Personal editor war

For those of you who know multiple ones, how do you defeat the Paralysis by analysis in choosing between them?

I know Vim and Emacs exceedingly well, and realized that I spent an hour deciding on whether to keep using Spacemacs or just drop back to plain old emacs with a highly customized config.

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Just Give Up And Use Atomâ„¢

use whatever is most efficient for you

If I take a liking to another editor chances are I can get Emacs to do everything it does.

Either start with the minimal Spacemacs and rice that or install Spacemacs packages in vanilla Emacs.

show us your init.el, OP

Sadly that's what I'm arguing with myself as I try to work out. Pure Emacs is probably the best bet. Spacemacs is nicely riced out, has a sensible configuration layout but really works best with evil-mode bindings. Part of me says it is just time to ditch vim completely.

Then 2 mins later, I think about switching to pure vim/neovim and working with that.

It's nothing too fancy, so don't worry about it. I always keep it quite minimal, and the settings are really just options for various modes. The only thing I did that was fancy is to ensure a list of packages are loaded from elpa.

In other words, just helm and magit. Probably the only things that are useful in Spacemacs. The power line stuff is pretty, but just bloat.

Your trips equal the amount of megs of memory I'd have to give up.

Those aren't even special Spacemacs packages. Does your vanilla Emacs ricing involve the package manager?

Sorry I wasn't aware what you meant by "Spacemacs packages", I thought you meant packages spacemacs uses.

For vanilla emacs, I pretty much just loop over a list of packages that I install from elpa if they're not present.

I did mean packages Spacemacs uses, but Spacemacs also comes with some packages that were created especially for Spacemacs and integrate nicely. Why would you use Spacemacs for helm and magit when it's trivial to install them in Emacs?

No no, I used spacemacs for the well-integrated set of packages it comes with, all... 132? of them. It's good, I can be productive with it, but for some reason I just want to rip it all down. I mention magit and helm because they're two prominent ones that are must have. I probably am not even aware of what most of the spacemacs packages are, even if I have been using them.

I'm going pure Neovim or vanilla emacs with whatever packages I need.

Will it help if I share mine? I gave up on figuring out why 1/2 my desired functionality failed, but I believe it was limited functionality from using emacsclient -t from /dev/tty{1..6}. Regardless, you may point & laugh at my .el

I have this problem myself. Best to just do something else during days when you get a mental block like that, very unproductive.

Geany/Scite serves me well.

Just don't think about it too much. More important than the editor is its culture, because you can change the editor to fit you but you cannot change the culture.

The Culture of Emacs for example is "throw in everything including the kitchen sink". That's where the meme of Emacs being an OS comes from, people have been embedding everything in Emacs. And that's the kind of culture you can expect from the plugins.

Vim on the other hand is if someone shot vi in the head and then gave it the Robocop treatment. Every addition to Vim is crafted around the editor rather than trying to be effectively its own program. And that's the kind of culture you can expect from Vim.

I think that Magit and Fugitive are good examples of their respective cultures. Magit is basically a program on its own, it takes over the buffer and adds its own key bindings. Fugitive on the other hand has barely any interface, everything works through the command-line and it tries to use Vim's special buffers like the quickfix buffer whenever possible.

Neovim is interesting in that it's clearly a descendant of Vim, but it's developing its own culture. I would compare Vim and Neovim like Robocop and Knight Rider: with Vim you bolt things on to make it more powerful, but with Neovim you make it possible for the editor to attach itself to other programs temporarily. One of Neovim's goals is to completely abstract the interface away so you can freely use it with a TUI, a GUI or embed it in an IDE or any other program, or control a headless instance remotely.

You'd be spending a huge amount of time to create a config that's nearly as featured spacemacs. You'd also have to maintain everything yourself.

It's not like you have to drop vim when using emacs. I use spacemacs with some own config and layers for programming and vi/vim for small edits/scripts/config files.


In vanilla emacs, not really. Especially if you only need a small subset of spacemacs functionality. Maintaining it yourself is easy now with elpa.

Configuring vim to work like spacemacs? Good god that'd be a task.

ITT: plebs to lame for ed

Install acme.

Alright I read the best way to move on from these blocks is to go with your gut instinct, make a decision and commit to it, and convince yourself you made a great choice.

Vanilla emacs with my small amounts of tweaks is great, maybe even the greatest. Spacemacs is bloat, Vim bindings are nice for editing but slow you down when writing code (I find evil mode is shit in paredit). Going pure vim is like going pure retard, as most things don't operate in modal form. The creator of vim is the definition of cuck, the best thing about vim is the vi bindings anyways. Neovim is a better implementation of a flawed idea.

I might seem like I'm sperging out, but I have to try and find absolutes in order to commit to decisions.

Only reasonably exciting part of my config. I have some other tweaks for helm, but as they are a year old I need to go through them before sharing.

(require 'package)(add-to-list 'package-archives '("melpa" . ""))(setq my-package-list '(solarized-theme zenburn-theme magit powerline helm racket-mode ada-mode paredit))(package-initialize)(unless package-archive-contents (package-refresh-contents))(mapc #'package-install my-package-list)

I know ex (vi, the original one, not vim crap), emacs and ed.
My favorite is ed, but it takes too long to do simple operations, so sam is actually better, but it's not as available as others.

This is so obviously correct that I can only assume people who don't do this are ricers concerned with "bloat" on their 8gb ram laptops that only run a twm and firefox.

Spacemacs is nice for adapting evil-mode to many other plugins, but if you don't want a modal editor, the benefits are not as significant over a lightly configured vanilla emacs.

You're giving it too much credit. A full blown IDE starts about as fast.

I tried to move to spacemacs from vim but it's too much of an effort, even for my pitifully small editor config.
It feels like ricing some tiling WM. I don't want to fucking rice or read 20 pages of documentation, I don't have time for that shit. Sorry.
In short, I want to be spoonfed. If the docs don't spoonfeed me compared to what I know my eyes glaze over.

In short, I really don't want to learn the RSI inducing chords of emacs, and the docs don't spoonfeed me, so my vimrc will stay where it is.

I'd consider them the same. But I do use spacemacs because of the keybinds and ease of layers.

I doubt you actually tried it.

I installed spacemacs, spent ~1 hour on it attempting to port my configuration reading some docs.
Then I realized I have actual work to do.

Feel free to post some spoonfeeding or good configurations on top of spacemacs, diffable from the default.
My big problem is that there's no "crash course." If I want to go back to the docs later, that's fine. But guess what, I don't want to spend an afternoon reading the docs when I have shit I'd rather be editing rather than elisp.

Why would I run a different editor for small edits when emacsclient makes Emacs/Spacemacs start just as fast?

I personally use KATE. It's got all the features I need (for now), and I've gotten used to using it. The integrated Konsole KPart is nice.

Spacemacs IS a good configuration of emacs.
What kind of "crash course" do you expect? A picture of an elephant saying "press Space"?

The point of an editor is that it shows you as much code as possible, IDEs have all these shitty other things obscuring your view and taking up screen real estate.

I appreciate that you can shitpost, but I require more than just vim modal editing bindings for my editor. I'm guessing that there isn't such a crash course, and I'd have to spend quite a bit of time reading the docs, learning the quirks of evil mode, finding the settings/flags that corrsepond to what I have set in vim, and finding snippets of eslisp that correspond to various vim plugins. As I thought.

i use a pretty unknown editor that just werk so i can get work done instead of wasting time shitposting here about which editor is the best

Space for spacemacs. H for help. Space for spacemacs-help. HOLY FUCK what is wrong with you.

What's it called? I'm looking for a new editor.

Just because you found the time to rice yout shit, doesn't mean everyone will be able to.
My vimrc has been built up for over a decade.

That's always the best setup, something you're completely happy with and don't want to waste time or energy considering swapping.

indeed, i spent a fair amount of time trying out various editors and finally stuck with this one. best of all it works on linux/mac/win so i can take it with me wherever i end up having to do work.
it is also free and open source written in c so it checks all the autism boxes.

What editor is it?

lmfao YOU are the ricer with your decade old vimrc

With a decent browser in the most recent release of emacs, how long till a literal emacs OS where it's just emacs, the linux kernel, and a few other essential packages needed is made?

I just use Mousepad or Notepad++. Never understood the appeal behind spending a week memorizing awkward key mappings.

but muh autism?!

The most recent release doesn't just have optional support for webkit, it also has optional support for native modules. You can compile C code into modules that provide functions and symbols to Emacs at run-time.

Doing everything in a single process is feasible now. Webkit would need X, but you can do plenty without a full web browser.

Sublime is better.

I'm going to use Pico from now on. Not this new-fangled Nano thing either. I mean the real Pico.

Sublime is malware.

Tell me why and I might stop using it.

He means nagware, but he's being edgy.

how do i get code completion in emacs (generally, but for both c++ and python in particular)?

and not just for the core language - i'd like if i include a library to get code completion for it too.

is this possible or only a dream?

funny i have that page bookmarked. i installed irony-mode off but couldn't get it working so i got rid of it. maybe i'll give it another go.

have you used any of these suggestions? what's worked for you?

I don't use emacs for C++, and I rarely program in that language. To be honest, I'd probably use an IDE for that, in my case XCode. As far as IDE's go, I've yet to see something better than IntelliJ, and I'm pretty sure the company have a C++ editor.

It's not ricing when everything has a practical purpose other than asthetic. Everything helps me edit.
Ricing would be mulling over what color airline should be, or whether it's too bloated, or whether I need it at all. I don't, but you certainly don't know what ricing entails.

i've used eclipse and intellij but they're bloated. too heavy, slow, resource demanding.

i love terminal emacs except that i don't get code completion. of all ide's i've tried qt creator is my favorite. very well put together. i could use that for code completion but i'd like to stick with terminal emacs for the workflow.

I can always close the terminal/fs browser. I just had the terminal open to show off the Konsole KPart. Plus, if so desired, those can be disabled completely.

[Spoiler]If you wanted KATE's actual editor component in a lighter package, KWrite is a decent option[/spoiler]


Learn vi/vim as you'll have to use it sometimes, anyway. Then if you want to learn emacs, pick it up via spacemacs. Stop thinking about it and just do it and move on.



Not on my watch.

:call writefile([repeat('aeuo', 1000000)], '/tmp/a.tmp', 'b')

Will give you a file with a line that contains a million aeuos and it will take less than a second, usually.

Use Wordstar.

Why use Wordstar when Emacs has a wordstar-mode?

spacemacs is all you need and probably a lot more.

Vi is a meme, Vim is a meme, Emacs is a bad forced meme, Ed is a horrid meme, Sam is good but depricated. What you need to use is Acme. It's used by the original UNIX bros, designed by them, and it is designed for the Graphical User Interface in mind. After all, it's designed for Plan 9, the ultimate system made to fix UNIX by the original inventors of UNIX. Anything other than Acme (and Plan 9) is shit.

Pico and Nano are child toys. Acme is simplistic like it, however. You just need to make sure you have a three button mouse.


Life would be so much fun if we all just had user's memevision. Seeing memes everywhere must be fun


Monsoon? Is that you?

Those edits fucks need shitmouse, mugabe tier. Only EDIT.COM triumphant, and the Borland IDE for DOS.

how long until vim / emacs pays off?

I tried each but end up getting close to my deadlines so I just back t comfy and colorful gedit

Emacs 1 week. Vim 3-4 weeks.



I don't know about Emacs, but with Vim you can work through the Vim tutorial in about half an hour, then turn on hard mode (disable arrow keys) to force you to think the Vim way, and in about a week you will be editing as fast as you think.

There is a book called Practical Vim by Drew Neil, it's a very good book about getting more out of Vim. It assumes that you already know the basics from the tutorial, but it doesn't rely on any plugins. That's a good thing, don't just go and install someone's Top 20 list of plugins, only install them when you find yourself thinking "I really wish I could do that thing". Every plugin just adds complexity to the program, so you want to get familiar with the program itself first. Vim is not vi, you will be surprised how far you can get without plugins. Also, don't copy-paste someone else's vimrc, start with an empty one and slowly build it as you see fit, your vimrc is something tailored for you specifically. Don't put everything into the vimrc either, split it over multiple files, use the 'ftplugin' or 'syntax' directories. If these terms don't make sense to you don't worry, you will remember them when the time comes.

Want simple editor that loads instantly? $leafpad
Want complex editor that can do custom commands? $gedit
Not running X Windows for some reason? $nano
In Windows virtual machine? >notepad

nice meme
not true btw

It is true, it just isn't any faster than other editors in your case.