Give me one reason, one reason, why we should tolerate religion in our society?

Give me one reason, one reason, why we should tolerate religion in our society?

"freedom of religion" is a liberal bouergeois institution, meant to keep the working class in awe before their earthly masters.

bakunin, proudhon, stirner, lenin,… each and every leader of the left rightly condemned religion, the cult of superstition, reaction, the moral enforcers of the upper classes.

christianity has always been the supporter of private property, of submission to the government and the upper classes, islam is a savage religion only fit for tribal barbarians, the quran praises sectarian warfare, taxing unbelievers, blood money,…

judaism, whatever the merits of individual jews, is an ethnosupremacist religion, that preaches hatred towards non-jews, of usury, of tribalism, of a chosen people against the subhuman other.

hinduism is a superstitious filthy sect consisting of idolatry, cultism, shamanism,…
etc….

all religions hate women, deny reality, have no proof to support themselves, encourage tribalism, promote sectarian strife, are barriers to human progress,….. and shoud be forbidden.

every man claiming to be a Messenger of a metaphysical being should be shot. everyone who believes in a skydaddy, in superstition and wallows in fear for the supernatural, should be forcefully educated.

religion is a pestilence, and we will never be free as long as this plague haunts this earth. it is the bane of humanity, the antithesis of everything socialism stands for.

During the early labor movements, religious leaders often worked with the capitalists to break up strikes/condemn class struggle etc, hence why all the early anarchist thinkers condemned religion so much. The religious leaders also had a lot of power in western society compared to today. There's a whole lot more problems than religion in our part of the world today

Baning religion solves nothing, just like baning some plants didn't make it go away.
Religion will disappear on it's own, but this takes take a long time and it will take centuries until it does.
Persecuting peopel for their religious believes will just make people even more religious. Haven't you learn anything with USSR? because that's what happened there.

do you mean to imply they are irrelevant today?

islamist preachers preach enslavement of western people, sharia law and other barbarism

evangelicalism in america is rampant, and contributes to consumerism, capitalism,…

and even if there were religious people who supported socialism, why on earth should we tolerate them? take archbishop romero. whatever his merits are on the socialist cause, the reality is that he still claimed to be an annointed sacred man, sent to make humans bow down before a non-existent entity. he still preaches opium to the proletarians. he is still spooked as fuck. same goes for civil rights episcopalians (though they are more liberal).

a priest with socialist tendencies may preach Paradise on earth, but will still preach a hell in the afterlife.

if a priest became a socialist, he would at once throw away his cassock.

humanity can never be free when religion persists. socialism will never be established until the last spiritual capitalist exists.


so we are just to tolerate it then? we just jave to meekly accept that there will always be this superstitious nonsense haunting us?

north Korea isn't religious at all. if the sovjet Union would not have been spooked with russian and orthodox nationalism, it could have completely eradicated the moral syfilis that is religion.

no it won't. people will always be led astray by false teachers, by fantasts who preach metaphysical drugs. we nust never allow ourselves to let them gain control.

yeah like if you want to see crucifixes then go to lithuania

the exception is "czechia" for some reason, I suppose the church was still associated with the opressor there - and they still have a strong Communist party so I'm not entirely sure

religion is a good motivator against socialism - it is also a good tool to unite people against the opressor. Beurgoisie decadence or hypocracy or the religious right etc, and just because people naturally like to congregate when they're feeling crushed.

>>1982071

if an ideology can be toppled by a bunch of hippies and cultists then it is worthless. Ironically Socialism could cause religion to increase by proving that the world can be fair and balanced like the idealistic texts found in religion claim. If that were to happen, religion would strengthen socialism.


My icon doesn't denote that I'm particularily religious I just couldn't find a better symbol for the Irish Republicans

You should read the 7th chapter of Ecology of Freedom. Pics related

so is ethnonationalism, antisemitism,… doesn't mean we should support that.


REEEEEE what the fuck. all cultists must fucking hang. no seriously, your comment made me think


fuck off christcuck. religion is filth. all your revisionism of muh bible and history won't change that. don't you have some heretics to burn?

We shouldn't. I am tolerant and friendly with religious people in geberal because they are proles and it's in the ibterest of class struggle not because of the liberal notion of 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧freedom of religion🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 that just means do not question the status quo, religion is here to stay in different forms as long as it comply to capital interest. I actually begin to think that fedora memes and similar shit were intelproed by mainstream american politicans. Isnt it strange how it appeared overnight at the most critical peak of anti religious internet discourse?
Also if there is a thing I disagree with zizek is that christianity is good for leftism. That of jesus is an inherently submissive message. Dont fight for shit it says, as long as you have your little death cult that exaltates suffering and self imposed torture of body and soul (every religion that promotes ascetism through shaming of the non sufferer is like this, christianity does so by denying you the famous kingdom of heaven and buddhism and hinduism through nirvana), the message behind christianity is just judaism 2 revenge of the old god, only that this time who folows this trail of shit is expected to not even complain about a miserable life but to thank gawd for it. Remember kids jesus saves.

Agreed fully. honestly,the way mainstream normies and the religious merged together to mock le epic atheists is definitely supported by hidden interests.

There will be superstitious nonsense as long as there are people willing to believe in superstitious nonsense. There will be people willing to believe in superstitious nonsense as long as there is something that makes it appealing to do so.

It's no surprise IMO that capitalism proved more efficient at eroding organized religion than 20th century communist projects. First, it offers an effective and all-encompassing substitute: itself. (.pdf) Second, it doesn't try to combat it directly: the market creeps into religion and takes it over from within. Third, highly specialized modes of autocratic control, self-propelling communicative forms of capitalism took over the authoritative and community-maintaining function of religions.

Really makes u think how one can DEVS VVLT all day on 4pol and they are heroes of civilization but even the most meek criticism of religion is now met with ridicule

This does not put religion in a good light, why not getting rid of one of these things we wrongfully believe in if we can?

what a load of defeatism, of apathy. you sound no better than classcucks saying "hurr durr if you are a socialist why do you use a computer"

indeed. especially since they then continue to criticize islam because it is expansionist.

I find fedoras annyoing as hell, but they are possibly the biggest strawman of the past few years

Exactly what I meant, fedoras may be stupid but neo christcucks that infest internet not only are unbelivably dumb but scream fedora so hard they completely destroyed internet criticism of religion and now if you dont buy into christian or neopagan or asian bullshit (islam bullshit dont count… I wonder why, 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧AHMURAYKKKA🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 ) you are not fashonable

This thing you got going user does sound a lot like a religion, come to think of it. You're going to call for an Atheist Jihad/Crusade against the barbarian believers? Praise our glorious comrades like Lenin? Compulsory reading of anti-religious books? Mass executions of people based on different belief?

What does that remind me of…it's almost like a religion of anti-religion, or belief of disbelief. Ideology so dogmatic it can't see anything else but itself, turned into an effective cult. I assume that our socialist comrades that are religious would get no mercy either.

I can't lie, it'd be fun watching it unfold, since you'd turn 86% of the Earth's population into corpses.

Dumbest thing I've read. If you hate religion and try to ban it you will alienate A LOT of people,believers and atheists alike. You would literally be creating an issue out of thin air.

Public relations.

There is no doubt that a society colaborating their efforts for the common good has no room for gods… BUT religion is an infectious disease currently rooted into the core beliefs of many, otherwise worthwhile people.


Tolerate religion, impose limits to their power outside of the merely spiritual and the hierarchies behind dogma will soon conspire to regain their power. Then, you are executing traitors and cult-leaders abusing the trust of their folk to gain power. No need to make a spectacle of it.No martyrs, no religious prosecution.


Without the machinery of indoctrination fueled by the power to sway the masses religion will either fade or transform into a more acceptable set of beliefs to fit the mold provided.

You're alienating A LOT of people by supporting socialism.

This thread is totally lacking a basis in material analysis. Christianity and Judaism were at various times progressive, currently they are reactionary. Islam was at various times progressive, then reactionary, and now it is progressive again. None of these categorizations are set in stone, they are simply the material reality of the great body of the various believers and their relation to the imperialist struggle. There is no room for softheaded uniform thinking in the form of "blanket condemnations" of religion in the current imperial framework we find ourselves in.

In the United States there would be more black Muslims than Christians if the Black Church didn't co-opt the revolutionary message from the Black muslims. This tendency is represented today by the United Church of Christ (Jeremiah Wright). They consciously became radical because it was in their best interests to retain congregants. That's called a positive development.

Some of you are still pol'ed or just haven't traveled extensively enough or read enough non-theory to understand these matters. The utterly game-changing Algerian revolution against raping, beheading, colonial France would be dismissed by many of you as "Islamist Wahhabist" if it happened today.

Socialism isn't exclusive though. You can be socialist and religious. Now imagine if I went outside and started talking to people about socialism and warming them up to the idea. And then afterwards I went "Oh lmao you're not allowed to believe what you believe in also because I said so". You're just hurting your cause. I'm not even religious but even I am opposed to outright banning religion. It serves no purpose and the idea is just self-indulgent wankery. If you really want to fall into that stereotype of "ebil god hating gommunist that wants to brainwash people into atheists and ban religion" then go for it, but don't be surprised when people don't want to join you.

Hierarchies directing their members with dogma are …
Hierarchies directing their members with dogma.

Wether you can align your interests with them is irrelevant.Any such deal is at-best temporary, since it rests on the judgement of the very few that lead.

Go away, intersectionalist.

the only problem with religion in this scenario is that it's all a load of horeshit

As always one can't criticize religions and it's immediatly muh genocide. Biggest victims ever.
Also a lot of people here can't even conceive how one can be opposed to religion but not hate religious people. Is that so hard? It's the same as capitalism, it's the system that is excellent not the people in it

What hierarchy? Ignorant super-profit loving bigot, gtfo.

Good job Holla Forums, now anti-imperialism is "intersectionality." Anymore ground that you dumbfucks want to cede to red liberals? Oh I have an idea, let's ignore the anticolonial struggles in Ireland and South Africa too since they're tinged with religiousity. Or do we just distance ourselves from anti-imperialism that involves Islam because we're crypto polyps?

Again as I said before. Why you people struggle so much in the idea that one can support people who happen to be religious but not their religion?

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Religions have historically been pretty liberatory when they first came about. Pointing out the fact of this doesn't make one a "christcuck"

That's not how tolerance works you overbearing faggot. Intolerance needs reasons. Intolerance needs justification. Tolerance just is, it's the default state. The world doesn't exist at your pleasure, or for you to control. Now get the fuck out of here and think about your life.

Because some religious people embrace anarchism, socialism and communism. Christian anarchism, Christian socialism, Christian communism, Islamic anarchism, Jewish anarchism and Buddhist anarchism are real things.

Well, that's purely pragmatical for now to achieve successful revolution, not anything legitimizing religion in the long run

Also islamig gommunism is better because meme :D

Buddhist anarchism sounds fucking amazing

It's fun. Odysseus, LOTR, even parts of the Bible make for good stories and pleasing symbolism.

People who take it seriously should be systematically excluded from society, though, and yes: their works and their speech should be banned.

A lie, unless you are referring to the kind Tolstoy practiced. Christians "anarchists" simply want to undermine the state with the aim of setting up their own spiritual dictatorship.

Jesus is pretty good though.

Freedom of thought is important for development of society and peace. (Unless the ideas encourage hatred and oppression of course)

Religion should obviously not get any support from the state, not be taught in school (sans philosophy classes) and churches should pay their taxed like the companies they are, but banning it has more downsides.

Before posting more reddit-spaced tripe, could you actually care to first define what constitutes "religion"?

Because 83.70% of the world population is religious and that's not even taking into account that the majority of the "unaffiliated" population is from China and Japan, with most still participating in folk religions and the like. Don't even get me started on ghosts, here in Britain the belief is widespread even among the non-religious, Stirner did well choosing the word spook.

this as communists we should strive to deconstruct all evil spooks and social constructs, abolishing religion, gender,
family, and all cultural differences by force if neccessary.

And as an anarchist communist I would kick the shit out of you if you tried to persecute someone for their religious beliefs, unless they are actively organising against us or plotting genocide/DEUSVULT or something like that they all deserve what they need to live including not having to worry about some edgy LARPer threatening them, all you're gonna do is alienate and hurt people.

religion is a spook that has been proven to be objectively wrong by science. gender is pure idpol. Engels disproved muh family sentimentalism. we should be merciless with all social constructs, for they perpetuate spooks and domination.

Does your mom know you habg out on these parts of the internet kid?>>1995025

It's shit but getting rid of it is impracticable.

define religion

has there ever been a society that restrict freedom of religion that wasn't shit?

It's no different to any other static ideology. So like 99% of this board and yourself, you make judgements without knowing these religions and imply that your judgements are resolute/valid critique. Such things give direction and identity to people, to avoid facing the nihilistic reality. This is not necessarily bad but singling out religion is stupid, as most religions function alongside cultures and further shape them (to remove them completely is to break and toss aside a lot of people's culture and identity, look at history if you fail to see why that is bad) and plenty of non-religious ideologies are far more hateful and destructive.

Because Islamophobia, and antisemitism has no place under a true socialist society.

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