Global Capitalism: Trump’s/GOP’s Tax Plan and a Changing US Economy [October 2017]

Decent assessment. I can't say I've read his work extensively enough to confirm this, though I have heard it stated on Holla Forums before that he reveals his true powerlevel in his writings, and that his lectures are more geared towards and introduction to socialism via critique of capitalism.

Also- CO-OPS!

Retards will also critique his advocacy of Co-Ops, when he doesn't even see co-ops as ends in and of themselves.

No, because as you can plainly see from even a glance at his videos he does not have brain damage

Why? it's cute

DELET

Doug you should get a trip code.

I havent read him at all but im pretty exciting by his co-ops idea. I advocated for this in a thread and a fucking leftcom called me stupid because there would still be market forces and the workers would be more reactionary to defend what they had.

I guess. But what if we tried to push this idea through electorally and there was a counter-revolution. Would that raise revolutionary potential amongst the proles and maybe create an opportunity to force something better through?

Yeah but you have to do that in a country that has the state infrastructure and military force to resist the CIA, what you're suggesting is kinda what happened to Allende. It didn't go so well there, I'd be open for that experiment in a place like Britain or France or Germany.

Something that gets workers together and empowers them by democratizing their workplace is hard to call counter-revolutionary. It is true that larger market forces may fuck with them in a variety of ways, (from anti-advertising, pushing/bribing for litigation that hinders their operation, infiltrations, assassinations to name a few possibilities) all the same I see it as a net positive for the workers and an idea that scares the heralds of capital, which always makes me happy.

So fucking jelly, good on ya m8

can I get a too-long:didnt-watch?

WE ARE GETTING SCREWED

Pretty jealous, my man.

Maybe I can enjoy it more because I'm a Yuropoor and he talks mostly about American issues so I'm a bit detached. But I really wish there were a similar program about Europe (maybe there is and I don't know it).

Can I get his arguments and talking points in bullet point/paragraph form, rather than his slow meandering?

I'd ride Don Wolff without a condom.

ignore those fucking autists you guys

He barely even advocates co-ops IRL. He mostly uses them as a hypothetical rhetorical device to contrast capitalism with socialism in terms that will make sense to his audience.

FTFY

No

Why is it there so much confusion between Trots and Leftcoms on this board? Do tankies just see both talking about things that aren't strictly speaking directly related to economics, and a klaxon goes off in their heads, "liberal, liberal!"? I can't think of any other explanation.

Trots are the sectarians who constantly shit on everything that isn't them. Leftcom isn't even a monolithic ideology, it's just a term for Marxists who didn't like Lenin back in the day

try mark blythe
he's not a marxist but he shits on the current thinking in the EU constantly (at least in the 4 or 5 vids I've seen)

I'm identifying the anti-Wolff autists as leftcoms because that's the flag I've seen posting >muh co-ops.

I should know, fam, I was one of them

There's nothing wrong with teaching people a version that's closer to the truth than what they currently believe but that they are more likely to accept/understand than the actual truth. The full story on capitalism is way more complex. As long as you don't say "socialism is co-ops and nothing else" then it's not even a thing. If the people you meme at are going to have any exposure to the left they are going to hear all kinds of arguments over what is and is not socialism, and the amount of damage done by misleading someone at first is vastly offset by getting them to pay attention at all.

Yeah, and then you start complaining when people correct them on their bullshit. Wolff might be a decent introduction, but then you get a swarm of people stubbornly believing in a version of socialism that was debunked over a century ago. There's no point in making people "socialists" if you do it by misleading them

Wolff doesn't claim that co-ops = socialism. He describes them as being a socialist way of organizing production. He's also consistently anti-market.

I'm not saying he does, famalam. I'm saying that his videos did lead to a swarm of people here thinking it was, after which they had to be corrected by all the leftcoms here, which you are now mad about

What annoyed me was the ones who continued posting anti-Wolff memes well after the point had been made that co-ops =/= socialism. It was never Wolff's problem, mostly a handful of people here who thought they understood him better than they did. And they were easily corrected. I'd go so far as to argue that the leftcom anti-Wolff meme brigade required more correction than the co-op misconception because they convinced a lot of people that he was a marksucc.

What exactly did you expect to happen? It was inevitable that people would understand him that way, especially when he literally said shit like "startups are socialism".
I respect what he's trying to do, but the backlash against him was perfectly understandable

Given what Marx had to say about co-ops and that socialism is "the real movement that abolishes the present state of things" he's not incorrect to describe co-ops and similar business structures as socialism-as-a-movement. It's ultimately the same issue with arguing whether the USSR was socialist as in it achieved socialism as a mode of production vs. it was a socialist movement. The semantic argument about which use of the word is the issue. The proper response isn't "co-ops aren't socialism"; it's "you're confusing the meaning of socialism as a mode of production vs. the movement to establish that mode of production." The former response causes more confusion, especially when it's extended to the point that people are ascribing outright false positions to people in order to make the point.

Fair enough

But the point is they would still be exploiting each other. There would still be wealthy wage earners who wouldnt want to work for the betterment of society.

There was a question wolff answered in a lecture, i think it was about how education would work under this new system and would our social system have to change to accomodate it. He said it would be transformational and that people when people werent seeing each other as someone to compete against it would change how we relate to one another. Has anyone got a link to that, because it seems to contradict this criticism.

Any expansion or articles on this point?

Blythe is good for learning about economics but he only talks about the european economic problems, not wider issues of how economics relates to other spheres like politics and relations like wolff. He explicitly stated he's not a comrade.

How do you mean?

Wew this comment.

Co-ops reintroduce socialized control of production and give workers a taste of what it's like outside capitalism, turning them more against it while also giving them the opportunity to learn management skills. If the co-op (or other org) has a revolutionary program, workers can pool resources to obtain weapons and spend time training with them. Especially with something like a large union or syndicate you can have communications over long distances to help establish infrastructure and logistics in the event of a capitalist crisis (which also can be leveraged to turn people off capitalism) or outright collapse/revolution.

The concept is pretty straightforward. If worker organization already happens in the workplace there's less work to do to adapt a lefty movement to the workplace once shit hits the fan.

I get that. I should have specified what does mitigating the effects of capitalism as a tool of propaganda mean?

top kek