these days.

That sounds like a much better idea. Like the whole idea seems like it would logically be a celebration of all the different versions of Spiderman, so what kind of idiot thinks that senseless, unheroic deaths for all those different versions of Spiderman would be entertaining? Especially when some of those versions are arguably MORE POPULAR than the modern comic version.

Yeah, but he still looks about 80 when he's only 59

Hell, some of them grew up with those versions of Spidey. Yes..even the Hostess Fruit Pies Spidey. Seriously, I wonder if Dan Slott really hates fun.

Too many horse.

Kindergartners, cats, they both piss and shit in the sand

The Art Nigger issue of Elementals (Bill Willingham in general. Wasn't he the one who killed Spoiler?)
Millar's Nemesis, or anything by Millar
Giving Spitfire a steel body
Giving Steel a steel body
Alicia the skrull
Psylocke running around booting people in the head when she has ESP.
Peter punching Mary Jane when the writer told the artist to draw him shoving her
Maxwell Lord going full psycho
Can anyone work out Wonder Girl or Hawkman's origin?
Tom DeFalco writing anything
Spikey Ben Grimm

"I don't condone death as an answer for anything! Now excuse me, I'm gonna go kill Bruce Banner."

Eh, he's always been on and off. I loved his Batman with Marshall Rogers, I hated his Fantastic Four. Why does he write as "John Harkness", anyway? He trying to get two paycheques?

John Harkness is his Cordwainer Bird.

I must disagree. When he wrote Spider-Man he was pretty good. Not as good as Roger Stern, but pretty good.

You mean like how Hank Pym wasn't actually supposed to hit his wife but when the mistake was made it became a thing that always managed to come up.

Yeah, except that no one actually mentions Peter hitting his wife. Partially because he's Spider-Man and partially because it was the Clone Saga and people just want to forget.

Also, adding Peter Parker being molested to the list of dumb comic shit

Even though Hank was off his rocker at the time, so much so that he made an alternate identity as Yellowjacket..and people still can't get over that a man not in his right mind at the time backhanded his wife.

And that's not even taking into account that Jan is a kind of a cunt.

Just look at what Millar did with it

Killed muh Ted
Such bullshit man
I'm still mad

Didn't Jaime time travel and saved him though? Or did I miss something?

Well, Jaime, Dan, Booster and some future Blue Beetle guy did save Ted…except it got a lot worse. As in the whole world is overrun with OMACs and their only hope is a resistance force led by Hawkman and Green Arrow, who constantly argues.

I feel like people don't get Nemesis. It seems to me a parody of Death Note/Xanatos schemes and Sherlock Holmes/Batman type minds who know all the obscure facts to put together to figure out the riddles. It's supposed to be stupid that everything was calculated years in advance. In before "ironic shitposting etc etc." I get that, but it just seems that if we take Nemesis less seriously, we might be able to laugh at it, instead of getting bent out of shape.

I meant "laugh with it," the Freudian slips are real.

I know it's not technically cape shit per say, but I really cannot stand Ennis' The Boys, it comes off as super hypocritical because Ennis wrote for the characters he's meant to be "parodying" in this series at one point in his career.

Plus the entire series can be summed up as "I hate superheros because they're all terrible people" even though ever single fucking character Ennis has ever written is an edgy asshole.

Oh, we get that, but it's just not nearly as interesting as any of the stuff you just mentioned. Deathnote works because the schemes are absurd, but they level of sense about them that allows it to work. Code Geass takes that same idea of super scheming to another level, and it works. Because both works have interesting characters that help the scenario FEEL real, even if you're laughing at Light eating potato chips. Even if it's stupid most of the time, characters like Light, L and Lelouch all make the absurdity of their plans feel logical, even if they're not. And characters like Light's dad or Lalouch's sister give her protag and supporting characters characters to look out for look up to.

In comparison, Nemesis is a complete failure. THERE ARE NO CHARACTERS. Nemesis has all the personality of a self insert, the police chief isn't built up enough as a character to make you care if he's a hypocrite or not. The chief's entire family is also worthless non-characters. There's just no real hook except to see how bad it gets, it's a complete failure of writing.

So no, I don't feel there is some secret level where Nemesis "just clicks". It's unsatisfying except as a cringefest. The fucking edgy thread it was last posted in saw it completely overshadowed in quality by a long running furry comic. That's how poor a writer Millar is. He's a joke that's funny one time, but after that, you already know the punchline.

All british writers get pissed at capes eventually, normally after writing them for years. I think some have an initial fascination with it, and then a backlash that comes out in works like this. It probably comes from some key differences between American and brit culture, but I'm not learned enough it everything british to detail exactly what.

Books like this tend to come off as a writer's ranting meltdown, that they had someone draw and then they charge you a cover price to read it. I don't really see the appeal, but some people like that kinda thing.

I hate all books with the premise of being capeshit but if capes were complete fucking assholes. It might have been novel the first time, but it's been fucking trite since the second or third time it was done and that has long sense passed. I also hate books with amoral assholes being the protagonists. In what little I've read of it, the Boys has managed to tick both boxes as hard as possible. If a story is just a bunch of dickbags being edgy and running around and killing another bunch of edgy dickbags, there is no one to support. Black and Black morality is trash in fiction.

I'll also add that a lot of the fun in a "scheme book" is the description of the scheme. Even when the likelihood of the plan is borderline impossible, Light or Lelouch gives some explanation, step by step, that eases you along to how it all worked out, and there is a "Ah ha!" feeling to it. This is why things like this or detective novels work.

Nemesis? It might as well be magic. When he breaks everyone out of prison, there is no explanation for how he parked hundreds of sports cars in the parking lot, or how he fought all the guards. It's lazy, there is nothing to satisfy a reader. I'm left to assume that Millar is an actual idiot unable to think of clever ways to make any of the schemes happen. It's just "I boobytrapped your daughter's womb!" which doesn't even have an emotional impact because, again, she's not a character. So we have no characters, we have no clever schemes, there is no reason to be invested in any of it at all. It's a chore to read, and I'm sure Millar was patting himself on the back for thinking it up.

Millar needs a good editor to fix his shitty ideas, and that doesn't happen anymore because he's a "big name". I expect nothing or worth from him ever again. I remember how shit his Ultimate Red Skull story was, where he, for some reason, completely ruins anything left of the villain in the last 2 pages, basically further ruining an already stupid story. He's actually more of a hack then Bendis, and I don't say that lightly.

Hmm, you are totally right. Everybody was just talking about how it was this awful garbage experience, but I couldn't stop laughing when the cop knew they'd attack the Pentagon because of numerology. You're right though, I forgot about the booby-trapped womb in the middle of the family drama, and how little it mattered. That's uh, that's my bad.

so thats where sam wilson got the werewolf cap idea from.

Edgy Harley beating the shit out of Ivy and burning her greenhouse
Edgy Riddler cutting question marks into himself and kidnapping babies
Edgy Mad Hatter as a kiddy diddler
Putting Erik Larsen on Aquaman as a fuck you to Peter David
What the hell is all that stuff on Cable's costume? Canonically has he ever even used any of it? Are those shotguns holstered on his back? From the rear they have no triggers and just kind of taper away. You'd think he'd be like Batman with his utility belt and have a gadget for everything, with all the tactical gear and pouches, but all he does is shoot things, and ESP. Is all that gear just dummies that grow out of his Techno-organic STD that Apocalypse gave him?
Is that a pistol on Shatterstar's belt? Liefeld never drew it with enough detail to tell. It looks like he's reaching for it when Cable knocks him out in his first appearance, but it's never mentioned again. It just seems weird that Sword Guy has a pistol he never uses.
SHIELD was Hydra alllll aloooong

Every single fucking thing about this abortion of a comic.

I hate Mark Millar, he's a 15 year old in a grown man's body. He thinks that being an edgy asshole is entertaining and this book is living proof why Millar should never be allowed to write anything ever again.

The concept is pretty cool, a world being secretly ruled by super villains but the main character is such an unlikable fucking cunt that it's impossible to give a fuck about anything he does, not to mention every other character is an immoral sack of shit with no redeeming qualities whatsoever.

so who's worse Mark Millar, Warren Ellis or Garth Ennis?

Not him, but I've really liked some stuff by Ellis (though I guess I should finished Planetary someday). I haven't read enough Ennis stuff to have a huge opinion of him either way, but that is honestly by choice. I'd say Millar is the worst because Ellis and Ennis can write stories that at least feel somewhat different. Millar just churns out the same edgelord shit, and I don't think he understands basics of writing. It's not like the other two who might have a classic british fit about cape comics, Millar just feels unskilled.

Millar gets easy movie deals because his comics are interesting enough pitches, and some Hollywood writer will edit it into something watchable most of the time. A decent writer could turn every one of Millar's stories into something at least readable, but it's not something he's capable of without direction.

Millar's way worse than those other two

Invisible Woman's stripperiffic costume with the 4 cut out over her tits.
Iron Fist getting shaken to death by Captain Hero while he was meditating.
John Byrne cucking Mr. Miracle. John Byrne having loli Sue Storm creeping on college age Reed. John Byrne knocking up 12 year old Next Men. John Byrne having Lex Luthor spank it to a VHS of 15 year old Lois Lane being strip searched by his amazon bulldyke guards. John Byrne having old Superman making out with jailbait Lana Lang.
Savage Dragon's gang bang. Gang bangs.
JOHN BYRNE MASTER PANDEMONIUM WITH BABIES FOR HANDS!
Mr. A. Guy comes off as a fucking psychpath, I always end up rooting for the villains just because they have actual personalities and he doesn't.
John Byrne constantly apologising for Doctor Doom. OH DR. DOOM IS THE RIGHT GUY FOR LATVERIA
Assholes ignoring two years of character an art development for two years of Alan Davis' Excalibur, and going right back to drawing Kurt as a weed and Kitty as a little girl.
Marvel digging up Elektra and Howard The Duck again and again.
Jesus showing up in Ghost Rider
John Byrne trying to reboot Doom Patrol

Did anyone else notice when Byrne was scripting X-Men, he had Bishop waffling on about "The history records don't mention Angel ever having metal wings!". At the time he was very vocal in how much he hated Archangel and how he wanted to take the X-Men back to the Lee-Kirby lineup and status quo. Even when he's only scripting, he's got to try and re-write everyone else's shit.

seems like Byrne's got a thing for underage girls. Did he ever fug an underage girl.

Without Mr A, we wouldn't have Rorschach

I LIKE Rorschach, I could be friends with Rorschach, but Mr. A is the kind of comic Rorschach would write.

what about The Question didn't he start out as an Objectivist character by Steve Ditko.

He's literally insane

The only real difference between the two is that Rorschach is more sympathetic because we know he had a hard life. If we didn't know that, they'd be exactly the same.

Steve Ditko's analysis: 'He's like Mr A, except he's insane' was pretty much spot-on, ironically

Rorschach isn't insane, he simply tries to embody the moral absolutism of a Ditko or a Mr. A in a world that ISN'T WRITTEN TO MAKE HIM RIGHT ALL THE TIME.
In fact the whole series was written as Moore's statement on Objectivism's black and white morality. Watchmen was written to break Rorschach.

...

Let's do a sequel to a story that was meant to reboot our universe and have a bunch of characters randomly die for no real reason!

Superboy Prime continuity punch.

And yet, Rorschach is right throughout Watchmen.

There's probably a deep moral message behind the idea that the character who is objectively correct is treated as a lunatic, but then Dr Manhattan went and created the DC Universe, so fuck the author's intent.

...

I feel your pain.

Oh, how could I forget.
Let it be known that even Batman & Fucking Robin did Mr. Freeze better than the New 52.

...

Yeah, that's true, that sucks.

But on the other hand, they made the best friggin Riddler.

Sounds about right. He's a superhero serial killer when he's not snarfing twinkees.

Mr. Freeze, like most things from the cartoons, always gets the shit end of the stick.

Remember Lazara? Who the fuck thought that was a good idea?

You need to read more comics.

JEEZ yeah, I hated that. X-23, first part of the story. She's a social autist psycho, noone expects she'd be the killer because she looks like a regular girl.

Sequel story: She looks like a whore.

The more I read this thread, the more I hate the Marvel comic universe.

>best anything

How do characters come up with stupid hero or villain names that spontaniously?

I like it when the name the press gives them becomes their hero or villain name.

How about no, because I fucking hate all that continuity bullshit. The only thing I can stand are one-shots and New52 Capullo/ Snyder collective works. Besides Hush and No Man's Land, there's nothing left I'm interested in.

wew
Boy did you pick the wrong fucking hobby.

No one at Marvel RESPECTS the Mecha. Leopardon gets downed in one shot, Sp//dr gets chucked to the wayside (I'll ignore the NGE reference since that's the only damn thing Western writers can apparently come up with when it comes down to Japanese mecha..seriously, at least Tartakovsky has the balls to reference Getter Robo)

I fucking loved this film. It was dumb as hell but it was just dumb wacky fun with all the trick shots and superhuman feats.

Anyone got images of that? I can't find it.

...

Are you fucking kidding me?

Good merciful lord why…

This whole thread has made me dead inside when it comes to the big two. I knew they were trash already but everything I've seen through this thread… it's broken me.

Wasn't it said that when they adapt Millar's comics to movies they write out a bunch of stupid shit he put in? I know both Kickass movies did omit alot of weird edgy shit he put in. Like how in the movie Red Mist actually does grow to like Kickass but in the comic he hated him all along and even admitted to fucking masturbating to the thought of killing him. Same in the sequel where Red Mist guns down kids and plans to bomb NYC but in the movie Red Mist isn't that level of edgy evil and more just a distraught kid with money lashing out.

I also felt Nemesis is movie bait. It could PROBABLY work but they will have to just have it attached in name only then rewrite the entire damn thing.

I don't recall Megas making a single NGE reference.

To be fair, there were other anime references.

Cartoons are a different animal. You have a broader culture there than in comics.

I feel like there needs to be a term for authors who cram too many overt references and "easter eggs" with absolutely no subtlety.

Like, there's a hidden joke, and then there's pointing directly at the joke and winking repeatedly at the audience.

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At least the nigger has taste.

Wasn't that the comic that had Hitler taking magical shits a plot point? Mark Miller has a scat fetish I swear. Literal Shit appease in his works too much.

I miss the humor duo.

It's because the fat middle aged out of touch fucks who write capeshit desperately want to appeal to the vastly larger audience of manga so they throw in these hairbrained references.

That ship sailed over a decade ago.

For what reason…?

When was this horseshit put out?

You gotta be open to the idea that single pages with no context posted like this are shops. Notice how every other fucking thing in this thread that the posters want you to know as much about how fucking retarded something is, give you a frame of reference you could look into and find more info? Not here. Just a single image, no text, leading file name… and the poster never came back to say who to blame this page on (I mean, first guess would be a story from Batman Black & White, right?).

It's not hard to change the text on a page. Some faggot OP posted a page of Dr. Doom and Dracula talking about Muslims a few weeks ago and idiots bought it. I mean, why the fuck would an encounter between Dr. Doom and Dracula from like SEVEN YEARS AGO, have shit to do with Muslims? It wouldn't. But people are easily trolled, and photoshop is easy to us.

So if you see something that looks purposefully angering, but no one can tell you the context, it's probably fake. Hell, if it's not fake, a lot of people will post pages out of context for maximum "clickbait bullshit", because they want attention. This is how we feed autistic fucks like Hijinks, and we all need to be better than that. If something looks too convenient, you have to at least be wary of it. I'm calling fake as fuck until a source is found.

Image search usually finds the original.

Capes are usually about tn years behind what's popular. Marvel did Disco Dazzler in the 80's.

They did their attempt to appeal to weebs about ten years ago.

Sounds like somebody isn't completely dead inside! Well, we can fix that: readcomics.tv/batman/chapter-44/21

See, all you had to do was say "It was a Scott Snyder story".

I still stand by what I said, it is the type of thing people need to be wary of.

denofgeek.com/us/books-comics/dracula/214616/dracula-vs-the-marvel-universe-14-times-the-lord-of-the-undead-fought-superheroes

marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Captain_Britain_and_MI-13_Vol_1_10

0-2 It seems. Remember, Muslim apologists have had an axe to grind since 2001.

Hmmm, interesting. I don't see why that OP didn't explain anything if it was on the level, he must have just been a lazy faggot.

I looked up Paul Cornell, because I've always wondered if "please Muslim woman, you'll be the best Captain Britain ever!" was written by a pathetic American, or a pathetic Brit. For those who were also curious: He's fucking British. I wonder how he feels about that shit now.

But seriously, Muslims? That shit is beneath Dracula. If he wanted them dead, they should just be dead. Because he's fucking DRACULA.

Probably the same reason he can't just wipe out Christianity, religious symbols of any faith burn his ass.

but symbols of satan shouldn't do anything to him, so how would mudslimes defend themselves?

convert to Christianity.

BEHOLD! The real reason that comics in the later era's kept getting shittier along with the politics involved:

1) Understand the socio-sexual hierarchy : alphagameplan.blogspot.ca/2011/03/socio-sexual-hierarchy.html / archive.is/keV9E I know it's shocking to read at first, but it will place some shit in perspective. And keep in mind that those spots are not permanent anybody can move up and down the ranks if they so choose.

2) Now consider what Vox is suggesting here: archive.is/7ML4x / voxday.blogspot.de/2016/09/a-tale-of-two-structures.html

alphagameplan.blogspot.ca/2016/09/gamma-fantasy-novel-one.html / archive.is/2z7GY
alphagameplan.blogspot.ca/2016/09/delta-story-one.html / archive.is/eLzhQ

He's talking about the notion that most adventure stories used to follow the Delta Conceits for storytelling, events being earned, healthy sexual politics included. But most SJW's and shit writers are pretty much gamma ranking females and males so that's what you're seeing when the edges in a story get way too sharp.

So discuss.

You're the lazy faggot. You called bullshit "until proof is found" rather than look it up yourself.

So basically you're saying it wasn't that bad because it branched off from something that was terrible. Trying to make Juggs into a nice guy was awful. Shulkie fucking him was just the exclamation point on that big pile of terrible that is easy to point to and talk about.

Man, the tragedy is that this is almost a good story. Too bad Snyder was bent on putting his politics into it.

So they used nonsensical shit to divert attention from general shit? That's like deciding to break a slightly cracked windshield instead of repairing it.

i love miller

Does it explain why comics have been getting steadily worse since 1986, or are you just talking about sjw crap?

Comics have gotten steadily worse since 1986 because, in their shortsighted greed, they invested more resources into the niche Direct Market than keeping ties to newsstands and other distribution sources. This lead to mainstream comics changing their product to appeal to this market, which ostracized their average joe readership and created the degraded medium we have today.

Look, man, I just really like Juggernaut, the same way I like Eddie Brock/Venom. Having him not get shat on constantly and giving him a more rounded character was nice for me. You know how they say "You either die a hero or live long enough to become a villain"? I think it's part of a general principle of humanity. As you grow, you move towards the center. Criminals get tired of losing, being hated by society, or looking over their shoulder and seek another route, heroes become frustrated with the weak justice system or the inability of law abiding action to bring about a fair conclusion.

If you don't think it should be like that, then blame the fact that Marvel never lets stories end. At this point, I've seen the classic heroes and villains butt heads in almost every conceivable combination, with various motives and schemes. We are past the arch, mythic stories. I'll take "Juggernaut grows as a person and gets a job" over "Juggernaut rampages for the fiftieth time and the X-men struggle at first, then coordinate, then overcome him." Put some fresh meat on the chopping block and let the old guys retire.

I agree with everything else you're saying, but people don't say this. It was a line from The Dark Knight movie.

Sorry for not being clearer and saying, "You know the concept demonstrating that over time, negative consequences will accumulate, causing a shift in character, because humans are an adaptive species? You may have heard this summed up by the Nolans in the snappy quote, 'You either die a hero…etc. etc.'"

Onslaught was retarded, but the fun kind of retarded. Like AU material kinda garbage, fun to 'what if' but stupid to make canon.

Wait, is Onslaught still canon?

We don't speak of that filth here.

All I can remember about Onslaught is he was created because Professor X had a crush on Jean Grey when she was a teenager. Yeah, it's that fucking retarded.

What? I thought Onslaught was about Xavier achieving his maximum potential while in the mindset of "Magneto was right." That's why he looks like Magneto, yeah?

I always liked Onslaught because I only knew him from MvC, I thought he was a tokusatsu-fication of Magneto, which seemed pretty novel.

Prof. X being in love with Jean goes back to the Lee/Kirby days.
IIRC, Onslaught was some kind of ill-defined headsick that got into Xavier's head when he psychically erased Magneto's mind.

That actually didn't happen. You should check your Alzheimer though.

I found it! This is a thing that every writer since Stan Lee has ignored. I don't recall it having anything to do with Onslaught, though, unless someone did some retconning?
Hehe, I think canonically, she went on dates with everyone in the original team before Cyclops manned up.

...

And what a fucking joke that was.

Mainstream comics must've thought manga was a passing fad. That's the only logical reason they let it eat up so much of their market unopposed.

Don't encourage spergs, mock them

Looks like something from one of those "learn to draw manga" books.

That looks more like a bad shojo manga.

Edgy Hatter best Hatter.

It's at least true to his source material *cough*

...

Wasn't there a Red Onslaught recently? So I guess he's canon.

You know, I wish I could draw my shitty designs that well. It really distracts from how terrible the character looks. Seriously, if Marvel or DC would draw Sonichu, people would probably suddenly think it's genius.

Who was that character who was spawned from some show about costume designers?

Back then, and correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't Prof. X not actually meant to be THAT MUCH older than the rest of them? I mean, he was just bald and crippled at a pretty young age.

I'm surprised Byrne didn't push to bring that back up, but then again, he had Kitty Pryde to fawn over.

Mangaverse was basically the Ultimate Universe done on a microscale. A handful of titles, some good, some crap, and then an almost Ultimatum tier finale that killed off anything of interest.

DC did their own "manga inspired" thing for a bit, too, right? I never really get this, if they want the manga market, they should just hire japanese creators to make manga with their characters (which has been done in the past).

I actually liked some of these. At least the Spider ninja one.

what exactly is so terrible about it compared to other capeshit designs?

I don't remember, but there was something about his "bad think" about Jean manifesting into some super evil or some crap. I can barely remember because this was the arc that killed off my interest in X-Men, primarily because they used it to whore a bunch of Marvel Universe retards instead of actual mutants. X-Men is better when it's self contained.

Easier said than done. Hiring freelancers to come up with a manga pastiche instead of actual mangaka doing the real deal would probably be easier and cheaper from an editorial standpoint.

I may have spent a fucking hour looking for that edit an user did of Jean using her powers to turn iceman gay just to find nothing but, my main point is I wouldn't trust psychic bitches. They play mind games like real women.

kind of like Emma Frost then.

Manga X-Men was pretty good.
Manga Spider-Man, the original 70's one by the Crying Freeman guy, was God Tier.

That is the best head-canon. The funny thing is that if it turned out to be true, Marvel would probably treat it like a good thing. Like she's helping him grow as a person, because being something other than heterosexual is more worthy in this ass-backwards society.

I think she mentally fucked with Cyclops.

...

I thought that was canon.
Some marriage counsellor, lol.

Azbats was always intended as a temporary thing to show what Batman isn't (or at least that's what the writer's claim) which is an OK storytelling idea.

Do I even want to know what this is?

DC universe online actually manages to salvage a half-decent plot from that.

Sadly only half-decent, but that's better than expected.

Fuck you. Spider-Girl was great.

fuck off

wasn't keen.
too many repeated dialogues followed up by a "Wow!"

fuck off

Jean looks like she's dying inside in that first panel.

Actually it was probably better that you weren't since Holla Forums was fucking awful anyways.

Yes, you do.

You don't seem to understand how imagesearch works.

It's interesting to note that almost everything that made Azbats "Not Batman" has been accepted wholeheartedly into the character. The only thing missing is the belt fed baterang shooters.

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magical

Like what? Batman never killed anyone

Terry has those

Spock was so awesome.

Neither did Azbats. He just didn't save someone.

Indeed he was

We'd call this intent

He was the reason Black Cat turned from a lovely cat thief to a shitty mobster trying to be female Kingpin and failing horribly.

Is it?

Yes

He said 'Do it Abbatoir - take you best swing. But it won't matter…you're already dead' i.e 'I'm going to kill you'.

Then he pushed Abbatoir into the vat with the aim of killing him. The fact that Abbatoir then managed to grab one of the chains and survive for a bit longer is immaterial.

Even including the schizophrenic episode, AzBats' intent to kill was clear. A court would see it as murder, not manslaughter or even accidental death

Speaking of Black Cat, anybody reminder when Kevin Smith wrote a mini series in which she got raped?

This turns me on.

The same mini that taken years to get another issue?

Yeah, I remember.

Also to add to this user's point.

Abbatior was holding a kid hostage and when Abbatior taken that plunge the kid died as well since only Abbatior knew where the fuck he was in the first place.

It wasn't a child. It was his cousin.

Wew fuck me then.

good excuse but fuck off

Took years to finish and was so shit that in retrospect it was probably best Kevin Smith didn't finish it.

Bitch is too tall for Spock's taste.

The only woman in Peter's life for Ock is aunt May.

Curing Dr Doom and having him be a generic suit wearing bad guy.

Also the art looked ugly as fuck
Everything was so edgy that nothing offended me. It was so FanFiction-tier edgy, except for that hamster. That part was disgusting.
And don't forget those progressive brownie points(poz loads)

I have never liked when they bold the names of famous characters using their "logos" instead, like in that page. While I read it, it feels as if you suddenly found a (tm) symbol while reading the name. It just feel so forced

Capeshit is below contempt. No point in trying to decide which pieces of shit smell worse than the others.

Was it at least heavily implied, or did they merely talk about it in speech bubbles?

So what would YOU recommend, darling?

what a hack

I don't know which one they did, that's why I'm asking. But it's comics, so I'm assuming they just talk about it.

If it wasn't shown in graphic, pornographic detail, it's cowardice

I prefer it when they show it, but don't show actual penetration. Make your mind work for the lewd.

'I was raped and that's why I burgle people'

...

I never noticed this before (because it's been years since I read this piece of shit) but Smith actually quoted the debunked '1 in 4 statistic'.

It's a good thing Smith is too fucking lazy to write more comics. Who knows what manner of cancer he might have unleashed on the medium if he could actually be bothered to finish his scripts.

All that time to finish the book and that's all anyone will remember from it. Peter should have opened up to her about being molested right after. Just spend the rest of the issue on their sexual abuse experiences.

I don't know about much of Kevin Smith's comic work. I mean, I read his Daredevil run like everyone else, and enjoyed it, but even that could have been trimmed down a fair bit.But then again, I'm sure he was told to aim for the trades instead of each issue.

I remember shelving a comic I was working on because I wasn't sure if my use of rape in the plot was good enough. Maybe I'll go back to it someday, it would at least be better than this.

It really would have been better that he didn't finish it. I mean, he said 'It's better story than it would have been if I finished it back in '04' but it really isn't.

It's almost uniformly terrible. Like pretty much all his other work, as it happens.

I know he had Batman shit his pants once.

...

He had Batman pee his pants. He made it canon that Batman peed his pants in Batman: Year One.

He also gave The Joker a beard made out of pubes.

why does Doom look like a mix of Rand Paul and Justin Trudeau?

when did he do this?

You didn't stop liking her because she was raped, did you?

Because he's based on an actor that looks like that. An actor that doesn't look much like any old representations of Doom.

Raped goods is useless goods.

I honestly can't see the connection

which actor is that user?

Somewhere along the path from jovial and wise cracking Femme Fatale/ Fallen heroine to degenerate slut. Now I see she's a mouth piece for SJW rape culture nonsense.

What about Kevin Smith's Green Arrow run?

See pic

Vincent Cassel comes to mind when he's "drawn" by Dedato Jr.

Well, I guess you can't like most Marvel characters anymore.

Or big 2 in general
Cuz they suck
Not that guy though

…Clearly he ripped off her fucking head. What kind of question is that? Why not "you killed her, you monster!" or "I'll make you pay for what you did to her!"

I can't believe that's real.

The real answer is that all of capeshit is fucking stupid and cringy for anyone who isn't a developmentally retarded manchild. I mean, you have all these people in idiotic costumes full of primary colors like a play by a special needs class, with stupid punny aliases flying around and getting into moronic punch-ups with similarly garishly-costumes freaks. Even actual children shun the retardation that is capeshit. That alone should tell you something.

You sure showed us

user is just very shy. This is the only way he could express himself. He'll be back the next thread that hits bump limit.

It's called being older than fucking five and realizing that faggots in pyjamas shooting cosmic lasers at each other is fucking stupid.

ya thats why i only like batman, hes the bet without any powers

I only come here to keep tabs on how bad things have gotten.