Tfw got chased out of the Brooklyn Democratic Cops of America for refusing to acknowledge my white male muh privilege...

what's even the point any more?

I'm so done

Other urls found in this thread:

Sounds juicy, mind saying something more?

I can't help but feel you haven't given a fully honest recounting of what actually happened.

My guess: You were politely asked to leave after screaming "Class is the only thing that matters, you fucking spic" when a Puerto Rican guest speaker suggested racism might have been a factor in the US's lackluster response to the hurricane compared to the other hurricanes that happened in predominately white areas. This sounding familiar?

This seems even more unlikely than OP's statement

Clearly you've never interacted with anyone from the Socialist Equality Party.

No but I've interacted with enough "leftists" like those described by OP

Nice meme. Trump did everything he could do, Puerto Rican truck drivers refusing to cart shit for less than $50/hr and going on strike in the midst of an apocalyptic disaster is out of his hands.


What's most likely is that OP tried to go to a Democratic Cops of America meeting but his social anxiety prevented him from going, so he took his donation money and got half drunk at a bar with an open wifi

I kinda like the Democratic Cops of America but I would probably do the same thing. Just no real point in getting drunk and fighting each other when we could be shitposting for the proletariat


Lucky bastard.

So, you believe the Trump administration is SO incompetent that they weren't capable of using their massive disaster relief funds to distribute the resources across a tiny US territory themselves?

That's almost worse than him just being a racist. No, not almost, that is worse.

Are you a Puerto Rican because your reading comprehension is below 5th grade level.

You said the Puerto Ricans wouldn't distribute the resources.

Why wouldn't the federal government do it instead, then? Do you actually think they don't have the capability to get some food and water to the people of Puerto Rico without native truck drivers helping them?

It's honestly pretty pathetic that your defence against this is that "Trump isn't racist he'she's just incompetent"

Kinda glad imo you still buy into the fuhrerprinzip cuz you're stuck with prezident swiss cheese brain now lmao

You telling me this isn't good praxis?



It's always the same with you fucking non whites, no altruism whatsoever and I mean that in the most objective, non racist way I can.

Mods are already starting to ban me so I'll show myself the door, I just wanted to get this one last post in.

Ayy leavim alone mods. He's just a nazi.

You're moving the goalposts. First you said it was out of Trump's hands, now you're saying they *could've* helped, but they shouldn't have to because the Puerto Ricans should have had solidarity.

It's middling praxis at best

If you want to get gud comrade you should have held the floor for ten mines with a pointless self serving speech about NATO intervention in Syria or something


Can mods hellban people? They totally should just to waste the time of reactionaries

Anyway this conversation is stupid, even the liberals are outdoing us in disrupting Mercer-funded astroturf groups with yesterday's leak of Spencer's University of Florida plans

So did Trump do all he could or not? Try to stay consistent.

i always wonder if Holla Forumstards don´t actually read what they write or if they are really this dumb

this. give us a greentext OP

you deserved it. "refusing to acknowledge" white male muh privilege? obviously it's fucking real, it's just a result of capitalism.

im just picturing this in my head and there's no situation where you didn't make a huge asshole of yourself dude


Nothing builds solidarity like tearing down your supposed comrades

funny how Trump's gone from god emperor to a well meaning moron in less than a year


made me chuckle

Approach my ass with your mouth dipshit

yes sir


The more committed white nationalists had basically admitted to each other than the only thing they'd be getting out of a Trump presidency is an overton window shift before the general election was even finished.

Give gteentext OP, otherwise confirmed fake.

>"fuck your idpol liberal discussion about desolate economic situation of Puerto Rico due to poor response of Trump's administration probably linked with racism in the system, my autism requires DEMANDS to dissect that joke Marx made about jewish nigger Lasalle for the 100th time again, or else I will gulag you dirty spics for idpolling in my org! REEE"
kill yourself fam

yeah i know, feels like all of Holla Forums has begun to shift to this state of embarrassment for awhile though

What the fuck are you on about m8

If they were just trying to discuss how there's a degree of systemic racism involved in all US relations with Puerto Rico because capitalism needs a degree of racism in order for imperialism to function and you were being an ass and suggesting that race has nothing to do with it ever never ever then you deserved it

If they started from "White people in general should whip themselves every single day because the oligarchs don't properly respond when subjugated people's are faced with disasters and if you don't like that you can leave" than good riddance

The problem is that I can't believe your story till you outline which one happens cuz Democratic Cops of America tolerates both tendencies despite them being diametrically opposed

I politely asking you to choke on dicks
racism might have been a factor, but for a marxist it shouldn't matter
marxism deals with CLASS
not gender
not race
not sexual fetish

so yea, for a marxist class really is the only thing that matters
if you base your analysis on race, you're doing it at the expense of class analysis

a fuckin trot


I like how posters here immediately defend these idpol faggot as if shit like this never happens. We have more examples of SJW spergouts than some leftypol poster reeeeing about class. It's becoming increasingly clear that it's time for a purge.

have fun with that commisar

It's willingly part of the USA
There have been multiple referendums and most there like the US


I don't like excessive idpol either m8 but why are you defending OP? He left very little context for what exactly went on in the meeting, it all reads as if OP was sperging out over some minor remark. I refuse to believe that Democratic Cops of America meetings are so insufferable that average Holla Forumser ends up being chased out of the meeting.

it definitely was the first one dude

I agree. We shouldn't have even tolerated Bernie Sanders tbh. It brought waaaaaay too many succdems here who all evolved into red liberals and now they won't stop defending Democratic Cops no matter how fucking stupid they are.

Democratic Cops of America is basically the succdem version of Antifa, the stupid shit they do outnumbers the occasional goods so much that they may as well not even exist

It's comforting to know that Cville burned up a lot of the political capital they accrued throughout 2016. Right-idpolers know it and it's probably why they've been acting a lot more desperate since August

Best way to deal with them is to exploit their complete economic illiteracy and the fact that they continue to believe that austerity economics and deregulation works. Their tendency towards infighting will take care of the rest (in the US, continental Europe is another story)

tbh you have to be on a certain spectrum of autism to be chased out of a demsoc meeting

Don't forget slashing Coast Guard funding and stalling on passing a waiver for the dumb shipping law


Maybe in the past, but these faggots rot our movements from the inside. We had a chance to raise class consciousness after 08, but faggots with names like Ketchup ruined it, and it happens all the time.

Class struggle being the root of all social struggle doesn't mean the other social struggles don't matter or shouldn't be talked about this. This is a classic fallacy of illiterate tankies who have never actually read Marx.

Have you ever met IdPol Leftists IRL? They're the most autistic people on the planet. I'd even argue that their "movement" is just a form of asperger's that's rooted in political matters just like Holla Forums's. Horseshoe theory is 100 percent true when it comes to IdPol.

Shit like in the OP happens all the time

Not only am I personally tired of having serious problems ignored to "make space" for rich socialites but it's stupid shit like this that has allowed fascism back into the mainstream

hey dumbass why are a higher relative proportion of black people, trans people and single women working class

jesus fucking christ

In that case the only non-racist option is socialism

no kidding. but to do socialism, you have to fight capitalism. to fight capitalism, you have to understand capitalism. to understand capitalism, you have to engage with the fact that it fucking over minorities way harder than white men.

I do not care about all those *other* struggles
I care about proletarian struggle and nothing else
because proletarian struggle has in its roots in contradictions between means of production and relations of production
that is why marx thought proletariat was a revolutionary subject, because of its relation to the means of production

if you want to play oppression olympics it is your problem
but if you want to bring marxism into this, call it the root of all struggle and all that wash, it is *my* problem as a marxist

I didn't realize me getting repeatedly abused, sometimes sexually, was such a walk in the park

Really makes me think 🤔

That didn't happen

Can we talk about negros disproportionately abusing welfare and committing murder while we're at it too or is critical theory still only used to brow beat whitey? My idpol is just as good as yours.

I'm not going to let a bunch of people with fucking cluster B personality disorders deter me from helping bayonet porky

This, most likely

OP is clearly seething with resentment

Really makes me think

Yes I actually have, I was main organizer of some anti-racism protest which required some organizing both online and IRL. They pissed me off so much later on (not so much with idpol shit, I can shrug it off, but how their reaction to a far-right counter protest was to LITERALLY drive the whole crowd over there instead of letting Holla Forumstards autistically screech in the corner and move on with the demonstration) that I was a Holla Forumstard for a year myself because I thought there is no leftism without idpol left anymore. Thank god I found Holla Forums.

I am not doubting stuff like OP's happens all the time, I just had a perception that since Democratic Cops of America even was willing to get rid of the cop, that they got their shit together relatively, and that shit doesn't happen in Democratic Cops of America anymore so maybe OP did unnecessary at his part, judging from how little context he gave.

Unless you used it as an opportunity to spread Marxist agitprop you are essentially just perpetuating liberalism by doing stuff like this.

How would this even arise? This reads like a sperg making shit up lmao

In practice fighting for programs that help whites and nonwhite alike help socialists and socdems in the west score more substantial, long-lasting victories than by forcing left dialogue to silo into dozens of identical, mercurial, selfishly puritanical debates over identity with no clear goals and literally hundreds of conflicting actions

You sure about that?

There were black Nazis, too, btw.

because a higher relative proportion of humankind are prols? dipshit

higher relative proportion of scat fetishists are working class
maybe we should disscuss how scat fetishists are oppressed huh?

Yes I am. Do you know what a "higher relative proportion" means?

It probably didn't, but there's no doubt that near identical meltdowns happen in left groups across the west every day

It's stupid and we given them more power when we treat them as anything more than the paper tigers they actually are. They only have power when people bend to their constant demands for apologies and struggle sessions. Half of them are careerist neolibs masquerading as left for social capital and the day no one listens to them is the day they fuck off back to scamming people with herbalife

Glad to hear then that white people are suffering at an acceptable level and what we really need is more women CEOs

I don't see how Marxism can possibly succeed if we just ignore racism and pretend white muh privilege doesn't real.

to my excuse, I'm eastern european and main man from local ANTIFA chapter helped me with organizing. Also, I was a liberal at the time. I don't think I would enthusiastically participate in liberal initiatives any more (they wouldn't accept me in those anyway since I angered them with my Holla Forumstard phase).

I know I fucked up a little there. I hope to redeem this by loyally lurking Holla Forums and hoping to get to reading theory one day and actually do marxist agitprop next time I start to organize an event for anything socio-critical.


Go fuck yourself, nobody said that. Capitalism fucks all proletarians but on average, proles who are white or male are able to carve out a more comfortable existence.

It's in the interests of capital to divide the working class and prioritize some groups over others. By getting triggered by the very notion of racial material inequality, you're directly helping Porky

From where I'm standing the white working class is the only working class that still actually works instead of cashing welfare all day and turning urban areas into Mogadishu. We're objectively being fucked the hardest.

WEW lad

this, there is a reason why moderate conservatives pretend to be colorblind and talk about welfare queens instead of muh nogs


Pick one

What we need to do is explain that racism is literally a product of class society. This is something that even some liberal scholars are admitting – – but they aren't able to realize that racism is economic every step of the way.

A really Marxist perspective on race and racism means throwing away the liberal obsession with speech and "racist attitudes", but by recognizing that black and brown people have a general material position below whites due to the efforts of segments of the bourgeoisie who are able to exploit black people more easily than whites.

First they came for the Nazis but I did not speak up because I was not a Nazi

Are you sure about that. West Virginia is MUCH poorer then Harlem or New Orleans

I've been to the chapter in Atlanta few times. Really not that many weirdos. Instead of sperging out maybe go to book clubs or social events or whatever whatever and offer your take. Bust out some theory and shit. This could actually be productive even. They're probably not gonna get mad at you unless you do it in a douchey way lol

I'm not being divisive by pointing out an economic fact you dipshit, the working class is ALREADY divided.

The kind of division I'm talking about, the division that matters infinitely more than arguments on fucking Holla Forums, is that white people usually make more money than black people. This means that many white workers would often rather keep their status than challenge class society, and that many black workers are spooked into thinking they can't trust white people.

The Marxist perspective is recognizing that racism/white muh privilege/white supremacy exists as a function of class society, not because "white people are evil" or whatever. To deny these empirical average differences between white workers and black workers totally inhibits any left-wing analysis of capitalism.

not true actually

But why even make this post. Only dipshit liberals say "racism means all white people are rich and all black people are poor", and there aren't any in this thread


You are a fucking moron of epic proportions.

yea, we should sacrifice key parts of our theory for cheap popularity points
pure genius..

You're a tard, just because you understand things through a lens of class warfare doesn't mean you can't address racism or sexism.
Why are marxists so bad at marxism?

tell me, why *should* we address racism or sexism at all?

Yes but white prols and black prols make the same amount of money. White prols don’t get special white money.

5 posts in and I find a trot shitting on trots… Quelle surprise.



"Racism doesn't exist" has never been a key part of Marxist theory. Marx and Engels recognized that divisions like nationality and gender are useful to class society because they inhibit solidarity, as did literally every Marxist after them.

You didn't present any point to refute. I explained that other social struggles were important and you just said "i don't care about those, lol"

But, just to give you an elementary education that you would already have if you had bothered to read Marx, the superstructure is very important most would probably say just as important as the base. It isn't something to ignore, because it supports and legitimizes the base. Racism, sexism, homophobia, etc. are very important as mechanisms of oppression of the working class and should be fought and dismantled when possible.

* and most

Because it's part of what's used to divide the proletariat and it's still a form of class oppression?

Obviously not, but this means porky can tell a poor white guy "At least you're not black!"

This not only disincentivizes him from working with black workers in their shared struggle, but often motivates him to protect Porky's property from any proletarian movement that includes black people.

Look at the KKK, a lot of their membership were genuinely working class dudes who were spooked into thinking defending the integrity of the white race from blacks trying to vote is more important than demanding the full value of their labor.

I'm not shitting on them for theoretical differences, I'm shitting on them because they are quite possibly the least pleasant socialist sect in modern history.

you talk about solidarity but whine about how whities get a bigger share of the pie
really makes you think

also Engels emphisized that women were proletarians first, and women second

Why are comrades in this thread still engaging with idpol spouting retards

As a socdem I must know which is the more revolutionary choice: Saya or Hotaru

Identity politics is analysis of social identity that isn't rooted in class struggle. It isn't ALL analysis of social identity. That is a vulgar distortion of Marx.

Racism inside of a society is a spook
Oppression stems from foreign policy

what a condescending faggot you are

then they are idiots
first was matter then was thought

it is the level of the development of the means of production that a determining factor

True, but in the Dietary Pyramid of Posting correcting the erroneous theory of other supposed leftists should be close to the top rather than the base of the pyramid


I'm not whining about anything.

I'm recognizing the objective fact that under capitalism in the US, whites on average fare better than blacks. And I'm positing based on historical analysis that this inhibits working class organization and protects class society.

If you're taught that race means everything, you're going to reject interracial cooperation to fight capitalism and you might even oppose anti-capitalist efforts that threaten racial division.

That doesn't contradict anything I said.

but your pic disproves that, doesn't it? It shows that Asians are superior aryans least exploited workers

well no shit, biology is real, women are not as exploitable as men.

so? we should make whities as miserable as blacks?
and I'm not even talking if the whole classification on white/black is of any use at all

you implying that whities are some kind of labor aristocracy which is laughable

The only way to do that is to kick them out of our movements. They have no revolutionary potential.

You can't just pretend whites aren't muh privileged over people of color.

So many first year suburban undergrads don't realize how condescending this sounds to an unemployed pipe fitter or auto worker who just lost a cousin to opiate abuse

where's that Taibbi quote about how it totally makes sense for a WWC male to vote republican when the left is effete twinks in pink t-shirts going door-to-door saving the whales?

privilege theory is ridiculous

Kill yourself.

I'd like that but expelling people left and right like the Socialist Workers Party usually results in a lot of friendly fire and retaliation/splinter parties

Back when I was a libertarian teenager the right wing groups I worked with had an (ironically) Stalinist activist infrastructure. Your standing in the group depended on your ability to fight for programme/platform goals and not fuck with caucus unity.

It'll take longer, but the long-term solution is to just cultivate an intolerance for dead weight and infighting. People who do that can spend the rest of the revolution stuffing envelopes in a boiler room

This is all so stupid, if race issues stem from those of a class system then wouldn't focusing on race be a pointless as you can't actually effectively stem the racism that inhibites the movement as its inherent to a class system, just rearrange it? All focusing on race issues seems to ever do is put people in a conflict of "who has it tougher", when in reality everyone is confined and oppressed by the system no matter their position even the bourgs

What I'm saying is that these people already push out sensible people. We should not tolerate intolerance, even if it masks itself as tolerance itself. SJWs need to go, and attacking workers based on their race is wrong, even if they are white.

Engaging in dialogue that explains to people that their persecution is the result of class struggle would be one reason, and opposing any form of reactionary politics is another. Would you not advocate for women's rights in patriarchal societies in the Middle East? Would you not explain to the black man how slavery was due to the need for cheap labor by porky? White indentured servants were a thing.

Of course class struggle is the imperative, but there is no reason we can't engage these ideas with people who find them relevant in order to provide a leftist perspective on the issue.

Agree 100%, but getting people to conform or self-gulag wastes less resources than formal expulsions.

Additional point: a LOT of SJWs just support other SJWs out of fear that they themselves will be called out and mobbed if they aren't sufficiently woke. We just need to ignore and refuse to bend to ridiculous demands to prove that idpol is a paper tiger

(Also avoid using the language of the opposition comrade. Do not let the opposition define the terms of your own conflict)

These are genuine concerns, the main rule of thumb is to show how interconnected the struggles are. How the current opiate crisis is the result of the same soulless, reactionary policies of the Reagan Administration that targeted urban blacks. How the KKK lynched blacks and italians. etc. etc.

The WORST thing that idpol has done to modern leftism is convince activists that activism is a zero-sum game: that fighting the opiate crisis prevents struggle against the drug war in urban ghettos. It isn't, there are so many opportunities where it's literally just poor/working class whites blacks whatever versus porky and his cocksucking sycophants. We will cut through them like butter when we break down that divide

if it is really the result of class struggle then just appeal to class
and if it is not - then to hell with it

proplem is when people begin to emphisize race over class
like in this thread for example
people whine about how whities get more scraps from the table
there's no class analysis here
just pure animal stupidity
this kind of road will always end up in "more black CEOs so that income statistics are the same"

literally /ourguy/

when is leftypol going to finally make a slur infested brocialist org?

Can you tell us some of your experiences with the SEP? I find them to be the most theoretically sound party in the US.

I don't think that racism can be subsumed under class. It encouraged by porky, but not invented by him. There is nothing incoherent about an analysis which is centered on class but which fully accounts for racism as a semi-independent force of oppression. The problem with liberal idpol SJWs is usually that they have no class analysis at all. You can actually impale them on their own sword, by saying that they are not being intersectional at all by failing to account for class. There is no need to deny the independent importance of race - just turn their argument around on them.

Whites do get more scraps from the table - like way more. Their household income is like 10x more than black people in the US.

There is nothing prevent a Marxist from acknowledging this and embracing the struggle against racism semi-independently from class.

The reason we either end up with brocialism or supporting black CEOs is because people seeminly can't hold two thoughts in their head at the same time. That is that both race and class are extremely important - but very different, structurally, and neither can be reduced to the other. Liberal idpols want to pretend like class is just "classism", being prejudiced against someone for being lower class. Notice how they often only give lip service to even that primitive class analysis.

The way forward is to put class front and center but also not dismiss the central importance of other dimensions of oppression.

Ameriburgers, how many minority socialists have you met that weren't idpol left-wing nationalists?

I like this post. People have met too many crazy liberals so any talk of addressing problems having to do with the identity of a individual you're talking to is met w/ backlash. You have to appeal to their self-interest and once they understand they are better off without capitalism is when you start to break down their spooks and emphasize internationalism and class.

Go back to Holla Forums, assholes.

Since it's so obviously real, why don't you describe the benefits of white muh privilege? What do white men get from being white men?

White muh privilege is obviously real, it's just really stupid to demand that unemployed rural whites in the rust belt acknowledge some amorphous muh privilege when they live in a post-industrial hellscape and everyone around them is dying from drug overdoses. it's stupid and there's better ways to fight for poc

Don't worry fams, Mcdonalds has got us covered.

If it's real, describe what it is.

How do white men benefit from it?

I can pull chinese and indian household income statistics
and argue that ALL burgers are net surplus value recipients, black white or pink
and argue that we should get them to capitalist periphery levels

but it will only help bourgs to solidify their rule
you all talk that marxists could use race and gender as an entry point to spread class based views
but with you people it is always the other way around
like with Puerto Rico
it is because Trump racist that he is not hasty to help, and not because for him it would be another burden on a budget

If household income is what defines ethnic muh privilege, then we should probably be having a discussion about Jewish muh privilege.

OK: What's the difference between the crack "epidemic" and the opioid crisis

not really since jews in the west are almost all white and there are disparities in income distribution between racial groups with israel's jews (that have only been recently mitigated by a strong infrastructure of services)


I think Asians and Indians have even higher income than whites in the US because 1) we only allow really high skilled ones to immigrate and 2) they have a high degree of cultural acclamation to capitalism. In other words drilling in the capitalist work ethic into their kids to become doctors, lawyers, scientists etc. That doesn't prove that racism (historical and present) against blacks isn't a significant reason for their low income. You know of the study that shows that employers are far less likely to call back applicants with "black" sounding names right? I also happen to think that there is a lot of aversion to capitalist values in the black community, moreso than in whites, which is perfectly understandable given their history.

dafuq? I don't know about this news item but it sounds like you're really stretching things to make Trump appear not racist. He is.

Slavs are white now

Yeah I welcome that discussion - I think Jews are muh privileged in terms of wealth and connections but oppressed in terms of being the target of idiotic anti-semitic hate. Which is probably why we can't have the discussion.

No, they're Fellow Whites. But only on twitter.

One has to wonder if racism isn't a net expense for the bourgeoisie considering how much money has to be transferred to Blacks and Latinos in welfare.

One example:

Whites use marijuana at a slightly higher rate than Blacks, but Blacks are thrown in prison for marijuana at a far higher rate.

Then why does "privilege" under capitalism even matter, hmm? 🤔

Go back to Reddit dipshit

Yeah I can attest to this. I'm lily white and every time I've gotten caught smoking it was almost always:
- Stern talking to
- Weed and pipe confiscated
- Night in lock-up once because I was also drunk

Never ever considered a "threat" just a misguided college student whose life would obviously be ruined by a criminal record

I'm jewish and I can confirm, I was taught at the frankfurt school of witchcraft and wizardry to cozy up to honest aryans through evil social media

I was talking about indians and chinks in their respective countiries
we have global capitalist system with global value chains
lets compare american blacks with bangladeshi workers

I don't give a fuck
he may as well fuck goats for all I care
but his primary concern is to balance the budget because he is a market fag

Blacks: scientifically lower Autism Level, violence culture, have made no effort to exit the ghettos in almost 60 years and have been raising generations in squalor that entire time

Trans: mental disease stops normal societal function, culture of putting sexuality before all else, even so much as making it their identity, skyrocketing suicide rates so not many workers survive long enough to flower in their career

Single women: lmfao but if you're serious, culture of being subservient to men, breadwinning culture, no drive to pursue higher education because they can just marry a man who did all the work and its socially acceptable

There's your answers bucko, read a fucking book and get off tumblr, go outside.

Yes, we need a much more equitable prison-industrial complex, THAT'S socialism for the 21st century!

how does it feel being a literal classcuck

Not an argument, porky. This sick way that you use racial fears to drive more people into the working class is disgusting. You can't call someone a classcuck while using classes to front your bullshit statements on who is most picked on. Fuck off with your shit.

'privilege' discourse is more theological than anything, it's all about forcing people to acknowledge and internalise this sense of guilt, which is completely useless, but really plays into people's post christian neuroses

Here's a study of racial bias in law. A legal paper was written and sent to 60 partnerships for review, 30 stating the writer was white 30 stating the writer was black.

The same paper was judged far more harshly when the writer was considered black.

There's probably hundreds of studies along similar lines if you care to dig.

Yes I can, classcuck

How often do you think Pork tells this to white prols. (Who make up a majority of the country btw)

So what's your solution then

Blacks frequently have weed on them when arrested doing one of the numerous crimes they commit. They are responsible for over half of all-in-one violent crimes in the United States despite being roughly 14% of the population.

because we're all virgins and we'd just end up embarrassing the left just like kekistan did with the right.

much of 'social justice' discourse is still mired in the ideologies of meritocracy and managerialism. It has degenerated into an auxiliary to corporate management, creating objects to fulfil the system's purposes. 'progress' now means corporate 'diversity', ie. the internalisation of everything into managerial capitalism. post-fordian capitalism is essentially a people managing system, that's what right wingers don't understand.

muh reformist managerial capitalism

Pretty much. The tech company where I work is "super progressive" when it comes to race, gender, LGBTQ, having "inclusion groups" for all of these. I would be dumbfounded if they ever even mentioned the word "class." If they did it would be completely neutered of any meaning of course.

Are you actually defending blacks being thrown in jail approx four times as often for a crime they commit at a lower rate? Or are you just trying to distract from the point that there is a tangible problem?

We can't meaningfully discuss racism in a hypothetical socialist USA which does not exist.

This is transparently false. More people are arrested for marijuana use alone than all violent crimes combined.

There's also other reasons why your narrative is wrong but I kinda feel like I'm biting the bait too hard already.

I dunno, man. I just want to clarify that it's a real problem and not a fake one.

What did he mean by this? Puerto Ricans are Americans you dumbfuck

I have the lingering suspicion the so called New Economy and the tech industry are actually a massive simulacrum, a deep state psyop engineered to keep the west from becoming ungovernable post cold war. fordianism allowed a separation between the private self and the businessperson, think factory workers or Weber's bureaucrats, while post fordianism demands total involvement. Every Day is Casual Friday. Modern american managerial culture owes a lot to the New Age-y human potential movement, hence the obsession with weird group therapy rituals.

No I'm asking why the problem here isn't just that people are getting thrown into jail over bullshit


Yeah this post-ford shit is a fuckin nightmare if you're at all class conscious - especially cause your coworkers probably aren't. I basically had to learn to be a pro actor to make it look like I fit into the cult. Would not be surprised if it is a deep state psyop.

FWIW, the whole reason marijuana was made illegal was to target mexicans and black people, in the 1920s and 30s. The fearmongering which got it illegalized in the first place was racist. (It was renamed "marijuana", from "cannabis," to associate it with mexicans; it was claimed it could entice white women into miscegenation, etc)

This was intensified by Nixon's drug war, which administration members later admitted was deliberately to target blacks and hippies.

It's probably not a deep state psy-op so much as a threadbare, bankrupt deep state slapping together anything they can get their hands on that will postpone the inevitable collapse

le argument from consequence

there's a difference between acknowledging a division exists on some tangible level, and saying that this division is immutable, or that it has some basis in biology or pschology or otherwise. the latter is the territory of idpol and essentialists. being a universalist and a Marxist doesn't mean we should be pretending that, e.g., black workers don't get an even crappier shit sandwich on average, because there are all indications to say this is the state of affairs and has been since blacks became able to work for a wage.

stop being retarded.

'there's a difference between acknowledging a division exists on some tangible level, and saying that this division is immutable, or that it has some basis in biology or pschology or otherwise.'

should read

'there's a difference between acknowledging a division exists on some tangible level, and saying that this division is immutable or that it has some basis in biology or pschology or otherwise.'

sorry, that little bit of grammar could confuse people

Y'all niggers really like to ignore affirmative action, don't you?


Tell me one thing the New Left has achieved.

Go on. One. Fucking. Thing.

I remember the days were leftypol laughed at r/cuck mods sperging about "materialist intersectionality".

We need to purge the Chapo thread, and every single idpozzed nigger. Nazbols, radlibs. Don't matter. Any of them that tries to coopt our movement.

The Left is a rotting corpse and they're feeding on its flesh.

Its a matter if capital owned, not race. If blacks are generally poorer, still its not racism in play, its the poor part. Be specific.

No u. Learn2discuss.

Yeah the neoliberals seem pretty desperate lately. I think the fact they were considering running Hillary again in 2020 is proof they are totally bankrupt and out of ideas.

please go back to leddit. Instead of focusing on the poverty caused by the class system, the paranoia of race against race as a result of a divided proletariat, or the fact that there are bourgeoisie and proletariat of all races, you focus on whites in some form of bizarre racial self-flagellation.

The material problems plaguing certain races disproportionately cannot be dealt with by crying about white muh privilege. If we're going to go down that road, we ought to oppose asians and jews, which you can probably tell is fucking ridiculous. The only tangible thing that matters here is the class system – do you think blacks (and all the other races there) are forced into ghettos by evil white males beating them in there, or by poverty and the profit motive trapping them in a situation that they can never get out of, will never get out of, and will never even get the chance to get out of?

Reminder that every civil rights "victory" that has occured thus far has only occured because the economic conditions were suitable for them and the issue was deemed more of an economic plus then a loss, either by profit or stabilization. Trying to dismantle racist/sexist/etc. institutions in capitalism is like trying to take the eggs out of the batter, you can mix them up a bit but you'll never be able to take them out.

Just take a page out of pols playbook and throw it back in their face bringing up their jewish muh privilege. You have like a 8:2 chance of being right, 100% if they're a fucking Trot.

If they're actually real Marxists, as unlikely as that is if they really believe in religious shit like white muh privilege, then you should obviously talk about the issues in bringing in bourgie and petit-bourgie shits trying to co-opt the class struggle to their own malicious ends.
Nothing gets an idpoler more butthurt than talking about class and wealth.

poor little white boy lmao

America feels is an abandoned big box store, a huge parking lot with no cars in sight

Blacks were forced into ghettos by "evil" white males. In some cities such as my own there was a literal line black people could not cross or they would get arrested by the police. This was not just poverty trapping them into the ghetto, it was white supremacy backed by the force of the state.

It is entirely possible to have a full Marxist class analysis and also incorporate the notion of muh privilege. yes we should also look at the relative muh privilege of asians and jews, who for one thing didn't have 300 years of slavery and 100 years of Jim Crow bringing them down. In my view we have to examine how races and the cultures associated with them have varying degrees of acclamation to capitalist values. Liberal idpols don't want to go there. But I think it explains a lot of the disparity between say blacks and asians. Asians have internalized way more capitalist values.

Meanwhile the Russians suffered for 800+ years of some of the worst slavery institutions known and their revolution, the most succesful communist one ever, didn't even concern itself with that much lessa any ethnic grievances born from it.

Class Struggle > Your Neoliberal garbage.

What are you talking about Russia has some of the worst ethnic tensions of any first world country

Ok, we can argue whether or not that white supremacy was economic or class in origin, but thus seems mostly fine
Whats the fucking point of all this though. What good is analyzing muh privilege if not to compare position? If it is such, then it is an ultimately futile affair as it doesn't really matter what your position in capitalism is, everyone is confined and consumed by the system. To compare the economic stations of the proles with each other is to weigh people by the standards of capitalism.

They were also relatively homogeneous ethnically were they not? That probably helps with the revolution, cause you don't have different races struggling against each other. Well I do know that there were pogroms to ethnically cleanse Jews, not sure how that relates to my point.


I have no doubt it was greatly assisted by economic and class division. But I think that Europeans are more than capable of racism without an economic motive. Don't their stereotypes of black and Asian people bear this out long before they were capable of economic relations of domination?

Well if I'm right that a lot of the economic disparity between the races is due to differing levels of internalization of capitalist values, then we can aim at demolishing that ideology, and flip the script of idpol. Idpol wants everyone to have capitalist prosperity, like whites and asians. But we need to turn that around and say that actually capitalist prosperity is slavery, and whites and asians are actually the most enslaved to capitalist values.

wasn't smart of you to stay over after she admitted she had a boyfriend. still from your story you didn't do anything else wrong.

Racism is fractional without economic backing, having a negative preconcieved opinion of a group of people =/= enslaving them for economic profit
Maybe but this is somewhat anti-materialist
This is very anti-materialist

the absolute shit state of leftypol holy shit

I always was sceptical that we're being coopted by reddit, but after seeing this shitshow of a thread I don't know anymore
people just don't learn, you tell them once, twice, movements get hijacked into a harmless shadow of a socdem
but they cling to thier charts of race income inequality and spew the same bullshit points that we need to pay attention to color peoples struggle, because it's not fair that whities have it better than balcks
this is literally not better than pol race faggotry, it is fucking disgusting even thining in these white/black categories
fucking hell

Are we to believe the Crusades were purely motivated by economics?

How can you account for the fact that white people in the US have 10x more wealth than the average black person on a materialist basis? There is no simple relationship between base and superstructure.

yes, because base created conditions for crusades to exist, and it also created crusaders as a psychotype
and I'm not even talking of venetian role in the whole story

Don’t worry OP, some “liberals” are pretty crazy that I agree with. With muh pro nouns and muh privallge but I figure the majority are rather intelligent people.

Very few, they often ethnonationalists of varying stripes

Arguing that racism isn't the problem you want to tackle is fine, but arguing that there's no racism in America is just false, and is going to piss people off.

It's like the difference between saying "global warming isn't my immediate priority" and "global warming doesn't exist." It obviously does exist, and a lot of people care about it.

That's not the point fam. Global Warming is consequence of capitalism, like racism.
The problem so it's not racism or global warming becase then Moar gibs and black Ceo's =less racism. Capitalism can adopt a human face, we don't need to save capitalism tho. You don't want racism? Destroy capitalism and bla bla bla

racism is going to exist with or without communism.
the only question is whether people will get hurt because of it or not, and that's a question communism addresses.