They have to deal with the pejorative of being labled as dumbfuck hillbillies from everyone, i understand their position, but burgers will have to act alongside burger politics
Say this too, truly nothing in burger politics is safe from identity focused politics. It's like they don't even want to win over the working class with better rhetoric, they are repeating the same tired shit that pushed away everyone from the left to begin with.
A couple of people from the local ANTIFA chapter actually started the Redneck Revolt chapter in my city so they really are ANTIFA 2.0
Was it really, though? Personally, I always thought the "take back redneck" thing was stupid. Though tbf, that is a weird statement to be coming from them since I've heard so much about them uniting on economic grounds.
RR is a bunch of hipsters pretending they grew up in a trailer park, and it's insulting. Their "range" video also showed how incompetent they are and that their only real goal is to stand in public with a firearm thinking this does anything when everyone knows they can't use them properly. Do not get involved with this group if you want to avoid being shot by cops and people who actually know how to use a weapon.
Also, standing around waiting to get shot is fucking stupid, and you should never do it. If you're carrying a rifle, it better be because you're on your way to a fight.
If you thought even for a second that redneck revolt wasn't idpol as fuck, then you're a fucking retard. It was right on their web page. You saw it when they trotted out that banner that listed a bunch of "oppressed" groups, as if that meant anything, and you saw it when they avoided the economic issue. Redneck revolt was always idpol shit, and you're an idiot for believing otherwise.
Did I ever tell you the definition of insanity?
Is it just me or does "anti" idpol sound a lot like idpol these days?
Both crowds are pretty annoying tbh. Not everything that has to do with minority and trans rights is automatically idpol. What I do have a problem with is that when identity takes center focus and that class/economic concerns should be dealt with after when really economic and social issues should be tackled together. The article the OP linked pretty much says focus on racism first which isn't bad praxis, it just needs a bigger focus on class issues that cause racism to begin with
Hate to say it, but I got the impression this is largely true. About the idpol thing, what did you expect from a group whose actual goal was "reclaiming" a "redneck identity" for the left? It's basically the left's equivalent of when some queer or nonwhite decides it'd be edgy if they kowtowed for the far right and became an "unusual" pundit for them to use as a shield, it puts too much emphasis on going contrary to what people expect. Literally "reactionary" in a way.
No. It isn't.
Defining your politics by your kneejerk reaction to a specific other group's politics?
Reactionary refers to wanting to go backwards in terms of progress. IE people shilling for absolutist monarchy etc.
Stop using words you don't know the meaning of.
I know that's one way to use the word, I just thought the way I used it was another way, I'd seen someone else use it that way here before. Guess I was wrong then.
It's ok. We all gotta learn.
I absolutely agree.
They aren't against fascism. They're against racism, and that's where it likely ends. It's just liberals wanting to LARP as poor whites.
So why? Have you read the article? Did you understand their position? Can you argue why is it wrong? And no, ignoring the very real, material components of racism and whining about some vaguely defined "material conditions" is not a critique.
Their entire platform revolved around white people being obligated to "defend PoC" from "Fascism" from the very beginning.
I don't give a fuck about "PoC" I only care about white people.
I have no opponents on Holla Forums
Just murricans being murricans. You can't escape idpol in the land of burger.
The interviewer is clearly a generic idpol liberal but the redneck revolt guy seems based. He states that what they're actually doing is organising armed working class communities based on mutual aid. I see no problem here unless you're so triggered by people saying 'white supremacy' it invalidates genuine leftist praxis.
Why would I want to fight against white supremacy? I wish to entrench it.(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
This is a leftist infighting thread, not everything is about you.
"racism" is never going to end just like how the war on drugs is unending. the cultural revolution should show us all we need to know in how theory can make anyone a traitor as it bends and yields to those who twist it
Eh who cares. If they can inoculate portions of the left against kneejerk gun control rhetoric then they're a net positive. Also the article title itself is painfully misleading, and I have a feeling OP knew that and didn't provide a link for that very reason
And most sane people wish to entrench their fists in your face but hey we can't have everything we want now huh
The fact that a fucking rose supports Reddit Revolt should be more than enough to convince any real leftist to be against it.
And what have you done recently, mister real leftist? What have you done to get us closer to revolution.
you can't deal with racism without first dealing with its economic roots racism is a defense mechanism against migrant labor, or against reserve army of labor in general by entrenched portions of the proletariat
By this logic capitalism is never going to end either so why don't we all just turn off our computers and read Bordiga?
Mmm, yes, because screeching like a harpy about "racism" is helping the leftist cause and doing anything other than alienate the proletariat who dont give a shit about your idpol nonsense and would rather not be demonized for holding tribalistic attitudes.
Have you read the interview?
Yea! Listen to Schomo and beat up 'em privileged White peoples working at Walmart!
t. imbecile who has not read the article
How so? Capitalism is based on material conditions. Racism is a shifting definition that went from thoughts of racial supremacy to how many board members of a company are ethnic.
Whites who want live and have jobs and shit in their own countries be racist!
Dont bother, they're too wrapped up in pointless idpol to get it through their heads that white people aren't evil. Shit like this is why most leftists worth their salt have turned to the far right for answers and are staying, because at least the proletariat aren't demonized over there.
Fuck off Holla Forums, your idpol is just as cancerous as your SJW enemies
What. Have. You. Done. Lately?
In the end if you really want to you can make anything "racist" and it's a never ending struggle session as more and more ways to define a racist are somehow discovered. Can't build unity in anyway when you are laser focused on what divides us. That's why of course class identity is the only identity that matters.
I haven't concern trolled about racism, unlike a certain rose. Also, nice job avoiding the argument.
Sure, he says that, but then they go around basically only talking about muh POC, and other retarded white guilt bullshit that only alienates the working class. Not once have they directly appealed to the white working class on an economic argument. It's always about how they were fooled to hate blacks. And the whole armed thing is retarded because none of them have ever been taught how to shoot, much less how to fight. Redneck Revolt is idpol, and if you don't see it, you're a retard or an SJW hunting for more "allies". Kill yourself.
They constantly talk about how racism is a tool of the ruling class to divide that working class.
So you've done nothing then, ok
You just did:
Anti-racism is still beneficial to the cause of the left.
Exactly, anti-racism= anti-idpol; why is this hard to understand
Big surprise there.
They are working on building unity among the black and white working classes. That's what they mean when they say that they are focusing on racism.
Yes, they constantly talk about racism, and that's exactly the problem.
This kind of thing presupposes that whites and blacks are naturally divided and that whites are naturally racist. It's insulting, to say the least.
Not if you're using that as your way of convincing the white working class.
I'm just trying to tell a disillusioned former leftist that he's wasting his time is all
God, fucking Brett came so close to making a good point how racism divides the working class and that it's important to approach whites before reactionaries do, but he had to go full retard and completely misunderstood class society, go full idealist and then ending racism will damage capitalism, and go full asshole and say that white proles benefit from the system instead of simply being fucked over less. No prole benefits from Capitalism, it's that fucking simple. Also what the fuck does this mean:
You mean fucking retards who don't understand basic theory? How the fuck could someone go from "the current leftist movement is really shitty and not actually advancing leftism" to "that means I should become part of the movement that wishes to violently suppress leftism"? No, instead they're manipulated into being class collaborationists.
Except they have to be retarded and say that white supremacy exists and that it actually benefits the white working-class. Institutional racism is not fucking white supremacy; there is only one supremacy and that is bourgeoisie supremacy.
The white working class does need to be convinced that racism works against their self-interest, but they shouldn't fucking be told they're privileged while you're also telling them capitalism is fucking them over.
>we need to MAKE THE WORD "REDNECK" GREAT AGAIN key word in that sentence, retards.
If leftism means putting the interest of foreign races ahead of class and demonizing me for being white and male, then I am not a leftist, to paraphrase Karl Marx.
Pretty much every WWC person I've ever met is anti-racism.
Most whites already know this. The problem is that you keep acting like they don't and wanting to preach to them. We're not living in the 60s. Most whites aren't racist, and your assumption that they need to be taught presupposes that they are.
Yeah, which is why it's stupid to come at them by saying they need to not be racist.
That's not what Leftism means and even if it did that doesn't give justification for being a fascist.
The majority aren't, but people targeted by reactionaries could be, which is why it's useful to counter recruit them. Many people already believe in the idea that foreign immigrant labor is taking their jobs and therefor the problem is the immigrants and not the system seeking for higher and higher profits.
You aren't going to get whites, who already resent being thought of as racist and therefore more receptive to people telling them to be proud of their race, to side with you by telling them that racism is bad. I don't know why you idpol faggots can never get this through your head.
Immigrants ARE taking jobs and depressing wages though. Limiting immigration and building a wall and deporting illegal immigrants is a perfectly viable solution. "Leftists" such as yourself simply pass the buck to it being a feature of capitalism while never offering any solutions yourself and working to undermine all nativist movements. Therefore you are nothing more than a gatekeeper for the Jewish bourgeoisie and a class traitor.
And a race traitor too assuming you're white and not Jewish.
You not only offer nothing but actively work make things worse and push more and more white people in our direction.
No it doesn't? In the USA the ruling class tells the white working class to hate their black comrades. This is a historical fact.
Yes, yes it does. If you go up to me and give me a lecture about how it's wrong to be racist, it presupposes that I might be a racist, or I might not know this. It's retarded idpol and it needs to stop.
Wow don't be so triggered that some people want to share their views with you.
What the fuck does this even mean? The most important aspects of racism are economic.
Do you see how condescending that sounds? Don't be surprised if people call your idpol for what it is. If anyone is triggered here, it's you because people resist the idea that you should focus on racism when talking to whites.
They believe that the revolution won't happen tomorrow and therefore the best they can work towards is uniting the working class which will hopefully lead to a more revolutionary situation.
The ruling class tells us to love negros and feel guilty that they were enslaved and to miscegenate with them and to revere them on MTV and the radio. We hate them of our all volition, totally contrary to their wishes. Negros are glorified by the bourgeoisie every step of the way.
Anti racism isn't anti capitalist. Racism is anti capitalist.
Doesn't sound like what you are talking about
makes you think
is this really what "leftists" think today? so much for the radical left!
Class is racialized in burgerland.
Any left movement that isn’t explicitly anti-racist here goes fash really quick (Greens, Occupy, Democratic Cops of America).
I see you are trying to obfuscate by posting something completely irrelevant. What is the first of the RR principles listed on their site? Hint: it's not about economics. Let's see some excerpts from it. Gee, sure sounds like if you're white and working class, you still have a "responsibility" to other races. You see, liberation is not about you, it's about muh PoC. This totally doesn't alienate whites that are tired of being called racist and privileged. Or how about their about page? Let's see what main ideas there are. So if you look about their about page, it's really about calling themselves rednecks and being against racism, not about helping white workers out. Not once does it mention the need to move white workers forward. It only talks about their responsibility to others. This is why white workers do not like these organizations. They are led by liberals interested in LARPing as revolutionaries.
This is why you lose. You only seek to attract liberals.
It's funny to me that these city kids throw their idpol into these organizations, when if they knew shit about rednecks and rural folk they'd know they generally have a distrust of the rich. It really wouldn't be hard to convert them if you used terms other than communism or explained what communism actually is without saying the trigger word.
Tell me how successful any anti-idpol group has been in the US.
Well, they got their guy in the white house. If only the left realize that we don't need SJWs and that they are detrimental to our movement. It's the same thing that is starting to eat the right because they're obsessed with race and white people in the US generally aren't racist. I don't know how hard this is for both sides to grasp.
You didn't answer the question.
In my experience they seem to actually have appeal among poor urban whites in the south, but the redneck identity one way or the other is almost always a posture so it's kind of inauthentic in a sense one way or another.
Standing around with guns is actually not that bad. If they're shit at guns they can get better, the message that they're armed is more than a lot of people will put out there.
The “they’re shit with guns” crit is dumb as fuck too lmao has this person been around III%’ers or even active cops for that matter?
The right didn't start by being white identitarians. They started by riffing off SJW stupidity, then easing their way into fascism. I know you people like to forget that, but that is exactly how it happened.
I told you already. No, it's not a leftist group, but that's because the left seems to be obsessed with idpol, and lately we have a lot of retards trying to push it in this board.
It's from the article, how is it irrelevant?
Obviously if you choose the name "redneck" which evokes the image of a racist southern who has drank away his brain and wears only clothing with the Confederate flag on it, the first thing you are going to do is assure everyone that you are not racist. Of course if you weren't so selective in choosing which principles to read you would have found out that every other principle is about helping workers out.
Hmmm this has nothing to do with moving the working class forward, it's just alienating """reverse racism,""" amrite??
Totally not idpol
Buddy. Buchanan, Reagan, Atwater, Nixon, and Wallace were all identitarians and are all spiritual successors to the current mainstream and fringe right.
Yeah, I'll totally believe some random guy on the internet. The fact is that RR doesn't even make a blip.
Standing around while armed is dangerous because you are likely to fuck up and accidentally point it at someone who will be only too happy to light you up. It also makes you look retarded like the militia movement. You look retarded, and nobody wants to be around armed incompetents. Guns are not for posing in public. Stop treating them as such.
Active cops have SWAT, which generally is good, and you shouldn't be aiming to match the militia movement. Those guys are fucking stupid.
Are you literate or what? How fucking stupid can you be?
When you keep talking about racism with people who aren't racist, those people might be tempted to think that you're treating them differently for the color of their skin. Yes, that's idpol. Drop it and get over it.
This might come as a surprise to you, but people generally like to think that their politicians will help them first. Congratulations on not understanding that poor working people want help and Trump offered it (although we all knew it was bullshit).
We can't read your mind, only what you actually write down.
It is aimed at racists. Do you even understand what counter-recruitment is?
Except that the modern white power movement didn't come out of the republican party. It came from the outside and people tired of being called racist. Get over it. Liberals like you made this happen.
No, but it seems you are. I already told you that idpol is what is killing the modern resurgence of the right, but you seem to think that adding idpol to the left is beneficial, when it's not.
Well that's fucking stupid, because most white workers aren't racists. Don't you think it would be easier to recruit the critical mass first? Oh, yes that would be smart, but liberals can't help themselves from talking about racism.
It literally fucking did. Read Atwater. Read Buckley.
It didn't, else it wouldn't have toppled much of the republican establishment. Stop being delusional, identity politics caused people to turn to people like Trump, and more idpol isn't going to save you. It's time to drop it.
For fuck's sake, have you heard of the Southern Strategy?
No Google allowed.
For fuck's sake have you heard we're not living in the late 60s, you fucking retard?
This thread is filled with a bunch of retards that 1) didn't read the article 2) conflate any challenge to racism with idpol 3) are coastal morons that doesn't know what kind of issues are still ongoing in rural and southern areas where a left wing militia movement would actually be popular.
There is no article linked ITT.
I know they don't retard, but the modern resurgence of the identitarian right didn't come from the southern strategy and did from people displeased with being constantly called racist and having their economic issues ignored.
Why would I make that up?
The Black Panthers actually seemed to do ok with this.
Looking retarded doesn't really matter, let alone "retarded like the militia movement." The right like to wave their guns around - yeah it's retarded, but it's also well-threatening. So the situation is the cops flaunt them, the military flaunt them, right-wing hordes flaunt them, and the left is worried about looking stupid and dangerous.
Because you want people to buy into and idpol organization you like.
The black panthers weren't living in a time when violence was as likely as today. Like it or not, the organizations were strong and street violence wasn't necessitated by the other parties. There was no honest fascist movement at the time. We are more likely to see street conflict today than then.
It's not to anyone that knows how to use a weapon.
The military and the police doesn't stand around waiting to get shot at, and neither should you. It's fine if you want to have some kind of QRF that's armed and ready, but don't just go out there with a rifle so that people can look at you armed. That's stupid. Unless you're making a concrete show of force with the intention of getting in a shootout, you should not be doing this. Force patrols are a thing, but that is not what these people are doing, nor do I think they know themselves.
what fucking alternate dimension are you from?
The panthers lived in the golden age of American institutions. They weren't likely to see street brawls because nothing they did was going to change things, and their protests were meaningless.
Jesus Christ. Have we dropped any semblance of materialism on this board? This is literally Goebells-tier propaganda. No, SJWs didn't cause the far right. The far right grew because of economic dislocation and the American middle class being materially incentivized to support fascism over any leftist politics
Yes, the far right grew because of that, but the left would have grown if it wasn't for idiots putting people off with idpol.
The article was full of idpol tripe. The RR guy said that capitalism is supported by a bedrock of white supremacy, but it’s obviously the other way around. Even the Black Panthers understood that capitalism was the disease and racism was the symptom. Furthermore the way he addressed racism was identitarian as fuck. It was all about allowing minorities to express their culture and racial identity while telling whites that they benefit from a system of oppression (which requires MTW tier logic to justify). There was no indication that they were struggling not only against racism, but against the concept of race altogether, which is what anti idpol means. One of the main talking points of the alt-right is the double standard on the left. Liberals encourage people to view politics through an identitarian lens, and so they band together according to their identities and act politically through their identities. They talk about the black vote and the gay vote and the one legged Philipino lesbian with Down’s syndrome vote. These groups are encouraged to organize along those identitarian lines, so when whites do the logical thing and follow suit you have the birth of white identitarian groups. They tell every little group that they deserve representation and are all equal. Then they turn around and look at white men and tell them that they are bad for doing exactly what everybody else is encouraged to do. So not only does it divide the proles, not only does it degenerate into Nation of Islam tier ethnonationalism among minorities, but on top of it all it drives whites into the arms of fascists.
This kind of white shaming and promotion/entrenchement of identity that is spun in that article is exactly what is fuelling the alt right, and porky is laughing all the way to the bank.
unless of course you are in the part of the country with rednecks, at which point it just evokes rural working class people.
Not denying RR a shit tho
Wrong. People in this country are mini-porkies who worship property.
Cultural demoralization and destruction is the only chance the left had.
Do you know ANYTHING about this fucking country?
IDpol was the only thing the left could cling to.
The labor movement has been right-wing for over a century now.
Not /pol. Thanks.
No, not really. Trump promised employment and more wealth for the working poor. Hillary promised more of the same. He was never going to keep his promise, but desperate people cling to anything.
Cling to idpol as you would a snake, that is to say not at all.
And that's the fault of liberal identitarians who decided that race was more important than class. Obviously putting race first again isn't going to bring those workers back into the fold.
At the rate enemies of communism are accumulating, Posadas may have the right idea.
My first post in the thread was shitting on them.
Honestly, the Klan was probably bigger back then. Not Fascist, sure, I guess. And state/police violence was seen as more acceptable.
Yet it culminates in various church and clinic attacks. And know how to use a weapon or not - if you're a hardcore ninja but the other guy is the one with the katana and you didn't come for a fight, your expertise doesn't eliminate the threat.
Well, the military does at the airport, but that's different I guess.
If that's what the other guys are doing, then they deserve one. If not, then I don't see why right-wingers don't take your advice.
M8, Reagan passed gun laws in California just because of how scared the establishment was.
Right-wingers are stupid, and I'm not interested in helping them out. You shouldn't carry weapons just for the sake of showing off. Be armed with a purpose. The best place to get in a shootout isn't out in the open street.
And that was the end of it. There was no need for extra-legal avenues of repression.
The thing you have to understand is that I'm not telling you not to be armed, only that open-carrying a rifle isn't doing anything useful. Keep a pistol if you're out in public, and if you break out the long guns, you better be on your way to a covered position so you can shoot without getting shot. Never put yourself in a position of the one that reacts. The right is willing to use terrorist tactics to kill us. The best thing to do is to have a stand-by set of properly trained individuals waiting to fuck shit up, not just some LARPers out in the street trying to look cool and failing. That's old fat white guy militia-tier.
It absolutely does
A good 40% of the anti-idpol stuff on leftypol is not good faith economism, but instead straight up reactionary ideology
You people never make direct attacks on arguments. It's always the smear of "reactionary" instead.
Reminder that hardcore idpols smeared RR for not being idpol enough some time back. The usual impossible to substantiate "sexual abuse" tactic was used. Anyone who wants to focus on race and sex idpol "issues" is here to sheepdog leftists into being the militant wing of liberal parties and away from leftism. You can see such people even in this thread. NO WAR BUT THE CLASS WAR
Since you have no idea what Leftism is and have no grasp on theory, you were obviously not valuable. If you think politics is just some tribal game where if one side treats you badly that means you automatically go over to the opposite, then it's probably best you go over to the far-right and damage them.
It's not about saying that they're racist or should be ashamed, is about saying how what these other guys are peddling don't actually work for you, and that working class unity is in your best interest. Anti-racism is anti-idpol.
Why do you think presently yourself as threatening and capable of reacting to an attack isn't useful? It's useful just in the fact that it shows Leftists aren't actually anti-gun, which is a huge thing for a lot of people.
I always hear this same criticism and I've never seen anyone present any examples or evidence.
You can make that argument without making your member hold banners listing all the oppressed groups you support and not once talking about poor whites.
Anti-racism the way these fags go about it is idpol, and you know it.
Because standing out in the open with a weapon you clearly don't know how to use is not threatening, nor does it make you capable to reacting to an attack. You can be pro-gun without being fucking stupid.
It depends on who you're trying to appeal to. If you're in a minority-predominant area with people who have a bad history with whites, then it's important to show solidarity. If you're talking to poor whites you obviously shouldn't bring up race unless they're being baited by reactionaries. I do know it and I've never argued against that. Then this is a question of them being incapable, which I don't know either way, not necessarily the practice of openly displaying guns.