What was the better debut movie

aliens trades horror for action, it's not really comparable to alien which is a space slasher.

same with t1 and t2. t2 is once again, trading substance for action. jim cameron can't actually write development, which is why almost all of his films are action-based.

satan demands it

booga booga

They're both great. Why do they need to be compared? And why even think of them as "debut" movies? Just view them as standalone films, which is what they were.

Alien is an overrated and pretentious flick. Just another cash in on the space genre that was popularized by 2001, Solaris, and Star Wars (the last two are true kino), and a mediocre attempt at that.

2001 is a (childish) take on man's purpose in the universe. Solaris takes on the subject of how man's spirit is incompatible with scientific discoveries. Star Wars is a classic hero's journey tale set in space with blaring orchestra, intense action, and interesting and vast lore. Alien has nothing going for, it's just a bland hard sci fi on top of boring acting and pointless and themeless plot. The characters have no motivation beyond trying to survive. It's shallow, very shallow.

T1's theme and post apocalyptic imagery of human's relations to technology got praised by Tarkovsky. T2 is just a dumb summer action flick. The action wasn't even that good, the car chase scenes are bland and Arnold wasn't allowed to kill anyone.

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Go jerk off to bells and candles, fag.

k

There isn't much lore in Alien other than a bunch of humanoid aliens who create other aliens. It's handled with great looking set design, but that's it. Like I said, it's just a bland hard scifi on top of mediocre stuff.

You're gonna call Hidden Fortress a shallow hero's journey too?

Yes.

Earth is probably what Blade Runner+smog looks like considering that a megacorp runs everything and they only care for furthering their profits, it's about the little things and implied things that make a world interesting and compelling most of the time.
No it's just that Star Wars that's shallow. Star Wars has no real substance and ruined sci-fi and the biggest thing wrong with it is that it's too popular for its own good making people dislike/hate it more than they should because they get fucking sick of seeing it. The only good things to come from it were the prequels which were O.K. to good and some of the games.

They're both equal as franchises since both only had two good movies, but overall I'd say Terminator since it worked across the board as a thriller/action/horror movie and didn't have any dumb rubber suits or bukkake robots.

Those background lore are not so relevant to the story. Also, social commentary is truly a bottom of the barrel plot/subplot.

Compared to Alien? Pffft. At least the characters have more complex motivation beyond making money or surviving.

Dumbass. It's a space opera in vein of Flash Gordon. It pays little to no attention to scientific accuracy or possibility.

star wars isn't sci fi. It's just a heros journey film set in "A long time ago in a galaxy far far away"
The aesthetics in Star Wars were pure kino and have inspired EU writers to further expand on the Star Wars universe to the point of absurdity. Star Wars became Sci Fi after the fact.

Aliens? Check.
Spaceships? Check.
Laser guns? Check.
Intelligent robots? Check.
It's sci-fi.

It's a deconstruction of the science fiction genre.

Star Wars is fantasy, not scifi. Not that it really matters, genre is irrelevant at the end of the day

Star Wars is pretty much a deconstruction of scifi genre. If the focus of scifi films is the discovery of a new scientific anomaly or the exploration of it, Star Wars abandoned all scientific plot aspects altogether. In Star Wars, mankind has reached the absolute peak of scientific discovery and technological advancement thousands of years before. Society now looks toward the spiritual, or the Force as described in Star Wars. The world depends on spiritual leaders instead of scientists and intellectuals. Becoming a Jedi has become the ultimate and most honorable goal in human life. Afterlife has become a scientifically proven truth as of Episode 2.

SW is a critique of humanity's obsession of technology, economy, and politics in the modern ages. Technology and scientific knowledge are nothing but toys to fill our boredom. Everything is meaningless without acknowledging and incorporating the spiritual into our life, it is the end goal of life. While THX 1138 questions whether technology and materials are really capable of improving the condition of our humanity, Star Wars is George's answer to it. This is the sole reason why Star Wars is infinitely deeper than Alien and even 2001: Space Odyssey.

It's much more Kino than everyone might have thought.

Everything in this post is 100% correct, though I would argue that 2001 definitely has more depth than Alien and could hold a candle to Star Wars, SW has the advantage of multiple films.