I wonder to what extent they believe the shit they spew about their fellow capitalists [and their political mouthpieces]. I personally have never really leapt to the defense of any left-liberal politician against charges of Communism, for instance, on the assumption that it's for the best that reactionaries not know what "Communism" actually means and why progressivism isn't it.
Cases in point, from the American political context:
They either know but use it as a smear tactic because your average retard thinks gommunism = gubberment and oppreshun. Or are retarded themselves and think it means gubberment and oppreshun.
Can a mod fix any typos in this?
Right, right. I just wonder which of the two is more common - opportunism or true believerism. If it's the latter, I think nothing ought to be done to try to dissuade them from it, because eventually they'll talk themselves into a position where they have to actually take physical action against the Red Menace. Helicopter rides for the middle-management of some solar panel firm, complete tranquility for the revolutionary proletariat.
They just know how to play to propaganda edge to influence politics and as an ideological justification for exploiting people.
This You have to realize that it doesn't make any practical difference. What they believe "deep down" doesn't matter. And I think they know it, even if in a vague manner.
Will use in the future to inform normies. pol, is lost cause, thought.
You got it wrong. Soros is a Jewish reptilian.
Nice try, Soros. I'm still expecting my paycheck.
I'm fairly sure the "Soros and Obama are Marxists" crowd is hardly more than a lunatic fringe made up of irrelevant people. Most capitalists don't really care that much about issues outside economic policy; the liberal and conservative segments of the bourgeoisie share remarkably similar stances in that respect — which goes without saying considering they have the same class interests.
Not a day goes that Breitbart doesn't write about Soros and the Open Society. It's not an organization promotes free markets in any meaningful way, it exists to import economic migrants from Africa and the Middle East. Are you aware the Poland and other Eastern European countries are facing potential sanctions for only taking refugees from Ukraine
You're an idiot if you believe you can have "free markets" without immigration.
Better not tell him about Nixon…
Your knowledge of geography is as weak as your knowledge of how capitalism works. Is this power of person "redpilled" by mainstream media?
I don't understand your gripe, Hungary is part of Eastern Europe. The more interesting question is if there are countries other than Poland and Hungary who are "facing potential sanctions for only taking refugees from Ukraine" and if they actually do in the first place.
Giving immigrants free housing, healthcare, education and welfare is not free market.
Something tells me, deep down, that this room reeks of axe body spray and BO.
How does the capitalist benefit from an economy being depressed from class of criminal welfare leeches? They don't work, they increase the cost of doing business and reduce economic activity in their hot spots (cities). They also increase the taxes as they vote for more left-wing parties to import more of their co-ethnics and give them more welfare.
If this is a capitalist conspiracy why are you using lefting-wing talking points to advocate and apologize for African and muslim welfare migrants? No right wing party is for this (at least on that is in any way connected to the grass roots), by ever left-wing movement and party is. The main reason you guys find the EU somewhat appealing is because they are pursuing Richard Spencer's policy of peaceful ethnic cleansing, but against whites
sure thing friend, btw i'm napoleon the great and the sky is colored purple
the "free market" means anything and everything is permitted and left to "market forces." if a "free market" has the things you mentioned, and they become popular and widespread, they are by definition products outcomes of the "free market," and your opposition to them a betrayal of "free market" principles
No I believe "free market" is to be opposed with "regulated market", e.g. when the government does stuff and enact a minimal wage law. That said, in an ideal free market, immigrants would probably come to richer countries and drive wages down just like today.
intentionally preventing certain things from occurring in a market is by definition a regulated or controlled market
reserve army of labor my dude
No need for immigrants, robots got it covered.
No. There have to be some short cuts such as common law. It's more economical to prevent disasters than fix them.
who or what enforces the law?
That is why all capitalist countries in the world right now operate with a (more or less) regulated market.
I'm not sure if these things can exist under a "truly" free market, since they are financed by taxes, which in essence skew supply and demand. An ideal free market under capitalism is a stupid wet dream anyway, it would look more like drug trade than an utopia where every customer is satisfied
pol shouldnt think Soros is a communist and they dont hate him for being a communist pol hates Soros because he's a sneaky evil rich jew who's funding the open borders groups facilitating the migration of the 3rd world into Europe kinda funny you'll acknowledge Soros's meddling in the USSR and his obvious reasons for doing so but you're not wondering if his open sponsorship of the refugee bollocks doesnt smell a bit fishy
you're retarded tbh if you think there isnt enough native unemployed willing to work its like EU immigration in the UK, the working class wants the economic migrants gone because they take manual labour jobs the working class want they cant get these manual labour jobs because employers won't hire them employers wont hire them because they would have to pay native workers a decent wage instead of the slave wages they pay the migrants the migrants that work are mostly from Eastern Europe and they dont care if they're paid peanuts for them working in the UK is a sleeping rough, eating beans working time, because if you earn sterling you can save it and send it back home where its worth more
none of this benefits the native working class of the UK though and its detrimental to the nation as a whole the only winner in this scenario is porky who gets to reap more from underpaying his workers and the slave workers who after their period of suffering have funneled enough wealth out of the UK to satisfy them
This guy gets it, in order for porky to be secure from worker's agitation he has a huge reserve army of labor that is willing to replace striking workers at any point.
It also pulls attention from porky fuckin the workers in the ass to the reserve army of labor as a decoy
The left needs to focus having economic and material critiques of immigration rather than racial or cultural criticisms that the right likes use. Blaming immigrants doesn't solve the root problem and just scapegoats regular immigrant workers who are still workers despite being used by porky to undermine the working class. To prevent reactionaries from capitalizing on migration fears and xenophobia, the left should offer solidarity with immigrants/refugees/etc. and use economic reasons to criticize immigration to prevent this notion of "the left wants to flood us with rapefugees to kill our nation and culture because they are godless communists." Basically focus on helping immigrants while also railing against immigration that is used for economic exploitation
they're still draining wealth out of the nation and sending it overseas as well as taking up jobs in the country unless these workers are literally doctors from nations on this earth with proper academic infrastructure there is no job of dwindling supply in the west thanks to automation a foreign immigrant can have that couldnt be better served by having a native working class citizen employed in thats going to stick im afraid
and what is the root problem immigration serves? not enough new debt slaves for the bank to keep their profit margins climbing? because every single other reason you have doesnt make sense especially from a selfish perspective and not the humanitarian share the world bullshit and this sentimental notion the entire globe can be elevated to the standard of living an upper middle class German enjoys
The capitalist class is responsible for this, immigrants are "useful idiots" in this case but immigrants aren't sending your jobs overseas to a sweatshop in China or Vietnam. Of course it would be easy to have a "native worker" but the job market is tough and unemployment is kept artificially high to keep people in their jobs with the threat of losing their livelihood. Immigrants serve as a way to exploit cheap labor and undermine wages while also filling positions keeping people out of work. Not just the job market but with ease of technology and the advancement of plane travel, immigration is going to happen regardless. It should be the left who puts a solution that solves the socioeconomic problems caused by mass human migration. Sadly, you're right. The whole ==NO BORDERS NO NATIONS STOP THE DEPORTATIONS== crowd makes a large part of socialist-leaning organizations and people from my experience anyway This crowd lacks any sort of nuance or theory and they make the rest of us look bad by basically being pseudo-porky apologists with a humanitarian veneer. Capitalism and undermining the working class through whichever means necessary This is my main problem with cosmopolitanism tbh. That being said the left/worker's movement should oppose any form of jingoist nationalism and try building of collation of nations who work under the pretext of mutual aid and not under exploitation and bourgeois trade deals.
Well… they could technicaly be marxist capitalists working in their class interest
Isn't that because Western Europe took in a bunch of Slavic immigrants and are now expecting eastern Europe to return the favor?
No. And don't be a fucking liberal. ex warsaw pact has all the right to threat the west like shit
It's just the only time I've seen euroes complain about migrants was on /int/ and most of their anger seemed to come from poles coming in and taking jobs.
Then open your eyes more because in the last years it all became about immigration Well yeah, it's true. No shit. Immigrants are porky tool to steal jobs. I do defend east euros tho because they where robbed of communism by the west
Then you know 0 about european contemporary political discourse
What is Japan?
Yes they do. It clearly benefits them to brand anybody advocating for even the smallest, least restrictive regulations aimed at improving the rights of workers a communist.
Japan will be forced to accept immigration soon, as its working population declines and businesses cease to be as profitable as they once were.
If capitalism didn't benefit from mass immigration, there would be no mass immigration.
Businesses will have to deal with the real prospect of pink tide in Japan, which will probably be the best thing to happen for these people who weren't alive during Imperialism and are running out of things to lose, and an educated, literate, and advanced proletariat will make the perfect revolutionary subjects, in fact, the Japanese revolution should it happen, may be the real start of the rise of 21st State Socialism.
Did you seriously just imply Japan has a free market? I mean, no country has a free market and all, and Abe certainly liberalized the economy in recent years, but fucking Japan?
Most people don't have the strict idea of a free market that lolberts do.
Japan is certainly not free of immigration (notably from China) and they're going to need more and more immigrants as their fertility rate continues to spiral downwards into oblivion. They're aware of this and have already started (more-or-less silently) relaxing their immigration policy.