Leaked: U.S. Special Operations Forces Massacred Nearly 100 Random Civilians in Somalia

This isn't really funny. That's the body of a like, a pre-teen. As in between the ages of 9-13.

Got a real source?

I mean I get jokes about terrible shit, but joking about the body of a child is kind of fucked and a bit too edgy for my tastes.

>A Somali National Army soldier who arrived later at the scene estimated there were between 10 and 13 U.S. Special Operators in the village who, he said, were Navy SEALS
not surprising. seals are the roided-out fratboys of the sof world

By U.S. AFRICA COMMAND PUBLIC AFFAIRS, United States Africa Command Stuttgart, Germany Aug 25, 2017

We are aware of the civilian casualty allegations near Bariire, Somalia. We take any allegations of civilian casualties seriously, and per standard, we are conducting an assessment into the situation to determine the facts on the ground.

We can confirm that the Somali National Army was conducting an operation in the area with U.S. forces in a supporting role.

U.S. forces are in Somalia at the request of the Federal Government of Somalia and are committed to helping Somali forces neutralize al-Shabaab and bring stability to the region.

africom.mil/media-room/pressrelease/30134/aug-25-civilian-casualty-allegation-assessment-results-released

(You're right)

...

they'll make Africa stable by depopulating it. flawless logic.

Could we stop pretending to know exactly what happened? This is fucking retarded. 5.56 belt ammo isn't rare and it isn't like we don't export that shit. As for the Somalians, they do have the M4 carbine, as well as 5.56 belt-fed weapons. So this article is outright false in that respect. That doesn't mean that US Special Forces didn't do this, but it does mean that there is room for doubt. There's also reasoning behind it. For one thing, it's unlikely that they were ordered to do this. This is counter-productive, and US Special Forces are all about cultivating relationships so they can get natives to fight for the US. It seems unlikely that they'd get their hands dirty like this. So if this was US Special Forces, it's a couple of rogue teams. This is rare, but not unheard of. If true, these guys are going to prison.
So really, this is just a sensationalist headline. All we know is that there are dead people some maybe shot with NATO weaponry. We don't know for sure who it was, nor do we know if there was an actual encounter there, nor almost anything else. Let's wait until the facts come out, and I say this because this just doesn't seem something the US Special Forces would do. This is completely fucking their own shit up and making it more dangerous for them to operate in country. Contrary to popular belief, the US does things out of self interest, not out of some mustache-twirling villainy.

The source is in the article itself

>For details released in the last 24 hours on the Aug. 25 operation, visit: africom.mil/media-room/pressrelease/29846/civilian-casualty-allegations-in-somalia

Fuck. Then allow me to retract this comment:

Those guys are fucking dicks.

...

Really. The US military does things out of self interest? Well, I suppose robbing homes of people they killed is in their self interest.

I've already retracted my comment. If SEALs are involved, it's more likely than not that they fucked it up. I doubt they were ordered to kill civilians, but these guys are trigger happy. I don't know why, but they're like that. Two of them recently killed a US Special Forces soldier because he discovered they were embezzling funds.

Pretty sure the guys doing the robbing were the Somalians.

theintercept.com/2017/01/10/the-crimes-of-seal-team-6/

Let's not pretend that SEALs are some outlier in the US military machine though.

We're talking about the Navy Seals here. And regardless, even if that was true, they were operating under US supervision. If they did, the soldiers simply allowed it.

When they do it to us, it's terrorism. When we do it to them, it's either done to protect freedom/american values, or it's collateral damage incurred in the prosecution of those aims.

Those are almost certainly US weapons involved. Even if the US isn't directly responsible, they bear an enormous degree of culpability for allowing their arms to fall into the hands of murderers.

Still, it's probably a result of direct American action.

Jesus Christ

First, don't call them soldiers, and second, they aren't allowed to intervene. When local forces decide they want to do something, they do so. You can write a report, but that's about it. They are hosting you, and you're there as an adviser. Now, SEALs are fucking cowboy-wannabe faggots, so I get that they're overenthusiastic, but this is one thing they literally are not responsible for.

I've retracted that comment after learning that it wasn't SF, but SEALs involved, and I don't believe they were ordered to massacre civilians. This is extremely counterproductive.

This isn't collateral damage because the village they mowed down was never a target, they were entirely innocent. There is no evidence whatsoever they had even ten people in there that could have justified this.

I'm leaning towards, they got the wrong call on a village, and simply mowed down the wrong people. The fact that they're all so trigger happy to begin with regardless is more of a problem then any terrorist anyways. This event was, basically terrorism. State sponsored terrorism.

I'm actually completely desensitized to burger violence, the joke's on _me_

None of it would have happened if they hadn't just decimated the population of an entire village of people.

Understatement of the year

I don't doubt that they believed at first that it was a legitimate target, but guys at this level of training need to know how to assess a situation. If the Somalians started firing, they should have first identified targets and proceed from there, not just simply join in. However, we don't know how many rounds were expended. For all we know it was an initial burst and then it ceased, but these guys being what they are, I wouldn't be surprised if they kept it up as long as they could and blamed fog of war later.

It doesn't matter. The US enters into these useless wars knowing full well that civilians will die, and that mistakes will likely be made.

t. army cuck
Fuck you, You country and you people who do dirty jobs for them.

We don't know how that came to be exactly, so clearly we need to wait for an investigation. You can be sure that it will be properly carried out because right now some high-ranking officer is pissed as hell because someone kicked him in the dick. It's the wrong reason to carry out justice, but it will be carried out.

Not if they are punished for doing so. Don't wage wars if you can't control your men on the ground.

That can be said of any war. I'm not condoning the US being involved in Somalia. Only that it's a lot different to blame the US for knowingly risking lives, to outright ordering them to be taken.

I don't work for them anymore, and I never did anything I consider dirty. So maybe kill yourself or something.

Considering corroborating eye witness testimony my theory is they got the wrong village, and went to town. I mean these people are corroborating that they saw people dragged from their homes and forced in a line and shot.

And don't forget, at least one preteen was murdered just boiling water for tea, and her mother was shot on the couch. We have photographic proof of this event because the body is right there, in the photos taken.

They simply went berserk.

They aren't our men. How do you not get this?

Like I'm going to trust the US military to give an honest statement

You don't work for them anymore but you are still their bitch defending them anytime you can, stupid cuck. Go lick a booth or something, bitch

Uh, they are. There were fucking seals there. The villagers said the seals were active in doing this.

There's a difference, but I don't see why we shouldn't condemn the US in the harshest possible terms for this.

Are they not our allies? The US is responsible for the actions of its puppets.

Okay, I don't doubt this, but who was doing the dragging and shooting? This is important, because of US forces were involved in these actions, it's going to brew a shitstorm of epic proportions. If not, the SEALs might be dismissed if they can provide evidence they were affected by fog of war, or they might be sent to prison if it can be proved that they were just being fucking assholes.

This is horrible either way, but the thing I see in this thread is that the Somalian forces are not being blamed at all, and it's as if the US had done this on its own. None of those Somalian soldiers will likely be reprimanded for doing this.

I'm just surprised that one of the troops didn't rape someone. Fucking bastards.

You'll know based on whether they fire or jail people and who they fire or jail.

should've input 'war aint what it used to be' tbh fam

I'm trying to provide perspective and nuance. I'm sorry that you can't just say all Americans are baby killers. The fact is they aren't, and if you don't understand how the US operates, you will never know how and why it does things, or how and why individuals involved do things, nor how to recruit them, or how to best them. Of course, you likely are not interested in ever carrying a weapon to war.

Please, there's not going to be a shitstorm. The US covered up for soldiers doing this all the time during Iraq.The Navy seals aren't the duty bound wide eyed innocent patriotic do gooders you're really trying hard to make them out to be.

There's just one flaw in your theory.

The Somali troops were armed with AK-47s, and while yes, there was a mix of AK-47 and 56x45 mm NATO rounds, the majority of rounds recovered on site were from those 56x45 mm NATO rounds.

I don't doubt the SEALs killed civilians. I can believe that. I don't believe that they started dragging them out of their houses and executing them. A team of 20 wouldn't want to risk going into buildings willy nilly without sending the natives first.

The problem is we do.

What kind of maniac is interested in that?

Going out of your way to defend an event that lead to the deaths of nearly 100 people is repugnant. You can call it whatever you like, it's still the same to me.

Sure, and we can agree to that. One hundred percent, I think this is wrong, and I think the guys who are responsible should be punished, and I don't think the US should be involved everywhere, but of course, they are there by necessity (capitalism forces them to do this or lose to other capitalists who will do this). What I am saying, is that we need to have some nuance.

Children are dead with 56x45 mm NATO rounds in their bodies. What nuance do you want.

They shot at children.

The US is very permissive in what it allows of its allies. The relationship has always been to let host nations conduct their operations and have SF or other groups aid them, but not be directly involved. You have to understand that individuals on the ground have no authority over host nation forces. You cannot tell a native to stop beating a civilian. This is outside of your legally sanctioned power to do. So while I don't doubt that US forces misbehave, you have to understand that they are not 100% responsible for everything that happened here.

No dude, don't you get it? It was an accident, the US forces need to be there, the soldiers were only told there might be innocent civilians there. We need to stop and wait for the military to investigate themselves and let us know what they did wrong.

Hell of a fucking goof to just kill 100 people. Not ten people. Not 30 people. One Hundred people.

This is quite the goof, a bit of a misstep, a tender blunder. A flub with guns. A slight gaffe.

Internally there will be, and no, I don't think that military personnel are wide eyed patriots, but I do think the vast majority are professionals. If this many went bad at once, this speaks volumes of the kind of environment being cultivated there, and whoever is in charge of that is going to get fucked, because massacres do not serve US interests.

Report this fucking idiot already he's in every anti american military thread defending the soldiers

No you stupid fucking dumb american cunt you are in every thread where we talk about american soldiers. You always justify them and always defend them or give them the benefit of the doubt and shilling your pro soldier narrative. Your nuance is #notalltroops
Fuck you, I'm not an american. Your guys are not my ally, they are my enemy.
All americans soldier post vietnam if not baby killer are scum. I don't give a fuck if that was their only solution for studing or someshit like that. You obviously don't regret it like every other Middle east vet unless they loose a limb.
I understand that well
Again they are the enemy for every non american
Classic. Keyboard macho soldier cuck attitude. Get the fuck out of here would ya?
That's your nuance. "I'm so superior because i'm a woke vet". Fucking end yourself fucking waste
You know how during the vietnam war they changed the protesters name from antiwar to anti troop?
For anyone outside of the US that doesn't make a difference. I'm not anti war. I'm anti american, anti imperialism, anti troop

Anyone fancying themselves a socialists should at least be prepared for such an eventuality, especially in the political climate of today.

You keep saying I'm defending them, when I'm not. I'm only pointing out things you aren't thinking of in your haste to condemn the US, which accomplishes nothing and teaches you nothing.

...

That's a big round, there. Here I thought it was. 5.56. Clearly they were killed by rouge tanks.

This isn't really related to this incident because basically nobody was carrying weapons, but do you think it's inherently wrong to shoot at children or something? You realize they carry weapons too in some places, right?("Is it a bad idea for a military to shoot at children and families?" is a question nobody should be asking )

Yeah, nobody ITT said that. Nice strawman.

...

...

Being prepared for war is a far cry from being interested in shooting another man.

I mean, yeah

How about you "report" yourself for trying to censor a helpful perspective in discussion because emotions make it hard for you to think straight.

They really don't. If you don't believe me look into civil affairs. They know that mistakes and misbehavior lead to more native resistance. Civilian Affairs is there to fix those problems and pacify the population, and US military personnel undergo sensitivity training to avoid this, because more dead soldiers means more expenses in training their replacements, and it means a more protracted conflict. I'm not saying the US has managed to pull it off, but at least they recognize that bad PR is expensive, and that's why they aren't likely to order shit like this.

So that's why they're trying to cover this up and downplay how many people died, right?
Bad PR would make things so difficult for our honored soldiers to perform their duties. The US military certainly doesn't want dead soldiers on its hands!

The military never ever ever ever would cover up an atrocity, never ever

The fact that you are a vet already shows that you are biased no matter what, second your insight are ideological as fuck (not all soldiers, it's always the single not the whole, no choice and no faults in the individual, soldiers good boys) and american centric (How will you convince them? You need to convert them, we need to get them on our side)
You are the one who doesn't think straight here.

Where are these detailed accounts coming from.
Who was in all places at all times and new the names of all of those who were killed.

Even if they have some survivors/witnesses, they wouldn't have seen and heard everything, nor would they recognise one shout from another.
People don't remember very well when under extreme stress like being surrounded by gunfire and people dying.
This sounds like emotional propaganda.(Ban Evasion, this is your only post in your history and it's fairly convenient that its a post questioning the authenticity of what we have photographs of. Smells fishy to me.)

Plus defending shooting children, I mean what the fuck

Which is precisely why the US bears a great deal of culpability.

Did you just ban evaded or are you another american?

...

Stupid subhumans I wish a million more die by choking on bananas

Are there members of US Military that don't deserve to be shot?

As to be expected of the people from the same armed forces as the ones that were racing to shoot Bin Laden in order to get the better book deal despite having order to take him alive.

This is the guy who got originally banned. I appealed, but that's not my post. You can ban me for this, but I wouldn't have wasted time writing that if I was just going to evade the ban.

As long as they don't get caught in the act it's okay, but when someone survives to tell the tale then they have to court Marshall somebody.
You know the quote "no one notices if there is no one to notice."

SOF includes more than just SF so your contention that this isn't in SF's wheelhouse is completely irrelevant.

Man I thought neocons were extinct but I guess craven bloodthirsty soulless vampires like you still walk the earth

I was really shocked when I heard that. I mean child soldiers do exist, but none of the children in this village were child soldiers, they must have hit the wrong place. And now children are dead.

So is he just under the mindset any child in a wartorn area could potentially be a child soldier, so we should just indiscriminately mow down innocent fucking children? There was a boy making tea for his mother for christ's sake, and she was gunned down too, right in the chair she was sitting in.

How can anyone defend a rule book of killing entire families and look at yourself at the end of the day and say,

You're misrepresenting what I said. I said that child soldiers exist, and while it did not apply in this incident, children do get shot legitimately in many conflicts. Do you think the USSR didn't shoot at the child soldiers of the German Nazis?

That's not what you said, you said

And the answer is a gigantic yes. I'm not going to defend shooting up kids, I don't care where it might be. Sudan, Somalia, Iraq, Afghanistan, South America, North America, Africa, Europe, Asia, Australia, fucking Antarctica

I do not support shooting children, and I do not support the excuse that it's war either. It's a cruel demoralizing way of enforcing power, no different than the people you're warning us about.

Innocent kids died and I don't care if I'm called a white knight, I will never ever support anyone on this Earth loading a child full of lead.

Also, since I'm unbanned now, I want you guys to understand that I do not think anything that happened here is correct, at all, but you need to understand that even if this had never happened, and the US conducted all operations with the utmost care, minimizing civilian casualties, this would not change what the end effects are. In fact, you would have very little to criticize them on if this is what you focus on. You cannot oppose a world power like the US based on moral grounds, because the US is always striving to conduct cleaner, and less controversial conflicts. What do you have left if you cannot criticize them based on this? Let's say the guys that did this get life in prison, that the US pays off the families, and improves training so this doesn't happen again. Does that mean that the US war machine is somehow good now? No. It doesn't, and your focus on this kind of stuff robs you of perspective. American imperialism spreads through the illusion consent. This is why host nations are given autonomy, and why the US tries to endear itself to native populations. If it were up to all the people in charge, US soldiers would simply befriend everyone they encountered and convince them to surrender. This would not change the end effects of what the US does, which is a function of global capitalism. The US is a tool, not an agent.

Yeah, and I said that it didn't apply in this case. Why do you continue to misrepresent what I said?
Except that's not who I was referring to, and innocent kids can be forced to carry weapons and you would still have to shoot them. Even child soldiers are innocent, but they are the victims of those forcing them into conflict, not those they come in conflict with. Again, the children in this case were not armed, and I was not saying they specifically deserved to die, I was criticizing the gut reaction of claiming that something is wrong because children died, as if that is what was wrong in this case, and not simply guys going berserk on a village.

I misread the title as just SF, and that's why it sounded odd to me.

The kids diudn't have guns, fucker. 100 people died, mothers, fathers, families. Why do you seek to defend every aspect of this? This is a fucking disgrace

Why do you keep ignoring the fact that I specifically said this did not apply in this case? I've explained it multiple times now, and you continue to ignore this.

Because you're justifying the logic that allowed this to happen.

There was no logic in what happened here. This is a failure, but as I said, it will be corrected, and the effects of US imperialism will be the same. The US does not need, nor want massacres. It wants compliance, and the friendlier it can seem to host nations, the better.

But what logic are you talking about anyway? Please clarify so that we aren't arguing about things we're making up in our minds.

No it won't. There was no correction for the atrocities we covered up during the war in Iraq, the War in Afghanistan, the War in the Persian Gulf, the War in Vietnam, the War in Korea, and every fucking small little minor conflict we engaged in that's killed countless civilians covered up as a hush hush secret

It will never be corrected. It never has been corrected. All that comes from America is destruction, tragedy, death, and war. It doesn't change, it will never change.

You have no idea how this works. Nobody in charge likes seeing this because native populations turn hostile. This means it's harder to conduct operations. Hint: this event is bad for the US.

Except you're completely mistaken. Civil Affairs integration has never been higher, and sensitivity training has never been more thorough. Any mistreatment of civilians is taken seriously, to the point where 4th ID had tons of investigations because of allegations of mistreatment and many lost their jobs. Those convicted of crimes were sent to prison. Do you think an undisciplined military makes it easier or harder to further capitalist goals? You are not the one they care about when shit like this happens. The opinions they keep in mind are those of the native populations, and it's hard to cover up that someone's family was killed by US ordnance, or that their farm was destroyed by US bombing campaigns. The public has little say on how these wars are carried out and all the anti-war protesting hasn't put an end to conflict and never will as long as capital is involved.

Again, you're completely missing the point because you do not care to look past what America is. If the US did everything in the most ethical way possible, I guess you would stop complaining about imperialism.

As of yesterday AFRICOM is literally covering up the killing of 10 civilians in Somalia even after the Somali government paid out reparations to the families. Forgive me if I don't have the same faith in the military's commitment to transparency and accountability as you do.
reuters.com/article/us-somalia-attacks/us-military-says-no-civilians-killed-in-august-somalia-raid-idUSKBN1DU0JW

You could make this statement for every goddamn atrocity imperial powers have ever committed throughout history and the logic would be there. Doesn't mean they didn't commit them and don't continue to commit them. The US cared a lot about
"Hearts and Minds" in Vietnam and look who got punished for the My Lai Massacre.

...

Fuck the US military. Bunch of hick trash welfare queens bullying the rest of the world into becoming capitalistic shitholes like the US.

Shut the fuck up

kent webb?

Getting mad at people in the military is like getting mad at workers.

THIS. Besides, how does one expect to overthrow the government if they don't have soldiers on their side? By the sheer power of workers with pitchforks?

...

Nice way to put words into my mouth. Name one revolution where the military did not launch a coup d'etat.

Cuba, Nicaragua on the top of my head.
Now name one revolution where the US military did not make a massacre.
I'm not anti soldier, I'm anti american soldiers

Workers are not irresponsible for their actions. When the government tells a soldier to kill innocents, the government is mostly at fault and the soldier at fault less (as if he refused they would simply find another person), but when a soldier kills and innocent as an individual the government is less at fault (still destabilized the region and gave guns to psychopaths) and the soldier is more at fault.
The only justifications for being a soldier or a policeman is that you'll do terrible things, but you'll resist more than the person who would be there if you weren't, for the US military where you won't replace anyone (they'll just get more people) this won't apply.
Therefor the only reason to be in the US military is monetary, which might be OK if you're starving, but is mostly selfish.

Gee, how about when the soldier kills an innocent under the false impression that the innocent was the enemy? There is no black and white way to view soldiers.

Not him. But Thanks for reminding me to never browse again at american hours.
Troop apologia is the worst

I didn't say there was, which is why I used the terms 'less' and 'more'.
To say soldiers have done nothing wrong is ridiculous, to say that we can know exactly the contents and context of their soul is ridiculous, but to not pass moral judgement because that judgement will inevitably be slightly inaccurate one way or the other is utterly retarded.

Look, you can be mad at individual soldiers for their individual actions, sure, but the reason they're there is because capitalism necessitates this. What's more, is that most soldiers serve in support roles and never fire a shot in anger. If these jobs were outsourced to civilians, nobody here would be crying for them to be shot too.
So let's get to the issue of grunts. These are the trigger pullers, the door kickers. Should they be held accountable for the actions of the collective grunt group? No, I still do not think so, but they should certainly be held accountable for what they personally did. The action of working for the government is not in and of itself a bad thing. Many people do it every day, directly or indirectly.
But I think we're missing the point. It doesn't really matter if it's "okay" to be mad at soldiers or not. The idea that we have to project morality onto an amoral system or the individuals involved is ridiculous. We should strive for pragmatism. The fact is that many disillusioned vets are going to come to our side, along with a large portion of the military if we are ever going to change things. Edgy kiddos on the internet are not the building blocks of a revolutionary army. We have people here that do not even feel comfortable with the thought of wanting to kill the enemy. Of course you want to kill the enemy. Every grunt wants to have hist shot at the enemy, and this hotheadedness is what leads to mistakes and trigger-happy morons if not managed. The fact is that these things that the US is guilty of, so to will any revolutionary force be guilty of. You will make mistakes, and you will kill innocent people, sometimes your own men are going to shoot at each other by mistake, or because their commanders allowed tensions to get too high. This is a reality of war, and if you cannot understand that it is a problem that needs to be thought of as inherent to war and not to a single nation, then you're going to make the same mistakes, and you're going to suffer for them much worse than you would if you learned that what happened here is a reality of war for any group.

I'm sorry that people disagree with you. That truly is the worst.

dude we already know that this type of behaviour is not uncommon for the US, AND we have evidence that shows that the US did this. I really want to believe that the US wasn't behind this, but the proof just points their way.
Oh, and trying to defending killing teenagers is pretty fucking slimey, and I don't think yoi can call yourself a leftist.

the people who were there
the speech never claimed that they were everywhere all the time.
they lived in the same small village, of course they knew each other.
what?
i'd think they'd remember one of their closest frienda dying, or american soldiers being near the scene of the crime.

I think you're making a steetch to try and disprove the claims, especially when all the sources and evidence back his claims up.

see, we disagree with you and thats fine. but the problem is your opinions are poorly educated ones, and you think along a biased line to defend soldiers at all cost even when there are eye witness accounts and reports that they did something wrong.
its okay, this is pretty common of right wingers to want their opinions respected when their opinions aren't as informed as other opinions, or are purely just their feelings over anything else.

Lmao clear case of pic related.

Makes me want to be a SEAL even more.

Please point out where I defended the SEALs.

...

Wow this stuff is sick
Who made it?

Run The Jewels - Crown feat. Diane Coffee (from the Run The Jewels 2 album)
youtube.com/watch?v=XbZR9JhGJ0Q

user retracted his statement at

You goddamn right they are.

Nice. Also related.
youtube.com/watch?v=vOfTLeoLM44

Military slime, like cops, dont actually preform any labor. They are subhuman murderers who are porky's buttplug.

You can use that logic for anyone because you dont really have to be military to overthrow the bourgeoisie

No mention of 100 civilian deaths appear in the article. They say 10 were killed. Not exactly more pleasant, but still.

Good!

I know """people""" who would unironically try to argue for this.

kek

t.fbi