>durr Dark Souls 2 is bad because of level design Eat shit

>durr Dark Souls 2 is bad because of level design Eat shit

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The same retards who shit on Earthen Peak to Iron Keep are the same ones who love Bloodborne which has a fishing village sitting above a clock tower, it's no use showing them reason since they just hate on Das2 to fit in.Fuck, I remember watching a stream of BB years ago when that DLC came out and one of the snail enemies literally glitched out and fell from the sky at one point, so much for "A team" ehh?

>>523659293This has never bothered me, and I will literally never care about it, because it's a video game.

>>523659807solid bait, people will fall for this

>>523659293OP just stop. You know DaS2 is a good game, so do I. Why do you feel the need to argue with trolls? Why not just talk about the game? My powerstanced cestus run was the most fun ive ever had in souls.

>>523659807It's a dream in BB, you trog.

>>523659293Fake and gay

>>523659943>world consistency is no big deal in a metroidvania

>>523660043Different user here, which is fine, but it occurs to me that nothing in the game actually existed. The only thing real is you getting the injection and thats it.

>>523660043oh so because its a dream that makes it ok, DaS2 has to be rigid as fuck in your retarded brain.

>>523659293That pic isn't what happens in the game and you know it. And the problems with DS2's level design don't have to do with location transition - that's a world design/consistency issue. Level design is a matter of internal map layouts, how interesting and interconnected the setup is, enemy placement, unique gimmicks, etc.DS2 has great level design in certain areas and very, very mediocre in others - as opposed to other games in the series which skew more towards being good to great most of the time. DS2 has a lot going for it, but criticism of its level design (and world design) are valid and shutting them down as strawman arguments is disingenuous.

>>523659293You forgot that ds2's garbage enemy placement, shitty bosses, gank overload, and vomit inducing hitboxes

>>523660505>cant fight more than one enemyGo back to pulling mobs one by one with a bow ya bitch.

>>523660043cope

>>523660043>It's a dream in BB, you trog.A shitty excuse to explain nonsensical level design. Anyways, funny how no one complains about Earthen Peak showing up in the Lothric in DaS3 either. Isn't that a bit strange? The whole windmill just up and moving probably thousands of miles? Never hear a peep about how "unrealistic" that is, because DaS3 has be designated as being acceptable to like around here by the hivemind.

>>523659293That’s not true because I hate all of them.

>>523660123>world consistency is no big deal in a metroidvaniaIt is a big deal in a metroidvania, just not Souls. As evident in the fact that only one entry out of four games has any kind of world consistency.

>>523659293Wow i never noticed that giant lava mountain behind the windmill.

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>>523660363>oh so because its a dream that makes it ok

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>>523659293The problem isn't "omg I can't see iron keep from earthen peak, literally unplayable". It's just the most obvious and glaring indicator of what's wrong with the level design of the vanilla game in general. That locations just feel like they were all developed completely independently (and probably by different sub-teams or something) and then just slapped together haphazardly afterwards. It's not just the lack of internal consistency. It's the way levels are all designed as linear paths, how the game relies on a large amount of one-way drops that prevent you from going backwards, etc.Of course, DaS2's world design feels god-tier in comparison to DaS3's design where it's more or less a straight fucking line. At least with DaS2 there were several different linear paths to choose from instead of playing the game in the exact same way every fucking time.

>>523660596If the enemies were actually good by themselves and had good hitboxes I would maybe fight them all at the same time, but i guess i can just ignore then and go kill those waste of bosses

>DaS2 revisionism These clowns probably still have nightmares about Mauler assraping them

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>>523661269DS2 is what you get when you design a game around Bonfire warps.DS3 is what you get when the team is lazy.

>>523660363just take the L and move on, stop embarrassing yourself

>>523660756>imagine being this fucking stupid

>>523659807You just SERIOUSLY embarrassed yourself.

>>523661413They just wear Jester's armor to catch Mauler off guard

>>523659293>durr Dark Souls 2 is bad because of level designIt's bad for a lot more than the level design

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>>523659293But that mountain isn't even there, retard. You can literally check in game.

>>523662791It was funny back when DS2 was recent when apologists were unironically trying to argue that drangleic was a consistent world. "nah bro, it totally makes sense the elevator goes from the back of earthen peak up to the mountains behind it!" Nigger there ain't no fucking mountains right behind earthen peak, they're far off in the distance. Eventually people gave up trying to argue it and accepted the fact that DS2's world map makes no sense.

Discuss.

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>>523663403Absolute truth

>>523663026Yeah they're not even remotely close to Earthen Peak. Like, how the fuck did people even come up with this shit?

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>>523663403what does each axis mean?

>>523663403This isn't fair to DeS. DeS at the time it came out was fantastic, it only pales in comparison to the later entries.

>>523660363>oh so because its a dream that makes it okit's literally a dream created by an eldritch being. it can be whatever the fuck it wants

>>523663579

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>>523659807

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>>523659807I know I'm responding to bait but I think comparing the transition from the clock tower to fishing village and earthen peak to iron keep is actually the perfect illustration of why DaS2 is half-assed and mediocre.

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>>523663403I hope this is ironic because that's not how a normal distribution works.

>>523659293>>523659807>>523660019>>523663403

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>>523664283>the perfect illustration of why DaS2 is half-assed and mediocre

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>>523659293DARK SOULS 2 SUCKS ASS AHAHAHAHA

>>523663403Demon's Souls is by far the worst souls game.

Why do people still not grasp that DS2 is literally about your character slowly losing his mind due to the curse and misremembering things? How'd they not pick it up with the elevator to there, or how it suddenly went from day to night towards the castle, or why your character suddenly decided to usurp the previous owners and take the throne for themselves?

>>523663659You just outted yourself as extremely low intelligence. I'm curious to see if anyone else notices how you did it.

>>523660043A single word changes your whole perception of the game? The Emerald Herald could've said " Oh, its all a dream btw" and shitty design becomes god-like? Jesus Christ you people are retarded.

>>523659293level design? They actually say this? Level design is laughable when you can teleport since the beginning of the game, the areas merely become unlockables.

>>523664668nice cope

>>523664668Or how he forgets he had a dick, balls, a wife and kids and now is suddenly a women?

>>523664668>Why do people still not grasp that DS2 is literally about your character slowly losing his mind due to the curse and misremembering things?Irrelevant to how bad the earthen peak transition is. The transition is bad, as confirmed by the devs.

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>>523664492>Ds2 is full of shit.

Iron Keep is such a poorly designed fucking mess.

>>523663403You are welcome to your opinion, as wrong as it is.

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>>523660043>it was all a dream!the absolute state of soulsfags

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>>523660043>it was all a dreampoor excuse for bad map design

>>523663487left/right is the topic in question (IQ)down/up is amount of indivudals.and, Yes, that does mean we can take the stance here shown to only be held by subhumans.

Why do people shit so much on DS2 when DS3 exists? Asking as somebody who played both not long ago.

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I think you can see the giant iron bull from Earthen Peak, but its still in the wrong location.

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>>523665318It’s an equally bad mess for every other reason, but you can get a decent playthrough of it with fun bosses compared to Ds2.

>>523665318Because dark souls 3 is better by miles

>>523660161Then why do you "wake up" in your gear in the cutscene? They could have just put you into the starting gear again if that was the intention.

>>523665318There are at least SOME production values found in 3 that hide all its cracks.

>>523665486DS3 felt like if DS1 was remade for the zoomer audience, at least DS2 felt like a new experience.

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>>523665318Cause it's a mediocre half-assed mess with the name "dark souls" on it.

>>523665784Delusional Ds2 trannie.

>>523665784DS2 didn’t feel new in the slightest, it felt every bit like it was trying too hard to be DS1.

>>523665890Try an argument.>>523665951>it felt every bit like it was trying too hard to be DS1.Elaborate please.

>>523661413I never watched Mauler videos because I could beat Dark Souls 2 in the time it would take me to watch the entire playlist.

>>523659293>GameplayDS1>DS2>DS3>DeS>BB>Level designDS1>BB>DeS>DS2>DS3>LoreBB>DeS>DS1>DS3>DS2

Dark souls 2 is bad because the animations are fucking shit and everything feels and sounds terrible. Souls combat was never good but at least it felt pretty satisfying, dark souls 2 completely drops the ball.

>>523664958Yeah, it's easily one of the most annoying areas in the game. Visually it's complete eye-cancer and looks like some shit out of launch-era PS2 game. And the first main area, where the boss fog to smelter is, is complete bullshit and a good example of everything wrong with DS2 enemy placement and level design. Especially in the vanilla version where you have greatbow archers shooting at you from every possible direction.

>>523663403Invalidated by lack of any metrics to gauge the proposed statistics. Arguably, given that das2 is widely known for dodging being more difficult and that many struggled to adjust. Then is it not so those who were able to adjust are higher functioning than those who did not?

>>523659807It seems even people who enjoy DaS2 have mediocre and half finished brains.

>>523665318Because dark souls 2 is where it went south.There were a lot of expectations for the game which got promptly let down.Dark souls 3 also looks shiny and has some production value which makes it at least appear better superficially, so it doesn't get nearly as much flak.

>DS1>DS2>DS3You mean, DaS? I didnt know they made several Demon's Souls, you fucking faggots

>>523666341I'd argue DS2's lore is better than DS3. DS3 feels like it barely has any lore at all and is just a hodgepodge of DS1 references. But either way, both are underwhelming because they don't really seek to do anything new

>>523666375I can't hear you over my powerstancing. Also, cloth physics.

>>523663665so why cant DaS2 do the same retard, hurr durr time is convoluted.

>>523666054>tries to have interesting npcs>tries to have interesting environments>tries to have interesting bosses>tries to have challenging combatEvery good thing it does has a shittier thing attached to it.DS3 attempts to fix most of these issues while actually failing blatantly in the few areas that DS2 actually SUCCEEDED in.

Uhm...bros?

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>>523665318Because its better made game, it has its flaws, like how grey everything looks, how linear the world is, and etc, but shitter like to parrot that DS3's stamina is too broken even though the combat is way more fast paced, so enemies and bosses are faster, they try to trick you up more, and due to your faster movements,decent hitbox and more stamina you can deal with more enemies at the same giving you more reason to fight group of enemies since you won't be gangbanged, its the natural evolution of dark souls 1 combat(with the exception of poise), it would be better if they kept power stance from ds2, but it is still an overall a better game to play than dark souls, DS3 has a constant quality with very few drops, DS2 has a few highpoints, but most of the time the quality of the game plummets to the bottom and lastly DS1 has a greater peak than both of them but it drops in quality after the halfway point.

>>523666893>but I think each of those things is actually good!!

>>523666701Demon's is DeS retard.

>>523666893Everything you listed is what is supposed to be good about a Souls games, it has nothing to do objectively with DS1, when DS3 in fact straight up pulls a lot of shit from DS1.

>>523667070>but shitter like to parrot that DS3's stamina is too broken even though the combat is way more fast paced, so enemies and bosses are fasterfaster does not mean better. DS3 combat is still oversimplified and streamlined garbage that just amounts to spamming panic-rolls and mashing R1s. It's all spectacle with little substance underneath, choosing to look flashy and "cool" even though the reality is that it's mind-numbingly dull and just tricks brainlets into thinking its better

>>523667070Don't go down this road man, just don't reply. DaS2fags are some the most sniveling disingenuous faggots on the board, they will pretend everything you said is untrue and just say "rollspam rollspam" like some sacred chant.

>>523666703The big takeaways from each game go something like this:>You can burn a though guy to continue the age of fire or just let it fade away. Everyone and everything is slowly dying.>Turns out it doesn't matter because anyone who gathers enough souls can make that choice, also there's a guy called Aldia who's doing some shit, making cute girls and dragons, trying to recreate immortal beings from before the age of fire. Oh shit, he's a tree now.>People have been abusing the process of linking the fire to the point it doesn't even work anymore, but there might be a way out if you either go full hollow and stab your wife in the face or find a new pair of eyes for your other wife, or not. Also remember that boss from the first game?

>>523666054>trying too hard to be ds1Look I think ds2 has problems too but that's a nonsensical argument, it deviates from ds1 in plenty of ways including its basic plot and how it's told

>>523667380You might want to read the whole chain, because I was merelly quoting somebody. I actually share the same opinion as you.

>>523667070DS3 is for people who like polish over substance. Its just that simple. Pretty much the people who watch capeshit.

>>523667240Yeah, DS2 just really sucks for the most part compared to DeS or DS1. Would rather play it than nuBioware stuff so it’s not the worst.

>>523667070There's good fast, and then there's the kind of fast that's more comparable to premature ejaculation, DaS 3 is more like the latter.Seriously, bosses don't have decent HP until NG +3 and R1 spam is ridiculous.

>>523667689What substance?

>>523667338rollspam is an objective issue with Dark Souls 3, and just because the game was designed around rollspamming does not make it better.

>>523660043>it was all a dreamI used to read word-up magazine

>>523667884What is spam? Define it for me.

>>523661043Vertical elevators are a metaphor for time-travel

>>523667884>roll spam for DS3>ADP dumping for DS2All they needed to do was just make equip load and stamina not tied to the same stat like in DS1, yet here we are

>>523663403Whoever made this graph is an absolute retard and doesn't into bell curves.

>>523667702Whatever floats your boat, just refrain from saying dumb shit next time okay user!?

Dark Souls 2 is bad. /thread

>>523667948Instead of other games where you have to weigh the pros/cons of dodge, such as worrying about timing, spacing, and stamina management, dark souls 3 just gives you a fuckton of i-frames, almost nonexistent recovery lag, and rolling uses almost no stamina at all. Basically in all but a very few circumstances, there is no risk to rolling, period.

>>523667372>Also remember that boss from the first game?Why do you people only accuse DS3 of this when Ornstein is LITERALLY just straight up a boss in DS2?

>>523668029Yeah, ADP is by far one of the worst ideas ever implemented into a souls game. I have no idea what they were thinking including a playability stat and forcing you to pump that shit to 25 unless you want a tedious slog of a game. The debate between 2 and 3 is a hard one, since both games have huge negatives but for polar opposite reasons. Ultimately I still prefer replaying DS2 more because a lot of its jank can be overcome/bypassed when you know how the game works, and for me its build variety and replayability win out over DS3, where PVP is trash, and the world is linear and the build variety is nonexistent so all playthroughs feel the same.

If they ever made another Souls game, I wonder what the chances are that From just says fuck it and removes invaders entirely. The entire series has been spent gimping them more and more, with DaS3 being the worst offender. From very clearly hates invaders but it's THE feature of the series.

>>523659293Ok what about the random ledge to nowhere in the castle?

>>523668315>Instead of other games where you have to weigh the pros/cons of dodge, such as worrying about timing, spacing, and stamina managementSo what's really interesting is that you don't have to do this much differently in the other games at all, because everything is much slower including followup attacks. The "almost nonexistent recovery lag" in 3 is still going to get you killed half the time because of how much faster every enemy attacks.

>>523668276>DS2 feels entirely unique from DS1You first. It just feels rushed, reusing tons of assets and failing to feel different.

>>523666908OH NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

>>523668764Elden Ring will essentially be a sprititual successor to souls games and they said it’ll still have multiplayer. It’s possible that only means cooperators but I’d say invasions are here to stay.

>>523668764God I hope so, these games are so much better offline anyway.

>>523662716You know clinging to one minor, minor mistake you probably didn't even know about either until after the fact in a video thats hours long as a refutation of the entire video makes you look less credible not more, right?

>>523668880>reusing tons of assetsName em. I want to see how much you can pull from your ass.

>>523668981>you probably didn't even know about eitherI agree with your post overall but don’t say this stupid shit, anyone who played DS2 pvp at all knew what the jester’s chest piece did.

>>523668412There are 3 "Ornsteins" in Dark Souls 3, and he is not the only one who shows up either.

>>523659293I'm sure this was the creator's intent but the limitations the consoles had at the time prevented the volcano from loading.

>>523659293there's no mountain like that behind Earthen Peakjust stop it's hilarious that someone actually spent time to draw this though

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>>523660043>It's a grief-fueled mind-prison emanating from the rotted brain of a stillborn child of a murdered ocean godFix'd.The Hunter's Nightmare is fucking rad and the "stacked world" structure makes sense when you consider how The Healing Church was twisting and building upon the world born from the Orphan's trauma for their own purposes.

>>523669179?

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>>523669047Pate's set, Black Leather set, Judgement set, Catarina set, Knight set, Elite Knight set, Dark set, Monestary set, Xanethous set, weapons coming up soon.

>>523668851Different user, but the lack of punishment is disproportionate with the increased pace of the combat. You can roll like 6 times in a row from the start with 0 investment in endurance, and the base i-frames are higher than mid-roll i-frames from Dark Souls 1.

>>523659293

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>>523668851>The "almost nonexistent recovery lag" in 3 is still going to get you killed half the time because of how much faster every enemy attacks.No, what gets you killed in 3 is STOPPING your panic rolls and trying to go in for an attack when the spastic bloodborne-reject enemy or boss isn't done its tedious 7-hit flailingI think the only time in 3 that you will generally get shrekt during your brainless panic rolling is phase-2 dancer. That's about it

>>523669453There's dead Ornstein in the dragon temple, the dragon slayer armor, and then the dragon slayer miniboss from the second DLC.

>>523669483I don't think you understand what the word "asset" means. The DS2 versions of these armors are new designs. There are reused assets in DS2 (just as there are assets in DS1 reused from DeS) but these ain't it

>>523664664absolutely filtered

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>>523669492I really don't think so. You still have to time your rolls properly or eat shit, and you eat shit much more quickly and easily than you do in the other games. It doesn't matter how many times you can roll if the enemies are swinging enough to get you inbetween consistently.

>>523669901That was a kino moment in vidya history

>>523669483Literal brainlet.

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>>523669756Not a single one of those is the exact same boss lifted from the first game, that is the entire issue, what are you smoking.

>>523664078Is Kojima World Order still after his ass like the autistic kids they are?

>>523669047>textures from Undead Burg and the like that don't even make sense where they are used>enemies like Ornstein Skeleton wheels, the Bed of Chaos bug, etc.>assets like CU's shitjar, Lordvessel, the giant malformed skulls from Tomb of the Giants, >multiple weapons and armor sets>music like the one for the Gargoyles

>>523669483Like 2 drops of water...

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>>523669683I guess I didn't actually play Dark Souls 3 then because this wasn't my experience at all, but okay.

>>523670034Neither is Ornstein from Dark souls 2 you dork, it has different attacks and uses hexes instead of miracles. You are cherrypicking now.

>>523669970>WHY AM I TOXIC?DSP is a kind of a showman

>>523669282But there literally is and you can see it in this pic

>>523669915no, if you're mashing roll like ds3 wants you to, there's practically zero chance you'll get hit. And if you do get hit, you recovery quickly and can easily go right back to rollmashing away from the boss and pop off a split-second estus chug. 3 completely spits in the face of the gameplay design of the other souls games, where it's all about methodical combat and weighing the risks vs rewards of every move you make. Dark souls 3 is instead trying to be fucking devil may cry.

>>523670241best part was the based&redpilled invader baiting phil into aggroing the blacksmith

>>523669915Notice how all your arguments are "I think", "you should", etc. Meanwhile, you can go check the wiki and verify what I just said.If the game was subjectively harder for you then ok, can't argue with that. I'm trying to bring up more objective stuff myself because otherwise there's no point on even talking about this stuff.Because do you know what's the subjectively hardest Souls game? the first one you played.

>>523660043>>523660756>>523665034I am taking the bait, but you are actual fucking retard secondaries."Dream" thing is not literal. It is a parallel dimension with things not working as they should be in a more grounded reality.The fish village is literally above the Nightmare area, because you can see a snail woman from the fishing village fall down from the sky. And you can see the nightmare area/clocktower beneath the sea in the village zone. It directly references the stupid meme phrase uttered by stupid meme boss that the sky and sea and cosmos are just one big thing.>WOOOOW WOULD YOU LOOK AT THAT SHIT CODING, YOU FALL THROUGH THE WATER DURING THE ROM'S FIGHT AND THEN LAND ON SOME MORE WATER THAT YOU CAN WALK UPON FOR SOME REASON WOW

>>523670215It has almost the exact same moveset with a couple additions and deletions. No, the buttslam being purple instead of yellow is not different.

>>523663403dumbest curve I've seen on this godforsaken board, congratulations on that

I never understood this meme about DS3 copying DS1 and "having too much fa service". It's a true sequel that takes place in the same world (unlike DS2). DS1 "copied" Demon's Souls if anything, like Patches for example.

>>523670057No, they disbanded. Phil is literally unstoppable.

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>>523670215You are fucking delusional if you can’t tell the difference. Dragonslayer’s armor bears some visual similarities but the design is for the most part different and has a totally different moveset. DS2 ornstein is literally a palette swap and has a lot of the same moves. Those “new” hexes are just hex versions of his old lightning attacks. He even has a hex version of the fucking butt slam he inherits from killing smough and it looks especially dumb on his small model.

>>523666908this shit bothered me more than Earthen Peak