What do you guys think about the PSL? I haven't done much research on the matter but they seem to be the biggest socialist organization in the US besides the Democratic Cops of America. If you have had any kind of experience with them how did they seem?
What do you guys think about the PSL...
Their platform is identical to Workers' World. In other words, they're tánkies.
Shit like any other leftist org that exists without the real movement backing it up.
They seem nice and are willing to talk about socialism in simple ways for uneducated people to understand, the people i talk to seem a lot like muke but well read and can go in detail on many topics. They and the trots are the only ones calling trump a symptom of a bigger problem. Most definitely the best ML org i have seen .
Also they run a gym in my city so that's cool.
Oh well I'll give them a chance since the Democratic Cops of America are a huge let down.
Which is funny considering there's plenty of older people who once lived in socialist states and prefer it to their current conditions.
I mean they're M-L, but they're one of the best organizations we've got in America rn so they're alright in my book.
tfw no good non-Bordigist leftcom organizations in the US and the IWW is a shell of it's former self
I'm biased as an M-L, but I'd consider them the best American org. I think the damned trots at SAlt actually do a good job in terms of agitation by way of electoral organization so they have their place for the normies, and PSL's place is for people who are more serious about socialist causes beyond just voting. Of the orgs I've had firsthand experience with, PSL is the least idpol-focused.
crypto-trotskyists, but who cares
I've only had one encounter with PSL folks, and they where nice, but kind of LARP-y.
They're good imo, maybe even the best org in the US of A
That first comment reminds me that liberals get the bullet too
Bordigism will never fucking happen you mong, and the IWW is full of idpol. The PSL will be the vanguard and maybe the SA if we are not forced to kill them.
LARPers, but I do like the anti-war work they do.
Lenin was a LARPer and look at how far he took it, there's nothing wrong with roleplaying.
you need to actually kill yourself
This is not a coincidence.
I keep growing stronger
The best party in the USA, but still has remnants of Trotskyism and opportunism that they never properly purged. It's not a revolutionary party, and they have done a poor job of upholding Marxist Leninist theory. Their newspaper is not a vanguard newspaper, it's mostly just agitation material.
Still, if you have to join/work with any one party in the USA, you should try PSL first.
Worker's World has been taken over by blatant wreckers and opportunists. PSL has yet to get as bad as WW.
fuck groups burn it all down
I'll take ☭TANKIE☭s any day over succdems
The PSL people in my city are constantly talking/posting about pronouns, trans rights, hate crimes, Christopher Columbus, etc. Not even completely against incorporating those things into class analysis but they are easily one of the most idpol-espousing groups I have ever seen.
The IMT is the only org that is serious about being a vanguard party in the future. All the more well-known groups are only popular because they waste all their time, money, and energy on LARPing in the streets then posting photos online that make their "movement" seem bigger than it is.
The masses are not yet ready for a serious movement. The task of Leninists at the moment is not LARPing and posting but diligent studying and cadre-building. Anything else is opportunist at this point.
They're a weird mix of crypto-Trots and unironic Dengists who still think China is socialist. Bad.
I wonder who's behind this post
A while back before xexizy got banned from twitter he and a few of his followers shared a picture that outlined what the PSL was all about and ended up calling them social democrates who call themselves MLs. Is there any truth in this statement?
Most modern M-Ls are social democrats, because they have no conception of socialism beyond State capitalism. Literally their only point of dispute with the rosefags is whether or not you can elect a reformist or impose reform on the State militarily.
Do social democrats want a planned, democratically controlled economy geared towards use-value?
Because if so, I've been talking to the wrong ones
they won't be leading anything
Marcy-ites are unironically good.
It's unclear to me how Trots managed to come to such a correct political line, but I'm happy it somehow happened.
I said non bordigist you retard, and that's why I said the IWW is a shell of its former self.
Who woulda thought a ☭TANKIE☭ has shit reading comprehension
because socialism in one country really was impossible to begin with. this concession has been absorbed into all modern marxist-leninist-(maoist) platforms, with the exception of the hoxhaists, who are the true anti-revisionists (but, ironically, find themselves alone in their incorrectness).
the reason PSL and twitter ☭TANKIE☭s appear dengist is because of their acquiescence to the basic trotskyist thesis.
i just wish they'd give him fucking credit for being right instead of slandering him constantly now
meant to respond to
Correct, the united states has no worthwhile organizations
They are, along with SAlt, Workers' World, CPUSA, and RCP-USA, one of only a handful of Marxist parties in America with anything resembling popular support.
Unlike the latter three, they have decent praxis.
These groups still use terms like "socialist country" and still advocate for socialism on a purely national basis. Their "internationalism" is no less artificial and shallow than Stalin's.
I'm confused. So Trotskyists think China is good now?
marcyites, being trotskyite revisionists, are unable to see revisionism for what it is, or combat it
What does it have to do with america?
trotskyites have always defended degenerated worker's states
For God knows what reason, they've somehow managed to make serious inroads in the various black radical movements as well as some antifa groups.
is that why PSL split from them?
Nobody knows why they split in the first place, which is one of the many problems with PSL. If it was important enough for them to split, why the fuck isn't it important enough for them to tell us why?
But yes, it seems WWP is more opportunist than PSL, which is lately becoming pretty opportunist itself.