Obama's Economy- How good is it?

the 4.7% unemployment thing is one of my favorite jewish memes

anyone can see how that's bullshit by opening their eyes and looking around them
all they did was redefine unemployment to only apply to people actively looking for jobs

there's actually something like 95 million people in the US that are out of employment
breitbart.com/big-government/2015/10/02/record-94610000-americans-not-labor-force/

Labour force participation dropped from about 66% to 60% during Obongo's presidency iirc.

It's really bad
Close to a third of the nation is no longer in the active work force
archive.is/iqbUq

For the "highly valued" STEM field, we have 2 or 3 graduates for every job opening, and only 1 in 4 STEM grads actually ends up working in a STEM field

We're starting to see degree inflation for Masters and PHd's due to the huge amount of people who went back to school because the economy is shit
I get paid more by the government to be a grad student than I would make working right now

Commodities are remaining at record lows due to a collapse in world demand brought about by the economic stagnation of the US and Europe, without that demand, the Chinese factories stop running, and so on

The finances of a lot of the big banks are even worse now than they were going into 08 since they were all bailed out by the governments and suffered no real losses

Full time employment has collapsed, in our workforce, only 50% or so actually have full time jobs anymore, the rest are working part time jobs

Housing prices have continued to skyrocket, and the tech field is starting to implode
Just go look at the value of Facebook compared to Ford

Capitalism by definition means that the government does not choose which companies succeed or fail and does not bail out the private sector.

What do you call it when the government pays farmers to not farm? to oil producers to slow work? to prop up failing banks? My friend we are very far from capitalism, more like an unholy fusion of socialism of corporatism

No, it means the private capital rules. And it does with everything, including politics.

It's called lobbying, it's called "revolving doors", it's called bribery, it's called "donations that you have to repay". You conveniently forget that those solutions are simply bought, this way or another, by capitalists.

okie dokie

hey Holla Forums the Six-Day War thread and USS Liberty got me thinking about the death ("suicide") of James Forrestal.

Some say he was obsessed about being followed by Zionist agents. what do you goys think?

Beat me to it. I was in the middle of trying to upload that same graph.

capitalism is founded on the laissez faire doctrine, as in the government leaves the private sector alone to maximize wealth. If they breach that founding doctrine you can't possibly have capitalism, it'd be like anarchism with a dictator or some such nonsense.

It is a thin line that is easy to cross, but it terms of function and classification it is a massive leap. Also you can't have capitalism if the government controls the money supply as it is then illegal to create competing currency. If it illegal to compete in a sector there is no capitalism.

Another theoretician. They (capitalists) care about maximizing wealth, and the gov is just another "market" to conquer so it would work in the great goal of maximizing our (capitalist) wealth.

i'm sure they care about it so much. It's still rule of private capital, over gov too.

Was going to post that the second I read the OP.

Probably somewhere more around 15-17% I'd say

Incorrect, the mint still issues coins. Regardless, it is the government that enforces and legislates the monopoly, it can't be laissez faire if the government legislates it. Now, the argument can be made that capitalism only works in a vacuum and that all capitalism eventually devolves into corporatism but that doesn't change the definition.

Except compared to literally every other system ever tried.

'whose hands are the means of production'

A significant number and perhaps the most important industries in the United States are controlled by the government or 'public'

Education? Healthcare? Like others have said, Oil, Agriculture.

Although I am speculating I can say with certainty that the only reason the whole shebang isn't controlled by government such as in the Soviet Union is because that system demonstrably failed. Also, the more the state takes control of, the faster society goes to hell but the rich become richer and poor become poorer.

We can argue forever about what Socialism is but Capitalism has clear definitions that are defined from a warped Socialist perspective of 'who controls the means of production'.

Really, you give me coins as "incorrect"?. All the electronic trillions don't matter, because coins?.

Gov works for them. With no gov, they just cut the middle man, that's all. Your made-up definition, and if it's not 100% perfect, then "it's not capitalism, capitalists dindu nuffin"

That's because capitalism requires some level of regulation, which itself a complex problem. You can't allow government to expand it powers beyond what is strictly enumerated, the legal system should be powerful, and finally anyone in government found guilty of corruption attempts should be executed. The last one is critical because anyone will accept a government job will do so with full knowledge that if they are corrupt or seek to corrupt and are caught, they will be executed irrespective of the level of the crime, which should clean house pretty quickly and provide a safeguard against corruption.

mad typos, sorry it's late and I can barely keep my eyes open this is what gooks must feel like all the time

Education: maybe elementary/high-shool level, not uni.
Healthcare: really?. All private.
Oil: Gov owned?. Really?
Agriculture: Even if small owners exist, they're corporate.

Just because there are laws, (that the private capitalists create btw), it doesn't mean public "runs" anything. Puppet in oval office is just for show.

Through Federal Reserve money printing, aka 'Quantitative Easing' and soon straight up helicopter money. This only works for so long though and makes things far worse when it turns to shit.

It depends on if you want to count non-participation in the labor force as 'unemployed'

Unemployed = no job but looking for one
Non participation = no job and have given up looking for one

The non participation rate is significantly higher than the unemployed rate.

(checked)
I don't know much about James Forrestal but those digits look pretty good.

Who will enact your rules, the private capital puppets from gov that want to act like that without punishment?. Go ahead, vote your people in, beat the oligarchs and their wealth they invest in taking over gov's power.

I don't see how you can go from "McDonalds makes their coffee hot so that you won't take advantage of free refills" to "McDonalds will shoot you if you take free refills and the government isn't there"

I'm trying not to strawman you here but I don't see where you're going. The government has a monopoly and if you interfere with that monopoly you die. McDonalds has at best a cartel where in they reduce competition through the use of the government. They bribe government officials and you get shot if you don't comply.

In both situations its the government shooting you

there exists more than America and yes even in America the gov owns the oil, you need eminent domain and other legal apparatus' in order to get it. Even if you "own" the land you actually really are renting it and must buy permits.

lol the best part is the Fed has put themselves in a no-win situation.

1) government needs low interest rates to service interest on debt
2) low interest rates destroy all public pension rates of return

There's literally nothing they can do at this point except prop the market up with QE because they can no longer raise interest rates, but they also can't let the market crash because it would bankrupt every single public pension in the country.

It's going to be fucking hilarious when the SHTF.

You have to build a framework for the system before putting people in. The Constitution has done well to slow the government expansion, but it needs to be corrected to eliminate the possibility of any expansion in the future.

After the foundation for the new government is laid in and these people are held accountable by death against corruption, then we can work on sufficient, minimal regulation.

ENTIRE US ECONOMY ONLY PRODUCED 38000 JOBS IN MAY

disregard, I'm cross posting here and I fucked up

Yep, I think their goal at this point isn't to stop the crash but prevent them from receiving a date with a lamp post and 10' of rope by making the system last long enough for them to pass it onto the next guy where it becomes his problem.

For those who don't understand the issue of this whole system here is a video on the Japan debt problem which is a mild form of the US one (the US can get away with it a lot more because the USD is still the global reserve currency to a large extent).

And those 'jobs' are just part time ones created by destroying more productive full time jobs.

They won't get away with it, that's why many of them are buying boltholes and bunkers and shit across the planet. New Zealand seems to be a favorite place for the rich to bail to, military should probably just nuke it when they cluster.

Newfags here really need to learn the difference between Capitalist, Communist, Fascist and Traditional models of economy.
Defending Capitalism is the same as Defending the Huge Monopolies that destroyed the European Economic Model that have worked for a thousand years, both for the worker and the consumer, in favor of an exploitive kike-ran slave economy.

get comfy guys

What the fuck happened to health care costs?

There is no power vacuum, if gov is not in power then oligarchs are. Not ordinary folks, we can barely do anything with democracy because oligarchs corrupt it. Less gov control means more private control - the feudalism kind.

Also the previous two months were revised downward a total of 59,000 jobs, meaning that they overstated the jobs created by that amount. This 38,000 number is also subject to possible (downward) revisions.

It could be worse.

However most of the metrics used by the Department of Labor are basically fudged numbers to make him look good. The only real "growth" sectors in the US economy are healthcare (due to Obammycare) and finance (lolbanks).

Unemployment numbers are made to look good by the ever increasing number of ways they can dismiss working-age Americans without jobs by simply dismissing them as 'not part of the work force'.

Econ 101 - Anything the government subsidizes you get more of, no different from college tuition.

Corruption can only occur in a system that is poorly designed. It's no different from designing a shit circuit. This can be solved and it can eliminate 99% of corruption, rope will eliminate the 1%.

Do we also remove the rich that corrupt it, or they are just free to try to corrupt everyone without consequences?

alright starting over
I'll summarize,
the current situation has certainly used the trappings and continues to call itself capitalism, but then again the USA continues to call itself a democracy when we all know its actually a republic.

Sure why not, any public servant guilty of corruption and their accomplices in the private sector will be subject to the death penalty.

These people will do anything if they know they'll get a slap on the wrist, maybe some minor jail time/fines, but I guarantee most of them would rethink that shit if their would be put to death for it. And in my opinion, those people should be put to death.

So who is in power, the gov or the one that bribed it?. Is the mall guard the owner of the mall, just because he enacts "don't steal" rule, made by the actual owner?.

yeah, accidental post to wrong thread, gets quads. Kek works in mysterious ways.

Leftists call it a democracy, and democracy ultimately leads to an oligarchy.

I am actually from NZ, the places they are buying are not hard find and they wont last long here.

NZ is the kind of country where you could only hide post-colapse if you aren't a slimy jew banker, most of the rich coming here are just regular upper class who are getting nervous at things like the migrant crisis. The global elite (the ones who you want to kill) are still mostly choosing bunkers over migrating.

;-).

I agree totally.

more like the guy with the tank in the food court is most certainly in charge. The guy in the wendy's booth can certainly hand him cheeseburgers voluntarily to gain favour, make no mistake though, tank guy can just up and take them if he wants.

At the end of the day, people are the ones who corrupt everything.

bribers -> gov -> military. That's how power goes. The wendy's guy owns the guy in tank.

I've read otherwise, regular upper class people don't have the money to buy boltholes with landing strips for their private jets.

Don't worry though, I'm sure we'll blanket nuke new zealand. You'll be disintegrated before you even realize you are going to be disintegrated.

that doesn't fit well with the analogy

Then don't give them resources to do that. Big private players corrupt gov. Remove them, and it's done. You think president will take your bribe of 5 fish?. No, they take millions.

Because you think gov rules over rich.

I'm fairly certain soviet russia had a fair amount of corruption

Hey dipshit, the equation has two sides. You want to bash the corporations, but they can't do shit without out the corrupt government motherfuckers.

If the government fucks have no power to enable corruption because the system is strictly enumerated, and they would be subject to death for attempting/doing, then the corporations have literally no mechanism to corrupt government.

Corporations have no power of their own.

If the gov doesn't have power, then capitalist have it directly, through their wealth. Remove gov now, what happens?. The rich rule with private armies, by force. Not some magical land where you're finally free.

You could bribe some low level official with some fish, it's not buying the whole gov like now.

You're either a faggot or a woman, because your hamster wheel logic is embarrassing. You're literally the only person who said "Remove gov now" and then proceeded to set fire to the straw-man like a vampire kike thirsting for baby dick blood.

I'm going to get comfy in bed.

Thats a cop out, non argument. Do you say that the soviet union where in there existed no private anything had no wide spread corruption?

he didn't argue an anarchist position man.

frankly this argument is like the gun control argument. Criminals will always exist, therefore you shouldn't punish every single person with unreasonably high restrictions if the criminals will bypass those anyway. Work hard to take down the thugs but let regular citizens be.

Limit gov's power means increase private rich power. That will limit it further, to the result i said. Feudalism will come back if you allow it.

he's basically Holla Forums at this point

That is an argument. There is small time corruption, and there is total takeover of power, including over military.

Gov with little power means it can't enact law and order. You might as well get anarchy/feudalism.

The other guy is a faggot but corporations have wealth, which is power even in the absence of government. Currency is preferable to bartering for higher-tier civilizations, and monopoly can still be quite easily formed with or without government intervention.

They aren't buying up remote places with personal airstrips, they are moving to cities and buying homes in their upper class suburbs. The airstrip thing is a meme, NZ isn't a huge country and there aren't many places to hide here if you are wealthy and have done bad things.

>If the gov doesn't have power then capitalist people have it directly
I fix for you, the government is not the people and does not care about them. The government cares about itself first and foremost.

So then why do the rich always shill for more government? because the only way the rich are so wealthy is because they use the state to their advantage.

Name me a desirable monopoly which doesn't rely on government.

You're embarrassing yourself leftypol

Desirable for the people or desirable for the company itself? Because all monopolies are desirable for those who hold them.
Farmland.

Job growth is mostly in shitty part-time jobs because regulations, Obamacare, and the economy in general means it's way better to make several part-time jobs than a full-time.

Unemployment is massively higher than 4.7%. The government figure doesn't take into account those who have stopped actively looking for work yet aren't employed. Labor Participation Rate (number of people employed or actively looking for work) is a much better indication, and it was only 62.6% last May, meaning just under half the country is not employed or looking for work anymore.

And of those that ARE employed, a fuckton are in shitty part-time underemployment.

So yeah, Obama's "recovery" consists of cooking the books till they're charred, then passing the mess to his successor and resting on muh legacy while his successor is blamed for everything since it'll break down under them.

See the 2001 and 2008 top?
Compare 2016 to those two and you'll realize silver and gold are going to make you rich.

As soon as credit peaked velocity of money declined. Government's solution will be a fuckton more money creation.

We Japanese nao.

Any time these Obama shills try to make it like the unemployment rate has decreased and tons of jobs have been created, just reply that going from a $55K job with retirement and healthcare to a $9 / hour temp / retail / service job is not a fucking step up.

ownership of land is reliant on government to assert your ownership.

your 'ownership' is really a rental as there are ongoing fees to pay to keep it.

If you think carefully all monopolies ( or even ownership) are reliant on enforcement of ownership rights. enforcement is usually government (or who ever has the most guns).

We fell for the universal healthcare meme.