Why was Rosa Luxemburg such a stuck up, retarded, dogmatic, ahistorical bitch?

Why was Rosa Luxemburg such a stuck up, retarded, dogmatic, ahistorical bitch?

Fucking LOL credit existed LONG before capitalism, even in her day this was known
To be fair she had never seen neoliberalism, in which the strong state regulates in favour over the capitalist, still though WRONG
Lmao wtf capitalism and the state are inseparable
Speaks for itself
It's like she is trying to be as obtuse and lacking nuance as is physically possible
I mean Bernstein was wrong, but seriously you are going to use Fox News Esque character assassination and just paint him as a whiner? Talk about a total lack of academic integrity
Queen of the buzzword in lieu of actual argument

Remind me again why people on here lick the arsehole of this ridiculously third rate theorist, who can't even write a short pamphlet without it being riddled with holes? Reform or Revolution, besides what it says about trade unions, is basically a crock of shit. I even agree with her, revolution is good, reform is bad, but her argumentation is piss poor

Other urls found in this thread:

marxists.org/archive/luxemburg/1909/national-question/ch03.htm
marxists.org/subject/germany-1918-23/dauve-authier/ch06.htm#h3).
marxists.org/archive/pannekoe/1934/collapse.htm.
marxistsfr.org/archive/marx/works/1858/letters/58_02_22.htm
marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1859/critique-pol-economy/preface.htm
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Because all women have a substantially lower Autism Level, and have a difficulty in using abstract thought. This is genetic of course considering for over 90% of human history they've tended to children, and cooked.

"anarchy of production" is also how Marx described capitalism. Alas, all Orthodox Marxists and those who draw on them (looking at you, Althusserians and other Leninists) are shit-tier theorists. I blame Kautsky. He just might have doomed humanity with his stupidity and opportunism via Lenin, Luxemburg, and everyone else who drew on him.

Can we get a good ol' fashion women hate thread going?

Holla Forums shitposter or think you're still on REEEEEEE9k?

Crypto SJW bullshit I'm talking about her words not her having of a vagina, her words suck

50% of Holla Forums actually believe this though.

How many levels of reading neither marx nor luxemburg are you on right now?

This isn't a rebuttal, it's just shouting "you don't read" clearly, as I had engaged with direct Luxemburg quotes and ideas, I have read her

Um sweetie, I mean your reading of 'anarchy' is decontextualized and either you haven't read them or you're just severely autistic.

See guys? We did everyone a favour by getting rid of such a shitty theorist.

marxists.org/archive/luxemburg/1909/national-question/ch03.htm
Read section II, she makes literally the exact opposite argument
See above, "anarchy of production" does not refer to the state

This is a bad critique of Luxemburg IMO. The first part started out promising and that's where she was clearly dead wrong versus Lenin (decadence theory on imperialism rather than stage theory). If anything her critique of muh co-ops, unions and reformism is the one really good thing about her.

Much better to critique her on is on the Great War. It's usually said that she took the correct position on it, but that's bullshit. She and Liebknecht took the centrist position in favour of a "peace without annexations". The correct position was the one advocated by Gorter and Lenin: revolutionary defeatism (the one which ended up securing a communist victory in Russia BTW through mass-partisanship with the Petrograd Bolsheviks).

It's also frequently said she was part of the break with social democracy, the emergence of the Third International and the formation of the KPD, but that was all in fact against her own will. She was a trenchant defender of the idea that the SPD needed to be reconquered, and she attacked vehemently the idea of splitting up until the point the leadership actively excluded the oppositional elements. She was even, personally opposed to splitting the USPD and founding the KPD.

She is also frequently associated with left communism or its positions which is dead wrong. Dauvé and Authier's "The Communist Left in Germany" contains a very good account of the KPD founding conference (marxists.org/subject/germany-1918-23/dauve-authier/ch06.htm#h3). Abstentionism was already an issue discussed and favoured by the majority (yes, the majority of the KPD membership at this time was the main body that would later form the KAPD), and Luxemburg argued against it.

I'll also note something else you didn't touch on – Luxemburg's criticisms of the Russian revolution. Specifically, she criticised them for dissolving the constituent assembly in favour of Soviet power, in the name of "democracy' and 'freedom", the same dissolution that actually ended up securing the mainstay of the revolution and for the first time actually gave the Soviets meaningful sociopolitical power since their creation in the early 20th century. There is a tendency among some elements to see all criticism of the Bolsheviks as essentially revolutionary. But the criticisms advanced by Luxemburg are no different to those advanced by Kautsky and the Mensheviks (admittedly within the context of "'critical support" rather outright condemnation).

I think the Luxemburg cult has various aspects. On the one hand there are the various "left communist", "libertarian socialist" and "anti-Bolshevik" tendencies who seem to intentionally misunderstand Luxemburg's politics, especially on those points where she was a "centrist" in contrast to Lenin. With regards to that, there is also the fact that Luxemburg is "pure"; she never held any real position of authority and she died quite early in the history of the German revolution. In contrast to Lenin or Trotsky she was never confronted with a situation in which power had actually been seized. Compare that to the other Spartacists like Levi, she never lived long enough to actively oppose the emerging communist left (on a dominating large organizational scale – as noted, she did already oppose the left at the KPD founding congress). One factor in this might be the effort Stalinists put into besmirching her name. Certainly it was this that led Trotsky to write occasionally in her defence and later Trotskyists to regard her as one of their own. Also no doubt that, at least today, the fact that she had a vagina and there's the easily regurgitatable pop-left fact to spew around that le SocDems killed her are factors in her popularity too. But whatever the case, I think this is one idol that needs to be smashed, or at least taken down and put on a slightly less ornate pedestal; where all the other deprecated and generic orthodox (Second International) Marxists stand with her.

And I forgot to add that despite being good politically she was also very weak as a theoretical Marxist. In The Accumulation of Capital she tries to critique Marx's theory of value, to say that the (c)+(v)+(s) model is flawed at calculating exchange value proportions, bringing forth an under-consumptionist argument (actually attempting to revive it, since it was the same Lassalle brought to Marx and he failed) and another one of her much better left successors, Pannekoek, utterly BTFOs her on this here: marxists.org/archive/pannekoe/1934/collapse.htm.

Another none rebuttal, repeating the same point again

Well then she directly contradicts herself in reform and revolution

I was referring specifically to reform or revolution, sorry if that wasn't clear, could you maybe address the points I made about that? The rest of this is interesting but I have no reference to it

Like I said I think most of what she writes in RoR is accurate, with the exception of:
which is just completely nuts historically. Marx even talks about how you already had evidence of credit existing in nomadic societies, which had ancient modes of production with easily alienable goods. Credit just like everything else tied to capitalist production is but an element of the whole to it. A fun fact actually on this subject is that Marx only managed to write Capital vol. 1 and material for others to compile and make volumes 2 and 3, but Marx originally wanted to write 6 volumes.
marxistsfr.org/archive/marx/works/1858/letters/58_02_22.htm
marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1859/critique-pol-economy/preface.htm
This would have been great since some theorists have suggested that material touching more deeply on the subject of credit would have been found in the 4th and 6th volume.

There is indeed a trend towards the decentralization of production when you factor in the advent of crisis. Marx posited the same, arguing that outside of crisis production gets more and more centralized into fewer proprietor entities, but that crisis causes this to fracture and break up again. Crisis theory and TRPF are here the key factors.

During the working day, the manager of capital puts capital to work in order to generate surplus value, i.e. a profit. Capital consists of the machinery and tools and other inanimate objects (otherwise known as constant capital or "dead-labour"). The other is variable capital, which is living-labour. The ratio between these two is called the organic composition of capital (OCC). In order to produce cheaper commodities, the OCC has to be high, that means that the functionary of capital has to spend more money on machinery in order to remain competitive, so that the amount of variable capital in the day used is less, meaning there is a bigger surplus produced. So the capitalist who is able to do this puts the other firm out of business, or they're forced to adopt the new machinery. This in turns lowers the amount of value of the thing produced (less labour is involved in it's production now), and this means that there is less profit. So capital goes from place to place with a low OCC, through competition is compelled to invest in constant capital more over variable capital, until there isn't much in the way of profit, and then move onto a new branch of industry. This in turn becomes systemic and leading to a collapse of capitalist economy, which unless the revolutionary transformation of society prevails will just start capitalist development anew, fractured and all.

I find it funny that Luxemburg came to the same view as Marx here despite invoking the underconsumptionist view in her writings in Accumulation of Capital and Neue Zeit.

She is speaking of "anarchy" here in the same way Marx spoke of capitalism as invoking "the anarchy of production", meaning chaos and turbulence. It has little to do with the State.

Is this from her text on the Russian Revolution? Please give a cituation otherwise.

Absolutely true. The only meaningful, non-temporal democracy will be the one of socialism, if we can even call such a self-evidently democratic society democratic anymore (hitherto democracy has always been a State or State-backed institution).

She is right, Bernstein was a faggot with a co-operaivist fetish. Lenin's What Is To Be Done? is also a great condemnation of his kind (the economizers of Marxism). Marx's work is not the work of an economist, it shows instead what the class struggle must amount to, and how the proletariat can achieve human self-emancipation.

Cite me one text where a revolutionary doesn't spam buzzwords like this, at least from that time.

Nope, she also gives the co-op notion a huge deathblow, and another excess nail in the coffin after Marx was done with them. She is also much more of an impossibilist than Marx here, since looking at her own time and events had shown to her that the parliamentary road to socialism is (from then on, at least) an utterly dead one.

confirmed you didnt read reform or revolution

I don't think the sort of systemic integration of credit into the overall functioning of global capital can really be compared to whatever passed for credit in previous epochs. Especially at this point when credit itself has become a commodity and industry unto itself. Is Socrates owing his friend a chicken really comparable to credit as its deployed now? I'd need to be convinced.

She was the quintessential LeftCom

By these, could she have been referring to power shifting away from those who directly manage firms to financial institutions who manage capital indirectly? Because she would have been totally correct if so.

That sort of shift - from the factory to the bank - is natural for capitalism, but also makes it more apparent that the emperor is wearing no clothes and the bourgeois class doesn't really contribute anything. At least the factory owner could have been thought an "entrepreneur" or an "innovator"; the banker, however, is obviously useless to anyone who looks at him for half a second. However, if the petite-bourgeois is pissed off enough at the bankers and apathetic enough about the factory owners what results is fascism, which is even more unstable than capitalism, partially as a result of the stigmatization of finance.

Lmao wtf capitalism and the state are inseparable

You have no idea what you're talking about, don't you? Marx himself described capitalism as "anarchy of production" — anarchy here referring to a lack of coordination and cooperation, not to anti-statism.

So fucking tired of brainlets who think they can smugly take on dedicated theorists after skimming through a few Wikipedia pages. Read an actual book, nigger.

In the same pamphlet she references anarchy in the traditional sense with absolutely no differentiation. So sick of brainless who hero worship unquestioningly old words for no particular reason. Ask yourself why it's such a short and undeveloped work before you decide it is gospel and yet again with the

No nigga op can read, comprehend and critique, you are capable of only the first, which is useless without the other 2