I feel like liberals overtook leftism because nowhere in leftist history somebody said "You're too well off to be a...

I feel like liberals overtook leftism because nowhere in leftist history somebody said "You're too well off to be a socialist" and so petit bourgeoid took over every fucking socialist movement and transformed them to serve idpol and not the working people.
I think we need to draw a line and make clear that socialism is above anything else a movement against rich people and that petit bourgeois are part of the problem.

Liberals are liberals because they're cowards who want to be on the winning side and liberalism is the winning side at the moment.

Why would it not be against the system that puts shitty people in these positions of power?

not everyone who is well off is bourgeois

No, you don't understand basic socialist terms. Class differences doesn't have anything to do with their current income.

So you guys are going to sit there and let a yale graduate who only got that position because of his parents talk about trans oppression and pretend the bullshit they speak is socialism?
I know people is not the problem, that being well off is not the problem but we need to recover socialism from liberal hands.


the lumpenproletariat will riseā€¦!

you fucking retard

Reminder that pic related is descended was the son of an aristo. It is not where you come from, but where you end up.

No it's because the Warsaw Pact states caused socialist theories to stagnate or become infused with liberalism

No, we should expel all idpol from leftist ideology. Turn it back into a movement about economics.

So you want to make class an identity and infuse even more idpol into the Left. How about you just fuck off instead?

A doctor and a janitor who both work for a hospital have the same relations to the means of production, in that they both need to sell their labor. The doctor might be paid four times as much as the janitor, but it is in the interest of both of them to take over the hospital so that they are no longer working for wages. Conflating the bourgeoisie with the rich displays a fundamental misunderstanding of socialism and it's goals.

Im almost certain """radical""" progressivism comes from rich kids who want to be edgy chaotic good undergod heroes without having to think about their lawyer daddy hanging by his neck while commisair jamal and commisair cletus whoop and celebrate.
maybe, in addition to that, people belieivng that liberal capitalism is unchangeable and eternal, and so latching onto idpol as a way to feel like they're achieving something.

Socdem scum

That is exactly what I'm proposing

class can't be an identity

You have a liberal understanding of class.

Yes they did lol.

B-but communism was supposed to be all about luxury automation for everyone. Wealthy heirs with a bit of a rebellious streak were a real-world model of their ambitions as well as the initial investors.

For those appealing to the "working class" they do.

The working class is not the group of people who make below some certain arbitrary threshold, it is the group of people who are exploited through wage labor and themselves do not profit from exploitation.

I know that class is how one relates to the means of production but that doesn't make petit bourgeois ideology any good for us.

ONCE, we need to do this again.

So is FALC part of the problem?

Most of the working class are families of unskilled or low-skilled laborers who have no chance of getting prestigious jobs as government employees. The best they can hope for is that their children will be able to get those jobs. "Working class" has connotations of meager living standards because this is what is most immediately conspicuous, and thus is their "reality." Even someone who doesn't work but is surviving on dwindling "accumulated wealth" is considered working class. That may not be the textbook definition, but what communist term has never been revised from its textbook definition?


OP, you make a big deal out of distracting idpol but yet you want to want to single out and obfuscate over middle-income workers ("middle-class" meme).

Find better things to argue about.



yeah worker fetishisation didn't happen