Since you guys are continually shilling on 4/pol/, I don't feel guilty making a thread on the catalog. I'm not here to debate because I'm banned when I do, I just want you guys to answer some questions I came up with. I'm probably not going to reply to your answers, I just want to get an idea as to why Holla Forums thinks the way it does.
1: True communism is stateless. How are you going to keep a consistent standard of morality? I ask this question of both you guys and AnCaps and don't get a very fulfilling answer.
2: How are you going to make everyone stop using money (realistically)?
3: Why is the Communist revolution inevitable apart from "Marx said so"?
4: If a society has a high standard of living for all classes, from high to working, such as in NutSac, why redistribute?
5: How are you going to enforce rules in a Communist society with no government? People aren't a hivemind and are bound to have disagreements.
6: Why do you consider all business owners evil, even non successful or generally fair ones? It just seems that you should judge them on a case by case basis, rather than having a kneejerk reaction to them, similarly to AnCaps saying all businesses are good.
7: With Google, YouTube, Facebook, and other social media sites being Leftist, do you not think that they are on your side? Same question with schools, both K-12 and Universities.
8: Why do you accept evolution, but deny races being different? Are humans above nature in your philosophy?
9: Why is all religion bad?
10: Do you think Marxism is Jewish? If not why do you deny that Marxism is pushed by a great number of Jews?
Thank you to all who took the time to respond. I might screencap answers, so be civil.
Why do you need a consistent standard of "morality"? Even if you are pure and don't engage in "de.generacy," if others do so it doesn't affect you. There will be no banks or printing press so how could they? Capitalism is self-contradictory and can only sustain itself so long before collapse. Communism is not "wealth" redistribution. What rules? Like stealing or murder? It's not in your best interest to kill your coworkers as they will revenge kill you and you will find no place to work. Because they reap the rewards of their employee's labour without doing anything. What makes you think a multi billion dollar tech company is on the side of people who want to destroy multi billion dollar tech companies? Material conditions lead to any perceived racial differences. Subverts control away from the people and towards some anointed priests or cardinals. I don't understand why you guys simultaneously cry about Jews being the ultimate capitalist banking scum and also about Jews being communists and wanting to overthrow the banking scum?
Hudson Wilson
Morality is a spook socialism will be a gift economy, you're a worker and walk into a bar you get a beer, you're a slacker and walk into a bar you get nothing. you get as long as you give. because of the contradictions of capitalism, society will keep rotting and when its completely rotten life won't be possible unless we move to socialism because of the above, good living conditions don't solve the contradictions of capitalism just swipes them to somewhere else. This question sounds kind of loaded. You're probably thinking of liberals Liberalism is not leftism races are different but is not a meaningful difference. Religion is a purely political tool Marx himself was kind of an antisemite, read Marx's The Jewish Question Eat cock
Nathan Anderson
How do you come to that conclusion? Do you think every communist in the world uses this board? ASAIK, the spaniard who keeps making the threads on 4/pol/ has never been here. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialectical_materialism We believe that morals and the such are part of the superstructure which is influenced by the material base. In feudalism, it was immoral not to bow before a nobleman, with feudalism being abolished, it does not matter anymore. The moral decay you are observing is mostly caused my capitalism, particulary to the commodification of everything. In communism, when people produce for need and not for profit, morals are likely to be more genuine. Probably only possible in global communism, and the answer would be due to a mode of production where allocation of goods for consumption is based on need.People havn't been using money in a generalized way for a long time, in feudalism, it was mostly a barter economy based of relationships between people, instead of relationships between things (as in capitalism). In socialism (lower phase of communism), when there is still money and the state, money isn't exchanged, and given out according to the quantity and quality of your labor (instead of being measured by the market price as in capitalism). Marx claims that there are several contradictions of capitalism which can not be resolved. The same way feudalism wasn't sustainable anymore once the enlightenment happened, and once standing armies replaced the feudal bannermen. There are many reasons, the most prominent one is the falling rate of profit. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tendency_of_the_rate_of_profit_to_fall Communism isn't redistribution, don't know where you picked that up. Regarding your example, NutSac was running on a ponzi scheme en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mefo_bills There is not much that indicated that Nazi Germany was not capitalist, so it was affected by the contradictions of capitalism like many other examples. The same way rules were enforced before there was a state. Government =/= state, even in full communism there would still be some institutions that regulate and control stuff. You are better off asking the Anarchists that one. We don't. We don't have moral categories like that when it comes to the analysis of relations to production. We do, however, believe that privately owned means of production take away the surplus value of labor that the worker produces. They are neoliberal/left-liberal, we are communists. Posting "Kulaks deserved it" on social media might get you banned when people report on it. Unis disregard Marx as an economist and outsource him to the social science department. Races don't exist, the last humanoid races died out hundreds of thousends of years ago. Homo Sapiens Sapiens remains. You are referring to Haplogroups. That's a very generalized statement, but you can see organized religion as an element of the superstructure to legitimize the base (see dialectical materialism). Example: Divine right of kings. Marx was an atheist. The Bolsheviks weren't, that's a myth, in the Spartakusaufstand there were a couple of Jews, which isn't very surprising considering a marginalized group with high education would join an intellectual alternative. None of them were practicing Judaism though.
Ayden Bailey
holy shit fuck off.
Carter Myers
And btw, regarding the Jews: >>>/marx/6064 Read this thread about Jews in communism, OP.
Alexander Collins
I would say the increasing need for moral behavior is closely linked to capitalism's wealth inequality. "Don't steal" is pretty moot when you don't need to steal. By centralizing the economy into the hands of the workers (no private production). Because of the tendency of the rate of profit to fall. As capitalist scramble to make a profit they will put enourmous pressure on the working class leading to a revolutionary climate. I really doubt the working class of nazi germany had a high standard of living compared to the extreme amount of labour they did. There is no peace in a class society. It's not about redistribution, but about eliminating this contradiction alltogether. Obviously, but they will be of the same class, which gives them at least the same economic interests in large. Disputes are settled all the time in all parts of society without the need for government, either through democracy or sheer force. You'll notice that people don't really use the word evil here. We are against small business because it is simply the preliminary stage towards big business, and their class interests are already very similar, meaning they'll generally support policies that benefit the upper class. Wat? I'm not going to pretend to understand what racial differences really means, but right wingers will look at a group poor black people and say they act like niggers because they're black and not poor. It is the sigh of the oppressed. We see it everywhere, when people are exploited economically or otherwise they tend towards religion to find some sense of meaning and purpose. "jewish"? Not denying that marxism was pushed by a great number of jews, but the number is extremely inflated by right wingers. But if we take the USSR for instance, prior to the collectivization of aggriculture, communism was almost exclusive to the urban areas where jews were far more concentrated than on the countryside.
Sorry you get banned for asking legitimate questions. Our mods have been nazis lately :^)
Levi Gomez
Morality is a fugging spoog :–DDD More seriously "morals" are almost always reflective of ruling class interests, and thus current morals wouldn't necessarily carry over to a communist society. When you're producing goods solely for use there's really no reason to use money. Not necessarily inevitable, just one of the outcomes of capitalism as a response to worsening material conditions i.e. a collapse. It's not about redistribution, it's about workers receiving the full value of their labour and being in control of their workplaces (and eventually phasing out work). This obviously doesn't happen when workers are being exploited by a capitalist class. Also class collaboration is cuckoldry of the highest level. Nobody ever said it'd be a utopia where nobody would ever disagree. I'm an anarchist, and not a Marxist so my ideas may be different on this, but rules would pretty much be self-evident and self-enforcing - common sense, if you will. Don't be a dick, don't take people's personal possessions without permission, don't neglect social labour etc. and people will be fine with you. If, on the other hand, you mean "how do u commies stop da whipepo forming their own ethnostate and killing all le undesirables KEK" the answer is militias. Militias would stop that, assuming there were sufficient such-minded people left after any kind of revolution to try such a thing. They're not "evil" - their class (and thus self) interest is not that of the working class - it is contingent on the working class staying where it is and as it is, and thus they are most likely to align themselves against any proletarian movement that in turn is acting in its own self-interest (not being exploited).
Jaxon James
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Luis Stewart
If he hadn't spaced his post it would a pain in the ass to read. Please take your whining to reddit
Daniel Jackson
Not with the numbers there. low-energy
Jackson King
1: We have a different view on the state as ancaps do. We see the state as a tool of class rule as it has been for most part. It protects private property, destroys movements against the status quo etc. There would still be an administration which is going to ensure laws and shit. 2: By making it worthless, read a little article about "Communization" on libcom.org 3: Because capital will collapse on itself after a time, we are seeing it for example climate change, it will cause famine and catastrophies, you can´t just tame something like that under capitalism. 4: We are not about the redistribution of wealth, what you are talking about is social democracy. What we want is the end of explotation by the capitalist class and capital itself. 5: We are going to have a government. 6: Well for my part, I don´t have anything against buisness owners, they´re simply just a part of our current system,I mean the system is allowing them to create a surplus value and take profits from workers, also what is definetly going to happen is that they wouldn´t want to give away their own power because, obviously, they´re in a really strong position of power thanks to the big amount of capital they have. 7: … 8: Because theres no real evidence for that there are multiple biological theses that have disproven such thing like a "masterrace" 9: It isn´t 10: don´t forget the amount of antisemites that were actually in marxist movements.
Mason Gomez
I seriously don't understand the problem with spacing your posts. Why does this trigger you so much?
Camden Young
Like I said, I don't want to get into debate about what I think vs what you think because of getting banned mid-debate, but I'll clarify stuff and ask for clarification if need be.
Companies couldn't do whatever they wanted in Nazi Germany. The government enforced moral standards and made sure businesses treated workers fairly. Capitalism has no such need to do these things. That's why they weren't Capitalist.
I read it. I guess the Jew thing is because you guys don't see it as a race AND religion, when we do. You can be a Jewish Atheist. I'm getting "contradictions in Capitalism" a lot from you guys, can you elaborate what contradictions specifically?
It's happened a few times for 2-3 years now. Whenever I say something they don't like or don't agree with your definitions, they ban me. At least you fucking have mods though.
Only do it for questions.
We don't actually buy into the "Ayrans are superior" meme, we just want every race and country to be homogeneous and govern themselves.
Blake Reed
Wholly unconcerned with the establishment of a standard of morality. Not as a matter of apathy, but deliberate disinterest. The development of capitalistic productive forces has wholly ebbed away the old traditional standards of religious and nation-state orthodoxy and, at least I, would halt at the idea of their re-establishment in any manner - I should prefer, as Badiou said in some of his latest lectures, that we establish a new codified society of symbols, not subjugating a a person to capital, nor race, nor phantasm. The waning of the market as a means for the exchange of commodities does not entail the natural dissolution of currency; however, it does render it completely inefficient - wholly unsuitable to an econophysics that is centered about production for use - I'd imagine we will see a development in trade through other means, this of course not entailing the re-establishing of the embryo of market relations The idea is that capitalism will be unable to bear the burden of it's productive limitations, with regards to the distribution of wealth as well its modern productive inefficiencies. Communism isn't an alternative posed to the subjective 'evil' of capitalism - its the superseding state It's not redistribution of wealth. As for the economic policies of the erstwhile empire - they were wholly Keynesian in nature, and actually begot a massive amount of state debt which was offset by the productive value of the capital created in the re-armament of the armed forces. This was also mitigated with the strict state control of social services, which besides their racial lines, seemed wholly more like a democratic socialist project - belying the inertia with which the nazi's developed their own cogent system of economic function - they simply couldn't sustain the national economy in such a way - war was inevitable. There will remain substantive organizational bodies to mediate dispute and settle scores. This, of course, not an indication of a higher regulative body or any cordon of state power We don't - I care not for the manner in which our economics are conducted, that does not render the business owner some primordial evil. I, maintain the attitude of Bartleby the scrivener The corporations are what suits them. I understand that we are made out to be naive utopians in this manner - simply blinded tools of corporate interests. But I doubt the sincerity with which any person, critical of their ideology, can honestly pose them as leftist. We're not for an eroded state apparatus that sustains multi-national conglomerates or the present global market. As for schools, the "leftist" nature has long since been replaced with a petty nihilism and the is/ought question. Fred Hampton responded well to this modern racial injunction by any "leftists" that they merely represent the opposite side of reaction. In that vein, the development of postmodern 'leftism' is utterly impotent to array itself against the predominant ideology Files related, they're fairly short It isn't per say, it's hardly my place to comment on the pre-reflective Jacobian faith. But I can certainly note the dangerous agency of religion that purports to carry the word of a divinity No, read the Rafiq post above, covers the pathology of the development of the Jew as an other, in the guise of anti-bolshevism.
Asher Torres
The problem mostly is that no people actually govern themselves under capitalism. And I can't really give a shit if the guy taking most of what I produce is a jew, nigger or cumskin.
Adam Cook
that doesn´t matter, in every capitalist country, companies weren´t allowed to do everything. ->
Juan Edwards
That's a welfare state/mixed economy. We consider this capitalism. Capitalism from our viewpoint is defined by private ownership over the means of production, wage labor, and individual producers competing in a market (commodity production). Yeah, but I don't know in what way is the haplogroup of Jews relevant. Do you think their group behaviour is not defined by cultural and societal circumstances but by some genetic code? Do you think the world is like an RPG where Jews have like perks on "deception"? Some of them: faculty.rsu.edu/users/f/felwell/www/Theorists/Essays/Marx5.htm
Read this, it gives several examples of companies doing just that.
Jaxon Carter
Do you actually think massive mega corporations are actually anti-capitalists or pushing marxism? Do you actually think that the teaching institutions aren't strictly enforcing the status quo? At best they're guilty of suggesting that there are some people that don't agree with the status quo(usually followed by how evil they are).
Gabriel Foster
Who cares? Morality is historically relative. Communizing most use values. You don't seem to understand what socialism is about. See above. Spooky. Nothing more leftist than billion dollar corporations, you utter fucking imbicile.
And so on. You don't even know what the words you use mean.
Blake Thompson
Morality is a spook Encourage them to take what they want Capitalism is unsustainable, infinite growth in a finite system will hit a brick wall at some point, and when it does… Firstly, nazifag germany sucked for white people, read The Wages of Destruction. Secondly, we're taking back what is ours. By force, the same way every society works. But we will eliminate the necessary conditions that make unnecessary force justified in the first place (war on drugs, and other bullshit) Evil is a spook. And even baby pigs are still pigs. You think the same way but apply it to races; "even if a black man is happy and sucessful with a family and he's a hardowkring man who defends white people, he still needs to be gassed because he's black" but unlike you, our positions aren't based on feelies or discredited 18th century textbooks on biology. It's not fair. Consider this: social media and schools are capitalist instituions to make money. Now, why would they support something like socialism which would destroy them and take power away from the CEO? Really makes you think… In other words, they're liberals, not lefties. Race is a spook. Melanin cannot describe The Unique One nor can any arbitrary abstract definitions. The Unique is defined by his Ownness and nothing else. Religion and "bad" (evil) are spooks. I find them unnecessary. Are you trying to apply anthropomorphic traits to inanimate objects? This is called a Pathetic Fallacy. There can no more be a jewish ideology than a jewish tree, or a jewish computer, or a jewish air sample, or a jewish glass of water, or a jewish blade of grass. So the answer is no.
