So how many of you got suckered/forced onto this dystopian shit...

Kratom is illegal in my state. ;_;

I was basically forced into being prescribed these after my bout of depression sophomore year of high school. I fake taking them every day and keep them in my pocket until I find somewhere new to throw them out.

Sadly they are overlooked in regards to the opioid crisis sweeping over here in burgerland. I was lucky my post acute withdraw was only a few months after rehab. I know some former addicts online that are still messed up years after detox.

DEA/FDA making it illegal to boost sales of narcan, naltrexone and vivitrol. The latter two I was almost forced into taking while in rehab, insurance wanted to bully me in order to continue treatment. Fucking pigs.

If that's what it means to be a leftist, Marx can suck a dick tbh

It is bad

You can either take blue pills and take prozac and do drugs

Or take red pill and cure the disease, not the symptoms

were you forced onto them 'cuz your parents were afraid you were dropping out (or were going to or already did or whatever)?

WEW
EWE
WEW

I got labelled really bad when I was 3 years old, suicidal at 6 because of how horribly I was treated in school, life basically destroyed. I would never, ever recommend anyone talk to a psychiatrist or therapist if they have no record, and do everything possible to avoid them. They're just a second-track police state and that's been by design since the Mental Health Act was created.

Funnily enough there was a period for about 12 years where I was basically free of psychiatric intervention - the only condition is that I'm legally disabled and have to inform the government that I am such on any government form that asks. It's quite embarrassing to have to carry that around as a fucking millstone for the rest of my life. But basically no drugs until last year, and those drugs practically turned me into a goddamn eunuch but at this point I don't care.

I had serious ED after ceasing SSRI usage. For maybe 2 entire years all my orgasms would be rapid and pleasureless. I'm just glad it finally went away.

I don't know why traditional tricyclic antidepressants aren't more common. They make the user drowsy for the first couple of weeks but then are largely devoid of side effects

All of you need Xanny

If you give me a cure for bipolar, I'll be eternally grateful.

They make your brain smaller for one.

I was on Prozac for S E V E N Y E A R S (14-21). Most of the time it basically did nothing. I took various stimulants for ADHD at the same time, but I'm pretty sure I just had attention problems because I was depressed as shit. I still take Welbutrin and Remeron so I don't want to die. I'm happy like 2-3 times a year which is worth the $30 I pay every three months tbh.

Stayed away from big pharmas bullshit because I saw what that shit did to the people around me though I almost got put on the shit in high school because I kept to myself and wasn't an open book with school officials.

Just glad I never ended up as somebody's bonus check.

I'd only briefly been on some kind of ADD med back when I was young as fuck. Apparently it made me "weepy", so my folks pulled me off of it, and that was probably for the best, especially since that was the year I had the shittest teacher in my life.

Other than that, just under two years ago I was really fucking depressed and wanted to end it all, though I didn't make a move to enact it. But it was definitely a depression born of circumstances, addiction and self realization. Through further self examination I determined a way I could actually make my life worth living none the less. As of January I'm no longer depressed and have not indulged my addiction. I can't imagine pills would have helped me, I'm in a better place than I have been for the last decade.

I think I might be bipolar (my mom is so there's a 25% risk I am).
I'm really having trouble with motivation so I can barely do any studying
I have used weed in the past (stopped recently) and that has made me feel amazing in comparison, it seems to help most bipolar people.
I'm thinking of getting professional help (for benefits and such), I need some help though, should I outright deny any medications they want to give me (fuck that shit) and self medicate with weed without telling them or should I fake taking the meds and selfmed?

I really do not want to take those shitty brain eroding meds for the rest of my life.

hot takes incoming

not even once. these legal drugs are shit and fuck up your psyche. who can i know if i never took them myself? i'm surrounded by people hooked on these chemicals and sometimes they seem like miserable zombies. hint: if you have half a brain you can tell if a person is hooked on the big pharma shit if you're exposed to him/her for some time.

Hot take #2: I strongly recommend to avoid ALL drugs, this includes your beloved booze and dope as well. Live without that shit, try seeing reality as it is. Not a very pleasant experience most of the time but i'prefer living in an often sad reality that is my own instead of living in some pink bubble created by drug that messes with my synapses.

Hot take #3: Living without drugs numbing your mind is a challenge. There are reasons why people voluntary turn into zombies. If you want to face reality as it is you need to cultivate a few techniques or otherwise you might end up in a crippling depression. 1.) Go out and talk to real people. Humans online are mostly edgy assholes, irl most are more friendly. 2.) Go into nature. Woods, mountains, fresh air. 3.) Most important: Learn to mediate and do it every day, i strongly recommend vipassana or zen.

If your plan is to get on benefits, you at least need to be recorded as cooperating with treatment, and showing patterns of weed use probably hurts your case.

In Burgerstan you basically have to be committed against your will or have an extensive school record to get benefits, and even that isn't enough these days. I don't know where you are but I've heard horrorstories about Britain as well.

Going on benefits ought to be the absolute last resort if you know you're never going to be employable or you are in desperate need of the money and the job market won't work in time. It's totally not worth the hassle of getting on and shitting your pants every time a review comes up. It's also another legal hassle (at least in Burgerstan) if you ever want to get OFF of benefits and return to work. I tried getting off SSI through work despite being a total mess and wound up tangled in some shit, fortunately I was never cut off completely. (And before you call me a malingerer, I had special accommodations from the employer and would have been fired in weeks if those weren't granted; also, shortly after I was fired the SSA has really started cracking down on the disabled working and employers will almost never hire someone who discloses a disability, especially a mental one. Lawyers would have advised me to never try working and I probably shouldn't have, but SSI at the time was almost all going to rent and me/my fam needed money somehow.)

As much as I hate empowering Porky, if I had the choice of a stable job paying $15-20k a year and disability, I'd pick the stable job, and pay the Obamacare penalty if it even applies to me. The problem of course is the "stable" part, no one can expect any sort of stability without strong connections. I'm trying to find an option where I can work from home and without managerial oversight, but SSA is really hard on the self-employed.

Anyway, about the drugs themselves - don't fucking take SSRIs, that shit is literally poison and shouldn't be prescribed to anyone for any reason. I don't know if it's still true but from what I understand they're often the first line in treatment for bipolar, and I have to wonder if it's part of some scheme to fuck with people and make their lives worse to wring money out of them.

I can't say too much about other drugs, aside from anti-psychotics (really terrible side-effects and some people suffer irreversible tardive dyskinesia, also likely to become impotent if you're male; the only good thing to say is that if the voices in your head are literally unbearable, it dulls that somewhat).

If I could go back I would never allow myself to be taken in by this system. Suicide would be preferable to carrying this status for the rest of my life. But now, what's done is done, and all I can do is stay out of the hospital or worse, the institution or the concentration camp when Porky/fascists decide to exterminate all the disabled. At least now no one gives a shit about whether I live or die.

Years of switching back and forth between various cocktails of SSRIs and antipsychotics fucked my friend's mind to pieces and made him a delusional paranoid shell of himself without the will to do anything but sleep. Antipsychotics, especially if taken daily are satan incarnate.

Every single human involved in Big Pharma at any level deserves a cruel and inhuman death. They are the most vile institution in America besides the military and police/prison system.

???
Did she get banned again?

I was a ritalin kid. I performed excellently in math. Every other aspect of my life was made absolutely awful.

I ended up getting diagnosed with ass burgers later because of the fact that I was a socially retarded zombie who would hyper concentrate on shit. When I stopped taking ritalin, I stopped acting autistic, what a surprise. My math grades dropped but my life became worth living again. Except for the crippling depression I had thanks to all the years I fucked everything up due to being a drug induced autistic retard. I don't think I even had ADHD. I was just an active kid.

I'm in Sweden. My mom has it pretty bad, pretty sure it's just going to get worse the older I get. I refuse to take meds for it (don't even know if I actually am bipolar, just guessing because I have a symptom of it).
Maybe not getting a diagnose is the best way to go in my case… I'll have to ponder it some more.
Thank you for the input, comrade.

I took an SNRI for a around a year. They helped to a certain extent. Decided to stop taking them to see if I still needed them, turns out I didn't. I'm trying out modafinil at the moment because I still need something to help with my ADHD. Meds can have their time and place

They literally ARE an arm of the police/prison/legal system. The role of psychiatry is written into a code of law that doesn't exist for any other category of illness.

I'm not even 100% anti-psychiatry (somehow, despite my experience with the system), but even if you make the system as nice and ideal as you like, it's still a legal and political apparatus.

I take antipsychotics daily. It's not pleasant but at this point the choice is between being chemically castrated (brain and cock), or hearing voices screaming in my head. Since I don't care about my cock any more and the brain castration is not too bad (I'm still able to read, write, do computer programming and enough shit; the only thing is that I feel basically no normal human emotion and the moods I do feel are dulled), I'm going along with it, but the damage is probably irreversible at this point.

I probably wouldn't be in this position if I could have been homeschooled and I was never put on anti-depressants which royally fucked up my body.

must suck to be a pillfag, they always fuck you up more than whatever it is you had

I dunno any details about Sweden but psychiatry is never going to be a lot of fun in any part of the world. Plus, you might be sent on your way with a different dx or none at all; I know my shrink only does diagnoses for insurance purposes and just hands out whatever pills he thinks are appropriate. I've had to tell him at least ten times not to put me on SSRIs because they have fucked up my life and it's a matter of medical record, and fortunately he has not prescribed them.

Maybe Sweden has a better system for handling benefits / putting disabled people to work; I seem to recall that was a priority of the government there at one point. The Burger system is one of the worst possible ways to handle the situation, and it doesn't help that our broke-ass schools are literal trauma factories.

This describes my friend's mental state pretty well. Wish you luck with all this comrade. These pigs will get their due when the day comes.

I did, ultimately shit left me emotionless. Depression cured itself after I made arrangments to make my life less stressful.

On the other side of the coin, there are people who do drugs specificaly to satisfy desire to forcefuly control their emotional states.

As much as I hated the doctors as a kid, the actual doctor psychiatrists - the ones with a private practice or working as university students - were not bad people. At least, they weren't trying to be overly malicious. The psychologists and therapists were universally awful monsters at the worst, and scumbags at the best. The worst I got from the system came from the school's psychologists, sped department, school administrators, Community Mental Health, and basically everything that has to do with the "legal" side of the system - and really, I blame the education system and academia more than psychiatry for what happened to me (Community Mental Health can die of gonorrhea and rot in hell tho - hat place shits on everybody I've ever known to enter its clutches). Pharma deserves to hang of course and their role in marketing shit as horrid as SSRIs is an unforgivable crime.

The only thing that helped me was being outside of the trauma factory that is school, and removing myself from all academia and the whole rotten structure. I hate all of it, from preschool to the highest echelons of the university, and I want to burn it all down.

I'm curious to hear your stories. Most therapists/psychologists I've met have been inadequate, but I would only consider one I've met to be awful.

Well I could tell you about that time one shrink threatened to send me and my siblings to foster care and press my mother with legal charges, because the school system suggested it. Then I learned that's what "therapists" do - they rat on their patients all of the time and report to authorities. I was too naïve to know and ran my mouth more than I should.

Then there was the one that just insulted me for an hour every time I visited him, after I basically refused to talk to him (remembering what happened the last time I actually said anything).

Then there's the bitch who tried to insinuate that I was faking everything all my life and that I'm just a scumbag malingerer (like I'd want to live through any of this shit).

Then there's the utterly useless bitch who didn't even bother taking notes and was clearly just killing time so she can collect her paycheck. That's as good as it gets.

I'm guessing these are all publicly funded therapists? Cant' say I've ever had experiences like that before, but I always went to private practices.

All of these are private therapists.

If it is to any help, I'm a fellow bipolar Swedefag. Used to be on pills (Seroquel was the last med I took) and was in contact with mental health authorities. Stopped both because all meds made me feel much worse and getting "help" from psychiatrists was just greatly humiliating and also made me feel worse. I'm doing pretty bad right now but for most of the time I've been better off without meds. Don't remember much about the mental health system since I was so drugged out at the time but feel free to ask me anything

Out of curiosity, what did you say to the school's therapist to make them want to send you to foster care?

I actually blacked out the details in my memory. Don't remember exactly what was said or what was suggested except that I was in full meltdown mode. (this wasn't a school's therapist - they had no time for someone like me)

1997 → 2007 → 1995:
mega.nz/#F!DJdkhYTR!gNrR2Hm7we5O0dyfwBHG0g

Study help:
mega.nz/#F!eUlWRQxR!9LG4fzKLvNTiM0CKgUjqvA

Find a Lacanian analyst:
lacanonline.com/index/find-a-lacanian-psychoanalyst/

Lacan documentary with his patients (turn on subtitles): youtube.com/watch?v=f1F-zysTjWg

what is rehab like, is it actually theraputic or do they just throw pills at you until you detox off whatever you're on? are you American?

Yeah I'm a burger. It all depends on the rehab really, like any hospital or institution, you have good ones and bad ones. I know though a common practice in most affordible rehabs is weening patients off drugs and alcohol with mild barbiturates, then focusing on a 12-step program (AA/NA) with group and 1-on-1 therapy sessions.

Granted I went to the best affordable rehab on the east coast, there's better out there that just focus on detox and therapy rather than AA, but you're going to pay a lot either through insurance or out of pocket.

Replied before I was finished like a dumb ass. So yeah rehab was very therapeutic, even if you just need a safe place to detox and get your head straight. Like I said, it depends on the institution, the staff and the patients themselves. Sure my place had some guys that didn't give a fuck and were just there to dodge jail time, but everyone else was there to get better. Helps that most of the staff are recovering addicts too. Also aftercare is really important too and having sober support coming out makes a big difference.

So basically, fuck the psychiatrists? Is it even remotely worthwhile in terms of benefits and such?

I've actually been planing to pick up Lacan because of Žižek. Are you telling me Lacan found a "cure" for bipolar disorder? Please provide more information.

...

if your ideological dogmata prohibit you from studying any other belief systems than historical materialism i pity you. however i can see getting excommunicated by your church clergy~ party leaders for heresy independent thinking poses a great threat to your tender soul revolutionary spirit. for people like you there are westernized and secularized versions of meditation that do essentially the what the buddhist techniques do but without the evil eastern mysticist vocabulary. good luck.

So you're literally recommending religious mysticism but accuse me of being religious? That's rich.

these techniques have nothing to do with believing in deities, praying etc. essentially they are about strenghtening your concentration, observing your body sensation and thoughts and not reacting to them.
i accuse you of being narrow minded and judging matters your know nothing about. feel free to trust big pharma to solve your mental problems.
honestly i pity you for not trying a technique that actually helps just because you dislike the terminology and cultural setting it's taught in. btw practicing vipassana cured my depression.

While I highly doubt meditation with solve my potential mental disorders, I have meditated for the past month and it has reduced my anxiety. It has not been helpful with my motivation though, it stays the same (non-existent).

It's not a good thing to tell people to go off their meds or to refuse medication if they're mentally ill and they need those pills to not suffer from their illnesses.

This thread is immoral, I can only hope that people don't take the shit they read on Holla Forums seriously.

Yeah, they're worthless. I studied some base courses on psychology later on and it's amazing the potential the field actually has, yet every psychiatrist I've met is either impossibly incompetent or a soulless asshole. My guess is that the better shrinks all get moved up to managerial positions and such
I don't even know what benefits you can get, I went when I was a teenager so I didn't get any of that. Personally I dislike the whole idea of becoming dependent on government institutions but there's nothing wrong with it if you need it to survive

focus on the desires you have, honestly don't expected to be motivated by something you don't want to do - we're not donkeys, stick and carrot ain't worth shit

yea, and I guess vaguely scared I would kill myself too. rough time

same thing happened to me, my parents would give me talks every day gaslighting me as I was considering dropping out that I had severe depression. They wouldn't give it up, it was all they would talk about, they'd all but force me to go to doctors and sit in in the meetings and whine about how I wasn't taking meds.

It was only after the first psych "med" that I began to have regular suicidal thoughts.
Fast forward 10 years, I'm completely drug dependent, my nervous system can't regulate itself properly from all the drugs I've been on. I have daily suicidal thoughts and panic attacks. I go to the ER 10+ times per year thinking I am dying.

Psychiatry is pure evil. And it's been used on way too many of my friends as a punishment or a way to keep people in often useless schooling.

Probably like half the modern professional class is doped up on legal meds to deal with the stress of complex modern responsibilities. Bunch of zombies.

I took SSRIs for a while and they actually helped me. My serotonin receptors were "burned out" apparently and I needed a "reset". Went from being unable to feel much of anything to feeling normal for the first time in over a decade. It only took a few months on it to get there and it was extremely obvious to me when the drug had done everything i was going to do.

Don't hate a drug because it gets misused by the system. Pretty much any drug can be useful in the right context. The problem is the pharmaceutical industry trying to sell shit. They'd be doing it with cocaine if it were legal. They already do it with opiods.

I don't believe in meds and psychiatry. What can some cunt tell me that I haven't told myself already? It's not like he can magically make me a less alienated and cowardly person, or make the world a less rotten place. All he can do is give me enough drugs to become incapable of observing the world and myself as I do now, which sounds rather scary.

I don't get why some communists act like society is only corrupted as far as income distribution and maybe racism and that's it.

Like there's a whole buncha lefties who the way society is set up and think "yea this is good"

When in reality if you look at psychiatry, sexuality, media, schooling… some really basic parts of society and take a closer look and you see a lot of sickness.

Now even if improving people's material conditions solves most of this… people aren't going to be motivated to change their material conditions if they can't identify and put emotion to the problems that have manifested systemically elsewhere.

Most people even on the right don't gravitate towards the right because of ethnonationalism or whatever.

** It's because the far right beats the far left in picking finding the socially sick areas of society ** I've actually heard on this board that it's better for the left to lie about the sick parts of society just for the sake of popularity.

Truth should become before agenda, especially when you are talking among political peers.

...

the pills don't even make you happy. They just are able to make you put on a zombified smile.

This user knows what's up

^^ people actually believe this is why we shouldn't talk about fucked up areas of society.

read zizek

I'm not saying that other parts of society aren't fucked up, or that medications aren't over-perscribed. I'm sure they are.

The fact remains, people do have legitimate mental illnesses that would exist no matter what their material conditions may happen to be. There have been mentally ill people since there have been people, no matter what the economic system is.

Telling mentally ill people to go off their meds is a foolish and counterproductive thing to do, especially if you want to affect societal change. What do you think is going to happen? Leftists will go off their meds and be too ill to even function, let alone be politically active.

What about the Irving Kirsch meta-analyses using FOIA on the FDA, the star*D trials etc of anti-depressants?

How can you look at both sides of the psychiatry debate and conclude that psych drugs are more than statistically helpful beyond placebo, but meaninfully clinically helpful placebo?

And if people get just as good on placebo knowing that they are taking a placebo, why don't we just write placebos and tell the patients they are placebos and send them on their way? That way we don't have 1/4-1/5th (real numbers) on the antidepressant experiments based on a serotonin hypothesis that even the doctors don't believe in anymore. It's been falsified!

And for most people, they get over their mental illness if they can identify what's causing it instead of trying to put band-aids over symptoms. 99% of talk-therapy and drug therapy for the mind has almost nothing to do with root causes for all but the most psychotic individuals.
People go looking for help, but just let their actual problems worsen while they "manage" the symptoms.

Tell them to taper off them and take sugar pills even if they know they are sugar pills. There's no clinically significant difference, except there isn't this 1984 emotional blunting side effect shit.

Unless they are on some huge dose of benzos, or are extremely delusional otherwise, tapering would be the best thing for them to do.

;edit
meaningfully clinically helpful beyond placebo

i find the content of your posts interesting but please fukcing stop it with the reddit spacing it makes my eyes bleed. thank you.

youtube.com/watch?v=UC5RZRG7-QQ

This vid should be mandatory watching for anyone with a pro-antidepressant attitude
youtube.com/watch?v=UC5RZRG7-QQ&t=3470s

the real question is: is your idea of yourself, for example, realistic? My experience with depressed people is that their self-image and worldview tends to be very very distorted

the concept of mental illness is a matter of perspective, or even a means of control - read Foucault

Please read my post before typing up a response next time. You'll notice in my first paragraph I said that "I'm sure that medications are over-perscribed". We can probably all agree on that.

Second, are you a doctor? Did you attend 10 years of med school, complete with a psychiatric residency? Did you spend years writing a thesis about the effects of antidepressants on the brain, and sort through volumes of scientific journals and peer-reviewed articles on the topic? Can you read formula diagrams for organic chemistry?

If your answer to any of those questions is No, you shouldn't be trying to give medical advice to people on the internet. Someone out there may be willing to believe the shit you're spouting.

People who say this believe that either you think you're amazing or you're mentally ill. I see little reason to think highly of myself, rationally speaking. So why should I? Is it 'distorted' to recognize that I really don't have much going on? And the horribleness of the world should be beyond dispute, especially on a far leftist board.

Yes, but the point of the concept of mental illness is that one's capability for rationality and rational evaluations of things such as the self are faulty. Without having more data or knowing you personally it is clearly not possible to have any complete opinions on the matter, but it is still something you should keep in mind.

i take it you are a doctor. fine. however they obviously didn't teach you in university how a debate works. all you do is stating the you are an authority and everybody who has not a phd in medicine yet dares to disagree with you is a fucking pleb whose opinion is to be discarded. this is a very elitist stance and i find it offending. there are people who actually suffer from mental problems and many of them are being prescribed these pills, and it seems that the pills don't improve their quality of life but rather deteriorate it in many cases. their opinion is just as valid as yours.

rt.com/shows/worlds-apart-oksana-boyko/315192-harm-healing-medicine-gotzsche/

LIBERALS GTFO

quality post. thank you.

What is rational? Surely there's nothing more irrational than some consumerist cunt who's never lifted a finger for anyone or contributed anything to the world to have a great self-image and a positive world view, yet no one tells such people that their capacity for rational self-judgement is lacking. It's only when you judge yourself negatively that the whole 'everyone is special and amazing!' train is interrupted and people tell you that you're mentally ill for thinking little of yourself. The moral is literally just that thinking highly of yourself is rational and that not doing so is irrational.

Most of these meds are literally destroying parts of people's brains and bodies to alleviate a mental symptom. Prescribing antipsychotics daily to people with bipolar disorder is like using a sledgehammer on your baby to get it to sleep.

Trusting psychiatrists over people (who can with ease educate themselves) on matters of mental health is just as reactionary as trusting cops over people in matters of law. Pure bourgeois arrogance and elitism.

I certainly agree with this; I live in a country where just about everyoned would be 'depressed' and would be given medication by the standards of American psychiatry (even if a great many are by local definitions as well).
However you should not confuse a social/societal evaluation with a realistic one: your own evaluation can be as faulty as the common social one. All I am saying is that you should not take your own intrepretation as final, especially if there is reason to believe you have a disfigured sense of self, as mentally ill people do.
Concentrate on doing, rather than being. Even if you feel like you are useless, dumb trash, a bit of reading, learning or even better a bout of creative action is useful and worthy, no matter who or what you are.

go away drug dealer

I'm not a doctor, actually. I'm a person whose life was fundamentally changed by SSRIs after I tried to kill myself twice. I was terrified of taking pills for years, even though doctors told me to go on them, because I was scared of getting addicted to them or having them change my personality. They did change my personality insofar as now I don't break down crying daily, and I haven't tried to drown myself or cut my arms since I've been on them.

Yeah, it sucks knowing I'm lining some asshole's pockets, but doesn't that apply to virtually everything we have to consume out of neccessity under capitalism? I would rather have the life I'm living now than the one where I wanted to kill myself basically every second of every day.

I don't know anything about bipolar disorder or the meds that are perscribed to treat it, what I'm arguing against here is the general consensus in this thread, which is "Never trust medical professionals, just go off your meds because you can treat it yourself easily!" That's a view I'd expect from religious institutions who tell people you can pray away cancer.

If you feel like the medications you've been perscribed are killing your soul, you need to talk to a doctor about it, not listen to advice on Holla Forums about how you should stop taking them completely and without any other plan to take care of yourself.

jesus christ that's dark. With me, it wasn't nearly that bad. I just have to fake being happier basically. But yeah, I agree with you, psychiatry borders on pseudoscience and probably ruins a shitload of lives for every life it "helps"

I'll take my own judgement over that of society or some person who does not know me but is paid to talk to me and prescribe me drugs.
This is a platitude.

fuck off
I've had my share of ritalin and vicodin
got off this shit like you would get off heroin
decreasing dosage until you can endure the suffering without your daily fix
life's been for the better since then
never again

Yes, talk to your doctor so he could describe some more pills to deal with the side effects of the pills. Maybe it's you who should listen to the experiences of people who've been on meds before spouting off from your """scientific""" moral high horse

Read my other post, I have been and still am on meds, they saved my life:

Indeed - but your own judgement might be distorted. Be careful.
No, I think there is inherent value for a person in creating, even for it is for its own sake.

There is no such thing as inherent value.

They're seriously over-perscribed. I'm not one of the dudes in this thread who will say 'don't ever take medication just deal with it'. I've had bad experiences with psychiatric medications, but I don't doubt that in some cases, it's better to deal with the symptoms of the drugs then deal with the issue. The problem is, psychiatry is such a soft science with such a wide range of barely substantiated bullshit, that basically everybody on earth can get diagnosed with something, and it is in the psychiatrists best interests to get everyone who walks through their door doped up on something or another.

Taking pills to stop the voices in your head screaming at you to kill yourself and to stop seeing spiders crawling underneath your skin 24/7, or you're so depressed you've already tried to kill yourself multiple times and your every waking moment is absolute unbearable misery, that's one thing. Taking pills because you're a 12 year old boy and you like to run around, or because your dad just died and you're upset while you go through the grieving process, or because you're a little shy and you feel anxious sometimes, that's a different story. And the majority of people getting put on drugs will probably fall into the latter category because psychiatrists hand them out like halloween candy.

broadly speaking - yes, I am also a value nihilist
but in terms of personal growth/achievement/aspiration, there is
even if the thing one creates is not valuable by whatever evaluation one subscribes to, the notion and convention of creating is useful and can eventually lead to something great

Like what?

posting these before reading thread

capitalism is not only one of the causes of depression, but it's standing in the way of quasi-cures

Depression as an 'illness' to be fixed by pumping happy pills into your brain is a degenewate concept anyway.

I presume this is a question pertaining to 'something great'?
A work of art, science, theory. A work of human creativity, human intelligence. Learning how to create, share and evaluate one's own product is the necessary condition for anything valuable to happen. This applies to depressives who feel that anything they create is meaningless even more than to others.

Art is pointless and I don't care about it. And really, out of the billions of people who live, how many create a work of theory or science with any value whatsoever? Most people can't even comprehend most scientific theories or works of philosophy, let alone create any.

You laugh but SJWs are pushing for imbecility like that right this moment. The current target is autism.

You do you. I'd encourage you to think about the meaning and purpose of art though.
Why does this matter at all?
This is a state of affairs, not a constant.

It matters because I see no point to spending time creating 'science' or theory without any value to anyone.

i had once, it was fucking shit, i would happily take drugs for revolutionary causes tho

that doesn't answer the question at all: why does the function or action of others mean anything to you at all in this regard? why are you afraid of sticking out in a positive (or any) sense?

Because I'm not arrogant enough to believe that I'll be the 1 guy out of billions who actually does something noteworthy? It seems insanely arrogant to me to believe such a thing.

I wish the original left-populism of the early 20th century was still a thing.

placebos have outperformed surgery in some cases as well

I'm sure you were helped, but it wasn't the active ingredients.

...

arrogant? how is that arrogant? no person is destined to greatness, your idea of worth or value in a person seems spooked, idealistic and essentialist
you aren't a statistic - or rather, even the 1 guy in a billion is a statistic - making that a function of belief or value is worthless
there is no merit to thinking of oneself as a mere piece of meat

I fail to see how this makes the results of the creative pursuits of the average person any more irrelevant.

because the great person is an average person who does great deeds
a person who doesn't do deeds at all cannot do great deeds

Yeah, but 99.999999% of the time, the person who does do deeds also can't do great things. Being fairly mediocre at everything I've ever attempted, I'd say it'd be fairly delusional to believe I'd happen to be a part of that very small group that actually creates something noteworthy.

a self-affirming belief?
either way it's a spook, people aren't part of the 'very small group that actually create something noteworthy' until they create something noteworthy, your logic is stultifying
people who create something noteworthy might also not think that much of themselves before they do create that one noteworthy thing
what I'm saying is do create a thing, let it be critiqued, do another thing based on accepting or rejecting critique, and so on

Yea, literally 1 in 4 women in the US take antidepressants and 1 in 5 men take them.

For so many doctors to be like "meh they probably don't work but whatever" is pretty frightening.

It doesn't take much cajoling to press a psychiatrist on the meta-analyses of psych drugs and get them to admit they are placebos at best.

Don't know what you're talking about; scripted 30mg Adderall here, I feel fucking great. Full of energy, increased pain tolerance, superhuman concentration powers, suppressed appetite keeping my weight in check, and my orgasms go continuous because my refractory period is like 2 minutes. I feel sorry for you depressionfags. ADHD master race.

And I'm just saying it's insanely unlikely and you have some seriously unjustified faith in yourself statistically speaking if you think you'll be the one to make it happen. And it being self-affirming makes it no less true as it would show that my mental fortitude is lacking for such an attempt. Defeatists and cowards never made anything happen.

Anecdotes from my friend with ADHD tells me otherwise. Enjoy your amphetamine light.

this applies equally to whoever does actually make it happen, and yet things do happen, your argument is nonsensical
things don't happen until they do
defining oneself as inherently defeatist or cowardly is precisely what I referred to earlier: unrealistic self-image
this depends obviouisly on your worldview, if you believe in essentialism maybe you can think of yourself as inherently trash but essentialism is trash and even if you do think so of yourself it is useless to do so. embrace emancipatory nihilism if nothing else

I'm not saying it's impossible to create things which are relevant to society, I'm just saying it's very unlikely. As such, I see little reason to hope for it. The chances of some random tosser taking up a random creative pursuit and just happening to gain sufficient insight to write the equivalent Capital IV are slim to non-existent. The idea of achieving something with any relevance seems like a really bizarre way to motivate oneself. Sure, maybe one of all those people who try so hard may actually do something, but that seems like a very low chance to be banking on.
Ah, but this makes no sense. If anything, it is exceedingly realistic as I admit that the average cunt has no real likelihood of creating anything noteworthy, whilst you present the very small chance that you might as a motivator to do particular things. I would argue that my version of how creative efforts end up is going to end up being more 'real' for billions of people than yours. If anything, this brings us back to the whole "negative self-analysis is inherently wrong" thing, as you're saying that self-analysis which concludes that the likelihood of creative relevance is negligable is inherently faulty.
I don't believe in any such thing. I do believe that I am an average Joe, and I do observe that most people never create anything of value. As such, I feel safe in concluding that I won't either, especially seeing how I'm not particularly intelligent and have no personality traits that would be conductive to that goal, nor any which would drive me to change that through some process of 'self-improvement'.

Sucks to be your friend then.
Hey thanks, I am.

I'll reply this tomorrow, I'm not into phoneposting
In the meantime I'll tell you to read 'The Ignorant Schoolmaster', you'll find it somewhere on this board, esp if you ask.

and what's the problem with that? who the heck told you you're supposed to create something extraordinary? why is it important to you? just live your life, do whatever floats your boat, and try not hurting yourself and others as you do so. forget about your position in history. you will most likely not be remembered. neither will i. and this is fine.

I'm on Sertraline (Zoloft)
Honestly it's not that bad, it made me not suicidal every fucking day which is nice
I still have anxiety and shit but I don't think about stabbing myself every time I see a knife or looking at my rifle contemplatively for half an hour

why do you want to off yourself fam?

I personally like to hold my loaded glock in my hand, I literally have it in my hand right now
it calms me, it makes me in control of my life
I can off myself anytime I want, I have a choice
it is a pleasant thought

I enjoy drugs

It's like saying weed and heroin are similar because they're both spooky drugs. Psychiatrics is often shitty and sloppy and ideological but it should be refined and used cautiously not thrown out the window. This is a #WeAreLegion tier thread and you should all be embarassed. Petty bourgeois moralists out here want people to be anxious because, like bro, if I don't have a panic attack about being alienated waiting in line them there's no way I'll ever be able to critique capitalism!

Until there's technology that can say without a shadow of a doubt you got brain problems and NEED medication (or some weed), pills should be a last ditch effort. I say more doctors should exhaust therapy and lifestyle changes for a patient before the drugs. No one with a problem deserves to suffer, but it's a slippery slope to just throw meds at every problem.

kek I agree. I've been Prescribed SSRIs. But the problem in reality was due to the lack of intimacy.

More often than not therapy is a waste of time. Therapists aren't going to be much help to a fucked-up schizophrenic whose situation is probably in part biological (even tho there's no real science to diagnose a schizo brain from a scan, sometimes you can see the brain's damage from years of neglect and atrophy). I mean, what is a therapist going to say? Feel good brah? There is no answer a therapist can give to someone suffering like that, nor can therapists answer the horrible shit rained down on schizophrenics by society. That doesn't even cover the sheer volume of people that have to be processed for all sorts of severe mental illness. It really is a system of sorting out people and classifying who is functional and who is not.

Therapy is for fags who are judged useful by society, so they can be converted into wageslaves or whatever counts as a "productive member of society". It's not meant for the hard cases, and frankly for the people who are just depressed, imo they don't have a real problem except perhaps one that is socially created or created as a result of their own fuckups. The "happy pills" have uncertain effects at best and I maintain that SSRIs and SNRIs are pure poison that shouldn't be prescribed to anyone.

I use nutrition and herbal medicine. I don't do all I should with it though so it's not hugely effective.

It's something for which there is a time and a place for some people, but there is no way that it's healthy to have this saturated a market on drugs.

I agree that it's a pleasant thought about being able to sudoku at any point where shit gets bad
I just didn't/don't like being alive and I just wanted to be out
I stress a lot and I'd go into spirals of self loathing and apathy and I wanted to be done with this bullshit

It is not a question of hope, it's not a force of nature or a random act of god. Things happen because people do things.
Marx was a random tosser until he wrote his theory. Nobody is born 'special' in a way relevant to the topic at hand. Or they are but that's what we are trying to change here on this board
This makes sense in the scale of populations and in a logic of averages, but it is not an useful way to think of oneself. You are more or less denying your subjectivity in the personal scale. ON the scale of epochs and peoples' and so on the people can be treated as objects but they consist of separate, active subjects. Individuals act, groups react.

You're a Big Pharma viraller wanting to get me hooked, aren't you? Can depression be treated with Adderall?

If you don't mind me asking, how did you overcome that?
I have a feeling I'm in a similar position. I've been depressed and anxious for years probably because of my childhood where I just completely shut down. After I started having regular panic attacks, my friend dragged me to the doctor where they gave me some SSRIs.
Its only been a few months but I don't really feel that they've helped. I've stopped being emotionally depressed I suppose but I still know cognitively that I am. Its also made me more irritable, lethargic, and headache prone.
I didn't mean to bore you with my life story but I just wanted to provide some context because I think that the root of my problem is actually an intimacy one, or lack thereof.

Almost was in middle school
Kept throwing hissy fits because therapy was so boring that I managed to get out before they could prescribe anything
Looking at what amphetamines are doing to my father right now and seeing what I could have become is a frightening tbh

amazon.com/Our-Posthuman-Future-Consequences-Biotechnology/dp/0312421710?SubscriptionId=AKIAILSHYYTFIVPWUY6Q&tag=duckduckgo-ffcm-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=0312421710
Anyone here have a PDF of this book while we're on the topic?

smart move

I've never tried them. I'm sure they would try to shove all kinds of pills down my throat if they actually got a hold of me. Being a burger with no healthcare though that won't be happening anytime soon.
I'm basically completely emotionally dead and have had all the negative symptoms of schizophrenia my entire life without any of the positive symptoms (delusions, hallucinations, racing thoughts etc.)
livingwithschizophreniauk.org/advice-sheets/negative-symptoms-understanding/

It is if you're in a situation that would provoke it.
If you're living precariously as a deliveroo slave in a damp shithole horsebox in London, anything other than depression and anxiety ought to be classified as neurologically deviant.

bad advice if good things start happening
immediate and rapid mood improvement, leading into a much healthier (if somewhat more detached) approach to politics came from that.

;-;

incidentally alcohol sucks, and is way too expensive now, and it doesn't even improve being around people you dislike all that much. if i was going to give any advice whatsoever it would be just to cut down consumption - even from a purely economic point of view, to get your tolerance down and thus make it all cheaper. that would be the one thing i've learned all these years.

user, what made you fell your life worth living? I think i'm sorta in the same spot rn.

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that pic is hilarious

This board is fucking vile.

It is all in your head, taking pills will worsen the problem.

Sick little men with their vile disgusting piles. BAN THIS SICK FILTH!!! NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is some serious bullshit if you know anyone who has dealt with the mental health system. I've dealt with the system myself since I was too young to have any memories (and I was forced into it by the law). I have family that were dragged into the system at a later age than I, some in their adulthood. I know people who have been dragged into the system at various stages in their life. Many adults are truly ignorant enough to think that the system is there to help them, only to find themselves descend into an underworld they didn't want and find their lives taken away from them.

Like I said, mental health is a legal and political system, basically a second-track prison system. Whether people are actually mentally ill or not - I believe many people are and do need help - is irrelevant to what the system actually does, what its social function is.

Being poor is no defense in the very worst cases. I've heard of employers using the mental health system to punish wayward employees, basically the company tells the doctor what to diagnose. It's just like how the school literally tells a doctor what to diagnose when dealing with a problem student, which is why you see medical records with apparently contradictory diagnoses sometimes (this is according to psychologist people and people in the system who I've been in contact with). In fact, I've been told that the dx I got is literally impossible by at least one shrink, but the legal/social system literally forced the doctor's hand to write it. Fucked up, I know.

I can say though that I could easily walk away from my current situation and go off pills, and no one would give a shit. I'm already regarded as a failure and too broke-ass to fix, regardless of anything I do now or in the future. My current shrink even admits that it's not about curing anything, it's about managing me so I don't waste more of society's resources than necessary.

The whole system is really classist and what you get is based on your social position. Poorfucks and low-caste wageslaves are simply managed with 15-minute med checks, and only really get diagnoses based on whether they're disruptive or not. (If you go of your own volition and you're a poorfuck with no obvious problems, they'll just boot you out of the office.) The college-educated and professional class, though, they need to be kept on a tighter leash. I started out as the child of someone in the professional class, and both of us were fucked by the system, chewed up and spat out. My mother died working at fucking Wal-Mart on the most asinine wageslave schedule possible. And it was all my fault for being diagnosed by the school as a mental defective, that is why her life went to such shit and why she died and early death. Because of me. How the fuck am I supposed to feel happy about life knowing that?

All drugs can be addictive or habit-forming to some extent. It mostly depends on your own self-control , which drugs you take and whether you're genetically vulnerable for addiction.
But if those things are checked, there shouldn't be much risk of it ruining your life.

ritalin i here, it also works.
It might temporarily make you euphoric, but the dip after would fuck you up.
If you're depressed, I'd look into weed to remember what being happy was like. And then maybe hallucinogens because I heard good things about those.

being anti-psychiatry is pretty regressive tbh

Anti-psychiatry is pure reactionary, anti-scientific bullshit and should be not tolerated in leftist circles.

Pills are actually working and there are only solution to mental helath problems when they occur. Of course, we need to work to create society place when mental problems don't occur, but at this moment no bullshit psychotherapy or other magic is effective, only pills.

t. anarchist user with depression, successfully treated

I took Fluoxetine for a while and my god, it was awful. I felt like a borg drone, no emotion, no individuality, simply being pushed around and goign about simple business in a mindless haze.

would not recommend.

Except that many times the pills aren't working, and a lot of people get fucked by the system. How many people have been misdiagnosed as children I can only guess, but I can believe it's a lot.

I guess the people who respond negatively to SSRIs and SNRIs, like me, are just life unworthy of life and it's our fault for not reacting to the pills in the correct way. That tends to be the attitude I get from "success stories".

Because your charlatans told you this?

Yes, system of alt-med abracadabra brainwashing.

I wait for "vaccines cause autism" mem.

Try other pills instead of spreading stupid memes.

For me, first worging SSRI was third from which I tried. I tried:
sertraline - it made me hyperactive maniac
fluoxetine - it simply didn't work
fluvoxamine - it was

Also, I doubt you ever take it, because there's no such side effects listed in the leaflet and probably you just lie.

Seek a psychoanalyst, preferably a Lacanian.

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Not bait, I really mean it. In fact, I visit a Lacanian myself.

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You must be very rich if you can afford it.

I've been put on quite a few pills of various types. I've read stories from people who've been put on a lot more pills, forcibly institutionalized, people whose legal rights have been taken away and forced to live as literal non-persons. It's not a question about whether psychiatry is a valid science, it's about the legal apparatus. That's what fucked me a lot more than the pills or the doctors, and once I was old enough to actually explain how the pills were making me fucking miserable I got off the really bad pills that made me bloat to 240lbs, sweat and itch constantly, and many other unpleasant effects. Now I just live with impotence and grew mantits thanks to risperidone.

You know what though? Internet depressionfags are the worst. They get sad, take some pills, then they're "cured" and feel the compulsion to impose their notions on everyone else, call everyone else who isn't happy "depressed" and denounce them nonstop. I've seen the type many, many times on the internet. Maybe they're just rotten people who get their energy off of others' misery. As mad as I am and as terrible a person as I am, I can never quite understand such people.

I will never, ever trust psychoanalysts after what they did to me and my family. Besides, I don't need to be interrogated by some asshole to know what my problems are, what my flaws are, etc. I've already beat myself up enough over things that have happened. No amount of being interrogated will change my brain simply being defective and incurable, and it certainly won't change my shit position in life. A competent shrink would probably see that and stop trying to pretend that the situation is fixable or blame me for yet more shit.

Also, I've read stories of serious cases who suffered at the hands of Lacanians because they don't understand how to deal with legal non-persons, the kind of people I am familiar with and face the risk of being if I'm not careful. I'm not a normal person and I never will be, and as far as I know it's due to inborn traits.

Also, I don't fucking have that kind of money.

In so far as you're not a psychotic in Lacanian subjective structure, you don't run the risk of the, the treatment is almost the same. Psychotics aren't treated the same as neurotics in Lacanian analysis. You also seem to be really ignorant about what Lacanians actually do: they don't tell you what to do, this is for you to decide as you speak of your symptoms. Regardless, if you want to be an asshole who treats help like this, I'll tell the same thing I always tell to people like you: enjoy your symptom. If you don't even seek to talk to one in the first place to see what they are like, you'll effectively stay the same as you are right now.

Not really, although they can be a tad expensive.

Here's problem. You read various anecdata, often invented from nothing, and base your view on this, even if scientific proof tells you otherwise. It's the same problem people believe in chemitrails, vaccines-cause-autism meme or negate Holocaust or global warming.

Impotence is probably more caused by depression than post-SSRI sexual dysfuncion, especially if you stopped to take SSRI more than year agor. There's no proof that SSR can cause long term sexual dysfunction that occurs still after stopping in taking pills, but theres's proof that depression can cause psychosomatic impotence.

Internet specialists on topics like medicine are the worst. People who educated themself in Youtube University shouldn't be allowed to have authority in topics like curing diseases - and, TBH, its probably the weakest point of anarchism, not fully solved to this day: how to prevent charlatans from spreading their bullshit in free society and save people from cognitive errors that mislead them?

Depression is actually much more than just being sad, comrade.

Is this even worth replying to? I will never know.

i mean what the fuck are they even going to write? "side effects may include loss of personality"? yeah, because that doesn't sound bizarre even by the standards of medicine.

if taking pills could lead to loss of personality, that would be included in a leaflet - if it isn't, that means they don't

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Big Pharma Jewry hides REAL effects of their drugs from us!

Reporting in. It was either that or suicide, so I chose to live. Never seen any kind of therapist and I never will. I don't need any kind of lacanian gobbledygook or a pharma-bribed shrink to tell me what's wrong with the world and my life. It's pretty damn obvious but also difficult to change; in the case of capitalism, incredibly difficult. What matters most is there's someone in your life who actually cares about you and who isn't a parent. Someone willing to put up with your shit because you're important to them, who you can say to them "I'm having a bad day" and they'll understand it's not the garfield-tier bullshit. That and a willingness to look hard at your life yet not despair. "An unexamined life is not worth living" they used to say: well, an unexamined life can get you killed these days. So can trusting the system to look after you. A combination of both usually lands people in prison, in a mental ward, and finally a grave. Sometimes in that order.

The point of all that should be obvious. Self-theory is no joke. The revolution starts with you developing a critical praxis in your own life and particular social context. They don't teach you that at school or college, and it's that kind of complacency which contributes to suicide rates because when people despair, and god isn't there to save them, there's nothing left. Even megalomaniacs can crack in this pressure cooker. And it doesn't mean fleeing into the arms of drug/alcohol abuse or the dead-end of consumerism. Abuse of any kind hurts you in the long term and even if it helps you cope today eventually the rope you've cast out for yourself will come to an end, and you with it. You have to read, motherfucker, and then think about your life. You have to set your own goals and achieve them. You have to learn not to be so fucking hard on yourself because the most successful people in this society are the most warped: they're barely even human anymore. They're more commodity than being. They aren't becoming anything and they aren't going anywhere. Whether they realize it or not the moment capitalism shatters their entire life goes with it. The only way they can relate to the world is through their branded life.

I'm not gonna lie it's fucking hard out there. I feel so cheated by this society. They taught me so much yet so little of it I needed to know; what I did need to know wasn't taught to me. I almost died before I had the courage to reach out to someone and embrace the fact that the dream isn't real. The ideology that tells us how to relate to our social realities only offers a fragment of truth, and the sheer mass and combination of these forms a kind of negative where there is no escape plottable, only infinite variations of the same damn thing. But there is an escape and it's called communism. We can only reach it together, but we have to start with ourselves. That's all I have to say. I'm leaving the thread.

Seriously, what could they tell me that I don't already know? I actually, you know, read shit and spent the past couple of decades sorting through my own shit. The best thing that happened for me was being free from an oppressive total institution like the school system and basically doing next to nothing with my adult life.

Also, as fucked as I am, I'm about as well as I can ever expect to be, and the real problems I have are legal and social, like being able to find a way to actually hold down a decent job. Socially, no one is ever going to hire me no matter how much I'm cured, because I have no employment history, no real educational credentials, and any educational credential I could gain now would be worthless. Legally, well, I'm disabled and that never goes away unless a judge rules that I was never mentally ill, and if that happens I have to pay back hundreds of thousands of dollars that I will never have.

Also, the brain is a fucking real thing, Psychoanalysis can't cure or change brain functioning. Many of those psychotics are hearing voices because their brain's structure is fucked, either by some inborn condition or drug use or brain trauma. I don't think science knows enough to detect a "psychotic brain" and I doubt a "psychotic brain" even exists, and some day when biology is not so fucking ideological scientists will be able to make actually useful judgements and actually understand why psychoactive drugs commonly prescribed work the way they do.

Blah blah blah more strawman arguments. I don't just have anecdata, I notice patterns that almost universally prove to be true, and use my fucking brain and fucking logic to add two and two. Also, the law surrounding mental health and the policies in the school system is there for everyone to see, if their head is not in the sand.

Uh, no. My impotence is directly caused by an antipsychotic, and sexual impotence is a noted side-effect. Learn to read motherfucker.

Maybe Anarchism is a retarded ideology? Or maybe you're wrong and you're an emotional vampire like most depressionfags, trying to make an argument to make up for your fragile… whatever you have going on? Like I said, I've seen the pattern before with other depressionfags who try to dominate others as a crutch for whatever they have going on.

why would it be included in a leaflet, especially if the side effect is "perception of a loss of personality"?
i mean, the point of the thing is to manipulate how you feel. a large chunk of how i behave is impulsive, based on spur of the moment feelings. it's not a conspiracy to hide the fact that when you drug that instability away, it goes away and you've got to fill the hole with something else.

(there's a question as to whether i should ever have been on SSRIs, but that's neither here or there, i ate them, they did stuff, i got bored and argumentative, i stopped eating them.)

Got off benzos a month ago and im tapering of Zoloft (an SSRI) right now, this shit is painful. Had a huge brain zap yesturday. Im so angry that people who can do well without them are being fed this shit, its way cheaper than therapy so thats why I guess

Shit thats so true, I act like a jackass when I was on SSRI to everyone. This shit makes you miserable

Meds definitely get over prescribed. There's a big push by insurance companies and the pharmaceutical industry to push them on people, because psychotherapy takes longer to get results.

people actually believe that antidepressants have clinical significance beyond placebo after reading the meta-analyses.

SMH

Oh yea they are the worst. They live as literal zombies, and then are like trolling the web with insane idpol and social reactionary bullshit. I bet like 90%+ of SJWs are on zombie pills and think it's good for them and society.
Just gross.

This exactly. I used to smoke weed to get rid of the depression, which worked pretty well, but it would only last as long as the high, maybe a little after.
Then I took Psilocybin and it completely changed me, in a good way. For a good 2-3 weeks afterwards I was no longer depressed and had an optimistic perception of the world. It does go away after a while, but you can microdose and treat it like a normal medicine, which works very well for a lot of people. I've wanted to try it, but I can't afford to be taking Psilocybin every couple of days. If you want to do psycidelics but don't know how to get a hold of any, or are too afraid of being arrested, check out 1P-LSD, it's a legal LSD analog.

That's what they told you in lectures in your academia, yes?

Depressionfag here, I tried to help myself with shrooms, they're shit, not helpful for depression at all, and it shouldn't be a surprise because they don't have any clinical effectiveness in research.
SSRI's, contrary to this, have.

Yes, and what you'll do if he'll have a 10h bad trip, dr leftypol?

No, just a regular poster here. I understand some of you may have your doubts since pharma being close buddies with capitalism, but to condemn psychiatry to condemn an entire field of medicine.
Adderall is an amphetamine (stimulant) not an anti-depressant, so no. If you want Adderall, just mimick ADHD behavior, it's not so hard, just tell them you have trouble concentrating and you're easily distracted etc.

Sometimes adderall is prescribed off-label to control being overweight via appetite suppression.

1. wait it out
2. fix you fucking set and setting next time you take it

if i could get a scrip for something like xanax or similar i could function without crippling panic attacks and i would actually be able to drive and attend events easily.
for all the talk of drug abuse in the USA its impossible to get help when you really need it. apparently these obvious meth-heads can get prescribed all this shit so easily, but a normal looking guy like me, nope.

I don't know why people are so hyped on psychotic-inducing drugs. That shit will just fry your brain and if you're one of the unfortunates your brain is pretty much fucked after one use. I've never tried them but heard enough from people who have had bad experiences to suggest never going down that path.

Not being a true depressionfag I can't say anything really constructive. The only thing I can say is that no one is ever, in a legal sense, "cured" of mental illness. The stigma remains for the rest of your life - and that is the whole point of the system as it exists today, as it has existed since the 1940s (and before that, the system was just straight-up eugenics targeting the supposedly feeble-minded for sterilization). Institutions like that don't change because they get nicer, they can only be toppled or degraded.

Had I been born in the 1960s, I probably would have been institutionalized and/or killed. The latter still happens from time to time (just throw the unwanted child into an abusive foster family and the authorities won't particularly mind if an "accident" occurs, happens all the time with Downs Syndrome babies).

I dunno, I got a benzo without even asking for it and I don't really notice the effect one way or another. Apparently it's supposed to help with panic attacks but the one time I had something to panic over I still freaked out, and I'd still freak out if I had to do things like socialize.

Excellent post.

Benzo's are a drug really only to be used as a temporary crutch until you can get help in the form of support or another drug. Usually around a week or two, max. They're highly addictive and for good reason, pretty much a glass of wine in a pill. The reason they're easy to get for junkies is through dealers or someone with a script pad. Doctors, at least in my state, can't prescribe them anymore in high doses and are really reluctant to even give emergency doses.

Saved

I actually have been looking into LSD microdosing like I've been seeing on this board and others lately. Just gotta wait till I move out because I can't receive suspicious packages in the mail here.

Psychedelics sound very promising in treating anxiety and depression. Of course it will take eons before any professionals start treating the mainstream with it. Look at how long it took for weed to get medically accepted and states are STILL burying their heads in the sand over it.

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Tried medication

Current medication

If it wasn't for Effexor, I'd be laying in my bed all day either in suicidal depression, in a state of dissociation or in sheer panic.

Without a stimulant, I'm a sloth and I don't even bother doing much of anything. Even now, I struggle, even though getting shit done is easier.

IIRC there were some attempts to combine therapy with psychedelics, but it assumes the patient trusts the therapist - which if you've been paying attention to the legal framework of psychiatry/psychology, no one should ever do because the therapist's first obligation is to be an agent of social control, and they will divulge all secrets to the authorities if you are suspected of being a serious crimethinker.

And for me anyway, that's the central problem - there are things I can never, ever reveal to the wrong people or else my life is ruined. This is not going to go away. I suspect that is the case for many people under treatment - they're in a bad place because socially and legally, they have things that they need to stay hidden. No one is going to have any sympathy for them. They're just fucked.

I guess though I just deserve it, or something, for being a bad, toxic person.

I am severely afflicted by both and it feels terrible. I can't even read and focus on anything anymore and I'm medicated for both.

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I'm adding all the lives that could be saved by now-illicit drugs on capitalism's already massive death toll. To say nothing of suffering that could be avoided by the living too.

In your case I'd read up and medicate yourself. Nothing wrong with seeking treatment outside your country where none of that would be an issue either. I believe everyone can be rehabilitated in some way, real rehab and not the burger method of locked up in prison or medicated in the psychward, that is.

Right now I'm just trying to find a way to work a legit job. The rough plan is to build a portfolio of vidya, put it on a website and distribute for free, build a following, and then put out the begging plate for contributions + sell copies on Humble Bundle or Steam or something. So basically I'd be a glorified beggar strumming his guitar on the sidewalk, except I hope to clear at least 12k/year.

SSA has pretty strict rules on self-employment and might look down on the model of glorified begging I intend to do to replace getting money from the government, so I have to tread carefully. But I don't see any way I'm just going to get hired by someone to make vidya, there's not exactly a position for "game designer" and I can't really work with people. If there's a particularly generous Porky who's willing to shell out $20k+/year for whatever I make on my own time that would be great. I don't give that many shits about being exploited if I can get more money than I'm getting now and have at least the pride of not being a total mooch on society. Even if I do this though, I still have a shit-ton of medical records that follow me wherever I go.

Maybe it's just a pipe dream and I'm better off just shutting up and taking the check, but at this point the only major thing I have to lose is my house if I get asked to make a giant-ass repayment or my plans fall through and I have no income.

Then again, if shit hits the fan and Porky takes away disability for everyone, or just takes it away from selected people like Reagan did, or hyperinflation happens and the checks don't rise in value to account for inflation, or the whole damn system collapses, it's all kind of a moot point and I'm screwed no matter what. And the possibility of something big happening - which I can see happening within my natural lifetime - is why I really need to find a way to get off of this if it is at all possible.

I wonder who's behind this post

here m7

Sadly he will become clinically insane and subsequently kill himself, as everyone knows a bad trip totally happens all the time, especially in low, therapeutic doses.
Now fuck off DEA.

The pharma shills are really out in full force today.

They don't help everyone, same as SSRIs, but unlike SSRIs they don't cause long term brain damage.

False. Can you source a single reputable study that found them to be ineffective?
thelancet.com/pb/assets/raw/Lancet/pdfs/S2215036616300657.pdf

Where the fuck did you hear this? Psilocybin and LSD are scientifically one of the safest drugs by every metric you could take, alcohol, tobacco, and marijuana included.
globaldrugsurvey.com/wp-content/themes/globaldrugsurvey/results/GDS2017_key-findings-report_final.pdf
disinfo.com/2017/06/9-millionth-study-finds-psilocybin-safest-recreational-drug/

Christ alive you sound like a DARE instructor.

Yes, they advise against over prescribing meds in most medical fields, not just in psychiatry. The medical industry is rife with people who over prescribe pain killers for instance. That aside, I have doctors and psychologist in my family who I frequently talk to about these issues.

Thanks comrade

It's not just psychiatry lad.
It's also music, videogames, porn, weed, sex, etc.

All of these have one thing in common: they're a quick and easy dopamine boosters to feel an artificial sense of accomplishment from not actually accomplishing anything.

I could swear I made a post talking about capitalist shit like thalidomide and stuff but can't find it. Anyway, look at what I just found: news.sky.com/story/vaginal-mesh-legal-action-could-be-bigger-than-thalidomide-11060083

you have more than 1 anarchist pepe on a folder somewhere on your hard drive?

I simply can't stand an idiots in leftist circles, really.

It's not scientific reasoning.

Maybe, but that don't mean they're effective. Drinking water is probably safe for depression too, but it don't means it's effective.
Don't get me wrong, I like LSD very much, I tried 1P-LSD and ALD-52 and read "Capitalisme et Schizofrenie" on trip, that was very developing experience. But, seriously, it didn't cure a depression. When my depression is too hard to deal with it without drugs, I take SSRIs. It's alwas working and no brain damage occurs.

One question, if you have a patient with severe depression or psychosis, are you as wise and anti-drug as in thsi topic, or then you take your medical ethics seriously and prescribe him/her drugs?

SNRIs helped for about two or three weeks, but after a while all the problems I had were made worse. I wasn't given any kind of talk therapy which probably didn't help anything either, my psychiatrist was usually generally pretty unsympathetic and just kept upping the dosage for around two years despite it not doing anything for me.
I was on a few different SSRIs over the period of around two or three months and it felt like waking up with a hangover every morning.
Welbutrin is treating me ok so far but I'm starting to feel fucky again so I might stop and start smoking occasionally instead with tobacco I grow myself.

I know, it's the worst.

Did you read the PDF I linked? It is scientifically proven and measurable, moreso than SSRIs which studies show "fail to show a clinically significant advantage for antidepressant medication over inert placebo."
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4172306/

It's unfortunate that LSD and ALD-52 are unable to cure your depression, however you should remember that everyone's brain is wired differently, and can react radically different to different stimuli. What works for you might not work for someone else, and vice versa. The point is that these drugs cause no harm and therefore should at least be given a chance to help, as they are clinically proven to be effective.

Who said I was "anti-drug"? I specifically said I was against over prescribing them.It would technically be medically unethical to overprescribe medication to begin with, so your question makes no sense.

anyone do oxy, hydro, anything like that

that's my shit

But you said it in context - thread where people were spreading anti-scientific, anti-psychiatric conspiracy theories about SSRIs, what can be only harmful to patients.[

I know this research. You use it wrongly - yes, it's true that this research had proven SSRIs have effect comparable to placebo, but in group of patients with mild or average depression symptoms. In group of patients with severe depression symptoms, like people with endogenous depression or unipolar depressive disorder, (what I actually have) it's clinically proven that SSRIs have evident effect far exceeding effect of placebo. That's you don't tell people, because it's not fitting well in simplified antipsychiatric narrative. And that's in fact very harmful for people with serious mental conditions like me, which leads us often to suicide or necessity of forced hospitalization.

No offence, but it's typical alt-med babbling. There's no scientific evidence that psychodelics can cure depression or even there's no convincing proof that they can be safely used by people suffering from severe mental illness such as severe depression, schizophrenia or personality disorders.
I know what a trip looks like. It's not something that I could responsibly recommend to people who have anxiety states or depressive delusions, they could possibly worsen state of patient.

Research is not conclusive.

I don't like it but I need the ssri to tolerate wagecucking while I save up for medical procedures

You are being impossible to debate. You seem to be of the predisposed opinion that scientific evidence is only right when it confirms your anecdotal view (which you have offered no sources to) that SSRIs are the only way to fix depression, and that it is impossible that your anecdotal experiences with them may not be indicative of an entire species.
I can't tell if you are a shill or a mule, either way you are as stubborn as both.

Requesting source, please.

This is what I mean by the intense levels of ideology in biology and medicine and psychiatry. No one can even say why SSRIs work (if they work), they can just make correlations based on diagnoses that can be really arbitrary.

Source: Was diagnosed with mood disorder as a child, given anti-depressants, which fucked my body for years and left me a crying, miserable wreck. I'd probably be a wreck without the drugs due to the situation I was forced in - schools are literal trauma factories - but the drugs certainly helped nothing, and one had nothing but really negative effects. It took about 10 years before the doctors realized this shit was killing me, all because of ideology forcing particular treatments on particular people.

I've read reports that try to explain the mechanistic effects of SSRIs on the brain, and a few scientists have come forward and said straight-up that the effects could only lead to intense agitation if they were in a human. Maybe that's why people on SSRIs are so fucking impossible to deal with.

All I know for sure is that the SSRIs and SNRIs fucked me up real bad and I never was really compensated for all my trouble. They're also fucking up people in my family. I guess we're all just eugenically unfit people for having the incorrect reaction, or something.

There are probably alternative treatments for depression, that would be possible if biology didn't have so much ideology and we really started asking ourselves how the human brain works. Or, I guess people could do what I do and drag myself through life with stimulants. Then again I'm not depressed in any clinical sense.

I can't recommend hallucinogens to anyone for any reason whatsoever as a medical treatment, and would caution against their recreational use because it's very easy to trigger permanent psychosis from their use even once, or their overuse.

People isn't me.
Admit you were confused.

Just shut the fuck up and let people find out what works best for them. Don't pretend that you know better than a psychiatrist or doctor just because you dislike the capitalist industry that produces these drugs. Don't spread this shit to regular people looking to help their problems.
Fuckers like you were the reason I didn't get help until after highschool and after I dropped out of college. I always thought that pills made you weak, made you subservient, brainwashed you, were bullshit and so on until I actually went and got help from a doctor.
Now I've been on medication ALONG WITH THERAPY/COUNSELING for over a year and it has allowed me to continue participating in life. I no longer am set off into a spiraling depression that makes me want to stop living over shitty life events. I can go outside and talk to people. I can look at myself in the mirror and be proud of who I am and how far I've come. I couldn't have done that without medical help.
I'm beyond thankful that I didn't buy into the counter culture psuedo armchair psychiatrist 2intelligent4u posters on the internet or else I would never have come as far as I have. So shut the fuck up.

That's funny, I only improved once I was free of overbearing social/legal apparatuses that are designed for social control first and foremost. I'm not saying psychiatric medicine is pure evil, only that the legal system surrounding it is necessarily evil and doctors have to work within that system or else they're sanctioned.

It's also a fucking insult to suggest talk therapy and the like to people who literally cannot be cured or helped by it in any way. I'm a fucking autist who had to go through hell, first because the doctors refused to accept that I'm fundamentally different from other humans, and then because of their prejudices against autists that make us live even worse lives than we have to. It all made sense when I (finally) realized the whole point of the system is to isolate and segregate unwanted persons, mark them as "toxic", and promote general eugenicist bullshit. It took me a long time to learn how to write like a fucking human, I still can't talk normally, and I'm never going to have anything like a normal social life. Even if you can say something good about interventions, the system itself is designed to segregate and put people into their social place and rank. I've seen too many bluepilled high-functioning autists who buy into horseshit as part of their "therapy" rather than using what intellect they have and realizing that autism fucking sucks and we have to compensate for it as best as we can; not that we're ever going to be normal, but at least try to see why things are so fucked up, instead of being led down false paths.

I didn't learn anything to cope with life from so-called therapy, it was just interrogations where I was made to blame myself for things I had little power over. The drugs are at best a mixed blessing and it was only when I was able to read for myself how these drugs work, and compare experiences with other people, that I found one that was moderately useful. Moderately useful, with some side-effects a normie would dread to live with, a drug that most normies would never, ever want to take if they experienced it first-hand, because it literally is intended to turn people into zombies. I had to choose zombification and impotence over living as I was for the forseeable future.

You know what else? Most people in my position aren't so lucky to even have the option of zombification. Their only exposure to psychiatry is the coercive side, where they have to act like a total crazy person or get locked up before there are any interventions. And when you understand that the system is bound by social and legal obligations to act as a second-track police state, that totally makes sense. I only wish I wasn't so fucking autistic and could have understood that earlier. People like you do not help.

I wanted to kill myself before I found the right SSRI, you moron. Living was pain and I fought just to have access to mental healthcare. Where do you get off spouting this bullshit

who needs bookwise when you have streetwise - the post

And I wanted to kill myself because of the SSRIs more times than I can count, and the "access" turned into a legal and social nightmare I'm still trying to put behind me and probably never will. I get off spouting this because of my own lived experience and the experiences of many others who are in the same place, who have had their lives wrecked.

I don't know why anyone would ever, ever put themselves in a position where they lose a good part of their freedom and civil rights, unless they're going to take up arms to fight Porky or something. If I knew what I know now, didn't have a mental health history, and felt sad, I would never enter the system, even if I were suicidal. The loss of freedom just by entering the system is not worth my life. But then, many people aren't exactly aware of what they're giving up until it's too late. My sister had to find out the hard way, she thought the system worked too and now she's trapped in a bind, and she has a lot more to lose than I do. Then again, her situation is such that losing her freedom might be a rational decision for the sake of her children. But now, she's definitely not shilling for pharma or going to say the system works; what she has now is just about what I have, where she's just managing symptoms and trying not to make the situation worse, after SSRIs fucked up her body.

I don't know why people are shilling for SSRIs when it's known that a significant part of the population has violently negative reactions to them. I guess those people are just life-unworthy-of-life for having the incorrect reaction or something. I can get shilling for pharma drugs to an extent, but the shilling for SSRIs in particular is really dubious when someone tells you over and over again their own lived experience to the contrary, and can back that up with others' lived experiences and information to suggest that mechanistically, the SSRIs are a drug with questionable effects at best.

Who else wants to put pill pushers on the wall first?

I guess I'm really putting myself out there with this but check happened to my pill pusher:

pasadenastarnews.com/2016/05/24/pasadena-psychiatrist-faces-assault-charges-after-allegedly-attacking-nanny-former-employee/

A Pasadena psychiatrist is facing assault charges after allegedly attacking his children’s nanny and a former employee during separate incidents over the past seven months.

Dirk de Brito, 53, of La Canada Flintridge, has been charged with two felony counts of assault by means of force, making criminal threats, interfering with a communication device, having a concealed firearm and exhibiting a firearm in connection with separate incidents in October and January. De Brito runs a private psychiatry practice out of an office located at 751 N. Fair Oaks Ave and specializes in adult ADHD and depression, according to his office’s Yelp page.

In the evening on Oct. 14, 2015, de Brito’s nanny April Montes was driving to his house in La Canada Flintridge with two of his children when he called her to tell her she was fired, according to testimony Montes provided during a court hearing last month. When Montes arrived, de Brito took his 2-year-old son from her, sat him on the couch and then put Montes in a headlock and began punching her and yelling profanities at her, according to the tesitmony.

“He said I abused his two year old,” Montes told the judge. And then, “put me in a headlock, started hitting me.”

He then threatened to kill Montes and bury her in the backyard before ordering her to pack her things, according to her testimony.

Montes said she tried to call the police from her room, but de Brito took her cell phones from her and disconnected the land line in her room. He continued to push her and yell at her.

“He was preventing me from calling any ­‑- I tried calling multiple ways, tried asking for help, tried yelling through the window. He would threaten me the whole time,” Montes said, adding that he kept her in sight during the whole incident and even followed her into the bathroom.

De Brito was arrested the following morning and posted $50,000 for bail, according to online booking records.

A few months later, the psychiatrist was arrested a second time after allegedly assaulting his office manager Jeanice Skeen in the parking lot behind his Pasadena office building. This time, de Brito was allegedly armed.

Skeen had voluntarily left her job on Jan. 11 and had arranged to pick up her final pay check and return a company vehicle at 10 p.m. the next day, according to her testimony. When Skeen arrived, another employee met her in the parking lot, asked her to sign some paperwork and handed her an envelope that she thought contained her paycheck, according to her testimony. Minutes later, as Skeen began to walk away from the area, de Brito appeared in the parking lot in his car. He drove up to her and began yelling. He was wearing a bullet proof vest, according to testimony.

De Brito said, “‘Do you want your check, you b—-?’ … I said, ‘What are you talking about I have my check right here,’” Skeen told the judge. He then told her that she had a “fake check” before jumping out of his car.

Skeen opened the envelope she had been given and found a photocopy of an old pay stub, according to her testimony.

“De Brito is still yelling at me,” Skeen said. “And then he just kept waving the check and saying, ‘Don’t you want your money?’”

At that point, Skeen grabbed the paperwork she had signed and started ripping them up when de Brito “grabbed” her and threw her to the ground, according to her testimony. She said de Brito kicked her and then returned to his vehicle. Skeen tried to block him from getting inside the car when she “saw him reach with his left hand to his waist and pull out a gun that was holstered,” she said.

He hit her right shoulder with the gun, causing her to fall down again, according to her testimony. De Brito then got back in his car and drove off. Skeen was transported to Huntington Memorial Hospital where she was treated for some bleeding, bruising, a sprained wrist and a hematoma on her brain.

Skeen said she abruptly walked off the job because of verbal abuse inflicted by de Brito.

“I was being berated on a constant daily basis, so at that moment, I reached my limit,” Skeen said her in testimony.

De Brito was arrested a few hours later. He posted $30,000 for bail and remains out of custody.

Has anyone ever had a psychiatrist who wasn't obviously slamming the hell out of the amphetamines? Not me… The most intolerable tweakers I've ever met in my life.

...

found the scientologist