what do you say, leftypol?
What do you say, leftypol?
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I don't think a fucking trap should rappresent us anywere. Not because I'm against trap or transexuality (which I'm. But that's not the point) but because we have to clean up the stigma we have of the "dege.nerate" left. Purge all the liberals. Now I'm gonna watch the video
I think she's right, aesthetic is very important. Theory is important too, but aesthetic gets people's attention better than arguments over the labor theory of value and dialectics.
Im not giving up the hammer and sickle though
I agree. Then he should delete his fucking, because having a tranvestite as a spokesman is pretty imbarassing and prole reperrent tbh.
The leftist caricature is confused and all over the place because she tried to make that person simultaneously a tankie, ancom, SJW lib, and socdem reformist all at once. I get that to a liberal audience it would be confusing but that criticism just doesn't land when you're trying to contrast them with the far right (who also have unsociable spergs in their movement, and also have retards waving around nazi flags). The point being missed is that the right wing coordinated strategy is to explain away transgressions and give apologism for the worst members of their group, not to tightly control the actions of every single person under their umbrella (a silly and unrealistic expectation).
That means have a good, and dismissive, answer to the typical liberal accusations, not to make sure there's nothing to criticize at all (impossible and the media will construct something to criticize even if it didn't exist)
my little moustache hapa can't be this reactionary
The average person could give a shit about homosexuals are transexuals. You seem to be caught up ina spook
She speaks the truth.
I always preferred the red star as a symbol anyways. I've noticed a lot of people today aren't familiar with it, which avoids funny looks.
When did this board get taken over by Tumblr and Reddit? Transsexuals are idpol, their entire existence is based around not belonging to the right identity. These people are not spokesmen of the working class in any way, shape or form; they are bourgeoisie hedonism taken to insanity and should be disregarded in favor of real issues.
The leftypol of now would have been caught up in that transsexual bathroom bullshit like the rest of the left. Hopeless. Utterly hopeless.
What are proles general reaction to the massive amounts of cringe inducing weirdos at all those alt-right/trump rallies? Because they're on the same level as trannies IMO (assuming a chunk of them are not also trannies).
I'm not posting it in agreement, but you have to respond to what you call idpol, because a lot of people are into it, so dismissing it and not paying attention to it makes you look like the furry in the video.
"Transsexuals existing is idpol" is a retarded, reddit-tier stance, especially when that's actually your "argument" against a video that has nothing to do with trans issues
Ok I worded my self really badly. I didn't meant to say anything reactionary, I just wanted to point out how the focus on aesthetics is more a right wing thing. Also it's pretty ironic how she/he that is today the classic rappresentation of muh degener.ate commies is talking about aeshtetics. Don't you guys think that aestetics are indipendet from the image that the group give or wants to give.
My dude are you drunk or has your english been getting worse lately?
I think "messaging" and "image" are related but not necessarily the same thing. A tranny can play into "negative" images of the left but still give a good speech, and a "TV-ready", well built leftist male can go on TV and look good while giving a terrible speech
Yeah, I drinked to much this week. My italian is getting worse too these days. They opened a bar under my house so when I finish the bottles at home I go down there.
Talking about image is liberal bullshit tbh.
This would kill me.
I lived over a bar during college, fun times at first but that shit gets old quick
but most liberals are rich yuppies, conservatives makes more sense but not liberals
…ok but what if I don't give a fuck about elections?
Maybe in Italy? I don't know my dude, Liberalism is the dominant ideology here in the states.
how many working class people were big Hilary supporters ?
Reminder that transphobia the same is as homphophobia. Fuck off
Depends on their wives probably.
Good video. It could be better; Tabby was an unfairly negative portrayal of the modern leftist - too caricatured and inconsistent - but it was still good.
I can guarantee the edge-lords here won't take any of this on board though.
I'd wager most of them, it's important to remember that the democrats have a lockdown on the minority vote and until Hillary also the unionists. Republicans, also liberal in a philsophical sense, have the most bourgeois support.
Oh yeah, must be why Milo Yabadabasackofdonkeyshit was so unpopular with liberals and conservatives uh?
Nod rly. Iran despised homosexuality, but accepts trannies.
Since trannies appeared in the Koran, they're permitted in Islam.
He means from an idpol perspective, but it's funny that you're responding as if this is a muslim board
They also diddle kids like they're going out of style.
This is true. But we are not good at speaking either. Rember that speaking is not only about the content. In Italy we have this guy called Marco Rizzo and is the head of the communist party in italy. He's a bit of a fake tankie (he voted for intervention in kosovo and afghanstan), but he's always the one who says the intelligent stuff on tv. This is common with every communist ever: You are always right. But then you binge on videos of his apparence in tv and you discover that the guy is a really fucking bad pitcher. He lacks carisma and spend most of the time explaining stuff more than convincing people. That's the problem, we need a charismatic figure that can unite all of us no matter what brand of ideology he has.
Also having toyed a lot with right-wing aesthetics and images I can say that that's a really really weak side for us. Our aestetics is the one of the old soviet union ecc. It's not sexy, It's old and fugly. I personally love it, but I can understand why normies hate it. If it's no that what do we have? Treehuggers, anarkiddies, "degenera.tes", crust punk and shit like that that is dangerously liberal.
It's not like it's a nice place where to find pussy, It's a shithole. At least before after I drank all the shit in my home I didn't want to go out, now it's just a matter of opening a door.
I'm not sure if the other stalinstache is italian, btw In italy we don't have that many liberals, but we don't have a left either. Many youngsters are apolitical or fascist. At least this in rome and milan
Milo gets the benefit of going "those libs say homos can't be conservative but WATCH ME". Ironically our most transgressive representatives will be those who boast no stereotypical left cultural signifiers but still go hard left.
Well they are. You gotta get 'em while they're hot.
I actually had no idea. This kind of situation would probably make me drink myself to death too tbh.
Two things here. You're kind of implying that the far right is gaining followers because of their comparitavely "cool" aesthetics when every "we're the new punk rock" type reimaging campaign has just been embarrassing. I think the left is actually starting from an advantage here in that rebellion is already seen as more leftist than rightist and the history of that is on our side but just needs to be rehabilitated (yes, hippies and punks are cringe now but they represented legit anti-establishment in their day and the same impetus can be channeled again)
I have some newfound respect for you my dude.
Yep. Thank god forming a fascist party here is illegal. There are a lot of nolstalgic here. These people vote mostly for lega nord and 5 star movment. First one are populist racist like le pen and Afd and trump (bascially neoliberals with a racist and nationalistic rethoric) and then the 5 star movment is something really interesting that I don't see anywhere else: They exist literally only as a reaction to the other parties, they don't even have an ideology, just antagonism to the other parties. These guy started as a joke and now they are one of the strongest party in this country, they are the one with a lot of presence online and they do their primaries online too.
It's really difficult to find an anti-establishment image today in a world were everything becomes a meme and a T-shity in few weeks and becomes old and mainstream in a month. We should be normcore tbh. We should go back to the origins and take back that working class image, without looking dirty. What the right played (and what backfired for the american establishment) is basically giving the idea that they are really a counter-culture to the ebil commies that now are ruling the world.
Made laugh fam. I'm not a neet tho, I work a lot, but now I'm on my way to getting fired again so I'm working less and mostly from home or at night. Tonight I have to go check on a set. Also when I'm home I only drink guinnes, jameson, vodka and I do cocktails for my self time to time. My favorites are Vesper Martini and Old fashioned
Tbf Rome and Milan are notoriously fascist. In some places like Turin it's very much to the left and Livorno is downright commie town. But a lot of people are forced to Milan and Rome for work.
At least according to my italian friend. I myself am a burger.
Yep. Turin and Bologna are pretty leftist, especially the latter, but milan and rome are the two most important cities in Italy. Also I talked about those two cities because my life here is going up and down those to cities
The hammer and sickle is a nice symbol, but if you actually want to get into power and change things - be it by reform or by revolution - then you're going to have to change the way you act. Want normies to support your cause? Don't fucking use a hammer and sickle.
The right understands this, they have smart suited twats like Spencer who's a literal Nazi but who publically disavows Nazism and anyone who is too closely associated with Nazism that there's no plausible deniability. And they have the even more successful ones like Farage, Bannon, Le Penn and so on, who have so successfully sanitized their own ideologies and parties that they have actually achieved meaningful political goals already and have moved the overton window to the right so that far right ideas are openly discussed in mainstream political discourse. They understand that symbolism and associations matter and you have to completely distance yourself from what you really want in order to achieve anything.
The left could be incredibly powerful right now if we had played our cards right after the financial crash. If we had kept repeating the same message that it was global capitalism that caused the crash and simultaneously pushed for daring but *achievable* and populist political goals like nationalization of the banks and supported left wing populism we would have shifted the overton window to the left and had actual social democrats (not red neoliberals) like Corbyn in power across Europe. From that point we could have worked on shifting the discourse further to the left. As it is, the Nazis have their right wing populist (not a nazi) POTUS and are using that as a position from which to shift the conversation further to the right towards actual fascism.
It comes down to this: do you actually want to change society-or do you just want to have some fun and LARP as a commie with your LARPing comrades?
If you're actually serious about wanting to change society in a big way, then you're going to have to understand how to appeal to people. You don't do that with fucking soviet symbols.
Pinned comment on the video from contra gives better context
Political videos tend not to be interpreted very charitably (I know this video is going to be upheld by centrists as evidence I’ve “gone full Antifa” and by leftists that I’m a closet centrist) so I’d better state unambiguously what I think.
The character Tabby represents a lot of what I think is wrong about leftist strategy: the indifference to optics, the undisguised hostility to the ideologically impure, the sectarian nitpicking, the alternation between extreme optimism (“a communist revolution can happen in the United States and it will go well if it does”) and extreme pessimism (“neoliberal propaganda has so tight a grip on the general public that why should we even bother trying to appeal to them?”), the blurring of lines between recognizing the necessity of violence in certain situations and the aesthetic celebration of violence as an end in itself. Nevertheless I try to represent Tabby with some sympathy, and anticipate that my viewers will like her—my audience is at least 95% trans Antifa cat girls, but I hope that doesn’t prevent them from thinking about the critique.
The character Justine is a mouthpiece for a lot of my complaints about the left, and the recipient of some leftist criticisms of me (“you go to brunch with these people?”), but I chose not to represent her as an attractive alternative. She’s complacent, frivolous, and ineffective, full of derision for the way other leftists do things but not contributing much for her own part either. When a fascist comes knocking on the door it’s better to have Tabby there than Justine. To see if Justine can put her money where her mouth is we’d have to see what speech she delivers following the fascist speech. This YouTube channel is effectively my attempt to make that speech, and I can’t be the one who judges how successful it is.
Fuck I want Rachel to draw her so bad now
She's right aesthetics is important, but i disagree that we have to change everything about us to appeal to what "normal" people like. As an American i have found that most of the time all you have to do is rap the American flag over communism and show how people like Jefferson were saying the same things karl marx was saying. You just tell them being a socialist is a patriotic thing because we want what's best for the working class of the country and that Global corporations are not loyal to Any Nation so they'll screw any Nations working class for a profit.
Nigga that's bourg as shit.
You should get drunk on negroni like I do, cheap and effective. Goes down like molten lava and the smell alone makes you retch, but I'll be damned if that shit isn't the most cost effective way to get you hammered known to man.
Reminder that homosexuals and transsexuals always subvert any movement they're in and Marx and Engels knew and hated them for it.
She advocates dropping commie symbolism. If symbolism is everything to you then you're 100% larping.
Preach. Money for me is not a problem thank god so I can go a little petty bourg sometimes, but if i'm out in milan with a friend I always get wasted on negroni and that shit really makes you go down, holy shit if makes you go down. It's strange to think that most people on this board don't even know what a negroni is.
lol get fucked whining faggot
Pretty sure transphobic stalinist edgelords make for even shittier representation. Kill yourself
you mean a watered down Manhattan?
shit taste fam
just maymaying tbh
Strange that burgers who can't legally drink until they're 21 and even then it's 90% shitty lager don't know about real booze?
Marx and Engels didn't write about trannies lmao
They did hate homosexuals though.
And because Marx and Engels said it it must be true.
I would agree with Marx and Engels on literally everything, regardless of the historical context of the time they were writing in or anything else.
Existing is idpol? That's like saying being black is idpol. This video has nothing to do with idpol.
Gay cis men are not the same thing.
Well manhattan is strong and good. It's not easy to find in italy, here you just enter a place where they have booz and they know how to do a negroni.
lel. Right, the 21 law in america. America is the only place so retarded that let you drive before letting you drink. Jesus, christ.
So did like 99% of EVERYONE in the world at the time??? The equivalent of left right and center had not modicum of respect gay people at the time
that's literally the point I was making
ah shit sorry I got yah.
I just woke up fam
I am very OK with this.
Another brilliant post by a homosexual on a leftist website talking about being a homosexual instead of leftism. Hmmmm it's almost like Marx and Engels made good predictions.
Another brilliant post by a shitposting faggot on a leftist website talking about being a homosexual instead of leftism. Hmmmm it's almost like Marx and Engels made good predictions.
Another brilliant post by a homosexual on a leftist website talking about being a homosexual instead of leftism. Hmmmm it's almost like Marx and Engels made good predictions.
and apparently I was the homosexual.
Holy shit shut up!
At first it hurt but she's right, we're LARPing way too much, just look at r/FC
People that worry more about commie aesthetics have never read anything, i can guarantee that, yeah they're pretty cool but worthless, just use a red star, stray cat and maybe the rose to identify yourself with other commies
I'm not the one that needs to shut up though, this guy is just being a whiny little bitch because the flaming Contrapoints has made a video - but sexuality hasn't been mentioned once in eight minutes. He is doing the thing he is mad at homosexuals doing, which they aren't actually doing.
ITT REDDITORS TRY TO SUBVERT LEFTYPOL WITH THEIR IDPOL HOMOSEXUAL AGENDA
YOU FUCKING FAGGOTS
Whoopgs forget my tasgh!
I already said this before, nobody is going to take a man transvestite in women clothes and make up seriously no matter how interesting and correct the things coming from his mouth are.
Also the fact that so many replies don't even realize this show how fucking detached from reality the average poster here is, it's leddit levels of ignorance.
YOU ARE NOT ME, REDDITOR SCUM
TRANNIE BLOOD WILL GROW MY CROPS
FAGGOT SCUM WILL FUEL MY TRUCKS
BACK TO REDDIT WITH YOU. THIS IS AN IDPOL FREE BOARD
RRRRREEEEEEEE TRRAAAAAANNNNIIIIEEEEESS RRREEEEEEEE
That wasn't my point tho. Read my other posts
Stache poster is corrrect, Contrapoints is liberal idpol trash. I don't care how well it constructs its arguments, I'm not interested in listening to this being nor am I the comrade of either it or its reddit refugee supporters.
Is that a false flag?
TRANNIE BLOOD WILL GROW MY CROPS
FAGGOT SCUM WILL FUEL MY TRUCKS
ITT: Multiple posters (the true voices of this board) all getting incredibly angry and bigging each other up at the same point in time after two hours of staying silent due to the oppressive idpol redditors
Definitely not ITT: One incredibly mad recent Holla Forums convert
Flase flags up in this bitch.
He likes to dress as a she and this makes newfags mad as fuck.
Contra is a grill now tho
This board and the video comments are from people that already agrees with Contrapoints and are free from spooks.
Unfortunately the average person is spooked to the bone.
Unless you think preaching to the choir it's something productive to do then contra's videos are just a waste of time.
The spooks ITT are glorious, fuck off you LARPing children, back to reddit and twitter
If you're asking that question about someone who is only known at all by most of us because of their popularity with with the "muh trannies" brigade and their videos explictly focusing on that topic, you should return whence you came. Or try Susans place. Just stop shitting things up here, thanks.
What the fuck are you doing
I don't actually watch them and only watched to see if the people having a spaz attack have any grounds to be doing so. Spoilers: They don't.
The people you're having a PR nightmare about don't give a shit what someone on youtube with 50K subs does. If you're not preaching to the unconverted in any meaningful way then you can't have a moan about preaching to the choir.
Unfortunately for you, someone would.
People want to fuck traps
Vietnam veterans fucked lady boys because heterosexuality, chads, and latent masculine strength rule the word.
But some of them are hot. You can't just take a picture of a fuggo and be like "All people like this, look like this" - it's dumb as fuck and it's silly that you've already got two responses not calling out this obvious brain dead behaviour. Stop being a retarded faggot and fire up your neurons a bit before posting.
Who would want to fuck a neocunt, it makes you an involuntary homosexual
Who said anything about no dick being involved?
Why can't we just fuck others based on how much we love them
True love is the love between a man and his trap
All the fucking idpol ITT.
Pro tip to fledgeling anti-idpolers, if you're taking about the persons identity more than the substance of their argument, then you're doing it wrong.
The point is to not have worker issues overshadowed by bickering about gender and race.
Love and sexual desire are different things.
Fucking hell i thought Holla Forums was better than this, Contra made some really good points here
That population is so small as to be practically non-existent. Hence the repeated rapes.
Are you a wizard?
A very small percentage of that population are ""hot"". Trannies themselves openly admit that the percentage of the population that don't find their forms sexually repugnant is tiny. Furthermore, many trannies admit that they are disgusted by the ""chasers"" who fetishize them. Not that this discussion has any value given your overt misrepresentations of reality.
laurelai is typical, deal with it
You're right, traps are a recent phenomenon, people don't fuck them. You wouldn't fuck them. You wouldn't become one.
Nice opinion presented as fact you've got there. Obviously it works well for you that we're moving the topic onto increasingly petty and stupid areas which are even harder to provide anything but opinions on now that you've been BTFO by the entire board, which as a spooked Holla Forums newfag you should have seen coming immediately before shitting the place up.
Sounds like you have experience
If you don't want to fuck traps you're not normal.
Think at how many times you have wanted to fuck someone, one of them must have been a trap
why do people who seem to oppose idpol the most talk like idpolers?
Watch his her? other videos. She more or less supports intersectionality and uses milton as her basis of what free speech should look like. Also is a self described "cynical socialist", whatever that is supposed to mean.
If traps are wrong I don't want to be right.
Because they were liberals before November 2016
I just don't like dick tho.
The overwhelming majority of people don't want to fuck medical experiments. Furthermore, from what I've seen, Contrapoints seems to plagiarise arguments from other sources, so those not watching are missing nothing. For example, it's video on free speech appears to have been largely lifted from a Julia Serano piece I read years back.
But please, continue whining about your sexual fetish.
Don't lie to yourself.
Then you're in the minority
Dicks are gross.
You don't have to like dick. But there's nothing gross or abnormal about a healthy appreciation for feminine penis.
i got u fam
Sounds like what you do everytime you get triggered someone here wants to fuck a trap
stop talking about traps, isn't the topic of the video a bit more interesting?
I'm proud of that.
Not abnormal, just gross.
It's funny because "cynical socialist" generally tends to describe the less utopian elements of socialism. Intersectionality is trash or decent depending upon whether you're using the common misinterpretation of interpreting it as the rarely used but correct "the intersection of all struggle is class struggle"
More like Holla Forumsyps before early to mid 2017
That's fine. Being part of the contingent that scream it from the rooftops every thread is not.
Keep justifying your spooked shitposting, it doesn't bother me in the slightest but I'm not going to engage with your feelings until you stop acting like a fresh off the boat little bitch. Until then I'll just keep pointing out your posts as what they are, baseless shit used to justify your feelings on a subject.
Yes. This is how you can tell the whiners are Holla Forums converts who think "anti-idpol" is "talking about subjects in a way that makes SJWs mad"
Tankies and anarkiddies got offended and they derailed the thread into identity politics to avoid people throwing shit at them
bit heterophobic tbqh
Us people who hate dicks will always exist tho.
Keep it in your pants
Not an argument.
We're not arguing, we're just talking.
Who is she
Right, but the people who have derailed the thread under the guise of "traps and homosexuals plan to use the movement to further their own agenda and derail it from its own" have, to everyones shock, used the thread to further their own agenda and derail it from its topic. They are essentially a mix of Holla Forums and SJW identity politics, and are engaging in the exact same behaviour Marx chastised the gays and feminists for.
Katya Pero. Russian NazBol trap.
I'm not doing that, I just think dicks are gross.
So why the fuck are we listening to you if we want to win them over?
that's your ice cold motherfucker
They don't know what they're missing
Alrighty then, I'm just having a hard time telling who was saying what previously since several other anons have piled into the thread in a short space of time.
Buying into majority opinion isn't the only way to get people on your side, christ.
Let's use these flags, normies would be less scared of them and they represent the current struggle
Yeah, this is a triggered sperg rage from someone who got their entire experience of the trans community from fapping on Holla Forums. Read the web, nigger.
The hammer and sickle was very much a symbol of the time and place it was used too, I don't think anyone on this board can say they've used a sickle. A well placed red star is pretty aesthetic, I always liked the tiny little one on the helmet of the Metro cover.
Holla Forums is in the middle of some sort of coordinated raid, worse than usual even.
Half the other threads are being brigaded by incels (or just one really dedicated incel) too
t. bases his politics off troons
Pretty fucking rich, Holla Forumsyp.
Mods should legitimately start banning people who derail threads like this. Either the arguments in the video were bad or they were good. If you niggers want to talk about if being trans is bougie or whatever the fuck bullshit you want then take it elsewhere
Who said anything about the hips
Now you're shouting "Holla Forums" when it is suggested that actually listening to trannies reports about their lives is a good idea. Well done.
Shut your month, bitch nigga.
Why not? I find them fascinating people that transgress society far more than fascists ever dreamed they could.
Oh I'm so upset, you've really shamed me into believing your opinion that you still have not made a convincing argument for peddling at every opportunity to the detriment each thread you peddle it in.
>Immediately commencing a bellicose argument on a topic is totally pointing out that the thread is being derailed.
Why you always lying?
No argument would persuade an autistic zealot such as yourself.
Practice left wing populism and "Democratic socialism"
Post your argument or stop posting.
Jesus christ, just stop talking about this shit and talk about the subject of the video!
Went to reddit and they had a decent discussion on this, i used to think this place is way better but i really don't know anymore
You mean the Contrapoints video or the obviously contentious matter of their identity?
I'm looking around this thread, and have been reading it for most of the time it's been up, but I can't seem to find where you made your argument. Can you point me to the posts where you actually elaborate on your point of "trannies are bad"? You don't have to post it again because obviously you can just CTRL+F "(You)" to find all the posts you've made your argument in.
Transgender people are fine. In fact in many culture's they're religious icons. The only way you can be against such a banality of modern life is by using the moral standards of Abrahamic religions to influence your behavior on what a person should or shouldn't be like.
This risks slipping into idpol, but the question becomes, at what point does it actually matter
looks like its the radical left's fault again.
quell that revolutionary anger fellas it's upsetting people
I think you've got your posters mixed up because I'm the one that doesn't give a shit about Contrapoint's identity beyond demanding the outraged ITT actually back up their shitposting.
I hate him but he's right
Holy shit I ended up in a muke tweet. I that post was severly misread tho, I explained later what I meant.
Holy shit am I laughing
Based two book Muke
Holy shit this imbarassing. I didn't meant to say that in a reactonary way.
He's not wrong
The points I made was that I'm not interested in what this individual has to say and the overwhelming majority of the population are not interested in sex with trannies. Shall we go from there or are you going to sperg out again?
Feel free to stop posting any time.
I'll be real the video was pretty on point. I wanted to close it at first cuz it was kinda cringy but it was all truth
And, what does that prove? That they shouldn't exist? What are you going to do, force them into re-education camps at a young age?
We do not need the majority of proles on our side, a decentralized network of sinister tribes acting as a vanguard will be enough. The Intergalactic Nazbol Imperium will come to pass
He's absolutely right. If you went back even 6 months ago and posted a contra video the most contentious argument would be on if she was anti-capitalist enough and barely anyone would bother to worry about whether being trans was good or not. Nowadays you can post an old Holla Forums infographic and have a dozen drooling newfag retards REEEEE about how liberal or reddit it is because it even mentions race or gender in it, because idpol is when people mention racial or gender inequalities instead of being about basing your politics on a foundation of identity. I want all of you fags who think racism or transphobia or whatever other bullshit personal vandetta they have isn't idpol to fuck off somewhere else but I'm afraid and stop ruining this board
not an argument
irrelevent to the video, unless you're saying people only listen to or agree with people they want to have sex with
…and stop ruining this board but I'm afraid it might be too late*
Up your post quality because you're seriously shit and half the time I think you're a reactionary Holla Forumscuck.
It fucking sucks in part because cracking down on that kind of thing by the mods yields lots of autistic screeching about r/socialism and free speech and torture chamberes and muh wrong opinions and shit. Honestly I'm becoming of the mind that the majority of people pulling that shit are Holla Forums themselves.
Yeah it's a tough line to walk but if you get non-retarded mods then the difference between banning for speech policing and banning for derailing should be pretty obvious
Holy shit. I explained later what I meant by that post.
It's more about this fag than it is about you
Sure it isn't you that's split from your concious self and opened a bar under your house?
I have said for ages here how a far left movement needs a rebranding of sorts to gain traction nowadays. Keep all the ideas, change the symbols, aesthetics, terminology etc. Yes, I know, the hammer and sickle is a masterpiece of design, but 99% of mankind associates it with gulags, The Cultural Revolution and famines. There's no point in holding on to it now, it's part of what Zizek meant by ideology. Learn everything you can from the past but use it to create new things.
Then again, crafting better aesthetics than those stemming from the Russian Revolution, and a better symbol than the h&s is a really tall order. But I reckon the new left doesn't need superior visuals, simply different ones.
1) Perhaps those of you with sex fetishes of this nature might like to tone it down
2) Perhaps 'tashe poster has some truth in the assertion that a bunch of sexual oddities are not the best way to represent ourselves to the masses. It is easy for most to ignore the views of obvious eccentrics as the product of mental illness.
Much as you're derailing a touch, do you think hacking up people's bodies and making them lifelong drug dependent beings is a good outcome? Wouldn't resolving their issues through therapy be better?
Nor is it particularly meant to be, except to highlight this persons focus on liberal idpol
You'll notice had started trying to contest such a point, recognized even by trannies themselves, presumably due to a sex fetish
"No you see, I'm not a reactionary. I just expressed myself poorly."
Yep. I meant it tbh. Idpol faggots are the worst
You're the worst, frankly.
I prefer to refer to my self as deeply misunderstood
Exactly. And it's the same for theory. The incestuosity of the left is one of it's worsts cancers. Stop masturbating over the USSR or Catalonia and learn from them. Stop fetishizing "Marxism-Leninism" or "Anarcho-Syndicalism" and try to actually understand the world we are living in.
You're just a reactionary faggot and the board would be better off without your constant shitposting.
We seriously need to start bullying more of these Holla Forums converts into reading more
This, you can love the past systems all you want but we have to move on, cybernetics, democratic confederalism and stuff like that is what we should focus on
When the revolution comes. Please let me put a bullet into Bourgeoispoints skull.
Point one shitposting example? I poorly worded a post. And btw There is nothing reactionary in saying that a reason why we are percived as bad is because of tranny and idpolers
And btw it's funny how he/she suggested vaporwave. Vaporwave it's inerenthly hypercapitalist
This is what i wish retards like Finbol and Muke would understand
Literally why are people arguing about fetishes on a leftist board? Who fucking cares?
I thought vaporwave started as a postmodernist critique of consumerism. Too bad it's has become what it originally opposed
there was a second one of these - could you post it?
The point of the video is that the left should stop glorifying things most people associate with mass-murders and start talking in a way most people can understand and appreciate.
It was good while it lasted but in the end I always knew the end of Holla Forums would come someday.
Vaporwave is cynical capitalism bordering on pro-socialism tbh.
finbol totally, but isn't muke not that bad on the LARPing front? Haven't seen that poster or ushanka in a while.
vaporwave is inspired by New Wave and synthwave aestethics. Yes it's hypercapitalistc in a "conscious" self. But look at the retards who like that, they are not conscious they just find it comfy. Maybe it started in a pro socialist way but now youtube.com
It's like the 80' actions revival, it doesn't take itself seriously, but still it's about riding nolstagia and reciclying new wave aesthetics
Anarchists have the better aesthetics
I don't have it, sorry.
Who talked about "having a trap as a spokesperson"?
He has gotten better recently. My biggest problem with left-Youtube is how dated the theory is, I doubt most of them even know about Dauvé.
Maybe Lauren can lend you a diaper.
I dont think you understood the video friendo
Bourgeoispoints simply doesn't want to face the criticism everyone in the left has to deal in a daily basis nor involve herself in activism. She wants to be a pretty middle class girl, with her pretty middle class friends and jerk off to their middle toast opinions.
When Trump destroys all the "progress" Americans think they achieved in the last 50 years and the alt-right takes over, I want to see her then. If she doesn't flee to Canada like a coward.
At no point did Contra nominate herself as a lefty spokeswoman. And in fact admits in the comments how preposterous an anarcho syndicalist antifa transcatgirl would seem to normies, which was the entire point of the character.
It seems like a lot of posters here would prefer she just not make video critiques at all.
This is why postmodernist leftism is shit, it can't beat the spectacle machine
Youtube is as much about entertainment as education so it seems a touch unfair to pick on them for LARPing, per se.
Yep. Also we don't have to play by the same rules of the aut-right. We are not idiots without a doctrine or a idelogy, we have history and theory. Going full circle: What I tried to say ITT is that aesthetics, while important, shouldn't be our focus. Why the right cares about aestethics? Because that's what fascism is, aesthetics. Nothing else. Their doctrine is about that. It's just autoritharian capitalist maskerated as something more. We have everything but that, we should play our cards by our own rules
Nah they really don't, it's more or less the same, we should unite for now and leave the past behind.
How do you get into modern theory without reading old theory btw, i want to read modern takes on marxism but i can't understand it fully yet.
Im sure you're such a great activist and doing so much for the struggle comrade user. Long live the motherland amirite
That would be an EXCELLENT idea actually. He really should go fuck himself.
Ehh, for the most part everyone in congress is still varying shades of neo-liberalism, albeit a more vulgar and direct rhetoric of neo-liberal policies. We're more or less going through the 2008 cycle again with eveyone slowly realizing that the populist "champion for change" is basically going to keep doing the the status quo.
I would agree, but I don't think the video stated that we should overwhelmingly focus on aesthetics to the neglect of theory or history. But that if we want to effect real change we need to consider our pitch. And at the moment, especially in online circles, leftism can seem impenetrable and hostile, not to mention all the disparate factions roaring at eachother.
Holla Forumsyp please
America is the only country were the far-right is actually taking over, Poland and Hungary don't count because they were already proto-fash anyway.
What job have you guys done in there? NONE.
I guess I should be working on our new symbol amrite? What about a red dildo? Is that edgy and cool enough for you?
And my point is that aesthetics are really our week point. We should totally ignore them. What do we have is old commie block nolstalgia that is fugly and old. That or we have anarchist… And that's what I meant by my first infamous post in this thread: Anarkiddie aesthetics are very similar to liberal ones, dirty, crusty and normie repellent. Our aesthtic should be normcore tbh. We should look like the average joe as much as possible, we should learn to speak better. Traps, people with dread and pot smoking hippies are not normcore
50k subscribers seem to have made that nomination.
Anyone who thinks Zinnia Jones is worth listening to is a liability.
There is some good modern texts you can read without knowing the basis like Capitalist Realism, but in general it's better to know them. My criticism is more on how they aren't very well read, but I don't want to be too hard on that because I know some of them are at least trying.
How exactly does it make sense to blame her for being popular? If anything her continued success is an indication that maybe it isn't such a big deal if she's a prominent leftist voice on a popular platform.
No thanks, we don't exist to trigger them. We have a history and theory, we shouldn't take part in a meme war
But I don't see why she should be blamed for, thus far, attracting the largest audience. There's very few lefty youtubers in the first place, even fewer that put any effort into their production value.
Also, I'd agree that the Holla Forums emphasis on memes is useless and stupid but it's probably a good thing to challenge the popular alt-right channels on youtube. It doesn't help to be dismissive when its been such a good recruitment tool and by and large their videos go unanswered.
A fucking idiot like Molyneux spews all kinds of drivel on his channel and if you're a just out of high school shithead you're not going to bother doing the background reading. Maybe a well presented video rebuttal would sew some doubt though, that's not a bad thing.
are you referencing the dustbin of history? nah son that's not sufficient, like it or not relevancy matters, and politics evolves along side society. Be as reactionary and conservative as you want but every successful political theory and politician understands this. Even somebody like Hillary Clinton eventually sided with gay marriage, as an example, when it became trendy enough to. May not have won her an election but how many Stalinists in the 1st world have come even close?
Contra has better theory than 99% of this board.
Yes, we shouldn't bother with trying to radicalize moderates by meeting them at their level. We should masterbate over 20th century states that don't exist anymore and debate with each other all day long about wars that are long over.
Yea, reminder that contra used to be studying for a PhD in philosophy, and has read Hegel.
Contra has better theory than 99% of this board. Also she's far from being our most prominent speaker.
That's true too tbh. Touchè
The third one honestly looks pretty cool.
Because youtube is not the best platform to recruit proles in the first place. It works for the alt-right because their movement consists of bourgeois, I mean kids who have the time to listen to a bald man talking shit about minorities for 2 hours while they play videogames. You think a guy who works 8 hours a day, goes home to watch Ben Shapiro? That guy turns on fox news and disconnects.
Alt-right tier. At least we shouldn't copy aesthetics that they already stole
It works for the alt-right because their movement consists of bourgeois, I mean kids who have the time to listen to a bald man talking shit about minorities for 2 hours while they play videogames.
that's not what that word means, retard
This feels like fetishism to me. These youtube watching types are also proles, are also susceptible to right-wing talking points, and are also politically relevant. They aren't stereotypical union workers but they can be propagandized to all the same. And more importantly than merely dissuading them from the alt-right they can be made to consider leftism, and contra's channel does both in equal parts.
It's a joke, lads.
The thing that's particularly dangerous about the prominent alt-right presence on the internet is that this is the TV of the future. Yes, most people who work full time go home to their TVs and tune out. But that's not true for younger people, younger people go him and sit at their computers instead. That's where they get their news from.
The kids of today who spend their time after school playing Xbox and listening to youtubers are the workforce of tomorrow.
this…didn't seem like one of Contra's best. I don't feel like she was saying anything new here
Iglesias said it better
One of the best speech by a lefty in a while, the tankies here that unironically go around praising the DPRK with Soviet flags should read this.
It wasn't very good tbh. Bad timing to hit a creative lull for a video that's bound to be so divisive.
spot the idiot
Bet you think trump is nationalist right?
A shitfaced Italian is the voice of reason ITT.
Podemos wasn't build with memes and aesthetics. They capitalized the anger of the European debt crisis and today they are the second largest political party in Spain.
That's how you do it.
yeah isn't Contra's audience like 90% hardcore leftists and 10% altright virgins who wanna hatefuck him
Also you do realize he asks people to call him "he" right?
ah fuck this makes me sad
No one is encouraging "meme war", whatever the fuck is meant by that. What rightists on youtube are creating is propaganda and if you don't take it seriously then a lot of skinny fat white kids with kekistan flags will. Propaganda doesn't have to be especially graceful or intelligent to be effective. It should be responded to.
Ideas like "cultural marxism" were not founded online but they've been popularized thanks to the likes of PJW and Molyneux. We're going to hit a brick fucking wall if we decide we're going to exit social media, which is quickly just becoming "the media", because we're too dignified with all our theory to speak to the plebs. This shit spills out into the real world as I'm sure we're all becoming increasingly aware.
I'll add that the focus should absolutely be more on concrete politics. But someone choosing to go out of their way to respond to the right-wing wave of youtube propaganda can't be a bad thing.
Check her twitter. Couple months ago she posted an update requesting that people drop the male pronoun. It's in her bio now.
More like 90% liberals who want to fuck her and 10% reactionaries who want to hatefuck her
thank God the left is this stupid tbh, now if only the far right could also do this. it'd be great.
Anglo-saxon alt-right and Front National have very few things in common, if you actually read a bit you'd know that.
Reminder that when Le Pen's economic program was being presented to workers in Northen France, a lot of people mistook it for Melenchon's
Reminder this guy spent several hours getting BTFO by everyone and is such a brainlet he can only come back a couple of hours later to repeat himself and assert that he is the true leftypol.
Yes but they also ditched autistic left purity and 20th century socialist symbols, like the lady in the video suggested.
The FN used to support right-wing economy, it's pandering just like how they used to be openly homophobic and now pretend to support gay rights.
Why the fuck all those people put their pronouns here? I've seen it amongst almost all of the Twitter 'Leftists'
I assume to let people know what pronouns they would prefer people use.
I understand the importance of symbolism however the rhetoric is what ultimately wins you the people. All those kids in the alt-right listen to reactionary youtubers all day and that's how they got indoctrinated, memes are just for shit a jiggles. The problem is you're not even reaching anyone in the first place. You should ask yourselves how I convince a blue collar in my country that socialism is the way to go. You shouldn't rely in a spokesman either, you can recruit people from your work, school literally anyone even the cab driver if you use the proper dialectics.
Yeah Jean-Ma has always been a free market enthusiast, but Marin/Phillipot have radically changed the programme in 2008 and they havent devaited from that in 10 years.
If, like you say, they're playing pretend they're really in it for the long haul.
Not to mention I have yet to see any blatant breach of their electoral promises in their districts, unlike Trump who essentially completely fucked over the workers since he got in office.
It was done in solidarity with trans people getting harassed and intentionally misgendered.
True, though in my experience a good spokesman personality with good rhetoric and a solid programe (like how Melenchon now tries to meme himself as a Tribunus plebis atm) can really help smaller movements gain (back) steam.
You are delusional m8
How do i avoid muh venezudla and muh north korea without looking like a sperg
become a narcho
only famous people or idiots with no sense of opsec use actual photos of them so pronouns are necessary to avoid confusion
Damn, no fucking clue.
Damn, this thread become cancerous pretty damn quickly.
The logical result of Fascism is the introduction of aesthetics into political life.
Why is aesthetics fascism?
Fascism sees its salvation in giving these masses not their right, but instead a chance to express themselves. The masses have a right to change property relations; Fascism seeks to give them an expression while preserving property.
All efforts to render politics aesthetic culminate in one thing: war. War and war only can set a goal for mass movements on the largest scale while respecting the traditional property system. Societies self-alienation has reached such a degree that it can experience its own destruction as an aesthetic pleasure of the first order. This is the situation of politics which Fascism is rendering aesthetic. Communism responds by politicising art.
What's the difference?
Venezuela failed to become socialist and is a failed capitalist state. We can't know much about North korea because of propaganda though they are just trying to defend themselves
She made me give up on leninism
Lemme show you the way
How do her videos consistently get so few dislikes (relatively speaking)? I thought alt-right chuds scour the net for vids like this to shit on.
When she specifically goes after alt-right personalities she gets way more. Her video on the golden one has like 2k dislikes.
Aesthetics itself isn't fascism. The aestheticization of politics is fascism, or rather a key ingredient to fascism. This is an idea that originated with Benjamin. Read more here: ceasefiremagazine.co.uk
here ya go :)
Honestly, if every twitter lefty-celeb died today the Marxist movement would suffer zero.
B a s e d
Open border policy with East Asia when?
Heh, is Contra in the thread?
I AM SILLY
That's a tweet from september 7th
It's also a viewpoint you don't really see posted here when there's plenty of opportunity to post it.
Contra, if that's you tell Destiny to start putting out at least 3 stream debates with le rational skeptics or Holla Forumsflakes each at least an an hour and a half long every week. I listen to that shit while doing chores…
Dafuq kinda washed up, rotten sea creature's she devouring in that pic?
I don't know how the fuck you watch those destiny debates. The pure fucking ideology routinely on display turns my brain waves into white noise. Although his talks with contra were mostly good.
There's an unconscious critique of activism and LARPing in the video. You can't force a revolution, where the material conditions don't allow it, and trying to re-enact historical movements certainly won't help.
The style was nevertheless a bit cringey overall, imo, and had a liberal undertone.
It's to create space for "non-binary" fantasists who insist everyone needs to call them some weird pronoun like "fuhrer" or they'll all be horribly triggered and will kill themselves (as though that would be a bad thing…)
that's seaweed and rice you cretin
It's a really, really big ball of rice wrapped in seaweed. They have a name for it but I forgot what it is.
holy shit SJW's BTFO!
Screencapped, liked, shared, subscribed.
Not an argument.
Arguments beget arguments, but not applicable here
What a bizarre request, to ask to be referred to by an existent English pronoun. Definitely deserving of the hyperbolic bullshit you posted earlier.
Calling your argument a strawman isn't a lie, it's a truth so obvious you had to pretend you didn't remember what we were actually talking about to avoid it.
Oh, so your complaint has moved from "it's not real!" to "too much hyperbole!" as well as asserting the demands of a psychotic are reasonable.
Okay. What is wrong with preferring to be called by a new pronoun?
Your only example of this in the wild is someone asking to be called they/them and your initial post lamented the bizarre pronouns being demanded so yes, it's hyperbolic. This is the first time I've replied to you.
Are you actually retarded or do you just not understand what a strawman is?
I want Holla Forums to go.
He obliterates neckbeards that leave their right-wing echo chamber thinking they're going up against a hysterical SJW. 9/10 they end up on Twitter bitching bout how all Destiny can do is "talk fast" and how they "weren't even *really* trying" on stream afterwards. What's not to love?
I have spent a lots of times in trans circles and I have never seen anyone with pronons others than he, she, or them. they certainly exists, but they represent such a small part of an already small part of the population I doubt the people who mind them are doing so for good reasons.
I have met one person, and tbh I don't mind,
The thing is singular non-gender they is actually quite useful as a term when referring to someone of which you do not know their gender (Par example: 'The Mayor vetoed minimum wage" "What party do they belong to?" "She is an independent").
I just want to jump on the Mark Fisher train here to say that the man was a gift to the left that we won't fully appreciate for at least another 30 years
His brilliant article "Exiting the Vampire Castle" is quite on topic with this discussion about the direction the left should take itself
What's even wrong with that
Scroll down to the comments if you want to see the vampire castle in real time. Though I will say that my one gripe with the article was the weird liberal implication towards the end that one of the major problems with these people is that they won't let you participate/vote in the labour party enough
Pronouns denote sex. There are only two sexes.
It's fair to state that I'm being hyperbolic, but the point with the tumblr link is that requests for bizarre pronouns are exactly what happened when these arguments were accepted, so claiming hyperbole or slippery slope in that regard is fallacious.
I'll let someone else point out the elephant in the room, I trust you've heard it before.
But let me ask you this. If someone decides they don't like those pronouns and would rather go by different ones why is this a problem?
Literally the only reason you can do that is the already weak indications of sex in the English language, in the majority of other languages the words themselves are different and you'd be unable to make such a dishonest argument.
"Them" and "she" aren't new pronouns, so that is a strawman
You posted a catalog of pronouns that have nothing to do with average trans people like contra, and even more embarrassingly when pressed your "ridiculous example" also only used "them"
I'm not the one who's upset here
but he can
no it isn’t
That is literally the best part of the article though; it is not often the key thesis of something is 100% proven accurate in the comments section!
The closest analog would be, for instance, an article saying that "as a female gamer, games have a deeply woman hateric community" which is then posted on 4chan. With in the hour anyone looking in from the outside can see that the woman who wrote about hatred of women in gaming was correct
Bring up figures & symbols local to your region instead. Dropping Lenin, Stalin, or Soviet H&S may induce a warm feeling of nostalgia for Russians but doing so in USA or Britain would get you scornful laughs.
At this point I sincerely believe that you are jealous because she is more attractive than you
If it's a lie, how do you decide what pronoun to use for a horse or a cat?
One, we're discussing someone who themselves used to claim to be non-binary
so "average" is a hilarious claim and furthermore, actual usage of ridiculous pronouns is not a requirement of attempting to create space for such.
Certainly looks like it from here.
We're not discussing gender, we're discussing sex. That said, if your criteria for the truth or falsity of an argument is the political alignment of the speaker, I suggest you have a serious brain injury
Is this your first political discussion?
We both know you're lying, so just stop being a faggot, fuck off for a few hours, and come back and start your argument from scratch like you have done once already.
Pronouns are gendered, thus the term, gendered pronouns. They are often masculine, feminine, and neuter. You know this, you're just a closeted faggot trying to pull sleights of hand in the hopes several other posters are as dense as you and won't see your obvious bullshitting.
Contra went from "I'm not trans" to "unsure" to "trans", that's pretty much how it goes for trans people. And even at "unsure" it didn't get more complicated than he/she/they.
It says a lot about your brain that you think you're being made fun of because of a political spectrum thing and not because you sound like a cringey edgelord
What does “ex-phlospher” mean?
Gets most of the way through a doctoral program for philosophy and then drops out close to the end, if I remember correctly
Answer the question then.
That process needs special words because…?
Except you're not making fun, you're all angrily trying to shout me down.
Top kek, are you the autistic fuck from the other day who demanded what Lenin, Mao's and Stalin's policy towards monster girls would be, then when provided with communist states it was explicitly allowed repeated the now redundant question?
What's wrong, is this your first sensible political discussion on the important issues online? Don't you know it's just
actually your arms have nothing to do with your hips, they have to do with your wings bro, and in that pose they extend, so nah she a weak bitch
would not fucc
You explicitly didn't answer the question though, you went off on a little rant about how pronouns are "gendered", gender being something only applicable to humans, not horses and cats.
Did you pass your basic English exams at school?
This is false, I have shown you it is false. I'm not here to answer whatever questions you pull out of your backside.
Even if this where the case (I've told you that it isn't, it's common knowledge you can check on wikipedia) - what the fuck does your stupid question have to do with what we're discussing? Absolutely fuck all.
I disagree, it's critical in showing what pronouns denote.
LMAO, the fact you think a site riddled with dishonest ideologues on these topics is in any way a supportive argument is hilarious. As someone who's done quite a bit of work behind the scenes on that site, all you just said to me is "I am a feminist mong".
So don't. You can just stop posting any time.
No argument, got it.
Why post a new argument when the old one has not been refuted.
So, firstly you have simply implicitly conceded the argument given that this is admitted to be something a bunch of advanced fantasists and their supporters want and continuing to refuse to acknowledge the assignment of pronouns in non humans. You've also just openly admitted that it is about creating space for non-binary pronouns, even after initial denials of this. Thank you for proving me right.
Contra's far from perfect but she/they is one of the best at this. Even considering that Contra's more of a liberal than a leftist tbh.
Pronouns also refer to gender in animals.
I have solved this for you.
But what about this thing?!?!?!?!?!?!
By fantasist I can only assume you mean to say that trans people don't really exist which seems to be the root of your grievance. Rather than this pedantic dissection of whether or not people are thinking of genitals when using a gendered pronoun.
Even if this is the case, who the hell cares?
Yawn. Don't you have any other talking points?
Animals have "social and cultural differences" between sexes?
If you think my opposition is to the entire trans population, then you should be able to explain to me why someone moving from group man to group woman or vice versa suddenly has a need for new pronouns.
Anyone with a sexual preference should care. Given the evidence of Tumblr, this is going to lead to a proliferation of nonsensical labels which serve to obfuscate and obliterate the concepts of man and woman. The oxymoron of terms like """girlcock""" can already be seen flowing like detritus from an open sewer. Trancels are already making open arguments demanding sexual congress with others in a way that is despised when it comes from others. Large swathes of the population are going to move violently rightward if Holla Forums manages to suggest persuasively that these groups are set on indoctrinating their children.
I want to agree with you but the pedant in me wants to point out that Contra didn't identify as trans 6 months ago. And tbh I think that may have had something to do with it. Back then we only knew her as a degenerate crossdresser.
Given they've already mentioned literally who journos who write about this shit and they're telling you to "read tumblr" what they're actually trying to communicate to you is "go check /cow/ or kiwifarms" the journo had an article there. Guy's a blatant sped who constructs his opinions from spending too much time on the internet.
The left cannot say they are materialist if they entertain that these abominations are "women".
No, say what you see, they are crossdressing men, disgusting ones.
all I see are cute girls, bro
Then your eyes deserve treatment.
BUT WHAT GENDER IS THE HORSE THO?
Does that horse have a penis?
I was pointing at the usage of "Everyone", clearly a plural. Given the decades of ranting I've seen from feminist about the default English singular pronoun, I think your source might be just a little biased. We don't need new pronouns, we need better medical treatment for the mentally ill.
KEK. Perhaps you'd like to name this """journo""", too.
Only gender dysphoria isn't a mental illness.
Yeah it's a mental illness.
You're a brainlet. I can only assume you're a moderator here because you're a disingenuous fucking retard who has spent hundreds of posts derailing the thread. You're a malignant tumor, and mods are fags.
No, it's not.
t. the alcoholic Moor who has made possibly five decent posts in line with the board discussion in his whole time here and has spent the rest of the time having minor breakdowns
Gender dysphoria is a mental illness. Being transgender is not. In the same way that being depressed or traumatized after something bad has happened to you is a mental illness. It's a normal response to the situation.
You are very dumb, my friend.
Then were is my alcholic pride parade?
In every fucking thread you complete mess of a retard.
Who do you think I'm referring to when I say "mentally ill", please?
I'm wondering why you mentioned Kiwi Farms, now. It's almost like you had spent quite a bit of time over there, despite being obviously hostile to their actions.
No, more like you're an easily led retard who takes the archive of the biggest shitshows on the internet and being the kind of autistic shut in that contributes to wikipedia you thought this was representative of society at large.
Well that's kind of an issue that only Marxism has: theory backlog. After the old Greco-Roman schools, Marxism is arguably the first new real school of Western philosophical thought. It's also the most extensive one by far simply because it had a global range in an age with a far bigger population than theAncient Mediterranean coastline. Another factor is that, after so much time and history, these ancient schools have already been subsumed into Western, and largely global, thought. By contrast, Marxism has been is near stasis since 1991, and even if it wasn't, the Soviets utterly failed to institutionalize its ideas, to turn them into a paradigm.
Consider how modern thinking already contains, subsumed within it, a lot of old ideas from Plato, Locke, Mill and a million other philosophers. Many of their thoughts are already implied in modern society. Sort of "default settings". Barring fashies and similar retards, everyone on a minimally civilized society will agree to some interpretations of democracy, human rights, rule of law etc. They're paradigmatic concepts, and a testament that mankind can collectively progress by adopting new and more humane ideas in its collective unconscious.
Marxist ideas, on the other hand, beyond a few key observations in political economy, have been relegated to "subversive literature", "failed systems", "academic bloviation" and whatever other labels Porky comes up with. Specialized knowledge, and a lot of it at that. It takes a lot of time and effort to absorb even a fraction of it, and that's without even getting into the discussion of determining what parts are worth prioritizing or abandoning.
So, one of the tasks of a new leftist societies would be to successfully institutionalize core ideas, to the point they surpass the current ones. For example, enthrone the notion of democracy as something participative and direct, replacing the farce of representative democracy we have now. This would be easier if we could properly condense Marxist thought, or perhaps write a handful of books that successfully subsume all the important ideas. Very tall orders, if even possible, but I didn't say it would be easy. Maybe people with a better grasp of history of philosophy could help here. I mean, take a random Ancient school, Stoicism for example. It produced a million separate works, but by modern standards, most of it is pure junk; yet the successful bits are now part of default civilized behavior, and that's what we want to do with leftist ideas.
As to how to do it, well, even if we do produce a condensed work that subsumes all the imporant parts of Marxism, Marxism itself states that the superstructure is affected by the base much more than the opposite. So this new, leftized paradigm could only become dominant if physically, socially enforced. In other words, the left would have to take power first.
I'd like to point out that the creation of the much-touted New Man was part of the idearium of the early Bolsheviks, but somewhere along the way, they dropped the project, or fucked up its execution, or both. Instead of reinventing man and society, they were content with emulating capitalist society, supposedly withuot exploitation. And that's a futile endeavor if there ever was one. You cannot emulate a society because you would need to recreate the material conditions that allow it to exist, and if you do the latter, you're not emulating that society, you're becoming it. This is partly why it was so easy for the Soviet system to be dismantled. It wasn't very institutionalized, but had become content to farcicaly emulate consumer capitalism.
Jesus, this post turned out way longer and more thoughtful than I expected. I think I might have stumbled onto something here. Am I talking sense here?
Kinda beaten to it comr8, pic related.
Trans people don't have pride for the dysphoria, which is a symptom of their situation any more than black people have pride for lynchings you fucking knuckle dragger.
ITT: The fight between good and evil was over. He loved intersectionality.
Are you so devoid of leaders that you pick some tranny SJW which is the your equivalent of "le rational skeptics"?
I don't even hate trans people but this is clearly a race to the bottom. You cannot fight absurdity with more absurdity.
You've got a thread on there, haven't you?
ITT: The mods do absolutely nothing to prevent the thread being an idpol thread when it's actually about a youtube video that doesn't touch on anything discussed in the thread
Wew laddy. The poster gave it away when they started complaining about Laurelai and when they mentioned some incredibly obscure journo I checked if they had a page there, which they did.
Getting a doctoral in philosophy doesn’t make you a philosopher.
Use the fucking report function you spergs.
What I really like about nu-leftists is infinite authority ass kissing. At least Holla Forums whined a little about the Imkampy furher. I suppose that absolute central planning demand for more dictatorship than ethnic cleansing mobs.
Just as an aside to this, I think the point of the video was to not even go into concepts like "global capitalism" too much because it alienates average people. for whatever that is worth.
I think it's more that we should approach it differently.
Furthermore, the fact that you think Zinnia is a """journo""" gives away what sort of person you are.
Least you confirmed you get your worldview from troons at large.
watch this or kys.
I'm sure even more trans on your side gonna help ya, I mean they are 2% of the population at the very best but eh, ~progress~. Not like that Trump literally won the primary on the most classcucked party on the world by saying fuck you to every powerful institution and promising gibs to his white base (that he immediatly reneged upon being elected obviously).
Why is "policy first" so hard to understand to the US left. Melenchon in France got third place outta nowhere cause it's platform had precise numbers and he played the "angry everyman fed up with the system". Just do that and you win, it isn't hard.
Who is picking a leader? Why assume we need leaders?
You're just a dickhead trying to obfuscate being an asshole by trying to dress it up as concern for workers and "the truth."
Oh wow, reducing everything Contrapoints does to her fucking sexual orientation and then simultaneously complaining about idpol. You're a fucking idiot.
People should remember that Contra Points is a (center-left) entertainer, and is not a political theorist.
You know honestly at 300 posts debating this, this is why nobody should give a shit. It silences anything people are saying with petty debate. Just move on with it, who cares.
Which is why when someone bring it up out of nowhere - either a virtue signaling SJW telling us that trans people need attention or a virtue signaling reactionary telling us trans people need to get out - they need to be told to shut the fuck up (and probably expelled).
Why is this such a huge thread for a video that says we should make leftism more approachable? Isn't that a platitude at this point?
I'm not sure I like the video, I was just saying that to say "I agree, we should have talked about global capitalism more in 2008" feels like it is missing how these kinds of conversations usually go. When they're presented in as liberal a fashion as the contra video, they usually say we should abandon almost all messaging except for shit like "medicare for all", which is literally a watering down of "single payer" or "universal healthcare" because the American left wing feels like the population is this uninformed. And they may be. I think it was Matt Bruenig who wrote an article that claimed it was neither Trump's nods to xenophobia, nor Clinton's lack of swinging to the left that drove the election. It was just that neither of them represented something like the cool factor of Obama. He just bases this on their approval ratings, and it seems like the simplest explanation. Bernie would have won because he was popular, but so was Joe Biden. They're totally different, but if the popularity is anything to go by more people would be excited about Biden than Trump or Hillary.
Also, Trump's white base wasn't primarily concerned with gibs. They wanted the wall. They got fed up because of DACA, not even because of Trump saying he was dropping healthcare, or that he hasn't even shown a plan for an infrastructure bill, or anything. They nearly got even more mad when they thought he was going to take out Assad, which is mostly based on conservative fears about international entanglements and the costs that come with that. They're totally incoherent, he is a cult of personality that still has weird stragglers who will follow him into the abyss of dementia.
When contra talks about some issues she does an alright job of breaking down the parts of it. In this video it's pretty much just tone policing with no driving point. If I had done the video I'd explicitly talk about going to where working people are and trying to organize them directly, joining orgs (or starting them) and so on. The problem with the left is less that we're weird and unapproachable than that we don't approach the workers enough. The root of the problem is the same though: too many lefties are socially awkward kids who found a niche topic they could nerd out over and care more about circlejerking with theory than accomplishing anything.
Whoops, forgot to remove sage from the email field.
There's a pretty distinct chance
That'd have been helpful, because I agree. The video felt like a finger wag at a kind of strange amalgamation of bad leftist traits with no particular direction given besides "stop being an anti-social sectarian furry with hammer and sickle pins that kicks trashcans". The central problem for the modern left in just about every case I can think of is not being organized.
And once you do get organized, you'll often find that a certain self-consciousness pervades the entire group anyways, I imagine depending on who you are with. I've seen both Democratic Cops of America and SA, and they were very conscious of not appearing like freaks that kick over trashcans and berate people with socialist terms.
Much as I'd like to shit on Contra for oversights, she's a cute and I would hold her and tell her every little thing's gonna be alright.
Ah, the Colbert defense.
Lol at the SJW-to-antifa transfuge who say "But it's not fair when she do it to us ;_;"
She want some liburul position in some think tank/media where she can get status and shit. You want to smash shit to feel good about yourself. At the end, you both merit each other.
Left sectarianism exist because there is two sort of people: The one who can access liberal cushy positions when the "troubles" stop and they settle for vox-tier succdem, and the one who can't and gonna get flecced by college shark loaners. Leftypol is number 2.
Based Stalin poster tells the truth
contrapoints doesn't deserve art this good.
Faggots and trannies have no place in socialism. It's bourgeois decadence.
bye bye false flagger and this thread in general
It's true tho
when will this die
So you disagree with Lenin?
About this one question, yes.
yeah, forget transexuality, this is the much bigger issue.
4 different characters
And it was about aesthetics the left needs to get rid of, which is even more ironic.
I will use this video to turn people into third worldism.
ITT: people who saw too much of themselves in the leftist fury character and are too immature to self reflect so instead make fun of the content creator's gender.
What did Lenin said about homosexuality?
this video is literally directed at leftists
exactly the kind of people who will accept that you can't judge what someone is saying by that person's appearance
except you apparently
bitching about the "gay agenda" is literally idpol you dip
you realize catgirl drawgirl is already a woman right
well he legalized it for a start
tfw no antifa gf who bet you with a bat for being a fascist