Why are all conspiratorial things pretty right wing? It's ridiculous. I want to get balls deep in some conspiracies and all I'm seeing is alt-right retards and Neo-Nazis spreading idiocy.
Why are all conspiratorial things pretty right wing? It's ridiculous...
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they're inherently reactionary because instead of addressing the system as a whole as the issue it instead resorts to finding a group of people to blame aka scapegoatism.
Most left-wing "conspiracy theories" eventually turn out to be true.
It's in their blood, dude, and has been from the start. Even the "respectable" conservatives like Edmund Burke peddled conspiracy theories about the French Revolution like this guy's work:
Also remember that Protocols of the Elders of Zion was fabricated by Russian monarchists and promoted by prominent figures such as Kaiser Wilhelm and Henry Ford right down to obscure cranks like Julius Evola.
Even whackjobs like this lady was feted in influential circles and treated as respectable by the likes of Lord Kitchener and Winston Churchill:
It's incredibly hard to find right-wingers, even the "intellectual" ones, who haven't endorsed some form of conspiracy theory.
CIA and Wall Street has funded communist revolutions dont be fooled
they found right-wing capitalists more than left-wing capitalists, i really hope you aren't this stupid in real life
pretty much this
The atlantic had a good investigative article about the issue of reptilians in DC a few years back. Really well sourced and researched.
this story has it all: secret masonic lodges, terrorists kidnap italian PM, spiritist sceances, Mossad/CIA agents pretending to be communists, The Mafia, Operation Gladio, Henry Kissinger. are you ready to see how deep the rabbit hole goes?
David Icke is definitely /ourguy/. The ruling class might not be shapeshifting reptoids, but there is a certain metaphorical truth in Dave Icke's theories. The spectacle relies on loosh harvesting, on the perversion of human desires. The ruling class presents itself as a cabal of disinterested technocratic humanitarians, when in reality, their power depends directly on human sacrifice (via war and exploitation).
Conspiracy theorising used to be a somewhat more left leaning space, but like other niche subcultures, it has become a target for the alt right. Mainstream culture is dominated by a bland liberal progressive hegemony. The current dominant form of capitalism justifies itself through 'woke' commodities and the discourse of 'inclusion', of course it's all hollow bullshit, but it is the visible aspect of capitalism, meant to conceal its brutal, mercenary reality. In the absence of a true revolutionary alternative, alienated individuals tend to invert the dominant discourse of capitalism as a form of shallow 'rebellion'.
David icke hates communists and thinks black bloc are liberal thugs
Fascinating how all 'right-wing' conspiracy theories (and even a few 'left-wing' ones) have deep roots in antisemitism. You can trace them all back to "the Joos did it because they hated Jesus".
And yet no one can provide documentation of this. Meanwhil banker and industrialist support for fascism and authoritarian capitalist regimes is well documented.
Fun fact: Silvio Burlesconi, former PM of Italy, was a major member of Propaganda Due, and the founder and leader of it Licio Gelli, who was a banker and liason to Nazi Germnay duting fascist Italy, said that he thought Burlesconi seemed to be continuing P2's vision for Italy with his justice system and media reforms. He was also a possible Nobel Prize in Literature candidate that was supported by Mother Theresa.
Tag yourself, I'm the twee rabbi
Having to live through the rise of 9/11 trutherism was embarrassing though
On this board it's literally "everything I don't like"
because liberalism(conservative or otherwise) is based on the centrality of human will as the cause of history whereas left wingers know most of history and most of society exist as an emergent pattern outside of individuals and thereby unaffected by their will.
I hear the world left-wing tossed around against everything, but there's a difference between liberals and, say, Marxist-Leninists. But this same nuance isn't afforded to 'the right wing'. Makes no sense.
Pretty much what I was about to post.
Because this board is just about circlejerking and feeling superior to Holla Forums, the alt-right, and right-wing thought in general.
So everyone from Burke to Hillary Clinton is "right wing", but um *ackchooally* Stalin wasn't "Leftist" according to my special snowflake definition of Leftism, he was really just a red fascist
anyone who supports capitalism
A few decades ago they weren't.
I browsed Jeff Rense's site a lot when I was 12. The Bush era had loads of left-wing/leftish conspiracy theorists - much of the conspiracy theorist Matrix fandom, a lot of the anti-Zionist folks, the New Agers all the while and "alternative medicine." Jeff Rense's site would often reference Chomsky - whereas last I checked (this past year) they had David Duke as a contributor, a bunch of linked articles on how Putin was a good boy, and some weird American far-right imitation-Russian Orthodox guy advertising.
In retrospect, a lot of it would be considered "progressive" (ie liberal holdouts from when the Democrats and Republicans had slightly separate economic platforms) probably, and the rhetoric about "Satan" was probably always there - although this seemed to increase with time, as the straightforward explanation the Illuminati (for instance) based on their actual Christian origins has more or less vanished from conspiracy theorist rhetoric in favor of "SATAN DID IT!!!1"
Where is this definition found? So right-wing is anybody who supports capitalism? Does that mean left-wing is anybody who opposes it? That would be the contraposition. But there are people on the 'right' who dislike certain forms of capitalism and prefer other forms, just as there are people on the 'left' who dislike certain forms of capitalism and opt for other forms. There are Keynesians, for example, who believe in interventionism at times, whereas other 'capitalists' do not. There are leftists who do not summarily reject capitalism and wish to 'refine' it. Just because the 'modern right wing' is more 'capitalistic' than the modern 'left wing' doesn't mean there is an absolute standard. 'Capitalism' is not a uniform concept, I think what you mean is production for profit. Capitalism can be further divided into many categories. I could take these categories and they would be principally opposed to the other.
t. "Jim Jones was actually a CIA agent"
It's true that the American left/right spectrum basically functions this way. I think it's worth noting that this stuff is contextual - ie, the original left/right was anti-monarchists and monarchists respectively.
Leftypol mostly adheres to a non-American concept of left/right - outside of America, "left" usually means something else. The same goes for the way we use "liberal" - we principally use it to refer to economics rather than social politics.
That said, I think that as long as Capitalism is the status quo system the predominant opposing ideologies will be left-wing… though I may not be giving neo-Feudalists their due…
Fair enough. I am simply opposed to political illiteracy (as most posters are actually American, at least on most forums of this 'politically incorrect' nature, out of fear of free speech probably? Not sure) like 'right-wing is capitalist, no ifs, ands, or buts'. There is a lot more depth to the issue. There are exceptions to the rule, but you are right to say that the predominant opposition will be what can be categorized as 'left-wing'.
more susceptible paranoia and fear probably
Then you're looking in the wrong places. There are many conspiracies that sit above the tired left/right paradigm, but they are rarely talked about. You can start off by looking up the Stargate Project, Phil Schneider, Danny Casolaro, and The Finders.
This shit's been going on a lot longer than the Bush era. My dad has been peddling lizard people, anti vax, chem trails, Rosicrucians etc. since at least the 80's.
Have alien conspiracy theory been co-opted by the right yet? That was the only stuff I found interesting. Especially anything by Jacque Vallee and Terence McKenna.
Both Robert Anton Wilson and Thomas Pynchon are solidly left-libertarian fiction writers who feature conspiracy theories pretty heavily in their writing.
If we're talking fiction then I should mention that Deus Ex is also a very class conscious video game that revolves heavily around conspiracies. In fact, one of the banners on this board is a quote from a character in the game.
The podcast Higherside Chats is fairly neutral and is more like people who are genuinely interested in conspiracy and not promoting right wing garbage.
I don't think there is anything inherently right wing about conspiracy. Rather, it is a kind of burgeoning class consciousness which is co-opted by the right. A wasted opportunity for the left, to show that the conspiracies have to do with capitalism. I think that the left is too wedded to "serious" academia and journalism to really enter the space. There is a certain degree of intellectual snobbishness which prevents those on the left from even considering certain silly ideas, even from a metaphorical point of view. Like I agree with one of the previous posters, David Icke is kind of proto-anticapitalist. But he perverts it in a right wing direction ultimately.
At the end of the day conspiracy is a lot easier for people who question the system to wrap their mind around than Marxism or critical theory. So I think we should give people a break and encourage them to question more deeply than conspiracy theories.
The UFO phenomenon remains mostly apolitical.
because it's easier to believe that the fluoride in the water is what makes you jack off to traps and not just that you're gay
You realize that we reject Capitalism, and thusly do not care for all the different ways it is justified? Call it a circle jerk if you want, but people are disagreed with all the time on here. I don't see why any of us would call Hillary leftwing, she supports Capitalism and thusly embraces right wing values. It's more of an adjective than anything else, it isn't some hardcore definition that all the cool Holla Forums kids use. A part of calling people seen today as leftists "right wing" is precisely the reason you are upset by it, it realizes the actual competing ideologies at play and doesnt make good with your preconceptions of "True left/right" thinking. Plenty of people here call Stalin a leftist, and I've never seen someone call him a "red fascist".
Is yer dad left or right, tho?
I mean, my impression was that the conspiracy theory stuff was pretty mixed, politically, in the US up 'til Obama.
It really is amazing how few self-proclaimed socialists realize "conspiracy theory" is newspeak used to discredit any attempt to question the status quo. Really any communist by definition is a conspiracy theorist, even if their minds have been trained to violently reject such terms on sight.
This isn't an apology for the most outlandish fascist lies invented to comfort themselves out there, I'm just ridiculing socialists' laughable inability to escape the confines of the state-manufactured bourgeois vocabulary.
DID SOMEONE SAY UFO?!
Personally I would love to see more leftists get into the study of it and produce leftist conspiracy theory. No reason why you can't start with real cases like Iran Contra for example and then slowly wade into the muddier waters out there.
people in the 1930's thought the left was more dangerous than the right.
UFO is more left wing.
Right wringers believe in the flat earth therefore space does not exist which means UFO's don't exist.
Tim Commerford is a 9/11 truther and believes the moon landing is fake. He's an ancom.
A lot of popular conspiracy theories originated from left-wing individuals and activists. Several modern ones were, as usual, stolen by the right.
Older right-wing conspiracy theories tended to focus on grand plots by the illuminati and jews in pursuit of republican and, later on, socialist causes. The idea of a global conspiracy started with conservatives in the late 18th century who though the bavarian illuminati and jacobins were conspiring to promote enlightenment liberalism throughout the world through covert subversion.
There's a lot of left leaning musicians who are into conspiracy stuff. Doctor Steel and Prozak are two names off the top of my head.
Immortal Technique is also another leftist musician that is very much into conspiracy theories that should probably be mentioned.
They lack materialist perspectives
I don't afford rightists nuance because it's just not practical to do so. I make distinction between various left-wing groups because these are people who I may be working with and I should know how far I should expect to be able to trust and ally with them.
I'm aware of the differences between an NRx Monarchist and a Neocon, but why should I bother making distinction when they're both opposed to me?
It doesn't matter in this case because every branch of the right-wing, from libertarians to fascists to Catholic traditionalists, is pervaded by conspiracy theorist nuts and ALWAYS has been, even the "respectable" and "intellectual" conservatives often succumb to it.
You've clearly never heard your fair share of the anti-capitalism memes.