How will a socialist society avoid the total societal collapse that would follow the dissolution of wage labour? When people don't have to spend all day working anymore wouldn't they have nothing better to do than going back to the old family unit and start breeding like crazy again? Could increased number of births by family in addition with universal modern healthcare lead to an unsustainable population growth? How would you deal with this without taking away someones means of people production?
How will a socialist society avoid the total societal collapse that would follow the dissolution of wage labour...
Anti-natalism are for faggots
You're a fucking retard honestly, READ A FUCKING BOOK
HIGHER STANDARD OF LIVING = LESS CHILDREN
It's proven across the world, advanced capitalist countries with high standards of living have depressed birth rates because they are able to provide for themselves in their old age. Poor third world countries do not have this ability and so have children as insurance to look after them.
Also you think the dissolution of wage labour is the dissolution of work or something? WTF everything would grind to a halt if there was no more production.
Why the fuck would the abolition of wage labor result in increased eagerness to reproduce, especially in the age of advanced family planning?
Higher standard of living doesn't result in less children.
Feminism and abortion does.
Not actually factual, it's just a coincidence in the statistics. We know nothing about the real dynamics at play only that within in our society right now that is the case. Birth rates also coincide with women going into the labour force and besides if anything marx said about the progress of capitalism is true population growth is bound the hindered by capitalism rather than anything else as it is becoming increasingly difficult to rear more than one or two children. Who says people wouldn't go back to having children if they could? And no the abolition of wage labour is not the abolition of work, do you have any idea of how much people worked in the past? They didn't work much at all.
Abortion = less crime
Stop pretending you care about these things, you're one track minded about niggers or pakis or whatever your local flavour is.
What's the problem?
We're going to need people to colonize space aren't we?
haha lets just pre-emptively kill potential criminals in utero to lower crime rates bro great idea
I do care about the fertility rate (of white people).
You'd just bitch about all the white lumpens your hamfisted attempts at policy create.
Better white lumpens than non white lumpens.
im agreeing with u bro in fact lets take it further and kill everyone that way crime is totally eradicated for good
After the nuclear war population will have dropped to such a degree that by the time population recovers even slightly technology will have advanced to the degree that we will all have robot lolis.
The reasons for abortion weigh so heavily towards lack of financial and familial stability that a significant number of children who would have been aborted otherwise get involved in crime later in life. This is why you can see a drop in regional crime give or take around 18 years after abortion is legalised.
No I really wouldn't. A whole standard deviation of intelligence separates white and black people. Black people simply have underdeveloped frontal lobes and are never desirable to have around. Test the theory by walking through Baltimore then walking through a post Soviet shithole city of your choice at night and see where you feel safer. I'll take white lumpens over black ones any day.
The thing is this is the exact kind of backwards reasoning stormfags raise against immigration. You have less poor people, of course you're going to have less crime.
But in the case it effectively amounts to punishing people long before they've done anything wrong. If they're going to grow up to be a criminal then that's their life to live and it is up to society to punish them for being a criminal, not enact thinly veiled eugenics policies against poor kids to prevent crime from happening.
You really would. The types who moan about immigrants/blacks/browns are the first to moan about the unemployed of all races when a crash hits.
This is some serious moralfaggotry from a transhumanist.
Fuck off Malthus, your bullshit has been debunked a million times already. It's literally the other way around. Without a social safety net (pensions, healthcare, welfare etc.) people need kids to support them. Birthrate is related to material conditions, not to cultural values.
Lots of non-arguments in this post. And I'm not saying we should bad immigrants, I'm saying the arguments for allowing abortion in the name of reducing crime aren't too different from the arguments for banning immigration in the name of reducing crime. They consider crime at the most fundamental and absurd root, people existing. This is the point of the absurd parody of this position saying that we should kill everyone and reduce crime to zero immediately, it's a ridiculous way to treat crime. It doesn't try to alleviate the actual socio-economic causes of crime, or improve the rehabilitation of criminals, it tries to weed out potential criminals from the gene-pool.
It is arguing for the death penalty for non-existent child criminals. People are being killed on the suspicion that they might commit a crime someday. It's absurd. If we're going to come up with a real solution, that's actually going to benefit everyone it's not to just let poor people kill their children. It would be to have a comprehensive, well-funded, state adoption system that can allow unwanted children to live a complete and well-adjusted life. It's a better investment than child murder clinics.
No, you dip, I'm saying the Nazi wanted to ban immigrants and abortion. I'm not saying we should allow abortion because it reduces crime, we've already allowed abortion and it has been proven to reduce crime, so banning it will increase it.
The crux here is that I'm saying that the people who decide to have an abortion have been shown to be in circumstances that consist of the conditions that turn someone to criminality, so banning abortion is actually immoral because it forces two people to live lives of poverty and very little choice. Nobody is being killed because they might commit a crime, none of these people have existed outside of the hypothetical world where we ban abortion. They are being aborted because their mothers don't see themselves as capable of looking after them properly. Forcing them to have the child will lead to the child not being looked after properly.
Come on now.
Only here is the thing, this is not the fault of abortion being unavailable, it is the fault of capitalism as a system that leads people into such poverty where they cannot afford to take care of their own children. Allowing to murder these children is no solution to this, it is a Band-Aid on a foundation crack. It hasn't actually fixed anything about the system, it just provides a superficial illusion of problems being solved by removing the people that would be most damaged by the system from the equation. In reality the parents are still in a shitty unstable situation, society just feels less pressured to confront this reality because the most pronounced symptom of this problem is killed in utero.
And not just that but it's a bad idea in principle. The child is not the property of the parents to be put down if they aren't able to take care of it like a housepet. They are an individual in their own right that ought to be just as protected from being killed as any other member of society. Even in the case of the ones that would become criminals I'm sure if you asked convicts if they're grateful for the opportunity to live a large amount of them would say yes. Whether an individual would rather continue with their difficult life or not is their choice to make, their parents shouldn't make that decision for them, society should not make that decision for them, as living individual people they deserve the opportunity to live and make their own autonomous choices. Their life may be very difficult, and they may eventually decide they don't like living very much at all. But only they can live that life and navigate those decisions.
If capitalist states got to do whatever they wanted we wouldn't have a lot of things that we have now. As socialists it's up to us to pressure them into conceding to orphans in this way rather than the monstrous amounts of time and energy we spend trying to legalize and/or defend abortion. This infatuation the socialist movement has with the freedom to murder children is something I cannot wrap my head around.
Burger tier morality. Take off that flag.
When transhumanism arrives you're in for one hell of a ride.
Pro-death kool-aid drinkers out
That's where you're wrong kiddo.
I made a new thread because I asked the mods to bring up the anchor but they seem to be absent and I am too lazy right now for long debates. Also stalin is online and I want to see him get mad.