How do we kill PHP?

PHP has to die. It must be exterminated like the horrible plague upon the world it is. How can Holla Forums help kill PHP?

I know Facebot is trying to kill PHP by replacing it with Hack but I think we can do better than that.

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stop using it and don't support those that do

use python or go instead because at least they're less cancerous than javascript and ruby

I get that PHP sucks, but at least it's not javascript. Is it really that big a deal?

Usually it's the javascript devs saying "at least it's not PHP!"...

You are correct. PHP is not Javascript. PHP is worse than Javascript. At least Javascript has the merit of being fairly small. PHP however is abominably bloated and fat like a decaying and beached whale.

NVM it looks the SJWs are doing it for us reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/4piv4i/phpfig_drama_continues_as_the_group_publicly/

Ah, noted. I've got no idea what developing with either is like, but all I know is that javascript is hell as an end-user. PHP, seemingly less so - although maybe that's just because it's used less

php was created by a jew who hates programming which is enough for me to never want to touch it.

JavaScript is just rough-cut. Designed in ten days. It still imitated better languages carefully enough, and Eich was competent enough, that it's a good language. The shitty end user experience is due to a shitty community that writes code without thinking they need to learn how to code first, or to learn JavaScript as an actual language.

PHP is actually horrible as a language. It is bad by design, repeatedly bad design. It's persisted though through a good admin side, basically. When other languages were writing web apps as if all the world was an in-house IT department with its own webservers with mod_lang modules running in the server, PHP took over shared servers. When other languages scoffed at the masses as a bunch of normies, they abandoned the masses to PHP developers who, purely from benefitting from so much attention, could invest in putting PHP to uses that are sort of not shit. So PHP today scales in a manner that's rarely seen: you can use it very easily on $5/month hosting in a CGI configuration with mysql page caching and nothing else, and you can use it just as easily on $500/month hosting with opcache and redis and shit in support.

"mysql and page"

Meanwhile, even as popular as RoR is, support for it is spotty. Yeah everyone can name a meme host. Grats. and "perl dancer cgi" has some more helpful search results than I remember, setting it up on, say, a server that anyone could easily install WordPress onto, is not part of the "dead simple" documentation.

let me boil this down.

If you want to put up a PHP site, you need a web developer and maybe a PHP developer. Maybe that'll be one guy.

If you want to put up any other kind of site, you need a web developer and maybe a lang developer (who is varying likely to be the same guy, but mostly less likely), and you also need a sysadmin.

That's what not supporting shared servers and basic CGI deployment means, and it's why PHP has been so resilient in the face of the language itself being such garbage.

You fags have to go back.

Well you CAN put up a PHP site without a sysadmin. Whether or not that is a good idea is another question. Why is it that the monetary costs of security problems caused by bad practises like these is outweighed by the profits of cheap development habits like these?

Replace it with server-side Javascript.

and you get to see how good of an idea that was. Do people like the site? Is it worth putting more money into it? You have a nice long gentle ramp up towards higher investment options. That matters.


mostly it's just installing bad plugins (or themes that include bad software, like old exploitable timthumb scripts). shared servers themselves are pretty secure even in the face of all the malware that gets onto them.

This is a bit obsessive and creepy.

PHP, like Javascript, is only okay if you use it sparingly and do not rely heavily on it. PHP is good for shit that would be tedious or redundant in plain HTML -- like a simple template and cache system. Javascript can be nice for certain end-users, but if your site breaks when said end-user doesn't want to run it, then you've failed as a webmaster.

There's nothing wrong with moderation, as long as the end result is good on resources and respects the visitor's browsing expectations.

le "it should work without JS" meme.

don't counter that it's actually an ancient and wise design principle that helps pretty little blind girls consume their twilight fan fiction in emacs-w3m. The browser has a whole computer to itself; it can can use some of those resources to put a page together if that shaves a few CPU ms off of what the server must do. I completely understand this principle and I reject it.

more on point, people do not hate JS because when they turn it off shit breaks. Obviously they don't. Why would they turn it off in the first place, to learn to hate it for this reason?

JS's abuses in the wild are many and varied and all that saying "your site should work without it" does is waste oxygen that could've gone towards attacking some of these.

granted, it's also not very interesting to note that advertisers are hateful fucks, holy shit. I wouldn't use adblock if not for wanting to follow Breitbart sometimes, and that site's ads make me want to torture someone to death.

wait I've got one. More than annoying than Breitbart's "push the entire page to the right" ads, are

1. smooth scrolling

2. floating DOM elements.

#2 generally is fine if done with CSS. Why God do people try and do it with JS.

Your argument is that instead of suggesting developers rely on Javascript that I should instead complain that they are abusing it?

To me it seems like the source of the problem is that developers become reliant on Javascript, to the point where their site has absolutely no functionality without it. Is that not abuse in its own right?

I don't understand what you're getting at. It's almost like a non-argument.

*suggesting developers not rely on Javascript

"The site should work without javascript" means this: reimplement some features server-side. Every once in a while you'll get an austistic visitor and he'll have a degraded yet more costly experience.

It does not mean that any particular thing should not happen in javascript. Fuck it doesn't even mean that horrible ads shouldn't be there, since the site "still works" without ads.

That you've given me reply shows that the meme really is a meme, because you've shown that you don't even understand what you're saying.

This has nothing to do with Javascript and everything to do with the pestilent source of pain and misery that PHP is.

bah. Then you're just a PHP apologist. "It's OK in moderation, goy." You don't fool me.

He's not me, I said that, and I browse Holla Forums you fucking nigger.

PHP shouldn't be used for giant webapps like WordPress, but I don't think there's anything wrong with making simple templating systems to do away with more tedious HTML.

Again, like Javascript, you shouldn't rely on it. If it can save you time/cpu cycles and respect the user's expectations, then who the fuck cares what you use?

If the site breaks then you'll lose users. If it's insecure, then you'll get your shit wrecked and lose your visitor's trust. If you think PHP is really all that bad, then let internet Darwinism sort it out.

That's the thing. Capitalism isn't working here. Silicon valley entrepreneurs gobble up so much angel investor money and spend so much money on marketing hype that they can implement practically any technical solution and still get rich.

I think PHP really is all that bad as a language. But it's more than a language, and internet Darwinism won't dispose of it until other languages start having similarly good normie support and similar friendliness towards the administrators of normies.

You don't think WordPress should be in PHP, but if WordPress were in anything else it couldn't possibly have the userbase it does. People would just speak of Joomla instead. The reasons for that are why WordPress is in PHP, and why people keep doing WP-scale stuff in PHP.

PHP is Israeli, no wonder weev uses it.

better stop supporting Holla Forums then

way ahead of you
lynxchan is the future

How many lines of PHP have you written or touched to improve this site? None? Then grats, youre taking your advice well. Next steps: replicate PHP's advantages; replace lines of PHP.

'hypocrisy' is a concept that actually impairs your ability to understand the world. Get rid of it.

Easy. Destroying things takes very little effort; imitate the behavior of SJW parasites for long enough and you can kill any organized entity. Holla Forums has plenty of brainwashed simpletons who can be commanded to dance in a certain way tirelessly when you utter the magic trigger word.

All you have to do is program the same pavlovian response in them for "PHP" as they have been for other keywords: AMD, Intel, Infinity Next, CP.

PHP IS GOD-TIER, EXAMPLE: INFINITY NEXT
(((zuckerberg)) cocksuckers BTFO

javascript is cancer in its own way