Free Education

tax from the corporations that have been dodging tax for the past century

More taxes does not necessarily correlate into more of that tax money being redirected toward education. More likely than not, it will be used to line the pockets of the government and private entities.

I thought you were asking for a socialist perspective.

The increased tax revenue from the increased salaries of newly skilled workers.

Just make sure you're actually giving educations in industries that increase salaries, standards of living, and tax revenue, so vocational schooling and tech.

If the idea is that certain kinds of skill acquisition and education are good investments, but limited because of barrier of capital requirement, you front the capital to make best use of an otherwise underutilized resource, and recoup the costs on average later on, now that the output is greater than the input.

You know, the same way private college loans from banks would work, except averaged out instead of a case-by-case basis and not given out for garbage investments with no return on investment.

Free education in our current system is completely out of touch with the needs of most of the working class, and simply shifts financial burden from the wealthy parents of college students at elite institutions to blue collar workers whose kids can't get near those institutions. It would be great in an ideal socialist society, in our current state it's a disaster, it's just another layer of exploitation while further propagating the capitalization of one of porky's biggest money makers - "education."

What part of "the wealthy aren't paying their fair share of taxes" aren't you getting?

The bourgeoisie through hard labour in the Gulags, of course. Are you a goddamn revisionist or something?

He said his planned Wall St. Speculation Tax will cover the cost.

First of all, he's planning on making public colleges free, not fucking Ivy League schools. Secondly, want to take a wild guess as to why those kids can't get into those institutions?
Stop this bullshit meme. Education is vital for everyone.

taxes aka theft

and what after the taxes are spent and/or stop accumulating?

go to bed Stefan.

what after taxes are spent? what then? how will you create new ones?

I'm dead fucking serious.

This is why 'Murica has to die.
Cause you people are idiots.

Do you want a nation? You need a state. To have a state, you need Taxes. You don't want taxes? Well.. Somalia doesn't have taxes… The markets are free there…

About "how to social services" have a look at Europe. Oh, wait.. 'Murica has been enforcing neoliberalism here too… hmm….

Well! I guess we need to make the world shit, for you not to pay taxes then!

The great part about taxes is that they are received constantly because people make and spend money constantly.

America needs more trade schools. Turning everyone into an academic is unfeasible, especially if you create a surplus of useless degrees.

Why do you need more "trade schools" when you send all your industry to china?

'Murica needs to stop being a neoliberal shithole, dragging the world down with it.

You mean like billionaires who make their fortunes off the sweat and labor of workers while never doing honest work in their lives?

In order to stop sending all the industry to China. Germany still has a fair amount of export industry. The only way to make offshoring low end jobs would work is being able to embargo educations so they also couldn't get the design and management level jobs.

THIS IS THE FUNNIEST THING I'VE HEARD IN YEARS!

Germany is based on, for example, southern europe, buying it's products, and now that the economy fails in other parts of the world, it has noone to buy them.
Same with China.

Controlling the movement of capital is both a requirement, and on some level possible. Saying otherwise is admitting the capitalist who controls the movement of capital will eternally hold sway over you.

Even monetarist Friedman agrees that trade deficits can lead to the foreign control of assets, in other words, transfer of capital. Capital is required for industry and a high standard of living.

Ok, so you agree the Neoliberalism is destroying the world…
And you want to go back to the 50s or something?

Cause, you do know, capitalism has crisis, becouse too much production, not enough buying power, products end up in stock and cannot be sold because no profit, part of production has to be destroyed, "let's go to war", right?

This is the result of an imperfect market. A functional market would set prices for goods at an equilibrium between buying power and production output. The ability to wage war and expand into new markets distorts the price setting mechanisms.

Yes, I think markets are okay, as long as you reduce the effects of the ownership of capital on them, and the supply side is more about providing uncoerced labor than having capital and reduce perverse incentives. Fight me.

Why are you radio silent, when taxes are spent on military or subsidising corporations, nuclear plants and farmers?

I don't need to fight anybody.
It's your choise not seeing beyond ideology.
You only have to look at 1929.

And Marx was saying this shit 200 years ago.
It's nothing new.
Capitalism has inherit contradictions.

Sorry if this doesn't agree with your Ideology, but it's true.

There can be no such thing as a "perfect market".

The government through taxation.

Right wingers know this, but I don't get why they think this is such a crowning argument against free university.

This is ironic.

You do realize capitalism is about the private ownership of capital, hence the name capitalism. Markets are a price setting mechanism that balance can supply and demand.

Capitalism is not markets. Markets are not capitalism. Learn the difference, it could save you from pure ideology.

There's no such thing as a perfect way of distributing goods even if there's an overabundance of surplus. The dichotomy of perfect and imperfect has been debated for centuries as a theological issue. The world isn't perfect. You are making the perfect the enemy of the good. If you want perfection go crusade or Jihad or something and go to heaven.

The inherent contradictions stemmed mostly from the degeneration of labor into the commodity of simple labor-time due to competition, which only happens because there is a muh privileged class to take advantage of it, and the increasing importance of ownership of capital in determining the distribution of profits.

Free education, without the requirement of capital investment, turns menial labor-time into skilled labor. Capital investment goes to those who can make good use of it, rather than those who already have capital by virtue of them owning capital.

A welfare state that provides basic necessities allows a worker to strike indefinitely without concern for meeting his needs and supporting his livelihood, making all labor non-coercive, and helping to balance the negotiating power of labor. It also reduces the need for minimum wage because costs of living are already a societal sunk cost.

Competition is only an evil when it leads to the unproductive subversion of other enterprises.

The market isn't at the center of the contradictions, ownership of capital is.

It's all you ideologue's fault for confusing markets with capitalism that is why self-proclaimed socialist states have hard times managing their economies.

the government, by issuing currency. learn MMT.

Is the current system not Capitalism?
Is there any point in "What markets are" since we the system is not feudalism or merchantilism?

No, but there is always a better one than the current one.

Fixed.

THIS IS TOP KEK!

AKA I have no idea what wellfare is and how it works.

AKA always.

The means of production in Capitalism is Capital.
In Feudalism is land.
In Classical Antiquity is slave ownership.

Historical Marxism 101.

It doesn't mater if you say "there is a better capitalism, this capitalism doesn't work well, but we can make it work".
Capitalism is the system we have today.
Capitalism is controling the markets.
Capitalism is doomed to bring crisis, war and destruction.

You cannot have infinite profit.
Education is for the benefit of society.
If you try to profit from social nessecities, you mess up society.
You mess up education, prisons, armies, water, electirity, communications, roads.. .. AKA '21 century 'Murica.

LONG LIVE NEOLIBERALISM! THE DESTROYER OF OUR WORLD!

...

Did you even read the Adam Smith parts in your red books? Even Smith wrote back in his day the effect of economic muh privilege (capital) in distorting markets. Markets can still exist without the private ownership of capital.

But it doesn't count unless its your one. And "better capitalism" doesn't count either, right?

No, they stem from capital. More specifically the private ownership of capital. That's why the book is called Das Capital.

THIS IS NO ARGUMENT!

Just because it doesn't fit your strict definition of what you think welfare means?

No not always.

Yes. The issue that leads to contradictions is that it is privately owned by individuals who do not share common interests with other individuals.

muh dialectics

Yes, I get that you're a raging Marxist and "Viva la revolucion" etc

And?

Yes, it does have that net effect.

Considering most of these necessities have relatively inelastic demand, they could easily produced as non-scarcity levels, and be provided with current industrial output and a welfare state.

Problems with these industries, mostly has to do with perverse incentives and market distortions such as barriers to entry, natural and de facto monopolies and require checks and balances.

But you're one of those Marxists that thinks everything is going to fix itself under communism, huh? Yes, yes, if they don't follow your interpretation of red books word for word, they're a reactionary revisionist sheeple scum piggy puppet, because Marxism has never been tried. Yes yes, I know how this argument goes.

I find it amazing how people don't realize ownership is a social construct and not a natural right, and the result of social contract, which is why possession is 9/10ths of the law.

GANGSTER COMPUTER GOD COMMUNIST CLOSED SOCIETY NUCLEAR WAR WITH ALL ALIEN EMPIRES THANKS TO EARPHONE RADIO SLAVE-MASTERS' PLAN FOR UNIVERSAL CONTROL

10/10 post, though to be fair the post you were ragging on is some incoherent retard spouting jargon he doesn't understand while thinking that markets are unique to capitalism and/pr incompatible with socialism

really wish there were more socialists like you

as to OP, sanders has proposed a financial transactions tax to pay for free tuition at public schools, though i wish his platform also included more promotion of trade schools and apprenticeships

It's still not free.

You can transfer taxes from military to education, it's still taxation, and it's still not free.

So why "free education" meme?

Just admit… you're going to have to pay for it.

You just proved the point you were responding to. The point is, that hasn't been fixed yet and before it is, it simply is more tax money that goes to the upper class of society whose children are more likely to wind up in college. Until you fix the other inherent problems with capitalism (by getting rid of capitalism) "free education" is a monster. And, no, not all "education" is important either. It depends what you consider education. Certainly sciences, mathematics, etc. are important. Somebody going to get a degree in "queer theory" isn't exactly the best use of the working class's tax money, in fact, it's again burdening the working class to fund bourgeois intellectual pursuits that they will never benefit from.

In a capitalist system no fucking way we should have "free education." When we get socialism, then it will be worth implementing, until then it's a net harm. So you need to stop the bullshit "free education" meme.

Honestly, just showing people a chart with listings of major-job-averageincome on the application form for each school would help people decide if it's something they really want to spend their time and free college time on. Not everyone is going to get into a top tier uni, the difference is it doesn't matter if you can pay for it or not.

Lets put it this way if the front sheet of an application said:

Rocket Science - Making Rockets - $150,000/yr
English Major - High School Teacher - $15,000/yr

That would deter lots of people from getting a useless degree. You could also post limits on subsidization. Schools have to collect alumni paystubs to show that their education has a net worth.

We have employment rates posted as well employment rates within the degree field posted in the UK too, it doesn't stop people from doing gender studies or media studies.

The prevailing attitude is that you should do what your heart desires above all else.

You don't have to prevent it 100%. It's okay to have a few gender studies authors and academics even if you think the field is bullshit.

Like I said, they could base subsidies based on those figures. If a degree has shit employment it only gets subsidized an average, excluding outliers, of the average increase in salary over a high school education.

Say the average high school education earns you $10,000/yr. A gender studies degree earns you $12,000/yr (mostly because you're college educated and took GE courses). The cost would only be subsidized $(12,000-10,000)*(some modifier). Or if 12,000-10,000 !> x, it's considered a sham education, like Trump Uni, and gets no government money. Or some form of accreditation.

Not every type of college has to be free.

speculation tax on wallstreet

grabien.com/file.php?id=82495

Night night, don't let the spooks bite.

No I didn't you fucking idiot, you seem to have this retarded notion that the poor are simply unable to qualify for university, and that monetary barriers to entry are somehow not the primary cause of dissuading and blocking their entry. I honestly don't know what the fuck kind of argument you are attempting to make. I was trying to make him (probably you) figure out that point on his own, but apparently you lack the mental capacity to do so.

Yes it is. Critical thinking skills are important for everyone, especially the poor, if we are ever to escape the capitalist society.

Fucking hell, and you call yourself a socialist.

SEE, THE SKULL
youtube.com/watch?v=TXCUenE0b5A

You can't get rid of capitalism if you don't empower the working people with knowledge. Arguing that people are just going to get "queer theory" degrees is a slippery slope fallacy. In fact, I would argue that people from working and lower class families are more pragmatic and would thus go into fields that would yield higher wages. Restricting education on the arbitrary grounds that it doesn't conform to Porky's idea of what's "valuable" is absurd and it only reinforces the capitalist system by reproducing its values.

Printing money to pay for public college would help get us out of the deflation that we are heading toward. If inflation were a problem, a wealth tax and highly progressive income tax could be used to dispose of excess money in circulation.

"Applying this to the US to replicate the Wiemar inflation Congress would have to increase the deficit to about $8 trillion a year and then sell those dollars continuously in the market place, using them to buy the likes of yen, euro, and pounds. And replicating Zimbabwe would mean some kind of disaster that wiped out 80% of our real productive capacity and then continuing to spend federal dollars as if that never happened."